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Escape From ISIS; Bill Clinton Speaks Out; Officers Charged in Freddie Gray Death in Court. Aired 3-3:30p ET

Aired September 29, 2015 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


[15:00:03]

MARTIN SAVIDGE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: We don't know how the vote went. We do know that it has to be a majority. The simple answer is that the execution is slated to now go forward.

There are other appeal attempts that are being made. Last we heard, there was one going before 11th Circuit Court of Appeals, but the U.S. Supreme Court has already ruled on her case. That actually happened back in 2014. So, it's unclear if it would go all the way back to the U.S. Supreme Court again. We don't know. We will have to see. There could be more maneuvering legally yet to come, Brooke.

BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN ANCHOR: As we mentioned off the top -- Martin, thank you so much.

We mentioned that the pope via a representative sent a letter ultimately to this board pleading for justice and mercy. These are the words they used. We just heard from the archdiocese in Atlanta. Listen to this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ARCHBISHOP WILTON GREGORY, ARCHDIOCESE OF ATLANTA: Why not wishing to minimize the gravity of the crime for which Ms. Gissendaner has been convicted and while sympathizing with the victims, I, nonetheless, implore you in consideration of the reasons that you have been presented to your board to commute the sentence to one that would better express both justice and mercy.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: All right, let me also now read for you a statement that we have just gotten in. We will put it up on the screen and I will read it for you here.

This is from the family of Doug Gissendaner. This is -- was her husband who was killed. "In the last 18 years, our mission has been to seek justice for Doug's murder and to keep his memory alive." It goes on: "We have faith in our legal system and do believe that Kelly has been afforded every right that our legal system affords. As the murderer, she's been given more rights and opportunity over the last 18 years than she ever afforded to Doug, who, again, is the victim here."

It ends with this: "She had no mercy, gave him no rights, no choices, nor the opportunity to live his life. His life was not hers to take."

Let me bring in now Jennifer McBride. She's an ethics and justice activist who met with Kelly Gissendaner not even 24 hours ago.

So, Jennifer, welcome to you. Again, you're just hearing this news as we're hearing this news in the last hour that she has been denied clemency. How -- obviously, you haven't spoken to her since this has come down, but how was she doing when you were at the prison just yesterday?

JENNIFER MCBRIDE, ETHICS AND JUSTICE ACTIVIST: Yes, yesterday, we were living in the unknown. She was, of course, under a great deal of stress and also she was supported and surrounded by her family, her children, pastors and friends who love her and were supporting her. She was trying to live in the moment.

BALDWIN: Was she hopeful that her life would be spared?

MCBRIDE: Well, we have been talking a lot about what hope means. And we look to the theologian Jurgen Moltmann, who is friends with her, who has written about hope, and he talks about hope as living into the promises of God, the promises of restoration and reconciliation.

Those are ultimate promises that we believe are meant to be made real here on earth. And we knew that we didn't have certainties either way. We were just living in the moment and hoping of course for life and for clemency.

BALDWIN: I wanted to ask you about her children who I know were at the prison yesterday as well, because I think they are a really important part of the story. But I do have to ask you, as we have learned too about this letter ultimately from His Holiness himself, from the pope, imploring for justice and mercy in this case, when did you learn that the pope tried to step in and your reaction or the family's reaction to that?

MCBRIDE: I learned of the pope's letter this morning. I have not spoken to Kelly or to her children today.

But the pope's words are right in line with my Christian faith and the Christian faith of the many faith leaders who have spoken out that believe that the only way to healing and wholeness is through mercy. That's for everyone. So, I'm grateful that the pope has spoken out and we wish that all of our voices would have been heard by the parole board.

BALDWIN: Jennifer, for people watching who aren't as familiar with Kelly Gissendaner's story, can you just tell me about we will call it the evolution, I guess, of how her children have been -- I don't want to put words in their mouth -- furious, sad with their mother for years and years, and only in recent years have turned the page and now have been fighting along with the rest of you all to find that justice and mercy for their mother?

Can you explain that to me? And did you see them yesterday? MCBRIDE: I did see them, yes. I think that the fact of the reconciliation with her children goes to show the character of Kelly and her children that they have done this very hard work.

