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NYC Mayor de Blasio not Endorsing Clinton Yet; Clinton's Appeal to Women; Shootings by Officers Rarely Prosecuted; Jordan Spieth Captures Masters. Aired 10:30-11a ET

Aired April 13, 2015 - 10:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[10:29:58] CAROL COSTELLO, CNN ANCHOR: And good morning. I'm Carol Costello. Thank you so much for joining me.

Hillary Clinton is running for president in 2016. It is official. But one fellow Democrat may be running away. New York Mayor Bill de Blasio, a progressive, is not endorsing Clinton, at least not yet if at all. The New York tabloids all over it this morning as you can see on "The Daily News" -- see it right here. It says "Stabbed in De Back". Get it? De Blasio -- De Back. You got it.

Mark Preston is CNN executive editor for politics. He's joining me to talk about this. So why didn't de Blasio come out and just endorse Hillary Clinton?

MARK PRESTON, CNN EXECUTIVE EDITOR FOR POLITICS: Well, I think a lot of people were surprised yesterday, Carol, when he came out and deferred. He didn't not endorse her but he deferred. You know, I talked to someone very close to him just a few moments ago. They said this is not out of character for the mayor. We shouldn't be surprised by this.

The fact of the matter is you have really one time to strike very hard on issues. This is the time for Mayor Bill de Blasio. Now he's heading to Iowa this week. He's going to give a speech on income inequality. Interestingly enough, De Blasio held a conference just a few weeks ago at Gracie Mansion to talk about income inequality.

He was asked several times about Hillary Clinton. And he always deferred. He never said anything.

COSTELLO: That's just -- I mean some people might find that strange. I don't know. Maybe he's waiting for a better candidate to come his way. So he's going to be in Iowa at the same time Hillary Clinton is in Iowa, right? You just got back from --

PRESTON: Politics is very, very strange -- right.

COSTELLO: Yes.

PRESTONG: You know, it's not so much that he's for another candidate. I think in many ways Bill de Blasio is for himself. He sees this as an opportunity to strike, to become a leader on progressive issues. We have Elizabeth Warren, you know, as that leader.

You know, as you said I was in Iowa a few weeks ago. Folks out there real liberal activists want Elizabeth Warren to run. If not Elizabeth Warren, if it's Hillary Clinton, they want her to push those issues such as income inequality.

COSTELLO: All right. Mark Preston -- thanks so much for joining me. I appreciate it.

Well, if you watched that Hillary Clinton rollout video, you notice there were lots and lots of women featured. In fact, you could say women took center stage. A man speaking Spanish shows up 25 seconds in. The next guy to appear is not your traditional man. He's gay. He shows up 50 seconds in.

But you get my drift here. Women, women, women -- women are it. Hillary Clinton is certainly leaning in when it comes to women. The question, will running on gender work? With me now to talk about that: CNN political commentator and Democratic strategist Donna Brazile and CNN political commentator and conservative columnist S.E. Cupp. Welcome to both of you.

S.E. CUPP, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Thank you.

DONNA BRAZILE, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Good morning.

COSTELLO: Good morning. S.E. Cupp in 2008, Clinton stressed competence and toughness. This time around she's definitely playing up the gender card. The thing is she kind of is the gender card. Does she really need to do that?

CUPP: You know, the thing that no one talks about is that on the left there's a greater deficiency with men than there is with women on the right. Democrats have a much bigger man problem than Republicans have a woman problem. And actually Hillary Clinton doesn't have to wonder if that's a good strategy. All she has to look back to is 2014 mid terms where in a number of states red and blue, a number of candidates male and female, tried the pander to women -- tried overselling to women. And they did so at the expense of other men and it failed disastrously whether that's in Colorado with Mark Udall who was nicknamed Mark Uterus; or in Texas with Wendy Davis.

I mean around the country you saw that kind of war on women campaign and it really backfired.

