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New ISIS Video Shows Two Japanese Hostages; "American Sniper" Controversy; Pope Francis Promotes Responsible Paternity; Jury Selection Begins for Aurora Shooter

Aired January 20, 2015 - 09:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

CAROL COSTELLO, CNN ANCHOR: And good morning. I'm Carol Costello. Thank you so much for joining me.

ISIS terrorists have released another video. It shows two Japanese hostages kneeling beside a knife wielding jihadi john. We're not going to show you the video because it just gives ISIS what it want, publicity. Instead, we'll show you pictures of the two hostages. One is a freelance journalist, the other a security consultant who was believed to have been traveling with rebel fighters when he was captured.

While we won't show you the ISIS video, we will talk about it because it's a little different from the other videos we've seen. The terrorist in this video asked the Japanese government for a $200 million ransom. So what does that mean? Is ISIS using this opportunity for cash or is it cash strapped?

Joe Ruffini is an anti-terror expert. He joins me now. He's also the author of the book "When Terror Comes to Wall Street: A Citizen's Guide to Terror and Awareness."

Good morning and thanks for being here.

JOE RUFFINI, ANTI-TERROR EXPERT: It's a pleasure. Thanks for having me.

COSTELLO: So, Joe, what do you make of this? Why is ISIS now asking for ransom?

RUFFINI: You know, it's kind of -- it can be one of two reasons. Either they're trying to play the game a little bit differently. I don't think ISIS is cash strapped, but this may be an opportunity for them to make a little cash. And, you know, they're very flexible. They're very asymmetric in their tactics. They're going to switch it up and this is just something a little bit different. Certainly nothing to be surprised about. They're going to change their tactics and their approaches from time to time. But it's very important for us to remember that what they want to project is this psychological effect that any kind of beheading or threatened beheading has on really the global population at large. COSTELLO: That's why we're not showing the ISIS video, frankly. The

reason I ask you that money question is because recently ISIS released 200 elderly Yazidis, elderly people and children, and many believe they released those 200 people not on humanitarian grounds but because they couldn't afford to feed them. That's why I asked you that first question.

RUFFINI: Well, you know, that could very well be the case. But to be perfectly honest with you, you know, we're not there. We're not there on the ground. And it's very, very hard to tell what their motivation is. ISIS remains strong. They remain a threat. A very credible threat. And it's not a threat that's going to go away any time soon.

COSTELLO: The terrible irony here is that Japan donated hundreds of millions of dollars, not to fight ISIS militarily, but to help refugees because, you know, Japan is a passivist country, yet ISIS accuses Japan of killing our women and children. I mean that's so ridiculous it's hard to even talk about.

RUFFINI: Well, they're going to make claims like this. Any of the jihadist groups are going to make claims like this. If you look at the social media, if you look at how they recruit on the Internet, if you look at what they do to motivate young men to become self-radicalized, they're preaching lies. They're preaching hatred. They are using the religion of Islam to kind of wave the religious banner and recruit very young men around the world and in the United States, and they're going to make absolutely ridiculous claims that would seem absolutely untrue to most everyday young men and women. And they'll continue to do this. It's part of the tactics. It's a game that they play.

COSTELLO: OK, so let's talk about the game they play. So as they pull in more countries, and in this terrible way, at some point don't they realize that the world will just harden against them? It will join together, will ban together?

RUFFINI: Well, you know, that's a good point and one would think they would take a lesson from al Qaeda around 2007, 2008. Osama bin Laden's popularity dropped in eight out of the nine predominantly Muslim nations. Support for suicide bombing dropped and overall support for al Qaeda dropped. And the main reason was is that Muslims around the world, like everyone else, were tired of seeing Muslims be killed by al Qaeda in their attacks. And I don't really understand why ISIS doesn't realize that if they don't choose their tactics and their victims carefully, this is going to fall back on them also. There's a lesson to be learned here, and they're not learning it.

COSTELLO: Yes, well, let's hope they never learn it. Joe Ruffini, thanks so much for your insight. I appreciate it.

RUFFINI: Thank you.

