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Pope Francis's Final Day in Philadelphia; A Day of Somber Meetings. Aired 3-4p ET
Aired September 27, 2015 - 15:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[15:00:00] ANDERSON COOPER, CNN HOST: Pope Francis' final day in Philadelphia. Tonight the Pope delivers his final homily in the U.S. capping off what many believe here has been a spectacular week, a papal firsts, moving moments. The Pope has arrived, as we just said and just showed you, at St. Joseph's. It was an unscheduled stop on his way to his final mass in the United States. Thousands, tens of thousands, hundreds of thousands flocking here. There's no official count of flocking here. Lining the iconic Benjamin Franklin parkway for the mass including the world festival of families.
Earlier today a much more somber mood has Pope Francis attended to, key meetings. First he met privately with five victims of sexual abuse. According to the Vatican, the Pope listened to their testimonies, their stories, all adults who as minors had been abused either by clergy members, by family members or by teachers. He then prayed with them and said the guilty will be punished.
The Holy Father also travel to the largest prison in Philadelphia, the Curran-Fromhold correctional facility. There he spoke to inmates whose crimes range from drug convictions to murder. We should point out there had been a priest who had been in that facility. He apparently was moved over the summer.
Afterwards the Pope returned to the St. Charles Borromeo seminary for a brief break before this evening's mass.
I want to bring in our panels. Senior Vatican correspondent and analyst John Allen, Bruce Feiler, best-selling author, and father James Martin.
Father Martin, explain this - you have a big smile on your face because you're very happy the Pope visited St. Joseph's. Explain why.
FATHER JAMES MARTIN, EDITOR-AT-LARGE, AMERICA MAGAZINE: Well, I'm really happy. The Pope normally makes an unscheduled stop to the Jesuit community in the city he visits. So we don't know if it was going to be New York, Philadelphia, or Washington. And he visited St. Joseph's University which is the Jesuit University of Philadelphia. He dedicated a statue there to Jewish/Christian relations. And he also, a friend of mine just texted me who was on campus there, visited the Jesuit infirmary, that is he went to the place where the sick and infirm and elderly Jesuits live in the area which is on the campus of St. Joe's. So it is a big moment for St. Joe's, a big moment for the Jesuits and I'm delighted. I just wish I were there.
COOPER: Yes. I mean, for -- what does it mean as a Jesuit to have a Pope who is a Jesuit?
MARTIN: It's amazing. I mean, I love the guy and I think part of it is I'm biased because he's a Jesuit. One of the things I like best is that he's able to sort of share Jesuit spirituality with the whole world now in very subtle ways. He doesn't say now I'm going to talk about Jesuit spirituality. But even last night when he was talking about the good and the evil spirits and, you know, the devil makes us do this and God makes us do that, that's Jesuit spirituality and he provides it for people in a really accessible way.
COOPER: It is amazing, John Allen, you've followed this Pope closer than really anybody, that he can have an unscheduled stop on such a program which is so finely calibrated. And I mean, just the security here. I've never seen security this intense for any event anywhere in the world. In terms of other papal visits that you've seen, does this go beyond anything you've ever seen?
JOHN ALLEN, CNN SENIOR VATICAN ANALYST: In 20 years in taking papal trip, Anderson, I have never seen anything like this. I mean, let's remember, this trip began in Cuba, which has a very thick kind of police-state feel. There was nothing like this.
You know, I was with John Paul in communist Poland. I was with John Paul in Syria under Assad. Nothing like this. And yet, Francis finds ways to break through it. (INAUDIBLE) mentioned it's not unusual for him to do this kind of unscheduled stops. Absolutely, not.
When we were in Sri Lanka, OK, in January, he was supposed to have a meeting with bishops but there was such a big crowd, his motorcade was running late, he had to cancel that visit. So he rescheduled it for later in the day. He shows up at the archbishop's residence, the bishops weren't there yet. So he said hey, I met this Buddhist monk at the airport, who invited me to swing by his temple, so let's do that. So they made a drive-by at this Buddhist temple. He walks in, and people are flabbergasted and they quickly arranged a little thing for him. You know, and then he goes back and does his meeting with bishops. This is vintage Francis.
COOPER: Bruce Feiler, it is amazing given all the security precautions, all the security requirements, the difficulty of even getting here. We're still seeing huge crowds. There is no official number of exactly how many, talked about perhaps as many as a million, you know. I think some people are no doubt scared away by all the security precautions. It's very difficult to figure out and very confusing just to get from point A to point B, but it certainly hasn't diminished the enthusiasm of people in the crowds.
BRUCE FEILER, CNN CONTRIBUTOR: People are definitely excited to be here, but the security is worth talking about. I got here on Friday night and the streets were deserted. There was no moving vehicle. They took the cars out of every parking garage in downtown Philadelphia at 2:00 p.m. on Friday. And he was still in New York at that time. Yesterday, it was actually much more onerous downtown than it is today. I actually went through the security that the visitors have to go to. There's a separate line for the police. And yesterday when I went through that security they took an apple that I had in my bag. And I thought this is the ultimate payback to the snake and the Garden of Eden that they are confiscating apples.
Today, actually, it's less onerous downtown I think because of the loop he took yesterday. I don't know that he's taking it today. But they've narrowed the number of ways that you can get in, which is why we're seeing crowds that are waiting three hours to go through the security screening.