COSTELLO: Yes, I pray we don't hear that term this time around because man, I'm sick of that term "war on women". Let's just not use that.

Going back to stats, Donna, according to a 2014 "Washington Post" poll, 61 percent of women support Hillary Clinton; only 49 percent of men support her. If she's already got women, I'll ask you the question the other way. Why not focus on men? BRAZILE: Well, she got 49 percent last time I checked, 50

percent is half. She will go after every vote. She's going to earn the support of not just women, but also men. And the Democratic Party is a very diverse. We have liberals, progressives, moderates and a few conservatives as well. What Secretary Clinton will try to do this time around is to make sure that she captured the votes of younger women who she lost in 2008 to Barack Obama.

Look, there's a 10 percent gender gap in the last presidential election meaning that President Obama outperformed Mitt Romney with women voters. We all know that women's issues are family issues and yes our reproductive health matters as well.

This is going to be a different campaign season for Secretary Clinton because she understands that what's at stake in terms of the issues but more importantly the voters that may not have been around in 2008 meaning they were younger voters -- they were not eligible to vote. They're eligible this time and her focus, her challenge is to capture their imagination and also their support.

[10:34:58] COSTELLO: That's exactly right. And you're talking specifically about young women voters. But I must say this time around, S.E., feminism is kind of hip right now in a way that it was not in 2008. Beyonce dancing in front of that big feminism sign; Emma Watson gave a speech on feminism at the U.N. that went viral.

This issue seems to resonate more with younger women voters. So isn't it smart to try to capitalize on that?

CUPP: I feel like I'm in a different reality. If dancing in front of a feminism sign is what counts as feminism today, then I think the movement is safely at --

(CROSSTALK)

COSTELLO: Well, let's talk about Emma Watson because what Emma Watson said had content and it was a serious speech.

CUPP: But no Carol, actually what Emma Watson said about feminism was that feminism's reputation has been suffering for its perception that it has been excluding men. So I think Hillary's challenge -- I know she's going to want to reach out to women but her challenge is going to have to be not looking like she's ignoring the other half of the country.

If you divide up the country between Republicans and Democrats and then divide up those categories between men and women, if you're talking about her pitching to 25 percent of the country, I don't think anyone would say that that's a good election strategy. I'm sure she'll try to find a balance. I think that would be wise for her to do.

BRAZILE: But, but -- then we make up more than half the population --

COSTELLO: Let's just talk about -- let's just talk about -- (CROSSTALK)

COSTELLO: I get it. But let me just throw in this question before our time runs out -- Donna.

BRAZILE: All right.

COSTELLO: On the other hand, I know a lot of women who are insulted when someone suggests they would vote for a woman just because she's female. And like S.E. said, couldn't this strategy sort of backfire in the end?

BRAZILE: Absolutely not. Look, remember, women just received the right to vote in 1920. This is probably the fourth election -- since Ronald Reagan, women have led in terms of voter turnout and voter participation. To engage women is to engage the issues that women care about, which are economic issues, peace and justice issues, security issues. We want to talk about the wage gap -- absolutely. There's no reason why we should be paid less.

These are issues that galvanize not just women voters but also male voters. We're not segregating or separating anybody. We're trying to make sure that every American, every eligible American, hear those words "I need your support". That's the challenge that Secretary Clinton will have.

On the other hand, let me just say I'm a feminist. I'm an unabashed feminist. And I'm a feminist because I'm a womanist and I respect the dignity of all human beings and all human lives including women.

CUPP: So do I -- Donna. So do I.

BRAZILE: I am a feminist. I just want you to know it could be sully, it could be dirty but I am a proud feminist. I've been one since I was probably two years old. And I'm just 12 now.

COSTELLO: Exactly. Thanks to both of you. I enjoyed the conversation. S.E. Cupp, Donna Brazile.

BRAZILE: Thank you.

COSTELLO: Still to come in the NEWSROOM -- you're welcome -- as California official investigate a police beating caught on tape, a new report examines deadly police use of force and how rarely officers are charged.

