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Former Governor George Pataki Is Running for President in 2016; New Witness in the Natalee Holloway Case. Aired 3:30p-4:00p ET.

Aired May 28, 2015 - 15:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


[15:34:00] BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN HOST: Just past the bottom of the hour. You're watching CNN. I'm Brooke Baldwin.

Another day, another Republican joining the 2016 presidential race. Today it was former governor George Pataki.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GEORGE PATAKI (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I announce I'm a candidate for the Republican nomination for president of the United States.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: We have heard this before now from seven other people. The three-time governor is joining a very crowded and tight field. Based upon the latest polling out of Quinnipiac University, you can say there are, men, all these faces of five leaders, or I guess, you know, glass half full, half empty. You could also say, there are no leaders. Five candidates all tied for first, 10 percent of Republican vote.

By the way, Pataki was asked about the poll and he had less than one percent of support thus far. Obviously this is very early. So what will it take to stand out?

Let's discuss with Kellyanne Conway, Republican strategist and president and CEO of the poling company, CNN politics digital correspondent M.J. Lee, and in Washington, I have the CNN political director David Chalian.

So Mr. Chalian, let me just begin with you. I mean, it's a lot of faces on the screen. I can't even imagine how this is all going to work on stage for a debate. But any who, you have these five men, all tied for first. Is this a good thing this early on or not so good thing?

[15:35:18] DAVID CHALIAN, CNN POLITICAL DIRECTOR: Well, I don't know if it's a good or bad thing. What it is, is a field that has no formidable frontrunner. Now, that doesn't mean all 10 percent are equal. Obviously Jeb Bush has been raising a ton of money and perhaps maybe we will see that. Mike Huckabee who is also a ten percent may not have. All that money when we first see the first financial reports of these campaigns, things like that matter, level of support out there among elected officials or sort of organizers and how the campaign is going, not everything is about these poll numbers. But this is a story, and it's eye popping, Brooke. To look at a five-way tie at this stage of the game says Republican simply have not coalesce around anyone. And for us, that's great. That's a great story to follow.

BALDWIN: Kellyanne, I want you to react to that. They haven't coalesce on one -

KELLYANNE CONWAY, REPUBLICAN STRATEGIST: Which I think is wonderful, the Republican party as well, Brooke and David, M.J. Because traditionally, the Republican Party wants to know who can win, who's electable 18 months before the election. And the only way you prove that you're electable is to be elected. And so, these folks who even told, you've got to support and the can win, Mitt Romney, John McCain, Bob Dole, they end up losing.

So this time, I seeing side you have people up and down the ideological spectrum in the Republican Party saying let's not coalesce so early. This early on and it is early, 18 months out. It's great to have a big field if you are going to have a big conversation on big ideas. And I would prefer the pro-competition Republican party have that pre-market competition in the race.

What is so fascinating to me that the Republican and Democratic parties have switched roles this time. It is usually the Democratic party that is masterful at elevating and indeed electing these generational transformational, young fresh figures - JFK, Barack Obama, Bill Clinton, even Jimmy Carter was relatively young when he was elected in 1976. And the Republicans this time have a chance to do that. We're usually infected by this pecking order patriarchy loyalist (ph) and next in line, the guy who lost to the guy who lost to the guy who lost to the guy who won. It is really refreshing this early on to not have a frontrunner. And I think it gives people the voice, not the money people, and not the consultants, but the people the voice they deserve.

BALDWIN: OK. So Kellyanne says it's refreshing. You're the politics gal here. I mean, when you're looking at this, especially as we continue forward in the cycle, what do these different candidates, and there will be others, to stand out?

M.J. LEE, CNN POLITICS AND FINANCE REPORTER: Look. We have a long way to go before November. But I do think that we probably can't overstate how not good this is for Jeb Bush.

BALDWIN: Why?

LEE: He's a person that people know the most. He is the person with the highest name recognition. And yet, he's polling at the same place as someone like Ben Carson, who's not someone people know.

BALDWIN: That's right. He's part of the top five.