[15:05:11] ALLEN: And it's probably also worth saying, Anderson, the Pope is of course here to cap this world festival of families that has been going on all week, which was scheduled to run Monday through Friday. But as of Thursday night, the security officials told them you've got to vacate the premises. So they actually had to cancel an entire day of the meeting the Pope was here specifically to celebrate in order to accommodate the exigencies of what I think many people would say has been a slightly overproduced security operation.
COOPER: In terms of what happens next for the Catholic Church, for this Pope, there is a big thing in October. Can you explain a little bit, John, what the importance of that?
ALLEN: Sure. Synod, it means basically a summit, a gathering. And Pope Francis has called two Synods on the family, one that met last October and another that he is going to meet this October. They're sort of like the Congress of the Catholic Church, although they don't have any decision-making authority. They simply make recommendations to the Pope. The idea is to come up with creative ways the Catholic Church can support families.
Now, last October this Synod became a major news event because there were interesting flashpoints that emerged, among them, whether the Catholic Church ought to invite divorced and remarried Catholics, that is those who remarry outside the church and are currently banned from receiving communion, whether they ought invite them back to receive communion, also, how welcoming the church ought to be to gays and lesbians, how positive that church have and people who are living together. And we expect those issues are going to be in the mix again in October.
You know, Francis as you know, Anderson, is trying to walk this fine line between on the one hand not changing church doctrine but on the other hand putting the emphasis on welcome, compassion, and mercy. I think the Synod is trying to figure, help him figure out what that looks like in practice.
COOPER: We are going to take a short break. We are going to have more with our panelists. Stay tuned. We hope very soon to get our glimpse of Pope Francis as we follow him down through the highways and the streets of Philadelphia. It is the location where we're at now where he is going to celebrate a mass, his final mass here in the United States.
A lot happening ahead. Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[15:10:49] COOPER: And welcome back to our continuing coverage of the people's Pope, Pope Francis, his last several hours here in Philadelphia. You see some of the Benjamin Franklin parkway there, some of the assembled crowds, tens of thousands of people along that route there. As you see there are people all over the city who have been lining up, some camping out, waiting for hours and hours, some even overnight waiting to get -- hoping to get a prime spot. Family members young and old, all ages, hoping of course not only to see Pope Francis himself, but also to perhaps have the Pope stop, hold their child, bless their child. No doubt there's a lot of expectation all along the route here.
The Pope's open motorcade about to start. Here, you see the first pictures there now of the pontiff as he's in the Popemobile getting ready to begin what is for many going to be the high point, their moment they actually get to see the Pope.
I'm joined as we continue to watch this live pictures by senior Vatican analyst John Allen, also best-selling author Bruce Feiler, and also father James Martin. All of us who are going to be watching this along with you and also listening to the sights and sounds whenever possible so you can experience what it's like being here in Philadelphia.
The crowd where we are is very excited. You can hear them. They're watch on monitors, just seeing the Pope starting his procession here. So there is certainly a lot of excitement about that.
But Bruce Feiler, really until you have actually seen the Pope in person, it's hard to sort of transmit the excitement even if you're not a Catholic. It is kind of thrilling to see this man who one has seen really only from afar, to see him up close is extraordinary. Look at this now.
FEILER: And the theatrics of how this vehicle is designed, when he came by -- let's just watch this for a second.
(CHEERS)
FEILER: When he came by the booth where we are sitting right now last night, it was dark and the illumination inside, there was a white light on top and there's a white light underneath. It's part of what we have seen at every step when we started in Washington at the cathedral and at ground zero and again last night, the production value and the way he is the center of attention and the way he stands out with the white vehicle surrounded by the black motorcade, I just had a quick story I wanted to throw in here. Look how clean that outfit is. OK?
Last night at the end of the festival of families that took place behind us, you had Mark Wahlberg emceeing, you have Aretha Franklin who sang, Andrea Boccelli. The last thing he did was he signed his name to a mural from the city of Philadelphia mural arts program. And they had intended for him to paint it. But then they were told at the last minute he only has two of those outfits and he couldn't paint because they didn't want paint to drip on the outfit so he just signed his name using a very large sharpie. ALLEN: When Francis took his first trip to Brazil in 2013, you know,
it was the first time we saw him walking up the staircase of the papal plane carrying that black bag. So we asked him during the press conference, hey, what's in bag, and he said it's my backup outfit, OK, it's the only one I've got.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Incredible.
COOPER: It is interesting actually to see kind of the size of this motorcade. It's actually smaller it looks like than the motorcade we saw in New York City, though I do feel like the security precautions in this area have been larger than we saw in New York City.
ALLEN: And also in Washington and for that matter in Havana.
COOPER: Let's just in to some of the crowd sounds here if we can.
(CHEERS AND APPLAUSE)
[15:15:22] COOPER: The first time in this motorcade that we've seen bicycle police officers accompanying the Pope, I believe.
Our Rosa Flores is in the crowd.
Rosa, has the Pope passed by where you are yet? Where are you? And what are you seeing as we continue to look at these live pictures?
ROSA FLORES, CNN CORRESPONDENT (on the phone): You know, I'm definitely on the parkway and we can see Pope Francis on the other side of the parkway. But, Anderson, I have to tell you, Pope Francis has been quoted with saying that he would rather have an injured church because it's out and about than a sick church. He wants his church to be not a regulator of faith but a transmitter of faith. And that is what we are seeing here because we are seeing thousands of people coming together to celebrate their faith.
