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Interview With Idaho Senator James Risch; Ferguson Violence; Trump Rising; Toxic Spill Turns Pristine River Orange; Clinton Giving Email Server to Federal Investigators. Aired 6-7p ET

Aired August 11, 2015 - 18:00   ET



BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN HOST: He is leading in two new polls. But is there a reason for him to feel threatened?

And trigger violence. We now have surveillance video of a shooting incident that helped spark new unrest in Ferguson, Missouri. Will there be more clashes on the streets tonight?

We want to welcome our viewers in the United States and around the world. Wolf Blitzer is off. I'm Brianna Keilar. You're in THE SITUATION ROOM.

ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.

KEILAR: Breaking news tonight.

Police just released surveillance video from the night new violence erupted in Ferguson, Missouri. It appears to show a suspect accused of firing shots during a protest with a gun before he was shot by an officer. Stand by for more on that.

Also this hour, we're waiting to hear from Donald Trump in a live news conference from the campaign trail. He is likely to face questions about two new polls. They show he is leading the Republican pack in both Iowa and New Hampshire, the first presidential battleground states of 2016.

Plus, another developing story, a young Mississippi couple accused of planning to honeymoon as a cover for traveling overseas to join ISIS. We have correspondents, analysts and newsmakers standing by as we cover all on the news.

First, I want to go our justice correspondent with the latest on this ISIS-related arrest -- Pamela.

PAMELA BROWN, CNN JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT: Well, Brianna, this is a young newlywed couple from Mississippi who allegedly used their honeymoon as a cover-up to go to Syria and join ISIS before being arrested at the airport on Saturday, according to the FBI.

The man is the 22-year-old Muhammad Dakhlalla and his wife, 20-year- old Jaelyn Young. They first caught the attention of the FBI back in May after making several statements in support of ISIS on social media. From there, they began corresponding with undercover FBI agents. Now, according to the complaint, from the outside, this was a seemingly normal couple.

Young is the daughter of a Vicksburg, Mississippi, police officer who was studying chemistry at Mississippi State University. She recently converted to Islam, law enforcement officials say. Her husband graduated last spring from Mississippi State with a psychology degree and is the son of a local imam.

According to the complaint, in one online conversation, Young allegedly boasted about how the two could help ISIS, saying -- quote -- "I am skilled in math and chemistry and worked at an analytical lab here at my college campus. My partner is very good with computer science and media. We learn very fast and would love to help."

In July, she also allegedly said on social media, she supported the shooting in Chattanooga, Tennessee, that killed four Marines. The two appeared in court today in Mississippi and were denied bail --

KEILAR: How were they caught, Pamela?

BROWN: They were caught because the FBI first noticed their social media postings back in May and then began interacting with them in an undercover capacity online. For months, this was happening.

And then as the couple began trying to get their passports and then showed up at the airport on Saturday, allegedly to board their flight from Columbus, Mississippi, on to Turkey, that is when the FBI stepped in and made those arrests -- Brianna.

KEILAR: And there was yet another person who was arrested in New Jersey. He had ties to other arrests in the New York area, right?

BROWN: That's right. Authorities arrested a former New Jersey resident, 20-year-old Nader Saadeh, for conspiring with five others in New Jersey and New York to provide services and personnel to ISIS. The other five including his brother were arrested back in June.

You may remember this group there in the New York area. Federal authorities say Saadeh left the company in May to join ISIS and was later arrested in Jordan. Authorities say that his computer files have a lot of evidence that he showed, you know, his desire to form a small army with friends, that he hated the U.S. and posted images on social media of terror flags. He is just the latest in dozens of ISIS-related arrests just this year -- Brianna.

KEILAR: All right. Pamela Brown, thanks so much for that report.

Tonight, the United States is set to launch new airstrikes against ISIS as it struggles to overcome an embarrassing setback in the fight against the terrorists.

Our Pentagon correspondent Barbara Starr has more on this -- Barbara.


The Pentagon always likes to say airstrikes again will not defeat ISIS, but tonight a new round of airstrikes, a new group of targets expected in the coming hours.


STARR (voice-over): American F-16s at any time could begin striking ISIS from their base here at Incirlik, Turkey.

Some strikes may be aimed at the Turkish-Syrian border, where ISIS forces just moved after al Qaeda left. Strikes will try to pave the way for putting U.S.-trained moderate rebels back into Syria after their unit was decimated in an attack.


