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Unemployment Rate Drops; Trump Under Fire; Terror Fears. Aired 3-3:30p ET

Aired July 02, 2015 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[15:00:05] BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN ANCHOR: Top of the hour. I'm Brooke Baldwin. You're watching CNN.

And we're beginning here with some breaking news we're getting, the first real impact of terror threat concerns this Fourth of July holiday. We have just learned that this British air base used by U.S. forces is canceling its Independence Day events over security fears.

That is coming from the chief public affairs of the 48th Fighter Wing, who says that the decision followed a meeting and was "based on the current threat assessment." Again, that was in England.

And then we have, of course, what happened this morning, some frightening moments in Washington, D.C.. This was the scene outside of the Naval Yard, this massive show of law enforcement force turned out to be, thank goodness, this false alarm. But it played out real concerns that a terrorist may strike around the Fourth of July.

Law enforcement across the nation had already been on heightened alert with ISIS calling for acts of violence this holiday. And then right around 7:30 this morning, a worker there at the Navy Yard called 911, said she had possibly heard gunshots and then, very quickly, the Yard went into lockdown.

No gunman was found, no shots fired, but what is left behind, the same fears and plans to step up security.

Let me turn now to Frank Wuco, CEO of Red Mind Solutions and a retired naval intelligence officer.

So, Frank, great to have you on. Welcome.

FRANK WUCO, CEO, RED MIND SOLUTIONS: Thank you, Brooke.

BALDWIN: I just want to begin with the tremendous response from law enforcement on all sides this morning swooping in. Can you just speak to the sensitivity of counterterror efforts obviously at any given time in our nation's capital, but especially ahead of the Fourth of July?

WUCO: Sure, Brooke.

If anything, that was a great demonstration of exactly the type of response that anybody can expect when there's a terror threat during a heightened time of awareness or a heightened threat level, especially in a major city, especially in Washington, D.C.

And what you saw there was virtually every level of law enforcement, from the local level up to the U.S. Marshals and FBI, responding in force. It's a good glimpse of what somebody would find facing them if they decided to do something of a terrorist nature in one of our major cities.

BALDWIN: Listen, we all remember what happened. I was there covering it, the shooting in 2013.

Let me just ask you, as a retired Naval officer, how has this particular location, these positions really, I don't know, altered or improved security procedures from what happened two years ago?

WUCO: Quite a bit.

You know, the Navy Yard has gone under, from what I understand, some extensive security review and enhancement. And just so people know, that entire neighborhood around the Navy Yard has gone through a re- gentrification in the past several years.

So, it's a much more populated area now just by the general public. So there's a very heightened sense of security there.

BALDWIN: Broadening this out, Frank, I know CNN -- officials are telling us at CNN that, when we talk about ISIS, right, the focus right now is encouraging attacks during the Fourth of July weekend and of course this is also the holy month of Ramadan, and that there has been this uptick in chatter leading into this holiday weekend.

Is your concern that there could be some coordinated attack from, you know, someone from ISIS, let's say, or someone, as we say, a lone wolf acting alone inspired by their messaging online?

WUCO: Absolutely.

I would say that any ISIS commander -- and this is a different group from al Qaeda, that these are not people who are too concerned with having an impact on our economy or on the convenience of American lives. These are people who are interested in killing us. Any ISIS commander who is serious about what he's undertaking is going to look for an event, a venue where you have large concentrations of Americans, Westerners gathered in areas.

And the Fourth of July celebrations in this country just provides very prime targets. So people need to be more aware of their surroundings, the environment that they know and just extra vigilant.

BALDWIN: OK. Frank Wuco, thank you so much for joining me. I really appreciate it.

WUCO: Thank you, Brooke.

BALDWIN: You got it. We are also now getting new details here of exactly how close an officer came to being killed in that manhunt for those two prison fugitives, those two murderers. And I'm going to show you a photo, but just a warning that what we're about to show you is graphic, but officers moving in on a likely drunk Richard Matt after shots were fired into an R.V.

And as they searched, he coughed. And by coughing, he tipped off police. When they approached him, he was lying -- let me show you -- right here. This is after he was taken down by police. But they approached him and this is where he was ultimately shot and killed.

