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Carson Backs Off Anti-Muslim Vow; Scott Walker Drops Out of Race; Pope Francis Arrives in the U.S.; Aired 9-9:30a ET
Aired September 22, 2015 - 09:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[09:00:01] PEREIRA: I'm against dogs. I'm against airplanes.
CAMEROTA: Yes.
CUOMO: My time matters.
PEREIRA: We're all together on this.
All right. Time for "NEWSROOM" with Carol Costello.
CUOMO: Carol Costello might decide a little bit. We're going to be what?
(LAUGHTER)
CAROL COSTELLO, CNN ANCHOR: If I had been paying attention -- that's a good idea Michaela. Thank you. I will. Poor Chris Cuomo.
NEWSROOM starts now.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
COSTELLO (voice-over): Happening now in the NEWSROOM. Protecting the Pope.
COMMISSIONER BILL BRATTON, NEW YORK CITY POLICE: We plan for the worst or the unexpected.
COSTELLO: Pope Francis arrives in the United States just hours from now.
BRATTON: You'd always be concerned about active shooter, you get concerned about certainly explosive device.
COSTELLO: How snipers and SWAT teams are preparing for this Pope, who loves to be among the people.
Also.
GOV. SCOTT WALKER (R), WISCONSIN: I will suspend my campaign immediately.
COSTELLO: Walker drops out and calls for other GOP candidates to do the same. Why? WALKER: So that the voters can focus on a limited number of
candidates who can offer a positive conservative alternative to the current frontrunner.
COSTELLO: A not-so veiled jab at Donald Trump. Will other candidates follow suit?
Plus, the price of a drug that helps AIDS patients rises by 5,000 percent.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There have been much larger drug price increases by a much bigger drug companies.
COSTELLO: Why a tablet that used to cost $13 now costs over $700? A move Hillary Clinton calls outrageous.
Let's talk. Live in the CNN NEWSROOM.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
COSTELLO: And good morning. I'm Carol Costello. Thank you so much for joining me.
Next hour Republican Ben Carson takes to the stage and tries to step out of the shadow of his controversial vow that he could never support a Muslim for president. First he doubled down. Now he's backing off, at least a little. And his Republican opponents are forced to go on record. First Carson's latest comments on FOX News.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DR. BEN CARSON (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Absolutely I stand by the comments. If, for instance, you believe in a theocracy, I don't care if you're a Christian. If you're a Christian and you're running for president, and you want to make this into a theocracy, I'm not going to support you. I'm not going to advocate you being the president.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COSTELLO: CNN's Joe Johns is live in Sharonville, Ohio, where Carson has a scheduled news conference for next hour.
Good morning.
JOE JOHNS, CNN SENIOR WASHINGTON CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Carol. He is expected to appear here at the Sharonville Convention Center in Sharonville, Ohio. The event is about healthcare. But we are hoping Ben Carson will take some questions. Talking to people in the crowd as they file in for this event.
There is a lot of support for what Ben Carson has said. Even though he nuanced it somewhat in this interview last night on FOX News. Nonetheless Ben Carson is taking a lot of criticism from some of the people on the campaign trail. A number of candidates saying they don't agree with Ben Carson, though in fact Donald Trump has said he for the most part supports what Ben Carson said because he says a lot of people are agreeing.
Let's listen now to some of the things that have been said by candidates on the campaign trail about Ben Carson's comments.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Ben was saying there are difficulties and I think everybody knows what those difficulties are and people want to be politically correct. But there have been difficulties and a lot of people agree with Ben. I do think that Ben would also agree, though, if properly vetted, the properly people properly vetted going through an election, I think that anybody that is able to win an election will be absolutely fine.
JEB BUSH (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I don't think that religion should be a criteria for being president. You know, there should be some exclusion based on one's faith or the lack of faith, frankly. I know a ton of people that are peaceful Muslims that live in the United States that are -- that love this country or are patriotic Americans and serve in the military. The idea that you would think otherwise is really not grounded in reality.