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[10:41:13] COSTELLO: The FBI is investigating a police beating caught on tape Thursday in California. Here it is. A group of sheriff's deputies kicking and punching a suspect while on the ground. Ten officers now on leave; this amid heightened scrutiny of police use of force after multiple killings of unarmed suspects in the past year most recently the shooting death of Walter Scott in South Carolina. "The Washington Post" and Bowling Green State University

examined the phenomenon in detail seeking to identify every officer charged in a deadly shooting in the last decade. Out of thousands of cases since 2005, only 54 resulted in charges. 35 of those cases were resolved and of those, 21 officers were either acquitted or saw their charges dropped -- the average sentence, four years.

Let's talk about this. Joining me now, "Washington Post" national reporter Kimberly Kindy and our CNN legal analyst, Paul Callan -- welcome to both of you.

PAUL CALLAN, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: Thank you.

COSTELLO: Kimberly --

KIMBERLY KINDY, "WASHINGTON POST": Thank you

COSTELLO: -- thanks for being here Kimberly. I sure appreciate it. As you were investigating these numbers, what surprised you the most?

KINDY: There were a lot of things that surprised me. I think that, first of all, just what it took in order to actually charge an officer. It really took a lot. There had to be a video or there had to be an autopsy that showed that they were shot in the back as they were running away sort of like the Walter Scott video that people have been viewing or sometimes usually --- most of the time it took a number of factors like that, really solid layers upon layers of evidence in order for there to be a charge. And then what was surprising was just how often even when you had that level of evidence, how often they just faced no jail time at all.

COSTELLO: So, Paul, you often talk about how high the bar is for charging officers. Might it be time for that bar to change?

CALLAN: Well, I think it should change. The bar frankly shouldn't be any different than it is for charging anybody else. But you have to understand that -- and nobody in law enforcement, nobody with a prosecutorial background is surprised by these numbers because we have seen how grand juries react to police officers and they always cut them a break.

Why do they cut them a break? When the bad guy beats somebody up or robs a bank or hurts somebody, he's doing it for his own personal gain. When an officer does it, he's generally trying to arrest who he perceives to be a bad guy to protect the public. So because of that, grand jurors kind of bend over backwards not to indict unless the evidence is overwhelming and that's why you're seeing those stats.

COSTELLO: Kimberly, you're not just talking about once maybe charges are filed. You're talking about the investigation from the get-go, right?

KINDY: Right. And you know, the other thing is that it's not just grand juries who tend to give them a pass. Even if the case is incredibly egregious, and that's what we're talking about with these cases, even when they get to a point where this hard evidence is presented to a jury, jurors themselves -- not just grand jurors but if it's a trial -- if they have a trial, the jurors just have a very difficult time seeing past that badge.

I talked to a juror who is really, really good to interview for this piece and he just spoke about how difficult not only is the legal threshold but how difficult it is for you to see an officer who you view as somebody who upholds the law, somebody whose job is to separate us from the chaos of life and as somebody who would not break from that. It's hard for them to believe that anything other than what the officer says.

[10:45:01] And what we found over and over again was even though there wasn't a weapon, if they said they were in fear -- they feared for their life, which is the legal threshold that can get them off, the jury believes them regardless of what the evidence is.

COSTELLO: I think that something else that may sway people's opinions, Paul, there's no one place where police-involved shootings, the statistics are kept. We don't really know how many police- involved shootings are. So that gives people the impression that there really aren't so many.

CALLAN: Yes, I think that's a very, very good point. Our statistical gathering in this area has really been bad. And there's been a lot of opposition from the law enforcement community through the years about second-guessing their decisions and gathering these statistics. I think this has to be more closely examined and obviously we need much better training of police officers. You have to remember that phrase power corrupts, absolute power corrupts absolutely.

Police officers function on power. Their power is often a nightstick and physical power. And you really have to keep the reins on that through good training and putting good people in these positions.

