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Hunt For Female Suspect In French Terror Attack; Three Terrorists Killed; Massive Unity Rally Planned For Sunday; The Art Of Negotiating With Terrorists

Aired January 10, 2015 - 11:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

FREDRICKA WHITFIELD, CNN ANCHOR: Hello everyone. I'm Fredricka Whitfield. I'd like to welcome our viewers in the U.S. and around the world. The next hour of NEWSROOM starts right now.

This hour CNN's breaking news coverage continues, armed and dangerous. The last surviving suspect in this week's terrorist attacks in Paris is on the run. Police are on the hunt for this woman.

Plus, new reports that one of the Kouachi brothers was once the roommate of the underwear bomber who tried to blow up a jet liner and fear in Paris. For the first time since World War II, the grand synagogue, a Paris landmark temporarily closed.

We have information about the four hostages who were killed in the kosher supermarket. Here they are according a Jewish news well-known online publication in France. Johan Cohen was 22 years old. Yoav Hattab was 21 years old and we don't know as much about Philippe Braham and Francois Michelle Saada.

A focus of the investigation now, however, finding that fourth suspect, a 26-year-old woman, who was the partner of one of the terrorists killed.

Let's go to Paris now and CNN's Hala Gorani. So Hala, what more do we know about what resources are being devoted to this search or whether her family has been questioned or is at all cooperating?

HALA GORANI, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, we've had our reporters fanned out across the area and the neighborhood where this young woman and the man who is suspected of having killed those four hostages in that kosher supermarket lived together as the couple.

A lot going on here in the French capital as we continue to investigate the connection between the Kouachi brothers, especially Cherif, the younger of the two, and Yemen.

Let's get back now to the woman. Her name is Hayat Boumediene. She is 26 years old. She is still very much on the loose. It is not a manhunt, in this case a woman hunt, considered armed and dangerous. She is reportedly, as I mentioned the girlfriend of the Amedi Coulibaly.

Now he is the man killed in a hail of gunfire when French police stormed the supermarket. Take a look at some of the dramatic video.

(VIDEO CLIP)

GORANI: Well, as you were saying, Fredricka, off the top, four hostages killed. Another 15 survived. Coulibaly reportedly claimed that he was working in tandem with the two brothers suspected of having massacred the people at the "Charlie Hebdo" magazine, the Kouachi brothers.

A French television journalist actually managed something pretty remarkable and spoke to Coulibaly on the telephone. Listen to a portion of that conversation.

Amedi Coulibaly there. I spoke to journalists at BFMTV, that is the network that managed to record the conversation on the phone with the suspect in the kosher supermarket.

They told me that they took out the portions that they considered were simply propaganda. They only excised from the conversation the elements they believed had editorial value for our understanding of the story. CNN has not verified the authenticity of the recording.

In another standoff north of Paris, that is involving the Kouachi brothers who were suspected on the attack on "Charlie Hebdo." And now we're learning more about their links to known terrorists.

A Yemeni journalist just telling us that Said Kouachi was once roommates with the underwear bomber, Umar Abdul Mutallab. He was convicted of trying to blow up a plane over Detroit on Christmas day in 2009. We all remember that story back then.

France for its part is increasing security, why, because tomorrow is a huge rally in the capitol, a unity rally. We're learning that several top level European leaders are actually going to attend including the prime ministers of Great Britain, the chancellor of Germany Angela Merkel.

And we're also learning from the news agency in Turkey that the prime minister of Turkey is also expected to attend this rally. One of the suspects killed in the terrorist attacks may have connection to the underwear bomber.

Now our Frederik Pleitgen has been on this story from the very beginning and he joins me now from outside the kosher deli in the east of Paris where part of this terror plot played out yesterday so dramatically.

All right, so let's talk first about the possible connection between one of the Kouachi brothers and the so-called underwear bomber in Yemen. Tell us more.

FREDERIK PLEITGEN, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Hi, Hala. That is information that we've been getting from people in Yemen who said that a journalist was trying to go to Yemen a couple of years ago in 2011. And he ran into Cherif Kouachi there as he was trying to do a story on the underwear bomber, who was, of course, that person who tried to hijack that Delta Airlines plane flying to Detroit, Abdul Faruk Abdul Mutallab.

