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New Day

Debris from Missing AirAsia Flight Found; AirAsia Crash Analyzed

Aired December 30, 2014 - 08:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: AirAsia confirming that the debris found in the Java Sea this morning is indeed that of flight 8501.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The debris was spotted about six miles from the plane's last known flight position.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The passenger door and the cargo door have been sighted.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The worst possible news for the families of these 162 people.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It was hysterical, people fainting, screaming.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The searchers have been lowered down by helicopters to collect bodies.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: That focus is on the people, on the passengers and the crew.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The most important clue now is the black boxes.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Then they'll be able to piece together precisely what happened to this aircraft.

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ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.

MICHAELA PEREIRA, CNN ANCHOR: Welcome to NEW DAY. It is Tuesday, December 30th. It is 8:00 in the east, I'm Michaela Pereira alongside John Berman, and our Christine Romans is here as well. We welcome our viewers in the U.S. and around the world.

We turn right now to our breaking news. AirAsia is confirming that debris found in the Java Sea this morning does indeed belong to missing flight 8501. Rescue teams have recovered bodies and debris from the doomed flight six miles from where it was last spotted on radar. Crews found broken up pieces of the plane in the shallow waters off the coast of Borneo Island. Now, right now they have recovered several bodies, an emergency exit door, and aluminum cuttings from the plane. Divers are being sent to the site to look for additional victims. Indonesia's president said a short time ago a full search will continue to go on.

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: It is getting dark over the search zone. The helicopters have been flying over the location of the debris which will soon be taken to Surabaya in Indonesia, the airport there, for further examination. The family members of those on board the flight were called in this morning to receive the news. You can see these images here, very difficult to see. So emotional hearing that there is now this information on the fate of their loved ones, the debris, the bodies found in the ocean. We are covering the story from every angle. We want to begin with Andrew Stevens live on the ground in Indonesia. Good morning, Andrew.

ANDREW STEVENS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good morning to you, John. The president of Indonesia has just left, and he has been visiting the families here and saying that "We are praying together to give us all strength in this hour of darkness." it has been a truly devastating day for these families, confirmation that flight 8501 had indeed crashed into the sea, pictures shown publicly on local television of bodies, bodies which would be related to people who have been gathering around waiting for information they could get about their families. Harrowing doesn't really begin to describe what the families have been going through.

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STEVENS: Breaking this morning, a devastating discovery, AirAsia confirming a number of bodies, passengers of AirAsia 8501 found floating in the Java Sea, the victims and debris some six miles from the aircraft's last known location.

GEOFFREY THOMAS, EDITOR-IN-CHIEF, MANAGING DIRECTOR, AIRLINERATING.COM: I think the debris field confirms a catastrophic event. I expect that the plane fuselage probably split in two.

STEVENS: Officials say the debris found belongs to the missing AirAsia flight 8501, searchers locating the debris in at least three separate locations, but, so far, no survivors, a heartbreaking end to the three-day search for the plane.

Relatives of those on board the plane in anguish over the news screaming, crying. These loved ones set to fly over the search area Wednesday aboard a specially chartered AirAsia flight to pray for their loved ones. It's unclear if families will move forward with that flight.

AirAsia's CEO Tony Fernandez expressing his condolences, saying "My heart is filled with sadness for all the families involved in QZ8501. On behalf of AirAsia, my condolences to all. Words cannot express how sorry I am."

Now the somber task of recovering the wreckage, the flight data, and cockpit voice recorders, and piecing together what caused the plane to go down. Overnight, audio transmissions from AirAsia 8501's cockpit to air traffic control surfacing, providing little to no clue. The pilots cleared for takeoff from Surabaya to Singapore but would never arrive.

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STEVENS: And the task also is before these family members to identify now their loved ones. They're already being asked by police if they can provide documentation, photos, Michaela, anything, even something which could have a DNA sample on it just so they could match it with people on that plane.

