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Women and Children Trapped in Fallujah; Americans Caught Up in Crisis in Yemen; Suicide Attack in Iraq; What Next for NBC's Brian Williams?; Remembering Beau Biden. Aired 9:30-10a ET

Aired June 01, 2015 - 09:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


CAROL COSTELLO, CNN ANCHOR: So do you think Paul is just posturing because I talked to Senator Lee earlier this morning and he said Paul passionately believes in what he's doing; he's not posturing.

[09:30:00] MARK PRESTON, CNN EXECUTIVE EDITOR, POLITICS: Well, he certainly does, and this is something that isn't new that has just arrived on the radar screen for Rand Paul. Something he's been talking about for years. The problem for Rand Paul, though, is that he's now running for president in a Republican primary where an issue like this might not play as well.

Now, again, if you talk to the Rand Paul folks, Carol, they will say that the American people do not trust the federal government, especially with data. And, of course, that has become such a big issue nowadays with all these companies, technology companies, collecting everything they can about you and me and everybody else.

But the fact is, is that Rand Paul to a principled stand in his own mind on the Senate floor last night. How that will play out over the next couple of months, we'll have to see. But the polling right now, Carol, shows that he's still near the top. So it hasn't affected him quite yet.

COSTELLO: All right, Mark Preston, thanks for your insight. I do appreciate it.

Still to come in the NEWSROOM, an army of Iraqi Sunnis say they're willing to die to rid their home of ISIS, but can they win without U.S. help?

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[09:35:32] COSTELLO: More women and children among the dead in ISIS controlled Fallujah. A city less than 50 miles from Iraq's capital Baghdad. Witnesses tell CNN that at least 31 people were killed in the last three days of ground and air assaults. And with some 100,000 civilians still trapped inside the war-torn city, Sunni tribes are pleading for America's help, fearing they can't defeat the extremists with their cheap weapons and volunteer army. CNN's Nick Paton Walsh live in Baghdad with more for us.

Hi, Nick.

NICK PATON WALSH, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: A key city of Fallujah, Carol, held by ISIS is the center of the current government advance against them. So much lives being lost there, so much bloodshed. But at the same time, from the southwest of that key city, there are Sunni tribesmen, ISIS are also Sunnis, but these are moderates who oppose them, struggling to get the weapons they need to hold ISIS off.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

WALSH (voice-over): These sandbags is exactly what Iraq needs to stay together as a country. Meters away, you can glimpse the flag of ISIS, extremists from Iraq's Sunni minority. But holding them off here are the men the U.S. says are key to victory, moderate Iraqi Sunnis who will die to rid their hometown of ISIS.

WALSH (on camera): If America is to send help to the Sunni tribes to Anbar here is where it is most badly needed. They have been in combat with ISIS for months and now the enemy is just across the river.

WALSH (voice-over): But they have been without pay for months. Some have Kalashnikovs made of cheap metal and chipboard.

"No one's come to help us (INAUDIBLE). Not help with anything. We buy our own weapons and we're supposed (INAUDIBLE)."

"Such people like ISIS," another says, "and not Sunnis, no. They're enemies, the ones who destroy and not build."

The local mayor of the town of Amaret (ph) al-Fallujah (ph), around which ISIS swarms and fires mortars daily, sees his enemy on the TV screen. This long-distance camera shows their mortars slamming into ISIS positions, and was paid for by locals themselves. They say Baghdad, whose officials are often Shia, and distrust Sunnis, has ignored months of their pleas for help. Now, they arm themselves.

"We buy them," he says, "there are lots of weapons for sale on the Iraqi market, whether it's from the previous army or what ISIS took from this army as they put it up for sale through a third party. Even some things come from Iran and are sold directly."

Here is where local volunteers are trained and armed. But again, we're shown the chipboard, 500 of them, they say. This man was trained by the U.S. nine years ago, then to help them fight al Qaeda here. Now, they want America's help again.

"We want the Americans to arm us directly," he says. "If they give it to the government, they'll take what they want and give us the tired weapons. The good stuff they'll keep."

Outside the hospital, you can see the help they are getting, an ambulance from Sunni Saudi Arabia. Inside, three injured from a mortar that hit off duty young fighters playing football the day before. Another died. This town endures, yet feels abandoned despite broad recognition it is vital they win.

(END VIDEOTAPE) WALSH: Now this Sunni/Shia rift has been a problem in Iraq for years certainly at the heart of the fight for Anbar, to push ISIS out of it. Now we've just spoke to perhaps the most senior Sunni politician here in Iraq, the speaker of parliament. And he gave a very interesting comment about why it was that Ramadi fell. Remember, the U.S. says perhaps the Iraqis defending it lacked the will to fight. Well, he says that the elite soldiers who were fighting for that city received an order to withdraw. Now, he isn't clear whether they've decided by themselves to pull out, or got an order from somewhere else in the military (INAUDIBLE) here in Baghdad. What he is clear about is that Iraq's prime minister, who's the commander in chief of their armed forces, didn't know about that. There's an investigation underway as to why this vital city fell, but at this stage there appears to be division, certainly chaos perhaps, in the chain of command in Iraq's military. An interesting insight.