Now apparently what Cherif Kouachi told this person is that yes he did know Abdul Mutallab, that he was friends with Abdul Mutallab and that apparently they housed together for about a week in Yemen. It appears as though at that time Kouachi was attending --

GORANI: OK, and can you --

PLEITGEN: -- sort of Arabic lessons in the old town of Sanaa -- yes?

GORANI: All right, and Frederik, you're of course at that kosher supermarket there in east of Paris. Yes. Go ahead, Fred.

PLEITGEN: Right. So that he was attending these Arabic lessons in Sanaa apparently at some sort of institute and that's where these two met. Apparently, they housed together for about a week.

Now one of the things, Hala, that we always have to keep in mind is that this is a single source that we're learning this from. It's not clear whether or not this is true. And of course, one of the things we also know is that we're not going to be able to hear any of this from the Kouachis themselves.

Because, of course, they have been killed and it's one of the reasons why it's so imperative and so important for the police to try and find the last remaining suspect, the woman who is on the run, Hayat Boumediene, who is still on the run to simply try and corroborate some of this.

And trying to establish a possible link between the Kouachis and al Qaeda in the Arabian Peninsula, which of course, is the al Qaeda wing there in Yemen -- Hala.

GORANI: All right, and Fred, I wanted to ask you also about where you are, the kosher supermarket where these four hostages were killed. I understand that several people who hid in the market actually sought shelter in the freezers. What can you tell us about how some people managed to save themselves yesterday?

PLEITGEN: Yes, the freezers in the cooling rooms. The eyewitness accounts we're getting from the siege here at that kosher supermarket are really harrowing. Some are saying that the moment that Coulibaly entered the room. He was coming there literally guns blazing.

They said that he was firing around. One of the things that one woman said was that he said he knew he was not afraid to die and that they saw that he knew that this would be his last stand and that made him all the more dangerous.

So one account that we have is that one person apparently tried to wrestle a gun from Coulibaly, failed and then was shot by him. And that's where this next account comes in to play. Apparently, one of the people who works at the grocery store here said that he helped people to hide inside a freezing and cooling unit because he figured that is one of the places Coulibaly possibly wouldn't look - and then went downstairs and became a hostage himself.

Listen to the account of that person and how he apparently helped these people to hide.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LASSANI BATHILY, KOSHER MARKET HOSTAGE (through translator): When people came down stairs running, I went towards the cold room. I opened the door and many people got into the cold room with me. I switch off the light and switch off the freezer.

He asked us to all come upstairs otherwise he would kill everyone who was downstairs. I asked my colleagues what they thought, should we go upstairs or stay here?

With me there was one person with a 2-year-old baby. When I switched off light in the cold room I closed the door. I told them you stay calm. I'm the one who is going to go out. I took the elevator and went upstairs.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PLEITGEN: So a 2-year-old baby hiding amongst those people inside that cooling and freezing area. Many of these people saying it was, of course, the most frightful hours that they've ever had in their lives.

Of course, that ended at around 4:00 p.m. local time here in Paris when the police unit then stormed that building and managed to free the rest of the hostages. At that point, of course, was the point where Coulibaly himself died in a hail of bullets -- Hala.

GORANI: Right. We were seeing that dramatic video. Fred Pleitgen, stay where you are. We'll be getting back to you as we continue our special coverage there in these Paris terror attacks and the hostage standoff crises that ended thankfully.

But now, Fredricka Whitfield, this country is having to digest everything that happened and try to figure out what happens next as they plan for this big unity rally. Back to you at CNN Headquarters.

WHITFIELD: All right, thanks so much, Hala. Indeed a lot to digest and try to embrace there. We've got a lot more to discuss in fact. Joining us right now from Boise, Idaho is Mike Baker, a former CIA Covert Operations officer.

Mike, you worked in counterterrorist operations in the CIA for nearly 20 years. Do you believe these terrorists took orders from al Qaeda in the Arabian Peninsula or was it just the issue them getting training and then on their own carrying out a plan?

