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Pope Francis Visits Cuba; Russian, Israelis Hold Meeting to Talk About Syria; Volkswagen in Hot Water With U.S. Emissions Regulators. Aired 3-4p ET.

Aired September 21, 2015 - 15:00   ET



MICHAEL HOLMES, HOST: Hello, everyone. Tonight, an historic visit.


HOLMES: Pope Francis celebrating mass with thousands of Cubans on his official trip to the island nation. We are live in Havana.

Plus, the Russian and Israeli leaders holding a rare meeting at the Kremlin with Syria topping the agenda.

Also, the auto giant Volkswagen in hot water after the U.S.. accuses it of cheating on emissions test. Can the German powerhouse rebuild its brand?

And two leading Presidential candidates causing controversy, incendiary comments about Muslims.


HOLMES: All that and much more to come. Hello, everyone, I'm Michael Holmes, live from CNN Atlanta. This is The World Right Now.


HOLMES: And we do begin in Cuba.


HOLMES: The second day of Pope Francis' momentum visit to the communist state. Right now, the Pontiff is in Holguin, which is in the east of the

country, it is the home region of Raul and Fidel Castro actually. There he celebrated mass with tens of thousands of people. Paolo Sandoval with our

continuing coverage.

PAOLO SANDOVAL, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Thousands lined the streets of Holguin, Cuba to greet the Pope Francis. It's a first time the

let head of the Catholic church visits the city which is a province that was once home to Raul and Fidel Castro. Francis celebrated mass in

Revolution Square, his second in as many days. He urged the faithful to give of themselves.

POPE FRANCIS: (As translated) (inaudible) and stimulates us to look further. We don't stay with the aspects of the politically correct.

SANDOVAL: He also made big reference to religious restrictions in Cuba.

POPE FRANCIS: (As translated) I know that the church in Cuba works in difficult conditions to take everyone, even in the most remote places, the

word and the presence of Christ.

SANDOVAL: The Pope is blessing Holguin after the mass. It will soon be off to Santiago, Cuba's second largest city to meet with local clergy and visit

a shrine. Tuesday, the Pope steps on U.S. soil for the first time. He'll visit Washington, New York and Philadelphia. New York's archbishop expects

the Pope will preach positivity.

TIMOTHY CARDINAL DOLAN, ARCHBISHOP OF NEW YORK: The world is filled with bad news. OK, all we hear about is division and violence and setbacks and

disappointments and war and hunger and refugees. He wants to give some good news.

SANDOVAL: Reporting in Havana, I'm Paolo Sandoval.


HOLMES: And let's get more on the atmosphere on the visit by the Pope, our own Patrick Pompano standing by in the Cuban capital, Havana. And tell us a

little bit more about the message today. Continuing that sort of spiritual but also - that spiritual message but also a message of caring for the

poor. Tell us more about it and the atmosphere there.

PATRICK OPPMAN, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Absolutely, the atmosphere has just been one of joy. We've sort of taken to calling him the rock star

Pope. Because we've never seen frankly anybody come from outside Cuba and get the reaction that this Pope has had.


OPPMAN: There have been two previous Popes who of course as well had tens of thousands of people come to their masses but not so much celebration. I

mean they were chanting yesterday. Remember when we talked to Michael, (inaudible) what a cool Pope is what they said here in Havana and that's

just not something that is said about any leader, particularly some of - some of Cuba's leaders.

So this has been an outpouring of joy and, you know, as Paolo was talking about, a number of very important people at this mass in Holguin, including

President Raul Castro. It is said that he'll go to all three of the papal masses. So something that's never happened before. It's quite

unprecedented. And we expect to see President Castro tomorrow in El Cobra for the Pope's third and final mass before he heads on an American Airlines

flight to the United States.

But Michael we couldn't go without talking about something that was not on the Pope's official itinerary yesterday and that was about a 40-minute

meeting with Fidel Castro at his home in Havana, a home that's called Zero Point.

It's not a place that you or I could perhaps walk into. But this being the Pope he was able to get past heavy security and go in and speak with Fidel

Castro and many of his family members. And it's rare that you see images of Fidel Castro's family in Cuba because he's always presented himself as

being someone who doesn't have any other -- anything else in his life other than the revolution. And a number of people remarked on how interesting it

was his wife Dalia, was wearing white because it's something of a protocol breach. The only women who we're white around the Pope have to be Catholic

queens, queens of Catholic countries. So she would not qualify but of course this Pope does not seem to be someone who is too hung up on

protocol. Michael.

[15:05:10] HOLMES: Yes, fashion faux pas doesn't seem like something that would bother him too much. What's next on the - on the agenda for the


OPPMAN: He'll continue on you know in Holguin where he was this morning. That's where Columbus first sighted land. And now is en route to Santiago,

the second largest city in Cuba.

