Return to Transcripts main page

CNN Newsroom

Pope Visits South America; Greece on the Brink; South Carolina Debates Confederate Flag. Aired 3-3:30p ET

Aired July 06, 2015 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[15:00:03]

BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN ANCHOR: Hour two. You're watching CNN. I'm Brooke Baldwin.

At this moment, the nation could be witnessing an historic turning point in South Carolina, because, right now, lawmakers are debating whether a symbol that has divided the state for generations, the Confederate Flag, should in fact remain flying there on capitol grounds.

It's happening now, nearly three weeks after that racist massacre inside a Charleston church. The Charleston killer proudly wore the symbol that many say represents hate, but others say, no, it's about Southern heritage.

CNN's Nick Valencia is live at the state capitol in Columbia, where lawmakers began debating just a couple of hours ago.

Where does the debate and a possible vote stand, Nick?

NICK VALENCIA, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, right now, the short answer is, Brooke, we just don't know. It's unclear.

I spoke to state Senator Marlon Kimpson earlier this afternoon when senators adjourned from that special session to enter caucus meetings to try to see where Democrats and Republicans stood on this issue, the bill, of course, to remove permanently the Confederate Flag from the state grounds.

Earlier today, we thought that there may have been enough votes. In fact, "The Post and Courier" on Friday taking a survey saying that there were enough votes for this bill to go through. In the last few hours, all of that may have changed.

But interesting point to note here, just a short time ago, Senator Dan Verdin, a Republican here in the state of South Carolina, proposing an amendment for this flag to only fly on Confederate Memorial Day. He addressed his colleagues in the Senate.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DANNY VERDIN (R), SOUTH CAROLINA STATE SENATOR: The current flag flying at the soldier monument right now, I'm asking that it be raised at sunup and lowered at sundown that memorializes the Confederate soldier.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

VALENCIA: This is without question a polarizing issue, with supporters of the Confederate Flag saying that it stands for Southern heritage and pride.

Opponents who are part of this take down movement, take it down movement say that it stands for racism, it stands for hatred and it should not fly on state capitol grounds. In order for this flag to be removed, it will take a two-thirds majority vote in both chambers of the state's assembly and that amounts to 31 Senate votes and 75 House rep votes. We expected perhaps a vote as early as Thursday, a decision on whether or not this flag would be brought down. It appears that may take a little bit longer, Brooke.

BALDWIN: OK. Nick Valencia, thank you so much.

I want to continue this conversation here because so much of the talk on South Carolina's Senate floor has been for the removal of the flag. It's clear the murders of those nine black worshipers last month have changed the hearts and minds of a number of lawmakers who once supported the flag and other lawmakers wish that they had done this sooner.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LARRY MARTIN (R), SOUTH CAROLINA STATE SENATOR: There's a difference between a banner that flutters in the breeze out there vs. a monument. Huge difference. Huge difference. And I don't think until what happened a few weeks ago that sort of devastated our state and country, I don't think I had ever really appreciated that to see that thing fluttering out there in a way that sort of gives some official status to it on behalf of the people of South Carolina.

That doesn't represent all the people of South Carolina.

VINCENT SHEHEEN (D), SOUTH CAROLINA STATE SENATOR: These wounds we have been dealing with for 200 years-plus, we have been pulling the Band-Aid off really slowly and it hasn't been good for us.

DARRELL JACKSON (D), SOUTH CAROLINA STATE SENATOR: When I see a Confederate soldier, I don't get goose bumps and feel all warm and fuzzy on it. I respect the fact that you do. All I'm saying is you can't force all of us to have the passion that some of you have about certain things.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: With me now from South Carolina, CNN contributor and former state Representative Bakari Sellers.

Representative Sellers, thanks for joining me.

BAKARI SELLERS, CNN CONTRIBUTOR: Thank you for having me. Thank you so much. BALDWIN: This is significant because of where you stand and also, you

know, people voting here. These are your former colleagues. What are you hearing from them? We're hearing maybe this could be over with by the end of the week. Can you just give me -- you give me a status update from what you're hearing.

SELLERS: Well, we have these conversations on a daily basis and I'm cautiously optimistic that the flag will come down.

But what I'm hearing more of are the e-mails that are being sent to my former colleagues. The tension is growing and the conversation is not one that is pleasant, although the conversation on the floor in both the House and the Senate is. The conversation and the chatter that is surrounding this body is not one that is very pleasant.

