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Legal View with Ashleigh Banfield

DOJ About To Release Report on Ferguson Police; Possibility Of Hung Jury In Jodi Arias Case Becoming More Likely; Fighting Back Against Distracted Drivers

Aired March 04, 2015 - 12:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

ASHLEIGH BANFIELD, CNN ANCHOR: And it's just fascinating reading and it's great you got your hands on. It certainly does sheds more light on this very mysterious and deadly death cult.

Thank you, Paul (ph) (inaudible), appreciate it.

Coming up, when the Department of Justice does its work, it files its work and then we the public gets to see its work, and sometimes reporters get their hands on that work before it's filed, such as the case for CNN and what the DOJ is saying about Ferguson, Missouri.

We've got the goods and they're about to go public with it. So what do you suppose the Ferguson Police Department has to say about it? You're going to hear all of it, the numbers, the problems, and possible solutions, coming up next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BANFIELD: Call it redemption or validation and in the town of Ferguson, Missouri, call this a giant leap towards major changes that are to come.

All of those people in Ferguson who accuse their police force is not playing fair. Black people who say they are targeted by the cops, stopped more often than people of other races, arrested more often, beat up more often, thrown in jail more often, and kept there longer. The people of Ferguson insist that this happens and now the United States government says, "You're right. It did and it has been."

The accusations went national in the violent aftermath of the Michael Brown killing, but the Justice Department looked into the Police Department's history years before anyone knew who Michael Brown was, and maybe even before he was born. And they found what they call, "a pattern of discrimination", a pattern that means no coincidences, no accidents and no isolated incidents.

I'm not going to hammer you with all the numbers but really it all came down to do the math. So, indulge me for a moment if you would. I want you to look at this, Ferguson, Missouri's population, 67 percent black just over two-thirds of the population, African American. But now look at two years worth of arrest record, 97 percent of people put in handcuffs are African American. In the same two years, 85 percent of vehicles stopped, black drivers. Nine out of every 10 citations written, they go to African American. And if you think the police force reflects the demographics in Ferguson, not in the least. On average, there were 53 police officers during the investigation time period and just three of them were black.

As for the city of Ferguson, they're not saying much just yet except that they're reviewing all of those federal findings just like CNN is doing. Officials there say they're going to make statement public later today and anytime now, the Justice Department will actually physically release the detailed report from that investigation that was ordered by the top guy, the U.S. Attorney General, Eric Holder.

And don't forget it is Holder, the man who called the United States, "a nation of cowards when it comes to confronting racial issues" that was back in 2009 just as he was taking office.

OK, time to talk about what all these means and whether big change is coming or bankruptcy in some cases. In St. Louis, I welcome Alderman Antonio French, he's been an outspoken voice ever since the Ferguson really hit the map of the nation and our common parlance, and our Senior Legal Analyst Jeffrey Toobin.

Jeffrey if I could start with you, I suppose -- I don't want to say are you surprise by this because ever since Eric Holder took office, he said this is his solemn obligation, to change the way justice is exacted in this country. But are you surprised at the numbers and the strange language that came in this report.

JEFFREY TOOBIN, CNN SENIOR LEGAL ANALYST: Not really. I mean the Justice Department has a history of taking on police departments that have bad histories on racial issues. They have investigated big cities and made changes in Cincinnati, in New Orleans and as well as smaller cities like Ferguson.

The question now is what are they going to do about it and is the Ferguson Police Department even going to continue to exist. There are some who believe that part of the problem is that there are too many small Police Departments around St. Louis, and consolidation would be the best thing that could happened for the people of Ferguson. And that is certainly an option that's going to be on the table.

BANFIELD: Alderman French, if I could get you to weigh in on this. As I understand it -- and please correct me if I'm wrong, the police department in Ferguson has two options here, it is a way to be official file, you know, figuratively speaking. They can agree with the Justice Department and work with the Justice Department which will cost millions and millions of dollars to oversee and implement and the lawyers fees, et cetera.

Or they can fight, they can fight the Justice Department which would mean millions and millions of dollars in litigation and et cetera. It's a little place, Ferguson, and it's a little department which option might they take and can they afford either? ALDERMAN ANTONIO FRENCH, 21ST WARD ST. LOUIS: Well I think they should the option of working with the Federal Government to try to remedy some of the problems that are outlined in this report. I think it would be very foolish for them to try to fight this, the evidence is clear and they would have a very tough time defeating the Federal Government in court.

Now the question remains though of the recommendations that the Department of Justice will make for Ferguson if Ferguson can actually afford to implement some of those recommendations. If they cannot they may do what other municipalities have done which is dissolve their police department and outsource policing to the St. Louis County Police Department which is a much larger organization.