[15:05:02]

They have all had different journeys towards reconciliation with Kelly. They of course are very much the victims in this case as well. They lost their father. And now they have the horrendous struggle to face watching their mother be killed by the state of Georgia today. They have a beautiful relationship with Kelly and a new relationship with a mother they didn't have before.

BALDWIN: Just quickly, do you know if they are opting to be in the room this evening?

MCBRIDE: They are not.

BALDWIN: Jennifer McBride, thank you so much for joining me.

MCBRIDE: Thank you.

BALDWIN: And also happening now in the city of Baltimore, for the first time, nearly all those police officers accused in the death of Freddie Gray are in the courtroom all at once. Five out of six of these defendants showed up today. All of them are charged after Freddie Gray died in April from a spinal injury he received while being taken in that prisoner transport van.

His death sparked riots and looting and demonstrations in the city. At this moment, a judge is meeting with defense teams. The defense is trying to delay this first trial, which is actually set for two weeks from today. Their argument is they say they need more time to go through new evidence.

And It's not just about when that first trial will happen. Also critical here is which of these officers will be tried first, and prosecutors would like it to be, we will show you, this man. This is officer William Porter. And it's because of a statement he made that reportedly incriminates his co-defendants, which then, depending on what he would say, would then affect future trials.

CNN's Jean Casarez has the details. Also with me, CNN contributor Andy Alperstein, a defense attorney in Baltimore, used to be a prosecutor.

So great to see both of you.

Jean, first to you to the news. Do we know whether or not that first trial date will be moved?

JEAN CASAREZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, we can confirm now that the first trial is going to be on November 30. That is a former police officer William Porter. The hearing just ended.

And Brooke, I got to tell you, we just saw some of the defense attorneys leave the building. We don't know if the defendants have left yet, but some of the defense attorneys, they looked unified, they walked together, they had smiles on their faces. We looked at them.

It just feels that they are bonding at this point. But five of the six defendants were in that courtroom today, William Porter not being there. But his trial will be first. We can tell you that November 30 is William Porter. Following that, after the new year, Goodson, Caesar Goodson, that is the officer that is charged with second-degree murder, 30 years in prison he's facing.

And it is Porter that prosecutors want to include a statement he made in some of the other trials, namely Goodson's, that it was Porter that asked Gray if he need medical attention. And Gray responded, "Yes, I do." He communicated that to Goodson, the driver of the van, and to also some other officers, but the van continued and didn't take him to the hospital.

Now, a caveat to that is that Porter also said he didn't know if he could believe Gray or not because there is jail-itis. People don't want to go to central booking. But now we know the orders of the trial. The last one will be Lieutenant Rice, which is on March 9, so one after the other.

But, remember, Brooke, November 30 is when they will try to get a jury here in Baltimore City, because the judge did not allow a change of venue at this point. Will they be able to get a jury here? Will the first defendant want a jury trial or will he ask to be tried by a judge? That's a possibility too.

BALDWIN: Right, and then presumably six different juries.

Andy, here's my question, because, as Jean mentioned, it was officer Porter who was that sixth officer who was not in that courtroom today who is the one who would be tried first because of those statements he has made. Why wasn't he at the hearing?

ANDREW ALPERSTEIN, CNN CONTRIBUTOR: Well, we don't know why he wasn't there.

What we saw unfold today, Brooke, is that the defense received recently some new discovery materials and some strategy is starting to play out before us. What happened is that everybody was on October 13 for trial. The judge has already ruled to sever the cases, meaning split them up, as we know.

And so, what was happening today is that the first officer that the state wants to try, because the state gets to pick the order, and that's this officer Porter, and when officer Porter goes first, he said, we're OK to postpone, trying to force the state to go out of its order. All five of the other defendants or their lawyers stood in court and opposed the state's request for postponement.

So, the defense asked for the first officer and then everybody else said, hey, we're opposed, we're ready and want to go. The judge said we're going to let the state pick the order and pick the order that Jean was just telling us about. BALDWIN: So November 30 would be that first trial in the city of

Baltimore.

[15:10:00]

Andy and Jean, thank you both so much.

ALPERSTEIN: Thank you.

