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Clooney Stands with Sony; The Dow is Up; Hollywood Outraged Over Sony Pulling "The Interview"; Stephen Colbert Signs Off "Colbert Report"

Aired December 19, 2014 - 09:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


CAROL COSTELLO, CNN ANCHOR: So Joey, I'll pose this question to you. Also in Clooney's little protest letter, he said, quote, "Sony didn't pull the movie because they were scared. They pulled the movie because all the theaters said they were not going to run it. And they said they were not going to run it because they talked to their lawyers and those lawyers said if somebody dies in one of these, then you're going to be responsible."

So is Clooney right because the White House says there's no credible threat.

JOEY JACKSON, HLN LEGAL ANALYST: Here's the problem, Carol, you're darned if you do, you're darned if you don't. And what am I referring to? It's a major liability issue. So you tell everyone, go to the movies, it's fine, everything is going to be OK. And then something happens and, guess what, you're responsible. Why? Because you were on notice, Carol, as to there being a risk. And so you have to be very careful.

And in the legal terms, here's the maxim. The risk perceived is the duty defined. What does that mean? It means if there's a risk, then there's a perception of the risk. What is that risk? The fact that there would be, you know, unlawful acts committed against theaters. You're on notice of that, right? So the risk -- that's the risk perceived. What's the duty defined, to keep everyone safe. And that's your obligation. And to the extent that you can't meet it or potentially can't because there are nuts out here who will do harmful things, it becomes a problem. So what did the lawyers say, Carol, err on the side of safety, pull it, move forward.

COSTELLO: What if -- what if they had people sign a disclaimer, like you're going to this movie at your own risk?

JACKSON: Who's going to do that, right?

COSTELLO: I would do it in this case. I would do it.

LAURIE SEGALL, CNN MONEY TECHNOLOGY CORRESPONDENT: Merry Christmas.

JACKSON: Right. You know, it's amazing, Carol, because I would say, look, we're the land of the free, the home of the brave and how dare we allow anyone to affect our way of lives. But, you know, at this time of year, discretion is the better part of valor. We've seen what could happen. And I think they just erred on the side of safety. We don't like it. We want to go to the movies. We want to go in peace. But at the same time, we don't want anything to happen.

COSTELLO: Yes, but, in my mind, and I'll get to you in a minute, Laurie, I swear.

SEGALL: Yes, (INAUDIBLE).

COSTELLO: I just want to pose this question to David because something else has happened. So, one movie house said, you know, you can't show the "South Park" movie either that features like, you know, Kim Jong's - just Kim Jong-un's father. He's a puppet in the movie and his head explodes and they can't show that either because they're scared.

JACKSON: Where does it end?

COSTELLO: So, yes, where does it end?

DAVID COHEN, SENIOR FEATURES EDITOR, VARIETY: Well, this is the real danger of this is that now we seem to have given any well-funded group that can afford to hire hackers veto power over whatever content people want to put out on television, in film or even on the Internet, because where does that end? We have film out this award season that's about Martin Luther King. There are extremist groups that might not approve of that. There are films out with gay characters. There are films out with atheist characters. There are groups all over the world that might object to any of those. Can they stop those films now by simply hacking a studio or hacking a distributor? It really is an awful precedent and it's very dangerous.

JACKSON: Apparently.

COSTELLO: It is. So the president will probably talk about this later on this afternoon when he does his last press conference of the year. But his people have already said, Laurie, that they're reluctant to call this cyber terrorism. Why?

SEGALL: Well, you've got to remember that the State Department has a very precise definition of cyber terrorism and it is pretty - it's pretty broad in that we still have unknowns. When you take a step back, we still don't 100 percent know who exactly is behind this. See, they've got to be very careful about this.

But I will say, I got off the phone with a security researcher I know who actually is hired by governments to protect different countries against cyber warfare and cyber terrorism. He said, Laurie, this looks to me like cyber terrorism. And he said, you know, but we have to be very careful at how we label it because you've got to look at the implications of labeling this cyber terrorism. What are we going to do? How is the United States going to react? You have to understand that there are cyber warriors in Russia, in China, all around. So what you do in any - that if we even did a cyber-attack back on North Korea, you've got to remember, these people aren't even that connected to the Internet. So a lot of things at play here and we still have a lot of unknowns right now. COSTELLO: Well, let me lay this by you, because I found this really

fascinating. So Sony apparently brought this film to the Obama administration to look at before they decided to release it. And then it was released. And I just found that interesting. So I'll get your perspective first from Sony's - because, you know, they had concerns -

JACKSON: Sure.

