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NEW DAY SUNDAY
Should Baltimore Curfew Be Lifted?; People In Baltimore Rally Peacefully; Accused "Spies" Talk To CNN. Aired 6-6:30a ET
Aired May 3, 2015 - 06:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
CHRISTI PAUL, CNN ANCHOR: Overnight several arrests in Baltimore. People upset about the curfew. The question this morning is will there be one again tonight?
The family of another black man who died at the hands of police is calling for justice again. Eric Garner's family says they want something doing like what they see in Baltimore.
A developing story for you right now, numerous people arrested in North Korea including a New York student. We have a live report for you coming up.
Just want to wish you a good morning. Thank you for spending time with us here. I'm Christi Paul. My colleague, Victor Blackwell is live in Baltimore this morning, his hometown, by the way. Good morning, Victor.
VICTOR BLACKWELL, CNN ANCHOR: Good morning, Christi, my hometown, indeed. A lot of people are asking here will there be a curfew again tonight? People across the city want to know, especially business owners. Many are not happy that, once again, last night people were told to go home at 10:00 p.m. Listen.
BLACKWELL: There were lots of warnings from police driving by. Also from the cops in the helicopters saying go home now, you're in violation of this curfew. But the protesters some of them were arrested after refusing to obey that citywide curfew.
According to a CNN team, who were out with the protesters watching everything that was happening, at one point, police unleashed pepper spray as some demonstrators got out of hand and calls to drop that curfew is getting louder. Officials say the people need to be patient.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
COLONEL WILLIAM PALLOZZI, MARYLAND STATE POLICE: The issue of keeping the curfew in place is something that was our decision to make that, keep it that way, it was our policy that we set in place. We continue to support that. We just ask for patience as we move forward and continue to move in a safer direction for a safer city.
MAJOR GENERAL LINDA SINGH, MARYLAND NATIONAL GUARD: My focus is ensuring we keep everything in a safe manner and we, the military, will pull out in the same manner that we came in, which is very calm and I want to pull out very calm.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BLACKWELL: Well, the governor of Maryland, Larry Hogan, is calling for a statewide day of prayer and peace today. We'll talk more about that in a moment.
But while the majority of the protesters were peaceful and we have to say, most the day, there was a celebratory side of the protest, there were a few tense moment after the 10:00 p.m. curfew went into effect.
SARA SIDNER, CNN CORRESPONDENT: We are standing on the corner of West North and Pennsylvania. There have been several arrests overnight here alone and in other parts of the city. The curfew came at 10:00.
Some people, most people in this area decided to go home. There were a handful of people who decided not to and they were arrested. A bit of a dramatic scene a man arrested lying on the ground and dragged from one point to the other.
It also appeared that he had ingested perhaps some pepper spray and was having difficulties with that and they ended up taking him away after arresting him and putting him into an ambulance and taking him for medical attention.
Most of the other protesters who were arrested or those who decided to defy the curfew have been taken in without major incident. The last person we saw a young lady who says she was arrested down the street didn't want to get into the van.
That went on for a bit of time, but now they have taken her in as well. We know now that there are at least a half dozen arrests here and there were arrests in other parts of the city as well. Back to you guys.
BLACKWELL: So there are the residents, business leaders, but also Baltimore community leaders calling for an end to the curfew and to trust that people will keep the peace.
Let's bring in CNN law enforcement analyst, Tom Fuentes to talk about this. Tom, there are some people, and we have discussed this, who are here protesting what they call a police state, who are here to protest the curfew itself. Is the curfew doing more harm than good?
TOM FUENTES, CNN LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: I don't think so. I think the fact that you've had peace here and no more property damage and serious injury to anyone, including the police and firefighters, you know, the last several days, I think it's shown that it's worked and worked well considering.
Even yesterday, we had several thousand people out here demonstrating and having basically a rally right here in this park where we are standing. The fact there is a handful later on at 10:00 when the curfew goes on.
I think it was fairly calm. You're always going to have a handful no matter what the situation is. I think it was the best that could have been expected the last couple of nights.
