Return to Transcripts main page

CNN Newsroom

Dakota Meyer Taking on ISIS After Warnings the Group Is Targeting Members of the Military; Federal Court That Will Try Accused Boston Marathon Bomber Dzhokhar Tsarnaev is Casting Wide Net for Impartial Jurors

Aired January 14, 2015 - 15:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN HOST: That mother is not the only one telling ISIS what to do. One of the most respected marines in this country is challenging these terrorists as well. Dakota Meyer received a medal of honor in 2011 for his bravery in Afghanistan. He helped saved 13 marines and 23 Afghan soldiers. Now, he is taking on ISIS after warnings the group is targeting members f the military.

Meyer who is now marine reservist posted this and we will talk to him in just a second. He posted this. ISIS, targeting the U.S. military is like a sheep targeting a lion. I think this warning should be taken seriously by all military members. I would hate for ISIS to go to anyone else's home and for me to miss the opportunity for me to meet and greet them. I'll take the responsibility to be liaison for the military. And then Meyer revealed his hometown and he tweeted this photo, do we have the photo? We have a photo of him asking ISIS to join. Here we go. With a pipe and all to join his book club.

Dakota Meyer, author of "In The Fire" joins me now.

Sgt. Meyer, honored does not do justice how I feel having you on today sir. Welcome. Thank you so much for your service to this country.

SGT. DAKOTA MEYER, MEDAL OF HONOR RECIPIENT: Thank you so much. Thank you.

BALDWIN: So, you know the deal. All these warnings, the FBI suggesting to, you know, members of U.S. military to, you know, clear your social media accounts of any kind of links to military, fear of being targeted by terrorists like ISIS. And your response sir is bring it. Tell me why.

MEYER: I mean, look, I think it's not just -- it is just taunting ISIS. It's about symbolization of who we are as Americans. I mean, you know, Terrorism wins and it feeds off of when you start changing your way of life and start living in fear. And that's what these people want. They're cowards. They are cowards that prey on the week and soft targets. And I just wanted to put that out there to show that look, we shouldn't live in fear. We need to stand up against these people and show them that we will not become the victim.

BALDWIN: What then do you say to some of these, you know, military families? We just -- CNN.com has profiled this phenomenal piece where we profile number of family members who are indeed, you know, heeding this cry. They are removing their posts from social media. And let me just quote one of these anonymous wife whose husband is in the special forces and this is what she told us here at CNN.

Let me read. It's quote "it is hard because I'm so proud of what my husband does. But lately so many spouses that I know are actually scared that they could be targets of a ISIS or someone who sympathizes with ISIS.

Sergeant, what would you say to her?

MEYER: Look. None of us want to come in contact with I.S. I mean, none of us want to walk down the street and say, you know, I really -- I look forward to fighting these people. Hope they go attack my family. But let's be realistic here. Don't change the way we live. I mean, we have to stand up to it.

You know, starting to do that stuff, it makes you become the victim. I think the French editor said it best when they said you know, I would rather die standing than I would live on my knees. And that's really how we have to look at life. I mean, that's how it is.

BALDWIN: You know Sergeant Meyer, I was talking to a writer from the blog yesterday and he wrote this whole piece about how terrorism is working I think to your point. You know, here we have this war on terror as it's called. We, you know, of course, in the wake of so many different attacks, we're enraged. Many of us fearful. In his point is that it is working. The sheer definition of terrorism -- terror is working.

MEYER: And it is. It is working. You know, when you start hoping they don't come, when you start sitting there changing your life and taking down things you're proud of. I mean, the proudest thing in my life is my military service. It is the proudest part in my life is being a United States marine. And there is no way that I'm going to take that off of anything because that's the proudest part of me. When you start changing what defines you because you're scared that someone is going to hurt you, I mean, that's terrorism. And that means it's winning.

BALDWIN: Let me get you to weigh in on the White House. You have the Spokesperson Josh Earnest saying he would not criticize anyone who chooses to refer to these recent attacks as radical Islam. They are not saying that, but he said that the Obama administration by using the term violent extremism, they're trying to be, he says, more specific, more accurate as describing what exactly happened. What are your thoughts on that?

