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Texas Officials Update on Flood Response; Iraqis Showing No Will to Fight?; Soldier's View Inside the Fall of Ramadi; Violence Surges in Baltimore; DOJ Finds Criminal Wrongdoing in 100 Deaths; Aired 10-10:30a ET

Aired May 25, 2015 - 10:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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[10:00:31]

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UNIDENTIFIED MALE: My god. Stop, stop, stop. He needs to get out.

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CAROL COSTELLO, CNN ANCHOR: Happening now in the NEWSROOM, dangerous flooding in Texas and Oklahoma. Three people killed. Eight still missing. And the storms aren't over yet. Also --

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ASH CARTER, DEFENSE SECRETARY: The Iraqi forces just showed no will to fight. They were not outnumbered.

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COSTELLO: Does the United States need to change its strategy on the ground in Iraq?

Plus President Obama speaks next hour at Arlington National Cemetery praising our men and women in uniform who gave their lives for our country.

Thanks for watching this Memorial Day. Let's talk. Live in the CNN NEWSROOM.

And good morning. I'm Carol Costello. Thank you so much for joining me. Any moment we're expecting a live press conference to begin from flood ravaged Texas. Deadly flash flooding killing three people over the weekend in Texas and in Oklahoma. Several others are missing and the threat is not over yet. As the waters subside, scattered debris remains. More than 350 homes swept away in raging rapids. SUVs tumbling like toys. The driver of this car escaping to safety just before it plunged underwater. Heavy rains could strike again today.

Chad Myers is in Atlanta tracking the threat.

Good morning. CHAD MYERS, AMS METEOROLOGIST: Good morning, Carol. The areas that

have seen so much rain will see more again today. And I'm talking about 10 to 15 inches of rainfall just in the past few days. In the -- over the month now we are breaking records for the entire month. We are breaking records for any month of any year that have records have been kept track.

Now here we go. Dallas, you're going to see more rain. Down here toward San Antonio, toward San Marcos. This is the area that saw so much rain and all the flooding yesterday. And there's the rain across the Red River over the past few days. And this is the area that's going to see more today. Flood watches and warnings are already in effect. We are going to see potential for tornadoes today like we could use any of that. We will see more flooding for sure-- Carol.

COSTELLO: All right. Chad, I want to take our viewers to Austin, Texas, now. Near Austin, Texas, I should say. This is Kharley Smith, the Emergency -- the Emergency Management coordinator. We understand 12 people are missing now. Let's listen.

KHARLEY SMITH, HAYS COUNTY, TEXAS EMERGENCY MANAGEMENT COORDINATOR: Information from reporting parties to make sure that the residents in -- I'm sorry, are missing or are not missing. Again I want to urge anyone that was in the area and self-evacuated or left and stayed with a friend to call our missing person reporting line. That's 393 -- I'm sorry, 512-393-7725. Again it's 512-393-7725. That is to report that you know someone that is missing or you yourself were in the Wimberley area or Saint Marcos area and left and are safe.

We are trying to gather as much information as we can but we have confirmed a person count of 12 that we are actively searching for as missing individuals. On that safety note, we are expecting rain today. We are receiving information that there are small groups of citizens that are mobilizing and going for searches along the river themselves. I want to remind the public that we do have resources that are designated to those activities.

We have local resources, regional and state assets that are actively doing search and rescues. It is not safe for the general public to go down and do those rescue or search operations themselves. We have impending weather concerns. We're expecting a substantial amount of rain later today that will complicate the situation and add further danger for our residents and anyone that is trying to be down in that environment.

So please allow the trained professionals to conduct the search and rescue exercises and we know that our citizens and community members are wanting to help and we promise we will allow that to happen as soon as we feel that it's safe in that area for those to go down and help the residents that were affected.

Judge Corporal Jackson?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Good morning. If people are wanting to know what they can do, the Red Cross is asking for volunteers. The Red Cross is in charge of feeding and taking care of our people who are in shelters. They are trying to tend to the physical needs of those people. If you have time and wish to help especially on this Memorial Day when we remember those who have given all for all of us.

[10:05:25] The press is here today because there's a lot happening. We need people who will be here for the long haul after the press has gone home. After everybody thinks it's over. I would personally like to ask you as a historian, amateur historian, that is, if you will maintain photographs of what you've seen --

COSTELLO: All right. We're going to step away from this news conference which, as you heard, 12 still missing in floodwaters there in Austin, Texas, and authorities there asking people to be careful and not attempt to rescue people themselves.

