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Legal View with Ashleigh Banfield

Two Georgia Deputies Caught On Video Violently Restraining Inmate; Zimmerman Involved In Violent Confrontation Again Yesterday; Tom Brady Sacked By The NFL Over Deflategate Controversy. Aired 12:30- 1p ET

Aired May 12, 2015 - 12:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[12:30:00] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

ASHLEIGH BANFIELD, CNN HOST: We got some new video just in to us of sheriffs, deputies in Chatham County, Georgia and they are violently restraining an inmate who had just come out of a restraint chair. I do want to give you a warning. This is pretty disturbing video but it's also very telling.

Two of the deputies in the video happen to be the same deputies who were recently fired for their part in the confrontation that led to the death of a 21-year-old man named Matthew Ajibade. Now, this is not Matthew.

Ajibade was arrested in January but this video is taken 23 days after the death of Ajibade and you can see this very violent confrontation that sheriffs and deputies taking that man down.

They went back for that inmate and according to the affiliate WSAV, they opened that door without telling a supervisor for violation. The confrontation turned violent. A third officer enters the scene, delivers a knee blow to the inmate's head. It's not protocol either.

A female deputy ended up being involved as well and she brought out her Taser. She had that Taser real close to him and the report said that that inmate was tased while he was in full restraint.

CNN Law Enforcement Analyst Cedric Alexander who is the President of the National Organization of Black Law Enforcement Executives with us live. And also with me is CNN commentator Mel Robbins.

So first to you Mel, I just want -- you've seen the video, you had a chance to look at it. I often start off by saying, "Let's remember folks, these guys are not in those circumstances because they were singing too loud in church. They are often violent. They are often difficult. They bite, they spit, they punch, they hurt even if they're in restraint." But with that said, is an officer allowed to use all that kind of force to try to restrain a bad guy?

MEL ROBBINS, CNN COMMENTATOR: Well, there is a justification for using force in certain situations and that, what we just saw on that video and there's more to that video, there's a second confrontation where that same officer that rackets the guy in the head with his knee does the exact same move to another guy who's doing nothing. [12:35:07] And so --

BANFIELD: Spitting or yelling or something now --

ROBBINS: He's spitting.

BANFIELD: Yeah.

ROBBINS: So here's the problem, in a correction facility it's very different than being a police officer on the street. You actually have a controlled environment. You also have background on the inmate so that you know exactly what they've done or been accused off. You now whether or not there's a mental health history or whether or not they're --

(CROSSTALK)

BANFIELD: You would hope you have, but this is intake. These guys have not been sitting in the cell for a long time.

ROBBINS: Yes, but they have complaints and in this particular situation, we're talking about a situation that didn't turn violent. We're seeing on videotape a situation that officers created using violence. And so, you don't see any, yeah, like you don't see anything happening with that inmate and yes...

BANFIELD: I do, I see him taking a shoulder to the bigger officer. Now, I see the bigger officer also, you know, like you said, gave him the rackets kick to the head with his knee. But Cedric Alexander, is there any circumstance for officers like that to use any means necessary with their body for instance if they're not holding a Taser, if they can't tase this guy and he is violent, can they knee kick him to the head, can they use their own bodies to stop him any way they can?

CEDRIC ALEXANDER, CNN LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: Well, you know, every agency and I'm quite sure and this agency as well too inside a correctional facility, you're going to have policies in which you're going to have to abide by even when it comes to take downs. There are such in this case as well too. But it's very hard for me because in some ways, we can clearly see what is going on. But yet in some ways we can not.

So without me being too speculative about this Ashleigh, I think one thing that's going to be critically important in this particular case considering the history of a previous case 23 days ago is going to be the outcome of the investigation. And I'm quite sure that is going to be conducted or is currently under investigation. Because I think in there, we're going to get more to the truth that is going to collaborate with that video and maybe some that will not.

But certainly it is not a video in which I would say the officers in some kind of way felt that they're in threat for their lives and they needed to go beyond what they would typically go beyond. But this clearly is a case that's going to require some more review considering his history. BANFIELD: Well, without question -- considering its question considering Matthew Ajibade is dead.