From there, he'll go to a very special place, it's just in the mountains outside of Santiago, it's a place called El Cobra and that is the site of

the black Madonna, Cuba's most revered Patriot Saint.

And along that road there, which I've driven many times, it's a very tight mountainous road, and I can just imagine there will be people packed on all

sides to welcome the Pope. He will sleep in a house, we're told, that was built for the last Pope to visit Cuba, Benedict, he only slept one night

there so it hasn't had a lot of use. And then tomorrow morning, he will deliver his third mass. President Raul Castro will be in attendance. And

then on to the United States and a full agenda there, Michael.

HOLMES: Patrick Oppman in Havana, appreciate it. Great coverage over the last couple of days.


HOLMES: OK, now we're going to turn now to Moscow. That's where the Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu has been meeting about Syria with the

Russian President Vladimir Putin and they have plenty to talk about.


HOLMES: Mr. Netanyahu saying Israel and Russia have agreed to coordinate military actions in the war-torn country. He says that is to prevent

Israeli and Russian forces from accidentally trading fire.

BENJAMIN NETANYAHU, IRSRAELI PRIME MINISTER: (As translated) In these conditions, I thought it was important for me to come here in order to

clarify our position and to do everything so that there were no misconceptions between our forces and your forces. And I want to add a

remark on the personal and on the national level. In all the contacts we had between us, when we agreed and when we had some disagreements, our

dialogue was in the atmosphere of mutual respect.


HOLMES: Now of course all of this comes as the Israeli and Russian leaders meet. While Russia is significantly ramping up its military presence in



HOLMES: Satellite images have shown Russian military equipment being moved into an air force base in Western Syria. Israel worried that weapons from

Russia could end up in the hands of Hezbollah.


HOLMES: CNN senior international correspondent Matthew Chance joins us now from Moscow. And Matthew, as we were saying you know Israel has of course

fired into Syria in retaliation in the past. They've also struck at what they say is weapons headed to Hezbollah.

And so you've now got what they're calling a coordination mechanism. The last thing Israel wants is to be firing on Russian boots on the ground, I


MATTHEW CHANCE, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, I mean it's why Israel I think feels quite threatened by this Russian deployment of

advanced weaponry including fighter jets. Because up until now, it's enjoyed almost -- well, complete air superiority in the skies over Syria

and, indeed, over the entire region.


CHANCE: The arrival of SU 30 fighter aircraft which are you know very advanced Russian warplanes, to the region and there are at least four of

them on the tarmac that have been spotted by satellite imagery at Latakia that air base which is government controlled and where the Russians are

staging this military build-up.

That means that Israel no longer enjoys that kind of superiority. And so they're very concerned that if they choose to strike against weapons,

convoys, like they have done in the past, on suspicion that the weapons are headed for Hezbollah, then they could be stopped from doing so both by

those Russian aircraft and by the air to - sorry surface to air missile systems that have also been deployed by the Russians on the ground in Syria

as well.

And so Benjamin Netanyahu seeking assurances that Israel's security, in general terms, is not going to be affected by this. I certainly think it's

not the Kremlin's intention to affect the security of Israel. And so I think that's why the Kremlin was so open to a meeting like this. But it

just shows how complicated it is to get involved in conflicts in the Middle East.


CHANCE: You think you're helping one ally, the Syrians in this case from the point of view from the Russians, but then you, you know alienate

potentially another friend in the region, Israel. And so that's the complicated balance the Kremlin is going to be faced with.

HOLMES: It does speak to the whole dynamic there in Syria. You've got the U.S. and its allies in the east of the country, a country bombing ISIS.

You've got Hezbollah coming in from Lebanon to help out Mr. Assad. Now you've got the Russians with their boots on the ground, Israel sometimes

getting involved in a territorial sense. It really is such a complex landscape I suppose.

But it also speaks to an important issue that you know about, which is the geopolitical importance of Syria to Russia. The port that is there, the air

access, this is their toehold in the region.

[15:10:05] CHANCE: Yes, I mean there are good reasons why Russia I think is doubling down its support for Bashar Al Assad, its Syrian ally, the Syrian


You mentioned Tartus there, it's only Mediterranean port.


CHANCE: It's got other military installations in Syria as well. It's got economic interests there also. I suppose more broadly it sees Syria as a

last defense against the spread of Islamism to the - to the areas of southern Russia, where they've already got a problem like that and in

Central Asia as well.


CHANCE: And so they think there's a moral obligation to back the Syrian government, to prevent Islamist groups from spreading further north towards

Russia's backyard. But I think you're right, there's a - there's a broader campaign being fought by the Kremlin as well. You know, this is about

Russia maintaining its clout on the international stage. And even increasing its clout on the international stage. It's got this last toehold

in the Middle east in Syria and it doesn't want to let it go. If Syria falls, the Kremlin believes so too does Russian influence in the Middle


HOLMES: Senior international correspondent Matthew Chance in Moscow. As always, our thanks, Matthew.