MIKE BAKER, FORMER CIA COVERT OPERATIONS OFFICER: Right. Well, I think sometimes we get wrapped around the actual trying to put all these things in separate little boxes to understand them. At the end of the day, you know, from the Muslim extremist point of view they really don't care.

They are not thinking about it in those same terms. This attack on Charlie Hebdo was green lit years ago before Al-Awlaki was killed in a drone. And at the end of the way, we talked sort shortly after attacks had taken place about the military precision, the military sophistication of the two brothers.

At the end of the day, really no, not sophistication, they had sufficient training. They had sufficient resources and so we talk about is this in the days after, we talked about is the new face of terrorism. It is a face of terrorism.

WHITFIELD: And what are the greatest worries for the intelligence community? And Hala Gorani is still joining me now. And I'll ask you in a moment about what the French law enforcement authority is doing to try to prevent perhaps another potential attack.

But Mike, you know, give me a better sense as to how the intelligence community both in western states, in United States and even in France might be trying to address the fact that so many young people are being trained overseas, who might be able to re-enter European nations or in some cases even U.S. nations. How is this changing the strategy of the intelligence community?

BAKER: Absolutely. It is a great question. Shortly after 9/11, in the world of counterterrorism, spent a lot of time worrying. Everyone was worrying about this very type of attack and whether this type of attack or something happened in Sidney with the hostage or Mumbai.

That was one of the top primary scenarios the world of counterterrorism was worried about. What's changed? Well, in part recently what's changed is essentially the success that ISIS has had in particular in gaining territorial integrity.

And we know from the past what happens when the extremists have that sort of comfort to plot and plan and train, in particular, within territory that they control. So that's been one of the issues.

And also, of course, the physical manifestation of this caliphate idea that's been banging around forever has allowed for more recruitment success. You have pointed to the biggest problem, which is again, over a thousand French citizens, from Germany, Spain, the U.K, the same issue.

All of these people transiting back and forth. Essentially the open borders have been created. Combine that with this multicultural celebrate your own identity. Don't assimilate policy that had been in Western Europe for decades. It's a very dangerous combination.

WHITFIELD: And then Hala, let me bring you back into the equation because, you know, Mike talking about a thousand from France alone who were transiting whether it be according to a senior U.S. officials who were saying either transiting to Syria and other places in which young terrorists might be trained and then overall we're talking about 3,000 in the European community.

So what are French authorities doing or even saying there about how they are trying to keep track of who some of these young people, who are traveling to locations that are known for terrorist or at least training of terrorist activity?

GORANI: There are many questions already being asked, even though the country is still mourning. And that is it appears as though one of the Kouachi brothers spent time in Yemen, according to one of our sources who spoke to CNN. He may have even been a roommate of the underwear bomber and that failed Christmas day plot in 2009.

So the question has to be at this point, if this person, the Kouachi brother was radicalized to the extent that he traveled to Yemen and spent time with Anwar Al-Awlaki, a known al Qaeda bomber, al Qaeda in the Arabian Peninsula.

Even spent time with a man who was then caught trying to bring down a commercial airliner, at what point did the intelligence failure happened to allow this individual to then organize an operation such as the one we saw here in Paris against "Charlie Hebdo" that ended up in the ruthless killing of 12 people.

These questions are going to have to be asked. I'm not second guessing French intelligence. I know there are many cases in which they diffused plots and they've been very successful at that and it's something that they do even according to American intelligence.

And even if I could ask Mike Baker that they do rather well. But something broke down here that led to this scenario and this blood bath in France. And that question is going to have to be answer. There is going to have to be on this one a very important conversation.

WHITFIELD: And then Mike, what answers are you hoping to hear from French authorities on that? We are awaiting the French interior minister who will be addressing a number of questions momentarily. But before he actually takes to that microphone there, what are you hoping to hear from French authorities?

BAKER: Well, you have a couple of different tracks. You've got sort of the big picture, 30,000, what are our policies for transiting borders? What are policies for detaining suspects coming into an airport? What are our policies for taking passports away? You've got those big issues.

And then you got the operation issues of, you know, this attack on for instance, on "Charlie Hebdo". What did we miss? Did our counter surveillance because we knew it was a target. Did we miss the final surveillance efforts by the brothers or whoever was involved?

