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EU Officials Meet In Brussels To Discuss Terror Security; Searching for the Next Great Photo Service; North Korean Defector Admits To Inaccuracies In Story; A Look at Cuba's Revolutionary History Through Cock Fighting; Air Rage On Rise In China

Aired January 19, 2015 - 08:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

KRISTIE LU STOUT, HOST: I'm Kristie Lu Stout in Hong Kong. And welcome to News Stream where news and technology meet.

As the hunt for terror cells continues across Europe, EU ministers meet in Brussels to discuss the threat.

Now one of the most famous defectors from North Korea admits that he made up parts of his story.

And searching for the next great photo service. We speak to a tech pundit about the power of digital images.

Now Europe is on high alert as authorities across the continent hunt for as many as 20 terrorist sleeper cells. Now heavily armed guards are on

the ground all over Brussels.

Now EU foreign ministers are there now in the wake of recent attacks and police raids. Five Belgian nationals have been charged with

participating in a terrorist organization and plotting to attack police officers.

And meanwhile in France, authorities are trying to track down two more people whose DNA links them to Amedy Coulibaly. Now he is the gunman

killed in that deadly siege at a kosher market in Paris.

Now, nine other suspects remain in custody in connection with that attack and the massacre at Charlie Hebdo magazine.

Now we mentioned the enormous security presence now visible in Belgium. And some of the troops are now patrolling Jewish neighborhoods,

but many Muslims in Belgium are also afraid that they could be targeted.

Now CNN's Phil Black looks at the concerns and the fears in both communities.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

PHIL BLACK, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Soldiers and children side by side on the streets of a European city. These Belgian paratroopers

were trained to fight wars. Instead, they stand guard outside a Jewish school in Antwerp. The military is now a highly visible presence in the

city's Jewish district. Locals are grateful.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It's not only we that were in the problem, it's everyone in Europe which is the problem. (inaudible) and I'm really

thankful for them doing the best.

BLACK: Soldiers were deployed in Antwerp and Brussels after investigators moved to break up a suspected terror plot to attack police.

Two suspects were killed during this firefight.

Belgium's Jewish community also believes it's high up on the list of potential Islamist targets. Last year, a man stormed a Jewish museum in

Brussels, killing four people inside.

RABBI MENACHEM MARGOLIN, EUROPEAN JEWISH ASSOCIATION: People feel it's dangerous to walk on the street. People are afraid to come to

synagogue. They're afraid to send their kids to Jewish school.

BLACK: Members of Belgium's Muslim community are also scared about what will happen now. Frank Hench (ph) is the Imam at a mosque in Verviers

where terror suspects opened fire against police Thursday night.

He tells me, "locals are shocked to know terrorists might have been living among them."

Belgium has a problem with radicalization. Around 300 are thought to have traveled to Syria to fight and train with Islamist groups, the highest

per capita rate of recruitment of any European country.

The imam blames social problems, unemployed, alienated young men who seek identity and purpose through radical Islam.

Jewish community leaders agree.

MARGOLIN: We're quite sure these are true thoughts in these words.

It's the responsibility of government not just to see now to make more gun and more security and police, but to make sure to see the problem

before it comes and to try and prevent it.

BLACK: Rabbi Margolin says the answer is more education and more guns. He wants Jewish institutions to be allowed to establish their own

security forces.

Imam Hench (ph) fears many of Europe's Muslims will now be persecuted because of events in France and Belgium.

Two scared communities struggling to respond to the terror deliberately created by a radical few.

Phil Black, CNN, Brussels.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

LU STOUT: Now authorities in Belgium are requesting the extradition of a terror suspect arrested over the weekend in Greece. The 33-year-old

Algerian man is wanted in connection with an alleged plot to attack Belgian police.

Now, a senior international correspondent Ivan Watson is following the story from Brussels. He joins us now live. And Ivan, what more do we know

about he suspect arrested in Greece and the overall extradition process?

IVAN WATSON, CNN INTERANTIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, first of all the Belgian authorities have been very tight lipped about all of the suspects

that they have arrested, including two suspects who were killed in a gun battle with Belgian police in the eastern Belgian town of Verviers in a

police raid that took place last Thursday night there.

So, they're not giving hardly any details.

