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Former Tennis Star James Blake Attacked By Police Officer; United States And Russia Trade Jabs Over Concerns About Syria's Military Build-Up; New Species Of Human Ancestors Discovered In South Africa. Aired 3-4p ET

Aired September 12, 2015 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:00:12] POPPY HARLOW, CNN ANCHOR: 3:00 Eastern, noon Pacific. I'm Poppy Harlow in New York.

We begin with politics. First up this hour, Republican presidential candidate front-runner Donald Trump telling CNN just last hour he is ready for Wednesday's presidential primary debate. The current front- runner just wrapped up an event in Iowa speaking to reporters following a campaign rally. Here's what he said.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE REPORTER: Said last time that -- anything different?

DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Well, my whole life is preparation for a debate. You know, if you think about it, what's preparing for a debate? There are a million different things. My whole life is preparation for a debate.

I want to talk about a lot of different things. There are so many things you can talk about. They can talk Obamacare, they can talk -- but we're really talking about in my opinion, security, the military, of which I really know a lot about. I think one of the biggest surprises will be, if I win, how good I'll be at national security. How good I'll be at the border. I think it will be a big, big, big surprise for people.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARLOW: So it sounds like Donald Trump wants to talk foreign policy, national security at the debate. You see him right there all lined up. The candidates that you will see this week, the CNN's debate, the GOP presidential primary debate. This Wednesday night, September 16th. 6:00 p.m. and 8:00 p.m. eastern only right here on CNN.

Also, the top story we are following here today, a former tennis star who is tackled, body slammed, and then arrested in a case of mistaken identity says he wants to change the way that some police deal with the public. And he now has video to make his case.

You see it playing there behind me. We will take it slow. This is newly released surveillance video which shows James Blake standing in front of a Manhattan hotel this week when suddenly a plain clothed officer rushes at him, grabs him by the arm and neck and pulls him face down on the sidewalk. The NYPD commissioner later apologized explain that Blake looked so much like the suspect the police were looking for in this credit card fraud investigation that he could have been his, quote, "twin brother." Blake says while he does appreciate that apology, it is not enough. He is planning to meet with the police department. This as it comes to light the officer who arrested him has been accused of excessive force multiple times before.

Earlier today James Blake spoke with our Don Lemon about the change he wants to see out of this incident and also whether or not he thinks this is at all motivated by race.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

DON LEMON, CNN HOST, CNN TONIGHT: You're looking at that video. Is it hard to look at?

JAMES BLAKE, FORMER TENNIS STAR: You know, I've seen it a few times now. And they talk about being desensitized when you see something a lot. And I'm definitely not at that point because it still strikes a nerve. And it's still so frustrating and angering to see how vulnerable I was and what he did with that. And to be a police officer you are given a lot of rights and you're given certain powers. And then to abuse them is just wrong in my opinion.

LEMON: Do you relive it?

BLAKE: I've relived it quite a few times, yes.

LEMON: How so?

BLAKE: Just thinking about what could have happened, what I could have done differently, what I should have done. And what I'm glad I didn't do. I'm very glad that I looked at it at an instance where thought it was someone coming up, rushing me to give me a hug or something or something positive. And that left me completely passive because I was scared. I think about what could have happened and I think about how scary it would have been had I put my arms up, how I done the normal human reaction of someone coming at you to defend myself. It seemed like this person had an agenda with how this was going to go down. And if I had any sort of resistance I wonder what could have happened and if instead of having a bump and a bruise, I could have broken bone or concussion or even worse.

LEMON: You may not be here. Sadly, to say that, but that's the reality of it.

BLAKE: Yes. And that to me makes me feel like it's obviously a negative situation but up trying to think about a lot of positives and one of those is that I completely didn't resist. The first words out of my mouth are I'm 100 percent cooperating. And that was to put my hands behind my back and do whatever he said.

LEMON: Did you do that because of what you had seen in the media? Because talked about it so much.

BLAKE: Yes.

LEMON: You saw the Eric Gardner video and you see what's happening across the country.

