Return to Transcripts main page

CNN Newsroom

Trump Lawyer Defends Candidate Against Rape Allegations; Accused Prison Worker Faces Judge; Daily Beast Answers Questions; Coast Guard Intensified Branch for L.A. Teens. Aired 10-10:30a ET

Aired July 28, 2015 - 10:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


[10:00:00] CAROL COSTELLO, CNN ANCHOR: Rape allegation decades ago from his then wife Ivana. Ivana Trump later walked back the rape accusation saying while she felt violated it was not rape in the criminal sense. But here's what Michael Cohen, a special counsel in Trump's business empire, told the "Daily Beast."

Quote, "You're talking about the frontrunner for the GOP presidential candidate, as well as a private individual who never raped anybody. And of course understand that by the very definition, you can't rape your spouse. It is true. You cannot rape your spouse and there's very clear case law," except that is not true. Marital rape would be a crime.

We'll hear from the "Daily Beast" shortly but we begin with CNN's Athena Jones. She's in Washington with more.

Good morning.

ATHENA JONES, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Carol. Another week, another controversy for the Trump campaign. Of course he is the frontrunner in the Republican race right now so he's under a lot of scrutiny as are the people who work for him.

As you said Michael Cohen is wrong, setting the record straight on that. Marital rape is illegal in all 50 states and nonconsensual sex with a spouse constitutes rape so he's wrong on that.

We reached out -- CNN reached out to Michael Cohen. He said he didn't want to talk but he will be putting out a statement.

Now the Trump campaign is distancing themselves from Cohen. They say that Trump does not agree with his lawyer and that Cohen does not speak for him. But I can tell you that in this "Daily Beast" article, this exchange that Michael Cohen had with the reporter who wrote this article, he threatened the reporter, said he'd take him to court, sue him for every penny he has, come after the "Daily Beast," come after everyone the reporter knows.

I want to play for you a little bit more of that reporter Tim Mak talking about that heated exchange with Mr. Cohen. Go ahead and play that.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) TIM MAK, SENIOR CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT, THE DAILY BEAST: I think it was important to look into, especially since Donald Trump launched his presidential campaign, making insults about Mexican immigrants, saying that they were, quote, "rapists." So it was a little bit relevant to look into his past and see exactly what might have been said about him on that topic in his personal life.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: And how did Mr. Trump's lawyer respond when you asked these questions?

MAK: I think it started off a little bit reasonably. They were trying to say that the allegation was not made in a criminal sense like you mentioned. But then it descended into insults and threats, threats of lawsuits telling me to tread lightly and to say that whatever lawsuits that they might file against me would be disgusting. It evolved pretty quickly.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

JONES: So there you have a contentious exchange between that reporter and Michael Cohen. It got ugly fast. I want to tell you, though, share with you, a statement that we have from Trump's former wife Ivana Trump about this story. She said, "I have recently received some comments attributed to me -- recently read some comments attributed to me from nearly 30 years ago at a time of very high tension during my divorce with -- from Donald. The story is totally without merit. Donald and I are the best of friends and together have raised three children that we love and are very proud of. I have nothing but fondness for Donald and wish him the best of luck on his campaign. Incidentally I think he would make an incredible president."

So that is the statement we have from Ivana Trump but of course this sorry is not going to go away. It's already getting a lot of attention. And Democrats are trying to make hay out of it. Democratic National Committee chairwoman Debbie Wasserman Schultz issued this statement. She said, in part, "This is a new low. Rape is rape, full stop. End of story. There is no difference or division between forcible, legitimate, marital or any other label Republicans slap on before this word rape. All rape is a disgusting violation and Americans have fought too long and hard for that to be acknowledged to still have it questioned in 2015."

So there you have the head of the DNC trying to link these comments to other controversial comments made by Republican candidates in the past. She also said that Republicans need to take a stand calling on them to stand up and call this what it is, quote, "despicable." So a lot of attention this is getting. We'll wait for that statement from Michael Cohen and share that with you as well -- Carol.

COSTELLO: All right. Thanks so much, Athena Jones.

So let's talk about this with Democratic strategist Robert Zimmerman and CNN political commentator and conservative Ben Ferguson.