COSTELLO: Still to come in the NEWSROOM, it's the movie that's making box office history. "American Sniper." I'll talk to a former Navy SEAL who trained the man who inspired the film to get his thoughts on the film and the controversy surrounding it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Do you ever think that you might have seen things or done some things over there that you wish you hadn't?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Oh, that's not me, no.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

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COSTELLO: It is the bestselling memoir that has turned into a box office bonanza. "American Sniper," the Oscar-nominated story of former Navy SEAL Chris Kyle luring movie goers in droves. But it's also sparking some controversy, I'm sure you've heard, after some top names in Hollywood criticized the film.

CNN's George Howell has more.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

GEORGE HOWELL, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Americans are packing into theaters to see "American Sniper," the real life story of the man known as America's deadliest sniper, Navy SEAL Chris Kyle, played by actor Bradley Cooper. The film is breaking box office records this debut weekend, earning 105 million in weekend ticket sales and six Academy Award nominations.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I loved it. I loved it.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It was a very emotionally stressful movie, I thought.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It was pretty good. It's very compelling.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Very good. Excellent.

HOWELL: Not so excellent, however, in the minds of some in Hollywood. Actor Seth Rogin tweeting, quote, "American Sniper" kind of reminds me of the movie that's showing in the third act of "Inglorious Bastards." And filmmaker Michael Moore igniting a firestorm on Twitter. Quote, "my uncle, killed by a sniper in World War II. We were taught snipers were cowards. Will shoot you in the back. Snipers aren't heroes and invaders are worse." Then, five hours later, quote, "but if you're on the roof of your home defending it from invaders who have come 7,000 miles, you are not a sniper, you are brave, you are a neighbor." Moore's comment about cowards definitely getting some pushback.

CADE COURTLEY, FORMER NAVY SEAL: For somebody who has spent their entire career on freedom of speech and freedom of expression, to be criticizing an individual like Chris Kyle, who exemplifies the very best, well, it's like -- that's really biting the hand that feeds you.

HOWELL: And the moviegoers we spoke to also took issue with the perceived criticism.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I think he was fighting for this country, was doing what he thought was right.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: None of us who don't serve or can't serve have no idea what our soldiers are going through.

HOWELL: Whether Moore was actually talking about the film "American Sniper" is now sort of a gray area, tweeting, quote, "Hmm, I never tweeted one word about "American Sniper," Chris Kyle. I said my uncle, killed by sniper in World War II. Only cowards would do that to him and others." He goes on to say, quote, "so people want me to tweet something about "American Sniper." Great acting. Powerful message. Sad ending. There." Then sending people to his Facebook page for further clarification. Regardless, one thing seems crystal clear on the streets among the masses who saw "American Sniper."

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It's not a coward. It's a matter of taking -- you know, doing what he was told to do and what he was trained to do.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE,: I'm ready.

HOWELL: George Howell, CNN, Chicago.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Oh, my God!

(END VIDEOTAPE)

COSTELLO: OK, so this controversy lives on. Brandon Webb is joining me. He's a former Navy SEAL who not only trained Chris Kyle but was also his friend. He's also "The New York Times" best-selling author of "Among Heroes."

Brandon, good morning.

BRANDON WEBB, FMR. NAVY SEAL WHO TRAINED CHRIS KYLE: Good morning, Carol.

COSTELLO: Thank you for being here. I just want to read a part of the letter that was posted online. It was written by Green Beret Bryan Sikes and it was meant for Michael Moore. I'm going to read you the last paragraph, so here goes. So Bryan Sikes writes to Michael Moore, "so, tender foot, I leave you with this final thought. What if you found yourself in some sort of hostage situation where you were held at knife point by some crazed person and they were dead set on making an example of you by bleeding you out on Hollywood Boulevard in front of the world and the only way out was with the precision aimed fire of a sniper? Would you want that coward to take the shot? Because knowing how you feel about snipers, such as myself, and your hatred of firearms, I'd probably drop the mag, roll the bolt, go get a jack and coke before helping you out."

