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One Man Arrested in Baltimore Protests; Cop Killer Manhunt Stopped; Police Tell Residents to Stay Inside as Manhunt Continues; Pretrial for Freddie Gray Murder Case Begins; Carly Fiorina Could Join Next Debate; Interview with John Kerry; Aired 10-10:30a ET

Aired September 02, 2015 - 10:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


[10:00:22] CAROL COSTELLO, CNN ANCHOR: And good morning. I'm Carol Costello. Thank you so much for joining me.

We're following breaking news out of Baltimore this morning where pretrial hearings are under way in the Freddie Gray case. Protesters out this force. Baltimore Police confirming one arrest already.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What's the number? What's the Justice Department --

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Hey, hey, stay back. Stay back.

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Stay back up. Stay back. Get back.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Back up, please. Back up. Back up, guys.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Come on. Out of the street. Out of the street.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Well, you can see they're just -- things are getting a little bit out of control here and they have taken --

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: All right. Police confirming one arrest. We expect more protests to go on throughout the day. Tempers flaring of course because of those pretrial hearings surrounding these six officers. They're facing charges ranging from false imprisonment to involuntary manslaughter in the arrest and ensuing death of 25-year-old Freddie Gray. That happened back in April. Their attorneys are in the courtroom right now, they're arguing several pretrial motions before a judge.

Jean Casarez is outside of the courthouse in Baltimore.

Bring us up to date, Jean.

JEAN CASAREZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, here is what we understand. You know, as this pretrial hearing is going on, and the most serious charge is murder, because second-degree depraved heart murder is one of the police officers is facing. And outside of these protests, we knew they were going to happen outside. But here is what we understand that led to this arrest. We understand that a number of protesters were linking arms, justice for Freddie Gray. Police officers asked them to get out of the way. Apparently police believe they did not.

One of them was then put into paddy wagon. And as you just said, Baltimore Police Department confirming there has been an arrest. And they just sent out a tweet in all of this really confirming that, saying that they were blocking the roadway. They have since been given direction to move out of the roadway. Most of them acknowledged that and moved to the sidewalk. There was approximately 50 to 75 people in total. An arrest has been made.

So I think, Carol, that what is as important as the facts of this is the presence of the police, the message being sent that we are going to be proactive in all of this because if you remember in May, the police did not do things when there was ransacking and looting and so many crimes being committed, saying that they were at the direction to not do anything. But today showing proactively we are going to arrest you if we believe that a crime is being committed. Even as far as being in the roadway where traffic cannot pass -- Carol.

COSTELLO: Yes, we can see. I'm just watching the video beside you, Jean, of police being very proactive. That's taking place in downtown Baltimore. Probably not far from you where you're standing at the courthouse.

Jean, tell us what's going on inside at the moment and what these pretrial motions involve.

CASAREZ: Well, this is a really important hearing because the defense has filed so many motions that are being argued today. First and foremost, that the charges should be dismissed. They're saying there is no basis of fact. And they explain that by saying that the Thursday evening before the Friday that the arrest warrants -- came about, that there was a secret meeting the defense documents say between an assistant medical examiner and some on the prosecution team.

And in that meeting, something they believe happened because all of a sudden a cause and manner of death were established and then the next day they say the police department went to the district court commissioner with their investigation -- that's to be turned over to the prosecutor -- and they say within 13 minutes that the first arrest warrant was issued.

So they believe there was prosecutorial misconduct and because of that, not only should charges in part or in all be dismissed, but they are asking the elected state attorney, Marilyn Mosby, who has really been the face of this case -- I mean, we remember her on the steps on that Friday, May 1st as she was reciting the probable cause statement of what the prosecutors believe was committed, criminal actions by these officers.

They think she should be recused and that a special prosecutor should be brought in to try this case. Both sides have 15 minutes each to argue. The judge may not render his decision or he could render his decision from the bench.

[10:05:02] This afternoon, it's all about the defendants themselves. Should they be severed? Should they be tried together? And will it proceed to trial in October -- Carol.

COSTELLO: All right. Jean Casarez, reporting live from Baltimore, thanks so much.

With me now, CNN legal analyst and criminal defense attorney Joey Jackson and Bernard Kerik, former New York City police commissioner.

Welcome to you both. Thank you so much for being here.

Bernard, I want to start with you, with how Baltimore City police are handling this protest. There are only about 75 protesters out on the streets right now. But as you could see from the video, police are being proactive.

