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Interview with Former Trump Adviser; Interview with Kate Bohner; Donald Trump's Comments about Megyn Kelly Widely Condemned. Aired 6-7p ET
Aired August 08, 2015 - 18:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
POPPY HARLOW, CNN ANCHOR: 6:00 Eastern, 3:00 Pacific this Saturday. I'm Poppy Harlow in New York. Thank you so much for being with me and we begin with this hour with a major shakeup in the Presidential Campaign of Donald Trump.
Longtime political insider and adviser, top adviser to Donald Trump, Roger Stone is suddenly out of the Trump Camp. Trump says he fired Stone. Stone says that is not true.
He tweeted "Sorry @realDonaldTrump didn't fire me- I fired Trump. Diasagree with diversion to food fight with @megynkelly away core issue messagesSorry @realDonaldTrump didn't fire me- I fired Trump.
Diasagree with diversion to food fight with @megynkelly away core issue messages." Stone was referring to Trump's dig at Fox Anchor and Fox Debate Moderate Megyn Kelly during Thursday night's GOP Debate.
Trying to clarify what he said. Trump's remarks last night to CNN's Don Lemon managed to inflame things. Listen.
(BEGIN VIDEOCLIP)
DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: So I have, you know she -- she gets out and she starts asking me all sorts of ridiculous questions, and you know you could see there was blood coming out of her eyes.
Blood coming out of her wherever, but she was -- in my opinion she was off-base. And by the way, not in my opinion, in the opinion of hundreds of thousands of people on Twitter. Because it has been a brutal day -
(END VIDEOCLIP)
HARLOW: Trump after that was not invited to a conservative Republic event in Atlanta called the Red State Gathering. He was supposed to speak there at 8:00 tonight. He will not be there.
He responded saying he is honored to be disinvited. He called the event organizer Erick Erickson weak and pathetic. With me now, Roger Stone, someone who is a friend of Donald Trump, has been a friend for 35 years. You were his top adviser.
You're not with the Camp anymore. I want to get right to it, and I want to read you what his campaign said about you leaving so let's pull this up.
ROGER STONE, FORMER ADVISER TO DONALD TRUMP: Okay.
HARLOW: It says Mr. Trump fired Roger Stone last night. We have a tremendously successful campaign and Roger wanted to use the campaign for his own political -- for his own personal publicity.
He has had a number of articles about him recently and Mr. Trump wants to keep the focus of the campaign on how to make America great again. Were you fired by Donald Trump?
STONE: No, not at all. And let me say from the top that I have nothing but admiration and respect for Donald Trump. I think he's the one person with the independence to take on an entire corrupt political system.
He's independent of the lobbyists, the special interests, and those who block any real reform. I think in the 40 years that I have been in American politics, I have never seen anything like the way he has zoomed to the top of the polls.
I mean let's put this in perspective. He's a Manhattan real estate developer, and he's leading 14, 15 other experienced politicians. Why? Because he had a core message of taking on the system, fixing our broke immigration system, taking on China and Mexico.
Redoing these trade deals to bring jobs back to the country. He was a breath of fresh air.
I resigned largely because I thought I was having no impact, and the campaign has been diverted from those big picture issues that have catapulted Trump to the number one position in the polls, which I thought was counterproductive. It just --
HARLOW: Can you take us into what happened behind closed doors?
STONE: No, no --
HARLOW: The Camp says you were fired. I say I was not fired, I resigned. When exactly did it happen, and take us into that room.
STONE: It's very simple. I made a decision this morning that I was having no impact, and I e-mailed a letter to Donald saying that I wished him the very best, that I would have nothing negative to say about him or his campaign.
When you're in a campaign you're in a situation where you have a lot of confidential information, and I have no intention of talking about internal campaign deliberations or who said what to whom.
All I can really do at this point is offer my advice and how I view the way the campaign should go forward.
HARLOW: So you sent a letter.
STONE: Correct. HARLOW: You sent it in an e-mail.
STONE: Correct.
HARLOW: What did you hear back?
STONE: I didn't hear anything back. I was called by a Washington Post reporter early this afternoon who told me that Trump said that I had been fired, which is inaccurate.
HARLOW: 35 years you've been a very close friend of Donald Trump. Do you still --
STONE: You know, I've been to two of his three wedding. I went to both his parents' funerals.
HARLOW: Right.
STONE: His sister, Maryanne Trump Barry is a very good friend of mine. I have nothing but admiration and respect for Trump.
HARLOW: Do you still consider him a friend?
STONE: Yes, I do.
HARLOW: You do?
STONE: Yes.
HARLOW: Let me --
STONE: Because this is just politics.
HARLOW: I'll re-read this to you. This is a transcript published today in POLITICO of what they were told happened, okay.
STONE: Yes.
HARLOW: I'm going to leave out the expletives in here.
STONE: Yes.
HARLOW: Stone, you saying, "Donald, stop with the Megyn Kelly bleep. It's crazy. It's killing us." Trump, "What do you mean? I won the debate. People loved it." You, "You didn't win the debate."
Trump, "Yes, I did. Look at the polling. Look at Drudge." You, "The Drudge Report Poll isn't a scientific poll. You won't give me the money to pay for a scientific poll and you're off message."