BLAKE: Yes. And I was aware of that in the media that a lot of times the reason for things going wrong, the claim is that there was miscommunication. That they thought someone was resisting, they thought he was reaching for something, they thought something was going on, and just a complete miscommunication. So I made sure there was no miscommunication. I'm 100 percent cooperating. Whatever you say.

LEMON: Having dealt with a situation similar to that, you're in shock. It's so shocking because at first, you thought you were getting a hug. I had a situation where I thought I was getting mugged. And people say, you know, these things happen. They don't happen very often. Do you think they happen more often they we think they do?

BLAKE: Sadly I think they happen a lot more often. But I think it's from a minority of the police force. I think there's the majority that are doing great police work that are true public servants that are keeping the public safe and doing the job the way they're supposed to. And unfortunately, the media attention is given to this very dangerous minority that is out there with a badge and using that as shield to do whatever they want.

And I also think it happens more often because this never would have been filed as report. If I hadn't gone to the press, its superior officers would never have known anything went on. And that to me is extremely scary. You wonder how many times this happens without anyone knowing.

[15:05:30] LEMON: And you don't know, right?

BLAKE: Right.

LEMON: And so, again, we don't know how often it happens. And I think even though the records are not clear, it still happens to black and brown people more than it happens to any other -- and from statistics belief, proportionate. It's not because, you know, people commit more times. It happens to black and brown, especially men, more often than anyone else. The police commissioner doesn't believe it has anything to do with the race. Here's he is on CNN's "new day". Take a look.

BILL BRATTON, NEW YORK POLICE DEPARTMENT COMMISSIONER: Sorry. Race has nothing at all to do with this. If you look at the photograph of the suspect it looks like the twin brother of Mr. Blake. So let's put that nonsense to rest right now. Race has nothing to do with this.

LEMON: So he says race has nothing to do with it. Your mom says, I'm glad he took the path of least resistance, she said. It could have gotten really ugly. You don't think about them being black until this throws it back on you. She thinks it has something to do with race. He doesn't. Do you?

BLAKE: You know, I think the race issue is a huge issue. I don't think it's appropriate for this incident because I think this incident needs to be more about the force and the fact that this can't be used in these kinds of police officers can't be encouraged to be back out on the streets. I think the issue of race is a bigger one for a whole different interview. And I don't want to like muddy this situation, muddy this incident that really needs to create change in the police brutality, in the account it of these police officers with the racial issue. I think there's probably -- there probably is a gray area with Bill Bratton being so clear one way and my mom being so clear the other way. I'm sure there is a gray area. And somewhere in the middle that we could talk about but I think that's for a really different discussion.

LEMON: You think its excessive force. That is the main issue when it comes to this.

BLAKE: Yes.

LEMON: And the officer has been investigated several times for excessive force and lawsuits have been filed. Are you planning on filing a lawsuit?

BLAKE: We haven't decided. I have an attorney and we haven't decided how we're going to go about it. The plan is to speak with Commissioner Bratton and Mayor De Blasio and really do it on civil terms and make sure we're trying to make a positive change. And if we come up with solutions, then we don't need to take it to court. If we're not happy what they're proposing, if we don't think they're doing enough to make this right, then we may have to consider a lawsuit. But we haven't made that decision yet.

LEMON: The former police commissioner Ray Kelly was on my colleague's "SMERCONISH's" show today talking about, you know, the procedure and protocol when it comes to some, you know, for identity theft or for cellphone or what have you and here's what he said. Let's listen.

RAY KELLY, FORMER POLICE COMMISSIONER: Well, quite frankly, I'm perplexed by it. This is a type of arrest against credit card fraud. You go up and introduce yourself to the individual, at least you want to talk to or you're doing to arrest. He, also was apparently with four other police officers who is I don't see the rest of the team. So I mean, it looks -- it is what it is. What it seems to be, which, to me is an overreaction.

LEMON: So he is saying, he's a former police commissioner, saying it's an overreaction. The current police department are saying, that is standard operating procedure. That's how you do it. What do you think? And they're saying $29 million they said to try to, you know, to help in situations like this. What do you think?

