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Baltimore Citywide Curfew in Effect; No Fans Allowed at Today's Orioles Game; Rare Truce Between Rival Gangs. Aired 9-9:30a ET

Aired April 29, 2015 - 09:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[09:00:27] CHRIS CUOMO, CNN ANCHOR, NEW DAY: All right. So now they're putting out flash bangs right now.

JASON CARROLL, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: At this point, it's somewhat of a standoff in terms of those who are still out here not wanting to go home, at least not yet.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Please, please, can you all -- can you all go home? You all see what is about to go on.

BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: My understanding is you've got some of the same organizers now going back into these communities to try to clean up in the aftermath of a handful of criminals and thugs.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It's not the right word to call our children. Thugs.

TOYA GRAHAM, YELLED AT SON DURING RIOT: That's my only son. And at the end of the day I don't want him to be a Freddie Gray.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CAROL COSTELLO, CNN ANCHOR: And good morning, everyone. I'm Carol Costello. Thank you so much for joining me. I'm live in Baltimore once again today. That curfew kicked in, an uneasy peace has taken hold.

Nearly an hour after the 10:00 p.m. curfew, police fire smoke canisters and pepper bullets and chase away a mostly peaceful crowd. A mere 10 people arrested to compared to the more than 200 arrested the night before.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ANTHONY BATTS, COMMISSIONER, BALTIMORE PD: The citizens are safe. The city is stable. We hope to maintain it that way, and we do not have a lot of movement throughout the city as a whole so the curfew is, in fact, working.

(END VIDEO CLIP) COSTELLO: This morning signs of normalcy reappeared. The city re- opens its public schools, the "Baltimore Sun" calls the mood an unsettled peace. But it was peace often forced at gunpoint. Some 2,000 National Guard troops are now mobilized in the city of Baltimore and another 1,000 police officers have been pulled from departments around the state and beyond.

But the unrest in Baltimore inspires protests in other American communities from coast to coast. And in the middle, Ferguson, Missouri. Hundreds gathered under the watchful eye of police, it was here last summer that the killing of an unarmed teenager ignited nationwide anger and debate over the police treatment of African- American men.

This morning we heard from President Obama in a taped interview with radio talk show host Steve Harvey. The president says police killings of unarmed black men like Michael Brown and Freddie Gray cannot be discounted as isolated incidents. He says their deaths must force serious discussion and change.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

OBAMA: We have to address these problems in a serious way. It's happening too often. And, you know, my heart goes out to the police officers who were injured over the last few days. They showed appropriate restraint and a number of them were hurt with stuff being thrown at them, and in the midst of these disturbances, it shows you how tough a job policing can be.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: You know what, though, self policing played a critical role in keeping the peace among the protesters last night. I was there, right there at the corner of North and Pennsylvania watching as clergy and community members linked arms, making a barrier between police and the crowd and calling for calm. Take a look.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Everybody, this is a peaceful march. Everyone, keep it that way.

COSTELLO: What are you guys protecting?

REV. CHARLES NEAL, PASTOR: We realize there is a curfew at 10:00, we want to keep some distance between the people and the police officers. We want to keep this rally peaceful. That's what we want. We don't want anything else. And we've been doing a great job all day long.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We're marching for all the future Freddie Grays out here.

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It's not going to change anything. It's not going to change anything. It's misguided frustration is what it is. That's what it is. We need to get to the root of the problem, and now all eyes on Baltimore City, now they're watching us, I'm sorry it had to take a tragic negative event to get our eyes on Baltimore City. But now they're watching, let's give them something good to look at.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Let's disperse peacefully. We can do this. I know we can. I have faith in my Baltimore. I know my people are going to show them. We're going to show the world what kind of city we have.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

[09:05:15] COSTELLO: I am telling you, it was an emotional night and some of the stuff I saw, it was just incredibly powerful.

I want to talk about this and more, so let's bring in Tom Verni, a former NYPD detective, and Tom Fuentes, CNN law enforcement analyst and former FBI assistant director.

Welcome to both of you.

TOM VERNI, FORMER NYPD DETECTIVE: Hey, good morning.

COSTELLO: OK. So you're both Tom, right, so this is going to be kind of tough. I'll call one Tom Detective, how's that?

VERNI: Yes.

COSTELLO: Is that good? OK. So, Detective -- Detective, you saw the community out there at North and Pennsylvania. They had formed this human chain between police officers and protesters who were intent on causing trouble. In my estimation they played a huge part in keeping the city calm in Baltimore last night. What do you think?