Trump, "There are other polls." You, "Those are B.S. polls, Donald, they're not scientific polls. We need to run a professional campaign and talk about what people care about." Trump, "We're winning."
Is this accurate?
STONE: Obviously I do not tape record my phone calls. Somebody might.
HARLOW: Okay. Not word for word. Is that true?
STONE: I think that's a pretty accurate reflection of my views. Now I am not going to kiss and tell about my advice to Donald, and my conversations with him are between he and I.
But I think that's a fairly accurate reflection of my view. I would submit that we should wait a few days and see some scientifically- based, non-online polls and see how the Republic race has been affected.
The question of a third-party candidacy I think is a very important one, and problematic with Republican voters.
HARLOW: So I want to get to that in one second, but I want to ask you.
STONE: All right.
HARLOW: You said I will not sort of disrespect my friendship with Donald Trump.
STONE: Right.
HARLOW: By telling you exactly verbatim what I said. Do you think Trump will honor that as well, that he won't say probably to the media what the two of you talked about and how that conversation went?
STONE: That's a question you'd have to direct to Mr. Trump. I can't tell you what he would do.
HARLOW: We've invited him to call in, so Mr. Trump, if you're watching please do call in, but he will be on State of the Union with our Jake Tapper --
STONE: Okay.
HARLOW: -- tomorrow morning at 9:00 a.m. Third-party. You saw him raise his hand. First few seconds of the debate on Thursday night.
STONE: Yes, yes.
HARLOW: Do you believe that Donald Trump, if he runs as an independent and a third-party, can he win?
STONE: Let me say two things. First of all the New York Times reported roughly two weeks ago, Maggie Haberman, that three of the leading candidates, that would have to be Walker, Bush and Marco Rubio, and their campaigns were in secret talks to boycott the FOX debate if Trump were included.
In 15 states, the Republic bosses can keep Donald Trump off the ballot with the stroke of a pen. So in all honesty, if he is not treated fairly by the Republican Party, if he's not given a level playing field, then he should preserve the option of running third-party. Now at the same time, I know Donald Trump doesn't want to do anything that might distract from the defeat of Hillary Clinton, because we don't need a third term of Barack Obama.
So that question was designed to derail his campaign. But I think that it's important to put his response in some context.
HARLOW: But he saw. Everyone saw what happened in 1992. He knows that if he runs as a third-party it could help Hillary Clinton. And he raised his hand.
STONE: But why would he not preserve his option and make sure he's given a fair shot at the Republican Party? The Republican Party establishment ought to think more about that.
Let me tell you what would happen. If you had a three-way race, the Democrats would win. Trump would be a strong second and the Republican Party would run third. Just like 1912.
HARLOW: Let me ask you this. Twofold question. What would -- what should voters be excited about in a Donald Trump presidency if we were to see it? And what should they be worried about?
STONE: Well, first of all I think you'd look at independence. Look, the political system is broken. Trump nailed this in the debate. You can buy politicians of either party for a contribution.
The special interests, the lobbyists, the billionaires, they're calling the shots. Look, all the --
HARLOW: So are you saying a Trump president would change that?
STONE: He would -- he'd be completely independent. You can't buy Donald Trump. Donald Trump is worth $10 billion. He doesn't need lobbyists or special interest money.
HARLOW: He also can't -- he can't overturn Citizens United.
STONE: No, he can't, but if he were President of the United States, he would have the independence to bring real reform to our economic system --
HARLOW: Okay, tax return?
STONE: Yes -- well across the board. You need a president who is a leader and independent of the political ruling class.
HARLOW: Okay. So what should they worry about?
STONE: I can't address that question. I have no thought --
HARLOW: Why?
STONE: Well because I think he'd be a very good president and I'm not here to criticize Donald Trump. HARLOW: I'm not asking you to criticize him, but as his adviser, top adviser, and a close friend, part of your job was to tell him, you got to work on X, Y and Z.
STONE: No, my job was to help get him elected president. My job was not to help him be president. I'm not a government guy. I'm a veteran of eight national presidential campaigns.
As far as needing to seek publicity, perhaps someone at the Trump Campaign should look at the -- at Google Newsfeed. I'm a New York Times bestselling author. I certainly don't need my friend Donald Trump to get positive publicity.
HARLOW: We were told, and some have said that there were two, or are two camps within the Trump Campaign.
Your camp, one camp, is pushing for a more professional approach, harkening back to this conversation that I read, saying look at the polling, look at scientific polling, and another camp that is saying embrace some of these other polls that are out there.
Embrace of this momentum. Is that true?
STONE: Well I think I'm the only one in the campaign that has any presidential campaign experience. I think I'm the only one who's won a large statewide race in the last 40 years.
At the same time, in many ways I'm in favor of letting Trump be Trump as far as the big picture issues. In other words, Donald Trump is one who identified trade and the inequity of our trade with China.
Does anyone think that the United States Senate would be thinking about doing away with sanctuary cities if Trump himself hadn't elevated the illegal immigrant issue in the country.
HARLOW: You said that you were -- you told my colleague here saying you were distraught at the campaign diversion from the issues and at his "food fight" with Megyn Kelly. Do you think --
STONE: That's my opinion, yes.
