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Germanwings Crash; Rescue Challenges. Aired 2:00-2:30p ET

Aired March 24, 2015 - 14:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[14:00:00] WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: Thanks very much for watching. "Newsroom" with Brooke Baldwin starts right now.

BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN ANCHOR: Here we go. Top of the hour. You're watching CNN. I'm Brooke Baldwin. Thank you so much for being with me. And I just want to thank all of our viewers in the United States and all around the world.

We have huge, huge developments to report at this hour, of course, on that absolutely devastating plane crash in the French Alps. So stand by for much more coverage on that.

Also just a heads up, we were following some other news in -- minutes from now. We are waiting to hear from the president of the United States, from President Barack Obama. He is due to speak after this crucial meeting with Afghanistan's new president, Ashraf Ghani.

The Afghani leader is in Washington with a warning, as we've been reporting, with ISIS on the move, pulling all American troops out of his country by the end of 2016 as is planned. According to this new Afghan president, it could have devastating consequences. The question that we'll be waiting for, of course, through this news conference is, will President Obama listen to this president, will he heed the warning? Might he change the timetable in the American presence there? We will, of course, bring you that news conference as soon as it happens live here on CNN.

But let me pivot to our breaking news this hour. This German airliner said to be, quote, "obliterated," in a devastating crash in the south of France. Here's what we know right now. Searchers are now scouring this wreckage of the Germanwings Flight 9525. Certainly when you think about the terrain, no easy task. Steep mountains in an incredibly remote area of the French Alps. And even as they reach the site, at this point in time, we are told this will likely be a recovery mission and not a rescue mission here. Not a search for survivors.

On board this plane, some 150 people. Among them, two babies and possibly a group of high school students. The airline, Germanwings. It's a budget carrier of Lufthansa. Now says its Airbus A-320 was at a cruising altitude a mere one minute before it started its descent, before it started that fall.

Flight 9525 wasn't even midway through its route from Barcelona there in Spain to Dusseldorf in Germany when it started a catastrophic eight-minute descent. Why this occurred, it is way too early to say. But I can report now that one of those black box flight recorders, those flight data recorders, has been found. In fact, it's now en route to investigators. And that, of course, could hold the answers as to the why.

Speaking today, the airline's CEO quick to say the captain of this jet was very experienced.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

THOMAS WINKELMANN, CEO, GERMANWINGS (through translator): The captain of the airliner was a captain who had been working for Lufthansa and Germanwings for over 10 years. The model Airbus, he had actually flown with over 6,000 flight hours.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: Joining me now, I have CNN international anchor Hala Gorani. She is live for us in London. I have Les Abend with me here in New York, CNN aviation analyst and 777 captain and contributing editor for "Flying" magazine. Also with us, another very valuable voice, David Soucie, CNN's safety analyst and former FAA safety inspector and author of "Malaysia Airlines Flight 370."

So, welcome to all of you. And we have a lot to pick through here.

Hala, let me just begin with you because I was reading part of this transcript of your interview with the president of this region of France and this person really walked you through a lot of the new details as far as, I'm wondering about the recovery mission, how helicopters can land in this region, when they can land in this region. Tell me what he told you.

HALA GORANI, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, it's difficult terrain. It's very difficult to navigate. You can't drive there. You have to send helicopters with search and rescue officials on board to try to figure out, first of all, the lay of the land. Where is the wreckage? How far is it strewn? How far is it scattered? He told me that so far - this was about 45 minutes ago, Brooke - that no helicopter has been able to land. No bodies have been retrieved. And you mentioned there at the top of the hour, 150 passengers and crew, all feared dead.

We did see some video, and you're showing some of that aerial video there, where you see sort of a few rescue workers on the very steep mountainside. Now, we believe they were possibly lowered by helicopter because no helicopter has been able to touch ground in order to start a thorough investigation and, most importantly for the families and loved ones, try to get to the people who sadly it seems now have lost their lives in this tragedy.