Well while the U.S. led coalition is taking on ISIS in Iraq and Syria, ISISs facing some defections within its own ranks.


HOLMES: 58 defectors have gone public about their disillusionment with the terror group. Some said they disagreed with how ISIS is fighting other

Sunni rebel groups in Syria. A number also criticized ISIS's' harsh tactics including of course those brutal beheadings of civilians and hostages.

Peter Neumann of The International Center for the Study of Radicalization collected the defector's stories. He spoke to senior chief international

correspondent Christiane Amanpour.

PETER NEUMANN, INTERNATIONAL CENTER FOR STUDY OF RADICALIZATION: The important thing here is that the number of defections seems to be

increasing. Two-thirds of these defections were this year alone. One-third was only in the last three months. Which, if anything, indicates that

people are perhaps feeling more confident in coming out, but perhaps also that some of the shininess of the color fade is wearing off, and that some

of the fault lines are becoming obvious.


HOLMES: Still to come on the program tonight, accusations of high-tech cheating.


HOLMES: And then a huge stock drop. Find out how many billions of dollars Volkswagen lost as a scandal sent its shares tumbling. Stay with us, we'll

be right back.





HOLMES: Welcome back, everyone, to The World Right Now. Greek voters have given Alexis Tsipras another try as Prime Minister.


HOLMES: Tsipras sworn in earlier today after his (inaudible) party won Greece's snap election on Sunday. Tsipras resigned last month you may

remember looking to get a fresh mandate on his leadership.


HOLMES: Well, now he will work on securing debt relief and implementing the economic reforms Greece's European creditors are requiring. He says it'll

be a tough road ahead but one that will preserve, the pride, he says, of the Greek people.

ALEXIS TSIPRAS, GREEK PRIME MINISTER: (As translated) Today in Europe, Greece and the Greek people are synonymous with resistance and dignity. The

struggle will be continued together for a full four years because the mandate we got is a four-year mandate.


HOLMES: Spare a thought for the Greek voter, it was the fourth time to the polls in three years. And despite that decisive victory for Tsipras, voter

turnout only about 57%, well down.

Well the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency says the German auto giant Volkswagen cheated on emissions test.


HOLMES: Controls on some Jetta's, Beetles and other models allegedly kicked in only during the test. So when the cars hit the open road, they were

belching out as much as 40 times the level of emissions they produced during the tests.

U.S. Agencies could fine Volkswagen a fortune perhaps as much as $18 billion while the automaker already experiencing some fallout.


HOLMES: Our Richard Quest is in New York watching Volkswagen stock. He joins us now live. Of course this is the latest in a number of

controversial car industry issues. This one seems incredible. The stock market spoke clearly about it.

RICHARD QUEST, HOST QUEST MEANS BUSINESS: Yes, you can tell the seriousness of this incident, Michael, by the way in which Volkswagen's

share price fell sharply.


QUEST: It was up to 20% lower rallied towards the close just a bit but still closed off 17%. Which is an extraordinary amount for a mature, widely

held stock like Volkswagen. And the reason of course is that the fines, the compensation, the class actions could be absolutely vast in this case.

Because what Volkswagen did was create a system in the diesel engine that noticed if the car was being tested and therefore lowered the emissions.

The car wasn't as powerful. And when the car -- when the system realized it was back on the open road, it boosted it up again, thus making the car more


And that's what this was all about. It was all about performance. Making the cars more powerful. And in doing so, they cheated on the emissions. Not

surprisingly, Volkswagen is absolutely embarrassed by all of this. The Chief Executive who realizes the enormous nature of this crisis facing the

company. And it is a crisis, make no bones about it. He said, Martin Winterkorn, "I personally am deeply sorry that we have broken the trust of

our customers and the public."

It will take more than that, I fear, for the EPA, the Department of Justice, the entire - our entire U.S. Government is going to be going after

them as a result of this, Michael, because what they did was unconscionable. They rigged the system to defeat the very thing they were

supposed to do.


HOLMES: It just seems utterly extraordinary. How long had it been going on? And how did they get caught? One presumes they're sorry. But they're sorry

they got caught.

QUEST: Well finally, OK, it's been going on since at least 2009, if not earlier. And the way it got caught was the clean air action group tested

the cars. They wanted to find out if -- they actually were trying to find out if diesel cars were better. So what they did is they tested the cars in

the lab and they tested them on the road, and they couldn't work out why in the lab they were OK and on the road they weren't.

And this went backwards and forwards. And finally, finally, Michael, they didn't find out what happened. They just kept saying to Volkswagen, what's

going on. We know there's something wrong, what's going on? Finally, Volkswagen, this is share price, Volkswagen had to admit that deep in the

algorithm of the diesel computer, the ECM, they had fiddled it so that in the lab it was OK, on the road, for more power, it wasn't.