[15:05:02]

As he lay there slumped up against this tree, he apparently refused to put his hands up though, and instead pointed a .28-gauge at a U.S. Customs and Border Protection agent, that agent firing three shots into Matt's head.

She just sat down next to me. Casey Jordan is here, CNN contributor, criminologist and behavioral analyst.

Welcome.

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: And thank you so much. My goodness, I have a lot. When you see him there almost lying in plain sight, I can't get over the fact that we're hearing that he had been drinking.

CASEY JORDAN, CNN CONTRIBUTOR: Yes.

And David Sweat said he had -- they break into these cabins. They find the alcohol. Hopefully, they found some weed. They get a shotgun. So he kind of went on a bender.

BALDWIN: If I'm on the run and I want to get the hell out of town, I'm not going to be drinking alcohol.

JOHNSON: Oh, but you hadn't had any for six or eight years. You would be thinking in a whole different way if you were an inmate who was in the supermax in the state of New York.

One of his many mistakes was stopping to celebrate. But that also explains why David Sweat left him behind.

BALDWIN: Sure.

JOHNSON: He was slowing him down. But let's not forget, Richard Matt had the shotgun. They only had one gun between them. And when you have two murderers and one has a gun, the other one doesn't want to stick around.

BALDWIN: The other thing that strikes me -- I could talk about this...

JOHNSON: All day.

BALDWIN: All day.

JOHNSON: Yes.

BALDWIN: The fact that David Sweat is talking and again he's saying, I was the guy, I was the mastermind, I ditched Richard Matt, this sense of narcissism, which I have talked to negotiators, and they are saying they're going in on that to get him to keep talking. Whether he's telling the truth is another story.

But why do you think he's owning this? Yes, we were going to Mexico.

(CROSSTALK)

JOHNSON: First of all, he's bragging because, A, there's no one to contradict him, with Richard Matt being dead. There's only one story out there and it's his.

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: Joyce Mitchell would disagree on some items.

JOHNSON: But she's under indictment, so we can't believe her either. She's going to say whatever she wants to say to save herself.

But the key is, he's going back to prison. He won't go back to Clinton, for sure. But he's a legend now. Whatever prison they send him to, he wants to be the big man. He wants to be the stuff of folklore. And he wants the other inmates to high-five him and respect him wherever he goes. So, he's going to be talking a lot of smack in the next few weeks.

BALDWIN: Smack talk.

And we know Joyce Mitchell, the seamstress, who is apparently he's saying, no, no, I never had any, how shall we call them? I might...

JOHNSON: Sexual relations.

BALDWIN: Sexual relations. Thank you.

No, he's saying he didn't, but his buddy Richard Matt did. He's also saying, no, it wasn't my plan to take out her husband. It was Joyce Mitchell who wanted to take out of her husband, Lyle Mitchell, where, in fact, she's saying, no, it was the two killers that wanted to stop and kill my husband.

Can you just speak to what is going on there?

JOHNSON: Everyone is trying to save their own butt. It's that simple.

BALDWIN: CYA.

JOHNSON: Yes, CYA. And he's saying that she knew they were going to Mexico, where her story was, oh, they wouldn't tell me where we were going. They just said we were going to drive for seven hours and I wasn't comfortable with that.

You're going to have a lot of people talking. Joyce Mitchell in theory should be more credible, but not given the aid that she gave these two guys. It's really is each person for himself when it comes down to the prosecution.

I do believe that there was a sexual relation between Joyce and both these guys because there was no reason for her to help both of the guys unless she was really in love with or felt made special by these guys.

BALDWIN: Right.

JOHNSON: The Joyce Mitchells of the world are the big problem with this prison break. It's not the target hardening. It's not the gates. It's not the walls. It's the Joyce Mitchells. Without Joyce, they never could have done it.

BALDWIN: It's amazing, even though she didn't end showing up. Therefore, they ended up in the woods, and finally, one killed, one caught.

What else? I could -- what else about this whole thing do you -- we want to know how they pulled it off and whether or not this sledgehammer really was lying around on the catwalk that he just so happened upon. I know they are looking for -- he said, no, no power tools were used. What else about this thing befuddles you?