MEYER: I mean, how accurate do you need to be? I mean, I think that one of the big issues is that our administration is both sides. It is not the right or left, it's both sides. We hired these people to make decisions on behalf of our country and do something and take action and protect us. And they're not doing it. I mean, they're not even representing us as Americans the right way. You're telling me that --

BALDWIN: How do you mean? MEYER: Well, I mean, you take -- they didn't even show up to the

French march. You're telling me that they didn't understand the importance of it? I mean, honestly, they understand the importance of Ferguson and things like that but they don't understand the importance of one of our nations that's been our ally for so long? And this is such a huge crisis. I mean, you really got to scratch your head on either their thought pattern or who's advising them. I mean, I'm just a country boy from Kentucky. I mean, you know, I can even get that.

BALDWIN: You know, I think a lot of people that agree with you, everyone the White House. Josh earnest came out and said listen, essentially saying our bad. We should have sent a higher profile from the administration, so to your point there.

Sergeant Dakota Meyer, thank you, thank you. Come back. All right?

MEYER: No, thank you.

BALDWIN: Thank you.

Could the Paris attack paint the jury pool for this upcoming Boston bombing trials? The defense attorney seems to think, yes. We are going to talk to one of the men who was in that jury pool, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BALDWIN: The federal court that will try accused Boston marathon bomber Dzhokhar Tsarnaev is casting a wide net for impartial jurors, 1200 jurors have been summoned to find 12 jurors, six alternates by January 26th. The defense already tried to postponed his process because of the terror attacks in Paris. That request was denied.

Ted Wayman in Boston now, a journalist who was summoned for Tsarnaev jury. We'll talk to him about this. And Mel Robbins, CNN commentator, legal analysts and someone who also happens to lives in Boston. Welcome to both of you.

And Ted, I just have to begin with you. I mean, you cover news in Boston for a couple decades. I mean, did you ever in a million years think you'd be walking in for jury duty for this potential trial?

TED WAYMAN, SUMMONED FOR TSARNAEV JURY: Well Brooke, I had covered literally dozens trials in that courthouse. And I knew it was January 5th that I was headed in there. But when I saw that huge media circuits up front, and then all of the sudden I was in a pool of 200 people, I knew I was in front of that case.

BALDWIN: How -- describe walking into the room. I had read you said there was a gasp among some of the people realizing and seeing Tsarnaev.

WAYMAN: It was. There was a gasp. It was interesting walking in, 200 juror ready to go. And then there was a glass partition. And all of my former colleagues in the news reporting at me saying to me, my gosh, are you a juror? And I really couldn't respond. But then once the prosecution walked in, I knew member of the prosecution, I knew members of the defense. I had been in the judge's courtroom many times. And then I saw the defendant come in. And there was actual physical gasps when they saw the defendant sit down with his defense team.

BALDWIN: What did he look like? How did he appear? Mel, I promise I'm coming to you in just a second.

MEL ROBBINS, CNN COMMENTATOR/LEGAL ANALYST: No problem. I'm riveted. I want to hear all this.

WAYMAN: He was completely indifferent. Didn't really pay much attention to his defense team, didn't look at the prosecutors. He was listening to judges as we all were, but just kind of that thousand yard stare in looking at the jury making no eye contact. But I could tell you, all 200 sets of eyes were on the defendant that day.

BALDWIN: My goodness.

Mel Robbins, so to you. In all cases you've, you know, been familiar with. Have you ever heard of a judge, you know, saying yes to, in this case, it would have been the defense attorneys, they wanted to wait a month because of what happened in Paris for the jury selection based upon current events?

MEL ROBBINS, CNN COMMENTATOR/LEGAL ANALYST: Well, you know, I think the closest thing that we've seen is when they tried to change venue both for this case and for the 9/11 trial cases where they were citing media coverage as the reason why they wouldn't be able to find impartial jurors. And that's what the defense was arguing this motion that was shot down almost as quick as they applied for the motion. The federal judge o' tool shot it down saying forget about it. I've seen the questionnaires of these jurors have filled out. You have the proves of (INAUDIBLE). You can question them about the French terror attacks. I'm not delaying this. We're moving forward, Brooke.

BALDWIN: As far as jury selection, this is so huge. Because not only as is this incredibly high profile, you know, federal trial, but it also has the potential for capital punishment. So how does that change things as they are selecting these jurors?

ROBBINS: Well, one thing that you may be interested to know, is that you can't sit on a death penalty case unless you're willing and you can admit during (INAUDIBLE) that you could vote for the death penalty if the person is convicted.

And so, everybody that will be seated of the 18 will have responded in a way during (INAUDIBLE) that says, yes under the circumstances, if prove, yes I could. I don't have an objection that would prevent me from delivering the death penalty as the sentencing verdict.

