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President Obama Criticizes Sony for Pulling The Interview

Aired December 19, 2014 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

JAY CARNEY, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: I will also say that the president was able to open this press conference by talking about how well the American economy is doing. And I think that the Band-Aid has been ripped off by Democrats and by the Democratic leader, the president, on the question on whether or not they can talk up the economy, because for so long now, during this recovery, so many Americans haven't been feeling it.

That's still the case. And we have seen that in the polls. But there's now data that show that middle-class Americans are beginning to see the benefits of this recovery and the steady growth and the steady job creation. Middle-class Americans are seeing their wages go up.

This is a key, key development, because if that persists, it will, I think, change perspective that a lot of Americans have about decisions the president made and the decisions Congress made during the depths of the great recession and his leadership and their leadership through the last several years, and it could play a big role in the 2016 election.

WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: Getting back to the headline, the big headline out of this news conference, the headline being, of course, that the president thinks Sony Pictures made a mistake in pulling the release of the film "The Interview" because it was critical, made fun of the North Korean leader, Kim Jong-un.

Jay Carney, how surprised were you by how blunt the president was on this sensitive subject and saying that the U.S. would retaliate, although he wasn't going to provide public details?

CARNEY: I knew he felt that way.

I was extremely glad to hear him say that so bluntly and clearly. I think that it's absolutely the right thing to say. The precedent -- as Cliff was saying before, the issues here go far beyond the decision to cancel screening of one movie.

The implications of this move by the North Koreans are profound and we need to react and take action. And I think that when he said the reaction would be proportional, I think the only signal he was sending is that he is not going to bomb North Korea, but he's going to respond probably in kind to what North Korea has done.

I think that's a good thing. And I think the messages he sent about the importance of the First Amendment and the importance to continue to avoid self-censorship was profound and the right thing to say.

BLITZER: What do you think, Cliff May? What would be the proportional, what would be the strong U.S. response that you would like to see come from the president?

CLIFF MAY, PRESIDENT, FOUNDATION FOR THE DEFENSE OF DEMOCRACIES: Well, I think he's right to ask for a range of options from the Defense Intelligence Agency, from the National Security Council and from others.

And I think he's stated that this was a red line that's been crossed. I think it's vital that that red line not be crossed with impunity. I think it would be useful. You could use cyber-weapons. We should have them to do some damage. But it should be right to the dictator in this case.

I think you could also do other things. How about a showing of the movie in the White House? How about using Voice of America to show the movie around the world? How about showing that we will not be intimidated, that this film will be shown, that this cannot be done to us, but then do inflict some real pain on this regime? Yes, short of bombing the regime, but there is more that can be done with economic sanctions on this regime, as poor as it is.

When the president says there will be a response, there has to be one. In the past, there hasn't always been one. When the Iranians plotted to bomb a restaurant here in Washington, D.C., a response was promised. I don't think we have seen one yet.

BLITZER: Doug Brinkley, the president is obviously the most powerful person in the world. When he said Sony Pictures made a mistake, they shouldn't have pulled the release of this film, Sony Pictures, that is a private company. They can change their mind and they can go ahead now and say, you know what? The president is right. We're going to release this film. Here's the question, Doug Brinkley. Do you think they should?

DOUGLAS BRINKLEY, PRESIDENTIAL HISTORIAN: No. I don't. I think you have to get this crisis behind us. I think you have to address it in the future, meaning I was disturbed. Why didn't Sony ever check in with the White House on what they should do?

The president said they never called him. They never even wanted his opinion on it, meaning we need a clearinghouse for these cyber- problems. As the president earmarked, all sorts of companies in the future will have these kinds of problems. We have to have a way to solve it better than just Sony acting unilaterally and then the U.S. government having to try to correct a private corporation.

BLITZER: Gloria Borger, the president in these final two years, he opened up by saying we're going into the fourth quarter. He's talking about a football game.

GLORIA BORGER, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: I heard.

BLITZER: Fourth quarter. He says interesting stuff happens in the fourth quarter. He's got two years to go. He's setting the stage that he wants to be active every single day. He says, I'm not going to stop for a minute in trying to make life better for the middle class of America.

(CROSSTALK)

BORGER: Right. And he was making the argument today that that's exactly what he's doing.

As to why Sony might not have called him, maybe they didn't want to call him because they know what his answer would be. His answer would have been, I don't think you should do this in the interest of national security. You shouldn't cave into this kind of hack attack.