I must say, though, at this stage, Michaela, we can't completely rule out the fact that there may be a miracle in 8501, there may be a survivor. It is highly, highly unlikely given the fact it was over 40 hours. That was a big impact, that plane crashed into the sea by all aviation expert accounts, but it is not beyond the realm of possibility, and some people may still be hoping for that miracle.

PEREIRA: I'm sure there are family members that are clinging to fading hope. Andrew, thank you so much for that.

The relatives of those 162 passengers and crew aboard that doomed flight left with heartbreak, grief, and agony this morning. Family members fainting, screaming, crying once they realized their worst nightmare had been realized. Let's turn to our Will Ripley in Beijing. Almost too much to even imagine, isn't it, Will?

WILL RIPLEY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: As we're just hours away from New Year's Eve, Michaela, this was supposed to be not only a week of celebration for a lot of people who were flying to Singapore to celebrate the new year, but this was also supposed to be an end to a very difficult and tumultuous year in this part of the world in Asia where there were two airliners from Kuala Lumpur based in Malaysia Airlines, one crashed, the other still missing. There was the Trans- Asia Airline crash where more than 40 people died in that. And now in this last week this flight that was bound for celebration is ending here in the Java Sea, and there are now hospitals preparing to identify these people, these bodies that are going to be pulled out of the water in the coming days.

Family members have already been asked to bring pictures, offer DNA samples, but this is going to be a very, very difficult time for them, because they will have to identify their loved ones who they put on a plane, said goodbye expecting they'd be safe only to have it end up like this, Michaela.

PEREIRA: Hopefully the airline is providing them with some counselors and some assistance. There's going to be so much help needed for those people in the coming days, hours, even months. We know that grief takes its own time, Will. Thanks so much for that, we appreciate it.

One thing we also know, U.S. help is arriving at the search area today. One ship is closing in. We learned in our last hour here on NEW DAY that another ship is just being deployed. Now the debris and victim's bodies have been spotted and located, pardon me. What exactly will the U.S. role be? Rene Marsh joins us live from Washington. We know as we heard Rear Admiral Kirby the U.S. is not taking a lead role in the investigation, but we're there to assist.

RENE MARSH, CNN AVIATION AND GOVERNMENT REGULATION CORRESPONDENT: Yes, we are, and we are ready to assist on all fronts if need be. I just was in communication with the NTSB. They tell me that they continue to monitor the situation. We do know that the engines on this aircraft manufactured and designed by GE, an American company, so they say they are specifically waiting to see if they will need any assistance as it relates to the engines when it gets to that part of the investigation.

But back to those ships. The U.S. Navy we know now has deployed a second ship. This is the USS Fort Worth. It's been deployed from Singapore. It is a combat ship. We do know that based on what is onboard. We know that there are high speed boats. We also know helicopters, which would be very useful in the recovery process of the wreckage on the surface. We also know that USS Sampson is already in place. It is already on the scene.

Again, both of these ships and the crew on board they're ready to assist in recovering wreckage. Also they have the capability of salvage as well, so they will be able to essentially pluck all of that wreckage from the surface and bring it aboard.

At this point, we know that as far as the black boxes, that is going to be critical. We could see that a request is made for that towed pinger locator that we saw in flight 370 to detect those pings, very critical in piecing this all together, Michaela.

PEREIRA: All that technology is certainly going to be of assistance. Rene, thank you for that. John?

BERMAN: All right, thanks so much, Michaela. Joining me now, Deborah Hersman, the president of the National Safety Council, former NTSB chairman, also Mary Schiavo, CNN aviation analyst, former inspector general of the U.S. Department of Transportation, also now an attorney for victims and families who do suffer through these airplane disasters. Deborah, thanks so much for being with us. We have seen these pictures now of debris in the Java Sea, we've seen a door, an emergency exit door, aluminum siding, also pieces of what could be a life raft. We've seen images from these helicopters pulling a body from the ocean as well. We're not showing too many of these. They are troubling to see. So now that you have this, now that you have these pieces, what's next?