MARK TONER, STATE DEPARTMENT SPOKESMAN: This has been a difficult process, to vet these people, to train them, to get them back into what is a very fluid, dynamic situation.

STARR: The Pentagon trying to figure out how to salvage the training effort. More than 70 additional rebels may finish their training in the next few weeks.

LT. COL. RICK FRANCONA (RET.), CNN MILITARY ANALYST: We need on find a group that is willing to be our boots on the ground. And the ones we have chosen right now are not it.

STARR: Defense Secretary Ash Carter moving beyond just working with the rebels.

ASHTON CARTER, U.S. DEFENSE SECRETARY: There are other capable ground forces fighting both the regime and ISIL. I gave the example of the Syrian Kurds. But we would like to see more.

STARR: The initial strikes could also be aimed at targets in Iraq, ISIS on a new rampage in Mosul where up to 300 civil servants may have been killed in recent days. The U.S. had credible intelligence a mass killing was being planned, but no way to stop it, a U.S. official tells CNN.

ISIS also still massing forces around the Baiji oil refinery, but the U.S. taking extra steps to keep Air Force pilots safe. When bombing runs are made out of Incirlik, the U.S. wants to send up stand-by helicopter rescue forces from this second base at Diyarbakir in Turkey in case a pilot goes down. Right now, they would have to come from further away in Irbil in Iraq.


STARR: Why is all of this so important of course is because, according to the U.S. intelligence community, ISIS is still bringing new fighters into Syria and Iraq at the same rate that the U.S. can kill them -- Brianna.

KEILAR: Barbara Starr at the Pentagon.

Let's talk now about this, a little more about this war against ISIS overseas and at home with Senator James Risch. He's a Republican of Idaho. He is a leading member of the Foreign Relations and Intelligence Committee.

Senator, thanks for being with us.


KEILAR: And can you shed any more light on these three recent ISIS arrests, this couple from a small Mississippi town and this New Jersey man?

RISCH: Well, I think probably the best way to look at this is to step back and look at the overall picture. There has been well over 50 arrests made this year in 2015 falling into generally two different categories, these arrests by the FBI.

One is a category of people who actually have been, at the very least, inspired by ISIS and have taken steps towards an attack right here in the United States. On the -- in the other camp are people who have either offered assistance to ISIS or in fact have planned and actually moved toward going to the Middle East to fight with ISIS, which, of course, the newest couple from Mississippi fall into.

But this is going on right now. We have got a robust program here in the United States to uncover these. And the FBI has been very good, very diligent and very successful this year in both of those categories.

KEILAR: Do you worry that this -- the second category you mentioned, someone who has been inspired and wants to provide support and maybe travel overseas, do you worry this is the new face of the radicalized individual in the U.S., a former homecoming princess and a soon-to-be- grad-student?

RISCH: Well, I think that there is no question that the people you're going to see may be very, very ordinary people, as these two are. They're very young. One was just out of her teens. The other one was 22. Young people a lot of times do really stupid things.

And this certainly falls in that category. Americans, whether they're young, old, whatever, who are duped by what ISIS is offering as solutions to world problems or satisfaction for an internal peace that a person might have, anybody who swallows that stuff is way out there and not very smart.

KEILAR: Now, part of this was easy to track, because you're talking about this young woman who posted things on social media. It's public.

What do you do if it's not public? If someone doesn't put something on social media, how do you find them?

RISCH: Well, you know, we don't talk about the various programs that we have publicly, for obvious reasons.

But there are ways and means. And the most important thing is that most of the people who do get involved in this are very proud of it and glad to tell their friends and glad to tell the world as to what they're doing. Most of it falls into that category. There are people who you don't hear anything from. And then you have got to use other ways and means to root those out.


KEILAR: All right, Senator Risch, stand by. I have many more questions for you after a quick break.

Trying to figure out where an entire squad of U.S.-trained Syrian rebels went. We will see what Senator Risch can tell us in just a moment.



KEILAR: We are waiting for Donald Trump's campaign event in Michigan.

Right now, let's turn back to Senator James Risch. He's a top member of the Foreign Relations and Intelligence Committees. We are talking about successes and failures in the war against ISIS, as the U.S. prepares to launch new airstrikes from Turkey.

And we understand, Senator Risch, that this entire group of about 60 U.S.-trained Syrian rebels, the first class really of its kind, have scattered, the ones who were not captured. How did the U.S. lose track of all of them?

RISCH: When this thing started out, there were a lot of us that had really serious reservations about that.