HOLMES: And just very quickly, I mean the thing that strikes me about this, when you look at the other controversies that have happened with Toyota and

GM and others, it's not a mistake, it's not an accident that they didn't correct, it's a computer program that was put in there.

QUEST: Right, and so the issue will become who knew it was there, how long ago was it put in there, and, you know, what -- even later models took the

same system and put it in. So I think what's going to end up happening is does this become a case where it was widespread within Volkswagen

engineering, they knew it was there, or was this put in 10, 15 years ago and frankly nobody ever knew it was there or they'd forgotten it was there,

or it was just one of those things that was that.


QUEST: That's going to be the issue. But at 37,000, up to $37,000, $36,500 in fines and compensation, you are looking at billions, billions. And

that's why the stock is off so badly. This is a crisis for Volkswagen on a monumental scale.

HOLMES: It is staggering, is it not? Richard Quest, thanks, appreciate that.>

Coming up here on the program.


HOLMES: Controversial comments about Muslims taking center stage in the U.S Presidential campaign. Might they cause one top contender to drop out? Some

are asking him to. Stay with us. We'll discuss.




HOLMES: Welcome back, everyone. In the U.S. Campaign for the White House, Hillary Clinton's lead in the Democrat Presidential primary is growing.


HOLMES: According to a new CNN/ORC poll, 42% of U.S Democratic primary voters support Clinton. You can see there, the 24% pick her rival, the

Vermont senator Bernie Sanders. And 22%, want Vice President, Joe Biden who hasn't even announced his candidacy to run. If Biden does stay out of the

race, Clinton's lead gets even bigger. It goes to 57% if you take him out of the equation.


HOLMES: Well, the latest talk in the U.S. Presidential campaign is centered on controversial comments with Islam among Republican candidates.

Presidential hopeful Ben Carson said the U.S. Should not elect a Muslim President and Donald Trump continued to face questions about a recent

campaign rally. Here's CNN Athena Jones.


BEN CARSON, REPUBLICAN PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I would not advocate that we put a Muslim in charge of this nation.

ATENA JONES, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: This shocking statement by Dr. Ben Carson under a spotlight this morning in the Republican

Presidential race. On NBC's "Meet the Press" on Sunday, Carson said a Muslim President should not be in the oval office. And that a President's

faith should matter to voters.

CARSON: If it's inconsistent with the values and principals of America, then of course it should matter.

JONES: Later when Trump was asked about the possibility of a Muslim President, he said --

DONALD TRUMP, REPUBLICAN PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I mean some people have said it already happened.

JONES: A reference to President Barack Obama. Trump later adding --

TRUMP: He said he was a Christian and he said he is a Christian. You know I'm willing to take him at his word for that.

JONES: But Carson is doubling down on his controversial comments. In an interview with Washington newspaper "The Hill," he said, "Muslims feel

their religion is very much a part of your public life and that is inconsistent with our principles and our constitution." Democrats were

quick to pounce.

BERNIE SANDERS, U.S. DEMOCRATIC PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: You judge candidates for President not on their religion, not on the color of their

skin, but on their ideas on what they stand for.

JONES: This as the latest CNN/ORC poll shows Trump and Carson losing momentum with voters after the CNN debate. Trump still the front-runner,

but his lead slipping, as Carly Fiorina makes the biggest jump, rising 12 percentage points.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: How many of you saw the debate on Wednesday night?

JONES: Over half of poll respondents who watched CNN's debate think Fiorina did the best job. Florida Senator Marco Rubio taking home second place. Far

better than his former mentor Jeb Bush.

TRUMP: I think Carly had a good night but I think you gave her a lot of very easy questions.

JONES: Trump now zeroing in on the post-debate star. Attacking Fiorina's record as CEO once again Sunday. Tweeting, she did such a horrible job at

Lucent and HP, she never got another CEO job offer. The GOP frontrunner writing there is no way Carly Fiorina can become the Republican nominee.


HOLMES: Well the leading Muslim Civil Liberties group in the U.S. is actually calling on the candidate, Ben Carson to drop out of the race for

the White House over his comments.

CNN political analyst and Bloomberg view columnist Josh Rogen joins us from Washington. Always good to see you, Josh.

That really sounded like a bit of backtrack today with Carson's people saying he would want a Muslim candidate to disavow sharia law. But that's

not what he actually said initially, that he wouldn't support a Muslim in the White House, he thought Islam was incompatible with the constitution

when in fact the opposite is true, right?

JOSH ROGEN, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: That's correct, Michael. And thanks for having me on.


ROGEN: Ben Carson's business manager in an interview with CNN today largely doubled down on Ben Carson's association that he was perfectly

within his rights to state that no Muslim should be President of the United States.