But we have since learned about one of the suspects who jumped out a window from the apartment last Thursday night to flee the gun battle. We

spoke with his defense attorney. And that man is identified as a 25-year- old Belgian of Moroccan descent named Mirwan al-Bali (ph).

According to the defense attorney, he claims his client is innocent of charges he's currently facing of participation in a terrorist organization,

of possessions of weapons and explosives and plans for armed rebellion.

He says that al-Bali (ph) was only in the apartment when the police raided the place because he was trying to deliver a pair of Nike shoes to

one of the suspects who later died shooting at Belgian police.

The defense attorney insists that his client has never traveled to Syria, had a clean record, no criminal offenses prior and actually worked

as a licensed security guard for a firm here in Brussels.

So that is the most that we have learned thus far about any of the suspects arrested as part of what the Belgian authorities say was a plot to

attack Belgian police. And police uniforms were found in the possession of the suspects who died in that gun battle.

As far as extradition plans, the Belgian authorities are trying to extradite two other Belgian citizens who were arrested by French police

trying to cross the border from France to Italy last week and also one suspect who was arrested in Greece over the course of the weekend. And

Belgian authorities have linked all of these suspects to this alleged jihadi plot to attack Belgian police officers.

It's important to note that that alleged plot does not have any links that we have been told thus far to the deadly attack on the offices of the

Charlie Hebdo magazine in Paris -- Kristie.

LU STOUT: And that's what we learned from Belgian police at that police conference on Friday.

That's the latest on the investigation.

Separately, Ivan, EU foreign ministers meeting there in Brussels today. What is their assessment of the terror threat across Europe?

WATSON: Well, this is the first meeting of Europe's top diplomats since the Charlie Hebdo attacks, since this alleged plot of foiled. And

the EU foreign police chief made it clear that at the top of the agenda was dealing with counterterrorism efforts. And she said that she had met at

the beginning of the day with the secretary general of the Arab League to discuss this. Of course there are clearly links between European citizens

and Middle Eastern countries.

Here you've got Belgium itself that has the highest per capita rate of suspected jihadis going to join the ranks of militant groups in Syria like

the Islamic State. And she made it clear that European countries were going to have to do more to coordinate, to work together to share

information and also to work with Middle Eastern countries, with Arab countries, with Muslim countries from which she says some of this problem

emanates -- Kristie.

LU STOUT: All right, CNN's Ivan Watson reporting live from Brussels, thank you, Ivan.

Now the terror attack at Charlie Hebdo magazine sent Europe into high alert. And now the publication is igniting more controversy because of its

new cover.

Now police say that over 800,000 people are gathered now in the Russian Republic of Chechnya. They are staging a protest over Charlie

Hebdo's new cartoon depiction of the Prophet Mohammed. This comes after a series of demonstrations over the weekend. Thousands of people across

Pakistan rallied against the magazine and the French government.

In Niger, several people died in violent protests. Now police say rioters set fire to dozens of churches and looted shops.

Now clashes between the army and Houthi rebels have escalated in the capital. And the government says it is battling an attempt at a coup in

Yemen. Some of the violence is centered on the presidential palace there. Another attack tarted the prime minister of Yemen who is now in hiding.

Now CNN's Nick Paton Walsh is the only western TV reporter in Sanaa. And he filed this report a short time ago.

We'll bring you that report a little bit later in the program. You're watching News Stream. We'll be back right after the break.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LU STOUT: Welcome back. You're watching News Stream.

Let's get the latest on the clashes and the battle for control of Yemen. Now CNN's Nick Paton Walsh, he is the only western TV reporter

there in the capital of Sanaa. And he filed this a short time ago.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

NICK PATON WALSH, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: A morning really here that spiraled out of control. It all began in the dark of night. A

security plan had been put in place by presidetial officials who were worried after the kidnap of their chief of staff a few days ago in the very

city center that other potential key officials could follow.

The Houthi movement, Shia rebel group, tribes and militia, who have swept across the capital here putting up their own checkpoints said, yes,

they had the (inaudible) the chief of staff because they wanted to stop a new constitution being implemented.

But that spiraled out of control, because the security plan resulted in some roads being locked down. The Houthis didn't like that. They asked

them to be open for the sake of the people of the capital. They said then clashes broke out. We don't know who started them.

We do know that we've heard the heavy thump of artillery, a duel, frankly, between two sides around the presidential administration.

