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Germanwings' Pilot Believed To Have Hidden Psychiatric Condition; Saudi Arabia Continues Air Strikes In Yemen; Indiana Governor Mike Pence Defends His State's Controversial New Religious Freedom Law; Aired 3-4p ET

Aired March 29, 2015 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.

[15:00:05] FREDRICKA WHITFIELD, CNN ANCHOR: We begin with breaking news on the last minutes of the Germanwings flight that crashed in the Alps last week killing all onboard. The German tabloid magazine "Build" is reporting that co-pilot Andreas Lubitz encouraged the plane's pilot to take a bathroom break. And when the pilot left, investigators say, it was at that point that the can co-pilot locked himself in the cockpit and intentionally began the plane to descend into the mountain side.

The French newspaper "Le Parisen" also has few details about Lubitz's medical history. The paper is reporting that he suffered from quote "generalized anxiety disorder." It also says that in 2009, Lubitz also suffered from severe depression symptoms. And in 2010, he even received injections of an anti-psychotic medication.

As I mentioned, the German tabloid magazine "Build" is reporting more details of the timeline about what happened in the last minutes of the Germanwings flight. Will Ripley has been following the story for us and he's joining us from Cologne, Germany.

So what is being said about the details of this timeline?

WILL RIPLEY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: (BREAK IN AUDIO)

WHITFIELD: All right. Looks like we're having some audio problems, we'll try to reconnect with Will Ripley.

Meantime, let's talk more then with my panel about today's new details. Because they're raising even more questions now about how this co-pilot was allowed to continue to fly given what we have been reading in "Le Parisen" newspaper about his bout with medical illness and the types of medications that he may have been treated with.

I want to bring in our panel now Dr. Mitchell Garber is a former NTSB medical officer and senior managing consultant for engineering consultant firm, ESI. Alastair Rosenschein is a former pilot and aviation consultant and Dr. Jacqueline Brunetti is a senior aviation medical examiner.

All right, so we have these reports now coming from a French newspaper and there are also details coming from a German tabloid, but particularly from the "Le Parisen". It spells out that there is a fairly long history of mental issues, including one time when he was given and anti psychotic medication.

So Dr. Garber, to you first, when we talk about this anti-psychotic medication, injections related to that and severe depression symptoms that the "Le Parisen" is reporting, what this is say to you about the possible severity of any mental illness?

DR. MITCH GARBER, FORMER NTSB MEDICAL OFFICER: Typically, if you're going to be giving somebody injectible anti-psychotics, that means that they are active when we have psychotic symptoms. That's a breakdown. That's a --

WHITFIELD: Meaning it would be on full display?

GARBER: Typically, yes. Typically, that's a situation, where you think you urgently need to treat this individual and those types of issues would almost never be compatible with flight. If someone became a regulatory authority or an employer became aware of that, it seems very unlikely that they would have allowed that individual at any point in time, I think after that, to continue flying.

WHITFIELD: So here we're talking 2015, but then we are talking, at least according to "Le Parisen," there's documentation which is far back as 2009. And to hear you say that if you're in need of this kind of treatment you shouldn't be flying. That means a lot of people paid attention, noticed, you know, what kind of treatment he need, there has to be people around him who knew that he was a pilot and that he was going from this kind of treatment to now getting in the cockpit.

GARBER: And I think that is going to really be the big question here is who did notice, who has access to this information and to what extent was that information shared or shareable because there are protections on the amount of medical information that can go to people.

WHITFIELD: And then it goes to the responsibility of wait a minute, this is information that should be shared.

GARBER: That's exactly right. This is information, not even exactly the employer, because the employer may not need to know that, but certainly the regulator, whoever it is, it is actually telling him you need to have this information so that you can determine whether or not this person fit to fly, the people whose job it is to do that. And those will be the regulators, typically.

WHITFIELD: OK. I do want to get Dr. Burnetti and Alastair's take on this as well. But first, we have reconnected with out Will Ripley there in Cologne to get more on the timeline and then we will get back to the conversation about mental health issues.

So Will, what more is being learned about this timeline and the events leading up to it?