It is so complicated there, which groups are fighting which. And what they did is they wanted to pick out or identify the so-called moderate Syrians that they could use to fight ISIS. The difficulty is, is that most of the Syrians don't want to fight ISIS nearly as much as they want to fight Assad, the regime that is in power there.

And so you train them up, you give them guns. You do all these things. And they're all ready to, but they're ready to fight Assad. And they're not that excited about fighting ISIS. And, look, this is a complex group of people who are separated into religious sects and ethnic groups and combinations of both of those and a lot of them over the years have fought each other.

And so it is really, really difficult. Look, there is a group there that we have been telling -- we have been preaching the administration forever, look, let's get tied to the Kurds. They have been our friends. They have taken really good care of us. They fought alongside of us. Not only that. These guys win. They're really good fighters. And they have proven themselves over and over again there. The

administration of course feels that they have to -- anything they do with the Kurds that are in Iraq, they have to go through Baghdad, which to me is absolute nonsense. And then, of course, you have the political problems in Turkey because the Turks are very squeamish about the Kurds and about the Kurds getting power.


KEILAR: Which is to say it lightly.

RISCH: Well, the Kurds really have done really good things on the Syrian side of the border all along Turkey.

And, as result of that, you have heard the discussion about the safe zone that they're trying to set up. And of course that is what has been the catalyst for these F-16s moving into Turkey from Italy.

KEILAR: And I want to ask you about that. Are you concerned that basing bombers in Turkey, this is a relatively new announcement here, that this could elevate security risks for Americans who are in Turkey?

RISCH: Well, there's no question about that.

Even more so, it probably elevates the security concerns for the Turkish government themselves. They -- now that they are being much more aggressive or positive about actually engaging, they're going to wind up being a target themselves. And they -- undoubtedly, they understand that. But they feel that the risks are worth it because of the issues that they're having to face with ISIS.

KEILAR: I want to switch topics, Senator, and ask you about something else that we have just found out.

Fragments of a suspected Russian missile system have been found at the MH-17 crash site. Of course, the expectation, the long-held belief by the U.S. government and claims that this was Russian separatists using Russian weapons that shot down this plane, knowing what we have now -- what has been discovered, what do you have to say? What is the U.S. government's position?

RISCH: Well, I'm certainly not the one to state the U.S. government's position at this time.

But there is really so little known about the facts that you have just rolled out here, that before we jump to conclusions on those, I think we need a little bit more analysis before we use that as a point to make a point.

KEILAR: Meaning what, you want there to be U.S. analysis of this?

RISCH: Well, U.S. analysis certainly, not necessarily physical, but at least some in-depth conversations with those who have -- who are closer to the facts, to those facts.

KEILAR: All right.

Senator Risch, thanks so much for joining us. We appreciate it.

RISCH: Thank you. Thanks, Brianna.

KEILAR: Just ahead, Donald Trump's campaign event. What is he going to say tonight about new polls and his rivals? I'm sure he will have something to say about it.

And surveillance video just released, it's of a shooting suspect in Ferguson, Missouri, during the new round of unrest we have been seeing, breaking news ahead.



KEILAR: We are standing by to hear from Donald Trump. He is scheduled to take reporters' questions on the campaign trail.

First, the breaking news. Police just released surveillance video from the night that new violence erupted in Ferguson, Missouri. They say it shows shooting suspect Tyrone Harris apparently with a gun before he was shot and wounded by an officer.

I want to get more now from CNN's Sara Sidner. She is there and joins us live -- Sara.


SARA SIDNER, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Police have said that Tyrone Harris shot at them before he was shot at and he was hit. He is in critical condition.

I want you to take a look at this, because his family told us initially that he was not armed and that they believe it was a case of mistaken identity. But let me see -- let you see this video. This is surveillance video from the area where about a few hundred yards from where the protests were.

And what you see is everyone scatter when those initial gunshots went off. And that was a fight between two separate groups fighting over something, according to police. Then you see someone who appears to have a gun. It looks very much like a gun. It seems like he's pointing it down on the ground and running toward where some of this gunfire was happening.

We're getting this video. The police saying that indeed -- the person with the gun is indeed Tyrone Harris, the person who ended up being shot by police after police say he shot at them. They also have two cars that were hit by gunfire.