BERNARD KERIK, FORMER NEW YORK CITY POLICE COMMISSIONER: They're going to be proactive, they're going to be very aggressive, I think, in -- you know, in today's times, based on what's happened in the past. You know, the mayor in the past said give the protesters room to do whatever they wanted to do. And it led to a lot of damage. A lot of destruction in the city. People getting hurt.

I don't think the police want to go through that again. I think they're going to be very aggressive. They -- you know, hopefully these are peaceful protests. They've called for peaceful protest. But who knows how it goes? You know, once they're out in the streets, and they start getting loud, and you have inciters, you have instigators that are going to come in and instigate and yell and scream and, you know, throw things. Once that starts, I could see the police in today's times getting very aggressive to stop it.

COSTELLO: And I notice most police are not -- they're not wearing riot gear. That was the plan early on. There is a new police chief there, as well. So he's dealing with this, right? It's tough.

KERIK: Well, these guys -- you know, there's not many people out there. You know, there are really, 50, 60, 70 people.

COSTELLO: Yes.

KERIK: It's a small protest. If it gets bigger, if it gets more aggressive, you're going to see a different response. Hopefully it stays the way it is.

COSTELLO: OK, Joey, now on to what's happening inside the courthouse. The state's attorney in this case, lawyers for these police officers want her recused.

JOEY JACKSON, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: Right.

COSTELLO: They say that she's like -- you know, she's weighted to one side, it's pretty obvious and she's doing it for political gain.

JACKSON: You know, what happens in cases is that, first of all, the defense is doing its job and their job really is to frame the issues and make sure when there is a trial that they discuss whatever the issues, you know, are that are significant there. One of the things that is important to this defense team is getting her removed because she's very motivated to get the conviction. We saw that, predicated on what should occurred.

Let's go back to that, Carol. April 12 the incident occurs. April 19th he dies. May 1st, she announces the charges criminally and the 21st, a few weeks later, there are indictments. So she's motivated to move forward. However, in looking and examining the issue, think about what a prosecutor's role is, Carol. To prosecute. That's no mystery. They're not neutral parties. They're there to obtain a conviction.

In looking at that, however, we need to look also at the process. There are built-in protections. What is that built-in protection? A 12-member jury. And ultimately when it goes to that 12-member jury and we'll have an opportunity to discuss whether this is the proper venue at the proper time, but those are going to be the people who are going to decide guilt or innocence beyond a reasonable doubt.

A prosecutor can merely lay out the facts of the case, lay out, discuss the issues of the case, make strenuous arguments advocate. But it's the people in that jury box who are going to have to determine whether the police acted unlawfully.

COSTELLO: But this state's attorney, this prosecutor, happens to be married to a city councilman.

JACKSON: Yes.

COSTELLO: And a lot of the unrest was happening in that city councilman's district. So, you know, defense attorneys are alleging that she brought these charges quickly to make his constituents happy.

JACKSON: Sure. And you know, they're doing what they need to be doing and the judge of course in feeling the pressures that the judge feels on that bench right now is going to have to weigh the issues and certainly the judge has sifted through those motions. There are multiple motions before that -- the court right now. And the judge will make the proper decision. But ultimately people are married to other people.

I mean, you know, what can you do? The fact is, is that some of those, there are inherent conflicts in them. And so are you going to predicate it upon your -- the fact that your husband is a city council person, you know, your husband is -- you know, has a relationship with the mayor, whatever it is. And of course there are other issues there, too. They're saying that she's too closely connected to who was the victim's attorney.

COSTELLO: Billy Murphy.

JACKSON: Billy Murphy.

COSTELLO: Who I just talked to.

JACKSON: Exactly. And so there are issues there. And the judge will have weigh and evaluate those. But I think that judge has to be very careful because at the end of the day, it's the people on that jury who make the decision, not the prosecutor who merely presents the case for them to review, evaluate and decide on them.

COSTELLO: Joey Jackson, Bernard Kerik, thanks to you both. I appreciate it.

KERIK: Thank you.

COSTELLO: Let's head north of Chicago now, a stunning development just moments ago, we learned that police have called off their search for those three suspected cop killers. The victim in this case, Lieutenant Charles Joseph Gliniewicz, was a 32-year police veteran and may have been just days from retiring.

CNN's Rosa Flores joins us now from Fox Lake, Illinois, with this latest development.

Good morning.

[10:10:04] ROSA FLORES, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Carol. I just got off the phone with the commander who is in charge of the investigation here now and he tells me that that massive manhunt, that search, has been called off at in this point and that at this point it's in the investigation phase, he tells me.