BANFIELD: Well and then there's all these, you know, suggestions that, the outcome although the intention is for good to come. It could end up in tax hikes for the residents there. It could end up as you said, you know, encompassing the police department into the larger Police Department. So, forget that whole community policing thing. An uptick in crime because a lot of police officers may say, "I'm not going to stop that car I don't want to be, you know, accused in any thing now that were under the microscope."

Let me bring in Evan Perez for a moment, our justice reporter here at CNN who was helpful in breaking the story before the feds actually filed this thing and made it public. Evan what else are the fed saying and is there anything that you're seeing that can sort of help to answer some of these issues that are on the table?

EVAN PEREZ, CNN JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT: Well Ashleigh, the Justice Department just issued two reports. The first one I'll tell you about is the decision to decline to bring charges against Darren Wilson, which is something we knew about. But this one report explains why that is. And I tell you what they've concluded is that there is no evidence upon which prosecutors can rely to disprove Darren Wilson's stated subjective belief that he feared for his safety.

There are two key parts of the controversy that we focused on in the last few months, which is was Michael Brown an aggressor, did he have his hands up, was Darren Wilson shooting him while he was trying to give himself up.

According to the Justice Department, they could find -- and they talked to many witnesses who gave varying accounts. They could not find anything to disprove Darren Wilson's account that Michael Brown was trying to reach for his gun. Remember, there was a struggle inside the squad car.

And then secondly, when Brown had his hands up, they're varying accounts, some witnesses recanted statements they made to the media when they talked to the FBI.

And according to the prosecutors, no matter what the account was from different witnesses, in the end, they determined that Michael Brown was moving towards Officer Darren Wilson. And therefore, that goes back to the key question of whether or not Darren Wilson had fear for his safety, which the Justice Department says they can't prove he did not.

BANFIELD: OK. Let me bring in Alderman French again, just quickly. I have to ask you about a comment that was made on CNN a couple of hours ago by the Police Officers Association. They say the numbers maybe need to be looked at in more context because it's horrible to hear that 97 percent of the people put in handcuffs are African- American when only 67 percent of the residents of Ferguson are black.

He says that doesn't take in account in the northern part of the county, and you're in that county, you're in Saint Louis. But in the northern part of the county, there are some towns that are 82 percent. Berkeley, is five-minute drive from Ferguson. It's 82 percent African-American. Jennings is 90 percent African-American, a 10- minute drive from Ferguson. A 13-minute drive from Ferguson to Le Fontane, it's 72.7 percent African-American.

And those would be the people driving through, shopping, going to work and back and maybe might account for some of those pullovers and stops. Is there any validation that you can get to that point of view when it comes to these numbers?

FRENCH: Well, I think that the number of people that are pulled over, cited, arrested by the Ferguson Police Department far exceeds the number of residents in the City of Ferguson. So there are African- Americans that travels from my ward in Saint Louis City, to shopping areas in the county that passed through Ferguson. And they are pulled over. They are stopped. They are arrested. But there are also many white citizens and also travel through Ferguson.

And what you see, though, is that arrest and pullovers and citations almost exclusively affect African-Americans. And what it really becomes is a case of taxation by citation and it's only African- American that are paying this tax just for traveling through cities like Ferguson.

BANFIELD: Alderman French is good to have you on the air again. Thank you for taking the time and to the rest of our panel as well. Jeff Toobin, thank you for your insight. Evan Perez, excellent reporting by you and your team. (inaudible) as well breaking this news early.

Coming up next, why are they taking so long? Are the jurors who are deciding on the death penalty for Jodi Arias headed for another deadlock or are they simply being extraordinarily careful when it comes to taking someone's life?

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BANFIELD: As the clock ticks by, it seems more and more possible there could be another hung jury in the Jodi Arias case. The Arizona jury who will decide whether that convicted murderer gets life behind bars or death has been delivering for over 20 hours now. Either way, Ms. Arias does not have a lot to look forward to.

I want to bring in CNN correspondent and attorney herself Jean Casarez, as well as HLN Host Nancy Grace. Good to have both of you ladies back. It's a Court TV reunion here.

Let me start with Jean if I can. Lay out the lifestyle for Jodi Arias no matter this jury decides.

JEAN CESAREZ, CNN LEGAL CORRESPONDENT: Once she becomes a part of the Department of Corrections in prison and it is a little different. Let show everybody. First of all, the thing is she'll have a single cell, and this is on death row if she does get that. It's 12 feet by 7 feet and there's a toilet, a sink, a bed with a mattress. And then beyond that, all of her meals come to her cell.