Civilians caught up in it. Residential buildings hit. A hospital, we're told, hit as well.

There are dead and injured. We simply don't know the numbers.

We do know that an attempt at a ceasefire has faltered. In fact the meeting the president held with the Houthis and his officials to try and

get everyone together in and agree to stop the fighting, well, as key officials left for that, the prime minister his convoy was attacked. We

don't know who by, but the presidents men blame the Houthis.

The Houthis themselves, as they left that meeting, their convoy was attacked. They don't know who is responsible for that.

As the day has gone by, we heard from the minister of information. She says that now state TV and state news agency are under Houthi control.

The Houthis deny that.

The fear is this is really escalating out of control. The presidential administration, most Yemeni officials say, whoever controls

that controls the country. We're going to see a fight really for power in Yemen decided potentially on the streets here unless this ceasefire takes

hold eminently.

There are real concerns, too, that as Yemen seems to spiral into greater sectarian violence, those Shia Houthis versus often Sunni tribes

and the Yemeni government, too, that provides a greater window for al Qaeda to gain recruits, to have a foothold, to prepare recruits to attack the

west and of course space for them, too, to plot attacks against Europe as well.

Real concerns that this instability here simply leads to greater threats against Europe and the United States.

Nick Paton Walsh, CNN, Sanaa, Yemen.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

LU STOUT: And now to Indonesia and the diplomatic fallout from Sunday's execution. Now six people were killed by firing squad for drug

charges, five of them foreign nationals including citizens of Brazil and The Netherlands. And now those countries have recalled their ambassadors.

Now the Indonesian foreign minister says she understands the decision.

Last month, the Indonesian president said he planned to reject the 64 appeals for clemency that he had received from drug offenders on death row.

Now Brazil's president says the killings severely affect relations between the two countries.

Now, to Pakistan where the country's fuel supply is almost depleted. Now the government is vowing to step in with little room to maneuver.

Now CNN's Michelle Stockman reports on the mad rush for what little gas remains.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

MICHELLE STOCKMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Pakistan is a country running on fumes. A delay in petrol imports has lead to a fuel crisis that's

lasted almost a week. Now officials say there's only three days of reserves left.

Long waits at the petrol pump are driving up transport prices, including cab fares.

"We're losing time in these lines," he says. "We have to charge the passengers to make up for our losses."

And disrupting daily life.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Other than office, I have to pick my children from school and drop them over there. They're on leave today. And it's -- the

life is crippled out here, just because of this fuel shortage.

STOCKMAN: This station is rationing fuel, allowing roughly a day's worth for the customer.

The prime minister is holding emergency meetings today to work on an action plan. Over the weekend, he purged his government of ministers he

holds responsible for the shortage.

As you can see behind me, this line of cars stretches on for at least a half mile. People have been waiting in line for more than three hours.

And this situation has been ongoing for days. Government officials say the crisis likely won't be resolved for another eight weeks when supplies are

replenished.

Michelle Stockman, CNN, Islamabad.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

LU STOUT: Now the New York Times reports U.S. intelligence penetrated North Korea's computer network back in 2010 and have been tracking North

Korean hackers for years.

It says National Security Agency access to North Korean computers was critical in convincing the U.S. president to accuse the North of hacking

Sony systems.

Now that came just before Sony released the film The Interview, a comedy focused on the assassination of the North Korean leader. But the

report, it also raises questions about why the U.S. did not alert Sony to the threat.

Now one of the most well-known survivors of a North Korean prison camp now admits that he changed parts of his life story. Now Shin Dong-hyuk was

the subject of the book "Escape from Camp 14."

Now the author who penned the best-seller says Shin has admitted to changing dates and locations, but his harrowing account of torture remains

true.

Paula Hancocks has more.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

PAULA HANCOCKS, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: He was a symbol of North Korea's human rights abuses. Shin Dong-hyuk's account of being born

into, and ultimately escaping, the country's most renowned political prison camp was translated into 27 languages. But the defector now admits not

everything was true.

The author of his book "Escape from Camp 14" says in a statement that Shin and his family were transferred from the brutal camp to a less

restrictive camp when he was six. It was there he says he witnessed the execution of his mother and brother after he informed guards of their plans

to escape.

He now says his torture, including being lowered from a hook over a charcoal fire happened when he was 20, not 13.