COSTELLO: Maybe legal concerns before they even decided to put this movie out (INAUDIBLE).

JACKSON: Sure. But here's the reality. Look, you know, in America, we have this First Amendment right. And we like to be expressive. And the Supreme Court says, you don't want to kill speech, right? We have an unrestrained, unbridled ideas. We should be able to share them. And so now should we be looking at, let's clear it with the White House, let's clear it with the State Department, let's bring it to someone else. When would that end? And so it's very problematic.

And, Laurie, to the point of, you know, cyber terrorism or whatever, forgetting about the labels, look at the effect. The effect it's having is altering our way of life through threats, through intimidation and through fear. And that's very problematic because of the precedent it sets. So it's a very big concern.

COSTELLO: Well, David, is that normal. I mean do movie -- do companies like Sony normally present their products to the White House before they decide to release their product?

COHEN: You know, that's sort of an interesting question. It depends on the movie. It's common if a movie needs Defense Department cooperation, if they want to film on an aircraft carrier, for example, than to submit the script in advance to the Defense Department for vetting an approval. And that's a common practice.

I don't think it's a common practice for them to run a movie like this by the White House or by the State Department, but I'm sure in this case, because they knew they were doing something that was daring and kind of transgressive, that they wanted to at least have -- give our government the chance to say, hey, you know, you're asking for trouble for the country if you do this. And I can understand that. It is a little bit queasy, but I can understand the desire to do it just to be responsible citizens.

You know, the thing about this that is also intriguing for me is that there are countries in the world, most notably China, that have been openly covetous of the soft power that the entertainment industry conveys to the United States. And they're open about wanting that soft power for themselves. So this attack may have come from North Korea and may have been executed by Russian hackers working from servers in China, all of those countries have potential interests in reducing the influence of the American entertainment industry.

COSTELLO: That's a very interesting point, right, because we -

JACKSON: We - SEGALL: Very good (ph) point.

JACKSON: Yes.

COSTELLO: We both interviewed a human rights organization who's going to drop movies over North Korea to get people to realize what's going on in the outside world. And those movies come from Hollywood, right?

SEGALL: Yes. Absolutely. And I think, you know, what's really scary is, when you think about this hack and the precedent it sets, you know, they -- one hacker told me when I was on the phone with him that there's never been a case where hackers have gone after someone to silence them. And that's what we're seeing and that's why this is unprecedented. I think that's what everyone here is touching on. Before it was credit card information, it was just - it was numbers and now this was, you know, why he believes this could be cyber terrorism, why he believes this is a step farther and it sets a very scary precedent is the idea that they wanted to silence them.

COSTELLO: All right, Laurie Segall -

JACKSON: It's affecting our way of life and that's troubling, it's scared, it's horrifying, you know? Should we now -- everything we do, we have to be concerned who it's going to offend and what the implications are going to be?

COSTELLO: (INAUDIBLE) concerned about a country like North Korea?

JACKSON: That's -

COSTELLO: It's just unbelievable.

SEGALL: (INAUDIBLE).

COSTELLO: Yes.

Laurie Segall, Joey Jackson, David Cohen, thanks so much. I appreciate it.

JACKSON: Thank you, Carol.

COSTELLO: All right, we've got to check on the markets because they've been going crazy lately. The Dow was up 700 points in the last two days. It appears, though, as you can see, things are slowing down just a bit this morning. CNN's Richard Quest joins us to tell us more.

Good morning, Richard.

RICHARD QUEST, HOST, CNN'S "QUEST MEANS BUSINESS": Good morning, Carol.

A bit of a hangover after yesterday's 400-plus point rise and 700 over two days, but that's what you get when you have economies that are in transition and markets that are nervous, excuse me, about what is going to happen next. The Fed said they're going to be patient about raising rates, Carol, and the markets certainly weren't patient about going off to the races.