Now, every single time that Pope Francis is on his Popemobile, everyone along that route hoping to get a glimpse of Pope Francis. And hear this. Just because you are on the sidelines, on the streets, next to Pope Francis, you are in the shadow of Peter, meaning that you are getting his blessing.
So here's what's going to happen. We'll see Pope Francis come through this road. He's going to come up to the altar. He's going to go up to the altar and celebrate mass. And this is going to be the biggest event here in the United States only because this is the only open-air mass in the U.S. in the states. And so, we're expecting, you know, record numbers of people.
But, again, we're going to see Pope Francis coming through this road here momentarily, Anderson. And we're going to bring you those live pictures.
COOPER: Father Martin, it is interesting just to watch you watching. You have this incredible smile on your face. What's this like for you? MARTIN: It's amazing. I never get tired of it. You know, I was
thinking he just passed a column that I was standing by in 1979 where I stood to see John Paul II. And, you know, I was talking to my cousins last night who were at independence hall, and I just kept saying over and over at dinner, I can't believe I saw the Pope.
I mean, you know, there's a nice analogy between God making his home in Jesus Christ and coming to live among us. And even though the Pope knows he's not Jesus, someone like the Pope who seems so far, I figure, coming to your hometown and reminding you that you're part of the church and I care for you. And I just think it's wonderful for Philadelphia and wonderful for the world to see this sort of emblem of holiness come to us.
COOPER: There is also an intimacy here. I mean, he is actually very close, closer than he was say on 5th avenue in New York to the people on both side. So people really feel this personal connection.
MARTIN: Well, and he has said before he doesn't want to be sort of enclosed, one of the quotes he had was, a mother doesn't visit her children in a glass cage. And, you know, we were talking before about, you know, his safety. You know, like a good Jesuit, one of the great models of being a Jesuit is freedom. He said I'm free even if they want to hurt me to do my job. And so, he's not really attached to that. And he is free and you can see that freedom in these gestures and in this light.
COOPER: Again, let's listen in to some of the sounds and see the sounds.
(CHEERS AND APPLAUSE)
COOPER: And even though the U.S. secret service is very much in- charge of security, the Philadelphia police obviously very involved, many state, federal, local agencies, up close it is the Vatican guards, the Vatican security, which is closest to the pontiff.
ALLEN: Yes. That's right. In fact, if you're looking to the Pope's right, the gentleman who is in the suit who is providing security, his name is Domenico (INAUDIBLE). He is the head of the Vatican gendarmes, the private security agency. He's been traveling with Popes since the time of John Paul II. And they are very good at figuring out what the Pope wants in situations like this.
COOPER: Father Martin, where is he now?
MARTIN: He is now in front of the basilica of St. Peter and Paul and there's an installation to the left called the grotto of Mary Ondure (ph) of knots and it was done by a local sister named Sister Mary Scallion who works with the homeless. And it was dedicated to the Pope's -- one of his favorite devotions, Mary, the mother of Jesus, who undo knots. And one of the questions was whether or not the Pope would actually see this and he has. It is all of the proceeds for this go to the homeless in Philadelphia.
There you can see it. Everyone was encouraged. There's the grotto to the left. Everyone was encouraged to write their problems on a little ribbon and tie it there and pray to Mary for her help. And it's wonderful the Pope has seen this wonderful grotto dedicated to one of his patrons.
[15:20:23] COOPER: In fact, it looks like he's going to get out.
MARTIN: So a little bit about Mary Scullion, she went to a project called Project Home, which takes care of the homeless in Philadelphia. He's done that for about 40 years. And she's worked with the local artist on this installation, Mary Untier of Knots. It's a devotion he came to when he was in Germany. He saw a painting of Mary kind of undoing a knot. And the idea is we go to Mary with our prayers and she undos our knots and she helps us with this.
COOPER: I can tell you this is a pool camera. We are not in control of this camera. They are scrambling now because this is not something they clearly anticipated, this pontiff getting out.
MARTIN: I saw her just last week and she gave me a tour of this place. It's this beautiful kind of grotto you can see that's made of wood. And people from all over Philadelphia have put their prayers --
COOPER: So all those pieces of paper.
MARTIN: All those ribbons have prayers on them and they're all knotted. And the idea is that they would hope the Pope would come in and pray. On the back wall, which I'm not sure you can see of St. Peter and Paul there is a painting of Mary, Undoer of Knots that is the traditional representation. And Sister Mary told me earlier this week that, you know, she didn't know if anyone knew about it. And yesterday at the press conference, someone said to Father Lombardi, do you think the Pope knows about Mary Undoer of Knots and this great grotto. And Father Lombardi shrug his shoulder and said, in typical fashion, well, we don't know. He may or may not.
ALLEN: Well, I guarantee you they know about it now.
MARTIN: They know about it now. So that is --
ALLEN: This is the kind of thing, by the way, Anderson, the Vatican security team has had to become used to with Pope Francis. Initially this threw them off their game when the Pope would sort of spontaneously decide he wanted to exit and look at something. By now they've worked out a protocol so Francis makes a kind of nod of his head and they know instantaneously to stop the Popemobile, they form around him and make this kind of thing possible for him.