HARLOW: Do you think that his comments to Megyn Kelly on stage at the debate on Thursday night and his comments about her last night to my Don Lemon were warranted or fair or presidential?
STONE: I'm not going to characterize them. I just think that they are counterproductive in terms of getting elected, which is the business that I am in.
HARLOW: Do you think that they are offensive?
STONE: They will be offensive to some people. They will not be offensive to others. The point is that presidency and American elections are decided on big picture issues.
We have an Iranian deal that could be a -- could conflagrate this country. And we're going to debate about what is and is not politically correct, or exchange personal insults. You know that's not the Trump I know. Trump is much bigger than that.
HARLOW: And that's what we saw -- yet that's what we saw Trump tweeting about after the debate.
STONE: Yes, and I would have to call myself disappointed.
HARLOW: Take me into the debate prep.
STONE: Well here's the great thing about Donald Trump. Donald Trump is not programmed. He is not -- he is not handled. He is not scripted.
HARLOW: Did you prepare for the debate with him?
STONE: I wrote him memos for his consumption and decision. And he makes those decisions. He's not like these politicians who take a poll and then tailor their position to be the most popular.
He doesn't do practices with stand-ins. That's not Trump. What you see is what you get. And when he articulates the big picture issues, it shows what happens. He went to the top of every poll.
That is what I was hoping for. But no one puts words in Trump's mouth, including me.
HARLOW: Did you practice?
STONE: No.
HARLOW: Did any debate practice something?
STONE: No, that's not Trump's style.
HARLOW: What was the most --
STONE: He's a voracious reader.
HARLOW: Yes.
STONE: He understands the issues facing the country. This is a very, very smart man. Isn't it time to have a president who is smart? He graduated at the top of his class at Wharton.
He knows the challenges facing the country.
HARLOW: Did you quit, as you say? The Trump Camp says you were fired. Honestly, that doesn't matter, right? But what matters is the future of this country.
STONE: Yes.
HARLOW: Did you quit because of what Donald Trump said to Don Lemon last night specifically about Megyn Kelly and bleeding? STONE: No. I quit because the campaign was headed in a direction that I felt I was having no impact. I would like to see the campaign return to the big issues -- the big picture issues.
HARLOW: So speaking about impact, one of our viewers on Twitter wrote in and they asked, "What did you find was the most effective way to provide Donald Trump feedback?"
STONE: Look, he's very -- he's always been very accessible. And he's a reader. If you want Donald Trump to consider something, write it out in a reasonable form.
Don't hand him 40 pages because he's not going to read 40 pages. By the way, either would I. But he's a quick study. He's very good at retaining information. And he's a superstar.
It's why he is a real contender in this race.
HARLOW: Will you -- will you work for another campaign?
STONE: No, absolutely not.
HARLOW: No way, has anyone called on you?
STONE: Yes, but I have no intention of doing that. And if he's on the ballot in the Florida primary -- well actually I'm not a registered Republican, I'm a Libertarian, but if I had the opportunity to vote for him in the primaries I would.
HARLOW: Would you possibly rejoin the Trump Camp?
STONE: I don't think I'll be asked.
HARLOW: But if you were?
STONE: Most likely not under the current setup. Look, Trump is going to be the master of his own campaign, and I respect that. And I'm not going to be out there trying to distract from what they're doing, because I still think he is the right man to make America great again.
HARLOW: Is this definitely -- some have been saying, is this definitely a real split? You say you're still good friends. It sounds like you still want him to be the next president.
STONE: I do.
HARLOW: Some are saying this is -- is this at all for publicity?
STONE: No, it's not for publicity. It's an honest disagreement and that's all it is, and frankly I don't want to be a distraction either. So I hope the campaign will go back to talking about the issues that made Trump a frontrunner.
HARLOW: Who can replace you? Who will replace you in the Trump Camp?
STONE: I can't be replaced because I'm the smartest person in this business. No, I'm kidding. I can't be replaced and I have no idea who they may be talking to.
I'm very good at what I do, and I'm proud to have played a role in the launch of a campaign that is already historic.
HARLOW: All right, Roger Stone. Stay with me will you?
STONE: Thank you.
HARLOW: Got to get a quick commercial break in here. We will be right back with Donald Trump's top political adviser until about 12 hours ago, Roger Stone, still with me. Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HARLOW: Welcome back. We are going to continue our conversation with Roger Stone, joining us for a first on CNN interview about Donald Trump, a man he still calls a friend after 35 years.
A man, though, who says that he fired Roger Stone. Roger Stone says he left the Trump Camp. This has all happened today. Let's continue our conversation.
STONE: Sure.
HARLOW: Thank you for being here. In a New Yorker article in 2008, Trump called you "a stone cold loser." He said you take credit for things that you didn't do. Did it happen, and then why did you go back to the camp?
STONE: Well he definitely did say that. We had a temporary falling out over Eliot Spitzer who I worked to drive from public life because I thought he was a bad guy.
I think I turned out to be right about that. We were subsequently reconciled and we put that behind us, and I continue to call him a friend.
HARLOW: Did Donald Trump apologize to you for that? We don't hear him apologize --
STONE: No, he --
HARLOW: -- often.