VERNI: Well, clearly Baltimore has come around a great distance from what it was the night before. The police clearly were using different tactics. I think that was a top down decision. It seemed like the day before that based on what the mayor had come out and said publicly that she was wanting the protesters to have some breathing room and room to destroy, which I think was, you know, not the way that we wanted to go about doing that, and they found out that that was probably not the best choice.

And she probably, you know, had more than a few meetings with the police commissioner and they decided that that was not the correct course and to change their course and to change their tactics. That, coupled with the fact that the community played a huge part last night as we saw with that young mother grabbing her son out of the crowd, that's what was needed.

You needed the older generation of community leaders going out and talking to the younger people to try to get them away from committing these acts of violence and making it more difficult to police the whole situation, and to kind of de-escalate the situation from turning into --

COSTELLO: I want to talk about that community effort, Detective, because, you know, you mentioned that mother. And that's just one person.

But last night, Tom, I saw hundreds and hundreds of community leaders and protesters out there keeping the peace. The police were waiting in line, they were standing there, but I am telling you that these community leaders formed a human chain and they pushed people out of the square. They pushed them down the street and they forced them to leave, and it was quite effective.

TOM FUENTES, CNN LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: I agree, Carol, that that had a huge effect on the people having their own community leaders out there, but I also don't think it was not lost on some of the people that caused the trouble on Monday night when all day yesterday you saw vehicles rolling in here, military vehicles, not just cops looking like the military, but the military.

So Monday night the police were spectators as buildings were burned and looted, and 20 officers were injured, some badly, where firefighters were attacked when they tried to put out the fire, where their hoses were cut right on CNN, live television. So I think if the community leaders can't get the job did not, then the police are there and the police this time have backup.

So I think that the difference was with yesterday, and the arrival of additional thousands of police and soldiers, I think it became clear that the community leaders can't get the job done, then the police are there and the police this time have backup. COSTELLO: I think what it really proves, Detective, is you need

everybody. It's -- you know, you can't have like just the police handling it, everybody has to be involved.

Here's another thing that I saw that was very powerful. So there were a lot of people there last night and they had masks over their face. They were intent on causing trouble. These community leaders, these protesters would surround those troublemakers, and they would say, we don't want you there. They would get right up in their face. We don't want you here. Then they surrounded them and they pushed them literally, you know, down the street and out of their neighborhood.

Very effective, don't you think?

VERNI: Well, again, yes, that's what was needed. I mean, the police could always change their tactics. They can call in additional resources, whether it'd be the National Guard or other police departments from the surrounding areas, which is always helpful to have more boots on the ground, so to speak, but in essence, you know, it really, you know, comes from the community to play an integral part in trying to help the police de-escalate the situation before it spirals out of control, which can happen very easily.

You're talking about a very highly charged, emotionally charged incident here where people are just going to let their emotions and their adrenaline run free, and it only takes one or two agitators or anarchist to kind of just set the flame and let the place explode. When you have hundreds of people who are all hunched up, you know, and ready to fight the police and just, you know, go -- have their way with the town. [09:10:00] So it is important that these community leaders did come

out. I'm very grateful that these community leaders came out and took charge of the situation to help the police kind of get a hold of the situation before it erupted or before it turned into the night before.

COSTELLO: And final question to you, Tom, because Friday, of course, the police -- they're going to turn over their investigation to the state attorney's office. I don't know if any information from that police report will be made public. I talked to one young man last night who said I don't even want to think about Friday, and -- you know, and if there is no information I don't even want to think about what might happen. So --

FUENTES: Right. That's a huge problem, because there is not going to be much information. It's only an interim report. The investigation isn't complete. I don't even know if all of the autopsy, the toxicology and the specific parts of the autopsy report are completed yet, so giving the interim report to the prosecutors, there are going to be no police officers in handcuffs by close of business Friday.

So now what happens on Friday, and then even worse, Saturday, when there is no visible action other than, you know, a file is taken and transported to the prosecutor's office. So I don't think it's going to be a good outcome Friday or Saturday when that happens.

COSTELLO: Well, I'm keeping my fingers and toes crossed.

Tom Fuentes, Tom Verni, thank you so much for your insight. I appreciate it as always.

One effect of the riots, it's a first for Major League Baseball today. Citing safety concerns, no fans, actually no fans will be in the stadium to watch and cheer when the Baltimore Orioles play the Chicago White Sox, closing the game to the public. That's never actually happened before.

Here's what the commissioner said. Quote, "We made a series of decisions based on safety conditions in Baltimore. I think the two clubs, both Baltimore and Chicago, were great, very cooperative in moving through a very difficult situation."