[14:05:00] I spoke also to a mountain guide earlier who was telling me, look, here's the problem. This big cloud formation is lowering itself on to this mountain formation. It's going to be very difficult even to fly helicopters. And (INAUDIBLE), the president of that French region, told me snow is forecast tomorrow and the ground is frozen, which means that rescue workers are going to have to wear special gear in order to - and you can see from that video you're showing here just how steep it is - go up and down those very steep hills.

BALDWIN: Yes, this, by the way, for those of you watching with us, this is new video into us of the scene. This is the first time any of us are looking at this here on CNN. And to be clear, from what I understand, you know, not a single piece of this debris is any larger than a small car. Clearly scattered throughout this mountainous region. As Hala was mentioning, the ground is frozen. The snow, it is treacherous, treacherous stuff. We'll be talking to a mountain rescuer as well who can walk us through the process of short lining and long lining and helicopters.

Karl Penhaul is with me as well. And, Karl, I mean we are all absolutely mindful of these families. I know that they've set up these crisis centers on both ends of this journey, both in Spain and in Germany. You're joining me from Barcelona. Have you had a moment to speak with any of these family members? Tell me who could be on board.

KARL PENHAUL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Right now, Brooke, the family members have been arriving. In fact, there's a crisis center set up there behind us. But so far, as they come in, many of them hugging one another, of course. Many of them in tears as well. None of them have spoken to the media so far. Their first priority is to get inside, is to talk to the airline authorities and find out a few more details.

What we do know is that within the last 45 minutes, representatives from Lufthansa, that is the company that owns Germanwings, has talked directly to around 150 relatives and friends of passengers who were on board here at the crisis center. Then, one of the European vice presidents of Lufthansa came out and gave us a briefing as well.

She is telling us that so far around 150 family and friends of some of the passengers on board have come to Barcelona Airport. And right now, Lufthansa is looking at the possibility of perhaps flying those relatives from Barcelona to the area where the crash occurred, considering that they may want to be closer to the recovery effort. They may want to have a look at the site where their relatives lost their lives. But that hasn't been decided yet. So that may not go ahead.

Another issue that the Lufthansa vice president also said was she confirmed that the plane did leave 26 minutes late this morning, but she said at this stage Lufthansa was not saying why. She did not have the answers to why the plane was delayed, whether it was a simple passenger or baggage issue or whether perhaps there was some technical issue right at the start of the flight.

Also, in terms of the nationalities that were aboard, Barcelona, of course, a very cosmopolitan city. We know that Germans were on board. We know that Spaniards were on board. But there were also other nationalities on board that flight as well. So far Lufthansa not confirming the exactly the nationalities who were on board. They say that they must look at the list of the passengers that were booked on, the list of passengers that actually checked in, and also take a look at their passports as well before they can tell us that, Brooke.

BALDWIN: That will take time. Obviously, incredibly gut-wrenching for these families. As we mentioned, hearing two babies on board, a group of high schoolers. One hundred fifty people on this plane, this Airbus 320.

Les, let me just turn to you because, first of all, just reacting to these pictures, hearing the word "obliterated," not a single piece of debris is larger than a small car, and we know most planes, most crashes occur takeoff and landing. This is incredibly rare.

LES ABEND, CNN AVIATION ANALYST: It is, and that's a horrific scene that - this is -- from what I can gather from that video and from some of the data that we've got, that that airplane impacted that terrain at high speed, which, you know, pure speculation on my part, but something occurred that there was either - something occurred in the cockpit that prevented the awareness that this terrain was in their immediate vicinity or they lost awareness, the crew lost awareness of where they were while they were handling and distracted by an emergency of some situation that we won't know until we recover these cockpit voice recorder and the flight data recorder.

BALDWIN: Right. At least we know, unlike other crashes sadly that we've had to cover, they have already found, according to investigators, this one flight data recorder. And so they should have the beginning of some of those answers.

David Soucie, I just want your perspective as well. You heard Les. I mean just also, I am so mindful of these 150 souls on board. You think they're 44 minutes into this flight. They think they're, you know, smooth sailing. And then this plane just goes down for eight minutes before it hits this terrain. In those eight minutes, are those people on board - are they - are they feeling the descent? Are they aware of what's happening?