ALEXANDER: Right.

BANFIELD: And so this is, you know, 23 days later you got an evidence --

ALEXANDER: That's right.

BANFIELD: -- of guys who were, you know, let go. So I have to leave it there but we're going to continue to watch this case.

Mel, I know you were fascinated by the fact that the people who were watching, the administrators didn't seemed to be -- they were somewhat non-classify what they were witnessing and that's maybe something that will work itself into this case too.

Cedric Alexander as always, thank you.

ALEXANDER: Thank you.

BANFIELD: Mel, always good to see you.

ROBBINS: Thank you.

Coming up, a shot fired at one George Zimmerman. Yes, the George Zimmerman, the man who shot and killed Trayvon Martin. Lots of shattered glass, but Mr. Zimmerman survived and we have the 911 call. But wow, this makes a long list of incidents George Zimmerman has been involved in. We'll update you next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[12:41:22] BANFIELD: I think this goes without saying George Zimmerman seems to be a magnet for trouble.

Wherever he goes problem seem to follow him. And yesterday proof positive because Zimmerman was involved in a violent confrontation in Florida, yet again. But this time it wasn't Zimmerman who was pulling any triggers instead he was the one who was shot at and hurt.

Zimmerman was hit in the face with car glass and debris. He only suffered minor injuries. And moments ago the Lake Mary police gave an update on the investigation saying that charges for either men have not been ruled out.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BIANCA GILLETT, LAKE MARY POLICE SPOKESPERSON: And out detectives are working diligently to have a very thorough investigation that's in partial. And so they are doing it methodically. And that will take sometime.

And at this point any investigation they are not ready to say whether or not there are any or if there will be any charges filed. It's still an active investigation.

(Off-Mike)

GILLETT: The warrant has been issued, it's just has not been enacted. Again --

(Off-Mike)

GILLETT: If the detectives are just working in the amount of time that the best time that they can that will happen is (tune as) they're already to do that.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BANFIELD: Either of the men could be charged.

Earlier this morning part of the 911 call from a man who was at the scene of yesterday's shooting. That call was released to the public and some of the call was withheld for the investigation.

But here is some of it for you.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yeah, how can I help you sir?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yeah a guy just said he had to pull a gun on a guy. And now a guy right here just said he had to shoot at a guy through his window and wants the police to com.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: That he saw shoot someone out of his window?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Do what?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: OK. Say that again. He saw what?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He had to shoot at somebody.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Is he there with you right now? He's there with you right now, sir?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yeah, the guy who just said it, yeah he just said he had to shoot him.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: What business is that?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It's -- he kind of outside on the street. He's just standing out there.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: What kind of car is he driving?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He's driving an Infinity. He said he had to -- it was George Zimmerman.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BANFIELD: That sounds a little confusing. But I think you get the idea two guys, got one at it and a shot get fired.

I want to take a look back though for a moment if some of George Zimmerman legal troubles. And you're going to have to stay with me here, OK.

Let's start in February 2012, he fatally shoots Trayvon Martin. In July 2013 he's pulled over for speeding. In 2013 he is arrested in aggravated assault and domestic violence battery. September 2014 he threatens to kill a man during a road rage incident. January 2015 he's arrested on a domestic violence complaint. May 2015 he's involved in a shooting.

Now it's a -- it would be unfair to just leave you with that list because some of those things actually ended up being dropped some of those domestics ended being dropped and recanted et cetera.

And he cleared the route for some of them as well. But that's a pretty long list of stuff, just stuff.

I want to bring in our Legal Analyst Jeffrey Toobin and Mel Robbins.

It's a kind of thing where in a court of law you're not just allowed to bring up prior bad acts unless there's a pattern. But I'm not sure if that's a pattern or if that's just horrible luck. What do you think Mel?

MEL ROBBINS, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: What do I think?

BANFIELD: Yeah.

ROBBINS: I'm going to take my legal head off and tell what I really think.

