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Black Box Found; MH-360 Search; Sailor Survives 66 Days; Iranians Celebrate Deal. Aired 2-2:30p ET

Aired April 03, 2015 - 14:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


[14:00:04] BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN ANCHOR: Brianna, thank you very much. Great to be with you on this Friday. I'm Brooke Baldwin. You're watching CNN here.

And now we have it. It just might be the biggest clue into what happened in those final moments aboard Germanwings Flight 9525. And it's coming from this. This burned-up black box. It's the flight data recorder, to be precise. Already telling investigators something pretty huge, that this co-pilot, 27-year-old Andreas Lubitz, didn't just intentionally fly this plane into the French Alps, but that he sped up while doing it. Specifically, quote, "he used the auto pilot to put the airplane into a descent towards an altitude of 100 feet. Then, on several occasions during the descent, the pilot modified the auto pilot setting to increase the speed of the airplane in descent."

And investigators say he was alive and he was conscious right up until that final impact. But this is just the initial reading. We are standing by, waiting for what else this flight data recorder may reveal to investigators. Let's go to Dusseldorf, Germany, to my colleague, Pamela Brown, and also with me, Shawn Pruchnicki from the Center for Aviation Studies at the Ohio State University, a former airline pilot, air safety expert and flight accident investigator.

So welcome to both of you.

But, Pamela, first, just on, you know, what we're reporting today, I know investigators, they say they were concerned they may not have ever been able to find that second black box, that flight data recorder. Now they have it. What else are they hoping to learn from it?

PAMELA BROWN, CNN JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT: Well, quite frankly, Brooke, I think the most crucial clues as to what happened in those final moments have already been revealed. We know from the cockpit voice recorder and now from these initial findings, as you pointed out, from the flight data recorder, that Andreas Lubitz, he programed auto pilot, engaged it to go down to 100 feet. And not only that, he manually tried to sped up the plane into the Alps, according to French investigators. So, there you go, that backs up what we heard from the French prosecutor that this was a voluntary action and it was deliberate. And, Brooke, it also bolsters this theory that Lubitz' actions were premeditated.

BALDWIN: Shawn, you're the pilot. I want you to explain to me here, if the black box is telling investigators, as Pamela was reporting, that this, you know, co-pilot was adjusting the auto pilot to increase the speed as it was going down, but we also heard yesterday he had been reducing the speed as well to prevent some of those alarms from going off, why would he want to do both?

SHAWN PRUCHNICKI, CENTER FOR AVIATION STUDIES, THE OHIO STATE UNIVERSITY: Well, there's a couple of reasons that could explain this, Brooke. I - you know, the first reason, to increase the speed would be to close that time interval, right? He -- I'm sure he can hear the pounding on the door, fearing that door might actually be breached and his attempt thwarted, increasing his speed obviously brings the airplane closer to an end. One of the things that we have to - that we have to be aware of is that with a lot of these different aircraft types, that if you go too far into an over speed mode, the aircraft will automatically start pitching up to reduce air speed. So -

BALDWIN: So it will correct itself?

PRUCHNICKI: Yes, it will. Yes, exactly. So you, you know, you walk this fine line. I want to go as fast as I can, if this is your intention, you would want to go probably as fast as you can, but not to the point where you trigger certain automated systems that would recover. My guess, just from what I've heard thus far, it sounds like he was trying to achieve that balance.

BALDWIN: Sure. Oh, gosh. Let me - let me follow up with this, Shawn. How would investigators then be using all of this information, the what, from what they're getting from this - you know, actually the why, the cockpit voice recorder, that initial black box they founding, to then match up with the data they're now gleaming from the flight data recorder?

PRUCHNICKI: Yes, you're exactly right, Brooke, what this does is, this brings together the whole concept of this intentionality. With any accident investigation, we never rely on just one or two pieces of information to help support and understand what's happening. We always want as many data points as possible. Finding this flight data recorder does just that, it brings together new information that shows that intentionality and how the airplane was flown with the other sources of data that we already suspected that was the intent really brings this picture together completely. I really think there's enough evidence at this point in time that investigators are starting to feel really comfortable with this rather, you know, unfortunate understanding of what happened.