The first pitch about five hours from now, Joe Johns is at Camden Yards where usually people would be tailgating and going to the bars. I know it's early, but you know that's what they do in Baltimore, they like to have fun, and I would assume the streets are empty near Camden Yards, Joe.

JOE JOHNS, CNN SENIOR WASHINGTON CORRESPONDENT: The streets are empty over here, and apparently it's going to remain that way, Carol.

Look, the stated reason for doing this is because police resources need to be used elsewhere in the city, and they don't want them down here doing crowd control, what have you, during a baseball game, but there are other reasons, and quite frankly, among those reasons on Saturday night, there was a big problem out here after a game. There were fans who were actually inside the stadium and had to stay there while there was unrest on the streets out here.

There were a couple cars torched, 34 people arrested, six police officers injured, and a fight in a bar, so big problems over here at Camden Yards, and that's the thing the authorities say they want to prevent.

They are getting some pushback, of course, about the idea of canceling, postponing games or even holding a game without any spectators. A lot of people say the city and the national league could have made a statement by going ahead and holding the game- Carol.

COSTELLO: They could have but I guess safety won out in this case.

Joe Johns reporting from Camden Yards. Thank you so much.

You saw the video of a mother grabbing and hitting her son when she saw them in the crowd during violence. Toya Graham told CBS, you know what, she just wanted to protect her son.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GRAHAM: I find myself shielding my son on a lot of different incidents where these young kids are out here shooting each other, and a lot of his friends have been killed, you know, and so my thing is I just want to keep him in the house.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: You'll hear more from this mother a little later this hour, but first a rare allegiance here in Baltimore. Rival gangs team up to try to bring unity to a city torn apart by violent protests.

Up next, CNN talks to a group of gang members who say, well, they're not saying, they had nothing to do with the recent looting.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

COSTELLO: We are united right now. That is the message two sworn enemies, rival gang members from the Crips and the Bloods coming together, after violence and unrest in the streets of Baltimore.

On Tuesday, Don Lemon had a chance to talk with members on both sides that say they are trying to bring peace to their community and insist they had nothing to do with the looting on Monday night.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DON LEMON, CNN ANCHOR: So all of you are with somebody, and the Crips are out here and the Bloods are out here, and the Black Guerilla Family out here.

Do you want to tell me your affiliation?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We are not pressed to tell you our affiliation, but we are pressed to say we are together. That's why we're trying to do, we're together. We live in a police state and everyday we come out, and they are checking our private areas and public areas, it's just out of hand.

LEMON: When you see the stuff that happened with the looting and the fires, and is that gang related? Who is that?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No, that's not gang related. We have nothing to do with that. We are the ones out here that is trying to bring peace and stop everything.

LEMON: When you see pictures of everything that happened last night, the burning and stuff on television, what do you all think?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It makes us look bad, man.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Disgrace.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: At the end of the day, what they show on the news, what they show to the media, they're showing what they want to see. They don't let them see what is really going on between us.

LEMON: What is really going on?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Unity.

The unity between all the rivals that would not be here together standing right here right now.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Kids were the ones who acted on that manner. But right now, the children are going out there because they have no recreational parks.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And they're angry.

LEMON: When was the last time is there even been a truce like this call between all the colors?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Never. Never in Baltimore.

LEMON: So, it was said that all the people who -- it all started because gang members said we are going to riot, we're going to loot --

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No, that was said by social media. That was said by the commission.

LEMON: You think that was social media doing that?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And the police. Who else they going to blame it on when they can't control it?

(CROSSTALK)

[09:20:00] UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I'd say, what is going to get out to loot? We are not worried about loot because we make money. Yes, we make money to get whatever we want. UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We are not out here to say that we are saints and

the most innocent people in the world, and we are trying to say we are making effective changes in our community, or at least trying. It started with Freddie Gray and now we are going to take it to the next level and we need everybody's support, and it's not just Baltimore and this is affecting the whole country right now.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: Many people here say this week's violent riots do not reflect peaceful protests, while some like the Baltimore mayor, Stephanie Rawlings-Blake, calls those behind the looting thugs and others say that name calling is racially charged and doesn't do anything to solve the problem.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MAYOR STEPHANIE RAWLINGS-BLAKE (D), BALTIMORE, MARYLAND: The difference between those protests and the thugs who only want to incite violence and destroy the city.

CARL STOKES, BALTIMORE CITY COUNCILMAN: Of course, it's not the right now to call our children thugs. These are children who have not been set aside, marginalized, who had not been engaged by us. No, we don't have to call them thugs.

ERIN BURNETT, CNN ANCHOR: How does that justify what they did? I mean, that's the sense of right and wrong. They know it's wrong to steal and burn down a CVS, and that old person's home. I mean, come on.