We're also hoping to find out and this is what they're working. They working feverishly on it is how big was this network? Who else involved in the support? How did they get the weapons? Who held the weapons prior to the attack? Where there any safe houses involved? What about the comes, that sort of thing. WHITFIELD: All right, hold your thought right there. Mike Baker, Hala Gorani, thank you so much. So what was missed and what might be ahead in the investigation, some of the questions perhaps going to be posed to the French interior minister there in Paris momentarily.

We'll be taking you live to Paris for that press conference and we'll also get information about what kind of measures are being taken in preparation for tomorrow's sizable rally through the streets of Paris. We'll be right back after this.

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WHITFIELD: Live right now from Paris, the interior minister talking about security measures that will be put into place for tomorrow's rather sizable unity rally expected with prime ministers from Germany, Turkey and Great Britain also in attendance. Let's listen in.

BERNARD CAZANAUVE, FRENCH INTERIOR MINISTER (through translator): -- aimed at the country of the rights of man in its general and broad definition and wishing to present alongside French people and to share their mourning and sadness, I would recall what was said once by General De Gaulle, there is secular pact between the greatest of France and freedom in the world.

And so we want to thank our guests with this mind and so the minister of the interior at the request of public and the prime minister will take some exceptional measures to assure the safety of the rally and the respectful public order.

To guarantee fluid flow of many people going from the Plaza Derepublic to Plaza Nacion two parallel routes will be made secure. Firstly, the main itinerary linking the plazas over a distance of about 3 kilometers because of the expected participation there will be an itinerary (inaudible), which will be reserved.

To facilitate the disperse the public unit for coordinating movements will be established in order to show the proper functioning of things and to ensure to those taking part maximum security.

The 24 units of the national reserve and of intervention units for traffic police and public order will be responsible for stand alongside itinerary to make sure that the access routes are passable.

And to channel the public to the itineraries have which have been established, 150 policemen in plain clothes will be on the order to protect distinguished persons and to detect from dangerous people there will be sharp shooters on the roofs.

Roofs and drains will be inspected and 56 motorcycle teams will accompany the vehicles and a number of public safety or rescue posts will be established along the itinerary.

Further more parking will be prohibited for all vehicles along the route and metro stations will be closed as of 11:00 in order to prevent main route being overcrowded. And others will be closed as of 12:00 for the same reasons. The other network stations will be closed and then opened as and when in coordination with the services to facilitate the dispersal of the crowds. And these places will be particularly well guarded. And units of the mobile units were mobilized, 2,200 men and the plan will be maintained at a high level.

And all this will make it possible to continue to guarantee the protection of many sensitive sites. I'm thinking in particular of the media, the audio visual and radio and print press, certain schools, confessional religious builds and sites of worship and diplomatic missions.

And 150 soldiers will be involved also and I will recall that demonstrations will take place tomorrow throughout the whole of France and as of today 700,000 of our citizens have marched in Marseille and others s Montpelier and these among city which is tomorrow will organize marches.

And units organized to help. The highest authorities of the state, the president of the republic and the prime minister and also a number of heads of states and government from abroad will participate in this rally. And as you can see, these are exceptional measures because of the scope of the march, because of its very symbolic meaning.

And we are taking these measures to ensure the smooth running of it all in an atmosphere of respect and memory, recalling those who lost their lives assassinated by terrorists.

Thank you and -- if you agree I will after you have gone to another demonstration, I will ask the prefect or Paris police to reply to any questions that there may be. Any questions you may like to put to him.

WHITFIELD: You are listening to the French interior minister really kind of lay the groundwork for the unity rallies taking place in Paris and beyond. He mentioned from Paris to Marseille to Leon. There will be about 700,000 people in France, citizens paying homage to this day.

Recognizing those lives lost in the massacre at the cartoon publication as well as paying homage to the freedom, the ongoing freedom of the press. You are hearing from the interior minister there.

We still have with us Hala Gorani, who is in Paris, and we have former CIA covert operations officer, Mike Baker, with us. We heard him really lay the groundwork. There will be snipers on the roof tops.

