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Dzhokhar Tsarnaev Sentenced to Death. Aired 3:30-4p ET

Aired May 15, 2015 - 15:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[15:30:00] BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN HOST: We just got this other note, apparently ten jurors believe the mother here, it was the mother who facilitated the older brother's radicalization, Tamerlan Tsarnaev's radicalization. Your response to that, Jeff.

JEFFREY TOOBIN, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: You know, I don't really have a -- I don't think that's going to be a terribly relevant factor in the jury's consideration. This case wasn't really about the mother. This was really about the two brothers. And so, we now know the prosecution has convinced just about everyone that Tamerlan Tsarnaev, the older brother, did not unduly manipulate the younger brother, but the key fact there is almost. If there's one juror who thinks that Tamerlan manipulated him, then it's over.

BALDWIN: Let me jump in because I'm just being told he has been sentenced -- Dzhokhar Tsarnaev has been sentenced to death on some counts. I just want to be precise on this language. But not all of the 17 counts related to his role in the Boston bombing. So has been sentenced to death for some counts. Jeff Toobin, what does that mean?

TOOBIN: Well, it means the overwhelming likelihood is that he will die. That this case was very closely litigated and there will certainly be years. And I emphasize years, of appeals. And there is a chance that this death sentence will be overturned.

But in federal court, most people sentenced to death ultimately are executed. In this case, there certainly will be a very strong appeal on the ground that this trial should not have taken place in Boston, that the community was too traumatized. That case was appealed even before the trial began. And it was a 2-1 verdict in the appeals court. The appeals court took that argument very seriously. I expect that will be the main point of appeal.

But the important point to remember about appeals, especially in criminal cases, is they usually fail. And the overwhelming likelihood now is that young Mr. Tsarnaev will die of a lethal injection in Terre Haute, Indiana in sometime in the next few years.

BALDWIN: So this just in here. To the world watching, downtown Boston, we have just learned that Dzhokhar Tsarnaev will be put to death. The jury had to be unanimous. And on multiple counts, he will be sentenced to death on counts numbers four, five, nine, ten, 14, and 15.

Jeff Toobin, I'm being told, just a little color in the courtroom that Dzhokhar Tsarnaev has not reacted. He's not reacted whatsoever to this being read aloud. You're looking at live pictures. Police presence outside. Tremendous media presence, I'm sure. People there in Boston. And really, the world reacting.

I mean, this is the kind of story. I was there, I covered this for a month after those pressure cookers went off there on Boylston Street. It rocked this city to the core. It's an incredibly strong city, but it was horrendous. And so now the world has learned that he will be put to death.

Jeff Toobin, on the point of appeals -- because I was talking to Susan Candiotti earlier as she was referencing her coverage of Timothy McVeigh. And she's told me those appeals lasted four years. So for people who want to know when he will be put to death, to your point, it could take some time.

TOOBIN: Easily four years. Frankly, Tsarnaev has better claims on appeal than Timothy McVeigh did. I covered that trial. And there was -- remember, that trial was moved. That trial that was of course the Oklahoma City bomb, and it was moved to Denver because of the issue of pretrial publicity in Oklahoma City. And that was one of the precedents that Tsarnaev's lawyers argued so strenuously for a change of venue in this case.

So, you know, I don't think it is out of the question that this case could be overturned on appeal. But it is important to remember that most cases are not overturned on appeal. And the overwhelming likelihood at this point is that he will be put to death.

BALDWIN: Jeff Toobin, stay with me. I think at this moment, I want to put some pictures up on the screen as I know we're all looking at Dzhokhar Tsarnaev's face, but let's remember those lives lost on that day in April, April 15th, 2013. The first three. Krystle Campbell, the youngest Martin Richard, Lingzi Lu, and then some time later, Sean Collier, was same as police officer who was killed. All four victims from that tragic day in April in the city of Boston in 2013.

As we have learned that the man who committed these atrocities, a convicted terrorist, Dzhokhar Tsarnaev, will be put to death at some point, as Jeff Toobin was mentioning, in Terre Haute, Indiana presumably after a process of appeal.

I know we have folks in the courtroom. So as soon as we can get them on the phone in front of a camera, they will let us know the color inside the courtroom, the jury, those family members. I know Martin Richard's family was inside. I know the first person to arrive inside that courthouse was the police chief there in Watertown where that manhunt ensued in those paralyzing few days in the city of Boston where they ultimately found Dzhokhar Tsarnaev hiding out bloodied in that boat in that man's backyard. Again, Dzhokhar Tsarnaev will be put to death.