RIPLEY: Fred, as you know, this is being reported by the German tabloid "Build." And so, we are going on the newspaper's account of this. Because this reporting has not been officially released, it won't be officially released because frankly the content of it is so horrific.

But if this is accurate, Fred, this indicates that people on the plane, the passengers, the pilot certainly, they knew for a full eight minutes before the plane crashed that something was seriously wrong and you can only imagine the terror that these people went through. We hope in fact this account is not as it seems. So let me take you through it.

10:27 a.m., the plane reaches its cruising altitude of 38,000 feet. And we know at 10:27, the pilot had been mentioning that he needed to use the restroom. He hasn't gone in Barcelona. It was only a two- hour flight to Dusseldorf, but his co-pilot, Andreas Lubitz told the pilot to go ahead, to go to the restroom. This was at 10:27. You hear the captain leaving the cockpit and telling Lubitz you can take over.

Then at 10:29, the flight radar monitors showed that the plane is starting to descend. And the descent was pretty rapid because at 10:32 a.m., air traffic control noticed something was wrong. They tried to contact the plane. They didn't get answer. And then the alarms in the cockpit there are going off, the sync ray alarm. Now these are loud alarms that the passengers near the front he of the aircraft would have been able to hear.

They also certainly would have heard the captain who at this point was now banging on the door, screaming, for God sake, open the door." And that's when you can passengers on the recording screaming in the background.

A few minutes later at 10:35 a.m., the horror really continues as the pilot tries to break his way into the cockpit. You can hear loud metallic bangs at 965 feet. There's 90 seconds of these continued alarms going off. Actually saying that the terrain is getting dangerously close, telling the pilot to pull-up. Lubitz is breathing normally, but he's not responding to the captain who's screaming again to him, open the damned door.

The descent continues. It is 10:38 now, the plane continues getting closer and closer to the French Alps. The co-pilot again, breathing normally on this recording -

[15:05:47] WHITFIELD: All right, heart stopping moments there as you can very tell from our Will Ripley. I'm sorry. The weather is very bad there in Cologne, Germany. So that is why we have lost that signal.

But let's continue our conversation. The timeline is horrific enough. And so, equally disturbing, as now these reports about the medical condition of this co-pilot, Andreas Lubitz. So let's resume our conversation with Dr. Mitch Garber, Dr. Jacqueline Brunetti an Alastair Rosenschein.

So Dr. Garber was just talking about this kind of treatment, very serious treatment for a very serious condition. So I wonder, from you Dr. Brunetti, is it possible when we hear from "Le Parisen" that there's treatment from 2009 where it has made clear that there was severe depression symptoms being exhibited and in 2010, that Lubitz received injections of an anti-psychotic medication, is it possible that perhaps, this patient may have gotten better overtime? And so, leading up to 2015, before that, you know, ripped up doctor's note that investigators found that perhaps he didn't exhibit any severe signs of mental depression and that may have helped justify why the army felt that he was fit to fly?

JACQUELINE BRUNETTI, SENIOR AVIATION MEDICAL EXAMINER: Well, first of all, Fredricka, both of those - the diagnoses are absolute denials for medical certifications even if you have a history and currently seem intact. It's difficult to comprehend that this was unknown, but on the other hand, not being a psychiatrist, that severe a psychiatric illnesses, without appropriate treatments, I think, would be difficult to overcome.

WHITFIELD: Alastair, just hearing this, I'm no medical professional, but just reading this, isn't this just outrageous?

ALASTAIR ROSENSCHEIN, AVIATION CONSULTANT: Absolutely. I mean it is - I mean, I'm just stunned that all of this has been kept away from the regulatory authorities. Of course they may have known this and made a decision that he was capable to fly, we don't know all the facts. But I'm sure that all of this will be dug up at some point or another.

But, you know, speaking as a retired pilot, when I was flying I would very much like to know if my colleague had some sort of psychiatric disorder, depressive anxiety.

(CROSSTALK)

ROSENSCHEIN: Yes, I mean, you often, you know, we're all judgmental about people we meet and work with. And you know, occasionally, I have flown with somebody who has not been acting normally. And I have to say here that most pilots don't regularly fly with their same colleague on the flight deck. You may have met just before the flight. But you very quickly, you notice if somebody's not acting normally, and you know, you should delve a little bit deeper.