Now the attacks from C.A.R.E. and other Muslim groups have focused on Article 6 of the Constitution which prevents any law being passed that

would put a religious test on ascending to the presidency.

So it's not to say that Ben Carson is in violation of the Constitution, and his response -- his team's response is focused on that. But they're basic

argument that Ben Carson has the right to be against a Muslim being President, they're not backing down at all and neither is Donald Trump, and

I think that's what's fueling the flames of this scandal in its second day.

HOLMES: He talks and claims that Islam you know is part of everyday life for Muslims but surely that's the same when it comes to politicians and

Christianity. And what's interesting here to me is both candidates, Carson and Trump involved in these Muslim-based controversies as we reported. But

the problem is as we heard from the initial questioner at that Trump event is there's an audience for this kind of Islamophobia. There was a CNN ORC

poll a couple weeks back. 29% of voters think the President is Muslim, and 43% of Republicans. 54% of Trump voters.

ROGEN: Well yes, Michael, I believe you're right in calling it Islamophobia. You're also right in saying there is an audience for it. But

I would add that audience is limited.

And while candidates, especially Trump, but also candidates like Carson, have used that sort of base, this section, and it is a minority section of

the Republican party, that plays to this type of Islamophobia, they've always known that that part of the electorate, that part of their voting

pool, is limited.

And this comes at a crucial moment when the campaigns are trying to broaden out. So this could be potentially devastating for Ben Carson's attempt to

really make a play, to be a more mainstream prime-time candidate.


HOLMES: And looking at it again, you know our audience internationally, when they look at a lot of this, the role of religion in U.S. Politics in

general. Because no matter what the Constitution says, you're probably not going to get elected if you're not a professed Christian in the U.S.,

certainly not at the moment. But, you know, you got to places in Europe where you know if you - if you wore religion on your sleeve, it would

probably cost you the election. Australia elected an atheist. I mean that wouldn't happen here. Speak to that that sort of, that intertwining of

religion and politics in the U.S.

ROGEN: Sure. I mean there's no doubt that faith plays a large part in American politics. And that it would be inconceivable for an American

candidate who didn't talk about his faith to really connect to a large part of the electorate.

However, part of that is that most of the electorate, and I think this is what the Democratic candidates are focusing on, believe that part of the

faith and part of a commitment to religion is a commitment to tolerance.

And so it's a double-edged sword. On the one hand, you want to be clear and forth right as a candidate about your faith and how it speaks to your

mission and your drive to become a public servant and leader of the country. At the same time, once you step over that line and into the field

of intolerance, I think you've taken faith and really turned into what could have been an advantage with the American voters into a disadvantage

and I think that's what happened to Ben Carson yesterday.

HOLMES: How do you think the GOP, the Republican establishment, is looking at what's going on right now? In terms of the polls, the leader, the

Trumps, the Carson's and others, when you imagine that the establishment's preferred list is completely different to those? It would be the Bushes,

the Rubios, the Kasichs and so on. Do you think they're looking at this and going hang on a minute, this ain't right?



ROGEN: Right, so according to my sources, the Republican establishment looks at this in two distinct ways.

On the one hand, they've been waiting for Trump and Carson to a lesser extent Fiorina, for the bubble to pop. They want these candidates to have

their moment of the sun and then move aside so the more moneyed, more well- established, more conventional candidates can have their turn.

So in the sense that scandals like these further the notion that Carson may have peaked as a candidate and Trump may have peaked as a candidate and the

CNN polls reflect that, that's fine. At the same time, the longer this goes on, the more damage it does to the Republican brand overall. All the

establishment candidates know that they have to run to the right during the primary, but then they have to get back to the middle during the general.

And that's going to be made more difficult if they're seen as an intolerant party.


HOLMES: Josh, always a pleasure, political analyst at Bloomberg view column, is Josh Rogen. Thanks so much, my friend.

ROGEN: Thank you.

HOLMES: Well, this is the World Right Now. Still to come here on the program.


HOLMES: European leaders meet later this week to try to figure out a plan to resettle those thousands of migrants and refugees and stop desperate

scenes such as these. Stay with us. We'll be right back.




HOLMES: All right, we're going to take you live to Cuba now. Pope Francis is continuing his historic visit to the island nation.


HOLMES: Has been given an official papal blessing to the city of Holguin before he departs for Santiago in Cuba. Earlier, the Pope held a mass with

thousands of Cubans attending, including the President, Raul Castro. What he's doing in Holguin is blessing the city from (lomo del a cruz) or "the

hill of the cross" in Holguin. Now, earlier, during his service, he urged Catholics to, "not be satisfied with what is politically correct." Pope

Francis arrives tomorrow in the United States. A lot of eyes will be on that visit.


HOLMES: Well the Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu meeting with the Russian President Vladimir Putin in Moscow today.


