Return to Transcripts main page
Legal View with Ashleigh Banfield
Fraternity's House Mom Involved in Racist Chants; Frat Race, Hazing & Rape; Video of Tsarnaev Brothers Released
Aired March 10, 2015 - 12:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
ASHLEIGH BANFIELD, CNN ANCHOR: Hello, everyone. I'm Ashleigh Banfield. Welcome to LEGAL VIEW.
It's 11:00 a.m. in Norman, Oklahoma. Thirteen hours and counting for students who used to be members of Sigma Alpha Epsilon at OU to be o- u-t, out of the frat house anyway. The issue, of course, that despicable display of racism by SAE members who were heading into a founder's day party, that's the birthday of the fraternity. This just over the weekend. But while the University of Oklahoma chapter of SAE is shut down, the letters already pried off the building and replaced with graffiti instead. The fate of the offending students, though, still unclear.
Here's Oklahoma University President and former Oklahoma governor and U.S. Senator David Boren.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DAVID BOREN, PRESIDENT, UNIVERSITY OF OKLAHOMA: Well, legally our concern is we have to demonstrate exactly how the educational experience of our students was threatened or disrupted by their actions. And it really has to focus also on the students on the bus. Did the other students have their educational experience disrupted? So our lawyers are piling through that now just as our investigators pile through the evidence, look at the video, see if we can identify those who were the ringleaders. I think that's who we have to concentrate on in this chant and leading the chant.
But we're not going to tolerate it. We're not going to put up with it. We just simply can't. And if I have to take a risk to send those students home permanently or for a semester, the rest of the year, whatever it is I can do, we're going to do it.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BANFIELD: It's not just the students facing a midnight deadline to vacate that house because the chapter's 78-year-old housemother is also having to leave. Yesterday she told CBS that she's, quote, "disappointed," by what she heard on that bus. But wait until you hear a vine video of the house mom from somewhere around 2013 where she appears to be gleefully singing the "n" word.
(VIDEO CLIP) BANFIELD: And, yes, that has gone viral. It is time to bring in CNN's Nick Valencia, who is live in Norman, Oklahoma.
Can you give us some context and tell us what the circumstances were regarding that video of the house mom?
NICK VALENCIA, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Sure. Well, this short clip was posted on a popular social media app called Vine, which is used a lot by students here at the University of Oklahoma. And it appears to show, as you said, the former house mom of the SAE fraternity here at the university. Her name, Beauton Gilbow. According to this student newspaper here, "The O.U. Daily," which first reported the video, it was posted sometime in late February in 2013.
Now, we have attempted, as an organization, CNN, to reach out to her to get context about what perhaps she was saying in that video and to get her side of the story. It appears just from listening to that tape that she is singing along with a hook of a popular rapper, an Atlanta- based rapper I should say, named Trinidad James, whose song was popular back in 2013. Some might find this ironic. As you mentioned, she spoke yesterday to CBS News talking about how disappointed she was in the actions of those members caught on tape from SAE.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BEAUTON GILBOW, FORMER SAE "HOUSE MOTHER": I heard the words. Unbelievable. This is not -- this is not SAE. This has been my family. I can't imagine tomorrow. I'm very disappointed, very ashamed, embarrassed.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VALENCIA: Now, again, we have to emphasize that we have reached out to Gilbow for comment but, Ashleigh, we just have not yet heard back.
BANFIELD: So, Nick, we heard the president saying that there's still investigations that need to be completed, that there may be people who are kicked off campus for good or for a semester, et cetera. But there were some other people on the bus. There were some young women on the bus from a sorority. Is there much talk about what's going to happen with them?
VALENCIA: Well, certainly. A statement just posted by the Tri Delta sorority just a little while ago, on their official website, saying that they are cooperating fully with the investigation here of university officials at the University of Oklahoma and that they are disappointed with the actions of those that they saw in this video. They do say, though, that they are fully cooperating. It is worth mentioning, though, that we don't know what official steps the university has taken against those individuals in this tape seen over the weekend. You say that it was at a founder's event, an anniversary for the university fraternity. It was on a party bus. I've spoken to students here who are just disgusted, they condemn it. They also say that they're shocked that it was SAE that was caught on tape because there are other fraternities here at the university that are just as bad. One student I spoke to says she believes that the entire Greek system here should be investigated.