Thanks to you both for being with me. Robert Zimmermann, Democratic strategist. Good morning.

COSTELLO: Good morning. So the Trump camp is saying Michael Cohen doesn't speak for Donald Trump. Only Donald Trump speaks for Donald Trump. And it was Michael Cohen that says you can't rape your spouse.

So, Ben, will this affect Donald Trump at all?

BEN FERGUSON, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: I think it will affect him some. I think Donald Trump is actually pretty good at coming out and understanding when he does need to talk. I wish he understood when he doesn't need to, but on this issue I think you will see him come out very clearly and say this was 30 years ago. I did not make this comments about you, you know, you cannot rape your spouse, and I'm sure he will do everything he can to distance himself from that and say that is not what I think.

I also think seeing her comments, his ex-wife's comments coming out, that's going to help him tremendously. She said this was a stressed out time 30 years ago. It sounds like there was some gamesmanship there in that divorce.

[10:05:09] From her comment, she is now endorsing him for the presidency. So from being an actual story of did he do anything wrong with her, I don't think this will stick at all. I think these comments from his lawyer is his biggest obstacle at this moment.

Well, you know --

COSTELLO: Except, except in the "Daily Beast" article it describes the incident in detail. So, frankly, I don't know what to believe. We're going to try to talk to the "Daily Beast" reporter a little later.

But, Robert, I would ascertain that Trump supporters will just think this is another attack by the media on Donald Trump.

ZIMMERMAN: Look, this story about Donald Trump and his wife is a big -- is big news for Perez Hilton or TMZ but it's not going to have any impact in the presidential race. Obviously his lawyer's comments, Michael Cohen's comments, certainly are going to have a big impact on Michael Cohen because they're despicable and ignorant and it really is a pathetic reflection of who he is both in terms of his thought process and also in terms of his legal thinking.

But in terms of what this means in the presidential race, there are so many tawdry and disgraceful aspects to Donald Trump's campaigns and the positions he's taken and his conduct that we don't have to dig into his divorce with his first wife. I think it's improper to do that and it has no place in what is already a pretty low bar in the Republican field.

COSTELLO: Oh, my gosh, it's just been such a strange --

FERGUSON: And look, there's also --

(CROSSTALK)

COSTELLO: Go ahead. Go ahead, Ben.

FERGUSON: It also fits the narrative that Donald Trump has been working with, which is the media is out to get me, the Republican candidates are out to get me, everyone is out to get me, and I'm the only one telling the truth, and he will probably be able to use this to say look how low people will go to come after me. Go back 30 years. My wife says it's not an issue and she's supporting me for the presidency -- or ex-wife I should say -- and this is probably going to just make his base even more solid to say this is -- you know, this is another political smear campaign because people are afraid of Donald Trump running this country.

ZIMMERMAN: Well, you know the Republican --

COSTELLO: You know, I just -- I just want to get out this new poll, Robert, before you go on. There's a new poll out of New Hampshire, the Monmouth poll. It shows Trump has more than doubled the support of Jeb Bush, 24 percent of Republicans say if the primary was today, they would vote for Donald Trump. He's just becoming more popular, Robert.

ZIMMERMAN: Well, I think it's a mistake to interpret Donald Trump's ratings to reflect popularity. I think what you're really witnessing is the Republican Party base in rebellion against the Republican Party establishment. If you add up Donald Trump's numbers and Ted Cruz's numbers along with Rick Santorum and Mike Huckabee and Ben Carson, you're talking about almost half of the Republicans who are polled in that poll and in other polls demonstrating very strong opposition to the Republican establishment.

And so that's what it reflects, but it also reflects why the Republican Party has lost the vote in five of the six last presidential elections. Because they stand as a party that's against but has no agenda for the future, no agenda to build -- to move this economy forward or to build the middle class. And so I think what we're witnesses obviously politically, it's looking like -- it's really looking like -- makes the World Wrestling Entertainment division look more respectable.

COSTELLO: Yes. Well --

ZIMMERMAN: Than what we're witnessing now.