Jeff Toobin, as you're watching all of this sort of unfold, just at what point -- because so many people of course want to hear what the jury went through in the 14 and a half hours of deliberations. Might we hear from them immediately? [15:36:11] TOOBIN: It's up to them. They are not prisoners. They

are not under any legal obligation to keep secret the nature of their deliberations. Usually in a very intense experience like this, a high-profile trial, the jurors tend to discuss that issue with each other before they leave. They tend to say, how are we going to handle this?

Sometimes several jurors hold a sort of joint press conference. That is often done in these high-profile cases. But it's completely up to them. They don't have any legal obligation to keep their deliberations secret. And certainly if prior patterns repeat themselves, some jurors certainly will not want to discuss it publicly. But I expect that some will. And they can do it starting right now. Just in terms of the logistics and how this works, this is a very high-security courtroom. The judge almost certainly will want to go back to the jury room and thank the jurors for their service. When I say immediately, I mean in an hour or so. It's going to take -- it's just going to take a while to empty the courtroom. But at that point, there certainly is nothing stopping any of the jurors from talking publicly about how they reached their decision.

BALDWIN: I've been told that the judge has already polled every single one of those jurors, just making sure he or she agreed with the verdict that was being read. And I'm told that every single one of the jurors said yes.

I'm also being told just a little more color as we're all getting this moment by moment that there are survivors and family members of the victims and survivors sitting inside that courthouse as that verdict was being read. I'm told by some of our CNN producers and correspondents that they were dabbing tears from their eyes. I know that the youngest victim, Martin Richard's parents, Martin and Denise Richard, according to one eyewitness, sat there stoically.

We know as we were referencing a couple of times, and it's important to fold into this conversation, they did not want death. And they made that opinion very public in "the Boston Globe" recently, essentially saying as Jeff was alluding to, you know, the years and years potentially of the appeals process before Dzhokhar Tsarnaev is put to death would be excruciating for some of these families. And they quite honestly didn't want to be dragged through it. They didn't want to be dragged through that emotional day from two Aprils ago. So that was their opinion. But clearly not the opinion of those 14 jurors, seven men, seven women, who unanimously decided that Dzhokhar Tsarnaev, convicted terrorist, Dzhokhar Tsarnaev should be put to death.

Let me know, guys, if we have Mel Robbins with us. Because I would love to hear -- Mel Robbins, I'd love to hear from you as, you know, not only an attorney but the only Bostonian I have right now. Just, you know, you've been living there, talking to people. How do you think this city will react to this?

MEL ROBBINS, CNN COMMENTATOR/LEGAL ANALYST: Brooke, you know, I'm just going to talk for myself personally because I'm in a bit of a state of shock. It's never a good idea to predict the way that a jury's going to go, but so much has been written locally, so much has been talked about locally about the fact that so many people in Massachusetts are personally against the death penalty. And it didn't seem like it would be a likely result.

And so, when you read that verdict, I just took a deep breath, and the first thing that came to my mind were Martin Richard's family. And look, they're not the only people that were clearly impacted. There were three other families who had devastating losses. There were over 200 families who had family members that were injured. There was a still blown apart. I mean, a terrorist act right here during the beloved marathon.

But I just immediately felt this heaviness because they had -- if the Martin family having lost their 8-year-old, having had their daughter have both her legs blown off, having expressed such a profound opinion about the excruciating agony that they thought that appeals would be, I just felt a heaviness for that in that moment. And I truly hope, Brooke, that they're wrong about the presumption that it will be an awful, excruciating process as the appeals go forward. I hope that this doesn't mean they're dragged back in court. I hope they're wrong about that because it makes me really sad to think that this verdict, while it allows our city, our country, the rest of us to move on, that for some people that were just devastatingly affected by this, it actually means it's not over.

[15:41:13] BALDWIN: I wholeheartedly agree with you. We all -- I mean, let me just take a moment and wish peace on every single person who was touched and affected by the terrorism, by the atrocities on that day two Aprils ago there in Boylston Street.

Mel, stay with me. I want to ask you about a note just passed along from the judge. But I also first, I want to just read a statement. This is a statement just made by our attorney general Loretta Lynch. And here is what she said in response to this.

Dzhokhar Tsarnaev coldly and callously perpetrated a terrorist act that injured hundreds of Americans and ultimately took the lives of three individuals. Krystle Marie Campbell, a 29-year-old (INAUDIBLE), Lingzi Lu, a 23-year-old Boston University Graduate student from China, and Martin Richard, an 8-year-old boy from Dorchester, who was watching the marathon with his family just a few feet from the second bomb. In the aftermath of the attack, Tsarnaev and his brother murdered Sean Collier, a 27-year-old patrol officer on the MIT campus, extinguishing a life dedicated to family and service.