COSTELLO: All right. Paul Callan, thanks so much. Kimberly Kindy, thanks for the great reporting and for appearing on my show today. I really appreciate it.

KINDY: Thank you so much for having me.

COSTELLO: Any time.

I'll be right back.

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[10:50:00] COSTELLO: 21-year-old phenom and now sex symbol, Jordan Spieth, is now the second youngest golfer ever to win the Masters tournament. The only other player to do it at a younger age would be Tiger Woods one of the competitors Spieth beat out to take the green jacket on Sunday.

Joining me with more, CNN sports reporter Rachel Nichols. I know, shouldn't have said it but I did. There's a lot of --

(CROSSTALK)

RACHEL NICHOLS, CNN SPORTS: Fun to watch for all kinds o reasons and all kinds of ways.

And this kid's composure was amazing. He's the first person to lead the Masters wire to wire from first day to the last in 39 years.

COSTELLO: Wow.

NICHOLS: There's a reason that that is so hard to do. The weight of it is just too much for most people but this kid was able to stay within himself. He said he got a pep talk on Sunday morning from his father. You can see him there with his parents and his dad just reminded him, look, this is a big deal -- absolutely. But there are more important things than golf. Every putt, every birdie chance you get, it doesn't have to feel like life or death.

The reason this family knows that is that Spieth has a sister who has special needs. They've had to struggle through her growing up, how to help her, care for her, and if you take a listen to him talking about her, you can see how much she means to him and why he was able to say that golf is just golf on Sunday.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JORDAN SPIETH, SECOND YOUNGEST MASTERS WINNER: She's the most special part of our family. She's the funniest part of our family. She's an incredible sister. Miss her a lot. Wish that she could have been here. Can't wait to get back to her and let her maybe try on the jacket or something.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

NICHOLS: Yes. I think that jacket they may need to take his measurements for next year because trust me, this kid is going to be around for a while. He said that his life-long dream -- he's 21 -- his life-long dream was to win the Masters. He was only allowed to legally drink about eight months ago. Now he's realized his life-long dream -- Carol. So hey, got to find a new dream.

COSTELLO: I must say, it's tough in itself to win something so big at such a young age. Maybe he should talk to Tiger Woods.

NICHOLS: Yes, well, you know, tiger actually had a good weekend. Tiger had taken more than two months off from competitive golf. He had to get his swing back, every putting back.

He had a scary moment when he slammed his iron into a tree root on Sunday. He said that he had to actually pop a bone in his hand back into his hand and wrist. I don't know how to do that. He said he did that. He said that he's going to feel ok and he'll be good to go going forward. He had a good showing this weekend -- that's good for Tiger fans.

COOPER: I would be crying.

Rachel Nichols, thank you so much. I appreciate it.

Still to come in the NEWSROOM --

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KATE MCKINNON, "SATURDAY NIGHT LIVE": Citizens, you will elect me. I will be your leader.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: "Saturday Night Live" skewers Hillary Clinton's 2016 announcement. Will the jokes hurt her in the polls? That depends. Just ask Sarah Palin.

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[10:55:08] COSTELLO: All right. This will probably come as no surprise to you but Senator Marco Rubio, Republican from Florida, has announced he's indeed running for president. The announcement is right now on his Web site. It's confirmed by our own Dana Bash. Marco Rubio says he's running for president and is uniquely qualified to talk about the future.

Of course I guess the official, official announcement will come at 6:00 p.m. Eastern and of course CNN will be there to cover it live. Again Senator Marco Rubio now running for president.

On the Democratic side of the coin, Hillary hilarity -- SNL's latest female power house Kate McKinnon delivers.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: And action.

MCKINNON: Citizens, you will elect me. I will be your leader.

I am running because I want to be a voice for women everywhere.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Did someone say women everywhere? Hillary would make a great president. I would make an even greater first dude.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: It's really funny. Over the years five comedians have taken on Clinton.