[14:10:12] DAVID SOUCIE, CNN SAFETY ANALYST: They're aware of what's happening, certainly, as it's descending because they know that it is descending. But it - at this - this is a very controlled descent. It wasn't like a rapid - I mean it was fairly rapid, of course, but it wasn't out of control. So it really raises a lot of questions as to why, if it was that well under control, why there wasn't some kind of emergency notification. And as Les said, there might have been some distraction or something.

But the challenge now going forward is trying to figure that out. I've investigated two different accidents in very similar terrain to this, one in Cheyenne, Wyoming, and one up here in Colorado, and both of those were just horrific scenes, as this one is. But the difficult thing is, once it impacts, when they use the word obliterated, that's probably about the best description you could come up with. But it also goes backwards away from the impact point. So you're actually having to figure out what went forward and what went backward from that accident point to gather information.

The fact they've got the flight data recorder is extremely useful, but the limits of the flight data recorder is that it will tell you what happened. It won't tell you why necessarily. And that's why we have to find that cockpit voice recorder to get the answers as to why it happened and what was going on in that cockpit at the time of the accident.

BALDWIN: And just looking at these pictures, I mean, this is the best, most horrific view we have had yet of this - the pieces of this now obliterated plane.

David Soucie, how do you even go about determining the point of impact when you're looking at this video?

SOUCIE: Well, without being too graphic, you know, it's an impact point, but it's also where we call - it's like a splash zone is what you'd call it originally. But when this aircraft hits, it's very evident -- it's hard to tell from these pictures that you have now, but it's very evident where the initial impact was. It's much like a fireman would try to determine the end point - or the impact or the start of a fire to kind of trace things backwards.

But this is very, very difficult. If you look at this terrain, every one of those grooves, every one of those small valleys or gullies there that traps the debris, it also redirects the debris as well. So trying to find remains and trying to find out how to bring those remains back to the families, this is an incredibly difficult task.

And you can see the gentleman there walking down the hill. The other thing that makes it more difficult as well is that they have to wear protective gear. So this gear is to protect them from Hepatitis B, for example. All of the preparation that goes into these types of sites, these gentlemen that are out there right now most likely already had all of their preparatory shots, their - everything that's necessary to protect them. And that's of the most - utmost importance. Secondly is trying to find the remains and document those and deal with those in a respectful manner.

BALDWIN: Hala, let me - let me spring board off of David's points. I mean my eyes, obviously, and I'm sure many of yours, go to these rescuers who you see. I mean, from our perspective, they almost look like ants in this massive, mountainous terrain. And to think, as you were talking to your mountaineer and talking to the president of this region in France, you know they -- it's very difficult for helicopters to land here. I mean pieces of the video we're looking at, I don't see a lot of snow. But to your point, I mean there's a lot of snow in this region. The forecast not looking great for tomorrow. Prone to avalanches. I mean at any given time, how long - do you even know how long these rescuers can stay down there before, for their own safety, they have to get out?

GORANI: Right. Well, this official I spoke with said essentially when it's dark out, you really can't fly helicopters and hope to achieve anything. And that's why he was saying nightfall is about an hour away from now. That his fear was that no bodies would be retrieved tonight. That hard work would have to start tomorrow.

But I wanted to ask your experts, Brooke -

BALDWIN: Sure.

GORANI: David and Les, one eyewitness said he saw the plane flying so low that he figured there's no way it would have time to clear the mountain range. I mean does that tell you anything about what may have happened here? Because this was the one eyewitness that was quoted in many of the French media saying he saw the plane, it was so low, he knows the area, he said, no way, it's not clearing this.

BALDWIN: Les, you take it.

ABEND: Well, let me caution people.

SOUCIE: Les, you can take that one.

ABEND: Well, let me caution people about -- eyewitnesses tend to be on the unreliable side. His perspective may be different. But then again, if indeed he was correct, that's - that is possible. If that airplane got itself into a predicament with the terrain, that it was too low for it to climb out of and the situation that got it to that situation in the first place, perhaps an engine out, perhaps a fire on board, may have got them to the point where clearing terrain was certainly an issue.

[14:14:57] BALDWIN: And to David's point about the flight data recorder, you know, that can figure out the what, the how, but not the why. They have to find the voices within the cockpit. They have to find that box to figure out why this happened.