STONE: No, and he doesn't need to, because we're guys, and we get past these things.
HARLOW: What do you mean you're guys?
STONE: We're guys.
HARLOW: Women get past things too, come on.
STONE: Well, my wife gets past things a lot slower, but --
HARLOW: I really -- are you saying all women do? STONE: No.
HARLOW: Not fair.
STONE: No, but the point is, we're not touchy feely. I didn't expect an apology and I didn't need one. We are reconciled and we are friends.
HARLOW: So let's talk about how it is that Donald Trump seems to stay bulletproof. Many people pointed to the comments he made about Senator John McCain and his military service to this country and said wow.
Over the line, how is he going to make it through this one. You wait until the next poll comes out, and he is at the top again.
STONE: Yes, that's because Donald Trump recognized something that political leads don't understand. John McCain is not held in high stead by the veterans in this country.
One thousand veterans died waiting for medical care under Obama. That was covered up. The U.S. Senate helped the cover-up. So nobody has been held responsible for that. It's like Benghazi.
People screw up, Americans die, nobody's held accountable.
HARLOW: My question is how does Donald Trump remain bulletproof?
STONE: Well because he is out on the stump, and everywhere he goes veterans come up to them and they say, please Mr. Trump, I can't get medical care. I have to wait 20 days to see a doctor.
My brother died in the hospital -- in the Veteran's Hospital waiting for medical care. He has his finger on the pulse of what people believed.
And therefore I think one of the reasons why there was no backfire is both POW families and veterans in this country do not have a high regard for Senator McCain who's been on the Veteran's Affairs Committee for 30 years.
HARLOW: Can you take me back to Trump's announcement speech.
STONE: Yes.
HARLOW: When he said -- I mean he went completely off-script; am I right?
STONE: Well there was no script.
HARLOW: There was no script.
STONE: There was no script.
HARLOW: But anything you may have discussed, completely off any script discussion that there may have been. And what he said about illegal immigrants in this country --
STONE: Yes.
HARLOW: -- offended many people. It also struck a nerve with many, and it really ignited this debate in this primary about immigrants and the 11 million undocumented workers.
Was that by chance, or was that always a plan within the Trump Camp to be the issue?
STONE: That was Trump speaking from his heart. From his gut.
HARLOW: Right, but was that what you thought would be? Did you guys all right, illegal immigration and dealing with the undocumented workers is going to be the issue of the campaign, it's what we're going to start on.
STONE: Within the context of the Republican nomination fight, it was always clear that this was going to be an issue that would have enormous resonance.
And everybody, all these other candidates have a mixed record. Some were for amnesty. Some were for amnesty now. Others forgot that they were for amnesty.
Trump had straight talk on this issue, and I think the mainstream media misread the mood of Republicans on this issue. Then secondarily the fact that Trump was correct was I think underlined by the murder in San Francisco by an illegal who got in and out of the country --
HARLOW: Kate Steinle.
STONE: -- five times. Correct. And that in turn I think helped highlight a number of other horrific crimes that were perpetrated by illegal immigrants.
HARLOW: Donald Trump has been asked by our Dana Bash, by a number of reporters, as have other candidates, what they would do with the 11 million undocumented workers in this country right now.
He was asked it again by Chris Wallace on Thursday night. And he didn't lay out -- and I will say some of the other candidates have not laid out a comprehensive plan yet.
Were you working with him on a comprehensive plan, and were you dismayed, disappointed, that if this was issue number one for him, lay out your solution about what you're going to do with those people in this country now.
STONE: Well that's what a campaign is about, and you don't have to put out all your issue material on day one.
HARLOW: No, but they weren't asking on day one.
STONE: I think he's been pretty clear on the stuff about the fact that he's opposed to amnesty and he's opposed to waving a wand and legalizing 11 million illegals.
HARLOW: But he said we'll handle it. He didn't say how.
STONE: But no one speaks for Donald Trump but Donald Trump, and --
HARLOW: I just, I'm interested if you had those conversations with him, and you said to him Donald, we have to come up with a plan, and we have to lay this out step-by-step. What is your plan.
Take us into his thinking.
STONE: I can't do that without violating my agreement of confidentiality. Let's just say he makes his own decisions. He has views on this that I think are quite articulate and well thought-out. I expect his campaign will release them.
HARLOW: What would your recommendation be when it comes to immigration and illegal immigration in this country and those 11 million undocumented workers?
STONE: Well first of all I would expel those with criminal records first.
HARLOW: 400,000, many of them criminals, were deported in the last two years each year.
STONE: And who can be found through driver's licenses and other net- based solutions. Then secondarily I would expel the rest of those people, but with some mechanism in which they can apply to come back if they will come back legally, take a job, pay taxes, and so on.
It is untenable to try to send some back and not others. I think you have to send everybody back and start over again. A country -- a nation that doesn't have borders, secure borders, is not a nation.
HARLOW: Who did you find to be the most formidable competitor to Donald Trump on the stage on Thursday night, either on the 5:00 debate or the 9:00 debate?
STONE: This was an example of one giant and nine pygmies. There's nobody there --
HARLOW: More than nine, you had 17 total.