LEE: Right. And I think he's confronting a couple of problems that we knew for a while that he might confront. Is he a little rusty? He hasn't had to run for office in a while. So we've seen him stumble a little bit. And the other problem is, is he able to sort of step away from some of the negative connotations associated with his family name? We've seen him struggle a lot with the question of the Iraq war. And it's a question that he really should have been prepared to answer, but it seemed like he wasn't.

BALDWIN: But at least on the flip side, he's put himself out there over and over and over again, which I think a lot of people appreciate.

David Chalian, speaking of standing out, let's talk quickly about Senator Rand Paul because in a crowded field, obviously this is someone who stands out for his views. Just this past week, I was talking about this yesterday with a guest, how he blamed, you know, hawks in the Republican party and actually threw Hillary Clinton in that for the rise of ISIS and also saying Snowden and Clapper, you know, Clapper being the head of U.S. Intel, should share a cell together for the non-Rand Paul obvious, you know, fans here, how is this sitting with potential constituents?

CHALIAN: Right. So let's be clear about what Rand Paul is doing. Rand Paul is energizing his base of the party by getting out with these comments, the sort of libertarian, world weary, civil liberties wing of the Republican Party. That strand there, he's sort of making sure to keep them excited, keep them engaged, get them donating to his campaign, get them organized. Because he wants to make sure he's punching up into that upper tier.

But what he's also doing, Brooke, is he's becoming the punching bag for the rest of the field. On the NSA stuff, Chris Christie hit him hard last night on his radio show. And then you saw Bobby Jindal just a little while ago with Wolf Blitzer.

BALDWIN: Let me play that. We have sound. Bobby Jindal, roll it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GOV. BOBBY JINDAL (R), LOUISIANA: I think when you listen to his views on foreign policy, it would be a continuation even worse of what we've seen in the last six-plus years. Senator Paul's comments suggest he would be even to the left of president Obama and Hillary Clinton.

WOLF BLITZER, CNN HOST, THE SITUATION ROOM: So would you be able to vote for him?

JINDAL: I don't think I'm going to be faced with that choice. I don't think he'll be the nominee.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

[15:40:05] BALDWIN: And Jindal isn't even in the race officially yet. David, continue.

CHALIAN: No. So, I mean, Bobby Jindal is obviously trying to get attention and get his name I.D. up. So he punches up a little bit and takes on Rand Paul, gets media attention. That should hopefully, from his perspective, help his poll numbers. But he also clearly took an ideological stance that everyone else in the party is taking on ISIS and leaving Rand Paul as sort of this isolated figure in the party, which helps differentiate Rand Paul but also I think is a dangerous place for him to be right now as we see in the polls that the country at large and the Republican party itself becoming a little bit more hawkish in light of all the ISIS news.

BALDWIN: OK. I'm looking at you out of the corner of my eye. You're nodding. But I'm also looking at you because I want to end this with Jeb Bush, too. Do we know when he's jumping in and why he's waiting?

LEE: I think he's waited because he wanted to make sure that he had a good operation in place and raised a lot of money. And I do think that the field has already been pretty crowded so far, right? We have folks who are more well-known. Mike Walker, Rubio, and then we have others like Carson, Fiorina. The field is crowded and I think it's beneficial to wait for that to sort of take shape and, you know, step in when there's really the sort of space and, you know, he has the momentum to really capitalize on that.

BALDWIN: I would be remiss without asking you about Ben Carson. He's in the top five, tied at 10 percent. Are you surprised by his rise?

CONWAY: I'm not surprised by that. He won the straw poll with 25 percent in Oklahoma, the southern Republican leadership. People love him. The grassroots give him standing ovations. They fill up halls for him. The question for every Republican primary caucus that are in this cycle and David just sense it out is, can I see you as my commander in-chief? And that's particularly important to Republicans in a place like South Carolina, a big military state, the evangelical Christians in Iowa, national security very important to them. So that's a question that I think first timers who have not held elective office like Ben Carson will be faced with that question. Can I see you as commander in-chief? And the fascinating debate in the Republican party right now is, are you with Marco Rubio, who believes in intervention it seems in most hot spots around the globe still? Or are you with the selective disengagement of the senator Rand Paul? Are you with Ted Cruz, who seems to just draw the line somewhere in the middle? And the irony of all three of them, if the coincidence, is that they're all three United States senators, fairly young, all who were told you can't win before, you can't beat the establishment. They're willing to chance that again, that you see differentiation on national security where you don't, Brooke, see it on other issues like the economy.