ABEND: Absolutely.

BALDWIN: Hala Gorani, Karl Penhaul, Les Abend and David Soucie, thank you all very much. Some of you I know are standing by.

Much more on coverage of this plane, this tragedy, in France. For more information on how you can help - I know a lot of you are reaching out to us here at CNN - you can help the families of these plane victims. Just go to cnn.com/impact. And there we've listed a hotline for families of the passengers and information on helping people cope with air disasters such as this one in France. Again, cnn.com/impact.

Coming up, we've been talking about this mountain recovery mission. How difficult is this terrain for these crews? We'll talk to a professional mountain climber who has performed multiple missions, including on Mt. Everest. What he says is likely challenge number one in recovering bodies, debris, hopefully that cockpit flight - the data recorder.

Also any minute now we are expecting a live conference with President Obama and the new president of Afghanistan. Live pictures here inside the White House on making his first visit there to Washington. One of the issues, will the United States delay its planned troop withdrawal timeline there? My colleague, Wolf Blitzer, is standing by with special live coverage.

Stay right here. You're watching CNN.

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[14:21:01] BALDWIN: You're watching CNN. Live pictures here inside of the White House. Any moment now, we will be taking you there as we will be watching for a news conference held between the United States' president, Barack Obama, and the president of Afghanistan. One of the key issues we'll be watching and waiting for, and we'll see if there are any questions being asked from members of the media will be, will the president of Afghanistan essentially get his wish. He's asking for more of a troop presence, an American troop presence, in Afghanistan, at the point when President Obama, who was planning on really drawing down those forces. So stand by for that happening at the White House momentarily.

Let's go back to our top story of the day here, that crash of a German airliner in the French Alps. All on board, at least 150 people are presumed dead. No word yet as far as why this happened, what happened. What we can tell you that one of the plane's black boxes, specifically the flight data recorder, has been found. That is en route to investigators.

The Airbus A-320 was headed from Barcelona, Spain, to Dusseldorf, Germany. A mountain guide in this area tells CNN he actually heard the plane flying at a very low altitude. He says the only way to reach that site will be by air.

And as we're all looking at some of these pictures for the first time, and we're continuing to get fresh images for you here on CNN. We've gotten so far, seemed to confirm his opinion.

I want to bring in Conrad Anker. He is a mountaineer. He is a rock climber. He is an author. He's scaled Mount Everest, climbed through the Himalayas and even trekked across Antarctica.

Conrad, welcome.

CONRAD ANKER, HE HAS CONDUCTED RECOVERY MISSIONS ON MOUNT EVEREST: Greetings, Brooke.

BALDWIN: You know, what is, amid the myriad challenges, what is challenge number one for these rescue crews who we see here on the ground in the Alps?

ANKER: The first challenge will be to ensure the safety of the rescuers. Whenever there's a rescue, you do not want to endanger the rescuers that are there. It's very hilly terrain. They'll be using a lot of helicopters in this operation. So ensuring that there's not any further accidents, that's their top priority.

BALDWIN: Some of the challenges, I understand, according to the president of this region in France, at this moment, helicopters are not able to land in this area. And I was reading part of what you were telling one of our producers, describing this process of lining in or long line, short lines. Can you explain that to me?

ANKER: Yes, there's two different ways they'll be able to get the rescuers in there. They're flying with a euro copter. Seats about four passengers. There's about 400 kilogram capacity. They land them there. They can tow in. They then hop off the helicopter. The other way is they can drop the rescuers in on a long line. They unclip from the helicopter. But they can only do one at a time.

My guess is that they would probably land the rescuers on top in groups and then they would descend down the mountain. But this isn't a rescue operation where you're looking for someone. There is (INAUDIBLE) in these gullies (ph) all over the place and they have a very specific protocol of how to collect that material that's there that then needs to go to the - the people that understand crashes and can then look at it and study it.

BALDWIN: All the while, you then have the challenge of the snow. The - apparently it's unstable. The outlook for tomorrow is not great. And this area is prone to avalanches.