COOPER: You know, I spoke several nights ago - the several nights to a former Vatican guard who provided security for Pope John Paul II, Andreas Widmer, I believe, who was saying that for Vatican security, he was almost taking issue with the tightness of the U.S. security. He was saying for the Vatican security it's a line between providing security, but also allowing the Pope to continue his mission, to continue his -- what he does.
ALLEN: I can tell you for sure, Anderson, that on background off the record, Vatican officials have been stumped by the thickness of the security apparatus on this trip. And there is real concern that it might get in the way of Francis being able to be as accessible to people as he wanted to. But as you have just seen, Francis is indefatigable in this regard. He's simply not going to be denied when he wants to make contact with people in situation like this one.
MARTIN: It's also a nice gesture towards the homeless. Sister Mary Scullion who is a mercy as her has worked with the homeless and project home in Philadelphia for 40 years. She's more or less the Dorothy Day of Philadelphia. And this revered figure. And so, this really is not simply to kind of honor that devotion that the Pope has and help people to pray, but it's also a way to sort of draw attention to the homeless in Philadelphia.
COOPER: And Dorothy Day, of course, somebody that the Pope himself made reference to in St. Patrick's cathedral in New York, which surprised a lot of people and thrilled you.
MARTIN: Yes. It was very thrilling. I mean, Dorothy Day and Thomas Merton, two of the four Americans that he raised up in his talk to Congress along with Abraham Lincoln and Martin Luther King. You know, Dorothy Day, the great apostle of social justice, Thomas Merton, the trappist monk and apostle of dialogue. Both of them interestingly kind of on the outs at different points in the church. And so he is, you know, once again in terms of including people he is restoring these people to their rightful place in the church.
FEILER: And in picking up on that, the other two people that he mentioned, of course, were as you just said Abraham Lincoln and Martin Luther King. And I find myself to invoke another person, Benjamin Franklin. He's now driving up the Benjamin Franklin parkway, and there is a great connection between Franklin and Francis. And that is on July 4th, 1776, after the declaration of independence was signed in independence hall to the left of where he stood last night, they formed a three-person committee to come up with a seal for the new United States. And it was Franklin himself who proposed they put Moses on that seal. And the other two members, John Adams and Thomas Jefferson, didn't want it, and frankly prevailed and actually made a sketch of Moses because it was Moses who took the Israelites out of slavery into freedom and this country of course was founded by people seeking religious freedom.
And in that speech before Congress, while he was staring at the bas relief of Moses across the House floor, he invoked Moses. He again invoke Moses at ground zero. And the fact there is this connection with Franklin, who would of course is the spiritual heir of the city, which became one of the great Catholic cities in the United States, is yet another example to me of how Francis, a south American, who perhaps may have had some sort of natural antipathy toward the United States, seems in the course of this trip to have drawn closer to the United States.
[15:25:39] ALLEN: (INAUDIBLE), Anderson, that the figure seated immediately behind the Pope, who you can see in the shot there to his left, is archbishop Charles Shicku of Philadelphia and therefore his local post on this visit. Archbishop Shicku, by the way, is a (INAUDIBLE) Franciscan. So imagine what it means to him to be able to host the Pope named Francis.
The Pope always invites the local bishop of the diocese he is in to ride with him in the Popemobile and to be with him at every venue because for this Pope in particular it's important to send a message that he is not an isolated autocrat. That he's trying to govern the church in communion with his fellow bishops. And the Catholic world be call that collegiality. And so, this is kind of a visible symbol of that communion among the bishops. One of the Pope's titles is, of course, bishop of Rome.
COOPER: You can see the crowd surging there, almost kind of pushing on one of the barricades. There's so much enthusiasm here.
MARTIN: One thing I'm looking for in the coming weeks, and that is in the past when he has driven in a fiat, that he has asked that that fiat be auctioned off to give money to the poor. And so, we have at least several of these fiats and we have several of these Popemobiles. I don't know if we have two or three of them. I wonder if we're not going to hear that these have been given with the money --
COOPER: And this, of course, is especially a jeep wrangler I believe that's been converted.
Rosa Flores is standing by.
I think, Rosa, I think he's heading toward you. Is that correct, to your location?
FLORES: He definitely is, Anderson. And we're seeing the Francis effect in full force. Thousands of people with their cell phones raised up in the air.
COOPER: Rosie, you may not be able to see this but I have to tell you he's now kissing a baby who's been brought from the crowd. Again, one of those moments that so many parents along the route hope for, are praying for, and something they will certainly remember all their lives and tell their little babies ump kissed by Pope Francis.
MARTIN: He also just passed a group --
FLORES: We met a couple yesterday, Anderson --
COOPER: Go ahead, Rosie.
COOPER: Yes. We met a couple yesterday, Anderson, who had their little baby boy who were hoping to have that moment. And, you know, they were raising little warren up in the air, hoping that a police officer would grab that baby and hand it to Pope Francis. But I can tell you here from the ground, I can tell that people are even on trees trying to get a glimpse of Pope Francis.
On both sides of the parkway, I can see people on the trees trying to get a better view. But they're holding iPads. They're wearing headpieces that say "Pope Francis number one fan." There are Pope Francis plush toys, Anderson. Just a little built of everything as people wait for this pontiff. COOPER: Rosa, let's just listen in a little bit as the crowds greet
the pontiff.
(CHEERS AND APPLAUSE)
COOPER: Father Martin, here we see another baby being brought to the Pope.
MARTIN: Yesterday there was a baby brought to him at independence hall dressed like the pope.
