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Legal View with Ashleigh Banfield

Another Controversial Shooting Fuels Race Division; Two Sisters On Opposing Sides In Aaron Hernandez Trial; New Video In Suge Knight Murder Case

Aired March 09, 2015 - 12:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

ASHLEIGH BANFIELD, CNN HOST: It's become all too familiar. A white police officer shoots and kills an unarmed 19-year-old. Protesters hit the streets and demand answers. This latest controversial shooting happened on Friday evening in Madison, Wisconsin and here is what we know about the shooting, and it isn't a whole lot yet.

Someone called 911 on Friday night. They complained about black male yelling and jumping in front of cars. Another call came in to 911 saying the suspect was trying to hit and strangle someone.

When Officer Matt Kenny arrived at the scene, a young man named Tony Robinson, a biracial 19-year-old allegedly tried to assault the officer. Police say during the scuffle, Officer Kenny suffered a blow to the head. We also know that Robinson pled guilty to armed robbery last April and just made that plea in December. And Kenny also has a past, he shot and killed a man in the line of duty eight years ago but he was cleared of any wrong doing related to that shooting, the police saying that it was an incident of suicide by cop.

I want to bring in Rosa Flores who is live in Madison, Wisconsin right now and CNN's law enforcement analyst, Tom Fuentes in Washington.

Rosa, you've been able to interview the neighbor who lives directly next door in the apartment and she was able to give some details about what she at least could hear happening. Can you enlighten us?

ROSA FLORES, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, absolutely. Now, she describes the walls between where she lives. It's a duplex. It's a duplex that you see behind me, just paper thin, Ashleigh. So she's able to hear everything that's happening.

Now, it's important to note that n this particular case because I know you have covered all of the high profile cases, is that we don't have a swarm of witnesses coming forward, viral videos, and that's because this happened inside the house. It's important to note that. So this woman who listen to everything, all of the details unfold. She's very, very important. She's already talked to the Department of Justice and take a listen to what she heard.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KATHLEEN BUTTON, NEIGHBOR: I heard the pounding on the door. UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Was that the police?

BUFTON: Yeah. And he forced the door open and went upstairs I don't know what happened I heard just more, you know, scuffling. I don't know.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Like a commotion something...

BUFTON: Yeah. That was going on -- yeah, and then when they -- when there was a running down the stairs I've heard the shots.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

FLORES: Then you could hear in her voice that she's nervous, she said she was scared, she didn't know what to do, she ducked to the ground, she says when she heard those gun shots and try to take cover and then Ashleigh she said I knew that something very bad have happened and she said I didn't even want to go outside because she just was too afraid.

BANFIELD: I want to bring in Tom Fuentes as well. Rosa, standby if you would for a moment, please. So Tom you heard what we know so far as the tic tac of how this incident actually transpired. Is there anything that stands out to you?

TOM FUENTES, CNN ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: I think what stands out Ashleigh is that the police already had received multiple calls first the erratic behavior of running in between cars on the street. And then the report that a battery had occurred that someone was trying to be strangled by the subject and then that the subject run in that house.

So when the police get there they already have a notion that a violent act has already occurred and from the earlier reporting we heard that the police officer heard scuffling inside the house and shows after knocking on the doors and no answer to go ahead and break in, so. You know in this particular case there's more truth of story than we've had in other shooting incidents.

BANFIELD: And the other thing Tom, I want to ask you about this and -- look I have to stress that the reporting is early, that, you know, there have been stations that WK, OW was able to get the dispatch and listen to the 911 call and we do know that the dispatcher said apparently Tony hit one of his friends no weapon seen.

There's two things that, that sort of stands out -- those two things stand out to me. Number one, they're calling him by his first name, Tony this are dispatchers not saying the suspect of the mail suspect identified as Tony Robinson and then Rosa was suggesting no weapons seen so are those sort of mutually exclusive issues there?

FUETES: Not necessarily what, you know the Department of Criminal Investigation Wisconsin Department of Justice are now handling the case they would also have the phone calls that actually came into the dispatcher and that would have to be checked also. How did the dispatcher know what to say to the officers on the street over the radio based on what they have received in the multiple phone calls that they had received?

So we don't have that to indicate why the dispatcher would say that. Secondly, any report that somebody that so far there's no weapon displayed in a way almost means nothing specially if the subject had a chance to go into their residence, they have access to butcher knives, guns and any manner of weapons.

So to say that on the street no weapon was displayed that doesn't prepare the officer that his absolutely dealing with none violent or an unarmed subject especially once they go into the residence.

BANFIELD: All right, Tom Fuentes thank you. Rosa Flores thank you as well.

I want to move on to the Aaron Hernendez murder trial. You know we said before on this program if you really want to know what's going on inside the house, ask the maid maybe the better question would be what did the babysitter see?

Because that's here and she was there very, very close to when the murder happened. We're going to tell you what she knows next.