BALDWIN: Shawn, what about just finally from an investigatory forensics perspective, because we're now learning that, you know, he apparently had doctor shopped before this crash and seen, as Pamela was reporting yesterday, seen as many as six doctors. We know that there were drug injections some years ago. I'm wondering as these recovery crews are in the mountains, they're going through the debris, they're recovering and identifying through DNA matching the remains, you know, if the co-pilot's remains are found, would someone be able to figure out if there were drugs in his system?

[14:05:15] PRUCHNICKI: Yes, that is possible still.

BALDWIN: It is?

PRUCHNICKI: It obviously depends upon the condition of the remains. We are getting pretty far time wise. But there are many different places within the body that they can go to extract fluids that they can test positive for some drugs. That's not entirely out of the question yet. It's just going to depend on his remains and the condition they're in.

BALDWIN: Shawn Pruchnicki, thank you. Pamela Brown, excellent reporting from Dusseldorf. Thank you both very much.

We've been talking about these recovery teams in the French Alps. They're facing also this tough task, of course. They're sifting through crash debris. They're trying to find to help match and locate those victims' remains. At least they know where they're looking.

Search crews, meantime, off the coast of Australia are still trying to find missing Malaysia Airlines Flight 370 more than a year now after it vanished. CNN's Anna Coren investigates why what happened to MH-370 remains such a mystery.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ANNA COREN, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): In the midst of this rugged steep terrain, high in the French Alps, the slow and painstaking search and recovery continues for the remains of Germanwings Flight 9525. Described by the chief investigator as emotionally very difficult, recovery teams rake through dirt and rubble to retrieve fragments of bodies and pieces of wreckage after co-pilot Andreas Lubitz is believed to have deliberately slammed the A-320 into a mountainside with 149 others on board.

And while the world grapples with how this could have happened, almost 9,000 miles away, in another hemisphere, a search even more challenging grinds on. In the remote southern Indian Ocean, a thousand nautical miles off the coast of Perth, western Australia, survey ships continue to scour the ocean floor for MH-370. The Boeing 777 carrying 239 people disappeared more than a year ago. And according to satellite data, experts believe it's somewhere here, two and a half miles under water at the bottom of the ocean that's never been mapped before.

JAMES KENT, DATA SUPERVISOR, DISCOVERY SEARCH VESSEL: You see Australia here. We've got the whole survey area where we started with the seventh (ph) arc. We're looking at this southern section down here.

COREN: After an initial search zone roughly half the size of the United States, it's being narrowed down to a priority area of 23,000 square miles. It's a slow and meticulous process that requires vessels traveling up and down strips of the search zone.

KENT: We're looking for small features similar to something like this pixel.

COREN: So far they've covered more than half the priority search area and authorities believe they are on target to complete it by May. The Malaysian government has remain tight-lipped on what will happen if nothing is found in that priority area by the end of next month.

Malaysia and Australia are sharing the costs for what has become the most expensive search in history. However, Australian Prime Minister Tony Abbott has indicated his country is prepared to continue searching, allaying the fears of the traumatized families who so desperately want answers.

Anna Coren, CNN, Hong Kong.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BALDWIN: Anna, thank you.

Coming up next, have you heard about this guy? This young man survived 66 days stranded at sea. It is a phenomenal story, but does it hold up? We'll talk live with a survivalist.

Plus, now that the U.S. and Iran have agreed to this tentative nuclear deal, what happens to the Americans being held there? Doesn't the U.S. now have leverage?

And CNN confronts flower shop owners who refuse to serve gay couples. Hear their stunning responses on whether they'd serve others they consider sinners, like cheaters. Don't miss this piece from Gary Tuchman. You're watching CNN.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[14:13:14] BALDWIN: Welcome back. You're watching CNN. I'm Brooke Baldwin.

Here's a quote, "it's just a miracle." Those are the words of the man everyone is talking about today, 37-year-old Louis Jordan. He spent 66 days lost on the Atlantic just before being rescued yesterday. In January, his sailboat capsized, breaking the mast and the rudder. Jordan's family reported him missing a week after he told them he was headed out on a fishing trip and they ultimately feared the worst. Yesterday words of gratitude when father and son were reunited with the younger in remarkable health. He was very dehydrated. He had suffered a broken shoulder. But just hours after his rescue, he detailed how he survived those 66 days. Here he was.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LOUIS JORDAN, SURVIVED 66 DAYS LOST AT SEA: Right before I ran out of water, finally the conditions were perfect where I was able to collect water. And by perfect, I mean the waves were not so strong that all the saltwater just splashed on deck and polluted all my fresh water. Every time I collected water, it always tasted like coconut milk. And I couldn't figure out what was wrong. But what most people don't know is that when you're on the ocean, the rainwater tastes like coconut milk. It's bizarre.