DEBORAH HERSMAN, PRESIDENT, NATIONAL SAFETY COUNCIL: Well, I think the first priority is really for those families, and I know you all have been talking about that a lot. This is really a difficult time for them, and so it's that recovery and the identification of remains, and, again, holding out any hope that there might be a survivor. We have had crashes where there are sole survivors on occasion and so we do want to continue to look for survivors, if that's a possibility.

But for the investigators, they are going to be really trying to identify the debris field, the spread where the first pieces started to shed and where they might be located. But the most important evidence for them will be those recorders, the cockpit voice recorder and the flight data recorder.

BERMAN: And, Mary, the debris is just six miles from the last known point of contact. What does that say?

MARY SCHIAVO, CNN AVIATION ANALYST: Well, to me that does suggest that the plane came down after some sort of aerodynamic stall, either a combination of weather and pilot error or weather, pilot error, and a mechanical issue. But because this is so close to the last known radar point, it suggests that there was not an in-flight breakup. The pieces in that case tend to be flung much further over much wider debris field. And of course it remains to be seen, there's the initial number of bodies, but it seems to be in one area and contained so I think it probably hit the water intact.

BERMAN: What are the complications of getting all of this debris, given that it seems to be in an area six miles to me sound like not a big area? Is that a hard area to search?

SCHIAVO: Well, I won't say it's not a hard area to search, but it's a more compacted area to search, and because of the conditions on the Java Sea and the depths of the water being much less than on, for example, the Indian Ocean, they will have a more efficient time in gathering it up.

The only complication might be you mentioned a couple seconds ago about the towed pinger locator. Right now they need as many helpful assets on the water as they can to collect the bodies as quickly as possible. The towed pinger locator can sometimes pick up other signals, et cetera. So I think right now they'll probably emphasize getting the bodies and then bringing in, for example, the towed pinger locator if they need it.

BERMAN: The recovery first. Deborah, you emphasized the need to deal with the families in a sympathetic, empathetic way. In this company, AirAsia has seemed to be doing that the last few days and we hope that they do that in the days ahead. As someone who has led these investigations before, how delicate is it to talk to the families to tell them everything they want to know, everything that they need to know while doing the investigation at the same time?

HERSMAN: You know, it's not hard because it's the right thing to do, and I think it's about making the decisions to share the information with the family. Make sure, again, you've got to maintain your credibility, and so it's making sure you've got the facts correct and sharing them in a timely manner with the family. And in this media frenzy that everyone is involved in is making sure that people feel that they're respected and that they're protected.

I mean, some of these shots, and I'm glad that you're not showing them, but some of these shots are really hard for families, and there are people who have been involved in crashes all around the world who are seeing these things and it is bringing up feelings again for them. And so you know, we've got the 370 that's still missing. BERMAN: And, Mary, based on what we've seen so far with the emergency

exit door, with the bodies that have been recovered, at least two right now, what questions pop into your mind now? What are the answers that you want in terms of this investigation?

SCHIAVO: Well, I think everyone will be focusing on the fact that the emergency exit door was free and was floating free. I have seen other crash sites, though, where the emergency exit doors popped out or there were slides that had been deployed and there are flotation devices. TWA 800, for example, off the coast of New York has flotation devices, but that didn't mean people got them on or had time to get them on. In many cases those things just come apart as the accident aircraft breaks apart in the water. But we certainly want to know that.

BERMAN: I think we're alluding to, you know, they're seeing the emergency exit door, people might think, well, someone popped it, someone tried to escape, someone tried to get. What you're saying is it may not necessarily mean that.

SCHIAVO: That's right. But that's certainly something that can be answered. And of course the cockpit voice recorder will be very clear as to whether anyone was ordered to prepare for a ditching.