She goes on, we know all too well that no verdict can heal the souls of those who lost loved ones, nor the minds and bodies of those who suffered life-changing injuries from this cowardly attack, but the ultimate penalty is a fitting punishment for this horrific crime, and we hope the completion of this prosecution will bring some measure of closure to the victim s and their families.

She ends with this, we thank the jurors for their service, the people of Boston for their vigilance, resilience, and support, and the law enforcement community in Boston and throughout the country for their important work. That was the response just in from attorney general Loretta Lynch.

Mel, back to you. This is what we just learned from the judge. That the judge has ordered the names and the places where the jury members reside to be made public. So this judge is saying, yes, you can now talk about all of this with your family and your friends and members of the media. So we could soon learn what it was like to sit on this jury, Mel.

ROBBINS: I would just be fascinated. Because one of the things that I'm thinking about is that, you know, particularly in a trial like this, Brooke, where there are no cameras in the courtroom, you forget about the fact that this jury has really been, while they weren't sequestered, they were truly in isolation for, you know, months and months, just focused on this particular trial. And I would not be surprised if what we find is that it was actually the closing arguments that really tipped the scales of justice in the direction of a death sentence because the prosecution had such a masterful close and really drove home beyond a reasonable doubt the fact that Tsarnaev knew exactly what he was doing.

In fact, he stood behind that Martin Richard's family for minutes, knowing full well where he was before he placed that bomb. And they ended, Brooke, after, you know, this riveting testimony with images and videos. And so, we talk about the fact that these families have had to live through so much. Well, this jury relived over and over and over again the devastation, the horror, the terror, the murders that Tsarnaev inflicted on not only the city of Boston, but over 200 victims of his terrorist act.

And I think at the end of the day, it was the overwhelming just visual, visceral, detailed, awful evidence that they could not turn away from. And I really do hope some of them speak because I would love to hear what the experience was like.

[15:45:21] BALDWIN: As we wait potentially to hear them speak, could even be pretty immediate. You're looking at live pictures here just outside the federal courthouse. We know in cases like this, oftentimes we will hear from attorneys. So we're going to keep one eye on the screen there.

Again, if you're just joining us, this jury here for the convicted terrorist Dzhokhar Tsarnaev Boston marathon bombing case have decided he will receive death. Death to Dzhokhar Tsarnaev.

But there are so many people in this amazing city of Boston who are now reacting. I'm trying to get in touch with and text one of the survivors. I've interviewed many of them over the last two years. I know have Jarrod Clowery, on the phone with me, who survived that horrific day in April two years ago.

Jarrod, obviously just let me begin with your reaction to this verdict, sir.

JARROD CLOWERY, BOSTON BOMBING SURVIVOR (via phone): How you doing, Brooke? BALDWIN: I'm doing OK. I think the better question is how are you

doing, sir?

CLOWERY: I'm doing unbelievable. My day today, you know, over the last couple years has had to change. And you know, I'm happy and healthy, you know, doing things with my family and friends.

My reaction, I just, you know, I found out today. And my phone's been going off the hook. I don't follow that case at all. That's what I've done to bring closure, to not really pay attention. Out of sight, out of mind. But, you know, for all the victims and all the survivors of that day, whether it brings closure or not, you know, my family and my family, our hearts and our best wishes go out to all of them. And as far as I go personally, you know, it's a tough job (INAUDIBLE). And I'm just glad I didn't have to do it and have to go through that. But I stand behind what the, you know, jury and the judge and everybody involved, I stand behind their verdict.

BALDWIN: So, and we're looking at a picture of you, I presume, in the days after the bombs went off with, you know, your legs wrapped up here. So you believe putting this terrorist to death is the just punishment.

CLOWERY: Again, not my job. I'm a citizen of the United States. So you know, I stand behind our legal system 100 percent. You know, if I was in that position, you know, I'd have to look at the evidence and look at everything myself and try to be objective, you know. I'm not the right person to ask what I believe or don't believe. I just, you know, it's not my area of expertise.

BALDWIN: I can't imagine what the last two years have been like for you, but as someone who survived it, we just wanted to hear directly from you to see how you were reacting to this.

But let me move on and just ask about you. I know you mentioned off the top that you've sort of put all this to the side and you haven't been paying attention to this trial. You know, I love Boston. And it's been incredible to watch that the healing process and how this has actually brought so many of you together. Can you talk to me a little bit about that, this community that's been formed in the wake of something so horrible and how are you doing?