My colleagues want to get this behind them. But what I can tell you is that there are some persons who are in that body right now who, when they vote to take this flag down, that will be one of the last votes they make as a member of the South Carolina House of Representatives. They are going to go back to their respective districts and face very, very competitive primaries based on this one vote.

[15:05:10]

BALDWIN: Let me follow up with you on that. When you say -- you're saying then depending on how they vote they could lose their jobs? Can you be more specific?

SELLERS: Well, we go back to Governor David Beasley, where you had a huge movement with millions of dollars put it being it that would state keep the flag, dump Beasley.

And now you have similar comments being sent to my former colleagues who want the bring the flag down. This is a very, very divisive issue. We know that. That's one reason we want the flag to come down. And this will be profiles in courage for these legislators.

I guarantee you, some will take walks. Some will just not be present when it's time to vote. But those who have the courage to stand and vote and take it down, I think they are confident enough to live with the repercussions.

BALDWIN: You talk about how this is so divisive. We have learned -- I just want to play some sound for our viewers. There have actually been -- some have been receiving robocalls, calling on saving of the Confederate Flag. Listen to this.

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This attack on our values is sick and un-American and it has to stop right here, right now.

Leave our flag alone and not stand with leftist fanatics who want to destroy the South we love. Stand up. Call now.

Paid for by the Conservative Response Team.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

BALDWIN: So, that's an example of a robocall.

But then there was this. I was just talking to our correspondent who was reporting that one of these state senators was proposing there would be a Confederate Memorial Day in which the flag would be raised and lowered on that one day.

Do you think that would fly, sir? No pun intended.

SELLERS: First of all, let me just clarify that we currently have a Confederate Memorial Day.

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: I'm from the South and I saw that. I have never heard of a Confederate Memorial Day.

SELLERS: It is a state holiday. We will work on that next.

But, right now, that flag -- they want the flag to be raised on Confederate Memorial Day and lowered at the end of it. The problem with that is that the compromise in 2000 got us to the situation where it was flying from the stop of the statehouse sort of in our faces every day. I don't think we will have a compromise.

This flag will either remain up for the rest of my lifetime or it's going to come down this week. And we're hopeful. We're really hopeful that it comes down in the next few days.

BALDWIN: Listen, as I mentioned, I'm from the South. I understand. I love where I'm from and I love celebrating Southern heritage, but I understand that you have to draw the line somewhere.

I was reading about NASCAR and they have even taken the stand, urging people who are going to races not to wave the banner, but even over this past weekend in Daytona, not everyone was listening to them. You have golfer Bubba Watson who has that "Dukes of Hazzard" car and he, all right, I'm going to repaint over the Confederate Flag there.

But, bottom line, it's one thing to remove the flag. That is not -- to me, there is such a deeper issue of hate that doesn't go away when you take a flag away.

SELLERS: Well, I share in that pride in my Southern heritage as well.

I'm proud to be a part of the South. But that Confederate Flag doesn't represent me. To be completely honest, I could care less what you do on your own private property. I could care less if you paint it on your car. And then you have to understand that I have the right to have an opinion about what you do.

But that's your prerogative. This statehouse is not any one individual's home. It's not their personal property. This is ours. This is our shared culture. This is our shared South Carolina, our shared soil. And my hope is that people respect that and understand that and maybe we can move forward into the 21st century.

BALDWIN: Bakari Sellers, let's loop back and have another conversation at the end of the week, shall we? Thank you so much.

SELLERS: I will be here. Thank you so much for the opportunity. All right.

BALDWIN: Thank you. You got it.

Coming up next, a young woman walking with her father shot and killed on a crowded pier broad daylight in San Francisco, the suspect, an undocumented immigrant with a long rap sheet who has been deported five times -- why he was not behind bars next.

Also, Greece teetering on the brink of financial collapse, banks still closed. Could the vote from over the weekend make it tougher to find a solution? How much will this really impact us here in the U.S.?

And the pope, a rock star reception in South America here, his message as he speaks back on his home continent.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:13:43]

BALDWIN: You're watching CNN, I'm Brooke Baldwin.

Kate Steinle was walking with her father Wednesday on a pier in San Francisco, popular tourist area, broad daylight, lots and lots of people around, when she was shot and killed by a single bullet. She was apparently just a random target, one bullet and she was gone, 31 years of age.

The suspect here is Juan Francisco Lopez-Sanchez, an undocumented immigrant with seven felonies on his record. He had been deported to Mexico five times in the past. The suspect's criminal background and immigration status has sparked a lot of debate and plenty of angry here.