JOHNSON: Every -- this is way more complicated than you think.

Everyone I talk goes, wow, Clinton must be really screwed up. How did it get to that state? I'm like, oh, no, no, no, they all are like this to a certain extent. But the key is not just -- right now, they are doing everything to change. They are putting gates in the catwalks.

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: New superintendent.

JOHNSON: New superintendent. And they are cleaning house, which is a very good idea. But accountability comes from the top.

I want to tell you that they can check the cells weekly and they can do random bed checks and do all of these things, but they are really missing the big point, which is that guards and inmates have inappropriate relationships all the time. And there's no accountability for that. So when they start cleaning house and firing C.O.s for inappropriate relationships, female inmates always getting pregnant, female guards getting pregnant by male inmates.

(CROSSTALK) BALDWIN: There's was one in Baltimore impregnated four women.

(CROSSTALK)

JOHNSON: Remember Susan Smith, who killed her kids in the '90s?

BALDWIN: Yes.

JOHNSON: She has been pregnant twice in prison. It's rampant.

BALDWIN: Wow.

JOHNSON: The amount of contraband that comes in, you know, the guy who impregnated those three C.O.s, he was making $16,000 a month bringing drugs in.

So, we have to clean house of all the bad C.O.s. We need to get rid of state mentality and grievances. If you are bad, if you're in an inappropriate relationship with an inmate, you need to go. This doesn't happen in privatized prisons.

(CROSSTALK)

[15:10:03]

BALDWIN: I sense that's a whole other conversation. I have a feeling we will be having it.

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: Casey Jordan, thank you so much. I really appreciate it.

JOHNSON: Always great to be here, Brooke.

And now also don't miss this. Coming up, we will take you inside the very trailer where Richard Matt hid from authorities. See what our correspondent Gary Tuchman found inside.

Also, as Donald Trump triples down on his derogatory remarks on Mexican immigrants, another company cuts ties. But there is some positive news involving his beauty pageants. We have that for you.

I'm Brooke Baldwin. This is CNN.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BALDWIN: You're watching CNN. I'm Brooke Baldwin.

Donald Trump, yes, he is under fire and he's, no, not backing down. Far from it. After calling Mexican migrants rapists more than two weeks ago, here's what he told Don Lemon just last night.

[15:15:08]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Well, if you look at the statistics, our people come -- I didn't see about Mexicans. I say the illegal immigrants. If you look at the statistics on rape, on crime, on everything coming in illegally into this country, they're mind boggling.

If you go to Fusion, you will see a story about 80 percent of the women coming in, I mean, you have to take a look at these stories. And you know who owns Fusion? Univision.

Go to Fusion and pick up the stories on rape and it's unbelievable when you look at what's going on. So, all I'm doing is telling the truth.

DON LEMON, CNN ANCHOR: I have read the -- I have read "The Washington Post." I have read the Fusion. I have read the Huffington Post. And that's about women being raped. It's not about criminals coming across the border or entering the country.

TRUMP: Well, somebody's doing the raping, Don. I mean, you know -- I mean, somebody's doing just think women are being rape. Well, who's doing the raping? Who's doing the raping?

LEMON: Yes.

TRUMP: How can you say such a thing?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: Part of the public backlash came from NBC and Univision, who decided not to air the Miss USA Pageant. But now it will air, just somewhere else.

Let me bring in our CNN senior media correspondent, Brian Stelter, here, and Felix Sanchez, chairman and co-founder of the National Hispanic Foundation for the Arts.

So, welcome to both of you.

FELIX SANCHEZ, CHAIRMAN AND CO-FOUNDER, NATIONAL HISPANIC FOUNDATION FOR THE ARTS: Thank you.

BRIAN STELTER, CNN SENIOR MEDIA CORRESPONDENT: Thank you.

BALDWIN: Stelter, you up first. We know that there has been this channel, the ReelzChannel, who has come in, who has said, yes, we will air Miss USA.

STELTER: That's right. And this solves a problem that Trump and NBC and Univision all have, because these contestants were going to be without a television home as a result of this breakup between companies.