CARLY FIORINA (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I actually believe that people of faith make better leaders. Whether they're Christians as I am. My faith has sustained me through some very bad times. I've battled cancers. I've lost a child. I've been tested. But whether it's a personal Christian faith or Jewish faith or Muslim faith or other faiths, I think faith gives us humility and empathy and optimism, and I think those are important things.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
JOHNS: So a couple of opportunities today in the great state of Ohio to hear from Ben Carson. And our hope is that he will fill out a little bit more of information on his comments that he could not support a Muslim president. Seems to be standing by that. But by the same token he is also saying he could support a Muslim president who denounces Sharia law and swears to uphold the Constitution, which essentially is what just about any elected official has to do.
Carol back to you.
COSTELLO: All right, Joe Johns. We'll get back to you. Joe Johns reporting live from Ohio this morning.
Not long after Carson's controversial remarks Mitt Romney tweeted, "Of course there is no religious test for the presidency. Every faith adds to our national character."
Romney himself, of course, battled concerns over his own Mormon faith when he ran for president back in 2012.
So let's talk about all of this and more. Nan Hayworth is a former Republican congresswoman and now a New York co-chair for the Fiorina campaign, Carly for America. Jason Johnson is a professor of political science and contributor to Sirius XM Radio. And the Ben Carson is a conservative talk show host and CNN political commentator.
Welcome to all of you.
JASON JOHNSON, POLITICAL SCIENCE PROFESSOR, HIRAM COLLEGE: Good morning, Carol.
BEN FERGUSON, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Good morning.
NAN HAYWORTH, NY CO-CHAIR, CARLY FOR AMERICA: Thank you.
COSTELLO: Nice to have you here. So, Jason, I'll start with you. Should Republicans be doing more to distance themselves from comments like Carson's?
JOHNSON: Well, I think they all are because they recognize that this is a bad move and it's bad branding. I mean, number one, any one of any religion can become president of the United States. And number two, Ben Carson is possibly in second or third place so it's an easy opportunity to attack him.
What I think is problematic about some of this, though, is that the GOP -- because I don't think Jeb Bush believe this. I don't think Carly Fiorina believes this. They've got to do something about their supporters who do have this sort of belief system because that's really anti-democratic and it doesn't help the party's brand going forward.
COSTELLO: All right. So along those lines let's talk about Scott Walker. As you know, he called it quits because -- he called it quits because he didn't have enough support. But he did not leave the race without a parting shot at Donald Trump. Let's listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GOV. SCOTT WALKER (R), WISCONSIN: I will suspend my campaign immediately. I encourage other Republican presidential candidates to consider doing the same so that the voters can focus on a limited number of candidates who can offer a positive, conservative alternative to the current frontrunner.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COSTELLO: So, Ben, should these lower tier candidates drop out for the greater good? And I'm talking about Jindal, Graham, Gilmore, Pataki and maybe Santorum.
FERGUSON: Yes. No, I don't think so. Look, Scott Walker can only blame so much of this on Donald Trump. Yes, he was high up in the polls early on. He was on the big debate stage two times in a row and yes, he didn't get a lot of coverage because of Trump-mania. But he also had two debates that honestly just weren't that good. He didn't drop by five, six, seven points because Donald Trump stole people from him or he didn't get any time on stage.
He dropped because people watched and then they just weren't very impressed with his debate. So for him to say, you know, others should drop out and all get around and go after Donald Trump, I don't think that's a realistic request of any of the other candidates. I would be highly upset if I was Scott Walker that you work your entire life, certainly in the last decade, to get to this point and because of Donald Trump you didn't get much coverage.
But you also didn't have two very good debates. So it's -- I think it's 50-50 here and I think the other candidates definitely should stay. And we're still a long ways away from election day and they deserve to be there.
COSTELLO: Nan, I saved the hardest question for you.
HAYWORTH: Thank you.
COSTELLO: OK. You, of course, support Carly Fiorina.
HAYWORTH: I do. Yes.
COSTELLO: You're very loyal. So when Walker bowed out.