CLOWERY: You are trying to get me to cry, aren't you, Brooke?

BALDWIN: I'm not. I'm not. I promise, I'm not.

CLOWERY: If I go back in my memories, you know, the friends who support, you know, new friend and support I made, you know, whether victims or (INAUDIBLE) at the hospital, so many people over there I've made lifelong friends. And, you know, and then just the millions of people that I've never even met before that have supported everyone that was involved in this. It's just -- it's really amazing.

So the transformation, you know, some things get pulled away from you and your life goes upside down in some ways, but you try not to dwell on that and you dwell on the positive and focus on moving forward and stuff like that. I've always done that in my life prior to that day.

And you know, no matter how hard it gets, it's going to get better. And you know, just by not watching it because I think you were mentioning when I was on hold there, you know, when you watch it, it goes over and over and over again. And realistically, the bomb was one second of evil, and it was a despicable act. But on the other side of it, it's followed by endless seconds of good. You know, all the people that rallied together, all the people of Boston, the country, and the world.

And I think, as survivors and victims', you get to see more of the good than just gets aired on the news because, you know, it's always the bomb going off and what they did.

[15:50:20] BALDWIN: Trying to get me to cry now Jerrod Clowery, listening to you.

CLOWERY: If that makes any sense.

BALDWIN: It makes sense to me, only at someone who has talked to so many of you and understands that the one second of evil and that is why we wanted to talk to you on TV today as a survivor to just, you know, ask about how you all have sort of seemed to have conquered that horrible moment two years ago.

Jerrod, I want you to listen, because I'm now just getting a statement from a witness inside the courthouse, and I know haven't been paying attention to this but I do want your reaction. We are going to read this together. I'm looking at this for the first time here. This is according to a witness in court. And I'm quoting it now. "As the marshals step forward to take Dzhokhar Tsarnaev away, he smiles raillery and makes an odd gesture. His index fingers are extended at waist level, it was like a gunslinger's two-pistol salute." Your reaction?

(LAUGHTER)

CLOWERY: I mean, it's comical, really. You painted a pretty good picture there. How about this -- you know, all the 99 percent of good people and I believe 99 percent of us are truly good, and I don't think any of us would trade places with him. So if that's -- if that's his, you know, walk-away salute or whatever, it's comical.

I'm doing great things with my family and friends, and I enjoy every day of my life as do a lot of citizens of this country. So good luck to him. Know? I don't know. Good luck, if that's what you want to do.

BALDWIN: I want to end his conversation not talking about him but talking about you. Before I let you get off this phone, Jerrod, tell me a little more about you.

CLOWERY: When I was younger, actually, I'll just tell you what's going on now moving forward. When I was younger I was a professional pool player, then I was a cop, because I had a son. And after the bombing I decided I'm going back to pool. And I recently just got done filming. It's going to air on Tru-TV May 22nd at 9:00 p.m. It's called "the Hustlers." And we did a reality show about, you know, professional pool and gambling and pool. It's going to air next Friday.

BALDWIN: Look at you. There you go, Jerrod Clowery. Best of luck to you. Thank you so much for jumping on the phone. I really appreciate it. Nice to meet you.

CLOWERY: Thank you, Brooke. Nice meeting you.

BALDWIN: Thank you. My best to you.

And that is just one survivor of that day in Boston two years ago who found this gesture from Dzhokhar Tsarnaev comical and wishes his luck. Luck, as he heads towards the death penalty.

Deborah Feyerick is with me no. Deborah Feyerick is our correspondent who has been covering this from the very beginning, now outside that courthouse.

Deborah, fill me in.

DEBORAH FEYERICK, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, Brooke, I can tell you, I want to tell you about the mood in that courtroom.

It was silent, and even as all the different sections were read, the aggravating factors, the statutory factors, sending up to the mitigating factors and there were some interesting revelations there. But once they got to the sentencing, and it was unanimous death on some of the counts, it was quieter than I'd ever, ever heard it before. And once the judge thanked everybody and the jury left that courtroom for the final time, Dzhokhar Tsarnaev stood up, his lawyer (INAUDIBLE) Conrad sort of squeezed his arm. And we walked outside. There were a number of victims and relatives of the victim whose were outside.

A lot of law enforcement officials. The head of Boston's FBI bureau here. Also the U.S. attorney. It was quiet. There was no sense of celebration. There was no sense of sort of jubilation or closure. It was an enormous sense of gravitas that this man was sentenced to death by a jury in Boston, where polls show that most people don't favor the death penalty.