BANFIELD: Go for it.

ROBBINS: -- which is, you know, he's either a criminal that got away with murder. And he continues to engage in criminal activity or he's a pots (ph) of the highest degree that is attracting a ton of trouble.

[12:45:06] And my personal opinion is, is that this guys is major trouble that he's instigating a lot of these instances. And I wouldn't be surprise if we see them bring some sort of charge that he was brandishing a weapon or that's he somehow instigated that.

BANFIELD: So, there is that claim that George had a weapon and that at the other shooter was afraid and shoot because of that. But then there's also history, this is not a one time event, it's not a one road rage incident. These are two guys that have been added and calling the police on each other and following each other and confronting each other as long. Is there any difference in the incident yesterday Jeffrey?

JEFFREY TOOBIN, CNN SENIOR LEGAL ANALYST: Well it might, you know, my only favorite person in whole controversy is the 911 operator.

It's like what.

BANFIELD: What.

TOOBIN: What did you say that he had to shot someone through there. I mean, I think to put it mildly these circumstances of what happened are unclear. And who did what to whom, and who started it.

You know, people should not be firing guns through car windows. I don't care who's on the other side, George Zimmerman or anyone else. So, you know, obviously George Zimmerman is a very troubled person, he's had a very troubled past. But this other guy should not be given some sort of free pass if, you know, just because George Zimmerman is a troubled guy. I mean the police need to figure out --

BANFIELD: He fired a weapon.

ROBBINS: -- attempted murder charges at him. I mean, seriously, if George Zimmerman is driving a car and if the facts bear out that he had no weapon and this guy has an axe to grind and he drives up next to him and fires at a car knowing full well.

BANFIELD: We do know George Zimmerman does carry weapons, I mean that's not unheard that there is a possibility.

ROBBINS: That doesn't mean that he shouted. It doesn't mean that he shouted.

TOOBIN: And he's not a convicted felon so he has the right to carry a weapon, and Florida has very loose rules on who can have a weapon. I think the situation is murky to say the least. But George Zimmerman as you said at the beginning is a magnet for trouble and this is not the last thing.

BANFIELD: Some have said that he's a magnet for trouble because of what he went through, that he was destroyed by the process of Trayvon case against him and others have said this is the guy he was going into that case. And unless you know him and you walk in those shoes I don't think we -- any of us should going to have that perfect --

TOOBIN: I certainly don't.

BANFIELD: Jeffrey, Mel thank you. I appreciate it.

Coming up next. Tom Brady, his hope for the flap on the wrist deflated. And the QB and the Patriots hit hard by the NFL. For tampering with football and they're not done fighting yet either. There's still so many questions. Coming up next.

(COMMECIAL BREAK)

[12:51:14] BANFIELD: Superstar quarterback, Tom Brady sacked, well kind of anyway. A little bit by the NFL. The league's hammer coming down hard on the Super Bowl MVP and his New England Patriots, handing out really unprecedented penalties for the deflategate controversy.

But the team is standing by their man. The owner, Robert Kraft, saying Brady "has our unconditional support." And how is this for an example of standing by your man. This is the Patriots' new profile on it's Twitter account, Brady can sure use the support right now. Look at that big old 12.

The four-time Super Bowl winner was suspended for the first four games of this upcoming season, and in a 16-game seasons, that's a pretty big sentence if you think about it. His team is fined $1 million, the highest in the history of the league. And worst, the Patriots are going to forfeit two draft picks including a first rounder next year. And in football talk, it's a big deal, on the surface, extremely harsh, harsh punishment.

But I want to bring in our sports panel, CNN's sports anchor, Rachel Nichols in Cleveland, and sports agent Leigh Steinberg who is live with us in California. So Rachel Nichols, given what deflategate ended up being and whether allegations were truly proven in the report that came out, how do you gauge this punishment? Thought on the money, too much, over compensation for not doing enough in other cases?