You will have plain clothes officers blending in there with the crowd. Drains will be inspected. Parking will be prohibited in many of the localities there in Paris where the rally is to take place. And even the metro will be closed in many locations.

And Hala, you can paint the picture for us. That is how most people get around in Paris by use of the metro. It will be a standstill but at the same time it sounds like the interior minister is laying out the plan that it will be an accessible and all inclusive rally that will be taking place with incredible security at hand.

GORANI: Aight. And if I can add, public transport will be free. So people who want to get around will be able to do so without paying. Maximum security, 1300 troops protecting the event. The anti-terror plan intensified in general across the nation. You mentioned rallies in other big cities.

And he also provided the itinerary for the rally. Keep in mind you have high level government officials expected to come to Paris tomorrow for a show of support, Angela Merkel, the chancellor of Germany, David Cameron, the prime minister of Britain.

We're also expecting the prime minister of Spain, possibly at least according to the Turkish news agency, the prime minister of Turkey, which could be a highly symbolic visit as well since we all know these massacres reported massacred these 12 people at "Charlie Hebdo" for having drawn cartoons that they saw as insulting the Prophet Muhammad.

So this is truly going to be almost like a summit. It almost like it is a state funeral or something where it gives the nation an opportunity to grieve, to mourn and also perhaps opportunity for some closure here.

WHITFIELD: And Mike, I wonder how important is it in your view that while the stage is being set for exactly what Hala said, it's making allowances for people to come out to feel comfortable.

At the same time the arsenal is letting the public and perhaps anybody else planning something up to no good letting them know about the resources in place. Why is that important for the interior minister do that?

BAKER: Well, you have to explain to the public, which obviously now is a great deal of angst. They are jittery and you have to tell them look. This is what wore doing on your behalf. This is why we want you to come out. We want you to feel safe in your own streets.

And believe me, you know, 99 percent of what they are doing from a security perspective he is not talking about and won't be visible. The counterterrorism police in France, the Parisian authorities the military are very capable, extremely good at this thing.

So they will have it locked down to the degree we can. It's terrific we're getting western leaders showing. What will be more meaningful is if we get a lot large number of Muslim leaders from around the world to actually show up.

Because I would argue, we can do this all we want, we can gather have western leader conferences and we can continue on the operational to prevent and plan and disrupt all the attacks.

But until we get the leaders of the Muslim world to consistently constantly, aggressively berate and pressure and strong arm the extremist community within their vast non extremist community and ostracize them into a box and bury that box then, we're never going to deal with them in a meaningfully significant way. WHITFIELD: And so Hala, what about them from the -- go ahead.

GORANI: I wanted to weigh in on that. The prime minister of Turkey is the prime minister of one of the most populous Muslim nations on earth so this is highly symbolic if it happens on Sunday. Community leaders and mosque leaders in Paris have come out.

They have come out to some of these demonstrations holding out placards saying not in my name. I think what people have to remember is hyperradicalized youth do not listen to moderate Muslim community leaders. They don't.

They are radicalized and take trips to Yemen where they have the most extreme of extremist Islamist teaching them the types of things that they don't go out and say and yell when they massacre people.

The question has to be a wider one I think. That's what many people in France are saying now. You can have the moderate Muslim mosque leader come out and lay a rose in honor of the fallen.

But at what point do you have a national conversation about how to integrate some of these communities. This is a very big question not just for France, but also other European countries. That is why I think you are seeing so many western leaders come out.

WHITFIELD: All right, we're going to have that conversation later on about that national conversation whether it be in France or even other western nations about the feeling of the disenfranchisement that people of Middle Eastern or even African decent may feel particularly there in France.

And Mike, thank you so much. We're going to check back with you as well later on in this hour. Still ahead, tense moments indeed for negotiators in particular over the past three days, where terrorist barricaded hostages every second counted. How did negotiators work through it all? We'll ask a security expert straight ahead.

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WHITFIELD: All right, we now know the names of four hostages killed by terrorists at that Paris market. According to JFS News, a well- known online Jewish publication in France, they are Johan Cohan age 22, Yoav Hattab age 21, Philippe Braham and Francois Michelle Saada.