Does that resonate with you?

WEBB: I mean, it does resonate a bit. I think Michael Moore, to me, was clearly trying to, you know, get a piece of my dead friend's spotlight in the media. And it just shows how naive he is about service. Would he have served his country as a police officer, first responder or volunteer for the military, I just -- I think it shows how naive he is about the way the world works. And, again, you know, I'm a big proponent of freedom of speech and what I do for a living today and I think that, you know, the conversation should be, you know, include different perspectives and "American Sniper" provides that. The movie provides that as well.

COSTELLO: Have you ever heard that accusation before, that snipers were cowards?

WEBB: No. I haven't heard it and it was a ridiculous comment to me. You know, snipers are some of the most highly trained individuals on the battlefield. And, you know, you talk about a tool in a commander's war chest that is able to be used with very little collateral damage. I mean look at the drone strikes that both presidents have launched that have come with a massive amount of civilian collateral damage and casualties as opposed to a sniper like Chris Kyle being very effective to support troops overseas and save lives on the ground.

COSTELLO: I think what most boggles my mind is the total absence of any kind of empathy because --

WEBB: Yes.

COSTELLO: You're a human being and by all accounts Chris Kyle was a wonderful human being, but he's sent to the battlefield to do this terrible task for his country, and then someone calls him a coward.

WEBB: Yes, I think it's tragic. And, again, just in very poor taste. Seth Rogen comments in poor taste. Michael Moore's comments. And here you're making comments like this about a person that's no longer here to defend himself. And Chris was a great human being. He was an American hero. And him and I had conversations about warfare. Anyone that's seen combat, myself included, doesn't think it's a -- you know, war is a great thing. War is terrible and it's an unfortunate and necessary thing that we still need people that are going to volunteer to go overseas and defend this country and freedom and what we care about in America.

COSTELLO: That said, I know that you saw the movie, and I want to talk a little bit about that because so many people have gone to see it and it's left them in, you know, emotionally exhausted. In fact, when the credits roll at the end of the movie, people just stay there and watch the credits roll because they are so emotionally exhausted. When you saw it, how did you react?

When you saw it, how did you react?

WEBB: First, I thought Bradley Cooper did an amazing job portraying Chris. The end of the movie, you know, really hit me hard. I was there in Dallas at the Cowboys Stadium and then the next day at the private funeral and seeing those images and thinking about, you know, all the friends I've lost besides Chris Kyle since 9/11 that are heroes and what inspired me to write my book "Among Heroes" to tell their stories -- it hit me. I was in the theater five minutes, pretty stunned with the ending because it hits you.

COSTELLO: It does. Yet you also say that there are inaccuracies in the movie. What are they?

WEBB: Yes. You know, you have to realize I'm extremely biased. I used to run one of the best sniper programs in the military and, you know, I just saw some of the training scenes as a little bit corny and could have been better. I just have extremely high expectations. You know, I love Chris and I love the SEAL community and just to see some of the military inaccuracies that are so easy to fix and get right, see some of those things -- but, again, you know, this movie is about Chris Kyle, you know, the husband, father, human being, and American hero. And I think Clint Eastwood and Bradley Cooper and the rest of the cast really did capture that.

COSTELLO: What would Chris think of Bradley Cooper portraying him in a movie? And what would he have thought of the movie, do you think?

WEBB: I think Chris would have been extremely happy with Bradley Cooper's performance. There was times where, you know, he -- I could -- could not tell the difference. So definitely from someone who knew Chris and worked with him in the SEAL community, I think Bradley did an amazing job. I think Chris would have been happy with what the movie portrayed and how people in America who are seeing it and how it's delivering a message that I think Chris would have been happy with the movie.

COSTELLO: Thank you so much, Brandon Webb. I appreciate your insight. Thank you so much for being with me.

WEBB: You bet. Thanks for having me.

COSTELLO: You're welcome. I'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

COSTELLO: I must say Pope Francis is the gift that keeps on giving. The pontiff has a way with words that, well, can be kind of shocking to a Catholic like myself. Pope Francis said -- get ready for it -- Pope Francis said Catholics must not breed like rabbits. Really? Because my Catholic faith taught me to have as many children as possible and no birth control ever except for the rhythm method and we all know how well that works.