So there's no commingling here. She's all by herself. Exercise three times a week, two hours a session, once again all by herself. No contact with inmate. A noncontact visitation. So, if her family comes or friend, it's just behind glass. She can't touch them.

Two phone calls per week, 10-minute a time, which isn't too long. She can have some personal property and some hygiene items. Two appliances -- and I asked the department of corrections what does that mean. Television and radio, she can have that in her cell.

BANFIELD: Wow.

CESAREZ: Two books, writing materials, which I'm sure she will like.

And then, if she has a life sentence, OK, there's an orientation when she get there. There is a face-to-face interview, because there's a step program to greater benefits, can even work her way to general population.

So, so much more freedom with a life sentence even though you're behind bars for life, but with death you're really virtually alone forever.

BANFIELD: Well, that's just a freight of horribles, no matter how you look at it. And Nancy Grace, that's the way it should be. I mean, for people who have watched the horrors that that woman perpetrated on her ex-boyfriend, I'm sure they really don't care one way or the other or do they?

NANCY GRACE, HLN HOST: You know, this is what I recall. I recall one particular photo. Forget all the sex session photos. We heard all after -- for days and days and days the jury saw those photos. And they look over at Arias dressed up like a librarian where their seats screwed down, so she would look smaller than everybody else. Forget all that.

This photo sticks in my mind, where Travis Alexander's head was yanked back by his hair, by Jodi Arias so she could slice his throat from ear to ear, OK? Just hold that image in one moment.

From what I know this morning, the court room is pack with Travis Alexander family and supporters. I think it's going to be a hung jury. I mean, Ashleigh, last night, the jury went out a secret way. So that's never happened before with this jury. So the press would not see them leave. They're obviously hiding from something, and I think that something is a hung jury.

BANFIELD: And if that happens, Nancy, remind our viewers what's automatic in that state?

GRACE: It's going to be life, either with or without parole, that will be decided by the judge.

BANFIELD: And if that's the case, that's the last we see this lady or does she have any other appeals?

GRACE: Is there such a thing as Twitter or Facebook, yes there is. It's not the end of Jodi Arias I can promise you that, this will be appealed forever.

BANFIELD: Yeah, I had a feeling you were going to say that. Nancy always good to see you thank you friend, I used your lines.

GRACE: Bye, ladies.

BANFIELD: Bye. I always love having you two together. I so appreciate it. Nancy's on 8:00 tonight HLN, don't miss her, back after this.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BANFIELD: Federal agents have raided dozens of so-called maternity hotels in Southern California. Here are the pictures to prove it. These are places where moms to be from other countries, mainly China, fly in to give birth so that their babies can be U.S. citizens. The feds say that the women pay anywhere from $15,000 to $50,000 and that does not always include the medical care. More on that later.

On the average, more than nine people are killed everyday in crashes involving distracted drivers. And now one victim is trying to lower the figure by changing the law. And my favorite person on earth, Dr. Sanjay Gupta, has her story.

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DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CNN CHIEF MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: Being stubborn may have saved Jacy Good's life.

JACY GOOD, SAFE DRIVING ADVOCATE: My mom didn't appreciate it nearly enough. I think it's my best characteristic.

GUPTA: In 2008, on the day she graduated from college, Jacy and her parents were in a car accident caused by a teenager talking on his cell phone. Her mom and dad were killed. Jacy was given a 10 percent chance of survival.

GOOD: My pelvis was shattered. And I had a damaged liver. And my lungs were both partially collapsed and I had a traumatic brain injury, which put me on the edge of death.

GUPTA: Jacy fought back, refusing to give in.

GOOD: I wanted my life back. In college, I had the reputation that I was the one who was going to save the world.

GUPTA: Her call to action came after the driver who caused the accident wasn't convicted. There was no law against the use of cellphones.

GOOD: I spoke at a press conference in Pennsylvania trying to get a hand-held ban and a texting ban. Finally it went into effect that texting and driving is illegal.

It was Sunday morning...

GUPTA: And now, the 28-year-old also speaks around the country to raise awareness about the dangers of using a phone behind the wheel.

GOOD: I am so grateful that I still have everything that I do have, in spite of having lost so much. Part of life is getting hurt. None of us escape unscathed. I survived for a reason and with a purpose. I'm going to use my time on this planet to make some other lives a little bit better.

GUPTA: Dr. Sanjay Gupta, CNN, reporting.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BANFIELD: Thanks for watching everybody, nice to have you with us. Wolf starts right after this quick break.

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