But I have to say, in all my years of flying, there are only two colleagues of mine I have reported for acting strangely, one strangely enough was on my very first flight, and I suspected he had been drinking. But, you know, another one was going through a marriage breakup and he was a bit tearful. So you know, clearly, neither of those should have been on the flight deck.

[15:10:02] WHITFIELD: Yes. So it was seems observations are made by everybody.

And Dr. Garber, when you talk about these injections possibly in 2010 according to "Le Parisen" of anti-psychotic medication, and it's a very severe treatment. Then it would seem you as a patient wouldn't have the wherewithal to know you're in trouble and you're going to take yourself to doctor when you now need injections. Somebody around you perhaps escorted you or someone around you may be witness to your behavior, right?

GARBER: Well, and again, we don't know the accuracy of all this information or even a lot of times where this is coming from. So we have to be careful about how we interpret it because we don't know exactly what the information includes. But if in fact it is accurate, if in fact we know that this individual did have a psychotic break, someone had to get him there. The police may have been involved. The authorities may have been involved and it's entirely possible is that this is an individual who really was incapable of taking care of themselves even if they were in forcibly or involuntarily injected with an antipsychotic medication.

WHITFIELD: Because Dr. Brunetti, it seems hard to believe this that person would have been able to mask, if this reporting is correct. Again, we have to turn to "Le Parisen" reporting and some "Build," a German tabloid reporting, and even some "New York Times" reporting, but it would seem hard to believe that a person could mask any kinds of symptoms that are associated with this kind of treatment.

BRUNETTI: Right. And I agree with Dr. Garber, we have to be very careful here. But the fact is diagnosis of psychosis and actually the definition of psychosis is a disconnection with realty. So I would think that would be very difficult to hide from the people around you.

WHITFIELD: All right, Dr. Jacqueline Brunetti, Alistair Rosenschein and Dr. Mitchell Garber, thanks to all of you. Appreciate it.

BRUNETTI: Thanks, Fredricka.

GARBER: Thank you.

WHITFIELD: Also straight ahead, U.S. secretary of state John Kerry in Switzerland trying to reach a nuclear deal with Iran, can the Obama administration beat a deadline that is just now two days away. Our Erin McPike is at the White House.

ERIN MCPIKE, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Fred, Republicans are still threatening to stand in the way of the potential deal, I'll have that story after the break.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:15:09] WHITFIELD: Right now U.S. secretary John Kerry is in Switzerland meeting with Iranian officials and foreign ministers who try to reach a deal on Iran's nuclear program, deadline just two days away. Meanwhile, Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu is slamming the nuclear talks. He says Tehran is working in Yemen to quote "take over the Middle East, the whole Middle East," end quote. And U.S. House speaker John Boehner had harsh words for President Obama's relationship with Netanyahu, he said it on CNN's "STATE OF THE UNION" this morning.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. JOHN BOEHNER (R), U.S. SPEAKER OF THE HOUSE: I think the animosity exhibited by our administration toward the prime minister of Israel is represented. And I think the pressure that they have put on him over the last four or five years have frankly pushed him to the point where he had to speak up.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WHITFIELD: CNN's Erin McPike is at the White House for us. So Erin, Boehner openly expressing serious doubts about these nuclear talk.

MCPIKE: Fred, that's right. He is skeptical of the Iranians and does not think they are negotiating in good faith. Listen here.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BOEHNER: I have serious doubts. I have had serious doubts over the last year whether there could be an agreement and I still have serious doubts. We have a regime that has never quite kept their word about anything. I just don't understand why the Senator Brandon (ph) with a group of people who in my opinion have no intention of keeping their word.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MCPIKE: Now, one option Republicans are floating is to put steeper sanctions on Iran in place, another option they're talking about is to move back the dead line. But White House press secretary John Earnest on ABC this morning dismissed that.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOSH EARNEST, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: Ultimately, it's time for the Iranians to sending clear signal to the international community about whether or not they are willing to make the serious commitments required and basically live up to their rhetoric that they're not trying to acquire a nuclear weapon. So if they can make those commitments, they should be able to do that by the end of March.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MCPIKE: But we should point out of course that they just need to come up with a frame work for a deal by Tuesday. The full deal doesn't have to be flushed out until the end of June, Fred.