Ashleigh.
BANFIELD: Nick Valencia reporting live. Thank you for that.
I also want to play another clip that shows far better than I or anyone on CNN could possibly show, the betrayal that so many O.U. -- 30,000 students, in fact, feel about the hatred of just a few that was displayed on that bus. So, here for you, the words of Oklahoma linebacker Eric Striker.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ERIC STRIKER, UNIVERSITY OF OKLAHOMA LINEBACKER: I'm so (EXPLETIVE DELETED) furious right now. SAE just (EXPLETIVE DELETED) it up for all you (EXPLETIVE DELETED) white fraternities. (EXPLETIVE DELETED) all you (EXPLETIVE DELETED). And if anything your (EXPLETIVE DELETED) affiliated with, (EXPLETIVE DELETED) you. The same (EXPLETIVE DELETED) telling them how (INAUDIBLE) (EXPLETIVE DELETED) (INAUDIBLE) giving us love. I know how you really love us, (EXPLETIVE DELETED). Phony (EXPLETIVE DELETED).
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BANFIELD: Last night, a calmer but no less hurt Eric Striker spoke with my CNN colleague Don Lemon.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
STRIKER: We believe that, you know, President Boren is taking the right actions and investigating and doing the right thing, you know, more than just suspensions and expelling these students, the people who are responsible for it, the people on the bus.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BANFIELD: And then there's Jean Delance, a high school offensive lineman from Texas, who had committed to play at the University of Oklahoma but now says he will play elsewhere, saying he was personally hurt.
And if you were watching CNN the last hour, you met the last African- American member of the O.U. chapter of Sigma Alpha Epsilon. Betrayal doesn't even begin to express his reaction.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
WILLIAM JAMES II, LAST AFRICAN-AMERICAN MEMBER OF UNIV. OF OKLA. SAE: The guys in that video are not my brothers. My first reaction was complete disgust and shock. I was deeply offended as a black man in general, but I was devastated also having been in that house for four years and put my own blood, sweat and tears in cultivating a culture that would never do that.
(END VIDEO CLIP) BANFIELD: And I've got to give the last word in this segment to a legend of the civil rights movement who says racism on college campuses is simply, quote, "unbelievable in this day and age," end quote. Congressman John Lewis was a guest on CNN's "New Day."
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REP. JOHN LEWIS (D), GEORGIA: And I think it's not a place on a college or university campus for young people or any group to be acting the way they're acting.
ALISYN CAMEROTA, ANCHOR, CNN'S "NEW DAY": They should be gone?
LEWIS: They should be gone.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BANFIELD: Sadly, before the racist bus video went viral, that fraternity, SAE, also had a starring role in a highly disturbing documentary about sexual assault on college campuses. The film's executive producer is going to join me next. First, though, here is a quick look.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I got a call from the dean of admissions asking if you were to get into Harvard (ph), would you accept? And I said, yes, because I knew my mom would kill me if I said anything else.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The first few weeks I made some of my best friends. But two of us were sexually assaulted before classes had even started.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I went to the dean of students office. And she said, I just want to make sure that you don't talk to anyone about this.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: They protect perpetrators because they have a financial incentive to do so.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The problem of sexual assault on campuses is enormous.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I think it's fair to say that they cover these crimes up.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: There's a lot of victim blaming.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He lectured us about how we shouldn't go out in short skirts.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: They told me despite the fact that I had a written admission of guilt that I presented to them could only prove that he loved me.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: They discourage them from going to the police. If they go to the police, then it's more likely to end up as a public record.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Universities are protecting a brand.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Campus police cannot contact an athlete.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He won the Heisman trophy with his DNA rape kit.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Just sit down with the students, ask them, where are the hot spots?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: SAE, sexual assault expected.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The second most common type of insurance claim against the fraternity industries is for rape.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Her rapist name matched the name of two other cases and he was allowed back on campus.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The message is clear, you're not going to win.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We started seeing, you know, what was happening at campuses across the country.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Why has no one connected the dots before?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: These students went from sexual assault victims to survivors and now activists.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: My name is Carolyn Looby (ph).
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: My name is Alexis Schwartz (ph).
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: My name is Ari Mostov (ph).