COOPER: Is that right? Really?
MARTIN: Yes.
MARTIN: You know, right by the cathedral he passed, I saw a group called To Philly for Francis. It is a group of 400 Jesuit high school students from all over the country that have come for the last three days and camped out at St. Joe's prep and they processed from the campus all the way down and were waiting -- they were hoping that he would come and I saw them pass and he was probably -- they were probably delighted.
FEILER: I can say the other thing I've been thinking a lot, Anderson, in the last few days is we just saw that shot of city hall in Philadelphia with William Penn atop, who was a great icon of religious freedom in this country. This is the second time that a Pope has visited Philadelphia. We heard that earlier Pope John Paul II came in 1979. We can't say for sure but my guess is we won't see one of these far while. I think you are going to see popes going to the U.N., you know, because of New York, because of that. You going to see maybe Washington. But the balance of power in the Catholic Church in the United States has shifted significantly away from the legacy cities in the east coast, both south and (INAUDIBLE).
And I keep thinking that these Vatican security people -- I don't know if they've got children but as a father of daughters, I'm not quite sure I love how they're handling the babies.
[15:30:25] ALLEN: Lots of experience.
COOPER: Yes, I'm sure.
FEILER: You're going to have to see future Popes going to the southwest, to the west.
ALLEN: I personally am absolutely convinced the next papal trip to the United States is going to take him to Miami, Houston, and Los Angeles. That's where the future of the Catholic Church is in country.
COOPER: By the way, that was the calmest baby I've ever seen being taken from its parent and brought to a stranger. That baby just kind of looking around, hanging out, enjoying the ride. What an incredible scene. I mean, again, for these parents who have camped out for hours and hours just to have moments like this, one after the other, is just extraordinary.
MARTIN: And also that's another reason why it's so special in Philadelphia. I mean, New York and Washington are used to hosting these world figures. But the Philadelphia, which is sometimes in the shadow, unfortunately, of New York and Washington, this is a huge event for everyone here. It's just so dramatic.
FEILER: Preach, father. Preach.
The other thing you see being in the crowd earlier today, Anderson, is you see -- it's kind of a tailgate feel for sure. You see Argentine flags. We saw a Brazilian flag over his shoulder. And there is this message that he delivered at independence hall yesterday which is don't forget your heritage. Even if you're an immigrant to this country, honor your elders and celebrate where you come from. You don't have to leave that behind. Globalization allows you to be who you are even as you engage the global community.
ALLEN: By the way, Anderson, as the camera pulls out, we have seen several times that the Popemobile was carrying a license plate that leads "SCD-1." You kind of what you pay me for as Vatican press, that stands for the (INAUDIBLE), which means the Vatican City state. No surprise that it's number one for the Pope. Actually, there are cars all over the Vatican where you see tags, you know, SCD-47, SCD-112. His, no matter what vehicle he's in, is always SCD-1.
COOPER: You had told me the story several days ago which I love which, again, to shows you how well connected a reporter John Allen is. You know a guy in the motor pool at Vatican City. And what did he tell you?
ALLEN: Well, you know, the Pope, of course, in Rome is famous for driving around in a blue Ford focus.
(CROSSTALK)
ALLEN: Francis is famous for moving around in this very economical blue Ford Focus. So a guy in the motor pool was telling me the other day a monsignor came down who wanted to check the car out of the motor pool and the guy gave him keys to a Mercedes. And the monsignor was like, are you kidding me? I can't be seen driving this. The Pope is in a Ford focus. That's what I need. Don't you have a Fiat or Kia or anything, you know? That's how the atmosphere has changed in the Francis era.
COOPER: I can't help but feel that Pope Francis is aware this is one of his big final stops in the United States and he is trying as much as possible to connect, as much as possible to enjoy these final hours that he is in the United States. And I think he's kissing more babies than we have seen on this entire trip.
FEILER: I have to say this is something I personally have missed. I understand that he gives press conferences on the way home from trips and John Allen will be on that plane and there's already lobbying going on among the press for which questions. It would have been nice to hear his reaction while he was here. I
think that the idea that he didn't have an opportunity to speak to someone where he got to say what do you think of Washington and New York and now Philadelphia? It seems he's got such a golden touch. He sort of the master of the bully quote to my mind.
COOPER: But John Allen, you were saying that often does occur on the plane.
ALLEN: It absolutely does. Bruce, I completely agree with you, that's one of the things we are most looking forward to on the plane ride with Francis back home and not merely because as you say he is a master of a sound bite and a sound bite of substance. But in addition, let's remember this is the first time not just as Pope but in his life he's ever been to the United States. So I think it will be fascinating.
COOPER: It is amazing how he spots somebody in the crowd, a baby in the crowd and he beckons and his security know that means bring that person to him. This is a young child.
MARTIN: That is just vintage Pope Francis.
FEILER: I was going to say it's a lot of babies. How about some, you know, young children?
ALLEN: Well remember, the Pope is actually particularly concerned with people at both ends of the spectrum of life. He talks a great deal about youth, but he also talks a great deal about the elderly. And I've often thought as he's making these swings through the crowds, that, you know, predominantly he has brought up babies to kiss, but I'm sure once in a while he'd welcome the opportunity to also greet an elderly person.