BLAKE: I think Ray Kelly isn't looking to keep his job anymore. You know, he's gone so he can speak the truth, you know. And I think that is the truth. Everyone can see that video and they can see that that just doesn't make sense when you're investigating a non-violent crime. Supposed non-violent criminal that isn't running, isn't showing any sign of resisting. It really is completely unnecessary. And I don't know why a Commissioner Bratton or anyone would try to spin it any other way because I don't see the value in protecting someone that does wrong because I think that tarnishes the image of the badge. I have the utmost respect for the New York police department and I think most of them are heroes, would be considered heroes in my mind. And I think if you have someone out there that is having this kind of rogue justice, they're tarnishing that image and they don't deserve to be in the same sentence with the heroes of the NYPD. And they don't deserve to have that badge.

LEMON: At no point did he say I'm a New York City police officer. I'm detaining you for this -- nothing?

BLAKE: No, I was detained for around ten minutes, 10 to 15 minutes and at no point was the word police uttered, officer, NYPD, nothing. I had no idea to the point where after I was done and the -- I was calling someone else and they -- I told them what happened. They said, you should change your credit cards, get them canceled, and I might have just been a victim of identity theft because someone just took advantage of me and they never even said they were law enforcement or showed me a badge or identified themselves. I didn't get a name. I never got a badge number. And it made me start thinking, oh, my God, did I just get scammed out of this because I had never heard the word police from any of them.

LEMON: There's a certain degree of comfort and confidence with which one walks through society. When I walk out of this building, I'm an American citizen. I'm going to be safe. The police are here to protect me. Has that changed at all for you?

BLAKE: It's still pretty new, but, you know, I definitely feel cautious right now. And I definitely, for the most part of my life, I felt like the police were public servants and they were here to help and they are here to keep you safe. And I don't want this to ruin it.

Right now it's still pretty raw. I'm still thinking about it a lot. I'm still rerunning it in my head at night. So, of course, I'm going to be a little more hesitant, but I hope it doesn't change my opinion. And by the commissioner, by the mayor, by the police force doing the right thing, getting this guy off the street, making positive change to make sure the police force is held accountable I think we'll slowly restore my faith in every police officer.

LEMON: You got an apology from the police commissioner, from the highest of the police commissioner, from the mayor of the city. Not everybody -- imagine the people this happens to and we know it does happen to other people. They don't get that.

BLAKE: Yes. And I respect that gesture. I appreciate it. It's very nice to them. It is really nice to get a call from the mayor of New York City on your cellphone looking to apologize to you. It is really nice. But this guy has five civilian complaints as well. I'm sure those people that have complaint against him have not gotten that same call. And I think there needs to be an active apology to all of those people

that don't have the stature that I have, that don't have the voice I have. And that's why I feel like this is so necessary for me to talk about because I have this voice and so many people that this happens to, they don't get that. And I've gotten emails and texts and people that have told me this happened to me. This is also something that happened to my friend. This happened to my father. This happened to my brother. And none of them get public apologies like that. They all deserve to get the same treatment I'm getting.

LEMON: You said that sort of this where you are saying that he said I'm determined to use my voice to turn this unfortunate incident into a catalyst for change in the relationship between the police and public they serve. If that's not through a lawsuit, or maybe it is, how does that work?

BLAKE: Well, like I said, I want to see change. I want to see this not happen. That was my first reaction once I realized that I needed to speak up about this is I can't imagine this happening to someone I care about and I don't want to go through this again. I don't want to go through it personally and I don't want to see it happen to anyone around me. I know there's a lot of people out there that feels the same way.

So we need to find a way to stop this from happening. I'm sure it won't be overnight. I'm sure tomorrow this is going to happen somewhere. And I don't want that to be the case. And I don't want it to be brushed under -- swept under the rug and said, it happens once in a while but we're going to move past it with a one time. That's what I don't -- I want a lawsuit that says here's $5 million, go away and we're not going to talk about this again.

I want to keep talking about this. I want to open a dialogue with Commissioner Bratton, with Mayor de Blasio about real solutions, about accountability, about making sure that this isn't going to happen and these types of police officers are no longer able to do this.

LEMON: What do you say to that officer?