The police aren't the only ones saying that he was armed. While his family says they believe it was a case of mistaken identity and someone -- he was not there and armed at the time, we have some other people who were there who say they do believe he was armed. (BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

SIDNER (voice-over): Pepper spray flies after police tell protesters to get out of the street that has become synonymous with civil unrest, West Florissant in Ferguson, Missouri, erupting again one night after shots rang out, scattering protesters and police.

The night after the barrage of gunfire and two stores were looted, West Florissant had some new guests, armed men who call themselves the Oath Keepers, here, they say, to protect the U.S. Constitution and in particular an employee of, who says its journalist was attacked and beaten after witnessing looting. He is wearing a black hat. We snapped moments of the way he went to police, his face bloodied.

The controversial Oath Keepers, their armed presence a sore spot with protesters who say they are unarmed, but getting much of the police attention, though Missouri's gun laws allowed people to openly carry if their guns are legally obtained. The night before, we witnessed a store owner who armed himself, too, protecting his store which had been looted in the past.

Meantime, police have made at least 85 arrests in 24 hours, as planned civil disobedience took place in and around Ferguson, blocking highways and stopping traffic, frustrations and fear causing one driver to step on the gas. Protesters plan on more action to remember Tyrone Harris. Police say he was shot early Monday after shooting at police down the street from the protest line.

Tyrone Harris' father, though, says his son did not shoot at police.

TYRONE HARRIS SR., FATHER: From what I heard, he was there with some friends. And the friends had a confrontation and they started shooting at the friend, and he just happened to just be at the wrong place at the wrong time.

SIDNER: But a young man who says he knows Harris and was on the scene told us Harris was armed and did fire back at police.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Tyrone was right next to me. And he was shooting back at them and all. He had a gun and all that. We were just protesting.

SIDNER (on camera): Police are saying, look, he shot at us, so we shot back. Is that what happened?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes. They shot him six times in the stomach and put him in handcuffs.

SIDNER (voice-over): We also took a close look at video of a man with a gun after gunfire erupted. You can clearly see he has on red pants. So did Harris, his red pants shone here after he lay on the ground after being shot by police.

(END VIDEOTAPE) SIDNER: And the surveillance video, again, police just released that we have on now, police say it indeed is Tyrone Harris holding that gun.

The police say that is the same person who fired at them and they fired back -- Brianna.

KEILAR: Sara Sidner in Ferguson, thank you for that report.

It really breaks down a lot of what we're talking about with Philip Banks. He is a former top official with the New York Police Department. We have CNN law enforcement analyst Tom Fuentes, who is a former FBI assistant director. Also with us, CNN anchor Don Lemon and community activist John Gaskin. He's in Ferguson tonight.

Phil, to you first. Let's take another look at the video. Police say that it shows Tyrone Harris, the man that they have charged in Sunday's shooting in Ferguson, this -- Right there, as we're zooming in here, grabbing a gun out of his waistband. This was after shots were fired during the protest. We have seen this now in Sara's report from different angles, and it certainly does appear, while back and white here, to be Harris, who in other angles is wearing those distinctive red pants. What's your analysis?

PHILIP BANKS, FORMER NYPD DEPARTMENT CHIEF: You know, Brianna, the investigation will determine in fact if that young man had a weapon, if he was firing at an officer or not. It certainly looks like it was. And it certainly looks like, just preliminary, that the officers had just justifications for their shootings.

But the bigger picture, of course, is the mistrust, and we have to call it as we see it. There are times in which local law enforcement makes mistakes, and they have to be held accountable. But there are times in which you have some young men and some young women who present very chaotic, dangerous, life-threatening situations, for not only the officers but for the people in the community. And the police department has to take necessary action in that particular case here.

So we need to look at the big picture, do a thorough investigation, get trust factors through their overall process, and see how we make progress from there.

KEILAR: What's your analysis of the different angles of this video that we're seeing?

FUENTES: Well, I think the verification that he was out there with a gun and then the kid that talked on Sara Sidner saying he was shooting the gun and was shooting it at police. I think that, you know, that's ample evidence that that was going on.

And of course, when the police are in a shoot-out and return fire, and the person ends up with bullets in him on the ground, that's kind of evidentiary that it must have been him shooting at the police. Because when they shot back, they shot him.

So I think that, you know, we commented before, I commented before that people even seeing the video might not necessarily believe it. Even if it was clearly in the video. And now you have that.

KEILAR: John, tell us what the community is feeling about this shooting. Some people really are very upset about it. They don't feel it was justified.

GASKIN: I've talked to a number of folks...

KEILAR: John Gaskin, if you could go ahead and comment on that.