Shin has not returned calls from CNN, but has apologized on his Facebook page, saying he, quote, "forever wanted to conceal and part of my

past. We tell ourselves that it's OK to not reveal every little detail."

In 2013, Shin was a key witness at the United Nations first comprehensive investigation into North Korea's human rights abuses.

The chair of that commission says these and other inaccuracies do not affect the report that condemns Pyongyang. They merely show he suffered

double horror versus triple horror.

MICHAEL KIRBY, FRM. CHAIRMAN, U.N. INQUIRY IN NORTH KOREA: It's still pretty clear that he suffered a lot of great wrongs and he had wounds and

burn marks and other things on his body which confirmed and corroborated that that was so.

So, I think it's very important to keep this in perspective.

Ahn Myeong-chul is a former prison guard in North Korea. He says where and when Shin was tortured is academic.

"Whether you're in Camp 14 or Camp 18, the torture methods are the same," he tells me. "A combination of methods used by Nazis and during

Japan's colonization of Korea."

North Korea has tried to discredit Shin for years, releasing this footage of his father last year denouncing his claims. Shin says he didn't

even know his father was still alive.

Pyongynang is widely expected to take advantage of Shin's admission of inaccuracies. The regime often refers to defectors who publicly criticize

the country's human rights as human scum.

Paula Hancocks, CNN, Seoul.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

LU STOUT: Now Pope Francis is flying home a day after millions of people braved downpours to attend his outdoor mass in Manila. Now he

encouraged the faithful to show compassion, especially to children.

On his way to the airport today, crowds lined the streets to say goodbye. As he's done many times during this trip, the pope slowed down to

touch people's hands.

Now you're watching News Stream right here on CNN. And coming up next, midair madness ensues as travelers throw punches, chairs, even hot

water. Now China's air rage is on the rise. What's being done to stop it?

Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LU STOUT: Coming to you live from Hong Kong, you are back watching News Stream.

Now the former Vice President of Korean airlines has appeared in court over the Macademia nut scandal.

Now Heather Cho says she is innocent of charges that she violated aviation security law. Last month, she forced her flight to turn back and

ordered the chief steward off the plane because she was served the nuts in a bag instead of on a dish. She later apologized and resigned. Her

father is the chairman of the airline.

Now in 20 years, China is expected to become the top airline market in the world. But new Chinese travelers are frustrated with the system not

yet equipped to handle the demands and air rage is already soaring. Will Ripley reports.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

WILL RIPLEY, CNN CORRESPONDEN: Melees in midair, tussles at the ticket counter. Chinese social media sites are full of these videos. Air

rage: China style.

Last month, a Chinese man's rant about cabin service turned into a threat to blow up the plane. His girlfriend hurled hot water at a flight

attendant.

Earlier this month, angry passengers opened emergency exits as their plane was pushing back from the gate seven hours late.

You see these tour groups all over the Beijing airport, and the guides are giving instructions to travelers about the right way to behave.

Of course, air rage and traveler bad behavior is not unique to China, but here things have gotten so bad the government issued this guide book on

how to be a civilized tourist.

In China, being loud and fending for yourself is part of the culture.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You need to respect others.

RIPLEY: Which is why some of China's new rich are going to finishing schools that include lessons in air travel etiquette.

Like the Chinese economy, its airline and tourism industries have taken off in the last few decades.

JIM FALLOW, AUTHOR: It's a nation of first generation air travelers...

RIPLEY: Journalist and author of China Airborne Jim Fallows says many newly prosperous passengers have never experienced the kind of travel

headaches long familiar to other flyers.

FALLOW: So the population is under prepared and a system that is especially annoying. When they combine, you see these results.

RIPLEY: China's busiest hubs are notorious for long delays. Fallow blames much of the misery on the Chinese military, which controls the vast

majority of the country's increasingly crowded air space. China is expected to pass the U.S. and become the world's top airline market in the

next 20 years, which means more agonizing waits and perhaps more passengers taking Chinese style air rage to new heights.

Will Ripley, CNN, Beijing.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

LU STOUT: You're watching News Stream. And coming up next, cool filters, special effects and people tagging: photosharing apps, they come

with a wide variety of functions, but could the next frontier in photo services lie somewhere else?