McKinnon made her debut last month following news of those now infamous e-mails.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MCKINNON: Hello. I'm Hillary Clinton. Tonight I'm speaking to you not as secretary of state or as a senator or as a first lady but as a relatable woman on a couch. Hello.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: That maniacal laugh. The question though -- the serious question, can the jokes hurt Hillary Clinton's run for president.

My next guest says simply comedy reinforces reality. Dean Obeidallah is a political comedian and columnist for the "Daily Beast". He's also the host of "Dean Obeidallah Show" on Sirius XM. That's a mouthful.

DEAN OBEIDALLAH, POLITICAL COMEDIAN: That's a lot of intro. Thank you.

COSTELLO: I know you're welcome anytime. So just reinforces what we already know about this candidate and can't hurt?

OBEIDALLAH: I think political comedy only works when it's based on reality. You cannot create a narrative. People go, look at SNL or "The Daily Show" creating a narrative about a candidate. They're not. They're just heightening and exaggerating for comedic purposes.

Look, Hillary Clinton is coming across like almost Frankenstein in here but the truth of it, the seed of truth is that she seems calculating and somebody who wants to win and wants to be president forever and has a problem being relatable. That makes us laugh.

If they portrayed Hillary like Sarah Palin as not knowing what's going on it wouldn't be funny. That doesn't resonate with us. It's just based on the genesis of that really the person is about, their essence.

COSTELLO: But this kind of comedy can hurt and I go all the way back to Gerald Ford and Chevy Chase -- right. Because Chevy Chase's, you know, kind of spoofing of Gerald Ford as this clumsy, doughy kind of dopey guy that resonated and not in a good way for Gerald Ford.

OBEIDALLAH: To me it just furthers and solidifies the narrative. To be honest, if you are running for president, if you are Marco Rubio, you're announcing today, worry about what you do in the real world because what you do in the real world is going to be heightened in the comedy world.

They cannot create their own narrative of the candidate. They cannot define a new role. I mean I worked at SNL for years and I saw Amy Poehler play Hillary Clinton. I saw Ana Gasa replaying Hillary Clinton. They were great. But they weren't inventing these people. They were based on what the candidates were actually saying or the politician was saying in the real world.

But I'm really excited. It's political comedy season now. Cue the breaking news banner. This is the best time of the year. And this is going to be so much fun.

COSTELLO: Do you thin that Tina Fey's spoof on Sarah Palin hurt Sarah Palin's chances?

OBEIDALLAH: I think it did but again it wasn't like they made up Sarah Palin as saying things about Russia like the famous line, "I could see Russia from my house. Tina Fey said it -- Sarah Palin didn't say but Sarah Palin did say when Putin leaves his house and he flies over the airspace he can see Alaska. They used that reality to exaggerate for comedic purposes.

It didn't help Sarah Palin but at the end of the day I think Bill Clinton -- I never saw anybody more lambasted -- he's still likable. He comes on SNL Saturday as Daryl Hammond playing him -- big laughs. And people like him. So I think there's a line were when you're making fun in an endearing way and you're really demonizing or defining someone in a way that makes them --

COSTELLO: I do think that the more SNL demonizes the candidate the more likely it is that the candidate will appear on SNL.

OBEIDALLAH: They're going to take care of every one. I think there's going to be so many fun candidates. The first debate is in August. It's going to be a great time. If you like political comedy, this is the time because most people don't follow politics. If you do political comedy it's very challenging until the election starts heating up. This is it this week. So it's going to be fun.

COSTELLO: You make me laugh, Dean, as always.

OBEIDALLAH: I try.

COSTELLO: Thanks for coming by.

OBEIDALLAH: Thanks Carol. Thanks for having me on.

COSTELLO: I appreciate it as always.

And thank you so much for joining me today. I'm Carol Costello.

" AT THIS HOUR WITH BERMAN AND BOLDUAN" starts now.