HAYWORTH: Yes.
COSTELLO: A former campaign aid that left his campaign, she lit up a Twitter firestorm. She tweeted out, "Things he got wrong. Misunderstanding the GOP base. Pandering, flip-flopping." Another tweet she said, "Becoming so invested in winning no matter what it took that he lost sight of his real identity as a political leader."
So, Nan, first is she right? And second, would you ever do that?
HAYWORTH: No. I would not do that. And my opinion of Governor Walker is frankly what Carly Fiorina has expressed, which is that, you know what, he's a terrific governor. He's a great leader. He has a great heart and I bet he'll be back in presidential politics. And what we all have to concentrate on in this contest -- and it's great to have such a vigorous contest -- is who among these candidates actually has the qualities of leadership, the voice, the compassion and the passion that we need. That's why I'm supporting Carly Fiorina.
COSTELLO: OK. So let me ask you the question that I opposed to Ben. If you -- like if your support is an asterisk, you're below .01 percent.
HAYWORTH: Yes.
COSTELLO: Why do you stay in the race? You don't have a prayer. What's the point?
HAYWORTH: Well, Carol, that's probably true. And look, Carly Fiorina has shown in that regard that you can, through excellence, through challenging the status quo, through not backing down from a challenge within the field, you can rise. And she had risen very dramatically.
COSTELLO: I know. She's done great and her poll numbers are great. But again, like, why are the candidates standing -- FERGUSON: Remember, she was -- right. Well, let me say this. Look
at Rick Santorum --
(CROSSTALK)
FERGUSON: Well, hold on. Look at Rick Santorum, for example. Rick Santorum defied all odds last time. And remember where he went from no one really talking about him to all of a sudden -- I think one of the first primary states and him walking on stage and saying game on. And then challenging all the way through the, you know, Super Tuesday in to the southern states, in the winning states with pennies on the dollars compared to Mitt Romney.
[09:10:10] So if you also -- look at Carly Fiorina. She was on the happy hour debate. We were barely talking about her less than a month ago. And now all of a sudden she's in second place. So I think again you've got to look at your campaign structure.
JOHNSON: Right.
FERGUSON: Do you have people that are loyal to you? I think Rick Santorum is a great example. He's saying, I'm not too worried about my national poll. I'm worried about Iowa, and New Hampshire, South Carolina, which is a strategy last time it worked.
(CROSSTALK)
COSTELLO: OK, Ben.
FERGUSON: So I'd stay --
COSTELLO: Ben, I hear you. I do. I hear you. I don't agree with you but I hear you.
OK, let's talk about the late-night TV because that's become quite the campaign stop. Right? Ted Cruz, and I must say he's a very brave man, Jason Johnson, for appearing on Colbert show. And Colbert held his feet to the fire when it came to comparing himself to President Reagan. Let's listen.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
SEN. TED CRUZ (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: The 10th Amendment says if it doesn't mention it, it's a question for the states. That's in the Bill of Rights. Everything that is not mentioned is left to the states. So if you want to change the marriage laws --
STEPHEN COLBERT, HOST, "THE LATE SHOW WITH STEPHEN COLBERT": I'm asking what you want.
CRUZ: I believe in democracy. I believe in democracy and I don't think we should trust --
(CROSSTALK)
COLBERT: No, no. Guys. Guys. However you feel, he's my guest so please don't boo him.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COSTELLO: All right, he was talking about same-sex marriage there, obviously, Jason Johnson. And as you heard the audience booed him at one point. I don't know if I would have brave enough to appear.
JOHNSON: I mean, I think Colbert did an amazing job. I mean, really tamping down the audience kind of saved Ted Cruz. But this is the problem that you run into if you are a Republican candidate and you are going on a show that's sort of moderate to left leaning. They're going to ask you about gay marriage. And you can't keep tap dancing around this issue, and saying, oh, I believe in democracy, or I believe in state's choice.