I heard that all seaweed on the ocean is edible. That may be true, but seaweed has so much iodine in it, for people who aren't used to eating iodine, I had iodine poisoning. But I did collect a bunch of seaweed and I founding that there were these little crabs, these little critters living in the seaweed. And they tasted dang good.

[14:14:46] And whenever I did my laundry, I would tie my dirty clothes onto a rope, and throw the rope overboard and let the waves clean my laundry. And I noticed that the fish would come out of hiding under my boat and they would swim around my clothes. Lure them from their hiding place with a shirt on a rope. And then I just took my hand net and I - I put the hand net right next to them and just scooped them up.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: Jordan, a novice sailor, admits he was outmatched at sea. So let's talk more about this with wilderness survival instructor Eric Kulick.

Eric, nice to see you back on the show, sir, welcome back.

ERIC KULICK, SURVIVAL INSTRUCTOR: Nice to speak with you again, Brooke.

BALDWIN: I have a lot of questions. But just, can I get your reaction. Looking at this man talking about, you know, rain tasting like coconut milk and iodine poisoning from seaweed and sitting there after being stranded, apparently for 66 days, do you - do you buy the whole story?

KULICK: I can't speak to the issue about the coconut-flavored water or the seaweed in and of itself, but certainly the story is plausible. I mean there have been numerous accounts, some quite well documented, of people surviving much longer periods at sea. I think in one account, 117 days. So it's certainly plausible. I think the one thing that strikes me though is just how - and what strikes me is how remarkable he looked coming off that helicopter.

BALDWIN: How do you mean?

KULICK: Well, he looked - he walked on his own after being steadied coming out of the helicopter. I would have expected him to be carried out after spending so much time on a boat, being -- not being able to move. People typically are very weak. I other is his skin. I expected him to be much more sunburned, as well as suffering from a lot of saltwater on the skin, which can cause a lot of blisters and really break that skin down. So I thought he looked really, really good.

BALDWIN: All right. Maybe he was in great shape. I mean I think off the top of my head, I think he's 37. But let's talk about some of the conditions that he faced. I mean if you know he set off in January, I mean 66 days, that is through the worst of it as far as winter goes. How cold would it have been? What would the conditions at sea have been like?

KULICK: I can't speak exactly to where he was and the conditions, but I would assume, even if this had occurred in the summer, that he would - the cold would be an issue. Just being in the wet and in the wind would chill anyone, to put it mildly. So added air - you know, add in a colder air temperature, that would certainly make that condition worse. But, look, in all my courses, our instructors our True North

Wilderness Survival (ph) teach our students that in the end it really doesn't matter how much gear or training you have, it's what's in your head and heart that matters most. And what he also explained in his interview might help explain a lot what went on, which is, he maintained his positive mental attitude. He was focused on his spiritual faith. That helped - seemed to help him get through the occasion. And he seemed to be more worried about his parents worrying about him than he was about himself.

BALDWIN: Right, that struck me as well. He was concerned his parents would be - he'd be in trouble or something to that effect. Let me loop back to, because I think -

KULICK: Or -

BALDWIN: Go ahead. Go ahead.

KULICK: I was going to say, he seemed to be worried that they thought he was dead. I mean that was my interpretation from one of the accounts. So it's typically when you're thinking of others, that's what helps you in a survival situation.

BALDWIN: Keep going, stay strong -

KULICK: To help you get you through it, yes.

BALDWIN: For your parents, of course.

KULICK: And to stay - exactly. Or any one, for that matter, any loved one.

BALDWIN: What about all that raw fish? I mean he said that once he ran out of food and water, obviously that's when you start to panic. And he realized, once he started putting some of his dirtier clothes in the water, fish would start swimming through his clothing and so that's when he would start grabbing and started eating all this fish. What does that do to your - to your body, to your system?