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BANFIELD: Part crime saga, part soap opera. The Aaron Hernandez trial is certainly all drama. Two sisters torn apart, one engaged to the rising NFL star. The other one dating the man who's accused of killing Odin Lloyd, that's awkward.

And this morning the jury heard from this woman, Jennifer Fortier. She's also the babysitter for Aaron Hernandez. And also the woman who slept over at the Patriots apartment couple of days before Lloyd's death. And yes, he had an apartment as well at the house.

The jury also saw this surveillance video look closely if you squint you can see Hernandez taking long drags of what's being described as either a cigarette or a marijuana cigarette. And that my friends is the night of the shooting, the night of the murder.

Joining me live outside the courthouse in Fall River, Massachusetts is CNN's Susan Candiotti. So, I'm fascinated by this babysitter because if you ever want to know what goes on, you need to figure out what those inside the house gets to see. What else is she going to be able to tell us, Susan?

SUSAN CANDIOTTI, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well I'll tell you her answers are very short and very clipped because those are the kinds of questions the prosecutor is asking her right now. But she is able to give us an inside view if -- on the hours before Aaron Hernandez left the house prosecutor say with two codefendants to later kill Odin Lloyd. That's the allegation to which she's pleaded not guilty.

So, she is saying that she got a knock on the door in about midnight after Aaron Hernandez and his fiancee left to go out to dinner. And she said I'm startled at midnight. And that's when she answers the door and that's when Ernest Wallace and Carlos Ortiz arrive at the house about an hour before Aaron Hernandez comes back from dinner with his fiancee. And eventually we are now watching video of them leaving again at a little after 1 a.m. to go pick up Odin Lloyd.

Ashleigh, the jury is keyed in on this video, so is Aaron Hernandez.

BANFIELD: And what's the story about this babysitter who apparently stayed at the crash. How are they getting somewhere that's going to be very uncomfortable for this fiancee?

CANDIOTTI: Right. Right, yeah and Shayanna the fiancee is not in the courtroom listening to this. We haven't gotten to the part yet where the babysitter slept over at the clubhouse two nights earlier. They didn't talk about that yet. They've gone forward in time.

BANFIELD: OK.

CANDIOTTI: But she is the one authority say, who slept over at the house.

BANFIELD: All right, I think you're going to have more to report yet at the clubhouse. Susan come back and let us know when the testimony continues. Thank you for that.

Coming up next a woman who was on fire and didn't even realize it. People who lost limbs, shocking testimony in the Boston Marathon bombing trial. And they're not just in pictures in that courtroom, they are there in person facing down the man who's accused of doing this to them, what do you think the jury is thinking.

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BANFIELD: The trial of Boston Marathon alleged bomber Dzhokhar Tsarnaev took up today where it left off last Thursday with heart rending testimony from people who lost limbs or worst on that horrific April afternoon in 2013.

CNN Deb Feyerick is there. Deb it is one thing to cover a murder trial when the victims are depicted in photographs that are silent. And it is quite another when you see victim after victim who survive walking, hobbling, rolling up to the stand to face down the man who's accused of doing it to them but also to face the jury.

Can you tell me how these jurors are reacting to all of this?

DEB FEYERICK, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well it's really incredible because the first witness who went by the name of Jessica Kensky. She walked, she came in to the courtroom wearing light sweater, beautiful stripped dress, she was in a wheel chair and you could see both legs are missing and scars at the end of her stomps.

She took a stand, used her experience and the trauma nurse to say that the bomb did exactly what it was supposed to do. It ripped away the soft tissue, the muscles leaving body parts exposed. She went to try to help her husband who was also badly injured because they were standing right in front of that first bomb.

And she said she didn't even realize that she herself was on fire. And then when prosecutors held up the clothing she was wearing that day Dzhokhar Tsarnaev didn't even turn around to look. He's made very little eye contact with any of the witnesses. The jury is taking all of these in.

They are clearly moved by the power of the testimony because it's not just the images as you say, Ashleigh, it is the words and the details that are making this so graphic and so horrible. A number of jurors invisibly choked up and, you know, wiping away tears, so it is very difficult to listen to but very important to understand exactly what happened, Ashleigh.

BANFIELD: So critical to hear from those survivors so that these are not just photographs that are speaking from the grave. Deb Fererick incredible work. Thank you for that, appreciate it.

Music mogul Suge Knight is accused of running down two men with his truck and there is now brand new video of what happened. And make no mistake, it is stunning.

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BANFIELD: There are some new and disturbing video that will impact the murder case against media mogul Suge Knight. The video obtained by TMZ shows the January 29th incident where Knight's truck apparently runs over the two men. The truck backs up, hits one men, seconds later the truck comes back and runs over that and we have to, you know, digitize the video because it was very violent, and it also runs over another and one of the man who were run over died.

Knight says that for his part he was trying to get away because he thought he was being ambushed and might actually be shot. Suge Knight is expected back in court of 2:30 p.m. Eastern Time today in CNN's Paul Vercammen at the court house Los Angeles. Here with me legal analyst Joe Jackson and Denny Cevallos. Paul, first to you what are we expecting because we're hearing now that Suge may have actually dismissed his attorney just thinking of representing himself is that accurate?