All right, in other news this morning, let's head overseas. Iran is wading into a squabble between the U.S. and its ally, Iraq, for some blistering criticism from the U.S. Defense secretary. In his first comments since ISIS militants captured the Iraqi town of Ramadi, Ash Carter lays the blame on the Iraqi forces who he says ran from the fight.

This is part of his exclusive interview with CNN.

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CARTER: The Iraqi forces just showed no will to fight. They were not outnumbered. In fact, they vastly outnumbered the opposing force. And yet they failed to fight. They withdrew from the site. And that says, to me, and I think to most of us, that we have an issue with the will of the Iraqis.

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COSTELLO: We're covering all angles of this breathtaking indictment of Iraq's commitment.

CNN's Arwa Damon is in Baghdad but let's begin with White House correspondent Jim Acosta.

Good morning, Jim.

JIM ACOSTA, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Carol. As President Obama is set to remember the nation's fallen soldiers on this Memorial Day, his plan for dealing with ISIS is coming under increasing scrutiny. Asked about Defense Secretary Ash Carter's very stunning and candid comments, a White House official pointed out that the president also said just last week that the Iraqis have to fight for their own security and that the U.S. cannot do that for them.

We should point out not only are Republicans criticizing the president's strategy, a few Democrats have also said the White House needs to rethink its approach. House Democrat Tulsi Gabbard, who is also an Iraq war veteran, is echoing Secretary Carter's concern that the Iraqis just don't have the will to fight. She and Illinois Republican Congressman Adam Kinzinger were both on CNN's "STATE OF THE UNION" yesterday debating whether or not more U.S. troops need to be sent in to battle ISIS. Here's what they had to say.

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REP. TULSI GABBARD (D), HAWAII: After the United States pulled out, you saw how these Iraqi Security Forces lasted. They cut and ran. They cut and ran and dropped their weapons when they're faced with their first real battle with ISIS. So the issue here is not about how many U.S. troops can be sent to train these Iraqi Security Forces because you can't train into someone the will to fight.

REP. ADAM KINZINGER (R), ILLINOIS: Every day that goes by the cost of liberating Iraq or the cost of defeating this cancer is only going to increase. So I think we have to do the force that's proportionate and frankly the violence proportionate necessary to push back ISIS.

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ACOSTA: And keep in mind relying on those Iraqi forces on the ground while the U.S. provides airpower support has been a key part of the president's plan. But, Carol, after you heard Secretary Carter make those comments to our Pentagon correspondent, Barbara Starr, it's really sparked a debate, I think, here in Washington that we're going to hear play out all week long about whether or not the Iraqi Security Forces there are worth investing anymore into given their record so far.

And we'll hear from the president later on this morning. He'll be laying a wreath at the Tomb of the Unknown Soldier to mark this Memorial Day. I don't think he's going to weigh in obviously on what Secretary Carter had to say but he may make some comments about the battle against ISIS and some of the sacrifices obviously that have been paid by our troops overseas -- Carol.

COSTELLO: Yes. And the president's comments coming in the 11:00 a.m. Eastern hour of NEWSROOM. Thanks so much. Jim Acosta reporting live from Washington.

So let's get the view from Baghdad now. CNN's Arwa Damon is there.

Tell us more, Arwa.

ARWA DAMON, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Hi, Carol. Well, we did hear Iraq's prime minister in an interview with the BBC expressing his surprise at Carter's comments, saying that he must have somehow been misinformed that Ramadi was back in government hands in just a few days. Iran also lashing out. General Qasem Soleimani, the head of the Quds Force who himself has spent time fighting in Iraq, advising the Iranian-backed Shia militias in Iraq, saying it was in fact the U.S. that has no will to fight ISIS, saying that America is doing nothing and adding today nobody is confronting ISIS properly except Iran, even the countries that Iran is supporting.

[10:10:08] Now we did meet with an Iraqi soldier whose brigade was among the last to withdraw from Ramadi. His account and the videos we saw providing some insight into what went wrong.

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DAMON (voice-over): The chaotic final moments captured on a cell phone.

"Come on, fight," a voice shouts. This one of the last firefights with ISIS before Ramadi fell. A body is seen in the dirt behind one of the berms used for cover. Asa'ad al-Yassiri who gave us the videos was one of the soldiers there, wounded in that final battle.