LEE: And if I can quickly jump in, candidates do tend to get a boost when they are new and they are fresh and people are sort of intrigued by a new candidate that they haven't heard of before. So, is Ben Carson getting a little bit of a boost because he's new? Quite possibly.

BALDWIN: M.J., Kellyanne, and David, thank you all so much. I appreciate it.

LEE: Thank you.

CHALIAN: Thanks. BALDWIN: Next, ten years after the disappearance of Natalee Holloway,

her father gets a new tip about what might have happened to her. We will take you live to Aruba coming up next.

Also, listen. There are police chases and there are police chases. But this is a little bit of a slow roll, little bizarre. There is a dramatic twist. We will show you the whole thing coming up.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:47:40] BALDWIN: Ten years ago Natalee Holloway was a typical 18- year-old. She just graduated from high school. She was taking a senior class trip to Aruba. But then, on that last night of the trip, she vanished. She never showed up to fly home. Despite an incredibly extensive search, there has been no sign of her since, but now a potential new lead.

CNN's Martin Savidge reports.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

MARTIN SAVIDGE, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): In the ten years since Natalee Holloway vanished in Aruba, her father has never stopped looking for her. It has been a decade, a false hopes and dead ends.

DAVE HOLLOWAY, NATALEE HOLLOWAY'S FATHER: Ponds, have dogs over there numerous times. I've searched cemeteries. I probably know that terrain better than some of the residents who live on the alley.

SAVIDGE: May 2005, Natalee Holloway was on high school graduation trip to Aruba and disappears. Suspicions fall on three young men she seen leaving a night club with. Two brothers and a Dutch nationals, the son of a judge, 17-year-old Joran Van Der Sloot.

They first say that they dropped Natalee off at her hotel, then the story changes. The brothers say that actually they dropped Joran and Natalee off at a different hotel. And Joran says that is where he left her, on this beach, alive and well.

Hundreds of tourists and locals search for her. Authorities detain a number of people and then let them go. Dutch fighter jets are even flown overhead scanning with sensors. Nothing is found. Many, including her father, believe Natalee is the victim of foul play, her body thrown in the ocean. Joran Van Der Sloot is never charged. The case goes cold.

Then three years later, Dave Holloway gets a call from a mysterious man telling him --

HOLLOWAY: She's (INAUDIBLE) and I know where her body is hidden. And my thought is this is another crazy.

SAVIDGE: You have had a lot of those in the story?

HOLLOWAY: Quite a few. SAVIDGE: Holloway dismisses the lead and the years drag on. In 2010,

Van Der Sloot is arrested and eventually convicted of the murder of 21-year-old Stephany Flores Ramirez in Peru. Five years to the day Natalee Holloway vanished.

To Holloway it is more proof that Van Der Sloot is responsible for his daughter's disappearance but he is no closer to finding her. In 2012, a judge legally declared Natalee dead.

Then in March, he gets a phone call from a Dutch journalist who tells him of an amazing lead, an eyewitness to his daughter's death.

Did you know who he was referring to?

[15:50:22] HOLLOWAY: I did not at the time. I said who are you referring to and he started bring me up to date and I said that sounds like the same guy who contacted me back in 2008.

SAVIDGE: And just as in 2008, the witness says Natalee is buried on land. After years of disappointment, Holloway is afraid to believe it.

HOLLOWAY: I thought I can't go here because I've gone through so many of these where they had details and facts and it turned out to be nothing.

SAVIDGE: So he asked a private investigator to check the witness out. And soon the investigator calls back.