Here's how it all went down. While the Pope was in the Philippines, he met children who were abandoned because their parents could not afford to care for them. In fact, he met a woman who was expecting her eighth child and called her irresponsible. Then on the plane ride home, the Pope sounded off on birth control in quite an un-Pope-like way.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

POPE FRANCIS (via translator): Something that -- excuse me if I use this word -- that in order to be good Catholics we have to be like rabbits. No. Responsible paternity, that is clear.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: Father Edward Beck, the CNN religion analyst. Welcome, Father.

FATHER EDWARD BECK, CNN RELIGION ANALYST: Thank you. Good to be here, Carol.

COSTELLO: Can't wait to talk to you about this.

BECK: Me, too.

COSTELLO: So Damien Thompson from "The Spectator" I thought put it best. He writes, quote, "I know what the Pope means, I think. Contraception and family planning are fine so long as you don't artificially block procreation. But the subliminal and unintended messages are, A, that Catholics have a reputation for breeding like rabbits, and B, birth control is OK."

BECK: The church has always taught that birth control is OK. They've always said responsible parenthood -- if you look at your --

COSTELLO: No, wait. Go back to birth control is OK thing.

BECK: OK. It just can't be artificial. It has to be natural birth control. As you said, family planning. Rhythm.

I mean, people don't really understand this. You as a woman understand it, but a woman can only become pregnant six days every month. So if she charts that -- through body temperature, secretions, and she has regular menstruation -- that means 24 days of the month, sexual intercourse is fine.

COSTELLO: Coming from an Italian family with many members who've had many, many children and are very committed Catholics, the rhythm method isn't so effective.

BECK: No, because they don't really chart it. They don't take their temperature. They don't monitor it. But I mean if you do -- I've counseled a lot of couples with this, Carol. And when they actually do it, they find it so much better than the artificial because they're not putting foreign substances into their body. They're not in some way prohibiting something unnaturally, and the relationship with the spouse can be much more natural. A lot of people like that.

COSTELLO: I'll be honest with you, because you are a Father and I have to be honest with you -- I don't agree. But I hear you. I do. I hear you.

Is that what the Pope was saying? Or was he sending some subliminal message? Remember what he said about gay people -- who am I to judge? So was he sort of doing the same thing with these comments on birth control?

BECK: Yes, but here's the message. Say natural family planning, which is what you were saying, rhythm, doesn't work for somebody. So someone comes to me in a confessional and says, Father, like that Filipino woman I've had eight kids. I can't have another one. It's a health risk. Pastorally, and the Pope said this, you deal with that woman in that situation. You say, for you, this church teaching doesn't work. You have to do something else.

So the teaching is for the norm but there are always exceptions to the norm. That's why you deal pastorally with people. He said to his priest in a confessional, in a counseling room, you deal with the person as an individual pastorally. And so the church has always gave some leeway for those situations where the rule cannot apply. And contraception is a perfect example of that. Many people, it doesn't work for. And so you have to deal with them in a pastoral way.

COSTELLO: Well, let's go back to the part where Catholics breed like rabbits and have many, many children because, when I was growing up, it was my duty to have children. Get married and have children. That was my duty.

BECK: Well, it's not so much duty but that you can't delink sex from procreation. It can't just be about pleasure; it can't just be about intimacy. But the natural order says this is how the species propagates. So that if a married couple says, well, you know what, no kids. We just want it about pleasure, about us, the Church teaches, well, that's not the fullness of God's intent with regard to sexuality.

So it's not have eight kids; it's be open to the possibility of life. That's responsible sexuality. That links procreation and intimacy and sexuality together. That's what the Church has always taught, that you just don't separate it.

COSTELLO: So these remarks of the Pope -- nothing new?