STONE: Well if you take both debates that's true. Look, there's a lot of people there that I personally like. For example, I think that Rand Paul's message is more compelling than Rand Paul himself.
I'm a Libertarian. I have a number of disagreements with Donald Trump. But I'm not the one running for president, he is. And my expertise is in how to get elected, so I'm not -- I never tried to impose my views on the candidates I work for.
At the same time there has to be some fundamental agreement between us or you can't get along.
HARLOW: If you -- you said you were disappointed in Donald Trump's debate performance. Was there no one who impressed you?
STONE: I'm sorry, say that again, I --
HARLOW: You said you were disappointed in Donald Trump's debate performance --
STONE: I -- no, I don't think I said that. I think he had a number of really good moments. For example, the question --
HARLOW: Dismayed at some of it.
STONE: Dismayed at some of it, yes. Because he wasn't asked public policy issues. Why was only Donald Trump being asked personal issues and everybody else is being asked public policy issues. Frankly --
HARLOW: He wasn't just asked personal. He was not just asked personal questions.
STONE: By and large, they really didn't give him any opportunity.
HARLOW: So who -- I'm very interested, because this has been your career for decades. Who else impressed you?
STONE: I thought that John Kasich had a good debate. I thought Jeb Bush had a terrible debate. I mean this guy is so boring that his podium almost fell asleep. I thought that --
HARLOW: Carly Fiorina?
STONE: I thought she had an excellent performance in the first debate. She'll clearly be at the big kids' table.
HARLOW: You're not going to work for any of the other competitors.
STONE: Correct.
HARLOW: What are you going to do next, Roger Stone?
STONE: I have a book coming out on October 6 called the Clintons' War on Women that will explain how Bill Clinton has sexually assaulted women and Hillary Clinton has basically run the intimidation and cover-up of those crimes.
HARLOW: Let me ask you finally, since you bring up the Clintons, do you know anything about the phone call between former President Bill Clinton and Donald Trump ahead of Trump jumping into the race?
STONE: Nothing whatsoever. I was actually dismayed to see that somebody leaked that because of course Bill Clinton is not held in high regard by Republican primary voters.
HARLOW: Will Donald Trump win the Republican nomination?
STONE: He can win the Republican nomination. He needs to get his campaign back on track.
HARLOW: Roger Stone, I appreciate you being with me.
STONE: Happy to be here.
HARLOW: Thank you very much.
STONE: Thank you.
HARLOW: You're going to hear what Donald Trump has to say about exactly that tomorrow morning, 9:00 a.m. eastern. Jake Tapper interviews Donald Trump live on CNN's State of the Union. Don't miss it. We'll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HARLOW: Welcome back. Before the break we heard from Roger Stone, one of the top political advisers to Donald Trump, a friend of Trump for 35 years. He is disputing reports -- or disputing what the Trump Camp said and that is that he was fired from the campaign.
Instead Stone says he was the one who left because he did not like the direction of the campaign. Didn't think he was getting his feedback taken from the campaign.
Let's talk about it with someone who knows what it's like to be in Trump's inner circle, Kate Bohner. She co-authored a book with Donald Trump in 1997. Trump: The Art of the Comeback.
Also with us, Mel Robbins. I believe we have Mel with us as well, is that right? All right, good. Thank you ladies both for being here. Kate, to you first, and also let me bring in Penny Nance as well, but Kate to you first.
What did you make of what you heard in that interview with Roger Stone?
KATE BOHNER, CO-AUTHOR, TRUMP: THE ART OF THE COMEBACK: Well, first when I heard this afternoon that they had parted, Roger Stone and the Trump Campaign, I was so surprised, because I remember when I was writing the book back in the late '90s, he depended on Roger Stone a tremendous amount.
They were extremely close back then. There's no PA system in the Trump organization, so it would just be Donald going "Get Stone on the phone!" And I just remember how close they were and how much he valued his judgment.
That saying, I'm not surprised because Donald does, indeed, go off people. He, you know, he'll be very close and depending on them and talking to them every day.
But one of the things I did notice is sometimes Mr. Trump will say that's enough, I'm going in a different direction. I will close with the fact, though, that I -- they -- it sounded to me like Stone was stumping for Trump.
It sounded like he was still campaigning for Mr. Trump. HARLOW: And he still is in support of him, he still thinks he'd be the best president.
BOHNER: Best president. So I thought that was very interesting and says a lot about their friendship of the past 35 years.
HARLOW: Mel Robbins, to you, just your reaction to that interview?
MEL ROBBINS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, you know, I thought the same thing, was fascinating, that here he was either quitting the campaign or fired, and yet everything he had to say was extremely positive about Trump.
And when you asked him those questions about who else impressed him on the stage, I thought his answer was pretty lukewarm. He basically trashed Jeb Bush and gave a little bit of plug for the Governor of Ohio and that was that.
So I agree with those comments, that despite what may have happened, Trump's going in a different direction, maybe he's going to bring somebody else on board obviously.
But clearly the friendship's still intact and he's still out there saying positive things, so that was interesting to me.
HARLOW: Penny Nance, to you, just talking about these comments, right, and going after Megyn Kelly.
