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Legal View with Ashleigh Banfield

Examining the Situation in Yemen; Henry Rayhons Trial Update; Hearing Held Regarding Release of John Hinckley, Jr. Aired 12:30-1p ET

Aired April 22, 2015 - 12:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[12:30:05] JONATHAN GILLIAM, FORMER NAVY SEAL: And what I see here is too much rhetoric. We're trying to make it sound like where there we could do something. But we never want to say do not do this or else.

ASHLEIGH BANFIELD, CNN HOST: And some of those ships are a lot more nimble than others. And I'm talking the aircraft carrier Theodore Roosevelt, Commander those don't turn on a dime and they are very useful certainly where it was, was very useful Theodore Roosevelt was -- as I understand it launching some of those much needed air assault on Iraq.

And it's not capable of doing that from the Gulf of Aden is it?

CMDR. CHRISTOPHER HARMER, U.S. NAVY (RET.): Well the aircraft carrier is built around the idea of launching strike fighter packages. It's not really built around the idea of conducting maritime interdiction operations. So you're correct to point out that by moving this aircraft carrier far off to south coast of Yemen or out there the Gulf of Oman, the Gulf of Aden.

It removes it from the fight in Iraq those strike fighters could conduct missions into Iraq. But they required significant in flight refueling.

I want to also dovetail on something Jonathan said which is the average American citizen, the American public thinks that the U.S. Government speaks with one voice. A lot of times there is, as Jonathan said, is cross pollenization going on where you get the DOD saying one thing, Department of States saying another thing. We're not always on the same page.

One of the critical factors here is there's a possibility of introvert intention between the different areas of the U.S. Government.

BANFIELD: Yeah, and I want to be real clear that when the president did say those words sending a message, he had given a very long preamble prior that. Also talking about exactly what Marie Harf was speaking of, and that was to keep things smooth, to keep businesses usual in the Gulf.

So less to any network that has a bent wants to use it other wise those are just the facts right there, you got to listen to whole...

GILLIAM: Absolutely, without a war plan though, without a war plan you cannot have a strategic focus.

BANFIELD: Yeah.

GILLIAM: There's no strategic focus anywhere in this region and Saudi Arabia is being surrounded by Iran.

BANFIELD: Yeah.

GILLIAM: And nobody, if Saudi Arabia falls, the whole region will fall.

BANFIELD: Iran yet again the star, a whole other issue this week and a couple weeks ago.

Jonathan Gilliam, thank you, and Christopher Harmer, appreciate your wise assessment of all these, thank you to both of you.

Coming up next court cases don't get a whole lot stranger or sadder than this one. Will a jury convict a man of the sexual abuse of his own wife at a nursing home? He says it was nothing like that and the verdict could come at anytime.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[12:36:14] BANFIELD: What happens in a deliberation room is private. But sometimes juries have questions and the questions they bring out in an open court can tell you a whole lot about what they're thinking.

The jury in Henry Rayhons' trial is deliberating now for a third day. Rayhons is accused of sexually assaulting his wife Donna. She was an Alzheimer's patient at her nursing home.

A doctor declared that she was unable to consent to sex due to her dementia. But she died in August and he was arrested about a week later.

Make no mistake her death had nothing to do with this. But the case is serious. Mr. Rayhons is 78 years old he denies that any kind of sexual incident that's being alleged happened on the night in question which is what the jury seems to be struggling with right now because the court documents are accusing Rayhons of committing a sex act with his wife on or about May 23rd.

Now why do I stress on or about May 23rd. For the legal view I want to bring in CNN Legal Analyst and Defense Attorney Danny Cevallos.

Because Danny that's exactly what they sent to note out asking about do we have to be closed to the 23rd, can we have some definitions of what honor about is suppose to tell us about the date, doesn't this tell you the jury wants to know if its that date and that date alone we get it but we don't get this whole 'on or about.' And we may have some wiggle room here.

DANNY CEVALLOS, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: 'On or about' language is commonly used in indictments and complaints and then yours to the benefit of the prosecution. But generally the rule of thumb is in this jurisdiction at least in federal court as long as the honor about date, if the jury finds that it occurred within a reasonable period of time whatever that means.

And especially where here, in cases like rape and assault time is not a material element of the crime charge. So as long as the jury finds it happened within reasonable time but I'll add this if an indictment says that an assault happened between January 2014 and say July 2014.

BANFIELD: It's pretty clear.