Voters aren't stupid. They know you are not in favor of gay marriage and that is something that a lot of people certainly in the center and the left and young people are in favor of. So this is the same problem that any Republican candidate is going to run into whether you're on the "Colbert Report" or any sort of "Daily Show" and they're going to have either accept the boos or come up with a different answer.
COSTELLO: "Colbert Report," you're living in the past, Jason Johnston. That was "Late Night."
(LAUGHTER)
JOHNSON: That speaks to what his brand is. It's still "Colbert Report" to me.
COSTELLO: Yes, it's Ben.
FERGUSON: I've always said this. You're a Republican, and you get booed in New York City on a nighttime TV show, I'm not sure that's actually going to hurt you in the conservative polls.
JOHNSON: That's right. Right.
(CROSSTALK)
FERGUSON: I think people will rally behind you.
COSTELLO: Exactly. And we cannot end without Carly Fiorina singing to her dog on the Jimmy Fallon show. So let's listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CARLY FIORINA (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I have two dogs, Snickers and Max, they're Yorkshire Terrier, but I have to explain. See, I make up songs. My mother and I used to sing together all the time. And I sing to my granddaughters. And --
JIMMY FALLON, HOST, "THE TONIGHT SHOW": Is it dorky?
FIORINA: Dorky? FALLON: Yes.
(LAUGHTER)
FIORINA: My dogs are not dorky.
FALLON: No, no, no. No. Is the singing dorky?
FIORINA: Oh, I don't know. I don't know.
FALLON: Because I know I sing to my dog and it is dorky. It's like we all do it.
FIORINA: You want to hear a verse?
(Singing) My name's Snick and I'm lazy, please don't take a walk with me. I'd rather stay right here at home instead. I want to lie back down in my nice warm bed. My name's Snick and you're going to have to carry me.
(LAUGHTER)
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COSTELLO: Nan, did you put her up to that?
HAYWORTH: You know, I credit Carly Fiorina completely. But isn't it refreshing that someone who shows such incredible gravitas who knows the world, knows the facts and can obviously best the field at any debate, can also relax. She is absolutely down to earth. She's a real compassionate and funny person.
COSTELLO: What a funny moment, I might add.
(CROSSTALK)
HAYWORTH: Anyone who has a sense of humor is a great leader.
COSTELLO: Risky move.
FERGUSON: Risky move and it paid off. But I will not be singing on TV any time soon and won't tell candidates to do it either.
JOHNSON: Right. It worked for Clinton. It's worked for Obama. If you can sing it works. It's good.
COSTELLO: And maybe you should cry a little bit, too. Who knows?
HAYWORTH: Right. And she loves her dogs, too.
COSTELLO: Yes, exactly. Nan Hayworth, Jason Johnson, Ben Ferguson, thanks to all of you. I appreciate it.
Still to come in the NEWSROOM, with just hours to go until Pope Francis arrives in the United States all hands are on deck. Up next the extraordinary security measures being put into place. (COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[09:18:25] COSTELLO: Hours from now Pope Francis will make history and step onto American soil. Later this morning, the leader of the Catholic world says goodbye, Cuba, and hello, USA. His visit expected to be the largest security operation in U.S. history. And that means all hands are on deck. The challenge keeping the Pope safe and allow him to interact with the people he loves.
Pope Francis will begin his trip in Washington. Later in the week he travels to New York and then it's on to Philadelphia. Excitement already in the air. According to a new CNN-ORC poll, nearly half of Americans and 78 percent of Catholics are looking forward to the Pope's visit. Both Catholics and non-Catholics giving the Pope very high marks, as you can see.
When the Pope touches down at Andrews Air Force Base a little later today, he'll be greeted by the president and the first lady, along with Vice President Joe Biden and his wife. From there it is on to the White House.
Joining us now, CNN White House correspondent Michelle Kosinski. She's in Washington. And over the phone from Cuba, CNN's Rosa Flores who is traveling with the Pope.
But, Michelle, I want to start with you and the excitement building in the air in Washington.