HOLMES: They talked about Syria, where Russia is reportedly building up its military presence. Mr. Netanyahu says Israel and Russia have agreed to

coordinate military actions there to prevent accidentally trading fire.


HOLMES: Also, Greece's leftist (inaudible) party has won the country's snap election and Alexis Tsipras has been sworn in as Prime Minister today for

the second time.


HOLMES: He called the election after reaching a new bailout deal with Europe because he wanted the mandate. Tsipras will oversee the

implementation of the tough economic reforms that deal requires.



HOLMES: Well Volkswagen CEO has apologized for a scandal over emissions.


HOLMES: His statement after the U.S. Environmental protection agency said 500,000 VW cars were out fitted with software meant to fool emissions




HOLMES: European leaders will descend on Brussels later this week to try to sort out how to resettle the huge numbers of migrants that have been

flooding into the region. Migrants and refugees a sign that this crisis is not abating, far from it and of course, with all of that comes the tragedy.


HOLMES: The latest, the bodies of at least 14 refugees recovered. Another 24 are missing by the way. In two separate disasters in in the Aegean Sea.

Meanwhile thousands of migrants are still moving northward. This group here traveling near the town of Sid on the Serbian/Croatian border. Croatia says

almost 30,000 have entered the country since the crisis began.

CNN's Ben Wedeman is further along the route the migrants are taking. He joins us now live from Nickelsdorf in Austria.


HOLMES: First of all let's start with what you have seen today.

BEN WEDEMAN, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, what we've seen, Michael, is a steady stream of refugees and migrants coming from Hungary

into Austria.


WEDEMAN: Basically throughout the day trains come and deposit them just about four kilometers from here on the Hungarian side. They walk and then

they're met by Hungarian aid workers and others who give them food before they actually enter Austria.

Usually, they stay here for a few hours. Sometimes overnight and they're bussed to points further inside the country. Now, here, for instance, the

Austrian army soldiers are just trying to keep the place organized herding the refugees and migrants around until they're ready to leave. But it's

really a steady flow of people.

We understand since over the weekend more than 20,000 refugees and migrants have reached Hungary. And we were on another border crossing to the east --

rather, the west of here and we saw that preparations were being made on the Hungarian side, as well as the Austrian side, to take in more. So

preparations people are bracing for a continued stream of people entering. First Austria, of course, but many of the refugees we've spoken to say

their final goal is actually Germany.

HOLMES: Yes, Hungary's parliament approving wider powers for the Hungarian army to be involved. You've seen up close and personal what the riot police

involvement has been. But what have you seen in terms of military presence. And what might those powers be when it companies to these refugees?

WEDEMAN: Well, the Hungarian parliament authorized the army to use nonlethal force, tear gas, rubber bullets, net guns and other nonlethal

means. Now, what we've seen over the last few days, for instance, we were driving away from the Hungarian border, and we saw four armored personnel

carriers and about half a dozen troop carriers driving up to the border there.

Now, it's hard to say unless disorder happens whether they'll be used along the lines, for instance, of the Austrian army or actually as active crowd

control to put it mildly along the lines of what we saw in the Serbian/Hungarian border where, indeed, yes, the riot police were using

tear gas and water cannon when some of the migrants and refugees were trying to break down the gate into Hungary itself.

But definitely when you listen to the rhetoric coming from Hungarian officials, they're taking a fairly hard line on this rhetorically. Although

what we've being seen is that they've been quite efficient at herding them along, getting the migrants and refugees to go as quickly as possible

through Hungary to here, Austria. Michael.

HOLMES: As always our thanks to Ben Wedeman, covering this continuing crisis. Thanks, Ben.


HOLMES: This is The World Right Now, coming up on the program. We're going to speak to a brand expert about the financial impact of that damaging

scandal engulfing Volkswagen. Do stay with us for that, fascinating discussion, extraordinary developments today, we'll be right back.




HOLMES: Well nothing ends a reputation for quality engineering like cheating allegations. And that's the hard lesson Volkswagen is learning

this Monday.


HOLMES: U.S. environmental authorities accusing the company of installing what they called defeat devices on diesel engines that clean up the car's

emissions but only during testing. The rest of the time, no it's all switched off. We told you earlier about their CEO apologizing for breaking

customers trust and about those big losses on the stock market. $18 billion disappeared at the start of trading.


HOLMES: Volkswagen single day share price drop may not be as damaging though as the loss of public trust. Joining us to discuss the potential

impact on brand Volkswagen is David Haigh the CEO of Brand Finance. Dave, thanks for being with us. So VW comes to you for advice, what do we do?

What do you tell them?

DAVID HAIGH, CEO BRAND FINANCE: Well first of all, they've got to be honest. And it will be interesting to see whether or not it was the actions

of a rogue engineer, five or six years ago or whether it was endemic to the organization.


HAIGH: It's very hard to believe that it wasn't widely known which is very, very damaging.