And he did acknowledge the conversation that I read out that POLITICO reported, that Roger Stone was very frustrated with the comments toward Megyn Kelly in that debate and afterwards with our Don Lemon last night.
What do you make of those comments, specifically about bleeding?
PENNY NANCE: You know, I found them absolutely outrageous. I represent the nation's largest public policy women's organization, we're right on center. Our ladies tend to be primary voters.
We're the very women that Donald Trump needs to win. And I think that what he's done this week, the way he behaved in the debate and certainly the way he's behaved afterwards has done nothing to help him.
He needed to apologize, but of course we know that he won't, and it's left women wondering if he has the temperament to be president.
HARLOW: Let's talk about the women's vote though to you, Penny.
NANCE: Okay.
HARLOW: We also have seen in the latest CNN/ORC pole at the end of July, 15 percent of GOP registered female voters support Trump. That's the most of any.
NANCE: That was then, right. So now -- HARLOW: So this changed it all is what you're saying. This changed it all.
NANCE: Well we'll find out. You know, it's hard to know for sure, but I strongly believe that you'll see a dip in those numbers. Now, you know, it's going to take a couple, four days for the polling to come out and I think it will be different.
The good news, the person who won from all of this actually, is probably Rand Paul. Because he was at the bottom. Now I believe that he will be replaced by Donald Trump.
If he's not this time, he will be. The man is -- the man cannot stop himself, and his tantrums are continuing, and we've got to wonder whether or not he can play with the big boys.
HARLOW: Kate to you -- well so far he has in the polling. Kate, to you. Strategically though, this attack on Fox news, specifically Megyn Kelly, the moderators of the debate. Take me -- I mean you know Donald Trump well. What's the mindset there?
BOHNER: What I found the most interesting about your interview was when you read from the transcript. That sounded exactly spot on. Again, I don't have any data.
I don't know if that phone call was recorded, but it certainly sounded like a conversation that would have taken place between Mr. Trump and Mr. Stone, in that in terms of strategy, as you asked, the -- it sounds like Mr. Stone was actually trying to impose a strategy, focusing on the larger issues.
HARLOW: Not the media.
BOHNER: Exactly. What the -- what Americans are responding to.
HARLOW: Yes. Mel, to you, for the women's vote, and it's sort of -- every time I say this I think well shouldn't men care too, right?
Shouldn't -- if something is offensive to any gender, shouldn't all genders care, if you do believe the comments were offensive. Do you think that these comments to Megyn Kelly in the debate.
And what he said to Don Lemon last night are going to hurt him in the polls? Because nothing that people have said will hurt him has so far.
ROBBINS: You know, Poppy, I don't think they're going to hurt him, and let me just say a couple things. Number one, women everywhere face all kinds of sexist things at work, bias at work.
However, when I take Trump's comments in their totality, if you look at the Don Lemon interview, he spends the first 10 minutes bashing everybody at Fox. And I mean everybody. He's disappointed. He calls them the worst.
HARLOW: Well he said he likes Bill O'Reilly and Greta. ROBBINS: That's true, and he also likes Sean Hannity. But at five -- if you tune in at 5:06, he also says that Chris Wallace has blood pouring out of his eyes.
He is clearly supremely angry at how he was treated. When I look at the comments, and he says seeing blood pour out of Megyn Kelly's eyes after he's already said that she knows zippo, that she's not smart, that she's not a great journalist.
I think if Donald Trump had wanted to say that she was menopausal or emotional he would have. What he said was she was off-based. And so I think that Erick Erickson, of all people, making a mountain out of a molehill.
And frankly if Donald Trump meant to call her emotional he would have, and he'll tell us all tomorrow at 9:00 when he's on CNN. And one more thing. I heard one of the other women say he keeps having tantrums.
If somebody were to say that Megyn Kelly were having a tantrum, we'd all be like woo, oh my God, that's so sexist saying a woman's having a tantrum.
So I think we've got to be very careful about our quick jumping to saying that things are sexist. He also says later in the interview, by the way, if you check it out around 11 minutes in, that Megyn Kelly can hold her own.
So in some kind of weird way, I don't think Donald is looking at this as bashing men against women. I think he bashes everybody equally when they attack him.
NANCE: If I could, if I could be clear, I did not call him sexist. I said he was temperamental. He's petulant. And you have to wonder -- and I think women will wonder, whether or not this man can work with leaders around the world who don't really care how much money he has or what his golf courses look like.
The ayatollahs don't care. Putin doesn't care. And so the fact that he's temperamental. The fact that his temperament is not steady, it's a question. Can he keep American safe. And I think American women are going to have a problem with him.
HARLOW: Kate Bohner, Mel Robbins, Penny Nance, please come back. Join me --
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Thank you.
HARLOW: -- next weekend if you will ladies. Good conversation, let's continue it. Thank you so much. We will be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HARLOW: Welcome back. Donald Trump's comments about Fox news host Megyn Kelly, widely condemned by other candidates in the GOP race, including former Florida governor, Jeb Bush. Listen.
(BEGIN VIDEOCLIP)
JEB BUSH, (R-FL), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Come on, give me a break. I mean are we -- do we want to win? Do we want to insult 53 percent of all voters? What Donald Trump said is wrong. That is not how we win elections, and worse yet that is not how you bring people together to solve problems.