"There were three IEDs that took out two Humvees and killed five. Then they came at us with two bulldozers rigged with explosives," he remembers. His contingent, he says, numbered around 140, spread out in smaller units along the vast terrain west of Ramadi.

Al-Yassiri was in this armored personnel carrier reloading ammunition. One soldier calls for a heavier weapon.

A warning that ISIS is approaching from another direction as well.

"Then they came at us with big gun trucks surrounding us from four directions. There should have been a force to our rear but they weren't there," al-Yassiri says. His commander radios for air support. Moments later cries of, "no ammunition, no ammunition." And the unit receives orders to withdraw.

Al-Yassiri is he's bitter and angry. Though wounded, he wanted to keep fighting. Just two weeks before the fall of Ramadi, he says, his unit captured an ISIS position, killing six, he claims. Two corpses seen torched in this video. Another seven, he says, were detained. Four of them foreigners.

Under interrogation, a captured ISIS fighter describes their surveillance and bold tactics. Al-Yassiri recalled the fighters saying, "We flash a light at the tower. We know that there are only 28 soldiers and in five-hour rotations, and that there is a lack of ammunition. If the soldiers don't fire at us, then we crawl and plant a bomb."

Al-Yassiri bristles at the accusation that Iraqi soldiers don't have the will to fight. He wants to quit the army and join the militias. "The failure is with the military higher ups," he says, who gave orders to retreat and allowed supply lines to fail and the frontlines to collapse.

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DAMON: And Carol, in an attempt to try to recapture Ramadi, the Iraqi government has mass forces along that city's eastern front. Quite a patchwork of forces, though. A combination of military police, Iranian backed Shia paramilitary units, as well as using the Sunni tribes in defensive positions.

COSTELLO: All right. Arwa Damon reporting live from Baghdad. Rain and lightning. Thank you so much.

And on this Memorial Day, a nation pauses to honor the sacrifices of those who served in the U.S. military. Right now in Washington a day of remembrance and reflection begins to unfold. Next hour President Obama honors the war dead at Arlington National Cemetery.

I'll be right back.

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COSTELLO: In Baltimore, a shocking surge of violence as the police commissioner says his city and his department are both at a time of uncertainty. The "Baltimore Sun" reporting that 33 people have been killed so far this month. That includes six were shot dead over Memorial Day holiday weekend. Now this is the first time the city has seen 30 homicides in one month in nearly eight years.

Tom Fuentes is a CNN law enforcement analyst and former FBI assistant director. He joins me now to talk more about this.

Good morning, Tom.

TOM FUENTES, CNN LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: Good morning, Carol.

COSTELLO: So do you think that the surge in the number of homicides in the city of Baltimore is directly tied to the protests over Freddie Gray's death?

FUENTES: No, I think it's directly tied to the police activities since the protest of Freddie Gray's death and since their perception that the city, the head of the police, the upper echelon of the police and the state's attorney's office will not back them when they make difficult choices on the street to try to take the guns off, to try to go against the aggressive people that are killing others.

So I think that -- I think the cause and effect here is very clear of why the police are out there in the first place, why they are aggressive in the first place, what happens if they aren't aggressive. And this is the result.

COSTELLO: So you say the -- you say the police just aren't sitting back and doing nothing because they're angry at the system. There are valid reasons why the police aren't making more arrests these days.

FUENTES: Absolutely. I mean, for the officers in the Freddie Gray case, you look at it, if a subject runs, should you chase after him because if you tackle him, you know, it's going to be on the sidewalk or on pavement. You know, even NFL players wear padding before they get tackled on grass. So bad things can happen just in trying to take somebody into custody.

If somebody resists arrest and they fall down and hit their head, you murdered them. If you pepper spray somebody, they might have asthma or some other medical condition, choke to death, you killed them. So the police are looking at these, you know, some of these judgments calls that they have to make in a split second are very difficult and if the net result for an officer is going to be facing 10 years in prison and being fired from their career, that's pretty severe if -- you know, if things don't go just so.

COSTELLO: So what should the police commissioner do?

FUENTES: Well, I think the police commissioner and the leaders of Baltimore and leaders across this country need to create a more defined set of rules of engagement that this is how you should behave and make it clear. And if the officers follow that, that they'll be backed up and protected from the difficulty of doing it.

But, you know, the police profession, what's difficult here is the narrative that goes out telling people to resist, to run, to wrestle with police, to engage in 100-mile-per-hour high-speed chases, because you don't feel like being stopped and being arrested by a police officer, the more that happens, bad things happen.