BLAKE: First I think I would say is you took advantage of me in a very vulnerable situation and in doing so you hurt my family. And I want him to know that this isn't just hurting me and every time he's done this or would do this, it hurts a whole family. And that's not fair. That's not fair to use your badge to do that because you've got that badge and you're supposed to treat that with respect and with honor the way we're supposed to respect and honor it. I don't think he deserves -- I would say to him I don't think he deserves to ever have that badge again.

LEMON: You think he should lose his job?

BLAKE: I do think he should lose this job over this because I don't think this is the right job for him. With him to have that kind of agenda, to take that kind of a tone and that kind of an attitude towards this situation, a non-violent criminal, if I had been the criminal I still think this is excessive and it shouldn't have happened the way it did. And I just don't think that's the right position for him to be in. He's abusing that power that he has.

LEMON: James Blake, it's a pleasure.

BLAKE: Thanks.

LEMON: Thank you. And best of luck to you.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

HARLOW: Fascinating interview by my colleague Don Lemon. And we're going to talk more about this coming up, including what disciplinary action the officer in this case could face. And more prior complaints of excessive force by the officer you're looking at has some people asking why was he still allowed to work these cases?

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:17:59] HARLOW: All right. Before the break, you heard my colleague Don Lemon interview James Blake, the former tennis star who slammed to the ground by a police officer in a case of mistaken identity this week in New York. He describes what happened to him as quote "rogue justice," noting that the officer involved faces prior complaints about excessive force.

CNN's Boris Sanchez is with me. He has been looking into the officer's past. Also with us for more analysis is criminal defense attorney and CNN legal analyst Danny Cevallos.

So Boris, let me begin with you. What do we know about the prior complaints, because I know there are at least two of excessive force. The "New York Times" is also citing three. And they are saying that one revealed the pattern of resident claiming they were detained without explanation and mistreated despite complying.

BORIS SANCHEZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Right. Officer James Frascatore has at least two civil suits against him for separate incidents alleging excessive force. They both happened in 2013 in New York. He was apparently one of eight officers charged with racially profiling a suspect, putting him in handcuffs, then beating him and directing racial slur toward him.

In another case he was one of five officers accused of beating someone up who was riding their bicycle on a sidewalk. That was in Queens. Interestingly, CNN has learned that the city of New York just yesterday has decided to try and settle these lawsuits before going to court obviously. They are trying to settle with these accusers. Of course, you heard James Blake earlier, this officer could be facing a third lawsuit now. They haven't decided whether or not they're going to pursue one. CNN has reached out to Officer Frascatore, but he's yet to respond.

HARLOW: How long ago did these other two cases of alleged excessive force happen?

SANCHEZ: In 2013.

HARLOW: So it's been years and he's been on the street working these cases.

SANCHEZ: One of them was filled in August of last year, the other one earlier this year. So he has been on the street working these cases with this litigation.

HARLOW: But then why now is he assigned to desk duty? This officer, after the Blake case the public case, he gets desk duty. These other two cases, they were -- I mean, some of them pretty violent.

SANCHEZ: Right.

HARLOW: Allegations.

[15:20:03] SANCHEZ: That's the big question. The internal affairs investigation of course is ongoing. He's had his gun taken away, his badge taken away as well. So he is just waiting to see what happens with this case.

HARLOW: All right. Stay with us, Boris. I want to bring in Danny.

Danny, can we talk a little bit more about that because I think that's surprising. After this very public case of alleged excessive force you see the video right there, you know, mistaken identity. This officer is put on desk duty. But these other two cases where these allegations of use of excessive force against others, you know, use of racial slurs were used, he's still allowed to be on the street doing his job day to day. Why would that be?

DANNY CEVALLOS, CNN LEGAL ANALYST (on the phone): Well, with each allegation, I mean, you have to look at it, whether they're substantiated or whether they are unsubstantiated. And after investigation, whether it's determined that those are valid accusations. And if they are, well, then, yes, that raises the question whether or not this guy should be still out there on the street or if he should be disciplined or even terminated. So it does raise that question.