CEVALLOS: That's a broader on or about. This criminal complaint alleges May 23rd 2014. So the question then becomes what is a reasonable amount of time.

BANFIELD: So and by the way that's a big question it often comes from the jury can you give us the definition of reasonable doubt usually. And...

CEVALLOS: I'm still wondering what it means myself.

BANFIELD: I find you very unreasonable.

CEVALLOS: I find myself many people find me unreasonable.

BANFIELD: Your reasonable answers within you. But here is the issue. So often, you know, juries will look at someone and say "I'm (ph) 78 do I really want to do this even though they made a pretty compelling case." Would this be the kind of thing that they could say "Look if it was meant to mean midnight the day before and maybe, you know, a few hours after 23rd we get it.

But we want a way out. And if you can't tell me it's exactly the 23rd and maybe I got a way out.

CEVALLOS: If we want to read jury [inaudible] which is always a repeat proposition, right, you can conclude possibly that there are real -- because remember there are two real elements that there was sex and part two that it was -- there was the absence of consent.

So if as to this first issue they are struggling with honor about language you might surmise that they are trying to find a something that as we say hang their hat on. And in this case that might be an acquittal.

BANFIELD: All right Danny Cevallos thank you for that we're going to continue this jury watch, this verdict watch, we'll let you know just as soon as we know more.

In the meantime up next, does a man who shot President Reagan, remember that long ago. Does he now deserve to walk out of a psychiatric facility virtually a freeman decades later. Could today's court hearings allow that to happen?

[12:39:50] (COMMERCIAL BREAK) BANFIELD: Should John Hinckley Jr. the man who shot Ronald Reagan, be released permanently from the psychiatric facility where he's been treated for more than three decades?

Today a federal judge in Washington is hearing arguments about that, about the case for granting him even more freedom than he's been given today.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It was March 30th 1981 when six shots were fired outside the Washington Hilton. President Ronald Reagan, his Press Secretary James Brady and two other people were wounded in that attack.

25 year old John Hinckley was arrested at the scene. Hinckley says he was trying to impress actress Jodie Foster with the Reagan assassination attempt.

He become obsessed with her after seeing her in the movie "Taxi Driver." After the shooting Foster a Yale University student was asked about Hinckley.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Despite that that you never met him as this whole experience made you feel like you've come to know John Hinckley?

JODIE FOSTER: Not all. I know nothing about him.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: In June of 1982 Hinckley was found not guilty by reason of insanity in those shootings. He's been treated at St. Elizabeth Psychiatric Hospital in Southeast Washington.

And overtime the courts have gradually granted him more unsupervised visits to his mother's home in Williamsburg Virginia.

In 2011 a psychiatrist named E. Fuller Torrey told CNN.

DR. E. FULLER TORREY, PSYCHIATRIST: If his on medication Mr. Hinckley could move in next door to me as far as I'm concern. If he's not on medication I would do everything I could to block him for moving in next door.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Since 2013 John Hinckley has been allowed 17 day period of off campus visits to his mother's home. He carries a GPS equipped cellphone and he sometimes followed secret service agents.

[12:45:00] In August of 2014 that former Reagan Press Secretary James Brady died at age 73. His death was ruled a homicide. But in January this year the United States attorney for the District of Columbia release a statement saying they will not be pursuing murder charges against John Hinckley for the death of James Brady.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BANFIELD: So how likely it is that he's going to go free and does he deserve that? You're going to hear the legal view next. (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BANFIELD: A hearing is underway right now on whether John Hinckley Jr., the man who shot President Ronald Reagan, should be released permanently from a psychiatric hospital.

Joining me to talk about this request is Criminal Defense Attorney, Midwin Charles. So here is the thing. He's almost 60 years old.

MIDWIN CHARLES, CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Yes.

BANFIELD: It just feels like it's been forever since he's been in there yet the standard is that he's not a danger to himself or others, OK? And that doctor before the break said, if he's on med, fine if he lives next door to me. If he's not on med, I don't want him next door to me.

CHARLES: Right, and that standard, it's pretty broad isn't it? Whether or not he posses a danger to himself or to others.

BANFIELD: Who is there to make sure he takes the med?

CHARLES: Exactly, and that's part of the question. Now, overtime each time he sort of made this request for additional freedom, a judge has granted it and all he's done is pretty much go spend time with his parents.

So there's an argument that his attorneys can make that his parents will sort of be there to supervise and ensure that he'll take his medication because he right now, he has about 17 days per month that he's spending with parents.

[12:50:08] BANFIELD: And has gone well, nobody has had any complaints, the neighbors.