That little guy isn't raised to be eaten. We'll take you to Cuba next where roosters are groomed to battle as part of an age old tradition.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LU STOUT: I'm Kristie Lu Stout in Hong Kong. You're watching News Stream. And these are your world headlines.

Now fighting has escalated between Yemen's army and Houthi rebels as the government says it is battling an attempt at a coup. Now officials say

the prime minister is now in hiding after surviving an attack. And there are fears that al Qaeda in Yemen may benefit from the chaos. Now both

sides blame the other for the violence.

French police are trying to track down two people who may have known Amedy Coulibaly, the gunman in the kosher supermarket siege. A source

close to the investigation says their DNA was found on his belongings. Now the terror threat is front and center at a meeting of EU foreign ministers

in Brussels. The EU's foreign policy chief says the bloc needs to strengthen its cooperation with Arab countries first, then look internally.

Now officials in Cameroon say Boko Haram has abducted 80 people, including a large number of children, from two villages in the north.

While in Chad, hundreds attended a rally denouncing Boko Haram. Now troops from Chad are heading to Cameroon to help fight the militants.

Now the rise of camera phones means that virtually everyone has a camera on their pocket. When you combine that with the rise of online

photo services it means that we're taking more pictures than we have ever taken before.

Now according to Instangram, 70 million photos are shared on the app each day, that's around 800 pictures every second.

But that's not much compared to what's on Facebook. According to Internet.org, 350 million pictures are uploaded to Facebook every day,

that's more than 4,000 each second.

Now if you're an organized person, you probably filed all your photos away properly, but for the rest of us how can we keep track of all the

photos we continue to take?

Now tech pundit Om Malik thinks the ideal service for keeping track of our photos hasn't been invented just yet. He joins me now live via Skype

from San Francisco. He's the founder of Gigaom.com. Thank you so much for joining us here on CNN.

And before we get into digital photo tracking and management, let's first talk about the power of images. What do you believe is the

significance of an image, even an Instagram, to the human experience?

OM MALIK, FOUNDER, GIGAOM.COM: I think, you know, we all as journalists know what an image can do. You know, CNN -- this history of

CNN is all about the image. If CNN, you know, became prominent because of its coverage of the Gulf War and the images it brought into our homes via

television.

And I think the photo apps of today are -- the video apps of today are doing pretty much the same thing, but on our mobile device. And I think

image is so important right now.

You remember there was that episode of a plane landing in Hudson River and it was the photo appeared first on Twitter. And I think it was that

pivotal moment for the emergence of Twitter as a media, as a news platform.

And I think you are starting to see more and more images are being captured on these smartphones, because more and more people are actually in

places where these events are unfolding so the images become -- the camera has become, you know, the storyteller of our times.

LU STOUT: Now, let's talk more about what you called the visual web and how on the visual web an image is a gateway to data. I mean, could you

elaborate on that point? Because that's an important point.

MALIK: So, you know, for one of the things which you look at apps today. So, there are some apps, which have been able to develop these

capability that if a place, let's say a bar, is favorited by a certain type of people, you know, you can derive that inference from the photos by

looking at, you know, their facial expressions, or facial hair -- for instance if you have certain kind of mustaches and beards, maybe that bar

is favored by hipsters. Or you can -- you can derive inference from the fact that there's a lot of people who are dressed in elegant evening dress

that this might actually be an upscale lounge bar.

So, there is a lot of data, which is embedded in the pictures just by looking at them collectively.

I think so far images have been viewed either artistically and individually, but when you put them all together as a fabric of images,

there is a lot of information which is in there. And there is a lot of inference, which can be derived from it. And I'm pretty sure our -- you

know, our intelligence agencies worldwide actually are doing some of that already.

LU STOUT: A lot of information can be summarized into an image. We are increasingly surfing on a visual web.

Now there is a big opportunity here. So for the company that's going to take on that challenge and do it successfully, what would the ideal

photo management or tracking service look like?

MALIK: I think my theory in this is that most services don't look at bits from the user's perspective. And the reason that is that, you know,

most of us take pictures and we forget about them. What we only remember is that we went to some place and we took a photo or we saw something and

we have a very vague recollection of an event unfolding. And that's all we remember of that photo Like, we don't really know where that photo is.