Now, here's the interesting twist in terms of how they're picking the jury. What the prosecution is going to argue is that based on what Tsarnaev did, based on the terrorist act that they are not going to convict them all, I believe, he will be convicted probably of all 30 counts, that he deserves the death penalty. I mean, he did it injured 260 people, blew the limbs off 16 people and killed another four. What the defense is going to argue is they are going to argue spare

the kid. Give him life imprison without the possibility of parole. It was his brother who was the master mind. But to the extent, Brooke, that jurors potentially look at this not as a one off but as part of a larger terrorist threat. Something that may or may not be connected to terrorists attacks, however, something that is just looming out there. It might influence somebody to say wait a minute. This wasn't just some dopey kid that had drunk the cool aid his brother was serving. This kid was a home grown terrorist, exactly what Al-Qaeda and ISIS want. And he deserves the death penalty. So, you know, remains to be seen. But that's how it could play out in court, Brooke.

BALDWIN: Ted, to you, just final question. You are there in Boston as a newsman, as a Bostonian, is there this sort of sense of buzz in the city that this really this huge trial is about to happen?

WAYMAN: I think what people, Brooke, are going to be caught about how long this trial actually goes. Judge O'Toole said for the final 12 and six alternates who are ultimately chosen, they're going to really have to take four months of their lives for this trial before they're going to get a verdict.

So I think once judge O'Toole mandated, fist of all, the no one discuss about the case but also said we appreciate your time. Because it's going to be four months before you get back to a normal lifestyle. That caught many people in the jury pool off guard.

BALDWIN: Four months. Ted Wayman, you're out. Meg Robbins, thank you so much, to both of you, obviously. We will be covering that from the beginning to end.

"Charlie Hebdo" cartoonists were the target in Paris last week. But a U.S. cartoonist has been in Hiding for years facing threats. We hear from her friends, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BALDWIN: Tragically the "Charlie Hebdo" staffers killed last week in Paris were not the only journalists targeted for depicting the prophet Mohammed. The (INAUDIBLE) the United States for cartoonist Molly Norris (ph) has been hiding four years.

CNN's Alina Machado reports.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I've been grieving for four years.

ALINA MACHADO, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): It's been that since Tim Apallo has seen or heard from his colleague and friend Molly Norris, a Seattle cartoonist who went in hiding in 2010 after receiving death threats from radical Islamists.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She's the unlikeliest person to be at the center of an international incident involving hate. MACHADO: Radical cleric al-Awlaki said Norris was a prime target for

execution, for creating cartoons of the prophet Mohammed proposing and everybody drama hamid (ph) day. Her illustrations depict the likeness of the prophet as several items including teacup and domino.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She didn't mean to skewer or offend. She just thought people should lighten up. She was standing up for free speech.

MACHADO: The FBI told Norris her life was in danger. And she decided to disappear. Apallo says she compared the threats to cancer.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You never know if it's going to be fine the rest your life or erupt at some point and end your life.

MACHADO: Three years after she vanished, Norris' name popped up again, this time on Al-Qaeda's most wanted list in the jihadist magazine "Inspire." The list also included "Charlie Hebdo" editor gunned down last week in Paris.

Alina Machado, CNN, New York.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BALDWIN: Also a close friend of Molly Norris has spoke out to CNN about the death threats in her life and hiding. Her years now in hiding, (INAUDIBLE) is Muslim, executive director of the council on American Islamic relations. And he spoke with my colleague Erin Burnett last night on your show. And so, what did he share?

ERIN BURNETT, CNN HOST, OUTFRONT: You know, it's interesting. Because he -- the care is the largest advocacy civil rights group for Muslims in America. And obviously, a controversial group in his own right. But when these things first happened, at first I think they didn't know what to think. They were probably angry too.

Molly then, he said reached out to him, reached out to Muslims in Seattle, tried to understand, actually did a short film on Muslim women in America wearing the veil. Tried to really put information out there. And he said her life has completely changed and he is one of her closest friends. Here is what he said to say.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She is the most sincere person I have ever met. She's the most well-meaning person you will ever meet. She stands up for what she believes is right and in standing up for what she believes is right. She drew those cartoons not to insult a minority group but just to stand up for free speech.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BURNETT: And now, Brooke, you know, with this Paris event, she as you just heard Alina report, you know, one of the editors for "Charlie Hebdo" was on the same list that Molly Norris is on. So her life is changed. You know, one expert said it's the equivalent of being dead. You have to change your name. You have to live somewhere else. You can't --it's not a free normal life like we would live.

BALDWIN: And that mean in hiding for four years?