But the other side of that coin is that police officers frequently have complaints lodged against them all the time. After all, they are in the very unique business of being authorized to go out on to the street and lay their hands on people. And those people will eventually usually be prosecuted. So it's no surprise that police find themselves commonly on the other end of the complaint about their conduct.

So, you know, there has to be a very exacting investigation process. But the mere fact that an officer has had a complaint lodged against him does not necessarily mean that there is wrong doing or that there's some -- that their conduct in general is suspect. They are in the business of being -- having complaints lodged against them. So it's not like other jobs. Police officers occupy a very unique position in our jurisprudence and in our employment sector. So for that reason, complaints against them should be at least substantiated before we act on them.

HARLOW: Absolutely. And we will see whether or not Blake is going to bring a case against, you know, this officer or the department in this situation. He says he and his attorney have not decided yet.

Thank you very much, Danny. Boris, thank you as well.

We will continue to follow this. Coming up next, I'm going to be joined by the former NYPD commissioner

who served in the police department here in New York for more than 40 years. Ray Kelly joins me next. I'll get his take on what happened.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:26:10] HARLOW: Former tennis star James Blake calling for police reform after he was tackled to the ground this week by a police officer in a case of mistaken identity right here in New York City. Who better to talk to about this than the former commissioner of the New York City police department Ray Kelly. He served for over 40 years. His author of the book you see on your screen "Vigilance, my life serving America and protecting its empire city." New book just out. I got it right here. Congratulation on the book.

KELLY: Thank you.

HARLOW: We are going to talk a lot more about it. I do want to start first with this case. Look, you've said it's not right what happened, the way he was treated. He says this points to -- Blake says this points to structural change that is needed in the NYPD. Is he right?

KELLY: I think -- look, we have -- the department makes 400,000 arrests a year, 23 million citizen contacts. Some of these are not going to go well. The vast majority of contacts, vast majority of arrests go peacefully. So this is an aberration, as I said, I don't see why this level of force was needed for this type of arrest. I don't know what this officer's experience is. People may have resisted him in the past, what have you. But in this particular instance, it seems to not be appropriate.

HARLOW: He was plain clothes. He never said he was an NYPD officer. He tackled him to the ground. And James Blake says you wonder how many times it's happened without anyone knowing, because he's famous. We all know and we're talking about it.

Yes.

HARLOW: Does this point to change need?

KELLY: Well, that's the problem. Because with these videos, and sort of the suspicions confirmed in a lot of people's minds, a-ha, we saw this. How many times has it happened in the past? So I understand that.

From my own experience over 40 years in the department, I think cops do great work every day. I think they do great work throughout America. I think they're generally underappreciated. When you see an abhorrent act like this people attend to pay in full cops with, you know, with this kind of brush and it is unfortunate.

HARLOW: And even do that. In his interview with my colleague Don Lemon today, he said, you know, so many cops are hero, there are good guy, good women doing good things, but this shouldn't happen.

KELLY: But the video is out there.

HARLOW: The video the out there. He wants New York City, he wants the mayor, he wants Commissioner Bratton to put more money, more resource behind retraining. They responded saying the city has invested nearly $29 million to refrain approximately 22,000 uniformed service members with thousands more to be refrained in the coming months. Is that progress? Are those the steps that need to be taken or do we need more?

KELLY: You can always have more training. You know, you have to get people out on the street, of course. But training is good. I think on my watch we did a lot of very effective training. If you can get more training done, fine.

HARLOW: Why not.

KELLY: More power to them.

HARLOW: Let me ask you one more thing and we are going to take break. We are going to get to the book and more.

The officer, Officer Frascatore, he's been put on desk assignment after this incident. But he is a defendant in at least two other cases alleging excessive force. One of those cases much more excessive force than we see here in this video. But he was still for two years after that on the street, you know, doing his job. Why on desk assignment now, commissioner?

KELLY: Allegations. Allegations have to be investigated. Police officers --

HARLOW: Still being investigated?

KELLY: Due process. Well, this will be investigated. The other case will be investigated. As the lawyer you had on here before said, cops receive a lot of allegations, a lot of them false allegations. Just so they back off. You know, you arrest somebody, they will make an allegation. I don't know if these cases were substantiated or not. I don't know if they were dismissed.