COSTELLO: You know, the saddest thing is Jeb Bush came out and outlined his immigration plan in Spanish and it's kind of gotten lost in all of this stuff swirling around Donald Trump.

(CROSSTALK)

FERGUSON: Yes.

ZIMMERMAN: Well, actually --

COSTELLO: So I don't -- FERGUSON: And if you're the other -- if you're the other candidates

right now, I mean, you're doing anything you can to try to not talk about Donald Trump. Look, there are more than 50 percent of registered Republicans that say they're not going to vote for Donald Trump. So his unfavorables are his biggest liability. Yes, he has a core group that absolutely are obsessed with him, but overall he is not someone that's going to be able to I think win this nomination because there's so many people in the Republican Party that absolutely cannot stand Donald Trump as well, and so this -- we are far from --

ZIMMERMAN: But here's the problem, Ben.

FERGUSON: -- him being anywhere close to being the nomination.

COSTELLO: All right. I've got to leave it there. I've got to leave it there. I do.

ZIMMERMAN: OK. Thank you.

COSTELLO: Robert Zimmerman, Ben Ferguson, thanks to both of you. I appreciate it.

We are watching other news this morning.

The showdown on Capitol Hill over the Iran nuclear deal. Right now the House Foreign Affairs Committee is holding their first hearing on the deal. Secretary of State John Kerry will testify at today's meeting. Also making an appearance will be the secretaries of energy and the treasury. We are monitoring the hearing. If anything develops, of course we'll bring it to you.

Minutes from now Joyce Mitchell, the New York prison worker accused of helping two killers bust out of prison, will be back in court. The big question, will she cut a deal? Mitchell faces up to eight years behind bars in she is convicted.

Jason Carroll is here, he's following the hearing today. He has more.

Good morning.

JASON CARROLL, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: And good morning to you. As you say it could happen any moment now. We've already seen Joyce Mitchell cooperating in some sense. We're already hearing word that she's expected to waive her right to have her charges presented in front of the grand jury. That would be another sign of cooperating. We've seen in the past her telling about all that she was accused of doing in terms of helping with this prison break.

[10:10:03] Let's go over first what some of the charges that she's facing. First-degree promoting prison contraband. You talked about smuggling in some of those hacksaw blades. Fourth-degree criminal facilitation. That's for her role in helping these two guys get out, David Sweat and Richard Matt. In terms of what's ahead for her, she could be looking at as much as eight years in prison. But once again her attorney telling me this was even just weeks ago that he is hoping for some sort of plea deal. Now in terms of what she's accused of, again, just to review just a

little bit here. She was supposed to be the alleged getaway driver. Apparently got cold feet, decided she wasn't going to do that. Provided tools to cut through all the cell walls. The D.A. telling me that not only it was just a hacksaw blade but also chisels, a punch tool and a screw driver. Again that's according to the Clinton County district attorney.

Also her cell phone was used to reach out to some of Richard Matt's friends and her relationship with David sweat, even though she's not charged with anything in terms of her relationship with David Sweat, that is still under investigation. He says he did not have a sexual relationship with her, but there's also word that there was some sort of a murder plot that was involved here to murder her husband, Lyle, who also worked at the prison. She denies that.

David Sweat said no, you shouldn't be denying this, you were the one who was a part of this. She says, I was not a part of this. Her attorney says she was not a part of this and none of the charges that she's facing today have to deal with those murder allegations, that murder plot allegations, but she is facing that first-degree promoting prison contraband, fourth-degree criminal facilitation.

We're going to have to see what happens but there have been clear steps already that she has been cooperating. We'll see if it leads to some sort of a plea deal.

COSTELLO: She's due in court in just about 20 minutes or so.

All right. Jason Carroll, many thanks.

Still to come in the NEWSROOM, the Coast Guard intensifying its search and still no luck finding those two missing teenagers.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[10:16:05] COSTELLO: Donald Trump in the middle of a new controversy. His camp now responding to a rape allegation decades ago from his then-wife Ivana. Ivana Trump later walked back that accusation saying, while she felt violated it was not rape in the criminal sense.