Carol.

[09:40:00] COSTELLO: All right, Nick Paton Walsh reporting live from Baghdad this morning.

Several Americans caught up in the crisis in Yemen. Reports say Iranian backed Houthi rebels are holding at least four U.S. citizens in a prison in the capital city of Sanaa. Three reportedly worked in the private sector and a fourth has dual U.S.-Yemeni citizenship. The State Department is apparently trying to negotiate their release, while the U.S. is supporting the Saudi-led attacks to drive the rebels out of that capital city.

So, what can the United States do to free these prisoners? Let's talk about that with Steven Bucci, former army special forces officer and a top Pentagon official.

Welcome, sir.

STEVEN BUCCI, FORMER ARMY SPECIAL FORCES OFFICER: Thanks for having me.

COSTELLO: Thank you for being here.

Before we get into the hostage situation in Yemen, I want to talk to you about what Nick Paton Walsh just reported. I don't know if you heard it. Did you hear it?

BUCCI: I did.

COSTELLO: What do you think about that?

BUCCI: Well I think that group that he was referring to, those Sunni tribesmen who want to fight ISIS, are a perfect target for where we should be embedding our special forces, or other special operations forces, and give them those weapons. Those guys want to fight. We ought to be helping them do it. And if the government in Baghdad is not cooperating, we should exert some influence to get them to allow us to do it. COSTELLO: But what about this notion that somebody gave the Iraqi

special forces an order to withdraw from Ramadi? And the Iraqi government doesn't know who that was. That's disturbing, isn't it?

BUCCI: Oh, it's disturbing. We have stuff like that happen in our government, too. It should be investigated. Somebody should find out what the truth is, and then get that truth out.

COSTELLO: Absolutely. OK. We'll move on to these four Americans being held hostage or taken prisoner in Yemen. It's been very hard to get any information out of there. But I would -- I would think that it would be difficult to negotiate while the Saudis are conducting air strikes over Yemen.

BUCCI: It is very difficult in that kind of situation. I would hope we're communicating with the Saudis so that that facility, if we know where they're being held, will not be targeted so that those folks will not be at risk. But the State Department has connections, maybe through Iran, I don't know how they're communicating with the Houthis, to try and get those folks out. It's very unfortunate. They made a bad choice staying there. But will -- our government is working to try and get them out and hopefully they'll make it.

COSTELLO: I know there's some sort of plan in the works to rework how the United States deals with these terrorists who take hostages. Do you get a sense of what those changes might be?

BUCCI: Not really sure. A lot of it has to do with how we communicate with the families back here. That sort of thing. I don't think the United States is going to jettison our general policy that we don't negotiate with these terrorists. In this case, the Houthis, it's more of a rebellion than an actual terrorism type situation. They are being supported by the Iranians, so we've got a nation-state connection there. We'll see what happens.

COSTELLO: Steve Bucci, thanks for your insight. I appreciate it.

Still to come in the NEWSROOM --

BUCCI: Thank you for having me.

COSTELLO: Still to come in the NEWSROOM, what do you think should happen to Brian Williams? That's what NBC is trying to figure out and it just may have an idea.

But first, possible good news for drivers. Some experts say gas prices might be close to peaking. Today's national average, 2.75 a gallon. That's about a one cent increase from last week. In the three weeks prior, prices climbed 14 cents. It's almost a buck cheaper than last summer when gas was 3.67 a gallon.

[09:43:45]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

COSTELLO: This news just in to CNN. A deadly suicide attack at an Iraqi police base just northwest of Baghdad. At least 34 members of security forces are dead and more than 48 injured after an ISIS member drove a tank packed with explosives onto the base. Officials say security stationed at the entrance of that facility fired on the tank, but were unable to stop it. The blast also happened near a stack of ammunition, which exploded and added to the high number of casualties. Reinforcements have now been sent to the area. We'll keep you posted.

In other news this morning, speculation swirling about Brian Williams' fate. Williams is nearing the end of a six-month suspension, leaving many wondering what will NBC do with their former leading man? Back in February, Williams apologized to "Nightly News" viewers after soldiers contradicted his account of an Iraq war mission in 2003.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BRIAN WILLIAMS, NBC ANCHOR: I made a mistake in recalling the events of twelve years ago. It did not take long to hear from some brave men and women in the air crews who were also in that desert. I want to apologize. I said I was traveling in an aircraft that was hit by RPG fire. I was instead in a following aircraft.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: Sounds just as bad this morning, right, as it did back then. Well, as you know, NBC immediately launched an investigation. And now there are rumblings about what the network might do moving forward. Brian Stelter is the man in the know. He joins me now live to talk about this. Good morning.

BRIAN STELTER, CNN SENIOR MEDIA CORRESPONDENT: Good morning.

COSTELLO: So what do you think NBC will do?

STELTER: What's really interesting, Carol, is that it's gone on for so long. People expected this to be resolved way sooner than it has. But it appears there's this third option that's emerged.