GASKIN: Sure. I've talked to a number of people here, and many people don't believe that that is the suspect that they're referencing.

But my answer to many folks is this: this movement, it's not about violence. It's a peaceful movement. We've learned that from Dr. King. And my advice to many folks is don't bring weapons out to the protest. Don't have them with you. If you were fearful of your life, you shouldn't be out at night protesting.

I was out there last night. Things remained relatively peaceful. But folks who were bringing weapons with them should remain at home and should not -- you know, obviously, shouldn't put themselves in the position to have weapons with them. Because not only does it put law enforcement -- law enforcement's lives at risk, it puts the other peaceful protesters that are out there at risk, as well.

KEILAR: Don, we were talking -- we've talking about this video, Oath Keepers. Heavily-armed individuals who were walking around. Did you ever see these folks when you were covering Ferguson? You were there quite a while covering this story. And what do you make of them being there last night?

LEMON: I -- I've been there so many times. And I don't remember them actively being on the ground when I was there. They very well could have been there. There were lots of -- lots of different scenes, lots of different places where there were altercations. The crowds were very big at some point. So I don't remember them being on the ground.

But I remember, Brianna, when you and I were on the air. Remember when the officer pushed me?


LEMON: Live on the air? That officer was a member of Oath Keepers, and some of his comments at an Oath Keepers' -- I think it convention or talk, whatever -- got him into trouble and then ultimately got him kicked off, or at least suspended at that time from the police department.

KEILAR: I should -- let me add real quick, Don, I believe he spoke to the Oath Keepers.

LEMON: Right.

KEILAR: They disavowed him being a member, the Oath Keepers did.

LEMON: Right, right.

KEILAR: But yes. He had spoken with them. They posted his video.

Sorry, go on.

LEMON: But as far as them being out there, the video that I've seen of them being out there, they're interacting with the protesters, saying that "I'm on your side" or what have you. I don't like seeing weapons open like that, unless police officers are carrying them. But that is -- that's our Second Amendment. That's what the laws say in Missouri, that you can carry a weapon as long as you have -- as long as it is licensed.

The problem there, it's not licensed guns and people who are using them properly. It's people who are not using them properly. People who are shooting at the crowds. People who should not be carrying guns. Whether or not the Oath Keepers should be there, listen, that's not for me to decide. I would rather not see any guns; I'd rather not see the violence.

But also remember, the security that we have when we're there, our security guards many times are armed. And they are not necessarily police officers or members of police departments who work for the St. Louis or Ferguson Police Departments. So it is within their rights, but I'd rather not see it.

KEILAR: Let me ask Phil what you think about this from a law enforcement perspective. Because you have the chief of police there saying they don't want these folks there. Obviously, they worry that this will get something going that they don't want to see.

BANK: I can't imagine any police chief wanting to have the Oath Keepers or any similar time of organization out there with -- with visible guns out there. It's certain undermining. You have a very tenuous situation, a very chaotic situation. You need emotions to stay cool. The police department and police officers have to remain cool.

[18:35:03] I see it as this recipe for disaster. I'm not really sure what the purpose of them is. I'm not sure what the good of them is. And I certainly, as a law-enforcement person, don't see how they help this situation during these -- during these times.

KEILAR: All right. Phil Banks, John Gaskin, Don Lemon and Tom Fuentes, thanks, guys.

And be sure to watch "CNN TONIGHT WITH DON LEMON" at 10 p.m. Eastern.

Now we are standing by for Donald Trump's campaign event as new polls show that he has taken the lead in Iowa despite his latest controversies.

Plus, millions of gallons of toxic waste water. Heavy metal in that metal turning a pristine river orange. Now new tests reveal the potential danger to people.


[18:40:32] KEILAR: Donald Trump is preparing to go in front of the microphones again, right there. We are waiting for him. Live pictures coming to you. He's scheduled to speak soon on the campaign trail. And there's plenty for reporters to ask him about, including two new post-debate polls and his new admission to CNN that he is a whiner and proud of it.

Let's bring in our chief congressional correspondent, Dana Bash. Whining to win, right?

DANA BASH, CNN CHIEF CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Whining to -- I mean, you know what? Why not? As good a strategy as any. You know, in Iowa, 55 percent of people who watched last week's debate said they were actually less comfortable with Donald Trump as a candidate, and it isn't stopping him still from topping a new poll there.