BERMAN: Deborah, I want to have a final thought from you about going forward now, safety in the air industry, or at least helping with further investigations. This idea, AirAsia is upgrading or is upgrading its fleet with more real time trackers to locate flights. This plane did not have that real time tracker. Do you think the industry needs to make these changes and do you think they will?

HERSMAN: You know what, the one thing that is constant is change, and technology continuously evolves. The airline industry has to evolve, and they have to adapt and keep up with technology. All of us really have that demand on us, no matter what we do. I think the pressure is high on the aviation industry right now to get into a really sophisticated tracking system. This year has been a bad one for them, and they need to move forward.

BERMAN: All right, Deborah Hersman and Mary Schiavo, thanks for being with us. Appreciate it.

Michaela?

PEREIRA: All right, John.

We'll continue to track developments in the search for AirAsia Flight 8501. We're going to take a look at what might have gone wrong up in the air as we learn more about what's being found in the ocean and what is next in the investigation.

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PEREIRA: Good to have you back with us for our continuing coverage of the crash of AirAsia 8501. Search crews are focusing on the Java Sea where bodies and debris have

been recovered overnight. Airline officials say they were missing from the missing flight.

The debris was only six miles from where the plane was last seen on radar, at the southeastern end of the expanded search area, which had been expanded several times. So, was this widening of the search zone what helped track down the debris?

Let's ask CNN safety analyst and former FAA safety inspector, David Soucie. We should also point out, he's the author of the upcoming book, "Malaysia Airlines Flight 370: Why It Disappeared and Why It's Only A Matter of Time Before This Happens Again." Sadly, it looks as though something has happened.

David, let's talk about, we're here on the map and it's good to look at what the investigators will be looking at, what the searchers are looking for and what they looked at. This red area is the debris site and sort of the main search area, if you will.

How do they backtrack to find from the point where the debris was found to find the main fuselage?

DAVID SOUCIE, CNN SAFETY ANALYST: Right. Well, this area is interesting, and it's not like we were talking about MH370 where it had the continuous flow through there. This area is circular, floating in a circle. It's moving --

PEREIRA: The currents?

SOUCIE: Yes, because it's more shallow and the way that it's on that shelf there, it's actually rotating within that area. So, the search and tracing it back, I don't have that technology in my mind, but that experts will be able to trace that back from what I'm told.

PEREIRA: Should there be signals coming from the flight data recorder?

SOUCIE: Yes.

PEREIRA: Should those be being received?

SOUCIE: No, because in the water you have to be in the water to hear what's going on in the water. It can't transmit out of the water into the air. So, at this point, it's necessary to get --

PEREIRA: Try over top of them almost right?

SOUCIE: -- the TPL, right, the towed pinger locator in there, hit it over the top. They may not need that device because they can do handheld surface indicators and actually pick up those signals.

PEREIRA: Over the side of the boat, if you will?

SOUCIE: Exactly like the Chinese did in 370. PEREIRA: Right, let's zoom into the search area, we know this was

expanded into some 13 zones. Sixty thousand -- over 60,000 square nautical miles, larger than the state of Georgia just to give people a perspective. By all accounts, we are hearing some of our experts are saying the textbook investigation in terms of how this has quickly sort of come about to find debris.

SOUCIE: Yes, it is textbook. But I don't want to go and say this is textbook, everything is normal, because there's no accident that's normal.

PEREIRA: I suppose not.

SOUCIE: When you talk about textbook, you're talking about the procedures that were used to get there.

PEREIRA: And the speed, too, because this is pretty standard, right, is it not? A few days in?

SOUCIE: This is what was normally be expected. This is what we expected in MH370 and Air France 447, but this one is did. From that perspective, yes, it is fairly standard as far as how it was gone about. Now, from here forward, you don't want to anticipate it's going to be that smooth.

PEREIRA: That's what I was going to ask you, seven nations contributing to the effort.

SOUCIE: Exactly.

PEREIRA: That is a challenge in and of itself.