WHITFIELD: And so, if no real deal, you know, struck in two days, then what are the options for Congress, what might it do?

MCPIKE: Again, what Republicans are talking about is simply putting steeper sanctions in place on Iran.

WHITFIELD: All right, Erin McPike, thanks so much at the White House.

All right, earlier on CNN, the head of the council on foreign relations and a nuclear weapons policy expert told Fareed Zakaria the military option should be a last option.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) JOSEPH CIRINCIONE, PRESIDENT, PLOUGHSHARES FUND: People talk very cavalierly about these strikes. It's really appalling to me that this kind of discussion goes on. This is not a pin for attack. This would be weeks of hundreds of U.S. sorties, this would be the beginning of a major war in the Middle East that would look - make the wars in Afghanistan and Iraq look like warm-up acts and they would have regional consequences. If you think Iran has influence everywhere, well, they are going to use that influence everywhere. This is not a war any military leader in the United States wants to fight.

FAREED ZAKARIA, CNN HOST, FAREED ZAKARIA GPS: Would you agree with that?

RICHARD HAAS, PRESIDENT, COUNCIL ON RELATIONS: (INAUDIBLE), it depends. Want to fight? Of course not. But we also cannot live in a world where Iran has nuclear weapons and where several other countries in the region follow suit. That would be catastrophically dangerous. So the real question again is can you come up with the diplomatic alternative. That's not perfect. That's not an option. But again, it's simply good enough and better than the alternatives because the alternatives are not attractive.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WHITFIELD: Christopher Dickey, Middle East editor at "the Daily Beast," joining us now from Paris.

So is that the feeling of people that you have spoken to particularly to people of the Middle East issues, an imperfect deal is better than no deal?

CHRISTOPHER DICKEY, MIDDLE EAST EDITOR, THE DAILY BEAST: Well, I think absolutely, that's the case. I mean, I think that Richard Haas and the others are exactly right when they stay people are not looking carefully at what a war with Iran would look like. It's not just a question of going in there and bombing for a couple of days. It's a massive war with a major regional power that has a lot of resources, a lot of strategic depths.

And I think if there is a way to negotiate with Iran, that addresses the specific problem of its nuclear program, then that is also the good.

WHITFIELD: So in your view, what are they say, you know, leaders like Netanyahu truly wary about in a deal. If we know that negotiators are saying there are three things that they're looking for in a deal. They want to cut off a pathway to a bomb. They want to be able to have eyes everywhere, you know, on Iran, to make sure that, you know, they're not up to no good, so to speak. And they have to - there has to be in place some sort of rapid response if it turns out Iran is up to no good.

So what is the matter with that kind of frame work? Why is it Netanyahu, for example, just doesn't believe that that is achievable or even worth the sweat in trying to work out a deal like that? [15:20:09] DICKEY: Well, I think first of all, I was listening to

Speaker Boehner on your program a few minutes ago, and it's clear, he has a very, very slim knowledge of the way things work in the Middle East, and almost no knowledge of what's been going on in Israel.

Netanyahu has a lot of support in Congress, particularly among the Republicans, but he has almost no support from his own defense establishment, which sees this pathway toward negotiations in close cooperation with the United States, as the way to go.

So, you know, Netanyahu can take an absolutist position, he can say what he wants is let's get rid of all the centrifuges, let's make sure Iran has no capabilities at all to eventually build a nuclear weapon.

But at the end of the day, he's not going to get that. Because you also have to remember that this diplomatic initiative is not just the U.S. and Iran. It's the five permanent members of the Security Council plus Germany talking to Iran and those five members include China and Russia. That the United States has been able to get them on board in these negotiations is a huge step.

Once Congress starts to meddle with this, which it probably will start doing in two weeks, all that is going to go to hell. And there will be no negotiated position. And at the end of the day, you will be put in a position where there probably will have to be military action to try and prevent Iran from building nuclear weapons and you open up the door to in fact an open ended war. It won't be Israel -- it may be Israel that starts it, but it won't be Israel that has to finish it, it will be the United States.