CHARLES: Right.

BANFIELD: Everything has been quiet and fine. What else a victim here granted President Reagan is dead, granted James Brady...

CHARLES: James Brady, yeah.

BANFIELD: James Brady's wife also, they didn't have children. But what about those other two people who were shot? What about the surviving family members, do they get any say in any of this process or is it all about the health of Hinckley?

CHARLES: See, at this point it's all about the health of Hinckley. But it wouldn't surprise me if as victims, as family members of victims that they would have the opportunity to sort of speak on the subject. This has gone on for quite a while and as I've said before, each time he's gone before this judge, this judge has allowed him more and more freedom, more and more leeway. And it's because he's exhibited, you know, proof that he can sort of, you know, rehabilitate himself and kind of be in society and not harm anyone. Remember, he tried to kill himself three times earlier during his hospitalization at Elizabeth Hospital.

BANFIELD: Yeah, yeah. You know, this has been such a sore spot for Americans. In fact, that the standard by which we deal with the criminally insane at this point has changed because of this man, this case, change everything.

CHARLES: It really has and this case sort of demonstrates what happens when that jury says not guilty by reason of insanity.

BANFIELD: It happened a whole lot less after Hinckley walks.

CHARLES: But this is sort of the aftermath and I think that the American public gets to see what happens to a defendant after he is found...

BANFIELD: I notice its going to sound hard to sort of digest but isn't this exactly the way it's supposed to work? I mean effectively isn't this the way the law was. We'll put him away until he's not sick anymore, and if says 10, 20, 34 years down the pike he's not sick, let him go.

CHARLES: It should be. I mean the justice system for the most part recognizes that people with mental illness do not belong in maximum security prisons with those who were not mentally ill. They need treatment.

BANFIELD: As uncomfortable as it sounds when you have a guy who shot four people and nearly took out the President.

Midwin Charlest, always good to see you.

CHARLES: Good to see you too.

BANFIELD: Thank you, appreciate it.

Well, Aaron Hernandez is sitting behind bars locked up for the rest of his life. There is a whole bunch of new trouble for him. It's not just criminal either, it's money.

Odin Lloyd's family is taking further legal action against him. They want him to pay in other ways. You'll hear from his mother just ahead.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

[12:55:05] SANJAY GUPTA, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Seeing Memphis Grizzlies star Jeff Green in action, it's clear he's a player with heart. But in 2011, his game was interrupted.

JEFF GREEN, MEMPHIS GRIZZLIES PLAYER: I was in a complete shock.

GUPTA: A routine team physical revealed an aortic aneurysm near the left valve of his heart. Jeff who was 25 at that time needed surgery.

GREEN: It was nerve wracking. I couldn't run. I couldn't touch a basketball. I couldn't get stressed out. It was tough.

GUPTA: And rebounding from open heart surgery, that wasn't easy either. Jeff didn't touch a basketball for nearly six months. He lost muscle in the mechanics of this game.

GREEN: It was a slow progression. My body was different. The timing was off. I was fatigued but I wasn't concerned about getting hit. The biggest thing for me which has been shape and being -- I would function out there on the floor.

GUPTA: The experience did give Jeff a greater appreciation for basketball.

GREEN: Now I attack every game as, you know, this could be my last.

(OFF-MIKE)

GUPTA: It also gave him a greater appreciation for life. He often visits young heart patients providing encouragement and they compare scars.

GREEN: To see me come back from the heart surgery, see me up there playing, and they look up to that. I look forward to that and, you know, they love it so, you know, I'm going to continue to do it.

GUPTA: Dr. Sanjay Gupta, CNN reporting.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BANFIELD: So he was just sentenced to life in prison without the possibility of parole. And now Aaron Hernandez faces another legal battle, not criminal, civil.

A wrongful death lawsuit officially filed now by victim, Odin Lloyd's family. A short time ago, Lloyd's mother spoke at a news conference about the loss of her son.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

URSULA WARD, ODIN LLOYD'S MOTHER: The day they told me my son was shot and killed, I thought my life ended with him. I always wish I was there to take those bullets for Odin.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BANFIELD: Families of Daniel de Abreu and Safiro Furtado are also suing Hernandez. Prosecutors say that Hernandez shot them in cold blood in 2012 over a spilled drink at a night club but Hernandez has yet to be tried for those two killings.

Thank you so much for watching everyone. It's been nice to have you with us. And my colleague Wolf Blitzer starts right now.