Here is what Michael Cohen, a special counsel in Trump's business empire told the "Daily Beast," and here's where the controversy is. Quote, "You're talking about the frontrunner for the GOP presidential candidate, as well as a private individual who never raped anybody. And, of course, understand that by the very definition, you can't rape your spouse. It's true, you cannot rape your spouse, and there's a very clear case law," except that is not true. In the state of New York, it is illegal to rape your wife.

SO let's talk about the "Daily Beast" article and why they chose to write this with the executive editor Noah Shachtman.

Thanks, Noah, for joining us.

NOAH SHACHTMAN, EXECUTIVE EDITOR, THE DAILY BEAST: Thanks for having me, Carol.

COSTELLO: Why was it important to publish this article?

SHACHTMAN: Well, I think it was important for a number of reasons. First of all, Donald Trump has had a history of really strange kind of awful statements about rape. He talked about, you know, Mexican immigrants being rapists. He basically blamed the military sexual assaults on women service members, and then, you know -- and then as we dug into this and asked for comment, we got Mr. Cohen's outrageous remarks, and that really sort of opened the Pandora's Box.

COSTELLO: Can you -- like where did this allegation come from? You obtained some sort of legal documents to get the information, right?

SHACHTMAN: Yes, that's right. It appeared in a book in the '90s about the Trumps, and we saw the allegation there and then we went to New York City court records and found more information there.

COSTELLO: And there was a detail described about exactly what happened the day that -- the day that -- I don't know how to characterize it since Ivana Trump has now characterized it as not something criminal. Help us parse that out.

SHACHTMAN: Yes, yes. Well, let me tell you a little bit about what happened. During the Trumps' divorce proceedings, Ivana gave a deposition. In that deposition she said, quote, "I stated that my husband had raped me." She then -- when this book came out a few years later, walked that back a little bit and said that she felt violated during a sexual encounter but that she didn't mean rape in the criminal or literal sense.

COSTELLO: And now she's stepping back even farther with a new statement, right?

SHACHTMAN: Yes. Yes, that's right. And, look, you know, maybe with 30 years' hindsight, you know, this far after the fact perhaps she's gained some new clarity but what her statement doesn't do, not in the slightest, is undo this outrageous statement by Mr. Trump's lawyer and his spokesman that a husband can't rape his wife, which is legally untrue and morally despicable.

COSTELLO: I would suppose Donald Trump says nobody speaks for me including Michael Cohen. These are his words, not mine.

SHACHTMAN: Yes, except that's totally not true because Michael Cohen has been on any number of TV shows representing the Trump campaign. So if he wants to now say that Cohen doesn't represent him, that's fine, but yesterday when we contacted the Trump Organization and asked for a spokesman, this is who we got speaking to us.

COSTELLO: OK. There's a new statement out, this is from a Trump campaign representative. He also slammed the "Daily Beast." He said, "It's just a way for the badly failing and money losing 'Daily Beast' which has been reporting inaccurately on Mr. Trump for years to get some publicity for itself."

Can you respond to that?

SHACHTMAN: Yes. Well, first of all, we were given that statement around last night. And when we asked the campaign to cite any specific inaccuracies about our reporting, they couldn't come up with anything. So I suppose their media critiques are as lousy as their legal ones.

[10:20:15] COSTELLO: Noah, thanks for being with me this morning. I appreciate it.

SHACHTMAN: Thanks.

COSTELLO: You're welcome.

The search for those two teenagers missing at sea is intensifying this morning. Austin Stephanos and Perry Cohen have now been missing for five days. Their capsized boat found on Sunday but there was no sign of the boys.

In the last 24 hours this message has been plastered across social media. Family members saying the boys could have made floating devices with a cooler, an engine cover and life jackets missing from that overturned boat. This as the Coast Guard is now refocusing its search. It's now 60 miles off Jacksonville. That area now widening thanks in part to the gulf stream.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You only have to go off about 10 miles and you encounter the gulf stream. That current basically took over their momentum and pushed them north. So we planned on that and our search areas were predicated on that fact and it validated our search efforts when we found the boat.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: That Coast Guard captain says at some point they're going to have to end the search and maybe they're talking about that right now.

Alina Machado is in Jupiter where the boys were last seen.

Good morning, Alina.