BLACKWELL: We will expect an announcement on this decision if the curfew will go into effect again tonight.
[06:05:05] I want to talk about some reporting from "The Baltimore Sun" that really takes us into the Baltimore Police Department's investigation of Freddie Gray's death, they are reporting that 30 members from the department.
At least 30 members including members from the crime lab, homicide, the force investigation team, internal affairs, and the automobile crash team were involved in trying to determine how he suffered these injuries.
They had 145 tasks to get through. Is that what you would expected, or even a larger, a longer process?
FUENTES: No. The process will take longer, Victor. It's not completed and no one expected it to be completed, but you have an unprecedented number of resources being devoted to this.
I think the first day Commissioner Batts announced that he would have 50 detectives assigned to it. Then you have the county sheriff's office assigning dozens more.
And of course, the state's attorney's office has its own team of investigators. Usually these are retired police officers who have also investigative experience under the control of Mosby.
But the fact that you had these many officers and others, if you read the article, special technicians of many different kinds, doing mapping of the route taken, looking at the video cameras.
Mapping where the cameras are to go to those shop owners if they are not publicly owned cameras and say do you have something that matters to this investigation?
That's how they discovered video coverage later. They may still keep discovering other cameras they don't know about and, in some cases, the shop owners may not know what they have on video because, you know, their cameras are focused out on the street, some inside the shop. They might know if something happened in their shop.
BLACKWELL: Look in the background?
FUENTES: They wouldn't know the traffic pattern that's going by day after day. BLACKWELL: Yes, but you know what, Tom, I think there is one thing we have to talk about here is that the police set this deadline of May 1st to hand over their information to the state's attorney office. They did it a day early.
According to the report it was not complete and not answer the central question, how he got these injuries. How much did public pressure play into setting that deadline and doing it a day early, even though the question hadn't been answered?
FUENTES: I think no question, public pressure, the protest and even the riot that occurred last Monday night. I think all of those things played into wanting to issue some preliminary report.
And he did refer to it initially we are giving it a preliminary report to the prosecutor's office and not the definitive final. At the time even the medical examiner report had not gone over. But even there, there is going to be questions.
I think right through the prosecution there is going to be questions. Another issue is that don't forget, surgeons worked on Freddie Gray at the hospital and, in essence, his body became a crime scene but not for a week.
That means that could also affect -- they have to know from the surgeons and whatever video they took to see what damage did they find when they started their surgery because they may have inflicted more damage just by trying to save him.
BLACKWELL: So lots of questions still to be answered. We will talk throughout the morning, Tom. Thank you so much.
In just a few hours, Maryland Governor Larry Hogan and Archbishop William Lori will attend a church service asking for a statewide day of prayer and peace. It's been not just in Baltimore but across the state and the rally based on prayer and peace for this afternoon for city hall.
I want to talk about this with CNN correspondent, Rene Marsh. Rene, we know that there has been a considerable amount of conversation about bringing the community together. We have seen for the last couple of days, celebrations. We heard music. We saw dancing even in the streets. Today, a more sober approach to this event.
RENE MARSH, CNN AVIATION AND GOVERNMENT REGULATION CORRESPONDENT: Right. As you mentioned, you were talking about the curfew. That's a coin that people are very upset about. They want that to go away, the militarized state of Baltimore.
As some people have told me, they don't want to see that presence anymore and it's time for it to go. All that said, the tone today that we expect to see as thousands more are going to take to the streets to march in another rally today is a different tone, a very religious tone.
We know religious leaders are going to get together and they are going to be marching. Speaking about peace and speaking about getting the message through, but through religious means and that will happen today, Victor.
MARSH (voice-over): A large peaceful protest in downtown Baltimore with the feeling a small victory had been accomplished. Thousands gathered, pushing for change and applauding the prosecutor who brought the charges against six Baltimore police officers in Freddie Gray's death.
SENATOR CATHERINE PUGH (D), MARYLAND: Let's give a real shout-out to Marilyn Mosby who showed America how you go about this process and trust her! Trust her!