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: This is a national problem.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We are fed up.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I was getting threatened. It was working in their favor to silence me and I was terrified.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I thought if I told them they would take action. But the only action they took was against me.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We've got a lot further to go.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BANFIELD: We have been talking about that boisterously racist song belted out by Sigma Alpha Epsilon members in Oklahoma on a bus. And yesterday we told you about SAE's hazing and alcohol accusations, even the deaths of at least 10 members since 2006. And that's according to Bloomberg. Today we want to dig into sexual assault allegations against SAE chapters around the country and this is why.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: SAE, sexual assault expected.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BANFIELD: Sexual assault expected. Some say SAE not only stands for Sigma Alpha Epsilon but it stands for that very uncomfortable phrase, sexual assault expected. That was a clip from the CNN film "The Hunting Ground." An expose of sexual assaults on college campuses. And Joining me now is the producer of that film, Amy Ziering.
Amy, it's nice to have you. Thank you for coming in.
AMY ZIERING: Thank you for having me.
BANFIELD: You know, you and I met just a week ago when this film began its rollout across the country. It opened in New York and L.A. and we were talking solely about sexual assaults and this particular fraternity featured fairly prominently, people -- a lot of people knew that expression, sexual assault expected.
ZIERING: Yes. When we traveled around the country looking into researching the epidemic of assaults on our campuses, time and again we'd ask students, where -- what have you heard on your campus, where is it dangerous? And they would say SAE. And we'd say, really, you know? And then we'd also ask, what are -- are there any nicknames for any of the fraternities on your campus and time and again they would say "sexual assault expected" is the nickname for SAE.
BANFIELD: One of the things your documentary pointed out very poignantly was that while SAE seemed to have, according to your research and the people you interviewed, a real problem with this, so did other fraternities right throughout the Greek system, right across the country. In the light of what we're seeing here, we've heard other people say, hey, this racist bus video is not unique. Did that surprise you to hear they're saying it's everywhere, it's at a lot of these fraternities?
ZIERING: That video shocked me, but, you know, it wouldn't surprise me that if that's happening at one fraternity it would happen at others. Because what we found in our research is whenever we uncovered something happening somewhere, it wasn't a one off, it wasn't a unique situation. It actually was pretty much a blueprint for what is happening at fraternities across the country.
BANFIELD: So I mentioned this to someone on the set yesterday. I'm 47. And nothing like this ever happened on the boisterous bus rides that I was on in college. And a lot of my colleagues say the same thing. Granted, disclaimer, I'm from Canada. A little different. What has happened? What all of a sudden is different? Why are you finding the awfulness that you're finding in this day and age? ZIERING: I don't know. I'm not a sociologist. And I don't actually
know if it's different. I think what we have now are these phones which can take these images, right, and we can circulate them a lot quicker over social media. So maybe we're just hearing about this. I mean racism has been in this country for a very long time, you know. What -- so I, you know, I don't know what to tell you. And also sexual assaults, well, I know why we haven't heard about that because the institutions are incentivized to cover them up.
BANFIELD: Right. Do you think that sexual assault on campus was as bad 10, 20, 40 years ago as it is as it's depicted in your documentary?
ZIERING: Again, we don't have the studies because these institutions weren't interested in doing this kind of research because who wants to expose negative -- negative --
BANFIELD: Yes. Stats. (INAUDIBLE) stats on your institution.
ZIERING: Stats on your institution. So we don't know. But anecdotally and empirically what we've seen and when we interview people is it seems to have been going on for decades.
BANFIELD: Last question, alcohol. It is a problem among these young kids. They are consuming it at alarming rates. I know you have a point of view in the documentary about alcohol as perhaps a precursor to the sexual assault problem. I want to get your take on that as sort of a last word and also how that might pertain to what we're seeing on this side (ph).
ZIERING: Well, what we found, which was so shocking to me and so revelatory as a parent, as a mom who has kids in college, which I didn't know, is that it isn't hook-up culture. It isn't sex gone bad. It's actually alcohol being used as a weapon by serial predators. And that's the information in our film that we want the country to see and that's why we think it's so important for people to go to theaters during our rollout because we're telling a story that no one has heard before and no one really understands. And to protect our children, you need to see this film.