HARLOW: But he got put on desk duty right after this one.

KELLY: This matter, yes.

HARLOW: Is that because it's on video, we're all talking about it?

KELLY: Sure. You have to make judgments on it. I mean, we're on CNN talking about it.

HARLOW: Right. We are.

KELLY: So obviously, the department had to take some action.

[15:30:2] HARLOW: All right, stay with me, Commissioner Ray Kelly. We are going to talk next about his book, again, "Vigilance."

We're also going to talk about why the murder rate in so many really big cities across America continues to rise. What is driving that, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:33:21] HARLOW: Former NYPD commissioner Ray Kelly is still with us. His new book just out, "Vigilance, my life service America and protecting its empire city."

Thank you for being here. I do want to start with this uptick in murder rates nationwide. When you look at the numbers, violent crimes, murders, are up eight percent in New York. Nonviolent crimes are down. Murders across major U.S. cities are way up, cities like Milwaukee, Baltimore, St. Louis. It's not happening everywhere. You see a decline in L.A., for example, in Phoenix. But you have talked about a Ferguson effect. Is that what's driving this?

KELLY: I think so. You know, maybe other factors. But I think generally speaking that is what's fueling it. Police officers are not engaging the way they've engaged in the past. Crime is down significantly in this country for the last two decades. I've said I think its smarter policing, better use of technology, those sorts of things. But proactive policing, police engaging, police initiatives, if you will, I think that as a result of Ferguson, I just want to say the Ferguson effect, there's been several incidents, terrible. The shooting of Walter Scott in North Charleston, South Carolina, those types of incidents have had a chilling effect on police initiative, if you will.

HARLOW: So what do you do about that?

KELLY: I think it will take some time. And I think, quite frankly, the adoption of body cameras will help in that regard.

HARLOW: Universal.

KELLY: As much as you reasonable can do. I was initially a little hesitant about them but I think after you see some of these events, then, it is you know, basically it's the way to go to raise the community trust, if you will.

[15:35:03] HARLOW: You write in the final chapter of this book, this is a watershed time for modern policing. And you also say quote "there is too much anxiety, too little trust, and far too much misunderstanding on all sides." Where do we go from here on that front?

KELLY: Well, you know, police chiefs, police departments constantly strive to have better relations with the communities. And you know, they're doing that every day. Being a police officer is a tough job. It's become much more complex, much more demanding. But they are attempting every day to get better relations. It's the nature of policing. Police are the bearers of bad news, they use force, as we saw, they use deadly force when someone passes away, the police are notify you. They give you traffic summonses. So there's always going to be some potential for friction. You know? People are not going to love the police. What you want is mutual respect.

HARLOW: And we also saw though what some of the police did in those first protests went all night in Ferguson. You say America needs to largely be demilitarized in terms of the police force.

KELLY: Yes.

HARLOW: What did those images that we saw in these streets of Ferguson? What did that do to breaking that trust?

KELLY: Well, the officers were bad. No question about it. I think the military style, vehicles, inappropriate for policing, for, you know, community policing. This was done with the best of intentions in the 1990s, a lot of excess military equipment. What do we do with it? Hey, we give it to the police departments. And I can see it used for natural disaster, that sort of thing. Should be kept perhaps by the state or maybe by a county but not for normal police work, it just doesn't look appropriate. And even the military uniforms that some of the police departments used there, I think were not appropriate. It just added fuel to the fire.

HARLOW: It did. But let's talk about this recent Gallup poll that I think is very telling. It is the Gallup poll from last year. And what it shows is that confidence in police in the United States reached its lowest level since 1993. 1993 is a year when the national murder rate was double what it was in 2013.

KELLY: Yes.

HARLOW: So why is that?

KELLY: Because of, I think, the focus on some horrific events, as you said. The shooting in North Charleston, South Carolina, Eric Garner case, the Michael Brown's case, but if again, in Michael Brown's instance in Ferguson, Darren Wilson, the police officer, I mention it in the book, was totally exonerated yet he didn't even get one day with that story because the justice department added its own report about the city of Ferguson.