WHITFIELD: All right, Christopher Dickey, very fascinating information there, appreciate those details. Thank you. Good to see you from Paris.

All right, passengers are still shaken up after an Air Canada jet skidded off the run way early this morning.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: When the plane hit initially, it bounced back up into the air.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WHITFIELD: The airline says it is a hard landing. But passengers, that's not the way they saw it nor felt it, the details next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:26:00] WHITFIELD: All right, some very terrifying moments for more than 130 passengers on Air Canada like early this morning, the a airbus 320 skid off the runway as it was landing at Halifax Stanfield international airport in Nova Scotia. And you can see the plane appears to have a pretty smashed up wing there, and part of the nose is missing. And according to Air Canada, 25 people actually suffered some nonlife-threatening injuries. Our Nick Valencia joining us now with the kind of in conflict over how

do you interpret this. Is this a crash landing or was it a hard landing?

NICK VALENCIA, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, the airline says that was a hard landing. Passengers say that they know what they felt, that this was certainly a crash. Weather also could have played a factor. The transportation safety board will look into that, passengers saying, though, that this experience was one of the worst of their lives.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

VALENCIA (voice-over): Early Sunday morning on final approach from Toronto into a snowy Halifax, Air Canada flight 624 comes down hard.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We were coming in to land and we heard a very big bump and very hard. Then I hit my head and we had another big bang, and then we just -- everyone just started to say get out, get out, get out.

VALENCIA: Airline and airport officials called it a hard landing.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: What's the difference between a crash and a hard landing?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Well, a crash is when the aircraft doesn't make it to the gate like in this incident.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: So why is this not a crash?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Well in this incident, at this point in time, the TSB investigation will determine.

VALENCIA: Passengers say they know what they felt.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It's not a hard landing, it's a crash.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: All the landing gears are off the run way, the engines are off of it.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: That's all we know, it's just a hard landing.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We read that on landing on facebook. They said they had a little bump in Halifax. No, no, we crash landed. Air Canada 624 crash landed confirm.

VALENCIA: These dramatic photos taken just after the crash shows significant damage to the plane's wing, engine and nose. TSB investigators will look into the extent to which heavy winter weather conditions played a role.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You slip for awhile. Thankfully, we are all alive.

VALENCIA: Of the 138 on board, 25 were hospitalized including the two pilots who were later released. There were no major injuries. UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Can you talk about what you have around your

neck?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Well, just neck injuries and back injuries.

VALENCIA: Halifax Stanfield international airport briefly suspended takeoffs and landings after to the incident. As for the plane, an airport official would not get specifics about the damage.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We heard it completely lost a wing, can you confirm that?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No, I'm sorry I can't.

VALENCIA: Passengers still processing the experience say things certainly could have been much worse.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Weill, I'm still lucky. I mean, lucky and glad that we all made it. Nobody was like badly injured.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

VALENCIA: Lucky, no doubt. The Canadian transportation safety board is looking into to the incident. Air Canada also releasing the statement here saying, we at Air Canada are greatly relieve that no one was critically injured, yet we fully appreciate this has been a very unsettling experiencing for our customers and their families as well as our employees. And we are focused now on caring for those affected we will also cooperate with the American transportation safety board as it begins an investigation to determine the cause.

Some scary moments there for everyone on board.

WHITFIELD: Indeed. My goodness.

All right, thanks so much for bringing that to us. Thank you, Nick.

VALENCIA: You bet.

WHITFIELD: All right, still to come, a woman who lost her brother in the Germanwings crash is speaking out. We'll hear from her next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:32:44] WHITFIELD: Surprising new details today in the crash of that Germanwings airliner. A German tabloid released what it said is a summary of the timeline of the flight's final moment from the cockpit voice recorder.

According to "Build," the German tabloid, flight captain Patrick Sondheimer told the co-pilot Andreas Lubitz that he had not been able to go to the bathroom before takeoff. Lubitz encouraged him to go, twice. Just minutes after the captain presumably leaves for the bathroom, and as the plane descends, the captain is heard screaming, for God's sake, open the door. That's followed by loud metallic bangs on the door as the captain again demands to be let in. "Build" reports as alarms sound in the cockpit, passengers can then be

heard screaming and that is followed by what sounds like a wing hitting the mountain, more screams and then silence.