RACHEL NICHOLS, CNN SPORTS ANCHOR: Well, it follows exactly along league rules, Ashleigh, and that's kind of what you got to look at here. The standard of evidence for this kinds of integrity of the game investigations and issues is comparable to a civil court for preponderance of the evidence. 50 percent plus one.

So that's what the investigation was looking to show whether or not there was a preponderance of the evidence. That's why the language in Wells report was more probable than not. That was very specific and purposeful to meet the league standard. Once that league standard is met, once you have crossed that threshold of preponderance of the evidence, the punishments are very harsh. And they don't judge on how much more than 50 percent, you've crossed that standard. It's just whether you've crossed it or not.

They take integrity of the game very seriously in all professional sports, they feel like if you don't have that as a building block, what do you have as fans trusting the games that you are going to watch. So it doesn't surprise that once the Wells report said, "Hey, these are the guilty parties," and showed that standard of evidence, that the NFL came down big here. And they said two things, they said, A, you crossed our standard in terms of integrity of the game, and B, you did not cooperate with the investigation.

BANFIELD: You weren't helpful. Yeah, you weren't helpful.

NICHOLS: And that was big part of this. Ashleigh, the NFL doesn't have subpoena powers, that's a real important thing and especially your viewers on Legal View, they can't force anyone to tell them anything. The only thing they can really do is bully people --

(CROSSTALK)

BANFIELD: All right. You're a part of our club, you need to talk to us. So, Lee, on that same vein that Rachel just went, I want to read for you -- being a famous agent yourself, I want to read for your Brady's agent, what he released after this.

He called this punishment, "ridiculous". "The discipline is ridiculous and has no legitimate basis. The NFL lacks standards or protocols with respect to its handling of footballs prior to games, this is not the fault of Tom or the Patriots. We will appeal."

But Lee, do you think ultimately that a lot of these punishment for Tom Brady is exactly as Rachel just said, for his intransigence, for failing to turn over some of his devices and for not helping that matter?

[12:54:52] LEIGH STEINBERG, SPORTS AGENT: Had Tom Brady simply said back at Super Bowl time, I like to throw balls which are a little under inflated, I'm a competitor, I push the staff to give me that type of ball, if that broke some rule, I'm very sorry, this thing would have ended.

Instead, by being intransigent, they almost pushed and provoke the NFL into protecting the integrity of the game. But remember that the fans have confidence, spend money to go to games, watch on television, (inaudible) play Fantasy football is the thought that the games were played on a even playing field, same rules, same equipment. And what happens on the field is really the determinant. This issue hit a third rail of public opinion one just pressed, people were really outraged by the concept that the games might not be honest.

Appealing would be the worst last thing I would ever suggest to a client, because what happens is that Tom Brady's had a pristine reputation and a golden boy, Bob Krafts' a awesome owner. It's not like the commissioner wanted to do this, but every single time this issue's brought up, it's going to conflate Brady cheating, Brady cheating in every headlines. And it does more harm --

BANFIELD: So, I have a suggestion, Leigh. I say you're right. Yeah, don't go ahead and fight this or, you know, appeal. Sue Tom Brady, go ahead and sue in court because then you're going to be compelled to turnover all that icky discovery and all those devices and all those text.

Rachel last words to you real quick, I need to ask you about the two guys who got fired. What happened to standing by your man? They're little men?

NICHOLS: Yeah. Look, that's part of the domino here of people saying if the Patriots suspended these guys without pay, it seems like they may know - they did something wrong and then that kind of wrecks the rest of their case where they said they did nothing wrong. That's a lot of deposition (ph), we don't know that but there a lot of people around the league who say, "Look, they had to treat the Patriots the same way they would treat any on the other 32 teams, and this is what's going to happen if you cheat." This is a message to everyone.

BANFIELD: All right. Rachel Nichols, nice to see you my friend. Thanks for that. And Leigh, it's always good to see you, thanks for doing this.

STEINBERG: A pleasure.

BANFIELD: Appropriate both of you. Hey everyone, thanks for watching. Please stand by, my colleague and friend and Wolf Blitzer starts right after this break.

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