HARLOW: Also found some -- as you would agree, some huge problems, rampant issues within the Ferguson police department.

KELLY: That's true. But Darren Wilson in essence lost his job because he couldn't stay there and can't get hired again. So his life is pretty well ruined as well.

HARLOW: I want to talk about stop and frisk. It is something that you pushed very hard during your time as commissioner. It is something that we've seen a c-change in in this city in New York City under Mayor Bill De Blasio and Commissioner Bratton. You write about that as well extensively in the book.

And here is one thing that you did write near the end. You say, New York City Mayor De Blasio shrugged and walked away from a routine and useful policing tool snatching law enforcement defeat from the jaws of legal victory. Police -- people will lose their lives as a result.

Bratton responds and he says crime is way down without stop and frisk. You know, complaints to our review board are the lowest they've been in 14 years.

KELLY: Murders are up and shootings are up.

HARLOW: What do you predict?

KELLY: So those are the crimes that we're concerned about. And the victims for the most part are young men of color. Those are the people that are being killed. Not only here in New York on the streets of America.

HARLOW: What do you predict we'll see?

KELLY: So the violent crimes are up. And I think as we go forward here with police not engaging in that accepted practice, that violent crime will go up. I think the department had 40,000 stops recorded last year. There are 700,000 radio calls of suspicious activity alone in this city and 12 million calls in the 911 system, 23 million contacts, as we said. Everything is bigger here. So 40,000 stops -- recorded stops, is very, very small given the suspicious activity that you get in the city of 8.4 million people.

HARLOW: One more thing. September 11th, 14 years since 9/11 yesterday.

KELLY: Right.

HARLOW: Are we safer now?

KELLY: Sure. Sure. We're much safer but as so many people said, we're not safe. We live in a dangerous world. We see these lone Wolf individuals, people who are motivated, who are recruited, who are radicalized on the internet just watching very sophisticated videos who decide to kill people in their own country. So I think we're going to face that threat for a long time to come.

[15:40:09] HARLOW: Thank you so much, commissioner. Thanks for your service to the city. Appreciate it. Good read. I'm almost done with it. Thank you for being with us.

We'll be right back.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: As a single mother, providing for my children is a struggle. Diapers are super expensive, making sure that my children have everything and wanting to provide for them really does cause anxiety.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Diapers are very challenging. Diapers are not covered by food stamps. They are not covered by other social service programs. When I had my first child I was just really amazed how hard it was to care for a newborn. It's emotionally very exhausting. It is physically very exhausting.

When things started to ease up, I wanted to help other moms. I started calling organization and I heard over and over again we need diapers. I was heartbroken because I started thinking about how difficult it will be to have that mom who doesn't have the diaper.

We have donated nearly two million diapers to families in the D.C. area. We partner with organizations who are helping families. A lot of our families are really at a breaking point. We're using diapers as a way to have them engaged with social service for their other needs. Let them know there is a network there that will help and support them.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Receiving diapers means there's one less thing I have to worry about.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We can really use these.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It allows me to put more money towards other things that are beneficial for my children.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Knowing that we're able to help moms at a critical point in their life and being able to bring them a little bit of relief is huge. I want them to have everything they need to thrive.

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[15:45:48] HARLOW: Live pictures of our nation's capital there as United States and Russia trading jabs back and forth over Washington's concerns of an increase military build-up in Syria. President Obama warning Moscow against propping up the Assad regime. Russia denies the allegations saying, look, this is all part of our effort, the international effort to defeat is. Saying air strikes alone will not do it.

Sunlen Serfaty joins me now from Washington.

When you look at this, obviously tensions are increasing between the U.S. and Russia over this. You had secretary of state John Kerry calling Russia's foreign minister Sergey Lavrov this week saying, you know, be careful about that true build up inside of Syria that could escalate into a conflict. Those are words. Any action expected between the United States and Russia, policy-wise?