MICHELLE KOSINSKI, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Yes, Carol, absolutely. And you can really see the preparations underway at the White House, too. A large number of Secret Service officers here today. You can hear conversation outside the White House, putting the finishing touches on how to deal with the entrances and exit. Not just of the Pope himself and the people traveling with him, but the 15,000 people that will be part of the greeting ceremonies here tomorrow on the White House's South Lawn.
Remember, all of those people have to get in and be screened first. And that's really just one tiny corner of the large beast that is the security operation for this. I mean, even when you're just talking about Washington, this is being called unprecedented. What people will see are a lot of road closures.
[09:20:12] The meticulous planning for how the Pope is going to move about because remember this isn't just multiple cities, it's multiple locations he will visit within those cities. What people won't see is all the training that went into this for months. The Secret Service traveled to Rome. They had their own replica of the Pope Mobile that they use at their training facility in this area. That large number of officers, both federal and local, that will be out there because it's the location, it's the large crowds, the movement, the fact that the Pope isn't always predictable, too, in the way he wants to interact with people, in ways the Secret Service isn't used to dealing with, you know, when they're guarding a president or a dignitary.
And also just the fact that you have more threats nowadays that you didn't even have to think about before, like drones -- Carol.
COSTELLO: Right. I'm just looking at the live pictures of the Pope and we can see what you're talking about, Michelle, because the Pope Mobile is quite open. Right? And we all remember Pope John Paul, right?
KOSINSKY: Yes, and it's really --
COSTELLO: Back in 1981 when he was shot in Vatican City.
KOSINSKY: Right. Yes. And they really try to make order out of the chaos of having a crowd that big. There is still a lot of unpredictability there but that's what months of planning are for. Really getting as much order out of those kind of events as one can.
COSTELLO: OK. So, Rosa Flores, I'm just going to ask you about the Pope because we saw him hugging people in the crowd, bending outside of the Pope Mobile, kissing babies. Did security in Cuba freak out?
ROSA FLORES, CNN CORRESPONDENT: You know security is definitely strong here in Cuba. And we've seen that type of security in South America as well. And you know, they cordoned out certain areas to make sure that people can't get too close to the Pope. Now after the Pope's first mass here there was an encounter where people got too close to the Pope Mobile and they were taken away. Cameras were rolling actually when that happened.
So there's always eyes and ears. He always has security with him. And of course we're traveling on the papal plane with the Pope and we see a lot of that security also board the plane with him. The head of security for Pope Francis actually also goes to the back of the plane and introduces himself to journalists. So very, very visible, Carol. Definitely so when it comes to the security and the health of the Pope.
He travels with a provision. You might imagine right now Cuba is very hot. We've been asking the spokesperson from the Vatican about the Pope, you know, how he's holding up. And they're like, you know, he's a little tired just like everybody else because it's hot and humid. But constantly. They are on constant watch to make sure that the Pope is OK.
COSTELLO: All right, Rosa Flores, many thanks. It's been very hot in Cuba but when the Pope arrives here in United States they're expecting beautiful weather in Washington, D.C. It's going to be -- only get a high of 80 degrees. Awesome.
All right. Back to protecting the Pope because that really is the biggest priority. Security plans have been in the works for nearly a year now. You heard Michelle Kosinski say it, and the goal here is to strike a balance. Keeping Pope Francis safe at all times but also allowing him to do what he loves and that would be interact with the crowds. The FBI has already set up round-the-clock intelligence centers in all three cities and according to the New York City Police Commissioner Bill Bratton, authorities have been studying the Pope's body language so they can anticipate the Pope's movement in a crowd. (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
We plan for the worst or the unexpected. And we watch very closely all of his appearances around the world, how he interacts with the crowd.
ANDERSON COOPER, CNN ANCHOR: So you've studies those appearances.
BRATTON: Sure. Sure. You know, in terms of how he interacts. That's something we need to know about him. Because undoubtedly he will seek to do that. He makes it quite clear that he wants to meet with his parishioners. You would always be concerned about active shooter, you'd be concerned about certainly explosive device. You'd be concerned with any type of weapon for that matter.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COSTELLO: Freaky, right? Joining me now to talk about this, Michael Balboni, he's the former New York state homeland security advisor. He's now a senior fellow at the Homeland Security Policy Center.