PAUL VERCAMMEN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well things change faster in Los Angeles actually what happen is that Knight has already appeared. Knight walked into the court room and he basically notified everybody that his new attorney is Matthew Fletcher from Long Beach and then Matthew Fletcher came downstairs after his very, very quick proceeding one who which avail during was that for the 20th or continue to tell that and Fletcher got in front of this whole video issue.

And Fletcher said repeatedly that this was a case where Suge Knight was lured to this hamburger stand and then was ambushed there he said he thought like three man who were known gang members. Let's take a listen to what the new lawyer for Suge Knight had to say.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) MATTHEW FLETCHER, SUGE KNIGHT ATTORNEY: With my (inaudible) that gentlemen did and he takes that he use his way out, he's not required to back out and reverse down the street. These guys were -- my understanding on those active gang members clearly a gun was (inaudible).

(END VIDEO CLIP)

VERCAMMEN: Again the new attorney for Suge Knight trying to get out in front of all this repeatedly stating that a 100 percent he says that this video shows that Suge Knight was ambushed clearly laying a defense out where Suge Knight is articulating that these men had plotted and schemed to attack him at that burger stand outside the court room though others supporters of not Suge Knight saying of course that he is just the thug and this is part of his criminal activity back to you now, Ashleigh.

BANFIELD: All right, thanks so much Paul VERCAMMEN. I want to bring in Denny and Joey on this I know you two have opposing views on this but that notion that you just heard Matthew Fletcher, I hope I got his name right, the new attorney for Suge Knight he said clearly there was a gun removed from one of them suggesting they we're gangsters and that they were dangerous. Will that make a difference now that you have this sort of clear video, I know it's not clear for our viewers but clear video.

DANNY CEVALLOS, CNN LEGAL ANAYST: Well that's the thing its not that clear and a gun makes a huge difference if in fact there is a gun which I don't know that we'll ever know unless you get those experts to come in and testify as to the pixilation and they sharpen the image but if -- even if that is an issue of reasonable doubt that will inure to the benefit of Suge because if there is a gun or the inspector of a gun is raised. Now we're talking about deadly force and Suge Knight will argue that he is allowed to use to meet deadly force with deadly force in other words a gun with a gun.

So it stands the reason ...

BNAFIELD: Or a gun with a truck?

CEVALLOS: Right. So it stands the reason then you should at least be allowed to use deadly force to flee and get out of there to avoid getting hit.

BANFIELD: Don't you have and many say it's a duty to find egress first before that?

JOEY JACKSON, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: Yes. But even backing up before that let me take the prosecution's point of view. Two issues to be clear first was there eminent fear for his life, was he an eminent fear. Number two was the force he used proportionate to the threat that was post. The video that I see maybe I don't believe my lying eyes but apparently he backed up and when you're backing up at that point you could continue to go back, you could continue to flee, you could continue to leave. It appears as though he backed up. Now Ashleigh, look at this. He backs up the person is down that person poses no fear will say the prosecution poses no treat. You see Terry, Terry is not pointing any weapon if he does have a weapon at Suge Knight. Suge Knight then goes and plows him over, so was there an immediacy of danger? I would say as a prosecutor right no, they going to say that. In number two was the force used a truck to plow over a person who's not pointing a weapon if they have one at you is that force proportion its any treat prose a prosectors going to say no and no which will spell problems to Suge Knight.

CEVALLOS: Good argument but if he - but if Suge Knight can creat a tie if he can raise that spector of reasonable doubt as to whether or not if there is possibly a gun there then Suge Knight wins because of that presumption of reasonable doubt that he is permitted to use self defense if he can raise the issue that deadly force was being raised against him that any of those guys had a gun and not an iPhone and not a wallet.

BANFIELD: All right. So just quickly play the video again at the same time I watch it over and over, I can't make a lot of it again we digitized some of it but out forensic analyst. The lack better of this than I am and our viewers and what we're able to see with our, you know, untrained eye.

JACKSON: Also Ashleigh understand that the defense playing defense now they're going to make a big deal about the back story why was he this? Was he there on the false pretenses? Was he threatened while he was there? What was going on? Who are these people? Are they gang bangers? What have they done in their past, expect the defense to expose all of that so we don't only see a video but we know the back story leading up to the video as well that's going to be very important.

BANFIELD: Well we have the appearance and I say thank God he's not going to defend himself because if you defend yourself the older expression is you have a fool for a--

JACKSON: You have a fool for a client. The attorney who represents themselves has a fool for a client.

BANFIELD: And a fool for a lawyer as they say.

CEVALLOS: No. But I'll represent each other any day.

BANFIELD: Danny and Joey thank you it's great to have you as always. And thank you all for joining us. Please stay tuned to my friend and colleague, Wolf Blitzer, starts right now.