But that may be one reason they didn't do it. Look, I think this is a president who is energized, buoyed in many ways -- it's been no secret to anybody in Washington that he was unhappy with the kind of lead bracelets he had to wear during the campaign. And he felt like he had to rein himself in.

He was getting criticized from the left. He was getting criticized from the right. And I think now he kind of feels like he is able to be who he wants to be and do what he wants to do within the confines of his executive power. He doesn't have to worry about the next election and he was frustrated in the past by his tactical responsibilities as a politician in chief for the Democratic Party.

Now those tactical responsibilities, aside from setting the table for 2016, which he's doing, have sort of melted away. I think we saw in his mood was a sense of, you know what? I'm finally getting to do the stuff I want to do. I bet he does veto the Keystone pipeline, again setting the table for energy issues in the next campaign.

BLITZER: Gloria, thanks very much.

BORGER: Sure

BLITZER: I want to thank the entire panel, obviously important stuff from the president of the United States.

Once again, the headline, the president says while sympathetic to Sony Pictures and their concerns, he says they made a mistake in pulling the release of the film. He says, "I wish they had spoken to me first," the president of the United States also saying that there will be a U.S. response. The FBI has concluded North Korea is responsible.

The president saying there's no indication other countries assisted North Korea. This was the work of North Korea. The president says the -- the FBI indication, he says, showed that. There will be a response. The U.S. will respond at the time it decides to respond. It will be proportional, but the president refusing to spell out publicly what that response will be.

Up next, George Clooney goes off on Sony Pictures as well, Hollywood and the news media. Why? Because he tried to get support from movie executives and no one played ball. You will hear his choice words for them and for Kim Jong-un.

This is CNN's special live coverage.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.

BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN ANCHOR: All right, here we go. Let's continue on our breaking news here on CNN. I'm Brooke Baldwin. Thank you so much for being with me.

The big news today from the president of the United States, in his last news conference of the year, he addressed a myriad of issues including Sony, which really was the headline. Let me quote him precisely.

He says: "Yes, I think they made a mistake" yanking the release of the satirical comedy "The Interview" Christmas Day and that those hackers are acting under the will of North Korea. That was confirmed by the FBI today. And what's more, this attack now has taken this new turn.

Let me fill you in. Overnight, another threat against Sony. These hackers sent executives a message that confirmed all this criticism that by pulling the release of the film "The Interview," Sony gave the terrorists precisely what they wanted.

Let me read this e-mail for you. And just a heads-up. The grammar isn't exactly perfect. This is what they say -- quote -- "It's very wise that you have made a decision to cancel the release of 'The Interview.' It will be very useful for you. We believe you will never be engaged in something dangerous like that. Now we want you never let the movie released, distributed or leaked in any form of, for instance, DVD or piracy, and we want everything related to the movie," it goes on, "including its trailers, as well as its full version, down from any Web site hosting them immediately.

"We still have your private and sensitive data. We ensure the security of your data unless you make additional trouble" -- end quote.

Again, from the president today moments ago saying, yes, he is sympathetic to the plight currently facing Sony, but, no, he says Sony shouldn't have pulled "The Interview" over this ongoing threat. Let me listen and you listen to that part.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: We cannot have a society in which some dictator someplace can start imposing censorship here in the United States. It says something interesting about North Korea that they decided to have the state mount an all-out assault on a movie studio because of a satirical movie starring Seth Rogen.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: The president says he worries that having seen this as an example, other studios, of course other producers could retreat into censoring themselves.

So, Michael Smerconish, let me bring you, host of CNN's "SMERCONISH."

I know you were listening to that and listening to every single word as I was certainly from the president. I planned on hitting actually on that point precisely with you off the top. Let me begin with that. This whole idea that Kim Jong-un, this petty tyrant half-a-world away could have any say whatsoever as to contest of our culture here in the States, is that not just unreal to you?

MICHAEL SMERCONISH, CNN CONTRIBUTOR: Yes, the whole thing is surreal.

If what played itself out in the last week or two were part of a movie pitch, if you and I were, Brooke, were to go into a Hollywood studio and say, now here's the idea for our movie and we lay this whole chronology out...

BALDWIN: It would be a great movie.

SMERCONISH: It would be a great movie, a hell of a movie. But I think they would have laughed us out and said, come on, it's too farcical.