Martin Richard, the youngest victim, his parents were also in that courtroom, Brooke. They didn't show any visible signs. They looked very stoic. They had written a letter saying they didn't want the death penalty because they didn't want Dzhokhar Tsarnaev to remain the focus of attention. It was so heavy in that court, even after the verdict was read. Everybody knew exactly the implications now that he's been sentenced to death on some of the counts, Brooke.

[15:54:58] BALDWIN: Deborah, stay with me, because I have more for you. But let me just throw something up on the screen as we're hearing now from different members of the surviving community. We just ahead from Jerrod Clowery. I want to show a tweet. This is from Adrian (INAUDIBLE). She the ballerina and a survivor. And she tweeted, my heart is with our entire survivor community. I am

thrilled with the verdict. #Bostonstrong, #Bostonsafer.

Just one of many voices I'm sure we will be hearing from on CNN in the ensuing hours here in the wake of this verdict for the fate of convicted terrorist Dzhokhar Tsarnaev.

Deborah, what about with these jurors? As these jurors were in this room. Can you just even lay of the land inside this courthouse. How close are they to Dzhokhar Tsarnaev, and did you notice if any of them even tried to look at him, when this verdict was being read or not at all?

FEYERICK: Well, most of the jurors were looking at the clerk, who was reading out the verdict forum and their findings in the case. There was one young man who sat in the front row. He was sort of looking around the courtroom, looking back at the media section at officials who were packing the pews there. And -- but otherwise, it was only when Tsarnaev's lawyers asked the jurors to be polled that the jury stood and when asked if that was their verdict, they seemed to look in Dzhokhar Tsarnaev's direction, each of them saying, yes, yes, yes, yes. Very quiet. Very somber.

I did notice that at least four were actually dressed in black which is not something I had noticed previously. But it just -- even the victims. Some of them dabbed tears from their eyes. Whether it was a sense of release, whether, that this was over. It just -- it's one of those things where, you know, your brain -- my brain -- is still really trying to process just all the different moving parts, because we did see some of the family members hugging each other outside of the courtroom. We did see some official sort of shaking hands with one another, but nobody was speaking. Nobody was really speaking. It was almost as if the sentence itself told you everything you need to know.

BALDWIN: Cannot imagine the feeling inside of that courtroom.

Deborah Feyerick, thank you so much for the color.

Let me just read you something before we go to Paul Callan. We also have a statement now from Marty Walsh. He is the mayor of Boston. He says this. I want to thank the jurors and judiciary for their service to our community and our country. I hope this verdict provide as small amount of closure to survivors, the families and all impacted by the violent and tragic event surrounding the 2013 Boston marathon. We will forever remember and honor those who lost their lives and affected by the senseless act of violence in our city. Today more than ever, we know that Boston is a city of hope, strength and resilience that can overcome any challenge. It was Mayor Menino who was mayor during -- during that entire ordeal there in Boston and was pretty phenomenal throughout.

Paul Callan to you. Just finally, in my remaining two minutes I have, you have some statistics as far as death penalty and in federal cases. What can you share? PAUL CALLAN, CNN LEGAL CONTRIBUTOR: It's very interesting. You know,

there was a moratorium on the death penalty from 1972 to its reinstatement in 1988 in the United States on the federal level. Since that time, since 1988, only three individuals have been sentenced to death, the last one being in the year 2003. And in cases where juries have deliberated in federal death penalty cases, approximately 34 percent of the time the jury return, the death penalty. So it's highly unusual to get the death penalty. And it's only been imposed by the federal government three times since 1988.

BALDWIN: All right. Paul Callan, thank you very much.

Thanks to everyone who has jumped in as part of this breaking news coverage as we have learned in the last hour that the convicted terrorist Dzhokhar Tsarnaev will be put to death. This has been a case in which the jury deliberated for 14.5 hours. This was day three, and I am sure we will hear in the ensuing hours. Make sure you stay here on CNN for special coverage of the reaction to death, death here for a man a convicted terrorist.

Before I let you go, I just -- we want to continue hearing from the survivor community in the city of Boston. And so, here is one more tweet. This is from Sydney Corcoran. She suffered shrapnel wounds. Her mother lost both her legs and she just put this out there.

My mother and I think that now he will go away and we will be able to move on. Justice. In his own words, an eye for an eye. Sydney Corcoran, one of the survivors.

I'm Brooke Baldwin. Thank you for being with me here today on CNN. Stay right here. Special live coverage continues with Jake Tapper. "The LEAD" starts now.

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