BASH (voice-over): In the first-contest state of Iowa, Donald Trump is leading for the first time, according to a new Suffolk University poll, edging out Wisconsin Governor Scott Walker, who spent months treading lightly around Trump and is now taking the gloves off.

GOV. SCOTT WALKER (R-WI), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Donald Trump is just using the same old tired talking points as the Democrats. And they didn't work in the past. They're certainly not going to work in Iowa.

BASH: Trump's rise in Iowa comes as he told CNN's Chris Cuomo he still won't rule out running as an independent.

DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I have to keep that door open, because if something happens where I'm not treat fairly, I may very well use that door.

BASH: And the bombastic billionaire is defying convention once again, admitting to and owning to being a whiner.

TRUMP: And I am a whiner. And I'm a whiner, and I keep whining and whining until I win.

BASH: Trump is trying to redeem himself with female voters after a public feud with FOX News's Megyn Kelly.

TRUMP: I cherish women. I will be so good to women. I will work hard to protect women.

BASH: The new Iowa poll shows that despite controversial remarks about women, Trump is at 14 percent, winning with female voters in the first-caucus state. This GOP opponent isn't buying it.

SEN. RAND PAUL (R-KY), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Vulgarity does not equate with insight. Because someone can stand up and say, "You're stupid and you're ugly" does not equate with a vision for the country. BASH: Trump's lead has narrowed in the first-primary state of New

Hampshire. On the upswing, two breakout stars from last week's debate.

GOV. JOHN KASICH (R-OH), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: We just keep plugging. We're like the little engine that can.

BASH: Ohio Governor John Kasich catapulted from barely registering in New Hampshire to third place. Conservative voters in the Live Free or Die state apparently not turned off by comments about same-sex marriage.

KASICH: I just went to a wedding of a friend of mine who happens to be gay.

BASH: And former CEO Carly Fiorina who couldn't even get on the main debate stage last week, moving up in both Iowa and New Hampshire.


BASH: Now, the people who are not doing well are as much of the story today as those who are.

Chris Christie is basically living in New Hampshire. He's only at 3 percent in a new poll there. And, you know, Brianna, Rick Perry, he's struggling so much he had to tell all of his staff that they were going to have to work without any pay. And then, of course, there's Jeb Bush, who is now seventh in Iowa. He never expected to win there, but seventh is not so great.

KEILAR: Yes, that's not very comfortable. All right, Dana Bash. Stand by for us. Thanks so much.

We want to go now to political reporter CNN political reporter Sara Murray. She is on the ground in Michigan, where Donald Trump is scheduled to speak any moment. What are reporters expecting, Sara?

SARA MURRAY, CNN POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, we're here at the Expo Center. Donald Trump is running a little bit late, but we're still expecting him to take reporter questions. I'm sure there is going to be a lot asked about his feud with Megyn Kelly and what he's going to do to sort of make up some ground with women voters, whether he thinks that will hurt him.

But we're also expecting people to press him about policy specifics and see if it's finally time for him to go into detail on some of these things, whether it's trade or tax plans or immigration.

Now here at the Expo Center, his supporters are being pretty patient in their waiting game for Trump, drinking some beer, chowing down on some popcorn. A couple of them have told me, look, they think it's time. It's time for him to offer some specifics.

KEILAR: Yes, and is he going to? Any sign whether or not he is going to? MURRAY: This is the big question. So over the last week or so,

campaign aides have been saying, Look, the policy papers are done. We're ready. We can start offering specifics." And Donald Trump is still holding back.

When he was on "NEW DAY" this morning with Chris Cuomo, he sort of grilled him on his different plans, and Trump said, "Look, they're ready to go. I'm just not ready to release them yet." So it will be interesting to see if he starts to feel any of this pressure to sort of show a little leg and give us a few more details on some of these plans.

KEILAR: All right. Sara Murray in Michigan, following Donald Trump. Should be taking questions any moment now.

Let's talk more about Donald Trump and these new polls -- big numbers -- and the state of the Republican presidential race. We have our chief political analyst Gloria Borger here with us; along with CNN chief congressional correspondent, Dana Bash; CNN political contributor, S.E. Cupp; and CNN senior political analyst, Ron Brownstein. He's the editorial director of the "Washington Journal."

[18:45:12] So, S.E., you have two pretty good headlines for Donald Trump. You look at these polls, Iowa, New Hampshire. Republicans look at this and they say, what?


KEILAR: Oy, that's a good --


CUPP: The word for this is oy.