SOUCIE: Delegated to the French authorities, the French who are really handling the investigation and for the first time in a year almost now, we have an investigation not just a search.

So, we have debris, we have deceased, we have something to tangibly put our hands on which is really going to help the families understand what's happened. It's no less painful certainly, but at least there's a bit of closure, you never get closure from something like this, but you have a bit from there.

PEREIRA: We'll talk about that, we have people unfortunately later on in the show who are the survivors of families who are lost at sea in these kind of crashes.

Let's look at the flight path and the weather, because we know that weather was certainly a situation here.

SOUCIE: Definitely.

PEREIRA: We know the pilot had asked for permission to rise in altitude to get around some of these horrific thunderstorms.

SOUCIE: Exactly.

PEREIRA: This is awful. Chad Myers was telling us, it's pretty standard for this part of the world.

SOUCIE: Yes, hurricane Katrina, all these hurricanes that we've always talked about, this is where they're born. This is where they start.

PEREIRA: You know the person at home is going to say it's not safe to fly through that. That terrifies me as a flier. Am I wrong?

SOUCIE: Well, it's vulnerable to this area of this situation, but it changes so quickly. If you take off and see that it's clear, there's a lot of ways to know what's happening and in fact, it's indicative of this because of the search zone of where they found the aircraft was behind where it had already been, where the airplane had already been.

So, that could tell us is one it stalled and fell out of the sky this direction and at that point, it's a little uncontrollable so you don't know if it could have come back this way. But the other alternative the pilot decided it was too risky to continue flying through some of these clouds. You see how difficult that is and you see the peaks. So, he's going to have to try to figure out how to get through these clouds and make the best decision he can, one of which might have been turning around, going back the other way.

PEREIRA: Give know confidence to get back on a plane again. You said the plane stalled and full out of the sky. A lot of things have to happen for that to occur, correct?

SOUCIE: They do. What is critical in that realm is the perception of the pilot as to what's going on and the pilot has to rely on automation. He has to know and rely on instruments to know I'm showing that this is going on it right now and react appropriately to that. So, it's that communication, giving that information from there, perceived properly by the pilot and then interpreted and then mitigated by the pilot. The pilot has to take action and to mitigate --

PEREIRA: And the plane has to respond to the pilot's commands.

SOUCIE: There you go, full circle.

PEREIRA: And that's why when we talk about what could have gone wrong here it's generally not one thing.

SOUCIE: No, in my experience there's never been just one thing, even if it goes all the way back to decisions made by management about training and things like that. It could go that far back.

PEREIRA: But again, this airline has had an impeccable safety record.

SOUCIE: A fantastic record, and Tony Fernandes who took over in 2001 or 2002 of this airlines, has done a great job of putting this -- he runs with an iron fist. He knows how to run an airline. He's run an airline. It's run very well that way.

This is some kind of anomalous thing that happened. It's not something that should make people afraid to fly. It's something that is extremely rare, and it's something that has never really happened before to have an in-flight turbulence in the middle of a flight take an aircraft down if that's what happened.

PEREIRA: And, again, the answers will come from that flight data recorder, come from the debris that they're finding and sadly, from some of the bodies.

SOUCIE: That' where the key is.

PEREIRA: David Soucie, always a pleasure. Thank you so much for your information. We appreciate it.

Still, so many questions, though, lingering about what could have possibly gone wrong aboard that flight. What do we know and what don't with he know? We're going to separate fact from fiction, coming up.

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ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.

PEREIRA: Good to have you back with us here on NEW DAY, watching our continuing coverage of the crash of AirAsia Flight 8501.

Once again, we want to welcome our viewers from around the globe and here in the United States.

We are following our breaking developments -- AirAsia officials saying bodies and debris recovered in the Java Sea are from the missing plane flight 8501. Crews recovering several bodies along with an emergency exit door and aluminum cuttings from the water. That debris found six miles from where the plane was last spotted on radar.