We have also learned that the French defense ministry sends a fighter jet and a helicopter to the area of the crash site after losing radio contact with the airliner.

Today, "Le Parisen" newspaper citing sources close to the investigation report that co-pilot Andreas Lubitz suffered from generalized anxiety disorder and from severe depression in the past. And the paper also reports that Lubitz received injections of anti psychotic medications in 2010.

On top of that, "the New York Times" reports that police found antidepressants in Lubitz's apartment. A French prosecutor says at least 70 bodies from that ill fated Germanwings aircraft have now been identified. It's been a painstaking process because many of those searchers have had to either go on foot or maybe even dropped into the crash site location by way of helicopter in order to find any remnants of the bodies of those victims, 150 people onboard that flight or even finding any kind of pieces of evidence of the plane. And of course they're still looking for one of the black boxes.

This is one of the conversations that our Karl Penhaul had with the sister of one of the Iranian soccer players who was on board that flight.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

[15:34:59] UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE (through translator): He was my everything. He was the only one in my childhood. I, you know, even you have the big brother, you always have some secret between you, you can rely on him. He was so good. We had a good relationship, friendship. And I lost him.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WHITFIELD: All right, painstaking and horrible situation. Investigators say remains of only half of the 150 passengers have since been identified.

All right, still ahead, Arab leaders taking a stand against rebels in Yemen as Saudi tanks rolled toward the Yemeni border in this internal conflict about to become a full-blown regional war. We talk to a former U.S. ambassador to Yemen, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:39:28] WHITFIELD: All right, checking our top story, seven people were shot and wounded in middle of spring break celebrations last night in Panama City beach, Florida. Some of the victims were students from Alabama A&M University. Several of the wounded are still hospitalized, three of them in critical condition. Authorities arrested 22-year-old David Jermichael Daniels on seven counts of attempted murder. Police say he was not one of the students on spring break. They have not revealed a possible motive.

And 21 people are recovering from injuries after a commuter train collided with a car and derailed Saturday in Los Angeles. The light rail train struck the car after it had turned on to the track. Ten people were hospitalized. An investigation is under way.

And today, Christians around the world are attending Palm Sunday services. Pope Francis led mass at St. Peter's square, ushering in holy week. During the service he said a prayer for the victims of the Germanwings plane crash.

And a French prosecutor said that 70 bodies from that ill-fated Germanwings airline crash have now been identified, nearly half of the 150 people onboard that flight.

Joining us from a site near the crash site, CNN's Karl Penhaul on the phone with us.

And so, I understand Karl, as so many relatives of those killed on board that flight, they have made their way there and they want to get to the that crash site. So what kind of arrangements are being made for them.

[15:40:56] KARL PENHAUL, CNN CORRESPONDENT (via phone): Yes. Well, the issue right now, Fredricka, is that the closest at any grieving relatives can get to a spot about two-and-a-half miles away as the crow flies from the actual crash site. That is because the terrain is just so rugged and so dangerous, trying to get there on foot or any closer. Even the recovery teams have to be flown in by helicopter right now.

But the local village men from (INAUDIBLE) is the one who has been trying to help consul the grieving families. And today, he ordered a backhoe into action to try and carve out a track into the hillside, so that it will serve a twofold purpose. So that recovery teams can recover fragments of the plane and also human remains that much quicker and then when the time comes so family members can get very much closer to the crash site.

He said to me because it is almost as if for the families, every yard matters. They really want to know what crash site looks like. They want to know what is around that crash site. And we hiked up there a cull of days ago. We know what's around that crash site. And rest assured, you know, that families, you know, I think when they do get there, will be able to find a little bit of peace, it's an area just beyond the crash site where wild flowers are growing, the snow's melting right now, and that's filling crystal streams. And you know, I think that families will be able to find some peace as eventually that track is built and the mayor says that hopefully it can be built within a week, Fredericka.

WHITFIELD: All right, Karl Penhaul, keep us posted. Thank you so much.

All right, now to the fierce battle under way for control of Yemen. Some major development today at the Arab League Summit in Egypt. Leaders have agreed to a unified military force in the region and are demanding that those Iranian backed Houthi rebels in Yemen drop their weapons and leave the capital city of Sana'a.