Look,. I think Republicans waiting for Donald Trump's supporters to say, all right. He just went too far. We're pulling out. Or we're going to be waiting a long time.

They don't seem to be interested much in his policy specifics, in his conservative credentials. I think what's going on here is, obviously, they like his personality and he's it's called a personality, the way he talks.

But, also, you have to remember that conservative voters feel burned. They feel like in 2008, and 2012 the establishment told them, here's the electable guy. Here's who you have to vote for.

And what do they have to show for it? Nothing. They didn't get a Republican in the White House. And they didn't get satisfaction of voting for their principle guy.

So, this time they're saying, you know what? Winnable or not, electable or not, Donald Trump, we're sticking just to show the establishment. We're not with you. We're not listening to you again.

KEILAR: That's really interesting. And, Gloria, Donald Trump is so unconventional. We look at where he

is in this first public appearance since the debate. He is in the key early primary state. Oh, wait, it's not. Michigan. What is -- what's the point here?

GLORIA BORGER, CNN CHIEF POLITICAL ANALYST: It's kind of a light blue state maybe?

I think he got invited by two Republican organizations, county Republican organizations. It is free media. He knows wherever he'll go, he's going to get press. And it is a Republican group at least.

But let me -- let me just add to what she was saying about Donald Trump. I think, you know, we use this phrase "disruption" a lot when it comes to the tech world. I think Donald Trump wants, I mean, I think his followers want to disrupt politics as usual in the Republican Party.

As S.E. was saying, they're alienated. They don't care if some people think he is an imposter. What they are saying is, stop and listen to us. We're sick of you guys. You're not winners. You're losers as Donald Trump might say. While we don't necessarily agree with Donald Trump on everything, and maybe some of us thought what he said about women is terrible, this kind of breaks wide open in public view the differences within the Republican party about how to proceed to win the presidency.

And these base voters are saying, before we get will, you have to pay attention. And this is a good way of getting that message across.

KEILAR: It seems, Ron, like his entire strategy is: earned media. Is he just rewriting the rules of campaigning?

RON BROWNSTEIN, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: He is certainly playing by different rules. I mean, as a celebrity candidate, we're about to cover a Donald Trump press conference. When was the last Scott Walker or Marco Rubio press conference we covered live?

But, you know, look, there is a difference between being the voice of a faction and being a full scale competitor for the presidency. He is at 18 percent in both these polls. You can do that. It is a lot tougher eventually to get to 38 percent or 45 percent, which is what you need to do to actually win when the race narrows.

And the other thing to keep in mine is when you look at how quickly John Kasich and Carly Fiorina moved up in that New Hampshire poll. At this point, to some point, we are still measuring clouds. I mean, they can be blown away very quickly by events. The attachments and even the awareness and understanding of any of these candidates is pretty shallow at this point and is subject to events that have not yet occurred yet, particularly the buying of television ads which hasn't started.

So, things can move around a lot. I agree with both of them. But there's no question, I agree with S.E. and Gloria, there is a segment of Republican Party that saying don't thread on me and wants to be heard in this kind of insurgency that we're seeing around Donald Trump.

KEILAR: Dana, I imagine the Jeb Bush campaign is at these polls and maybe they're also saying oy when they look at them, right? You have John Kasich who's surging in New Hampshire. Jeb Bush doing better in New Hampshire than Iowa, he is down to seventh in Iowa.

BASH: That's right. You know, his campaign, maybe even he tweeted a photograph of a turtle today, to remind people that he considers the tortoise in the tortoise and the hare, slow and steady.

However -- and just to answer your questions on Iowa, you know, he is not your typical flavor of conservative for most Iowa voters. And his campaign will tell that you, first and foremost, they were surprised he was in third place in the last couple of months. It is New Hampshire that he has to be most worried about. He's still doing well but he's got John Kasich coming up in his lane. The more moderate, sort of I'm a governor who has done something who isn't a Bush.

[18:50:01] So that is something that should be concerning. It is early. They will tell you that and he's got a lot of money. They will tell you that. But that is the thing they're watching for.

KEILAR: Rick Perry --

BORGER: Brianna, one other thing, is that just in the Iowa poll, one thing to pay attention to is that 20 percent of those people polled were undecided. So, you know, as everyone is saying, there is a lot of shifting to be done before the first votes are cast in Iowa, you know, this winter in February.

KEILAR: When you look at Trump and you think he looks like he's not going away any time soon, he's sort of defying the conventions here, how can other candidates adapt to him? We have asked this question but it seems like it's always based on this idea, OK, at a certain point, he's going to mess up and then we'll have our moment. At this point, no, what are they going to do?