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We are not thugs. We want to be heard and, right now, I'm standing up here to be heard.
[06:10:03] MARSH: Kevin Moore, the man who helped spread the word of Gray's arrest nationwide with his amateur video, told CNN he was overcome with emotion after the charges were announced.
KEVIN MOORE, SHOT HOME VIDEO OF ARREST: I cried. My natural instinct was to cry. I couldn't believe it. It was surreal.
MARSH (on camera): Why did you cry?
MOORE: Because -- and it's a shame, right, that it took to many people to come to God -- to come together and unify because my friend Freddie died. I cried because I feel like I finally may have made a change in the world.
MARSH (voice-over): As the city works to recover from last week's riots, Mayor Stephanie Rawlings-Blake helped the church hand out food to people and having a hard time finding the basics because businesses were looted.
MAYOR STEPHANIE RAWLINGS-BLAKE, BALTIMORE: It's amazing the way the community has come together in our darkest days. I think there is a bright light that is shining through and that is the spirit of our community. People are really coming together in amazing ways and I just hope it continues as we heal our city and we work toward rebuilding.
MARSH: All right, so this rally that we have been talking about here, I was told by the Reverend Jamal Bryant, who is very much a part of this, he is expecting hundreds of clergy and thousands of people to take to the streets again today.
BLACKWELL: OK, and we, of course, will cover that live. Rene Marsh, thank you so much.
So the question now is what can we expect in the coming days and weeks for those six officers charged in the Freddie Gray case? We will find out.
Also this is pretty interesting, the new lengths that Baltimore officers are willing to go in order to protect themselves. CNN was there to see it and we are going to show you the video next.
BLACKWELL: It's 14 minutes after the hour now. It is set to be a big week for the six Baltimore officers charged in the death of Freddie Gray. This is coming as cops patrolling the streets are staying cautious in the new developments in this case.
CNN's Ryan Young was there as our cameras were rolling. Look at what they found.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
RYAN YOUNG, CNN CORRESPONDENT: The officers, obviously, dealing with a lot of people complaining about how they are treated, have decided to do use their own video equipment to film each person who is being arrested.
There's a gentleman there with a white hat on, it looks like from here, and he has a small hand camera and every time the officers get ready to load someone in the back of this van.
He takes a video picture it looks like of their face as he is backing up and he takes a full body shot and they are basically cataloging each person as they are being put in the van.
I'm sure they are doing this so they can show the custody and have fact that no one was injured as they are being put in the van.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BLACKWELL: So you see there that officers are taking extra precautions after the arrests and charges filed against those six officers.
We have got with us this morning, criminal defense attorney and HLN legal analyst, Joey Jackson. Joey, let's talk about this week ahead. What are we going to see as we move through the next few days?
JOEY JACKSON, HLN LEGAL ANALYST: I think what the attorneys want to do for the officers is they want to gather all of the information so that they could prepare the defense. I think the prosecution certainly still gathering information. I think the time line is going to be critical, Victor.
I think the release of the autopsy report ultimately in terms of the body. Any toxicology issues, of course, the defense attorneys are going to want to gather and I think you're going to see, you know, defense attorneys start making challenges on the information that is presented to the public. BLACKWELL: So if you were hired by one of these officers, what would the defense be? How would you craft it and where would you start?
JACKSON: It's interesting, Victor, because every one of the single officers is charged with different things. Now there is, obviously, consistency, the officers who went and tackled and got him initially, that false imprisonment charge and the driver who is charged with the second-degree murder.
So it really appears, Victor, that the state's attorney looked at the specific conduct of each and every officer to see what facts might justify what charges.
So if you're the attorney representing them, you want to know what conduct, if any, did your officer engage in. I think you're going to hear and see from the defense attorney that near presence, meaning merely being there in and of itself don't constitute a crime.
So it's going to be important for the prosecution to establish did they specifically, that is, the officers, neglect and know about the medical condition of Freddie Gray?
And, you know, if they didn't know about it, then, of course, the liability is less. But if they did, and ignored it, that's another store. The defense wants to know what my client's conduct was in each and every turn of the stop that they made when he was in that van.