(END VIDEOCLIP)
HARLOW: Ohio Governor John Kasich said this, "Everyone deserves respect and dignity, whether they agree with you or not. You don't tear people down just because they disagree with you or stand up to you or question you."
And this from South Carolina Senator Lindsey Graham: "@RealDonaldTrump comments are not worthy of the office he is seeking nor consistent w/the leadership we should expect from POTUS."
Let's bring in David Gergen, a former adviser to four U.S. Presidents. Also a CNN Senior Political Analyst. David, to begin with this, you watched the interview with Roger Stone, you heard what he said about Donald Trump.
Do the other candidates have a point here or do you side with the Trump Camp on this one?
DAVID GERGEN, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: Hello Poppy. Absolutely the other candidates have a point, and they're doing something wise and that is they're starting to not just, not attack Trump per se.
But to link him to some of his anger as John Kasich said the other night, but then turn it in a positive direction. Here's how we really win an election. Not by insulting women. But by doing this and that.
And Kasich said well listen, we have to respect, you know, the fact that he's tapped into his emotions here, and what we have to do is understand the people who are so angry and win their votes.
So I think that's smart, but I'll tell you something else. The real news now is coming out of this debate night where he delivers a huge audience to the Republicans, and that was a gift on his part.
HARLOW: Right.
GERGEN: And it gave them platforms, Carly Fiorina now has catapulted into the national spotlight because you got 6 million people to watch that afternoon debate, and she did so well.
You know, it's helped her and I think it's helped some of these other candidates, this huge audience. So all of that's been good, but it has not been good for Donald Trump. And we now have an aftermath.
It's not just the narcissism and abortionist that he showed in the debate. It's been the aftermath, when he went after Megyn Kelly. It was entirely unnecessary to go after her the way he did.
He was shut out by -- in this debate in Atlanta, and now Roger Stone. This is significant news that Roger Stone is out.
HARLOW: Yes, I did want to ask you that, David, because you know Roger Stone going back to the '70s. I mean this is someone who is so well-known, and known to really be ruthless but very effective at his job, right, in terms of advising politicians.
He is still supporting --
GERGEN: He is a tough --
HARLOW: Right. He's still supporting Trump, but he left. What does that say?
GERGEN: Well two things. One was I think Roger Stone, for all of that, you know, people think he's a really tough operatives in the past, I've known him all the way back to Nixon days.
I have not (inaudible) here. But he gave the best third-party endorsement, eye witness account of who Trump is, of anybody I've heard. It was the best single argument I've heard in favor of Donald Trump from anybody, in your interview.
And that was very interesting. But clearly he finds the campaign has gone off track, and went way off track, in that Thursday night debate, it reminds me so much of what happened with Ross Perot, when he was running this renegade third-party operation in 1992 against Clinton.
Remember this, it was the last time somebody ran against a Clinton, back in '92, and Ed Rollins and Pam Jergin (ph) came in there, one a major Republican, the other a major Democratic campaign strategist.
But in two months Ed Rollins resigned. And in a similarly classy way I might say. And it hurt Perot. It gave people pause that if you can't keep Ed Rollins and he find that, you know, you're running a crazy campaign, there's something that's amiss here.
There's something wrong with the candidate and the people around him.
HARLOW: Yes.
GERGEN: So I do think that this is, this Roger Stone thing, was, you know, people like these, Roger Stone, are hired like jockeys to ride a really good horse.
And the problem for a good jockey like a Roger Stone or an Ed Rollins is that if you've got a runaway horse it's hard to stay in the saddle.
HARLOW: Yes, yes. Interesting.
GERGEN: And that really speaks to the temperament of the candidate, and why that person can be very successful in another field but yet not ultimately win at politics.
HARLOW: Yes, who now will replace Roger Stone as the top political adviser to Donald Trump. Roger Stone says he doesn't know and he tells me he's not going back to the Trump Camp and we'll be watching. David Gergen, thank you as always. Quick break, we'll be right back.
GERGEN: Thanks Poppy, it's always great to talk to you, bye.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HARLOW: In just about an hour's time Donald Trump was supposed to be speaking at the Red State Gathering in Atlanta with other conservatives. He was invited with some leading Republican candidates.
That is until his comments about Megyn, Megyn Kelly, the Fox news anchor, to our Don Lemon, last night. After that Erick Erickson, the main organizer, disinvited him.
Mark Preston is at that event, the Red State Gathering in Atlanta. You just saw Donald Trump's top adviser, Roger Stone, say I wasn't fired, I quit. But he's still a huge supporter of Donald Trump.
What do you make of it?
MARK PRESTON, CNN EXECUTIVE EDITOR: Well, first of all an amazing interview to have somebody who's fired from a campaign at such a high level to come in and sit with you.
And talk to you for 30 minutes about the Trump Campaign which has dominated the headlines certainly for the past several months. You know, you have to wonder to yourself, is there some kind of deal cut between Donald Trump and Roger Stone.
Roger Stone was very laudatory of Donald Trump. Would never say anything negative about him. In fact, said he wants him to become president. I mean it was really fascinating, and the interesting thing right now, Poppy, is where does Donald Trump go from here.