CUPP: If I were one of those second tier candidates, I would make my moment around calling Trump out. I get why the front runner class, maybe Marco, Chris Christie, Scott Walker, Jeb Bush are kind of letting him alone, but if you're Rand Paul or, I don't know, Rick Santorum, Mike Huckabee, Carly Fiorina, why wouldn't you say this is not the answer?

BASH: Here's the thing --


BASH: So, Rick Perry did, didn't work well for him. Lindsey Graham did, didn't work well. Rand Paul is trying.

CUPP: Trying, yes.

BASH: And it almost seems like he's sort of screaming in the wilderness. I mean, today, he went after Donald Trump as vulgar and someone with the vision and even stronger than that. CUPP: Yes.

BORGER: I think the attack is that he's an imposter, that he, you know, he's pretending to be a real Republican and Rand Paul started to get at that and so did Walker today, that this is an impostor and if you start taking a look at his positions on the issues if you can find them out, conservatives, you might understand that he's not as to the right as you want him to be.

KEILAR: All right.

BORGER: And that may be more lucrative than attacking him for his personality.

KEILAR: All right. Guys, I'm sorry. We do have to leave there.

Gloria, Dana, S.E., and Ron, thank you guys so much. You get the last word next time, Ron, I promise.

All right. Just ahead, Donald Trump courting controversy and now taking questions as polls show him leading still the Republican pack.

And it's a disturbing color of orange, but is the water in this river safe? That's the question. We have new test results in on a --


[18:56:44] KEILAR: A once pristine river now a toxic tributary and environmental nightmare, a huge black eye for the very agency charged with protecting America's waterways.

Let's go to Dan Simon. He is in Durango River, along the Animus River.

Give us the latest on this, Dan.

DAN SIMON, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, hey, Brianna, there's really no way for the EPA to sugarcoat this. This was their deal, this was their fault, but they say they are committed to making things right for the people in the community of Durango.

In the meantime, you can see that the Animus River is still closed. You see signs like this along the river, but if you come out, you can see the river has basically turned to its natural color. That said, you can still see evidence of this toxic sludge and we actually got a sample of the water. Looks like orange juice but you don't want to drink it. This is really nasty stuff. There is lead, there is arsenic and the folks in this community are very concerned.

Now, this all happened when the EPA was trying to do the right thing, trying to clean up an abandoned gold mine and it basically backfired. And that sent 3 million gallons of this toxic sludge into the Animas River, what the EPA says they're trying to do is clean things up, and so far, their mitigation efforts have been successful because the water is returning back to its normal, if you will. And also, the Colorado governor sounded optimistic when he said that the levels in the water seem to be looking better. But that said, residents are still pretty nervous about this -- Brianna.

KEILAR: All right. Dan Simon in Durango, thanks so much.

We have breaking political news coming into THE SITUATION ROOM. Hillary Clinton will be turning over her e-mail server to federal investigators.

CNN's Elise Labott is with us now.

This is huge news, Elise.

ELISE LABOTT, CNN GLOBAL AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: Huge, Brianna. You know there has been a lot of talk about why Secretary Clinton was wiping the server, why she was not handing over all of the information related to that server. Secretary Clinton has said she handed over 50,000 pages of the e-mails.

Now, in a statement, CNN has learned Nick Merrill, her spokesman, saying that Secretary Clinton has, quote, "directed her team to give her e-mail server that was used during her tenure as secretary of state to the state to the Department of Justice, as well as a thumb drive containing copies of her e-mail already provided to the State Department and as we know, her attorney David Kendall has been holding that thumb drive.

Big news, Brianna. There is an expanding probe into the use of Secretary Clinton's e-mails. That probe is now expanding to some of her other top aides. Secretary Clinton has said that she's handed overall of the e-mails, but the question is that a lot of members of Congress particularly Republican members have asked, what about the server?

Now, Secretary Clinton saying she will hand over that server to the Department of Justice.

KEILAR: All right. Elisa Labott with that big news, Hillary Clinton had said back in March that the server will remain private. That is a direct quote, now we are learning that she will be handing it over. Very big breaking news here in THE SITUATION ROOM.

Thank you so much for watching. I am Brianna Keilar in THE SITUATION ROOM. I'll be right back here tomorrow filling in for Wolf Blitzer.

"ERIN BURNETT OUTFRONT" starts right now.