But Kate Steinle's father says he's focused on his daughter and he says the outpouring of public support gives him hope.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JIM STEINLE, FATHER OF VICTIM: The people that would stop that doesn't know Kate and our family, and to put a memorial for her tells me that, you know, love is going to triumph over evil.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: CNN's Dan Simon joins me from San Francisco

And we know, Dan, the suspect has opened up, talked to a local reporter there in San Francisco, said he did it. What else did he there?

DAN SIMON, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Brooke, first of all, this story, as you know, is really going to galvanize critics of America's immigration problem.

[15:15:00]

Here you have this guy who had been convicted of many crimes and been deported an astounding five times to his native Mexico, and somehow he's able to roam the streets of San Francisco, get ahold of a gun and then come to this popular tourist destination, where he fires off a ground and it kills this young woman.

Now, get this. Before he came to this area, he said he found some sleeping pills in a dumpster and then as he's walking around he found a gun wrapped in a T-shirt and when he picked it up it just accidentally went off. Here is what he said during that jailhouse interview.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

QUESTION: Did you shoot Kate Steinle, the lady who was down on Pier 14?

JUAN FRANCISCO LOPEZ-SANCHEZ, SUSPECT: Yes.

QUESTION: You did shoot her?

LOPEZ-SANCHEZ: Mm-hmm.

QUESTION: Where did you get the gun?

LOPEZ-SANCHEZ: In the ground. When the -- when the -- over there in the bench, I put DOWN my leg and I see the one T-shirt, and then I SEE OVER There something like. Then, suddenly, I heard a boom, boom three times.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SIMON: Brooke, this case offers sort of a rare look into so many things, first of all, weak border enforcement.

How did this guy come over to the United States five times or more? And then you have the issue of the so-called sanctuary cities. There's going to be this debate over the wisdom of these so-called sanctuary cities.

And then finally there's the issue of gun control that some people will raise. The question is, we're not sure if authorities are going to believe this story of just finding this gun wrapped in a T-shirt. I think at this point that's pretty suspect -- Brooke.

BALDWIN: Yes, casting suspicion on that. Let me follow up though on the notion of sanctuary cities because I don't know how familiar our viewers are on that and the fact that Sanchez -- Dan, you with me? All right. I think we lost him. We will move on. SIMON: Brooke, I don't know -- I lost your audio there, but I think

you were asking me a little bit sanctuary cities.

Now, here's the deal with sanctuary cities. Basically, what it means is they are not going to comply with federal authorities' take when it comes to immigration. If the authorities say, you know what, we want you to comply with the order that we want to take this person into custody and charge them based on their immigration status, they are not going to comply.

San Francisco takes an even harder -line approach in that regard. San Francisco, if the authorities say put a detainer on a suspect, which they did in this case with Francisco Lopez -- they put a detainer on him -- San Francisco said no. That's what this whole debate is going to be about, on these so-called detainers and whether cities should honor them -- I will throw it back to you.

BALDWIN: Dan Simon, thank you so much.

Just following up, the point I was also going to make is the fact that in this jailhouse interview Sanchez said, yes, this is the reason why I came to San Francisco, because of the so-called sanctuary city status.

Coming up here on CNN, how about this for an exit? Take a look at this picture. This is the finance minister of Greece quitting his job, hopping on his motorcycle with his wife and driving off into the country's cash crisis, leaving that, driving off into the sunset. How is Greece though -- the real question here, how is Greece impacting your money, your 401(k) and perhaps your next European vacation? We will ask all those questions.

Also, crowds and crowds of people here lining the streets all to just catch a glimpse of this man in the Popemobile -- where he is today and why this is so special. That's straight ahead.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:22:55]

BALDWIN: All eyes on Greece's money woes. Negotiations are under way for a new financial recovery plan after voters over the weekend rejected this European bailout. But the turmoil is having a rippling effect on other economies.

CNN chief business correspondent Christine Romans breaks down what it all means for America's bank accounts.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

CHRISTINE ROMANS, CNN CHIEF BUSINESS CORRESPONDENT: Brooke, the Greek people told Europe, basically, take your bailout and shove it. And that means that Greece now dangerously close to leaving the Eurozone.

Greece is drowning in debt, it desperately needs money, and European leaders have an emergency summit tomorrow. What does all this mean for your wallet? Three things. First, your 401(k) could lose value. The Dow last week had the worst drop of the year, when it became clear Greece would miss a debt payment. That could happen again.