BURNETT: In hiding for four years. And Arselon (ph) said, well, she had hoped the controversy would die down, that she could go back to her life. And this has now change that. The answer maybe never. That she never can.

And when you think about it, it's not just that in some sense the equivalence of being dead, as one former FBI agent told me, that some people who go through this, you have to not just change your name and where you live, some of them has actually change their appearance.

Now, we have no idea --

BALDWIN: Like Plastic surgery?

BURNETT: Plastic surgery. And you know, one person who went through this with the same issue with fears of Islamic extremists told me you know, look, I didn't actually go through the plastic surgery and I know that I'm risking my life, but I wanted my own children to recognize me. And I thought that just poignantly made the point about how you do something and you do not realize and it's something like this, there is no time where you know OK, now it's OK, now I can go back to being Molly Norris in her case.

BALDWIN: Right. Somewhere in hiding over what she drew.

Erin Burnett, thank you. See you tonight 7:00 p.m., "OUTFRONT".

BURNETT: Thanks, Brooke.

BALDWIN: Next, two brave guys have been climbing up a cliff, mighty tall cliff, I might add or about two and a half weeks. This is El Capitan at Yosemite. They are almost at the summit. One climber's dad joins me live next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BALDWIN: My goodness. This is so exciting. History is about to be made in Yosemite national park. Tommy Caldwell and Kevin Jorgenson will be the first to free climb the route El Capitan, (INAUDIBLE) higher than two empire state buildings stacked one on top of each other. This was Jorgenson about halfway up.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KEVIN JORGENSON, YOSEMITE CLIMBERS: There's this crazy arctic wind storm happening today. It's getting pretty rowdy. We're taking a rest day today because our skin took a beating but tomorrow, we are on to pitch 15.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: My goodness. On the phone with me now, Michael Caldwell, whose son Tommy is also near that summit. As I speak, I hear we are, you know, hours away and you are there at El Capitan at the meadow in Yosemite Valley, Michael. I mean Why, tell me why your son wants to do this so badly.

MICHAEL CALDWELL, TOMMY CALDWELL'S FATHER (via phone): You know, it's just something he found that he was good at from a real young age. And you know, once you accomplish a goal, you always go on to the next. And this was the next logical thing for him to try. And I don't think he realized at the time how tough it was going to be but here he is about to complete it. There are sure a lot of people here. It's a lot of fun.

BALDWIN: I am sure you are surrounded by tons of supporters. And Mike, I mean, just everything I have read about this climb, correct me because you are the dad, you know this stuff, they have been super gluing their fingers, sanding down their nails, waking up twice at night in these tents they are sleeping on hanging off this, you know, this wall just reapplying lotion. Can you just talk about just the technical difficulties in mastering this?

CALDWELL: You know, the thing about a big wall like this and the reason that it's so unusual is not only is there a lot of technical difficulty meaning that's hard moves to make and long endurance sections to climb. But there's so much figuring out of, you know, how to get their gear up there, how to sustain themselves on the wall for 19 days, so many other things that they need to do that it's just a nightmare and not a lot of people are willing to put themselves through this.

BALDWIN: And when we say free climb, that means they have these ropes, right, but they are basically just climbing, you know, with their feet and their hands and full body weight here.

CALDWELL: Right. The rope generally runs down from the climber to the next anchor that he placed in the rock, and so, you know, if a climber's ten feet above his last anchor he's going to fall 20 feet and the rope will catch Yes, Tim but the style they've got to use, if they fall at any point on a given pitch or climb, they've got to start that whole pitch over again, go back down to the bottom of it and start over. And that was the hang-up this morning when Kevin fell on the first pitch of the day and had to repeat it. That's why we're a little behind schedule.

BALDWIN: How many years has Tommy been training to do this?

CALDWELL: This climb specifically, about eight.

BALDWIN: I was hanging on his every word. Mike Caldwell, did we lose you in the middle of Yosemite national park?

CALDWELL: Nope, I'm here.

BALDWIN: You are there. Forgive me. I think you went out. How many years, just quickly, I got 20 seconds, how many years has your son been trying to training to do this?

CALDWELL: He has been working on this for eight years. BALDWIN: I think I heard eight years but at least I heard plural

years. That tells me quite awhile. Mike Caldwell, we are thinking about you. We are thinking about your son. We are thinking about Kevin as well. And they can pull this off together El Capitan. They will be the first, if they can make it, to do this free climbing. Thank you so much.

I'm Brooke Baldwin. Thank you so much for being with me. "The LEAD" with Jake Tapper starts right now.