I like what the president had to say. And I believe those are his sentiments. I'm surprised that he expressed them. I would have expected him to dodge, to hem and haw when asked a direct question about whether Sony made a mistake. I'm glad that he said it was a mistake, although I have to add this.

It's very easy for those of us who are on the sidelines to say that Sony blew it, because it's not our personal data that right now hangs in the balance.

BALDWIN: True. But he definitely didn't hem and haw in saying I wish Sony would had spoken to me first. I would have told them don't get into this pattern in which you are intimidated. He pointed out of course the Boston bombing and if they had let the terrorists win, or these lone wolves in that case win, there wouldn't have been a marathon this year and there was.

The other issue, he was asked specifically actually two different times from two different reporters how the United States will respond to this. His answer again and not going farther than just saying the U.S. will respond proportionately. What would a proportional attack look like? Michael, do we know?

SMERCONISH: I think it would look -- just one person's opinion, I think it would look like a Stuxnet-type bug much like was used presumably by the Israelis against the Iranian nuclear capability.

My prediction is that there will be some action. There will not be any announcement by the White House that the action has been taken, but there will be fallout and we will be aware of it, and it will be cyber-warfare in its purpose. And there will be no claim that's made that, this is what we did, but rather a wink and a nod.

BALDWIN: OK.

What about though, that aside -- here you have now that this has been successful, considering success that Sony has yanked this film from appearing in theaters Christmas Day, what's to prevent North Korea from saying that worked, let's try Bank of America, let's try Google, let's try Pentagon? Because we heard the president say today we are way behind on cyber-security. Congress needs to get on that.

SMERCONISH: You know, and there are many in the government who have been saying this for a long time. It will be odd if this is the wakeup call that brings it all home, but probably it will be. You think of Richard Clarke, the former national security adviser, he has gone so far as to write novels using much of this material as a plot line because he found that when he went out and he delivered speeches, people weren't taking him seriously.

That we need a wakeup call I think is certainly the case. But, Brooke, one other observation if I can make it because we're all laying this off on Sony. Sony shouldn't have done this. I don't think Sony should have backed off. But in the end, it was the distributors. It was about a half-dozen entities, those that control all of the screens across the country that all backed out and said we're not going to distribute this movie.

BALDWIN: Sure.

SMERCONISH: I would like to see it put on demand and give Americans on Christmas Day the opportunity to spend $5.99 or $6.99 and use it as a family activity and watch the movie at home in the protection of our own homes. I think that would send a wonderful message.

BALDWIN: I think you're not alone. I think one of those reporters even asked President Obama if he would be seeing the movie. He said, listen, I have a long list of movies.

But wouldn't that be something, if the president comes out later and said, you know what, I saw "The Interview"? Before I let you go, Michael Smerconish, I do want to ask you about Cuba, because of course the president was asked about it. He said obviously he's pleased with what happened so far.

But he was very clear in saying he doesn't plan on going to Cuba and meeting with Raul Castro any time soon and that if freedom happens it will be in fits and starts. You once interviewed Fidel Castro. In his heart of hearts, do you think Fidel Castro feels that he and his brother have finally given it to the big Yankee imperialista to the north? They have given in?

SMERCONISH: I think the best thing that ever happened to Fidel Castro and to his brother Raul was the implementation of the Cuban embargo.

I think that for 54 years the embargo has succeeded in one respect and that is keeping them in power, because it created a boogeyman. It created an entity that they could blame everything on. It's a Third World country. To be in Havana and the outlying areas is to see the abject poverty. But he always was able to lay it off on the foreign policy of the United States.

What are they going to blame now? If things go terribly wrong for Cubans, as they have in the past, there won't be any blaming the United States going forward. I think it's a good thing. I say I think it's a good thing because what I would most like to see is a change in leadership in Cuba. And how best to bring that about? Give them a taste of what we experience here on a day-to-day basis.

BALDWIN: Michael Smerconish, can't wait to see you on CNN tomorrow morning. Thank you so, so much.

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: Coming up next, George Clooney goes off on Sony and Hollywood and the media. Why? Because he tried to get support from movie executives and no one was willing to play ball. Hear his choice words for them and for Kim Jong-un.

And also ahead here on CNN, is America prepared for a cyber-war and what other countries have this kind of capability to attack? You're watching CNN's special live coverage. I'm Brooke Baldwin. Stay with me.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BALDWIN: You're watching CNN. I'm Brooke Baldwin.