ALINA MACHADO, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Carol. The Coast Guard says the search is challenging but they are vowing to continue at least for now. The families meanwhile are hoping and praying for a miracle.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

MACHADO (voice-over): This morning rescue teams are beginning day five of their search for missing teenage boaters Austin Stephanos and Perry Cohen. On Sunday crews located the boys' capsized boat off the coast of Florida. Austin and Perry nowhere in sight. Only a single orange life vest floating alongside the 19-foot vessel. UNIDENTIFIED MALE: That's a negative. We just confirmed nobody is on

board. They're trying to find any other gear.

CAPT. MARK FEDOR, U.S. COAST GUARD: It is positive news in that it helped validate our search efforts that we were looking in the right area. Obviously disappointed that the boys were not clinging to that boat.

MACHADO: Now with the Gulf Stream in mind, they're searching north of where the boat was located about 77 miles off the coast of St. Augustine.

FEDOR: So it's been all-hands-on-deck type of effort.

MACHADO: The operation aggressive, the U.S. Coast Guard executing at least 36 different searches with the help from the Navy. Crews have now scoured more than 37,000 square miles. That's more than the size of Indiana.

CARLY BLACK, MOTHER OF MISSING 14-YEAR-OLD AUSTIN STEPHANOS: These boys have been out there doing this forever. It's not new to them. They prepare for these situations.

MACHADO: The boys' moms say their sons are both licensed and experienced boaters.

PAMELA COHEN, MOTHER OF MISSING 14-YEAR-OLD PERRY COHEN: I think a lot of people think about -- but the boys are only 14 years old, what were they doing out on a boat? We live in a boating community and this is part of the lifestyle here.

MACHADO: The Coast Guard says right now the good conditions could work in Austin and Perry's favor, saying a person could survive in these warm waters for four to five days.

COHEN: The boys are raised on the water. They're raised on boats. So it really is second nature to them. They're going to be OK.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

MACHADO: The Perry and Austin Rescue Fund has been established to help pay for private searches for the missing teens. So far they've raised more than $58,000 -- Carol.

COSTELLO: Alina Machado, reporting live from Jupiter, Florida, this morning.

Still to come in the NEWSROOM, unanswered questions remain about the arrest and death of Sandra Bland. Now there's a push to bring in the U.S. Justice Department.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[10:28:03] COSTELLO: Sandra Bland, who died in jail after a traffic stop, had marijuana in her system. That's what an autopsy performed by the Harris County Medical Examiner shows. That autopsy also shows no signs of struggle, so at the moment it appears Bland may have committed suicide. But the case is far from over. There are calls for the U.S. Justice Department to investigate Bland's arrest and her death. So far U.S. Attorney Loretta Lynch isn't biting, but she is commenting on the case.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LORETTA LYNCH, U.S. ATTORNEY GENERAL: I think that it highlights the concern of many in the black community that a routine stop for many of our -- for the members of the black community is not handled with the same professionalism and courtesy that other people may get from the police.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: Illinois Congressman Bill Foster is urging Lynch to open an investigation into Bland's death. He's written a letter to the attorney general and he joins me now.

Welcome, sir.

REP. BILL FOSTER (D), ILLINOIS: Happy to be here, Carol.

COSTELLO: Happy to have you with me. The Waller County district attorney has already appointed an independent oversight committee, so why not wait until that investigation is complete?

FOSTER: Well, Sandra Bland was a constituent of mine. And she lived until recently in Naperville, Illinois, a quiet suburb of Chicago that's in my district. And at the memorial service that was held last weekend it was absolutely clear that the -- that her family, her friends, those that loved her were not going to trust anything short of a full, complete, and fair federal investigation into the circumstances surrounding both her traffic stop and her death in custody.

COSTELLO: An autopsy showed there was no struggle in Bland's death, meaning she may have committed suicide. CNN talked to the woman in the cell next to bland. She heard no signs of a struggle, no signs of distress except for Bland's crying. What do you think happened to her?

FOSTER: Well, I don't want to speculate on this. There are really two issues here. The first is the traffic stop itself. I have not talked to one officer of the law that believes that the police officer acted appropriately in those circumstances.