[15:35:08] MARTIN: That's one of the reasons he went to the Jesuit infirmary at St. Joe's, you know, where all the elderly Jesuits are. And I would imagine some of my Jesuit brothers would have taken pictures of that. And so, there is that, as you say the very young and the very old. And interestingly he did both in one day.
FEILER: That's beautiful.
COOPER: And I can also tell you -- again, here a child who looks to be handing him something. What an extraordinary moment for that little boy. There was a moment in St. Patrick's cathedral in New York where as he was leaving he spotted two elderly ladies who were not able to stand up and he basically kind of made a bee line for them, bent down to their level, was talking to them, whispering to them, in a very intimate way. And I thought it was such an extraordinary moment with the entire world watching, the entire world waiting for him. He took the time to go to where they were and talked to them on their level.
MARTIN: Jesus in the gospels goes out specifically to the sick. You know, there are stories in the gospels like, you know, where Jesus sees a man who was paralyzed for 38 years and he goes to him. And said there's this idea that god cares for all of us and loves us, but he has a specific care for the poor and the sick and the marginalized. And I think we see Pope Francis doing that right now.
ALLEN: And you know, Anderson, the thing is we live in a very cynical time. If this were any other public figure, we might be tempted to think it was showcasing rather than reality. But there is something about Francis about his integrity and his sincerity that tells us these are not photo-ops, these are not faux PR exercises for him. In many ways this is the highlight of the experience of coming to celebrate this mass for him and these fleeting moments of contact with real people.
FEILER: You know, what I was thinking in the last few days, I was thinking about Princess Diana in the early years of the AIDS crisis who would go physically make contact with people at a time when that was still something that frightened many people. We have seen this sort of parade of official church people give a kind of, you know, awkward male hug to Francis where there is not contact. And he sees these handicapped people or disabled people or suffering people, even the people with the sick, he puts his face, physical contact made between his face and their face. The more pain they are, the closer he draws to them.
COOPER: I mean, think about him washing the feet of people early on in -- after becoming Pope, not only washing their feet but kissing their feet as well.
MARTIN: Another model of what we would call servant leadership. I mean, Jesus just in the gospels a few days ago said that the ones who wants to be first should be last and the one for the leadership should be servant of all. And he talks about that a lot in his homilies, but he also shows that, as you say, he washes the feet of people, he goes to the prisoners, he goes to the sick and the outcast, and he's trying his best to emulate what Jesus asks us to do.
FEILER: The first time he did that was --
MARTIN: He did -- the theme of his talk at the prison was the washing of the feet. He may not have done it because it was more of a liturgical act. But, you know, there was a sense of all of us needing to be cleansed which I thought that was very beautiful.
ALLEN: And of course, as you know, Father Jim, the first time he did that was the Holy Thursday mass in Rome shortly after he was elected. And the interesting thing was it wasn't something lowly and the outcast. There were also women and Muslims including in that feet washing ceremony, which another symbol of this Pope's desire to gather everyone together.
MARTIN: Exactly. And also somewhat controversial.
ALLEN: You could also make the point that technically speaking the inclusion of women in that ceremony was a violation of the church's liturgical laws.
FEILER: Excellent. MARTIN: That's right. And one person said is it now OK for people to
wash women's feet in Holy Thursday services? And I said the Pope just did it so it's OK. So yes, so it is once again it is reaching out to people.
FEILER: And let's point out, is that you mentioned in passing earlier, Father Martin, that when today he dedicated a statue to Jewish-Christian dialogue, we are coming up in a few weeks on the 50th anniversary of (INAUDIBLE) which was the document, one of the most hard fought and hard rat (ph) documents of Vatican too that opened the arms of the church not just to Jews but eastern Christians and to other basic --.
COOPER: And now, the Pope is going by where we have our correspondent Rosa Flores.
Rosa, explain where you are in relation to the Pope and what's the e reaction of the crowd?
FLORES: Well, the crowd cheering. People holding up their cell phones, taking pictures. We are about 20 feet from Pope Francis at this point in time. And the crowd just cheering and hoping to get a glimpse of the 78-year-old pontiff.
Now, the Popemobile going very, very slow, which is nice for these people because that's what they were hoping for so that they can get a nice glimpse of Pope Francis. Now, what he's doing now is he is heading towards the altar, Anderson. We are very, very close to that location. And so, we are going to see Pope Francis just head there and to begin to celebrate mass -- Anderson.
[15:40:13] COOPER: And in fact, Rosa, we are getting our first now look of Pope Francis. He is now arriving at the location where he is going to be celebrating mass. There are choirs in place who are singing to welcome him here. Let's just listen in a little bit.
(APPLAUSE)
COOPER: We should tell you a little bit about what is going to be happening now for the next several hours. At 4:00, the papal mass concluding the world festival of families will commence. There will be a hymn sung by a cantor, Charlene Anglini and entrance chants, the first reading from the book of numbers. That is going to be in Spanish. Second reading from the book of James is going to actually be in Vietnamese. So it is going to be a multilingual ceremony and universal prayer again sung by Charlene Anglini. That is going to be in English. The communion will begin. We of course will hear from Pope Francis himself.
MARTIN: That story, Anderson, what we saw earlier, you see there in the picture on the screen the white sort of semicircle, which is the top of -- there we go, right there, which is the top of the altar where this mass is going to be conducted.