BANFIELD: Well, and, you know, it behooves every parent across the country to look, to do the research before your kids head off to these very prestigious institutions, some of them. The stats are there. And hopefully, you know, if these bills get passed that are in the hopper, that kind of information will be a lot more available. Thank you so much.
And, by the way, a quick reminder, if you're in new York or L.A., the theaters are already showing this film, "The Hunting Ground." But this weekend it opens in how many more cities?
ZIERING: Four, I think.
BANFIELD: Four more cities across the country.
ZIERING: San Francisco, Berkeley, D.C. and Boston.
BANFIELD: And then two weeks from now, Chicago --
ZIERING: And then Chicago the following weekend. It's currently in New York and L.A.
BANFIELD: New York and L.A.
And CNN will be airing the film on our airwaves later this year as well. Amy, it's good to see you. Thank you for the information.
ZIERING: Thanks so much.
BANFIELD: Thanks for the great work. I mean that was a lot of digging and a lot of hard material to sort through.
ZIERING: Yes.
BANFIELD: So, we appreciate you doing that. Thank you.
ZIERING: Thank you.
BANFIELD: Good to see you again.
Coming up next, video played for the -- for clearly showing the Tsarnaev brothers in the moments before the Boston blasts. And afterwards, too. And it is difficult to say which of the scenes are more upsetting. But what's clear, the man in the circle, Dzhokhar Tsarnaev.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BANFIELD: The jurors in the Boston Marathon bombing trial are seeing some pretty dramatic new video. It's of the Tsarnaev brothers seconds before the blasts tore into the crowd at the finish line and afterwards as well, which is very telling. And I want to warn you that some of the pictures we're about to show you are definitely disturbing.
The surveillance video shows people just milling about moments before the bombs went off. The circle on the left-hand side of your screen is pointing to Dzhokhar Tsarnaev in the crowd. The first bomb explodes. People are confused but Dzhokhar simply starts walking away. And then the second one goes off.
CNN's Deborah Feyerick breaks down the critical other footage of the defendant before and immediately after those deadly blasts went off.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
DEBORAH FEYERICK, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Nearly four hours after the race began, the Tsarnaev brothers rounded the corner together onto the marathon route. Tamerlan in the lead, the younger Dzhokhar keeping pace. Then the two split up. Tamerlan heading to the finish line. Multiple images show Dzhokhar Tsarnaev standing by himself for nearly four minutes, among spectators, several of them children. At 2:49, records show, using a disposable phone bought the day before,
Dzhokhar, seen here, calls his brother. Moments later, the first bomb explodes. Dzhokhar moves quickly in the opposite direction, reaching the corner just as the second bomb detonates. Neither Dzhokhar nor Tamerlan have their backpacks.
Less than 23 minutes after the terror attack, Dzhokhar Tsarnaev enters a nearby Whole Foods and pays cash for a half gallon of milk. He leaves only to return moments later to swap the milk before getting back into the passenger side of a car. The driver speeds off. That night, on one of two Twitter accounts under his name, Tsarnaev posts, "ain't no love in the heart of the city, stay safe, people."
Prosecutors say 19-year-old Tsarnaev had returned to his dorm room at Umass Dartmouth. He's seen here at 9:05 p.m. the next night entering the university fitness center with a friend and staying for about an hour. The FBI gathered 4,000 hours of surveillance videos, photos and home movies from that day.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
BANFIELD: Four thousand hours. I want to bring in Deborah Feyerick, who's live at the courthouse in Boston right now. And with us as well, HLN legal analyst Joey Jackson.
Deb, if we could just begin with you. Get me up to speed on today. It's great that you can come out of the courtroom. We don't have cameras in there. It's a federal court proceeding. But what are the jurors hearing, how are they reacting to what they're hearing today?
FEYERICK: Well, you know, it's very interesting because the video that you just showed, the way the jury reacted to that is they saw a man who apparently didn't care about what was going on. He was more interested in the kind of milk he was buying than in the people he had killed and maimed.
Today, what they saw, was a note that he scrawled in the boat where he was hiding. And that text was read by one of the people who found it. It was covered with blood. There were bullet holes that pock marked it. He was jealous that his brother got into paradise, according to the note, and he said God has a plan for each of us and perhaps the plan for him was to stay behind to shed some light. And he's quoted saying that, "you're fighting me who looks into the barrel of a gun and sees heaven. How can you compete with that?"