[09:50:01] I learned of this through my reporting in the past few days. And, frankly, it surprised me at first because I, like a lot of people, were under the impression there were two options here: either for Williams to come back from his suspension and go back to the "Nightly News", or for him to leave NBC all together. And most have been guessing that he's leaving NBC and that negotiations are under way about how exactly he'll leave.

You know how it works in the industry. People like Brian Williams have a contract, so NBC would have to pay him a lot of money if he ends up leaving the network through some sort of settlement.

But the idea that there's a third option is what came through in my reporting, and the third option could be a new role for Brian Williams at NBC. Not as the "Nightly News anchor but as something else. And that role could be a reporting job. It could be something else at the network. But it might be a way to bring him back onto television and have him return and see if people accept him in a new role without having him return to the anchor desk. COSTELLO: Now, I'm feeling like deja vu all over again, and the name

coming to mind is Ann Curry.

STELTER: Right, right. This is a lot like what happened with Ann Curry in 2012. They wanted to move her off the "Today Show"; they being the all-knowing bosses at NBC. They wanted to move her off the "Today Show", basically kick her out of her job, but they said they were going to create a new job for her where she would be an international correspondent and roving anchor. Well, that didn't really work out. It was almost like she was frozen on ice over on the sidelines for several years, and then earlier this year they officially unwound that deal at NBC.

But this could be different. Brian Williams is a bigger star; he's got a bigger paycheck. So there's a lot at stake for NBC if they can get this right.

COSTELLO: If they can get this right. Brian Stelter, many thanks to you. I appreciate it.

Still to come in the NEWSROOM, remembering a war veteran, a public servant, a young father. I'll talk with a longtime friend of Beau Biden next.

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[09:56:02] COSTELLO: Tributes and condolences are pouring in following the death of Vice President Joe Biden's oldest son. President Obama and the First Lady visiting the Bidens' official residence on Sunday to pay their respects. Beau Biden, an Iraq War vet and a former Delaware attorney general, died Saturday after battling brain cancer. He was just 46 years old. In a statement, his father wrote, quote, "Beau Biden was quite simply the finest man any of us have ever known."

Joining me is Tom Gordon, a longtime friend of Beau Biden. Thank you so much for joining me this morning.

TOM GORDON, LONGTIME FRIEND OF BEAU BIDEN: Well, thank you, Carol.

COSTELLO: I have heard such kudos for Beau Biden, but, in your estimation, what made him such a fine man?

GORDON: He was really a unique individual. I think it was mostly his character and he was attorney general for eight years, a very powerful position in Delaware. And he was self-assuming. Just a wonderful person. He did a great job as attorney general and he took it very serious, especially with the crime problem that we have in Wilmington.

COSTELLO: He seemed to be very close to his father. Tell us about their relationship?

GORDON: Well, the vice president has very close ties with all of his family and his kids. And they were uniquely bonded; I'm sure some of it had to do with the tragedy in '72. But a lot of it had to do with the Vice President's parenting skills where, if you ever saw them meet, they're hugging and kissing. And he let everybody know how close he was with his kids. And he continues that to this day.

COSTELLO: Yes, those touching pictures of when Beau Biden was 4 years old. He and his mother and 1-year-old sister and another brother were in a car accident. His mother and 1-year-old sister died, and he was in the hospital. Joe Biden was sworn in as senator right next to his hospital bed. Those pictures are quite touching. I hope we have them up soon.

I kind of like what Joe Biden said. He said, "If you raise your child to be better than yourself, you have succeeded." That really touched me.

GORDON: Well, he succeeded. This was a Delaware star. Everybody liked him. And we all had aspirations that he would become our next governor. And of course that's been cut short now. There's a tremendous void.

COSTELLO: I did read that he still planned to run for governor, right up until the very end.

GORDON: Yes, I think it was six weeks I spoke to him about -- we were talking about getting a press release out about a crime issue so he would stay relevant, because he had left office a year ago. And he thought he was going to beat it, I'm sure.

COSTELLO: I want to play for our audience and for you something the vice president said, because he did speak frequently about his love for his son. Listen to this tribute from his speech to the Democratic National Convention.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOE BIDEN, VICE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: My dad used to have an expression. He'ld say a father knows his success when he turns and looks at his son or daughter and know that they turned out better than he did. I'm a success. I'm a hell of a success. Beauy, I love you. I'm so proud of you. I'm so proud of the son you've become. I'm so proud of the father you are.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: Yeah, it's just expanding on what I shared with everyone before. But it's so touching. You know, the Bidens kept this quiet, really. We knew that Beau Biden was admitted to Walter Reed, but we didn't know why.

GORDON: Well, I'm sure that the vice president thought that his son was going to get better up until about three weeks ago. I think he knew at that point that it was critical. And they kept it quiet and I'm sure they wanted to spend -- I'm sure that's why his father never left Washington, spent every probably minute he could by his bedside. And we're just hoping that the vice president will recover from this.

[10:00:00]

He's a great man also. COSTELLO: Tom Gordon, thanks so much for your comments this morning.

I appreciate it.

GORDON: Thank you very much.

COSTELLO: You're welcome.

The next hour of CNN NEWSROOM starts now.