Immediately, you know, behind that kind of where the Chiron is that it says about the number of people is a tent that houses the orchestra. And it had a white tarp on it as you might see in any sort of vent like a wedding or something like that, right in front of these people. But there are hundreds of thousands of people behind it and their view was blocked, and they were lobbying the security officials for some time --
COOPER: Quite vigorously.
MARTIN: About an hour ago they took down the tarp.
COOPER: A cheer went up.
MARTIN: Ten minutes.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Deafening roar.
COOPER: Deafening roar.
MARTIN: Thank you! Thank you. Thank you!
COOPER: We're going to take a short break. We are going to have limited interruptions of course for the next several hours so we'll get a quick break in. We'll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[15:46:10] COOPER: And you're looking at the altar here in Philadelphia that has been assembled for Pope Francis to celebrate his final mass of his extraordinary visit in the United States. There are thousands of ticketed guests. Tickets sold out in a matter of seconds we're sold for about 10,000 people who have actually have seats in the immediate area around the altar. But there are hundreds of thousands of people who will be watching on monitors all throughout downtown Philadelphia, the surrounding blocks.
It is an extraordinary scene. People have been gathering now for hours waiting for the pontiff. They've gotten their first glimpse of him as he arrives just a short time ago before the commercial break. He is now getting prepared to celebrate this mass. And we are joined by senior Vatican correspondent John Allen, also Vatican correspondent Delia Gallagher, also Father James Martin, who have been helping us through our coverage for this entire week.
Father Martin, just in terms of what our viewers should anticipate, because this mass is set to begin at about 4:00 eastern time, is this in any way different or specific to the meeting of the families, or is this a traditional mass?
MARTIN: Well, that's a good question. It's important to know this is the regular Sunday mass. And so, it's divided into two parts, what's called the liturgy of the word where we will have readings from particularly the gospels and the old and the new testaments and a psalm, and then what's called the liturgy of the Eucharist, which is a consecration of the bread and the wine, and then the distribution of communion.
So, what's wonderful is that this is the same mass and the same readings that will be celebrated all over the world today. He will pick the readings of the day, and he will go through a normal mass. Obviously it's different because of the size of it and the music and the crowds, but this is the same mass that you will find in every Catholic Church across the country.
COOPER: And just for our viewers, I just want to show everybody we are not going to be yammering throughout the mass. We are going to allow you at home or wherever you are watching this to celebrate this -- the final visit by Pope Francis just as everybody here is celebrating it as well.
ALLEN: Just apropos of Father Martin's point, I often say, having covered papal masses for 20 years, but the papal liturgy is really just a regular Catholic mass, only with much better production values.
DELIA GALLAGHER, CNN VATICAN CORRESPONDENT: And we know that the Pope also at the end of the mass will be giving to five families a copy of the gospels. And this is kind of representative of the continents each family comes from one continent, Africa, America, Asia, Australia, and Europe.
COOPER: And Rosa Flores, who has been doing yeoman work for us, she accompanied the Pope here from Cuba, was able to have a conversation with the Pope as well. And she is now been in the crowds for several hours.
Rosa, you are soon going to be departing in order to get on to the papal plane as will John Allen to accompany this Pope back, back home. It's often on the plane, as John Allen was saying earlier, Rosa, that the Pope will come back and talk to reporters and kind of sum up some of the experiences and his thoughts about the trip of wherever it is he's just been.
FLORES: And we get the opportunity also to ask him questions, Anderson, which is a key part of that press conference because a lot of the issues that come up during the visit, the two-country visit will be talked about during that press conference.
I've got to tell you, from being in Cuba and then from coming here to the United States on the papal plane and then talking to people out in the street, there is a Francis effect. This energy, this excitement wherever Pope Francis goes to. I've been talking to some of the people here, all from the Philadelphia area.
Now, this lady here in particular, I want to chat with her because she baked cookies for the Pope that have little crosses on it.
Now, tell me your name, where you're from and why is it important for you to be here today to get a glimpse of Pope Francis?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Well, I feel like a special blessing came upon our family when my grandson was diagnosed with leukemia a year and a half ago and my other grandson was a perfect match donor and it was all through prayer and divine intervention. And I felt it important to be here to see the Pope today. I put these beads on, which are rosary beads, but I wear them all the time. When they do the cells and they transfuse, it's been a miracle ever since.
FLORES: Now, tell me a little something because I know that there's such so much emotion surrounding Pope Francis, what he says, what he represents, the mercy that he delivers everywhere he goes, his presence here in Philadelphia with your family, with your sick relative, do you feel that? What emotions go through your body?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: A lot of emotions. Like I keep talking, I'll probably be crying in a couple minutes. But a lot of emotions. Just a wonderful man and just the presence of God on earth. And I really feel it today.
FLORES: OK. Again, Anderson, a lot of emotion. And that's what we feel, raw emotion from people who feel so connected. And these are not just Catholics. We're talking about people from other faiths who come together in a beautiful way. I mean, you can see the crowd here. Thousands of people coming together to celebrate their faith to spend a few moments, seeing a man who around the world who has change lives, who changed perspectives.
And today, we are going to be listening to his homily here in Philadelphia. But let me tell you there are tweets going around the world about what he's saying, what he's doing and what he represents around the world -- Anderson.
COOPER: Yes. And you can -- it's interesting, I mean, you can hear the emotion in that woman's voice about her personal experience and what she's feeling there today. But I think that's echoed by many people you hear from in the crowd. And it's very rare. I can't really think of any other kind of experience where you can have crowds of hundreds of thousands of people and yet people feel they have had a personal experience with Pope Francis. They've had a personal experience with the person who is at the center of this crowd even if it was only for a moment.