And in Saudi Arabia last night, trucks were seen hauling tanks on a highway headed south toward Yemen about 20 miles from the border.

Joining me right now on the phone from Washington is Stephen Seche, the former U.S. ambassador to Yemen.

So Mr. Ambassador, what are your worries here about hearing of Saudi tanks that may be on their way, this following Saudi airstrike there in Yemen trying to weed out these Houthi rebels?

STEPHEN SECHE, FORMER U.S. AMBASSADOR TO YEMEN (via phone): Well, Fredricka, I think what you - what we have seen and you mentioned it yourself in coming at the Arab League summit is a lot more saber rattling, some - (INAUDIBLE) the Houthi in Yemen.

But I would be very surprised and very concerned if they were to actually seriously try to mount a ground operation in Yemen. It's very difficult, inhospitable terrain for convention armies to try to (INAUDIBLE). No one has really been successful at Saudis by no measure. Have managed to do it in the head, a bit of a scuffle with the Houthis back in 2010 or end of 2009 that didn't go well from the Saudi perspectives.

So it is bad enough at the moment that we have the airstrikes continuing everyday into urban areas where they are hitting perhaps we believe military targets associated with the Houthis. But how much civilian damage and destruction in these areas is being done and how long we can tolerate this to continue is really the question for the community of nations to begin to contemplate very seriously.

WHITFIELD: So if at that Arab summit, there is an agreement by these Arab neighbors to say that something needs to be done to stabilize Yemen and Saudi Arabia continues to get the green light to lead this, you know, coalition of forces, if the airstrikes didn't work, or are not working fast enough, I should say, then is there any other option but the ground forces? I know you said that you don't believe it would likely go in that direction, but what other direction would it go in to try to stabilize and now destabilize a very destabilized country?

[15:44:54] SECHE: Well, it's not going to be the easiest route and I think there's greater satisfaction in try to do something militarily and to say we can really turn the course around here quickly because we are in the pound the Houthis into submission. I don't think they're going to be that easily pacified. And I think that we need to consider try to get them to get back into some negotiation frame of mind. And the U.N. has been working very hard to do that. The Houthis have shown absolute no disposition. So I can understand frustration that has led the Saudis and others to take a military course. But I do hope they will be at some point a recognition that it's not going to work, it's only going to create more instability, greater human toll inside Yemen and cost. And we need to get away from this constant that we're going to do this strictly at the point of a gun or at the bottom of the plane where they are dropping bombs on the urban areas where this military information are located.

WHITFIELD: So I wonder, Ambassador, while this really is about Yemen, isn't it also about the U.S. in Iran too because U.S., you know, had a lot at stake with this government that is now been pushed out of Yemen and now it's Iran who is backing these rebels. But at the same time, the U.S. and Iran are at a table talking about nuclear negotiations. So, you know, do you see these two issues conflicting when you're involving these two common parties?

SECHE: You're absolutely right. There's a message being sent here, both to us and to the Iranian government that the Arab world is very unhappy, unsettled and uncertain about the way these P5 negotiations are going in Switzerland. And they are -- we're going to introduce Iran back into the region, allow it to have unfettered influence in the Arab world.

And the Arabs already see that happening, they see it in Iraq, they see it in Syria, they see at some extent (ph). They believe it is there in Bahrain and now certainly in Yemen. So all they see is the Iranian hand moving more determinately into their sphere of influence. And they are sending a message that will not be tolerated. And to us, we don't like what we are doing and we're not going to let this go on without some kind of response. We will protect our interests as we determine them to be threatened by Iran. And this is a message to both us and to the Iranians and I think that it's ill advised because I think that fundamentally the P5 plus One talks, if they succeeds, coming up for good solution to the nuclear problem, it can be a real boost for stability in the region and it will not be a de-stabilizer.

WHITFIELD: All right, former U.S. ambassador to Yemen, Stephen Seche, thank you so much for your time. Appreciate it.

All right, Indiana governor Mike Pence, under fire for a new law in his state that opponents say lets businesses turn away gay, lesbian and transgender customers. But now the governor has had a chance to defend the law, what did he say? Next.