COSTELLO: You're not kidding, but like you - like things seem to be calming down this morning. So we see these huge spikes and then we see dips and like, overall, what does this mean? Anything?

QUEST: Yes, it means that there is a transition underway. The markets are now waiting for these first raises in interest rates by the Fed. We expect that to happen mid to late next year. Janet Yellen and the Feds said that they were going to be patient. They've got -- almost got rid of the phrase "considerable time." And now everybody is just waiting for that patience to become exhausted.

But by reading the statement we got, we sort of now understand they're in no rush to raise rates. And these markets have lived on the cheap fuel of cheap money. And that's what's been propelling them along.

So, Carol, when you go to one of your holiday parties over the next few days, and suddenly somebody announces that the next crate of champagne is about to be delivered, everybody goes, woohoo! And we're off to the party again. And that's what's happened with the markets this week. They've been told there's more money, there's more partying, and that's why they're celebrating.

COSTELLO: All right, Richard Quest, many thanks. I appreciate it.

Still to come, it's a podcast that's had over 1 million people glued to their mobile devices every single Thursday night, including me. A look at the real life whodunit, taking the world by storm, that's next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

COSTELLO: It is a whodunit murder mystery that has more than 5 million people listening. Over the last 12 weeks, a podcast called "Serial" has been delving into a 1999 murder case of a Baltimore teenager. Well, the series came to an end yesterday, but the question this morning, could this true crime drama be changing the public's perception of the murder case? I'm going to unplug because I haven't listened to the last episode, which aired on the 18th, so here's the story from Lisa Robertson (ph) from WBAL. And I'll be back.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Previously on "Serial."

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He left his cell phone and car with me, told me he'd call me.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK, now, at this point, you know why he's leaving the car with you?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes.

LISA ROBERTSON, WBAL (voice-over): "Serial" listeners hear that music and they know there is a new episode, time to sit and listen closely. ANNIE WEINSCHENK, "SERIAL" FAN: I just listened to the last episode

and I felt like the music has a lot to do with why I love it. Like it just makes me -- it's like my Thursday guilty pleasure. It makes me feel like I'm watching something.

ROBERTSON: The global hit is about a true crime in Woodlawn. Sarah Koenig is the host of a 12 part podcast that follows one story in- depth, week by week.

SARAH KOENIG, "SERIAL" CREATOR: Something's not -- doesn't make sense here in this case. And I don't know where the problem is. And so it really is just me trying to figure that out.

ROBERTSON: Koenig and the "Serial" team have been looking into the case of Adnan Syed, convicted of killing his ex-girlfriend Hae Mini Lee in January of 1999 and burying her body in Lincoln Park. He was largely convicted on cell phone records and the testimony of an acquaintance who says Syed told him he was going to kill Lee, showed him the body and even helped dig her grave.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You know, perhaps I'll never be able to explain it.

ROBERTSON: Throughout the podcast, we hear from Syed, who calls Koenig from the maximum security prison in Cumberland. Koenig and her colleagues uncover new evidence by talking to people thee police didn't talk to and going back to the crime scenes.

WEINSCHENK: I can visualize what's happening in Lincoln Park and, you know, Security and the Best Buy and all the places that, you know, the events of the story.

ROBERTSON: A witness told police Syed used a pay phone outside this Security Boulevard Best Buy right after the murder. Koenig and her team spent a great deal of time trying to find out if there was a pay phone there. It's that kind of digging that listener's love.

HANK PURCELL, "SERIAL" FAN: I think it's just the storytelling method and the fact that the narrators are as engaged in the show as the viewers are, or the audience is.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

COSTELLO: OK, I'm putting my earpiece in. OK, I hope you enjoyed that story. And I can't wait to listen to the last episode. The "Serial" podcast finale, as I said, was released last night. I'm going to be listening to it on the plane on my way to see my mom for Christmas.

Still to come in the NEWSROOM.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JON STEWART, HOST, "THE DAILY SHOW": How are you feeling?

STEPHEN COLBERT, HOST, "COLBERT REPORT": I'm always excited, Jon.

STEWART: Right, but tonight's a very special show, a very exciting show.