[10:20:17] And every street cop knows if you're in a situation where you have to physically put your hands on another human being, bad things can happen to that person or to you for that matter. And it's a dangerous profession. And the simple answer in many of these cases would be comply. Surrender. Go along with the police. If you are under arrest, you're under arrest.

We shouldn't be expecting our police officers to be Olympic wrestlers, Harvard debaters, track stars, NASCAR drivers on the streets of a city. That's asking too much of our police.

COSTELLO: So you're saying there was no problem at all between the community and in police departments across the nation where -- are we overstating this?

FUENTES: No. I'm not saying there is no problem, I'm saying there is a problem, but the other hand, we're going to have to recognize which police practices work. If you take New York City, for example, with almost 2,500 murders a year and they get that rate down to under 300, how did they get that down? You know. And several administrations in New York will say it was due to stop and frisk.

Well, community hates stop and frisk, yet it helps keep the community safe. And I'd like to add, I don't know if the whole community thinks that it's a bad practice. Some other people who live in these communities that actually would like to be safer on a daily basis and when you see the homicide rate in Baltimore, for example, if New York had the same homicide rate, they'd be looking at over 3,000 murders a year compared to now where it's under 300.

So, you know, there are consequences to overly severe policing, let's say, overly aggressive policing. But there's consequences to going too far the other way and telling the police we want you to be kinder and gentler. We don't want you putting hands on people. We don't want you running after them. We don't want you chasing them or shooting at them.

And there's an element of our society that all the community policing in the world is not going to address, and that's the young men on the streets of Baltimore or New York or other cities who are gunning down their fellow citizens in those communities. And that's the problem. How do you stop that element from pulling the trigger and killing their fellow citizens?

COSTELLO: All right. Tom Fuentes, thanks for your insight as usual. I appreciate it.

Still to come in the NEWSROOM, the government is reportedly close to bringing a criminal case against General Motors over its faulty ignition switches.

Alison Kosik is here.

ALISON KOSIK, CNN BUSINESS CORRESPONDENT: Carol, those criminal charges could be measured by the billions of dollars. I'm going to have details on the potentially record-breaking fine.

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[10:26:24] COSTELLO: More trouble for General Motors. A "The New York Times" report says the Justice Department has identified criminal wrongdoing by GM in at least 100 deaths tied to that ignition switch defect.

Alison Kosik is here to tell us more about this. Really, criminal charges?

KOSIK: Criminal charges. And let me just say this. We did reach out to the Department of Justice and to General Motors. Not really getting much comment except a little bit from GM saying that, we, quote, "are cooperating on all requests. We are unable to comment on the status of the investigation, including the timing."

So this latest news is coming out from "The New York Times" basically saying that the Department of Justice has identified criminal wrongdoing in GM failing to disclose a defect in those ignition switches in those vehicles. What does that mean? It means that, for one, according to "New York Times," former employees are under investigation and could face criminal charges, which means, yes, people could be arrested. We could see some of these former employees be handcuffed. This certainly could be a company that becomes --

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COSTELLO: And have a trial and go to jail?

KOSIK: Possibly. And you know, when you're arrested, you go through the -- you know, you go through the justice system. So GM could really wind up being the poster child on how not to handle a defect in your vehicles. You know, what sort of took the cake before GM was -- excuse me, Toyota, which paid $1.2 billion penalty for its unintended acceleration in their vehicles. That was actually a record fine.

But now what "The New York Times" is sort of surmising in its article is that GM could be fined even more than that. And also we could see actual people arrested. Keep in mind --

COSTELLO: Let's center on those people for just a second. Like are they the engineers? Are they -- I mean, how high up would it go? To whoever was heading GM at the time?

KOSIK: That's a good question. Some of them are engineers.

COSTELLO: Because I doubt it.

KOSIK: Well, some of them are engineers. We don't know exactly their names. Their names weren't released. But once again, this really could put a face not just obviously the faces of the victims that we've seen but a face on the alleged criminals who's responsible exactly. It's sort of holding people accountable which so many people have wanted to see with General Motors.

COSTELLO: Alison Kosik, many thanks. I appreciate it.

Still to come in the NEWSROOM, the allies plan to defeat ISIS and the political campaigns to win the White House. How the 2016 election could affect military strategy now?

In the meantime, this is a wreath laying ceremony in Kabul in Afghanistan, in memory of the American troops who've lost their lives there. I'll be right back.

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