I mean, Father Martin, I know you got a message from a friend of yours who was with some Jesuit students who feel they had kind of a double take from the Pope.
MARTIN: They did. It was a group called To Philly for Francis. And as I said, a group of Jesuits from around the country. And they held up a big sign and shouted in Spanish, which was smart, we are a Jesuit school. And he turned -- he heard Jesuits probably and gave them a blessing. So even at that moment, I mean, these kids came from all over the country just for that moment and he gave it to them which is really special.
ALLEN: You know, one of the - another observation that make about these papal liturgies, what almost amazes me is sort of the good sense of the people who come to these things. You know, when the Pope comes in, you know, it will feel like a college pep rally. I mean, they will be cheering and screaming and clapping and stomping their feet. But when the mass begins and particularly in kind of the high points of the mass, they'll turn on a guy to being silent and being reverent and being deeply entered into the experience. I mean, I don't know how many other settings, Anderson, where you can
have more than a million people who can shift from wild enthusiasm to deep reverence as quickly, and without anyone telling them to do it. I mean, it just wells up spontaneously. It's a remarkable thing to see.
[15:55:00] GALLAGHER: One of the things that I noticed on this trip is, as we've said, that it's not just the Catholics who are feeling this connection to Pope Francis. And I think there's something to do with the moment that we're in as a society in America, as a world society, you know, kind of looking for something, looking for a certain direction, certainly young kids, but even adults I think looking for a kind of moral compass and something to look up to. And I think Francis has filled that for many people.
COOPER: And with about five minutes left to go before the papal mass, let's just talk a little bit, Father Martin, about what we are going to be hearing for our viewers, because we don't want to interrupt this mass. It will begin with preludes, Hallelujah, Cristasoberga (ph). Well, my Latin is terrible.
MARTIN: That's probably as good as my Latin. He will make the sign of the cross then we go right into its called the act of penitence where the penitential act where we ask for forgiveness of our sins. We do a Gloria, which is giving glory to God, others a short prayer, and then we get into what's called the liturgy of the word. So the first reading is from Numbers, the second is from the letter of James and then there is the gospel proclamation and then after that, Pope Francis will give his homily.
COOPER: Both those readings, the first readings is going to be from the book of Numbers is going to be in Spanish. The second reading is actually going to be Vietnamese according to the document that I have and then the gospel of Mark will be read in English or excerpts of the gospel of Mark.
MARTIN: Remember that Francis is here for the world meeting of families. There are people from over 100 countries here. And so, that universality I think is also reflected in the languages they are choosing for various moments of the mass.
And then part two is the liturgy of the Eucharist, which is a long prayer. That includes the consecration of the body and blood of Christ, the bread and wine, and then there is the distribution of communion, a short prayer, and then the mass is over.
Interesting, I notice this morning the gospel reading of the day is that anyone who would bring harm to the little one where Jesus says, you know, better that a great millstone be sort of tied around the person's neck and they be thrown into the sea. So it will be interesting to see how he ties that gospel reading into the theme of the world meeting of families. And perhaps into the theme of sexual abuse.
COOPER: And just checking with our Rosa Flores. As people, even who don't -- who are not ticketed to actually be
sitting near the celebration of the mass are eagerly awaiting this, Rosa.
FLORES: You know, I'm meeting Sister Lucy here, Anderson. And I just love the fact that Pope Francis has this almost, I don't know what to call it, this gift to make people laugh. Now, we were laughing because when I was covering him in Paraguay, Pope Francis said that, he said, you know, nuns watch too many soap operas. And so she started laughing about this.
Now, earlier in Cuba, he said, oh, God, please free us from crying nuns. So I was trying to get Sister Lucy's reaction. What was your reaction when you hear Pope Francis talking off the cuff?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It makes me happy. I'm so proud to be a Catholic. I will tell for the Catholic charity in the Pope's liturgy, (INAUDIBLE), and I'm proud to be a nun as well.
FLORES: Now, Sister Lucy, be honest with me. Do you watch a lot of soap operas?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes.
(LAUGHTER)
FLORES: Now, do you cry a little too much when they give you your assignment? That's what Pope Francis was saying. He was saying, you know, the nuns should be happy to serve anywhere that God wants them to serve. Did you cry when you were selected to serve somewhere?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Sometimes.
FLORES: There you go again, Pope Francis with this magic gift to connect with people. And Anderson, yesterday he made the entire crowd laugh because he started saying, you know, I'm talking very beautifully about the family and he says, you're probably thinking it's because I'm Soltero, which means I'm single. Of course the Pope is single. And then he started speaking about mother-in-laws and he said, I don't even want to start talking about (INAUDIBLE). This is then entire crowd started laughing. And then at the end of the mass, Anderson, he says, he asks, wait a minute. What time is mass tomorrow? The entire crowd started laughing because he was just so genuine. And you know, everybody started laughing because, quite frankly, he's going to be celebrating mass for everyone and he didn't know what time mass was going to start today. So again, just a little glimpse with how he connects with regular people -- Anderson.
COOPER: Yes, Rosa, thank you very much. Let's listen in now as the orchestra has begun to play the last celebration of the mass of Pope Francis in the United States.
(MUSIC PLAYING)