BLACKWELL: OK, from the state's attorney office what is next for her and that investigation?
JACKSON: Well, you know that there are claims for her to recuse herself and calls for a special prosecutor to be appointed. I don't really see that. I know that there are concerns that there was a donation to your campaign that was represented by the Gray family.
That in of itself is not enough. The fact her husband is a councilman is not enough. I think she will stay on the case and continue to investigate.
Nothing precludes the defense team from engaging in their own independent investigation so that they will get and secure the information they need to defend their clients.
BLACKWELL: Yes, we have been telling people all week that this is the start of a process and could be a quite lengthy process.
JACKSON: It's big, Victor. Remember, charges now you have to go into the indictment phase and that has to be, you know, a grand jury has to decide, A, is there probable cause to believe that a crime was committed? And, B, that these officers committed it.
So I think once you see an indictment if there is an indictment and certainly it appears there is likely there will be, there will be a lot of challenges by the attorneys in terms of the information they gather and what their client's conduct did and does it constitute a crime. Certainly the prosecution believes it does. BLACKWELL: All right, Joey Jackson, thank you so much for helping us understand all of this. We will talk to Joey more in the next half hour what we can expect the next week and several months as this case continues.
Coming up, we will talk to Joey about the similarities also between the deaths of Eric Garner in New York and Freddie Gray, and whether those new calls to reopen the Garner case by his family will actually be heard -- Christi.
PAUL: All righty, it's good to know. Thank you so much, Victor. Great conversations there.
Listen, there is another big story that we are keeping an eye on for you this morning. Reports that North Korea has detained a New York University student and CNN gets exclusive access to two other men being held by Pyongyang right now. North Korea says they are spies. What the men are telling us here at CNN straight ahead.
PAUL: It's 23 minutes past the hour. We're so glad to have you with us. Here is a look at the other stories we are watching today.
First of all, a New York City officer was shot in the head last night. Official say Officer Brian Moore is in critical but stable condition this morning. He was allegedly shot by an individual that he was questioning. Officials say they do have that suspect in custody.
The death toll of last week's magnitude 7.8 earthquake in Nepal has increased to 7,056 and expected to go higher. More than 1,400 were injured according to officials, who warned that the chances of finding anymore survivors buried under the rubble at this point is, quote, "extremely slim."
The United Nations estimates more than 3 million people are in need of food assistance and many need it immediately. If you'd like to help, go to CNN.com/impact and thanks for checking that out.
A rare earthquake rattled Western Michigan this weekend. Yes, Michigan, thankfully the magnitude 4.2 quake didn't cause any serious damage. A local church pastor said he was delivering a sermon on helping the aid efforts for Nepal's massive earthquake when this tremor hit. It was strong enough to be felt in Ohio and Illinois. That's according to the "Chicago Tribune."
North Korea says it has detained a business student from New York University. Pyongyang accuses the 21-year-old South Korean and U.S. permanent resident of entering North Korea illegally from China.
Now CNN is getting exclusively access meanwhile to two other South Koreans jailed in North Korea right now. Pyongyang accuses them of being spies and they are talking to CNN. So we are going to have a live report from Pyongyang to let you know what they are saying in just a couple of minutes.
[06:25:10] But first, two men, both black, both die in the custody of police officers this morning. The family of Eric Garner is demanding justice after officers are charged in the death of Freddie Gray. Our CNN investigation is next. Stay close.
PAUL: Mortgage rates are inching up again this week. Here is your look.
BLACKWELL: Welcome back live in Baltimore. Overnight, police here made a handful of arrests after some demonstrators violated the citywide is your few and that curfew went into place as it has several nights this week at 10:00 p.m.
And a lot of people not happy that the curfew has not been lifted, they say that it is hurting their businesses, their jobs as well and, at one point, police you see in the video we are about to show you used pepper spray on a man.
He was being arrested here. He was dragged at one point but taken to a hospital for medical attention.
The question this morning, will there be another curfew tonight? We'll get an announcement about that probably some time mid afternoon.