HARLOW: Right.
PRESTON: He says he's still in it. They're going to build out their campaign's operation, a whole new phase for the Donald Trump campaign.
HARLOW: But I wonder Mark, and if you can still hear me, I'm having a little hard time hearing you at the end, but I wonder to you, Mark, who replaces a Roger Stone, right. Who becomes the next top voice in the Trump Camp?
PRESTON: Well it's going to be his campaign manager, Corey Lewandowski, who has apparently taken the reins of the campaign at this moment. He's a political operative -- longtime political operative, so he'll be the one, you know, taking the reins.
But as Roger Stone said in that interview, Roger Stone wasn't always able to talk to Donald Trump. There obviously was some kind of a campaign rift between top advisers, and it seems to me that Roger Stone just got fed up with it and that's why he said he resigned from the campaign. HARLOW: Yes, and we'll hear what Donald Trump has to say in response to that, 9:00 a.m. eastern tomorrow morning, he will be on State of the Union with Jake Tapper. Mark Preston, great reporting all night, thank you my friend. We'll be right back.
PRESTON: Thanks Poppy.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HARLOW: Just this week, in case you didn't see it, Netflix introduced a new policy to give unlimited parental leave for the first year after birth or adoption of a child. Other companies have done the same thing.
We saw Microsoft, for example, greatly increase parental leave the day after Netflix made the announcement. Other companies introducing higher wages, even unlimited vacation days.
We're really seeing a sea change in the way that corporate America is responding to what clearly employees are asking for. But can these types of policies -- that's a real question when you look at it.
Can these types of policies really work and can they sustain the bottom line of companies. Let's talk about it with Dan Price, CEO of Gravity Payments.com.
Katharine Zaleski, President and cofounder of Power to Fly. Now Dan, you have an interesting voice in this debate because you took a huge pay cut a few months ago.
You said the minimum salary anyone at my company is going to make is $70,000, and we're going to hear more on the show tomorrow night about why you did that and how that worked out.
And Katharine, you wrote this fascinating piece in Fortune, saying I used to judge working mothers and expect things of them and I was completely wrong. So let me start with you, Katharine.
This change in the workplace that we're seeing, what do you make of it? Is it good for working parents?
KATHARINE ZALESKI, PRESIDENT AND COFOUNDER, POWER TO FLY: I think it's great for working parents, but we have to remember that it's being done amongst a number of companies that are in an arms race for talent.
Talent that represents a very small sliver of the U.S. population. And so, you know, we really need to think sort of beyond what Netflix is doing.
And how we can help smaller companies that aren't making billions of dollars in revenue every quarter, and can really use some help in other avenues to create more paternity and maternity leave policies, help from the government for example.
So I think it's a good start, but let's not forget that 80 percent of companies do not offer these kinds of benefits, and we need to do a lot more. So I don't want us to be distracted by what Netflix and Google are doing.
HARLOW: It's a great point, and some folks, Dan, have pointed out and said look, this is only Silicon Valley that can do this and only those big heavy-hitters.
You're a much smaller company. Could you do this? Could you give unlimited, you know, parental leave?
DAN PRICE, CEO, GRAVITY PAYMENTS.COM: Absolutely. You know, we're always trying to push the boundaries, and you know I think we've proven that, but for me, the larger point here is that it's really important for businesses to make a profit and to be sustainable.
But it's not the only thing that businesses exist to do. And part of what we exist to do is to make credit card processing fair for businesses.
And I think with the stand, Netflix, like Gravity and many other progressive companies, they're saying that they're existing to try to create a great life for their team members.
The people that are building the success, the financial success, outside of work. And I think that's a worthy cause for businesses to take up.
HARLOW: Olivia, what -- oh look, I just called Katharine Olivia because Olivia's her sister, someone I know very well. I'm sorry Katharine. But Katharine, to you -- you're saying you agree.
ZALESKI: That's okay, I get it all the time. No, I agree with Dan on that point, I mean it's great business. But let's not forget that this is for a year after a baby is born, which is the hardest time.
I have a 21-month-old at home. What, you know, companies really need to start doing is thinking about what happens to women and men as a child is growing up.
I think part of the issue is that a lot of companies, you know, they force people to go into the office all the time. Look at a lot of these Silicon Valley companies. They have campuses.
That's very, very hard when your kid gets to be three, four, you have a sick kid at home. That's when a lot of women start to drop out of the workforce.
And we're actually seeing the highest percentages of women leave the workplace because of what happens as kids sort of get older. It's not really in the first year so much.
HARLOW: Yes.
ZALESKI: So let's not, let's not lose sight of that.
HARLOW: It's a good point. We actually saw, Dan, when Google increased maternity leave from 12 weeks to 18 weeks, new mothers left the company at half the rate they did previously. What do you see in your employees, especially new parents?
PRICE: Yes, well I think the key from an employer standpoint is not just the policy. There has to be heart behind it. Because you could have the best policy ever.
And if there's not an understanding that we're going to work together and partner together, it really won't take you where you want to go, because you could never plan for every situation that's going to happen.
The important thing is for employers and employees to start treating each other like partners, have a mission together, and then have flexible policies that go well beyond that first year.