So what does all this mean? Let me give you the background here. He says that after Lieutenant Gliniewicz was shot and killed, they established a two-mile perimeter around that scene and they sent hundreds of agents to go in there, knock on every door, clear every house, go through every single abandoned building, he tell me, because in that area there is abandoned buildings that are used by squatters sometimes, or overgrown areas, marshy areas.

He says that they combed through every inch again and again to make sure that these three suspects were not in that area. After they finished doing that, Carol, he says that at that point it goes into the investigation phase. What they're doing now, they're trying to gather surveillance video which they have recovered, he tells me, and they have two to three investigators combing through that video.

He says some has great video quality, others a little grainy, but they haven't found anything specific that they could release to the public at this point in time that would identify or at least give the public a clue as to who we're talking about here in these three individuals who have only been described as two white males and a black male.

Now, again, they are collecting evidence. I asked about witnesses, is there an eyewitness? He tells me this is a remote secluded area. There wasn't anybody that they know of. But of course they are asking anyone if you saw anything for them to come forward and give a description or anything that they know at this point in time about the timeline. He says it could be hours, it could be weeks, Carol, because we are north of Chicago, yes, but it's very connected to the Chicago metro area and to the Chicago transportation. He says they could be out of town, they could be out of state at this point this time.

Again, the investigation does continue, but it shifts from a search to a digging through evidence, gathering evidence, and figuring out who these people are. Not in the sense of sending in K-9s, but using just good old police work to try to find these suspects -- Carol.

COSTELLO: All right. Rosa Flores reporting live from Fox Lake, Illinois.

Still to come in the NEWSROOM, opening the door. A change in the rules could allow one GOP candidate to take her place on the main stage.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[10:17:04] COSTELLO: Carly Fiorina's surge in the polls could pay off in a big way with a spot on the main stage at the next Republican presidential debate.

CNN, host of that debate, announcing we are revising the debate's criteria which could expand the field, and that prompted praise from Fiorina.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CARLY FIORINA (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: They have said that the cause was a lack of national public polling data following the August 6th debate. And that is the truth. You know, there were so many polls prior to August 6th and there have been very few since August 6th. And so if you just average these polls you come up with an answer that doesn't reflect current reality.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: OK. So let's talk about that with CNN Politics editor -- executive editor, Mark Preston, and CNN correspondent Athena Jones.

Thanks for being with me, guys, Both of you, I should say,

Mark, walk us through the changes and why they were made.

MARK PRESTON, CNN POLITICS EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR: Sure, Carol. Let me unpack this for you. This can be a little bit confusing. I'll try to make it as simple as possible. When we created the criteria back in May, we were looking at national polling as one of the main criteria and will continue to do so. You have to hit a minimum threshold to be invited to the Ronald Reagan Presidential Library debate.

What we discovered, though, and what we thought is that there would be an abundance of polls from August through September. And in fact, if you go back to 2011, you saw 15 polls that were conducted during that time and if you go back since -- you saw 16 polls. The problem was, Carol, is that right now there are only three national polls that we would be looking at to decide who would get on to the top tier debate.

We decided editorially that wasn't fair; to do so, we made an amendment and what that amendment says that if you rank in the top 10 in these national polls from the beginning of August basically until September 10th, then you would receive an invitation to be on the main stage on September 16th.

COSTELLO: OK. So there was a method to our madness here at CNN. But Athena, Fiorina praised what she called a grassroots effort for change. So what was she talking about?

ATHENA JONES, CNN CORRESPONDENT: That's right. Well, Fiorina's campaign and also a lot of supporters have been pushing for CNN to be more inclusive. Obviously in the end CNN decided that it made sense because you have to look at Fiorina surging after that first debate. She's talking about celebrating being on the main stage now.

Well, that first debate at the beginning of August she was in the so- called happy hour debate, some people called it the kiddy table debate. But a lot of people felt like she won that debate. She really stood out. She wasn't afraid to throw some punches. She was poised, she impressed a lot of people. And so ever since then, she's been rising in the polls.

Before that debate, she was around 1 percent. Now she's hovering around 5 percent. Clearly in the top 10 in a lot of the recent polls. And so she and her supporters were really pushing CNN pushing the Republican National Committee who also has something to do with this to support a change that would allow her to be on that main stage. And so now it looks like she will be.

[10:20:10] Of course I think Mark may have mentioned that it's not going to be final until that cutoff date of September 10th. But right now, with her standing, it's looking like she will join the others on that main stage -- Carol.