ANKER: Yes, this is - looking at the terrain there, it's barren of cover, trees, and things like that. So if it does snow quite a bit overnight, it can cover everything up, all the material that's left there will be covered with snow, and then possibly an avalanche. It is early spring, late winter. And the higher elevations, if there is snow there, it tends to be either frozen really solid in the morning and then in the afternoon it becomes wet and more prone to avalanches. So compound that with you can only fly during the day and that mountain weather often creates clouds. And it's a very challenging situation for the rescuers.

[14:25:00] BALDWIN: You have been in a scenario on Everest. This was back in '99. In fact, you were the climber in this crew who actually spotted the remains of legendary British climber George Mallory. I mean with snow packs and rocks, how did you find him? How will these crews - it just looks like such a massive area to cover. How will they do this?

ANKER: Back to '99, it was familiarity with the mountain, having worked mountain rescue in Denali National Park and other places and then being aware of my environment with that. For the rescuers in France, they will be -- they're trained. In France, the mountain rescue is part of the Gendarmerie. It's the police force. So right out here in Montana it's a search and rescue. It's part of the county sheriff's office. And many of the people that help out are volunteers and they train in it. But, in France, it is part of the police force.

These - the rescuers that will be working on it are trained for this and so they're probably hyper situationally aware. They know where they are on the mountain, they know what they're looking for. And when you see the wreckage of this plane in terrain like this, it will -- it's very obvious that it's not something of the natural origin and they will have to pay attention to it.

BALDWIN: Special gear, special equipment certainly. Conrad Anker, I'm sure we'll be tapping into your expertise in the coming days here as we get more information and the recovery process continues. Thank you so much.

For now, let me just pivot to Dusseldorf, Germany. Remember that's the location where this plane was to have landed. CNN's Frederik Pleitgen has just arrived there. I understand he's just - there he is, stepped in front of this camera for us. And, Fred, I've got a lot for you. I mean let me just begin with the lives on board this plane. I was reading reports that there were high school students on the passenger list. What can you tell me about this group of young people?

FREDERIK PLEITGEN, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes. Yes, Brooke, that's the big tragedy within the tragedy, if you will, is that apparently among the at least 67 Germans who were killed on that flight, there were 16 high school students, as well as two teachers from a town called Highton (ph), which I would say is about one and a half hours north of where I am right now of Dusseldorf. They were on an exchange in Spain for about a week and were just on their way back when this tragedy happened.

Now, we've been in touch with the local authorities here of the state that this town is in and they have confirmed that, in fact, they know that the names of these people were on the passenger list and so therefore they believe that, in fact, these people are also among the dead. And, of course, this is a huge tragedy because these were these young people who were coming back from such an important trip for their lives, a trip to Spain, which is, of course, is always a big event for high school students. But also because this is a very, very small town and it really hits the heart of that small town. There's a school there. There's also been a crisis center put together in the school there for people who need psychological counseling.

So, right now, the folks in that town, as well as everybody else who believes they might have relatives or friends who might have been on that flight is trying to gather information, is trying to understand what happened, is trying to confirm whether or not their loved ones were on that. But certainly the story of this high school, of these 16 children who were on that flight, is certainly one that within this large tragedy, which is the biggest ever disaster in German aviation, is one that is particularly heart wrenching, Brooke.

BALDWIN: Obviously our thoughts and prayers go to all family members of any one of these souls on board. Frederik Pleitgen, well, I'm sure we'll come back to you next hour. I know you've been on many a Germanwings aircraft before. We'll talk about that. We'll talk about pilot experience. A lot to explore.

But I just want to pivot back to Washington, D.C. Again, we're watching and waiting for a live news conference to take place between President Barack Obama and the new Afghan president. They're expected to address a range of issues, including the withdrawal of U.S. troops from Afghanistan. Our special live coverage right after this quick break. You're watching CNN.

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[14:29:56] BALDWIN: Thank you.

WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: Washington once again. We want to welcome our viewers in the United States and around the world.

Within a minute or so, President Obama and the visiting Afghan president, Ashraf Ghani, they're set to take the stage. They'll be holding a joint news conference after a series of meetings over at the White House.