So, very strong testimony supporting the motive, the reason why Dzhokhar Tsarnaev may have done this. But Tsarnaev's lawyers had a little bit of a victory today because they really tore apart some of the Twitter accounts that were alleged to have come from Tsarnaev, saying that most of the tweets were about girls and cars and studies and they referenced music titles and they pointed out that the FBI actually isolated only those tweets that were relevant to their case and did not look at them in their entirety. And there were some very uncomfortable moments for that FBI agent who was on the stand today. But the Tsarnaev lawyers looked a little bit pleased because they haven't cross examined barely anyone during this trial, Ashleigh. FEYERICK: Well, I can only assume that could come back to haunt them too.
Stand by for a moment, Deb, if you will. I want to bring Joey in on this.
OK, so a 19-year-old kid is fawning over some girls and on two separate Twitter accounts at one point he's saying things like, "ain't no love in the heart of the city. Stay safe, people." This after he allegedly planted that bomb right next to a couple of kids and set it off. And on another account, he's got jihadi references and things like, "I will die young."
JOEY JACKSON, HLN LEGAL ANALYST: Big problem.
BANFIELD: Yes.
JACKSON: Let me -- let's talk about why. The prosecution is pursuing a strategy that I call triangulation. Here's what they're doing. First, they're bringing in the victims, people who were suffer -- who suffered and suffered dramatically at his hands, lost limbs, lost a child. There are people who are suffering grievously because of his actions. That's step one.
Step number two, Deb referenced it, going -- what is he doing after the fact. You're more concerned about purchasing milk after. Are you? After doing this. This shows callousness.
Step number three, to the heart of what you're saying --
BANFIELD: But, wait -- no -- no, let's get past step two. He bought the milk but he returned it because it wasn't the right kind.
JACKSON: Fabulous point.
BANFIELD: And got the right -- I mean, honestly, seconds after --
JACKSON: Right.
BANFIELD: All of these people were so grievously injured and killed --
JACKSON: Right.
BANFIELD: He didn't like the kind of milk he'd bought.
JACKSON: Cold blood and --
BANFIELD: And had to return it.
JACKSON: That does, Ashleigh, to three, which is the Twitter, OK? Now, they may have -- that is the defense -- had some moments feeling gleeful because, hey, FBI agent, you just told the jurors about the relevant e-mails, about the ones where he is about jihad and against America. Well, of course, because those are the ones that focus on you having, sir, a mind of your own. This is about your brother? Well, was he tweeting those tweets about America? Was he tweeting those tweets about rising up against it? So, of course, you're going to have assorted other tweets in your e-mail account. It's the FBI's job to bring the people of the jury, those that are relevant, to this case. And by those three theories, what you have, what the prosecution hopes, is a death penalty case that can actually be won.
BANFIELD: Can --
JACKSON: That's what this case is about, preserving his life.
BANFIELD: Speaking of that, just a couple of seconds. By the way, I will die young. Maybe not as young as he figured.
JACKSON: Right.
BANFIELD: But a really quick question. If you -- in all of your years in a courtroom and you've seen words come back to haunt defendants, have you ever seen words come back written in their own blood? Something that the jury will actually have to look at. They'll have to look at Dzhokhar Tsarnaev's own blood --
JACKSON: From that boat.
BANFIELD: From the boat.
JACKSON: Very chilling, very telling and right there a confession. And so the reality is, at the end of the day, this is compelling stuff. Will it resonate with the jury? I certainly think so.
BANFIELD: Deb, you wanted a last quick word there?
FEYERICK: Two quick points. One of them, the car was presumably driven by his brother. So it would have been his brother who sent him back in to exchange that milk. The second thing, the tweets apparently referred to rap lyrics, both in Russian and in English. So I will die young is actually from a Russian rap lyric and that was brought out in court today.
BANFIELD: OK.
FEYERICK: So, again, the defense very carefully setting up their case, Ashleigh and Joey.
BANFIELD: Deb Feyerick, thank you.
Joey Jackson, thank you.
JACKSON: Always.
BANFIELD: Also coming up, 47 Republican senators signing a letter to Iran that some Democrats say makes them traitors. Yes, they used the "t" word. Some even used the "t" word treason. But is the Constitution on their said. we'll have the legal view, next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