COSTELLO: OK. So, Mark, couldn't every other candidate make the same argument?

PRESTON: Well, I mean, if you look at statistics, any candidate can make that argument if they reach the threshold. So let's just be clear. A couple of things. As Athena said, it's premature to say that anybody is going to be in that debate. You know, at this point we don't know until the cutoff happens on September 10th.

We could actually see some of the people who are polling in the top 10 from our original criteria from July 16th to September 10th, they could fall out. What will happen, though, is that we're not going to penalize anybody. If you were in the top 10 in this time period from July 16th until September 10th, if you remain in the top 10, and somebody, perhaps Carly Fiorina, were to be in the top 10 between August 7th and September 10th, then there won't be 10 people on the top tier -- stage. There'll be 11 people. And we should also note that there are going to be two segments of

this debate. So almost all of the presidential candidates will have an opportunity basically in primetime to try to spread their message to Republican voters.

COSTELLO: All right. I can't wait. Mark Preston, Athena Jones, thanks to both of you.

Vice President Joe Biden heads to Miami today fueling more speculation of a White House run. Biden speaking at a Miami-Dade College this afternoon about the importance of community colleges teaming up with employers. But that's not all. He'll also be doing a little fundraising tonight. According to reports, he'll be hosting a $10,000 per couple event benefiting the Democratic Senatorial Campaign.

Now Biden's trip to Florida is nothing new but it comes on the heels of Senator Chris Coons, a Delaware Democrat, saying Tuesday that he would support Joe Biden for president.

We're following breaking news this morning. An update in the shooting death of a man in Texas by police. We'll have a live report for you next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[10:26:25] COSTELLO: All right. Christiane Amanpour is right now interviewing Secretary of State John Kerry on the heels of very good news. Apparently President Obama has enough Democratic support to get that Iranian nuclear deal through. Let's listen to the interview.

(BEGIN LIVE INTERVIEW - STARTS IN PROGRESS)

JOHN KERRY, SECRETARY OF STATE: Trying to point out clearly today what I will say is that this agreement is not based on hope or trust. This agreement is based on verification and on very specific steps that Iran has to take. For instance, you were just having somebody interviewed about business in Iran. Business in Iran will not be able to take off until Iran has done all of the things that it has to do in ordered to expand the breakout time and live up to this agreement. That could take six months to a year.

And so again, nothing in this agreement is based on hope or in a signature. It is based on very specific things that have to be verified for the lifetime of this agreement. There is no sunset to this agreement. It is the lifetime of the agreement that must be lived up to.

CHRISTIANE AMANPOUR, CNN CHIEF INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: And, Secretary Kerry, as we continue, I want to also welcome our viewers in the United States. This interview is being broadcast live around the world and in the USA.

So let me just ask you again, you said you wanted to dispel the myths, as you call it, around this deal. One of them and you've addressed quite a lot right now, one of them, even those supporters in Congress say they have a heavy heart about, is what about all the billions of dollars that will be freed under sanctions relief that many fear, not just in the U.S. but in the region, will go towards Iran funding the kind of terrorism that it's been accused of funding in the past?

KERRY: Right. Well, to give you an example of the level of distortion and the mythology, I keep hearing people talk about hundreds of billions of dollars that will be released. That is not what will happen. The money that has been held back in escrow is money actually that belongs to Iran. But it has not been delivered to Iran under the sanctions regime.

The real amount is somewhere in the vicinity of $50 billion to $55 billion. Much of that money is already spoken for in Iran because of contracts with China, because of bad loans, because of balance of debt payments, because of infrastructure projects. And for Iran to bring its oil industry back to where it was just five years ago, they would have to invest several hundred billion dollars.

So, yes, it is probably fair to say something may find its way to some bad or nefarious activity, but the activities that we have objected to that Iran has engaged in are not fueled primarily by money. And much of the terrorism that has been supported in the region is done on the cheap, not because of money. So I do not believe nor does our intelligence community that the money released by this, which is not hundreds of billions but about $50 billion to $55 billion, that that money is going to be determinative in any way regarding the security of the region.

AMANPOUR: Mr. Secretary, a lot of attention was paid to the head of the Iranian Revolutionary Guard this week saying that the United States remains and is the great Satan no matter where this deal is approved or not. But just afterwards I spoke to the powerful head of the Iran's parliament, Ali Larijani, and he said that that was referring to American's past actions and that there may be a more friendly future.

Just take a listen if you would to what he told me about possible better relations with the United States going forward.