HOLMES: So, you know - and that's one of the things you know. Because as we were saying with Richard Quest in the previous half hour. You know one of

the things that you see all these other things that happen, somebody make a mistake, somebody didn't do enough, somebody didn't act quickly enough.

This looks very deliberate. You don't put in a computer thing like this by accident.

HAIGH: It certainly does --

HOLMES: Does that makes it worse I suppose is the question.

HAIGH: Well yes, I think it does actually. I mean if you were to compare it with the Toyota and the General Motors problems, they were both engineering

problems that caused loss of life in one case and severe problems in the other. They both cost billions to fix. But they were accidental.

And while there was a bit of prevarication before they took action, in this case it goes to the very heart of what a brand stands for. You know in the

current environment, that could be extremely damaging for a long time. I estimate that they could knock $10 billion off their brand value and that

it could take 5 to 10 years to recover.

HOLMES: How do you work that out `cause that's fascinating, $10 billion off. I mean you're going to annoy all the environmentalists for a start. 40

times the pollution I think was the number when these things are switched off as they were. So how do you - how do you, I don't know, evaluate the

actual monetary loss to a brand?

HAIGH: Well, in the end, brands allow companies to sell more products and sell them at a higher price.


HAIGH: And when people lose trust and they lose belief and when the products are no longer allowed to be sold, which may be the case in this

situation, then obviously it's going to substantially damage the value of the business. And we measured the effect on Toyota when they had their

scandal in 2011. It instantly knocked $5 billion off their brand and it took them five years to recover. And it would appear this is an even worse


HOLMES: You know, and then you know when it comes to the, you know, latest string of embarrassing things to happen when you talk about Toyota, GM and

the like, you know do they recover -- I guess what I'm asking is do people have a short memory, or does next week somebody wants to buy a VW beetle,

they're just going to go out and do it?

HAIGH: Well I think they have a relatively short memory but it really depends on the circumstances. The point about the car market is people take

a very long time to decide on a brand. They think about it a long time and it takes a long time to change perceptions.

Well, this goes to the heart of what VW stands for. All their advertising was always about honesty, trust.


HAIGH: And they're at a time where there's a move towards clean technology, clean cars, even in places like China, which are being polluted to, you

know, to the end. I think this could seriously damage VW's business in the States and in China.

HOLMES: So, OK, so the CEO apologizes. That's not enough though, is it really? What do you think else they should do other than you know come

clean, so to speak?

HAIGH: Well, the interesting thing will be to see whether the products are actually salable and what they do about future products, because that would

dramatically decrease their product range. I mean that has a fundamental effect on the business.


HAIGH: Clearly, he has apologized. The question is, what heads are going to roll and what will the costs be? Because America doesn't take this sort

thing lightly. As we saw with the BP scandal which basically brought the company to its knees and they are now say is a takeover target. Will VW go

the same way?

HOLMES: Yes. David Haigh, CEO of Brand Finance. Fascinating, thanks so much. $10 billion off the reputation, appreciate it, thanks for being with


HAIGH: Thank you.

HOLMES: Well, North Korea has invited CNN's Will Ripley back to the country. He wanted to meet people outside of the country's capital,

Pyongyang, so government officials took him to meet a 20-year-old woman that they say is a shining product of North Korean collective society. Now

she was orphaned as a young woman when her parents died in a famine. Now is dedicating her life to helping other orphans like herself. Here's Will



WILL RIPLEY, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: North Koreans born 20 years ago during the great famine are too young to remember when these fields

were ravaged, when hundreds of thousands died from starvation.

(Jang Jong Hwa) doesn't remember the mother and father she lost.

My parents died a long time ago. I was so young, she says. The 20-year-old is part of a generation of orphans, now young adults. Born during the 1990s

humanitarian crisis North Korea calls the arduous march. A family with three children of their own took her in.

My adoptive mother was so kind to me, she says. A kindness she's trying to repay by serving the state. Caring for a houseful of orphans while also

working full time.

(Jong) gets help from family, friends and neighbors. She began taking in orphans when she was 18, just out of secondary school. Now, she's caring

for seven of them.

There's the leader, and where are you? You're right there? An achievement recognized by North Korea's supreme leader Kim Jong-un.

Jong shows us laptops sent by the state for the kids to study with but she doesn't have batteries to turn them on. The family including all seven

orphans live in standard government housing. Sharing a one-bathroom apartment in a working class neighborhood 45 minutes west of Pyongyang.

The oldest orphan (Jong un-Jong) is 16. Her parents died working in a state-owned steel mill. The other workers took turns caring for her, her

brother and sister, until Jong brought them home.

At first, she was like my older sister because she's only four years older than me but now I call her my mother, she says.