So, Reelz has come in. They see an opportunity. It's a relatively small channel, but if you're watching CNN, you do probably have Reelz somewhere in your channel lineup, which is one of those channels it's kind of hard to find. We will see how many people actually now seek out the pageant as a result of this. But this pageant now has become this weird sort of political situation. Obviously, the contestants don't want it to be that at all.

BALDWIN: Felix, I read your piece, your opinion piece on CNN.com entitled "How Trump's Comments Unleashed Latino Spring."

What do you mean by Latino spring?

SANCHEZ: Well, there was a galvanizing moment, Brooke, in which Latinos across the country and throughout the Western Hemisphere felt outrage over what has happened.

As you can see, a lot of the reaction to Trump has come not just from the United States, but from Mexico, Central America and Latin America.

BALDWIN: Well, there are specific artists, you point out, in the wake of this who are putting videos out. You have Juanes, Shakira, Mana. They're all responding. Even Ricky Martin is yanking his foundation golf tournament off of a Trump property.

That's all happening. But you point out in your piece it's the Republican presidential candidates who you wanted to hear more from, specifically Jeb Bush with a Mexican wife, Mexican-American kids. What did you wish Jeb Bush had said?

SANCHEZ: You know, this is the part that I think is really stunning, is that you had a tremendous opportunity to show your support for the Latino community by saying zero tolerance to Latino bashing, and they didn't do it.

Jeb Bush gave a statement yesterday that was rather tepid and Ted Cruz agreed with Donald Trump's comments. But equally on the Democratic side, Senator -- Secretary Clinton could have been more forceful and could have come out and really knocked him out in a really forceful way.

And can you imagine how she would have garnered this incredible support from the Latino community in the United States? And, you know, we have got to look at both parties and we have got to ask why didn't they understand the importance of coming out and defending the Latino community against these heinous insults.

BALDWIN: This building block is quite the constituency.

I want to loop back with you on that point and America Ferrera's point in just a minute.

But, Brian Stelter, in terms of dollars and cents, do we even know how much, with all these companies severing ties, how much this means that his organization has lost?

STELTER: Yes, it's a loss probably more in the tens of millions than in the hundreds of millions.

The Miss USA and Miss Universe organization together have been valued at about $15 million. And then you add on top of this Macy's. Serta mattresses is no longer going to sell Trump mattresses. There's been these various impacts to his bottom line, none of them massive, but altogether very embarrassing, clearly doing reputational damage.

And to give an example about what Felix was talking about, about the marketplace for Hispanics in this country, Univision -- we're talking about Univision. Well, today, Univision announced they are going to have an IPO. They're going to sell stock for the first time. It's going to be valued at many billions of dollars, maybe up to $20 billion. It's one of the most valuable television networks in the whole country, in the whole continent.

It just goes to speak about the growing power of the Hispanic marketplace. That's what we saw Felix and his groups organize last weekend against...

(CROSSTALK)

[15:20:02]

BALDWIN: Yes.

On that point, Felix, America Ferrera, America Ferrera said: "Thank you for galvanizing Latino Americans to go to the polls, a voting bloc that has grown by 49 percent over the last decade."

Your thoughts on Latinos voting for Trump, or really it's also a lesson to any of these candidates how much power Latinos have in this country.

SANCHEZ: Well, look, we have a $1.5 trillion buying power in the United States.

And the impact of this election will be decided in some of those key states like Arizona and Nevada and Colorado and Florida. But what is key here is that it's very clear that the presidential candidates do not have a good handle or strategy to understand the Latino community on the Republican side and the Democratic side as well.

This was a perfect example of how they really could have hit it out of the ballpark, and no one did it.

BALDWIN: On both sides, a wakeup call.

Felix Sanchez, thank you so much.

Brian Stelter, thank you.

SANCHEZ: My pleasure.

STELTER: Thanks.

BALDWIN: We will see you Sunday morning, my friend.

STELTER: Thank you. BALDWIN: Coming up next here, America's unemployment rate the lowest

in six years, which is great. But there's a catch and it involves the salaries of the middle class. We have those details with Christine Romans ahead.