HOLLOWAY: He said, hey, Dave, the guy passed this voice analysis test. I thought, oh, my God.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I had -- best time in my life.

SAVIDGE: Now, for the first time in nearly a decade, the dad who never gave up dares to hope he may finally bring his daughter back home.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BALDWIN: Here we are ten years later. Martin Savidge live in Aruba. So what is the latest on this lead?

SAVIDGE: Well, that is that the prosecutor's office here in Aruba has opened the investigation specifically looking into the statements made. The man coming forward is (INAUDIBLE). He is actually lived in Amsterdam but was here in 2005. This changes everything if it is true because almost everybody believed that she was in the water. If she's buried on land, if her remains could be recovered, it would bring at least some sentiment of relief for her family, but those remain could have clues that could lead to potentially what happened to her and how she died and who may have carried it out.

It is such a big lead, we're going to Amsterdam, will sits you down in front of this witness. You'll get to hear him face to face. What did he see and why has he taken ten years to come forward? It is pretty amazing. Brooke, that's tonight on "AC360."

BALDWIN: All right. Martin Savidge, thank you so much. We'll be listening to that interview with the witness live in Aruba there. Don't miss part two of Martin's series tonight, "AC360" 8:00 p.m. eastern here on CNN.

Coming up, a car chase through Texas but a barely broke 10 miles an hour, pictures tell it. The car going so slow, in fact, the spike sticks that law enforcement usually use, they didn't work. We will show you how this whole thing ended, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(VIDEO CLIP PLAYING)

[15:57:05] BALDWIN: This was a vacation home in Wimberley, Texas. We just had to play this video for you again. Imagine you're this family and thank goodness they had a second floor. They were able to come up to the second floor and get out of the way of the fast rising floodwater and apparently the woman didn't even realize she had record on her cell phone. So we have the video. The car totally submerged so they just had to wait it out like so many people in Texas.

Here is what we are watching for and this is specific to the city of Wharton, Texas, because they are watching the Colorado River rise and continue to rise. It will be cresting. I talked to the PIO last hour. It should happen between Friday and Saturday as a result of that. They're already flooded. Imagine this. And now they are watching for this river to crest so there are voluntary evacuations under way right there. Again that should happen, she told us me, sometime between Friday or Saturday. Jake Tapper is going to be all over the flooding in Texas coming up next.

But let me leave you with this. How slow can you go when it comes to a police chase you at? Good question. A bizarre pursuit in Texas has crowd mesmerized for two hours. This suspected drug dealer, you are going to see this white car rolling down the highway, at a leisurely pace with a fleet of police following his trail, the most fascinating part, the surprise ending.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

BALDWIN (voice-over): That's your normal car chase, but this one may be the slowest ever. Fort Worth police followed the white Nissan more than two hours. The suspect in no hurry to escape, crowds of gawkers gathered on overpasses to snap photos of the slow ride. At one point the suspect took off this shirt, talked on his cell phone. One witness in traffic told ABC affiliate, WFAA, the guy was quote "waving at us like he had a parade or something."

Police shut down highways exits and entrances causing rush hour traffic snarls. But just when you think he's finally going to stop, he resumes his slow crawl over and over again.

I know you're wondering, why didn't police just pull in front of the car? Well, it's simple. According to policy there, officers are not allowed to pass and block a vehicle during a chase. Instead, officers resorted to loud speakers and sirens. They even put out spike sticks. No dice. Hours passed.

Finally the suspect made his move, hit the gas, leaving the interstate, zooming across the grass median and went the wrong way down in access rod to get back on the interstate. Then, enough is enough. A police white car performed a pit maneuver and ran the back of the suspect's car causing it to slam into a concrete median. SWAT officers swarmed the suspect. We're told a considerable amount of methamphetamines was found in the car. So there you have it, a guy who drives his getaway car in a slow lane busted for a drug known as speed.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BALDWIN: I'm Brooke Baldwin. I will see you back here tomorrow. In the meantime, "The LEAD" with Jake Tapper starts now.

END