She and her sisters say they want to join the army to serve Kim Jong-un. And their younger brother wants to play soccer. When I grow up, I'm going

to be a very good football player to please our leader, he says. All tell me they consider their leader their father. Something we hear everywhere in

North Korea. Jong says she hopes these kids will grow strong to serve the nation.

Our country is one huge family, she says. And here, country always comes first. Will Ripley, CNN, Nampo City, North Korea.


HOLMES: Coming up on the World Right Now.


HOLMES: History made at the Emmy awards. Michaela Pereira looks at our big winners on last night's American television awards. That's just ahead after

the break






HOLMES: And welcome back, to The World Right Now. Now As you saw earlier this hour, the Pope is visiting Cuba and has been receiving a very warm

welcome from those who practice Santeria. Santeria rather is a religion that blames Catholicism and religious traditions from West Africa. But as

Patrick Oppman now shows us it hasn't received much recognition from the Catholic church.


OPPMAN: In the gritty harborside town just (inaudible) just across the water from Havana, the faithful adore their beloved statue the Virgin Mary.

It's one of the largest catholic processions leading up to the visit of Pope Francis to the island. But not everyone here is a strictly by the book


Priests order the crowds not to throw money at the virgin. A veiled reference to the kind of offerings made by followers of Santeria. Santeria

has its roots in Cuba's slave trade. The slaves brought here from Africa, were forced to convert to Christianity.

But Catholicism mixed with African traditions and a new religion was born. Santeria. Many Cuban says they are Catholics and Santeros.

You can be both at once, Isabel says. First you have to believe in the lord Jesus and then Santeria. And even though the previous two Popes to visit

Cuba didn't acknowledge Santeria's large following on the island, parishioners of the religion like (Anita) say they're excited that Pope

Francis is coming.

It's a big deal, (Anita) says, we welcome him and we hope to see him. Duality is nothing new for an island that is communist and capitalist,

African and European.

(Inaudible) is a (inaudible) or Santeria priest. While he has crosses and images of Jesus in his home, he says Santeria, also known to some as the

Aruba religion, has its advantages.

The church calms people. It gives them spirituality, he says. The Aruba religion is more direct with the analysis of problems and the solution to

those problems so a lot of times people like it more. Though we can say your problem is this and here's how we're going to fix it.

As the Cuban government has loosened controls on religion, the number of Santeria followers has soared.

Santeria's rise in popularity has presented a dilemma for the Catholic church. Church officials criticizing the religion for being what they call

a cult but at the same time they acknowledge many of the people who come out to catholic processions and services like this one are followers of


The Catholic church was nearly shut down in the early years of the Cuban revolution and it's been a long road back. With the visit from Pope

Francis, the church is now trying to build up the ranks of the faithful. Even if they might not be, well, always faithful to just one church.

Patrick Oppman, CNN, Regla.


HOLMES: And Pope Francis continues his travels tomorrow when he touches down in the United States. President Barack Obama will be on hand to greet

the Pontiff and CNN of course will have full coverage of the Pope's historic journey. Set to arrive at 4:00 p.m. Eastern time in the U.S.,

That's 9:00 p.m. in London.

It was a big night for American television as several historic moments unfolded on Sunday at the 67th prime-time Emmy awards.

CNN's Michaela Pereira has more on some of the winners.



VIOLA DAVIS, EMMY AWARD WINNER: The only thing that separates women of color from anyone else is opportunity. [Applause ] you cannot win an Emmy

for roles that are simply not there.

PEREIRA: becoming the first African-American woman to win an Emmy for outstanding lead actress in a drama series. Grabbing an Emmy for her

performance in "How to get away with Murder."

(UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE): This is the first Emmy win and 16th nomination for Jon Hamm.

PEREIRA: another first, Jon Hamm finally scooping up an Emmy for outstanding lead actor in a drama for his iconic role as the tortured Don

Draper on Mad Men after seven previous losses.

JON HAMM, EMMY AWARD WINNER: There has been a terrible mistake clearly.

PEREIRA: HBO dominating with a whopping 43 victories. Their fantasy series Game of Thrones being crowned best drama. The show's first win, beating out

Mad Men and shattering an academy record. Defeating the west wing by winning more Emmys in a single year than any other series. HBO's Veep also

grabbing best comedy. And Olive Kitterage leading the limited series categories.

TRACY MORGAN, COMEDIAN: I miss you guys so much.

PEREIRA: Surprising everyone, Tracy Morgan marking his return by presenting best drama. His first time back on stage since that serious car accident

that left him in a coma for eight days. Morgan's fellow Saturday Night Live alum Andy Samberg rounding out another night of first, hosting the show for

the first time.


HOLMES: Michaela Pereira there. And for more on all the day's top stories, do visit our website. You can find all the latest news and analysis from

around the world

Well this has been "The World Right Now." thanks for watching. "Quest Means Business" is up next. And for those of you in Asia, I'll be back with "CNN

today" a little later.