COLBERT: I'd like to think everything is special, Jon; it's a little something called professionalism.

(LAUGHTER)

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: Stephen Colbert signs off with a little help from Alex Trebek and a slew of other famous faces. Inside his final report, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

COSTELLO: George Clooney is outraged over Sony pulling "The Interview". Chris Rock, whose new movie, "Take Five", made it to theaters, is also speaking out, this time on "The Daily Show with Jon Stewart".

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

STEWART: There's a real hole in the movie theater schedule now that they've taken away -- apparently there's a movie that's not going to run at planned.

CHRIS ROCK, ACTOR/COMEDIAN: Really?

STEWART: You think to yourself, more cheese for me? What do you think?

ROCK: I -- I -- you know. I'll say this: my movie is very Korean- friendly.

STEWART: So "Take Five" is the safest Christmas movie.

ROCK: It's the safest Christmas movie there is. It's fun for Koreans.

(LAUGHTER)

STEWART: I can vouch for that. You know what I'm upset about? I write a movie (EXPLETIVE) all over the Iranian regime -- nothing. They don't even care.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: And he's not alone. Other stars have been lashing out on Twitter. CNN's Paul Vercammen has more for you.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JAMES FRANCO, ACTOR: You want to go kill Kim Jong-Un?

SETH ROGEN, ACTOR: Totally. I'd love to assassinate Kim Jong-Un. It's a date. PAUL VERCAMMEN, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): But there's no release date for "The Interview", plans to release the dark comedy on Christmas Day killed by Sony Pictures. Instead of flowers on the Walk of Fame after a celebrity death, billboards are coming down. Hollywood is riled up, especially on Twitter.

Rob Lowe, who appears in the film with stars Seth Rogen and James Franco, tweeted, "Everyone caved." The move led to outrage from Ben Stiller, Stephen King, to Donald Trump.

DONALD TRUMP, REAL ESTATE MOGUL: While I hear it was a terrible, terrible movie, Sony has absolutely no courage or guts.

VERCAMMEN: Their ongoing theme -- Sony just stepped on the First Amendment, and its own money-making comedy team of Rogen and Franco, also starring in hits "This Is The End".

FRANCO: You two just stepped inside me.

VERCAMMEN: And this marijuana-laced action comedy.

FRANCO: You a servant, my butler?

ROGEN: No.

VERCAMMEN: Fact indeed stranger than fiction. Two American comedians and an enraged North Korean government.

JIMMY FALLON, TALK SHOW HOST: Can you imagine if we wind up in a war because of the guys from "Pineapple Express"?

VERCAMMEN: Paul Vercammen, CNN, Hollywood.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

COSTELLO: All right, it's time to say -- well, kind of say good-bye to Colbert. That's coming up next.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

COLBERT (singing): We'll meet again, don't no where, don't know when, but I know we'll meet again some sunny day.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

COSTELLO: For lovers of politics and satire alike, the end of "The Colbert Report" is also the end of an incredible run. Comedy Central, the home of the show, since its launch nine years ago, tweeting that "2014 marks the final year of truthiness," Colbert's trademark phrase. Colbert, as you may well know, is leaving the network to take over for David Letterman next year, but not before an epic sendoff.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

COLBERT: What do I do now?

Now, folks, if this is your first time tuning into "The Colbert Report", I have some terrible news.

(LAUGHTER)

Nation, I know that this is an emotional night for a lot of you, so I want to start the show tonight with something a little more upbeat -- Syria.

(LAUGHTER)

The truthiness is all those incredible things people say I did -- running for president, saving the Olympics, Colbert Super PAC, treadmill in space, the Rally to Restore Sanity and/or Fear and/or Cat Steven's career -- none of that was really me. You, the Nation, did all of that. I just got paid for it.

(LAUGHTER)

What I'm trying to say is -- we'll meet again. Don't know where, don't know when, but I know we'll meet again some sunny day. We'll meet again, don't no where, don't know when, but I know we'll meet again some sunny day. Keep smiling through just like you always do till the blue skies drive the dark clouds far away

Oh, and you the Colbert nation, we couldn't done it without you. Thank you for being such a big part of it. That was fun! OK. OK, that's the show.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: Man, even Cookie Monster showed up!