George Clooney defends Sony Pictures and he takes Hollywood to task for not standing by the studio as hackers linked to North Korea used this epic cyber-attack and threats against theaters to force Sony to pull the plug on "The Interview."

In this back-and-forth interview here with Deadline, Clooney says he sent top entertainment producers a petition supporting Sony. Thing is, he couldn't get anyone to sign it.

This is part of what he told Deadline. Let me quote him: "Nobody stood up. Nobody took that stand. Now I say this is a situation we are going to have to come to terms with because this could happen to an electric company, a car company, a newsroom. It could happen to anybody."

Clooney is fully behind releasing this movie in some form, even online. He says: "Do whatever you can to get this movie out. Not because everybody has to see the movie, but because I'm not going to be told we can't see the movie. That's the most important part. We cannot be told we can't see something by Kim Jong-un of all 'bleep' people."

Clooney also blasts the news media for failing to see the bigger picture and focusing on these salacious e-mails involving famous people. This is what he said on that. "There was a real story going on. With just a little bit of work you could have found out that it wasn't just probably North Korea, it was North Korea."

I have Mike Fleming on the phone, Mike Fleming of Deadline, who was the one that conducted that interview with George Clooney.

Mike, how did you get the interview?

MIKE FLEMING, DEADLINE: I had heard that he was going to try to get all of the support for a petition.

And so I reached out and we had an agreement that when he did, I would break a story about it. And so the story that I broke was actually much more interesting.

But there have been so many twists and turns in this story that you never could have predicted, and this is just one of them, the idea that nobody would sign a petition of support for Sony.

BALDWIN: You're not kidding on the twists and turns.

Let me though -- let's back up a half-step. When we talk about this petition, explain to our viewers, what was the purpose of this petition that George Clooney and his agent apparently were trying to get signatures?

FLEMING: The purpose of the petition, I think, was just to establish that Sony and its leadership, Amy Pascal and Michael Lynton, were not alone and that the community recognized what was happening here, this divide and conquer campaign that was going on where these embarrassing e-mails were released and basically polarized everyone in Hollywood from supporting them.

But, in this case, the most powerful people in Hollywood were asked to sign a simple petition of support, and they didn't want to do it because they didn't want to put themselves in the hackers' crosshairs.

BALDWIN: When you say the most powerful people in Hollywood, did George Clooney say specifically who he went to? Because I know he told you he went to some pretty big names because once you have the big name sign on, right, then you have that trickle-down effect. Who did he get and why exactly did they say no?

FLEMING: He wouldn't say.

And I didn't press him because that isn't George's style. What I liked about George's interview was he wasn't really condemning anyone, kind of the way that Aaron Sorkin made pointed comments about the media. George understands everyone's rationale for acting in their own self-interest and what their self-interests are, including the media.

He just felt this was unfortunate, that here you have what turns out to be a cyber-terror attack by a hostile foreign country on a communications business in the United States and everyone put their heads in the sand pretty much, at least according to what George told me.

BALDWIN: It was a fantastic interview. I think one of the headlines that hasn't gotten as much buzz is what I wanted to ask you about, because we here at CNN, we have been reporting that Sony has zero plans of releasing this online or elsewhere.

But George Clooney in your back and forth, he told you he had a conversation with Amy Pascal and she told a different story.

FLEMING: Well, the thing is, they don't know what to do.

This is a completely unprecedented occurrence. No one expected it. There is no playbook of how to handle this crisis. So, even though they may be having those conversations, I don't know. It's -- just today, the people at Sony apparently received an e-mail telling them that they would call off the cyber-dogs if they just let this movie die.

So do they want another, a fresh batch of attacks and to be left alone and polarized and have to absorb more damage for a comedy? I'm not sure. I'm not sure if they're willing to go in and pay the price for an -- even though it's for an important principle.

BALDWIN: Mike Fleming of Deadline with the big get with the interview with George Clooney, thank you so much for calling in. I appreciate it.

And we're going to stay on this story, because my next guest, a longtime movie critics, says the "faceless cowards" have won. But the big question, what happens? Flash forward five years, 10 years from now. Will anyone in Hollywood take a risk?

Plus, the head of Sony just now sitting down with CNN and responding to the president's remarks that the company just made a total mistake.

This is CNN. This is just in. Stay with me.

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