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[15:51:27] WHITFIELD: Indiana Governor Mike Pence is defending his state's controversial new religious freedom law. Opponents say a less business has turned away gay, lesbian and transgender customers. Pence signed the bill Thursday. And today, he faced the national media.

So he blames for purely outrage over the law. CNN a Shasta Darlington will joins me with more on this - Sashta.

SASHTA DARLINGTON, CNN CORRESPONDENT: That's right, Fred. It was interesting because yesterday the governor said he would support new legislation if it helped clarify this law. And yet today, we didn't hear any details about that supposed new legislation. It really seems for the governor this controversy all comes down to a misunderstanding.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE) UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Was it a mistake to sign this law?

GOV. MIKE PENCE, INDIANA: Absolutely not.

DARLINGTON (voice-over): Indiana governor Mike Pence on the defensive over the new religious freedom law sparking protests and boycotts. Opponents say it would allow businesses to turn away customers on religious grounds.

On ABC's this week, Pence blames the media.

PENCE: There's been a tremendous amount of misinformation and misunderstanding around this bill. And I'm just determined and I appreciate the time on your program, I'm just determined to clarify this.

DARLINGTON: The firestorms come amid criticism from business. CEOs from Apple to Yelp lashing out and Angie's List which is based in Indianapolis cancelling a planned expansion there. The NCAA preparing to host its college basketball final four in Indianapolis next weekend saying we are especially concerned about how this legislation could affect our student athletes and employees.

Former NBA star Charles Barkley piling on the pressure, as long as antigay legislation exists in any state, I strong believe that any big events such as the Final Four and Super Bowl should not be held in those states' cities.

But Pence made it clear he's not going to change the law or consider a bill making gays and lesbians a protected class, like in many other states.

PENCE: I will not push for that. That's not on my agenda. This is not about discrimination. This is about protecting the religious liberty of every Hoosier of every faith.

DARLINGTON: But deflecting repeated questions about its impact.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes or no, should it be legal to discriminate against gays and lesbians?

PENCE: George, you're following the mantra of the last week online.

DARLINGTON: The White House quick to react.

EARNEST: When you have a law like this one in Indiana that seems to legitimize discrimination, it's important for everybody to stand up and speak out.

DARLINGTON: There are now 20 states with some form of religious freedom law on the books. But the blowback in Indiana could deter others from pursuing such laws.

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DARLINGTON: And it's really not clear if this won't just fuel more controversy. For example, he refused to answer at least six yes-or-no questions about whether this law legalizes discrimination against gays questions like under this new law, can florists in Indiana refuse to provide flowers for a gay wedding? So without these answers or about this clarification, I expect the controversy will just grow, Fred.

WHITFIELD: Yes. It seems like it will.

All right, Shasta Darlington. Thanks so much.

All right, would remotely flown planes prevent another Germanwings- like disaster? Next, we will take a look at the technology involved in planes piloted from the ground and the impact it could have on air travel.

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[15:58:33] WHITFIELD: Co-pilot Andreas Lubitz was alone behind the cockpit door when he apparently sets the plane on a fatal descent. Passengers and crew were powerless to stop him. And many are wondering could someone on the ground have taken control of the plane remotely and guided it to a safe landing?

CNN's Tome Foreman reports on technology of pilot-less plane.

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TOM FOREMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Watch closely. This plane over England has a crew at the controls, passengers in the back, but something extraordinary is about to happen, a pilot on the ground is taking over.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Ready to take control.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Proceed.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I have control.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You have control.

FOREMAN: This is the $94 million Astria project by the British aerospace company BAE, one of several efforts around the world to develop planes that can be flown remotely.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And what you can hear at the moment is the discussion with the traffic that's exactly the same conversation that the pilots would be having if in charge of the steering of the aircraft.

FOREMAN: Military success with drones has driven much of the interest, and some efforts are focused on airplanes in hazardous conditions such as hurricane research and fighting wildfires. Analysts say pilotless planes could be a $400 billion a year global business, so why not passenger flights?

First, the airline industry has a remarkable safety record despite high profile disasters. Many believe on board pilots remain the most reliable way to handle problems and retrofitting planes would cost billions of dollars.

And second, passengers may not be ready.

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