For those of you who are skeptical of his impact, "The New York Times" has compiled a list called "Colbert By The Numbers". Among "The Times's" findings, 2010 was the year Colbert's famous phrase "truthiness" was added to the New Oxford American Dictionary. In 2007, 13 percent of respondents preferred Colbert over Hillary Clinton and Rudy Giuliani in a three-way hypothetical presidential race. And his Super PAC, Americans for a Better Tomorrow, Tomorrow, raised just over a million bucks as of January 2012.

Here's the woman laughing in the background, Nischelle Turner, CNN contributor and correspondent for "Entertainment Tonight". Hi, Nischelle.

NISCHELLE TURNER, CNN CONTRIBUTOR: Hi! You know, those numbers I couldn't get past --

COSTELLO: He looks a little sad.

TURNER: He did and I'm sure he was. He put that Colbert on, but he is Colbert, and he's a guy and his show's ending and I'm sure that it's really sentimental for him because he had everybody, even his staff, out there singing. And so I thought it was a fitting ending. I had to watch it twice, though, Carol, because the first time I couldn't get past Big Bird and Cyndi Lauper in the bright yellow. So I was trying to see who else was there, so I had to watch it twice.

But you know those numbers by "The New York Times", the one I could not get past, was the 1,120 calories in a pint of Stephen Colbert's Americone Dream. I can't believe it. I think I've eaten about 50,000 calories then. Good lord.

(LAUGHTER)

COSTELLO: It's Stephen Colbert's fault! Write him a letter. Actually, you talked to him at the Emmys. What did he tell you?

TURNER: I did. I asked him about going to the new show. At this time, he was still doing "The Colbert Report". But I said, you know, are you going to be nervous? Are you ready? Are you ready to take over the big shoes for David Letterman? And here's what he said.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

COLBERT: As soon as my show's over, then I can start thinking about the new thing. But I don't want to drop the ball on what I'm doing right now. But as soon as I'm not doing it, I'm surely I will just get as nervous as possible about not having any ideas. But we'll work it out. It's all the same team and we'll have fun.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TURNER: OK, so you're about six hours removed, Mr. Colbert, Mr. Colbert. So time to get nervous. I think he's going to be great, but I do think it's interesting, Carol, because he's not going to be able to be that character so now we're going to be able to see who Stephen Colbert really is. And I'm wondering if the audience will love that. Because we love the satirical guy who hates everything and who breathes everything American, he says.

COSTELLO: Do you think he'll be political?

TURNER: That's a tough one, because what we've seen the trend in late night become is more friendly, is more kind of fun and spoofy and sketchy and not so much on the political realm. I mean, from Jimmy Kimmel and Jimmy Fallon, who are both doing really well, we don't see them doing that kind of thing at all. He could zig when everyone else zags and that could make for interesting television, but I'm not sure if network television can sustain what he does on Comedy Central right now.

COSTELLO: You're absolutely right.

TURNER: I think he's going to have to sanitize it a bit.

COSTELLO: We've entered the era of the friendly, friendly comic like the guy next door, and Stephen Colbert, he's pretty cynical, actually, underneath all the laughter and all that stuff and the characters. So why would that play on Comedy Central and not play on network television, though? TURNER: Well, I think it's the same reason that shows like "The Nick"

could play on Cinemax and not be able to play on network television because cable can take risks the network can't. And that's one of the reasons we've seen a shift, especially going into awards season, so many cable television shows getting accolades for things because they're able to push the boundaries when network television really can't. I mean, there's some things you just can't say and you just can't do.

But you know what? He may try to push those boundaries a little bit. I hope he does, because I want to see something different. I do like Jimmy Fallon and I do like Jimmy Kimmel a lot, I think they're very funny, but I would like to see kind of a snarky, glib, funny guy on late night. I mean, I think David Letterman gives you that a bit.

COSTELLO: Someone who makes you use your brain a little, right? Yes, David Letterman --

TURNER: Yes.

COSTELLO: Well, David Letterman has become really cynical, but I get where you're going. Nischelle Turner, thank you so much for joining us this morning. I appreciate it.

Next hour of CNN NEWSROOM starts now.