Also, is it safe for beachgoers to go swimming this holiday weekend? Cue the shark video, new shark attacks along the same area of the East Coast. It has a lot of people talking about whether they want to get in the water. You're watching CNN.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:25:45]

BALDWIN: Unemployment dropped to its lowest level in seven years, and more than 200,000 jobs were added. But those gains, according to experts, are not necessarily because people are finding work. And then you add to that stagnant low wages remain a sore point here with this report.

Today, while stumping his plan to raise middle-class wages, President Obama said there is more work to do.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: We have got more work to do, because we have got to get folks' wages and incomes to keep going up. We have got to make sure folks feel like their hard work is getting them somewhere.

And let's face it. There are a lot of folks who still feel like the playing field is tilted in ways that make it hard for them to get ahead.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: Let's go to someone we don't get to see at this hour often, our chief business correspondent, Christine Romans.

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: Thanks for staying up.

CHRISTINE ROMANS, CNN CHIEF BUSINESS CORRESPONDENT: Nice to see you.

BALDWIN: OK, awesome news with regard to the unemployment rate, the lowest in seven years, but what's going on with the wages?

ROMANS: Yes.

Well, when you hear the president here, he is going to look at these numbers and he's going to say, look, we need to raise the minimum wage. He's going to use these numbers to try to tout what are still his next two years of economic policies -- 5.3 percent, the unemployment rate, that's the lowest since April 2008. That's before the crisis, Brooke. So these are the lowest unemployment rates since before the crisis.

I want to put it kind of into even bigger perspective for you, going all the way back. This trend has been very nice. The unemployment rate is going lower, lower, lower month after month. But the wages have been stubborn, wages up just 2 percent. And that's what the president is talking about. He wants to have a national increase in the minimum wage.

A lot of CEOs are telling me that they think the wages are going to start to rise because they are seeing competition for jobs. They need to compete for workers for their jobs now and so they think the wages will eventually start to rise.

BALDWIN: Who is hiring? Where are the jobs?

ROMANS: That's a really good question, because we saw business and information services.

These are architects. These are computer system designers. These are engineers. These are a lot of office jobs, some temporary work in there as well, but these are higher-paid jobs. In health care, we saw it in ambulatory services. You know how you go some place for testing that is not in a hospital setting or in a doctor's office? There are a lot of jobs there, also in hospitals, also in assisted living and home health care.

A lot of different jobs in health care along the spectrum of wages, and retail jobs and bars and restaurants. And these wages are starting to rise because these companies have been jacking up their wages by about a dollar an hour because they are trying to keep workers. They are trying to keep workers in this...

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: Good.

ROMANS: Lower paid, but fast-growing part of the economy.

BALDWIN: How does this all affect our interest rates?

ROMANS: That's such a good question, because if you start to see a job market that continues to chug along like this, the Fed, the Federal Reserve will be able to raise interest rates.

BALDWIN: Increase.

ROMANS: And that means that mortgage rates will go up. Credit card rates will go up. Car loans will go up. The actionable information for you folks is please refinance your mortgage, please refinance your mortgage, because rates are going to start to rise.

Numbers like this give the Fed the runway it needs to start raising interest rates, maybe not in September, but eventually.

BALDWIN: So, we should be grateful those raises are -- interest rates are rising, I suppose. ROMANS: I would like to see bigger paychecks.

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: Yes.

ROMANS: I would like to see bigger paychecks for everyone.

BALDWIN: You hear that? You hear that, everyone?

Christine Romans, thank you so m. I really appreciate it.

ROMANS: You're welcome.

BALDWIN: And next, with thousands expected to hit the beach this upcoming holiday weekend, how safe is it to go in the water? Another shark attack off the coast of the Carolinas. Folks, this the 10th this year and it's just the beginning of July. It's quickly raising concerns. We will talk to an expert who has spent his career filming sharks.

Also, so much talk about guacamole today, people. It was "The New York Times"' tweet that sparked a national debate. "Add green peas to your guacamole. Trust us." Well, let me tell you, this tweet has caused quite the uproar. Even President Obama and Jeb Bush are weighing in. We will talk to "The New York Times"' Melissa Clark, whose food column has seemingly divided this country.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)