Thanks for being here, Michael.
MICHAEL BALBONI, SENIOR FELLOW, HOMELAND SECURITY POLICY CENTER: Good to be here.
COSTELLO: So you heard what Commissioner Bratton said. The Pope has made a request. Don't let security get too close to me. So if you are in charge of protecting the Pope what goes through your mind?
BALBONI: Actually this is really not unique. A lot of protectees, particularly in the political realm, have that same complaint. Let me get to the people so I can meet voters or I can talk to my constituencies. So this is not a new dynamic. But of course here, the size of this, the incredible scope. This is going to be probably the largest security operation that we've ever seen to protect one individual.
[09:25:02] COSTELLO: Well, I think Philadelphia will present perhaps the biggest challenge because, number one, Philadelphia isn't used to handling these big, giant events like Washington, D.C. and New York City. And also in Philadelphia they're going to have that open air mass. 1.5 million people are expected to attend. So what do you do?
BALBONI: So Police Commissioner Ramsey isn't very experienced handling. He's been Chicago and in Washington, D.C., now he's in Philadelphia. They've have been ramping up for this for a very long time. They've made sure that they have the resources. And everybody that I've talked to, my sources in law enforcement, say that they're going to be ready for this. Of course, you know, a million plus people is such a dynamic. And the key to all of this is certainty. To be able to take out the unpredictability.
So if you know that the Pope is going to be greeting people, then you plan for that. Just as Commissioner Bratton said. What people really kind of respond to, can we have a fast response should something off script happen to be able to prevent and mitigate what could happen?
COSTELLO: OK. So Commissioner Bratton says they practiced reading the Pope's body language. So what sorts of things in particular are they looking for?
BALBONI: So when the Pope -- when the protectee makes movements, what Secret Service experts have taught me is that you try to provide a 360-degree arc of protection, which means you're not just looking at the individual, you're looking outside. You have counter- surveillance, counter (INAUDIBLE) teams that are in high points that can take a look around. And this is what you're trying to do here. But you're also using undercovers.
You also have people in the crowd, you try to anticipate what's going on ahead of time. You know, it's not like suddenly the Pope arrives and everybody just comes with him. There's lots of folks seated throughout the crowds way before the Pope ever gets there.
COSTELLO: I read a very good article on security and I can't remember which publication but they said because people will have so many different expressions on their faces when they see the Pope, extreme emotion, it will be difficult to read the crowd because of this particular protectee, as you call it.
BALBONI: That's an excellent point. And so the usual behavioral assessment systems that they have out there, they don't necessarily work in these types of situations but again it's the people who are really on the ground, you know, are going to use video surveillance and perhaps facial recognition to pick up people that they -- are on the list. But the Secret Service knows who are going to be issues ahead of time and they've actually gone out way ahead.
The challenge, of course, is that you get so many tips. Every New Year's Eve the FBI and New York City Police, they get literally hundreds of tips and they've got to run that down. And that's resource allocation. Sometimes it's not so great. But here, we're sure we have as many resources as we possibly need.
COSTELLO: And as far as you know there is no credible threat against the Pope at this point in time, as we sit on this news set.
BALBONI: You know, my sources tell me that there is no credible threat against him. Of course there are all sorts of concerns as to what might happen. There was just recently a warning to be careful that folks might try to impersonate emergency personnel, security personnel. But that's not a new threat. That's always been something we've looked at. But overall, you know, this is going to be the event that we expect it to be as of right now. Lots of people. Lots of interests. Lots of threat. It's a concentration of risk and that's what you always try to mitigate and anticipate.
COSTELLO: All right. Michael Balboni, thank you so much for joining me. I appreciate it.
Still to come in the NEWSROOM, how did Hillary Clinton send biotech stocks tumbling with a single tweet. (COMMERCIAL BREAK)