So if a photo service has to exist, it has to be able to work from our thought process. In a sense, how can you surface a photo from like four

years ago when all you can remember is having a coffee in some side alley in Paris, right, and you took a picture. How do you find that picture in

your stack of photos, which are -- you know, they keep going up. I don't know about you, but I like end up taking about 20 to 50 pictures every day.

And they're like -- they're not really, you know, artistic photos, they're photos of people I meet, things I eat, just mostly out of habit because I

have a camera in my pocket.

And I think that is what there is an opportunity. I think both Facebook and Apple have a big opportunity here to make something --

something interesting, because they have so much of our visual data.

Similarly, if there is a startup which comes into the world. It has to ask the question, you know, how will I help people find that photo?

It's like -- you know, it's not about just taking the photo, it's tying the photo to a memory in our head. Now that's a big challenge. But, again,

big challenges result in big rewards as well.

LU STOUT: You know, and that's a question I ask myself every day. And I pretty much a pretty good digitally organized person, but here is

hoping that the opportunity is out there, the need will be answered and some app developer will answer a need.

Om Malik, we'll leave it at that, but thank you for sharing your thoughts with us. Hope to talk soon. Take care.

MALIK: Thank you for having me.

LU STOUT: Now you're watching News Stream. Still to come on the program, a top U.S. diplomat is heading to Cuba in another sign of thawing

relations between the two nations. We've got more next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LU STOUT: Welcome back.

Now U.S. President Barack Obama is sending America's highest level delegation to Cuba in decades. Assistant secretary of state Roberta

Jacobson is set to arrive in Havana on Wednesday. Now a separate congressional delegation landed there this weekend. Jacobson and her team

will tackle a number of issues, including opening a U.S. embassy, easing trade and travel restrictions, and visa applications for Cubans.

Now one person unlikely to take advantage of eased travel restrictions is 93-year-old Tono Torrente. Now he has spent his entire life in Cuba,

even refusing to leave for the U.S. when he had the opportunity. And Karl Penhaul has his story.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

KARL PENHAUL, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: For Tono Torrente, life in Cuba boils down to a few simple truths.

TONO TORRENTE, 93-YEAR-OLD (through translator): The most important thing is women, then fighting cocks and boxing.

PENHAUL: At 93-years-old, he survived the rise of revolution and fall of family fortunes. Through it all, his roosters have brought him hope.

TORRENTE (through translator): Ever since I was born, there was a cock fighting arena near my house. The peasants would come on their horses

to the fights. I used to love that.

PENHAUL: His memory soured shortly after Fidel Castro and his rebels seized power in 1959.

TORRENTE (through translator): It seemed that everything was going to change and get better, but for me and many others it didn't. But you can't

speak too much about that.

PENHAUL: These faded photos tell part of the tale. Tono's dad died young, his uncle Antonio made a fortune as a traveling salesman in New

York. He paid for Tono's upbringing and invested in real estate back in hold Havana.

Years later, the Cuban revolution stripped rich landlords like his uncle of their property. Tono was left with a single apartment.

TORRENTE (through translator): They took my barber shop from me as well. They pay me nothing. Now I earn just $9 in pension.

PENHAUL: He gets by thanks to remittances from three of his children. They left for Miami, but he refused to go.

TORRENTE (through translator): Cock fighting was banned over there. I didn't want to go.

PENHAUL: Tono's own birds are not heavy enough to fight yet. After a long ban in Cuba, the blood sport is still not fully sanctioned.

Nevertheless, Tono brings us to this semi-underground private venue.

Now on paper gambling in Cuba is definitely illegal, but if you ask about cock fighting well the answer is a little more complicated.

Organizers here say it's kind of permitted but kind of forbidden. Then they just shrug their shoulders and say, well, it's a gray area. Life is

often like that here in Cuba.

Tono and the other spectators are too focused on the ring to worry about the letter of the law. The details that matter most here, the weigh

in, then tying on the spurs.

Down the years at ringside, Tono said he learned a straightforward lesson on life.

TORRENTE (through translator): If you're born to win, you'll win. But if you're born to lose it doesn't matter how good you are, you'll end

up like this.

PENHAUL: He says his experience getting by in Communist Cuba has been much like a cockfight, part technique, part luck.

Karl Penhaul, CNN, Havana.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

LU STOUT: And that is News Stream. I'm Kristie Lu Stout. And World Sport is up next with Alex Thomas.

END