How bad could it be? Well, stocks wobbling today, but Greece is a tiny economy and U.S. investors have little direct exposure, but still we could be in for wild swings and dips until Greece finds resolution.

Second, travel to Europe could be a lot cheaper for travelers. There's a noticeable difference here. The euro is plunging against the dollar. That means every dollar saved for vacation to Spain or Paris, that dollar will go farther. That strong dollar is good for American tourists, but it's bad for American companies that sell things abroad.

And, Brooke, third, turmoil in Greece could delay higher interest rates here. If the Eurozone is in turmoil, it's the largest trading partner for America, after all, the Federal Reserve could be more reluctant to raise interest rates this fall.

Those are three ways, Brooke, Greece matters to your money.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BALDWIN: Christine Romans, thank you very much.

So how could this affect us and why should we really be caring about China?

Let me bring in CNN global economic analyst Rana Foroohar, who joins me here, beginning with Greece. I love how Christine put it, take it and shove it, so says the Greeks.

But, seriously, though, this could have, to your point, as we were discussing in commercial, political fallout if they exit the euro.

RANA FOROOHAR, CNN ANALYST: Absolutely, because if you think about it, if Greece is left on its own, who is it going to look to for money and for political support? Russia, China, perhaps any number of Middle Eastern countries?

[15:25:00]

So, that's one of the reasons why you see the president and Jack Lew getting involved in this and saying, hey, you guys have got to fix this because they don't want a situation where the Balkans is destabilized by this.

BALDWIN: This is why, ring-ring, Vladimir Putin has already been on the phone apparently with the Greek P.M. Why? What's in it for Russia and given everything we have been reporting with Ukraine and the sanctions, could they even pull this off?

FOROOHAR: Well, it's interesting. Russia is having its own economic crisis. But that's one of the reasons why Putin has been so aggressive. He wants people to not focus on what is happening at home. He likes

to stir up trouble abroad. It creates a sense of nationalism, particularly amongst young Russians. It makes them feel powerful. So this is another weak peripheral area of Europe that Russia can stir up trouble in, just like the Ukraine. Greece could potentially become another area where you start to see conflict.

And if Europe is perceived as being weak and even not able to fix its own debt crisis, that only encourages countries like Russia.

BALDWIN: So when you go to CNN Money right now, CNNMoney.com, the big headline is about why we should care less about what is happening in Greece and more about China. When you read further, they talked about how the markets were down 30 percent. And I was even hearing about comparisons here in the U.S. 1929 or 2008.

FOROOHAR: Yes. Yes.

BALDWIN: Tell me why it could be bad news.

FOROOHAR: Well, it's bad news in China. And it's been bad news for a while.

China is basically having a debt crisis that is not dissimilar from what happened in the U.S. in 2008. It's a subprime crisis. There's been a lot of bad lending. If you look at how much debt it takes to create growth in China now, it's $4 of debt for every $1 of growth. That ratio used to be 1-1 just five years ago. Just think how much more debt China needs to create its growth.

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: Why do I care here in the U.S.?

FOROOHAR: Why do you care? Because China buys a lot of our stuff.

(CROSSTALK)

FOROOHAR: And it's one of our main trading partners as well. And, you know, it's one of the three legs of the global economy.

I like to think of it as a stool.

BALDWIN: OK.

FOROOHAR: You have got the U.S., Europe and China. The U.S. is really the only leg, amazingly, that is not too shaky right now. That's not great for growth.

We have got a recovery under way, but it's not a strong enough recovery that we can pull everybody else along with us. Yes.

BALDWIN: OK. Rana Foroohar, thank you so much.

FOROOHAR: You're welcome.

BALDWIN: And really just a great resource, go to CNNMoney.com for much more on this.

Coming up next, you have seen the pope pictures?

FOROOHAR: I haven't.

BALDWIN: Oh, I'm being told in my ear live, live pictures of the pope. Got to love this. This is CNN. The crowds have gathered. This is Guayaquil, Ecuador, packing the streets. Listen, it's always a rock star reception for the pope, especially when he heads home, I should say his homeland, his continent of South America. We will take you there and hear more on his message ahead.

Also just in to CNN, a new request from the attorney team of the Boston bomber, Dzhokhar Tsarnaev, who has been convicted, who has been sentenced to death. A new twist here, what he's asking -- straight ahead on CNN.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)