KULICK: Depending on the fish, that's certainly - what he did again is plausible. You know, when you're at sea that long, a microenvironment forms under the boat and the fish will do exactly what he said. So that sounds plausible to me. Depending on the larger fish, you know, that might have parasites and the like in it, but smaller fish might not. But even so, in the end you've got to survive and you do what you have to do. And I could see him still getting through that quite healthy. I mean he might need some ongoing medical care, but, again, he did what he had to do.

BALDWIN: Yes, I suppose it's pretty incredible, that will to survive really kicks in. Eric Kulick -

KULICK: And that's really what it comes down to is the will.

BALDWIN: Right, in the very ending, the will to survive.

KULICK: That's ultimate - yes.

BALDWIN: Eric, thank you very much. Appreciate it.

KULICK: Thank you.

BALDWIN: Coming up next, with this tentative deal on the Iran nuclear talks, a lot of Iranians citizens took to the streets celebrating, dancing around. Why they see this deal as a victory.

Plus, what happens to the Americans still being held in Iran?

And as the backlash grows over the religious freedom laws, Mike Huckabee, former Arkansas governor, says the gay community is trying to get rid of churches in America. Hear his reasons, coming up.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[14:24:00] BALDWIN: A lot of reaction coming in all around the world after the breakthrough in nuclear talks between the United States and Iran. America's closest ally in the Middle East, Israel, remains vehemently opposed to the deal. Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu summoning Israel's top security officials into a meeting earlier today saying the proposal threatens Israel's survival.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BENJAMIN NETANYAHU, ISRAELI PRIME MINISTER: Israel will not accept an agreement which allows a country that vows to annihilate us to develop nuclear weapons, period. In addition, Israel demands that any final agreement with Iran will include a clear and unambiguous Iranian commitment of Israel's right to exist.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: Look at this here. Quite a different response and reaction in Iran, where people there took to the streets, honking their horns, getting out and dancing in celebration. The president of Iran sounding optimistic in public. Jim Sciutto has more on what this proposal could mean to a country that has been isolated from the world for nearly 40 years and where the three Americans are still held.

[14:25:05] Jim.

JIM SCIUTTO, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Well, Brooke, I'll tell you, from an American perspective, a lot of people back home look at this as sort of a dry diplomatic deal. They see the Iran issue largely through the prism of its nuclear program and understandably it's a big threat to U.S. interests in the region. It's the way we've been talking about this country for so long.

When you go to Iran, though, yes, the nuclear program very important to them, the Iranian people, they see it as a matter of pride, but this deal is about far more. This is about opening up Iran to the world again. Iran being something of a normal country because under these economic sanctions and under this long history of disagreement and mistrust with the U.S., listen, in Iran today, you know, to get in certain kinds of cars they have to be smuggled in. you pay two to three times the price. It's hard to get chemotherapy drugs. If you're an Iranian student, to get visas to go to certain countries, very difficult. It just makes, in their view, a normal life not possible and they see this opening up of relations with the U.S., the lifting of these sanctions over time as truly not only opening their country but opening up their futures, dramatic, and that's why you've seen so much celebration there. Of course, enormous implications for the government as well because it's been suffering under these economic sanctions, lost tens of billions of dollars in oil revenue and so on. So, politically, it's a major thing too.

But the other issue, and I mentioned the relationship, is this. Keep in mind that for all the celebration and achievement in Switzerland with this deal, you still have three Americans held in Iran on trumped-up charges really with no justification. Amir Hekmati, he's a former Marine accused of spying. Saeed Abedini, an American-Iranian pastor who's imprisoned there. And then Jason Rezaian, he's a "Washington Post" reporter accused of spying as well. Their families not happy to see these negotiations go forward without the freedom of those Americans being granted. Of course it's still possible, though. Perhaps it could come before or after a final agreement, but that's still a major source of tension between the U.S. and Iran.

Brooke.

BALDWIN: Jim Sciutto in Washington. thank you very much, Jim.

Next, basketball, anyone? We're live outside the final four where teams are getting ready to play amid all the backlash over that religion law. Hear what the NCAA just said to Indiana's governor.

Plus, the allegations against one of the most powerful Democrats in the Senate involving women, models, lavish trips and a lot of cash. And now hear who's calling on Senator Bob Menendez to step down.

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