Israeli government sources tell CNN 15 others were rescued in a standoff with terrorists. The art of negotiation becomes critically important and adding hostages to the mix further complicates an already dangerous situation.

And when police are dealing with two simultaneous negotiations coordination is a must, but the final and perhaps most daunting obstacle is the realization that terrorists in their own words want to die as martyrs.

Joining me right now from New York is Sal Lifneri, a security consultant. He was once security for New York Mayor Rudy Giuliani's Office of Emergency Management. Good to see you, Sal.

SAL LIFNERI, SECURITY CONSULTANT: Good morning.

WHITFIELD: So if you could kind of put yourself in the shoes of the negotiators and what we saw over the last few days. What was their first priority especially when in both cases it was really unclear how many people might be in those localities, the print office or even the market?

LIFNERI: One of the toughest things as a negotiator when you first get to the situation is to try and calm everything down. There is always this close pursuit mentality when you are going after the gunmen and this particular case was probably more difficult than most.

In that person they were -- the people they were going after had killed police officers. So you have a big emotional pull that is affecting all of the response.

And then you try and get in and try and stop everybody and say OK time is on our side. Let's use the time and figure out what we have. And again this was further complicated by the fact that we had learned very quickly that this had potential terrorism ties that there was stuff going back to Yemen.

So what you try and do in the initial phases of a negotiation is to collect as much intelligence on the person you are dealing with, the person you are going to negotiate with.

At that point you now realize this isn't somebody who is just living day to day of an average citizen that you are contending with. You now have a much greater field you have to take a look at and assimilate that information rather quickly.

WHITFIELD: How important is it for negotiators or are these even things to consider, that what they knew at this juncture when there were terrorists in these two locations that there may potentially be some hostages, but they weren't really sure.

You mentioned that police officers had been killed. That's one thing, but that there was an escape from that publication as opposed to staying there and dying as martyrs.

And it was later expressed that I either die are I get 40 years. How many of that information is privy to the negotiators and how much does that play a role in how they approach the situations?

LIFNERI: You know, one of the biggest problems we have in any of the breaking news stories and that it always the fact of what is real and what is not? What is assumed? What's been verified? Some of the conversations that were had and I talked about this yesterday, about some of the conversations that the brothers were having the publication.

WHITFIELD: Like we don't kill women.

LIFNERI: Like we don't kill women. So there seemed to be some conflict between them. That would be somewhat critical to the negotiator to know at this particular point in time is what is the relationship between the two brothers? What are they talking about? What the relationship?

One of the things we don't talk vastly about, but there is a tremendous amount of technology and technique that is utilized at a hostage situation. And that information gets made available to the primary hostage negotiator or to the coach next to him.

So there is a lot of information that they are looking at and that from -- you know, as we look at this and, you know, sitting back in the studios watching it, sometimes we're questioning what were the decisions that were being made.

WHITFIELD: Right.

LIFNERI: It's based on their making the decisions based on the information that's in front of them at the moment.

WHITFIELD: Right real time versus that reflective kind of time. All right, thank you so much, Sal Lifneri. Appreciate your expertise.

All right, coming up free speech advocates are standing strong in the wake of the terrorist attack on the "Charlie Hebdo" in Paris. But some are saying there should be limits on the right to mock and shock even in a free society. Are there any areas off limits?

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

WHITFIELD: France is gearing up for that massive unity rally tomorrow. Moments ago we heard from the French interior minutes about the 1,900 troops, which will provide additional security and several foreign dignitaries are expected to attend.

Let's go now to Paris and CNN's Hala Gorani where we continue our live coverage. Hala, give me an idea what kind of anticipation is permeating through the city for this huge rally tomorrow?

GORANI: You know, it is a tragic but also surreal scene here. People associate Paris with romance and the padlock tops bridges and the city of lights, but for the last three days parts of the city truly looked like a war zone.

SWAT teams, you have military troops. You had military transport planes landing in Paris Regional Airports. It was truly surreal and the Parisians and the French people in general are having to adapt to this reality over the last several days that their own French born individuals that have traveled to Yemen, to other parts of the Middle East and radicalized and come back to just massacre people in broad daylight.