STOKES: Come on. So calling them thugs, and just call them (EXPLETIVE DELETED) call them (EXPLETIVE DELETED). No, we don't have to call them by names such as that.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: He said the thug word is just like the "N" word. Now, that anger reflects some of the problems facing the young people here in Baltimore.

My next guest knows the city well, and challenges many here face.

Kevin Shird grew up in West Baltimore. He's is a former drug dealer who traded the tough streets for a brand-new life in addition to being a community leader focused on substance abuse prevention. He's also the author of "Lessons of Redemption."

Kevin, thanks so much for being here.

KEVIN SHIRD, AUTHOR, LESSONS OF REDEMPTION: Good morning. I have a gift for you.

COSTELLO: Thank you so much. Awesome. I appreciate that. Thank you. Can we talk about the thug word? I was out last night and a young

lady gave me a tongue lashing for 40 minutes. She was very passionate, very angry. She had tears in her eyes and she said I should not have called the people that called down the CVS store idiots.

SHIRD: Right.

COSTELLO: Help me understand that.

SHIRD: I can see how that can be offensive. It was definitely criminals, no doubt about that, and I am not here to make excuse for that.

But when you have people that have been living in poverty for a long time and unemployment, and you have 50 percent unemployment rate in that area. We are talking about people that is struggling with substance abuse and mental health issues, so I am not here to make excuses.

But I don't think -- they're not idiots, they're human beings, but they also need help. But that was a criminal act as well.

COSTELLO: Well, when you have the Crips coming out and saying that those people shouldn't have looted the CVS store, I mean, that says, right?

SHIRD: It says a lot.

COSTELLO: But I also understand what this young woman was trying to say to me. She said, you know we're powerless, we don't have money and we live in a poverty-stricken area, probably don't have the best education, and we have no power and how else do we seize that power, right?

SHIRD: We need to continue focusing on education, poverty and unemployment. So, Washington talks about these things all the time, and for some reason that message has not reached Pennsylvania Avenue and North Avenue, and the unemployment rate at 50 percent, anywhere else in America those numbers would be absurd. So, again, I'm not here to make an excuse for bad behavior, because again looting and stealing, that's criminal, but we had the sad part about it is we had protesters that were focused on a real important issue like police brutality. So, it kind of overshadowed the more important issues.

COSTELLO: That's exactly right. You heard what that one lawmaker said, he said that the thug word is just like the "N" word.

SHIRD: It's not like the "N" word in my mind, but I think that's not an accurate description and it has been racialized across America, so I can see why people become offended by that.

COSTELLO: Even Jamal Bryant said that. He said, you know, that's like calling an African-American person the N word, if you call an African-American person a thug. Other people would say, you know, if you are committing violent criminal behavior, it doesn't matter what color you are, you are a thug.

SHIRD: I mean, these were young juveniles. In my mind I don't see a 16 or 17-year-old as a thug. I have seen thugs, and they don't look like thugs to me, right?

My experience in life has been a little more extreme than that. But, again, it was criminal behavior and it can't be justified.

We want to stay focused on the issue of police brutality and the Freddie Gray matter, because this really distracted us from the positive stuff that was really going on in the city. And that's a shame. But we really want to get back to that.

[09:25:00] That's the focus.

COSTELLO: Thanks so much for stopping by, and thank you so much for your book. Kevin Shird, thank you so much for joining us.

Still to come in the NEWSROOM: the calls for justice over the death of Freddie Gray getting louder. Up next, why we can learn new details about the controversial takedown in just a matter of days.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

COSTELLO: And good morning. I'm Carol Costello. Thank you so much for joining me. I'm live in Baltimore.

With all eyes on this city, residents are demanding answers over the death of Freddie Gray. On Friday, Baltimore police are expected to hand over a report into the investigation of Gray's death into the state attorneys office.

Now, it's unclear how much of that report will be made public, but one of the big questions is whether criminal charges will be filed against the officers involved.

Let's head to Los Angeles and talk more about this with criminal defense attorney, Brian Claypool.

God morning, Brian.

BRIAN CLAYPOOL, CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Hi, Carol.

COSTELLO: Oh, good. You can hear me, I was scared there for a second.

Thank you so much for joining me.

So, when the police turn over this report to prosecutors, take us through what happens next.

CLAYPOOL: Well, law enforcement investigates this death. They create an investigative file that includes witness statements, interviews, a review of surveillance video, medical forensics and they turn all of it over to the attorney general's office, and the attorney general can do one of two things, the A.G. can decide on its own to prosecute one or more police officers, or it can turn it over to a grand jury and allow the grand jury to render an indictment.