BECK: Nothing new except that he's opened the door to say be responsible with parenthood. Don't think the church is saying you have to have eight kids. It's saying how you limit those eight kids is what is important. And, priests, be pastoral with those people for whom those norms and guidelines cannot apply. Make sure that you give them another out.

COSTELLO: Father Beck, thanks so much. I appreciate it.

I'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

COSTELLO: Today, jury selection begins outside Denver for the man accused of one of the deadliest mass shootings in U.S. history. It's been two years since James Holmes entered an Aurora, Colorado, movie theater and opened fire. Twelve people were killed, dozens more hurt, and a jury of 12 men and women must decide if Holmes was insane when he started shooting.

HLN legal analyst Joey Jackson joins me with more on this. Good morning.

JOEY JACKSON, HLN LEGAL ANALYST: Good morning, Carol.

COSTELLO: So I can't imagine how difficult it will be to seat a jury in this case. JACKSON: It will be very difficult. And it's unprecedented what

they're doing here. They have 9,000 prospective jurors. And, remember, Carol, as you mentioned, they're looking for only 12. But you have to have 12 alternates, and that's basically a function of the case lasting so long. And so even though jury selection is beginning now, they don't even anticipate the trial to begin until sometime in June. And then of course when it does begin it could be up to a half year, so you need those extra 12 in the event one of the jurors gets sick or otherwise can't participate.

COSTELLO: Yes, so when they say jury selection will take months, they mean it.

JACKSON: Yes, they do.

COSTELLO: So the D.A. talked to 60 victims before deciding there will be no plea deal. I don't understand why they couldn't arrive at a plea deal in this case.

JACKSON: It's a tough decision to make. Because remember the mass destruction that he engaged in. You're talking about lives that were lost there -- not only the 12 lives that were lost but look at all the others that were injured. And when you look at that, and you look at the victims, and you look at the impact that it had on them, what they have to say, Carol, is very meaningful. And although the D.A. is elected and ultimately determines what's the appropriate punishment and what they should do, you do it with the input from your victims. And the victims really feel that he needs to be held accountable by way of going to trial and being sentenced, if convicted, to death.

COSTELLO: I understand. Just to refresh, Holmes pleaded not guilty by reason of insanity. He underwent two psychological evaluations and his parents wrote an op-ed last month, which is really interesting. In this op-ed, James Holmes' parents said their son is not a monster but someone suffering from severe mental illness. Quote, "We realize treatment in an institution would be best for our son. We love our son. We have always loved him and we do not want him to be executed. We also decry the need for a trial. A lengthy trial requires everyone to relive those horrible moments in time, causing additional trauma."

JACKSON: You know, it's a fair point, Carol, but many would beg to differ. And I think who he is will be very much on display at the trial. Why? Because the defense is putting his mental health at issue. Was he insane? Did he understand right from wrong? Or, as the defense said, was he undergoing a psychotic episode wherein he didn't know what he was doing?

And so I think whether he's a monster or not, I think many will disagree with that assertion. Certainly the prosecution does. And in the event that he did know and could adequately distinguish between right from wrong, the feeling is, by the families, that he should be held accountable as a person who is sane.

COSTELLO: Because there really is no doubt -- he allegedly planned this, meticulously planned this. JACKSON: Oh, absolutely. And that's something that the prosecution

is going to show by way of mental state. And so in the event that you are insane, Carol, how is it that you can plot and plan and otherwise prepare? And that signals premeditation, which is far from insanity.

COSTELLO: On the other hand, it's clear to some that he is mentally ill.

JACKSON: Well, just the act itself seems to be somewhat off. It doesn't seem to be; it certainly is. But, remember, there's also -- and you mentioned the psychological health evaluations -- those are under seal at this time. Throughout the course of the trial, we'll see what the evaluators have to say about his mental state, about his preparation, and about whether or not he was engaged in this fantasy. And so that will remain to be seen as the trial begins -- again, in June, with jury selectioin beginning right now.

COSTELLO: Joey Jackson, thanks as always. I appreciate it.

JACKSON: A pleasure and a privilege. Thank you, Carol.

COSTELLO: The next hour of CNN NEWSROOM starts now.

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