It is truly a new reality for this country and as you mentioned, Fredricka, we're also working to bring together this massive unity rallies, the largest one in which will be held here in Paris.

Joining me now is Janine De Giovani. She is an author and the Middle East editor for "Newsweek." And Janine, you wrote about comments from former president, Nicholas (inaudience.)

There was outreach to the Jewish community as well because the second hostage standoff was at the kosher supermarket and four French Jews were killed in that.

JANINE DI GIOVANNI, MIDDLE EAST EDITOR, "NEWSWEEK": First off all the general population of Paris is very, very tense. Walking to drop my son off at school for general activities, they have all schools security alerts with armed guards with the automatic weapons, which is very disconcerting to see.

As you said Paris almost looks like a war zone now. I think Sarcosi's remarks that this was an attack against civilization. I think the Jewish population in France, of course, which has one of the largest in all of Europe are on alert, are saddened, are frightened.

But I think it's all French. I think that as well as all Europeans. I mean, I think we have to now being to think about borders, tightening security. What are we going to be looking at for the future? What is the retaliation, the fallback going to be?

I'm very worried personally about the extremist reactions between the right which will use this as opportunity to twist the narrative into a war between Muslims and Europe and the left or the jihadist who will be young people drawn to this by feeling their --

GORANI: I'm sorry to jump in, but it feels like there is going to be a hardening on both end of the spectrum. We're seeing all over the world at this hour but also in the United States as well, Janine.

And I want to ask a very much a topic in the U.S. after the Snowden leaks, which is what would French people like the response of their government to be for all this? Do they want more surveillance, more policing or is there a fundamental difference between the two approaches, do you think?

GIOVANNI: I think most French I know are always horrified by American gun laws. I think in the sense there isn't really an issue of people here having guns or there are incidents that happen in the way they do in the United States.

But I think there will be a call for more security. A lot of pressure on the government on the president to step up tactics, to think how did this happen. It's really quite extraordinary that the terrorists got into the newspaper on that day while they were having a meeting. It's so well planned out, but still how did we allowed this to happen.

GORANI: So you think after this massacre, the hostage standoff that we saw, two of them outside Paris and inside Paris, there may be a shift in public opinion as to how to respond to this terrorist threat?

GIOVANNI: I'm worried about this. This does concern me. I think before there had been a lot of -- looking at the United States and criticizing guns and people who arm themselves, but how do we protect our families? If there is going to be an attack and there hasn't been confirmed, but Al Qaeda in Yemen has been saying they will have fresh attacks on France for their involvement in war against the Muslims. Then what will people do here? How will they protect themselves?

On the other hand, I have to say there is a big attitude of "we are not afraid." We are not going to, but there is a great sense of solidarity and unity.

GORANI: We're getting searched on our ways into stores, which is something very unusual. We'll toss it back to Atlanta. But as we do, I want to bring to our viewers' attention, that on the arc of triumph is, Paris is Charlie, to honor the victims on this very rainy, windy day.

A quick break, back to Fredricka on the other side, but when we come back, staff members of the satirical weekly massacred in Paris, now some should say that there should be perhaps limits on the rights of the free press when it comes to provocative expression. We'll explore that question, coming up.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

WHITFIELD: All right. Back to our continuing coverage of the terror attacks in France, President Obama is calling the attack on the satirical magazine, "Charlie Hebdo," a show of fear by the terrorists.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA: The fact that this was an attack on our free press also how that these terrorists feared freedom of speech and freedom of the press.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WHITFIELD: I'm joined by CNN terrorism analyst, Paul Cruickshank and Bobby Ghosh, CNN global affairs analyst and managing editor of "Quartz." Good to see both of you, Gentlemen.

So I wonder, Bobby, if I can begin with you. Because we see it says, you know, Paris is Charlie, and you see signs, people saying, Je Suis Charlie. But is that enough in your view to disarm the real motivation behind these terrorists and perhaps other percolating terrorist plans or groups right there in France?

BOBBY GHOSH, CNN GLOBAL AFFAIRS ANALYST: Well, as you had Janine say in the previous segment, France has -- right now, this seems to be an appropriate way to mourn. It's a very powerful emotion and these images traveling around the world make a great impact.