SUNLEN SERFATY, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, at this point, Poppy, I don't think so. But I think you can really get an indication of the level of concern by looking at the level of response that we've seen over the past week since the first reports were coming out that Russia was ramping up presence in Syria, as you referenced, secretary of state John Kerry speaking twice on the phone this week with his Russian counterpart.

Also hearing from strong words coming from President Obama who yesterday really spoke out for the first time about this and really sent a big warning sign to Russia basically coming out more bluntly than administration officials have all week, connecting the dots saying almost point blank that they believe that these actions are for Russia to help prop up the government of Assad. Here's how president Obama put it just yesterday.

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BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: It appears now that Assad is worried enough that he's inviting Russian advisers in and Russian equipment in. And that won't change our core strategy, which is to continue to put pressure on ISIL in Iraq and Syria. But we are going to be engaging Russia to let them know that you can't continue to double down on a strategy that's doomed a failure.

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SERFATY: Both President Obama and Russian president Vladimir Putin will be in New York later this month. They are both attending the U.N. general assembly. There is no meeting scheduled between the two leaders yet, Poppy, but of course that's always something that they can sit down and discuss this. Of course this being the major point of topic of discussion during those meetings, Poppy.

HARLOW: Absolutely. The world will be watching very closely. Sunlen, thank you.

Just ahead, scientific breakthrough, some of what we know about human evolution being literally rewritten based on a new discovery in South Africa. We are back with the leading scientist on the case next.

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[15:52:44] HARLOW: Scientists in South Africa have made a really remarkable discovery. They could drastically change our understanding of human evolution. A new species of human ancestors called Homo Naledi. It has had a brain the size of an orange, stood about five feet tall and incredibly appears to have buried its dead, a behavior previously thought to be really limited to humans. The man who led the team on this amazing find, Professor Lee Berger, joins me from Johannesburg, South Africa.

Thank you for being with me, sir.

LEE BERGER, RESEARCH PROFESSOR: Good afternoon.

HARLOW: Can you walk us through how significant, how big of a find this is?

BERGER: Well, every time we find even a small fragment of one of these human relatives, it's a big deal. They are, well, until recently, perhaps the rarest sought after objects on earth. Normally our field is fragments. In this discovery, Homo Naledi and the Naledi chamber I South Africa, we discovered the largest assemblage of primitive human relatives ever discovered on the continent of Africa. 1,500 remains, 15 individuals but of course, it's a new species. We named it Homo Naledi on the 10th of September. And of course, we believe they were deliberately disposing of their dead in this chamber that's why there are so many there.

HARLOW: Well, and this was found as I read it, I mean, in sort of a crack through a cave, some people were spelunking through caves, they saw some bones. You guys went through really a rigorous two years, very dangerous work trying to remove all of these bones. What was the piece of the puzzle, professor, that told you a-ha, this is huge?

BERGER: We knew almost from the beginning. Firstly, you are quite right, the crack to get into these, you have to remember the beginning of what we call a chute is already 60 feet underground. And the crack is 7 1/2 inches wide. So that our explorers had to be very small and very skilled to get down that crack. They went down 60 feet. As soon as material started coming back, way back in November of 2013, as it came out of this cave we knew we had something very special. By the end of the week we discovered more individual fossils of these early human relatives that had been discovered at the richest sites in Africa. We were astounded by the abundance. We had a new species by about May of last year.

[15:55:22] HARLOW: So can we talk just, before I let you go, about what this means for sort of theories of human evolution, what this changes and what stays the same.

BERGER: Actually, I have one of them here. This is a cast of one of them. What it actually, you can actually see how small they are, how small the head is, but what it tells us is that human evolution is a lot more complex than we thought. We thought we had it figured out 15 years ago, it was a simple ordered origin from one species to the next to the next. Now we know it's incredible and complex. And now what we really know is we need more explorers in the field making discoveries.

HARLOW: I think we certainly do. Thank you to you and your team for this. I will change the way we all learn about evolution for quite a long time. Thank you so much.

BERGER: My pleasure.

HARLOW: Just four days until the GOP debate only right here on CNN. And the candidates are certainly on the trail making the most of every single minute. We will take you live to Iowa, where Donald Trump told reporters why he is not one bit worried about the upcoming debate next.

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