But after the spirit of mourning, France also has deeper questions to ask itself about integration and about what to do with angry and disaffected young men, and these are mostly men if their midst, especially in this age, when anger and disaffection can be very quickly crystalized into hatred and then very quickly, after that, into violence. Now, those are issues that society at large has to deal with. There's a political dimension to it, a security dimension to it, but there's a societal dimension to it.

As far as the motivations of these people go, France is very unlikely to change its own view about freedom of expression, its own long- standing and much cherished tradition of satire, even occasionally offensive satire that is something the French hold very dear and have for centuries. I can't see that that is going to change.

WHITFIELD: So the Paul, are you in agreement with Bobby that it's much bigger than the attack on the freedom of press, that it's something far deeper that this country has to deal, that law enforcement has to deal, not perhaps just in France, but in other western nations?

PAUL CRUICKSHANK, CNN TERRORISM ANALYST: Well, that's right. I mean, there's an unprecedented threat in Europe right now. And that's because there's so many European extremists who have gone off to Syria and Iraq and joined up with jihadist groups there.

About 3,000, I believe, have traveled. There are about 400 French nationals fighting now in Syria, 200 want to go, 200 are on their way, 200 are already back in France. The 5,000 individuals in France are on the French security agency watch list. So this is a very, very significant problem in France, indeed.

There's the problem of these gritty suburbs on the fringes of French cities with large North American populations, a lot of alien nation there.

There's a real message of ISIS spread through social media and also the message of al Qaeda. So a lot of concern right throughout Europe. But just because of the sheer numbers who have become radicalized, and really the war in Syria, the jihad in Syria has inspired a lot of this, really energized a lot of Jihadis.

And I think this attack on the cartoonists in Paris is electrifying the jihadist movement. It was a real hot button issue for Muslims and terrorist groups, for some time have been trying to put a plot together to take out the cartoonists.

For example, in 2010, al Qaeda organized a plot for a Swedish cell to drive over to Copenhagen to murder 200 journalists in Copenhagen at the newspaper that originally published the cartoons. I don't think we're likely to see the last plot against cartoonists in Europe.

WHITFIELD: Paul, you ticked off a lot of numbers there, talking out people who are traveling to places like Yemen or other places where there is known terrorist training activity. And you know, some U.S. officials are saying that 3,000 number really encompasses all of Europe.

It's not just France that has a problem, but all of Europe. So Bobby, I wonder, how do European nations and of course the United States try to tackle that kind of transit of young, mostly men, but we know some young ladies too, of Middle Eastern or African descent, without profiling.

Because therein lies yet another big problem, particularly in France, where you hear a number of young people already say they feel disenfranchised, but how are law enforcement going to be able to watch the behavior or the travels of some of these young people and not also overlook some of the more obvious candidates who maybe are not of Middle Eastern or North African descent?

GHOSH: It's an enormous security challenge. And truth be told, the Europeans in general, and the French in particular, do it well. Those numbers that Paul just gave you, give you a sense of the scale of the problem.

The fact that there have been relative to those numbers, few attacks in Europe, suggests that the security agencies are doing well. The French, if you just take the French intelligence, they pride themselves at having excellent connections into communities.

They pride themselves at being very good at infiltrating radical groups. They use fairly sophisticated eavesdropping technology, but also old-fashioned boots on the ground espionage techniques. They have got good ears on the ground in North Africa, in countries, countries in particular where there may be opportunities for French citizens to go and radicalize them.

So it's already a quite sophisticated and quite efficient program. But it's -- but as we've just discovered this past week, even the best-laid plans, even the best net does not protect absolutely. There will be people who get through.

And that suggests that there needs to be, that that points to the fact that this is not only a security challenge, there are economic issues, there are social issues, there are conversations that need to be had between communities and within communities, before we can address them.

WHITFIELD: All right. Bobby Ghosh, Paul Cruickshank, thanks so much to you both, Gentlemen. Appreciate it. We'll be checking back with you momentarily.

Meantime, we have much more straight ahead in the NEWSROOM and it all starts right now.