BALDWIN: And just into CNN, Erin Burnett sat down with former President Bill Clinton, and he let loose on Donald Trump and the possibility he could make it to the White House.

Plus, for weeks, Republicans demanding that Planned Parenthood answer for controversial videos. Well, right now, they are getting their chance to grill the woman in charge. Hear the fiery moments and how she responds ahead.

And the escape from hell. A teenage girl manages to survive a face- off with ISI, and her escape is caught on video. From CNN -- barely escaped the escaped the horrors of ISIS. One year later, CNN catches up with that teenage girl. We have that story for you coming up.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BALDWIN: We mentioned at the top of the hour that a woman on death row in the state of Georgia first to be executed in 70 years, she's been denied clemency.

[15:15:00]

And what's also making news today, the fact that we have learned that a letter essentially from the pope begging this Georgia parole board to grant her clemency, to grant her justice and mercy, were the words they used in this letter.

To Rosa Flores, we go, who has been covering the pope for us as he's just returned home to Rome from the United States.

And, Rosa, I'm just wondering. I'm sure it's too early to get any kind of reaction from the Vatican, but how rare is it for a pope to intervene in a situation such as this?

ROSA FLORES, CNN CORRESPONDENT: You know, we have heard Pope Francis speak about the death penalty, Brooke. Less than a week ago, he was before a joint session of Congress calling for the end of the death penalty. He's very passionate about this. And so it wouldn't surprise some people that this call is coming straight from him.

But despite that call, the news we have at this hour is that that request of clemency was denied. Now, the letter was not signed by Pope Francis, but it was on behalf of Pope Francis, and signed by the apostolic nuncio, by the archbishop of Atlanta, asking the Georgia Board of Pardon and Parole for clemency, for the life of Kelly Gissendaner. Now, let me just read a piece of Pope Francis' speech to Congress, because he's very passionate about this, saying in part: "I am convinced that this way is the best way." Now, this is him speaking about the end of the death penalty. "Since every life is sacred, every human person is endowed with an inalienable dignity, and society can only benefit from the rehabilitation of those convicted of crimes."

Now, Pope Francis went on to say that, yes, people are punished for certain crimes, but that you have to give people hope. There has to be a rehabilitation part of that process. Here's the backstory. This woman was convicted of murder back in 1997 for killing her husband in collusion with her lover.

Since then, her advocates say that she has changed, that she's rehabilitated her life, that she's been an example for other women in prison, and calling for her life to be saved. Now, Pope Francis is not the only one asking for clemency here. More than 90,000 people have signed a petition asking for clemency and asking for her life to be spared, but, Brooke, like you mentioned, the Georgia Board of Pardons and Paroles going forward with their decision and deciding to end her life -- Brooke.

BALDWIN: At 7:00 p.m. Eastern tonight in Georgia.

Rosa Flores, live in Rome, Rosa, thank you.

A dramatic and emotionally charged hearing on Capitol Hill today, the president of Planned Parenthood grilled by lawmakers, Cecile Richards testifying in hearings on those undercover videos that claim to show workers and groups, clinics discussing the sale of fetal tissue.

The videos just absolutely outraging some Republicans, so much so they are now threatening to shut down the federal government all in an effort to cut the group's federal funding. Here she was speaking for the first time in front of lawmakers.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CECILE RICHARDS, PRESIDENT, PLANNED PARENTHOOD: The outrageous accusations leveled against Planned Parenthood based on heavily doctored videos are offensive and categorically untrue. It is unacceptable that in the 21st century, women in America are routinely harassed for accessing a legal medical procedure.

REP. JASON CHAFFETZ (R), UTAH: Does Planned Parenthood control any organizations that lobby?

RICHARDS: The Planned Parenthood Action Fund is a separate organization that has its own board and is its own fundraising and no federal employees.

CHAFFETZ: Shared employees, shared assets, shared lists, shared e- mails, shared assets. This is the concern.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Why do you need federal dollars? You're making a ton of dough.

RICHARDS: I don't get -- we don't make any profit off of federal money, if I could just have a moment to explain.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: But you're using federal coffers and displacing money that could go to the 13,000 health care clinics.

RICHARDS: But I do think it's really important that you understand that 60 percent of our patients are receiving either -- they're either Medicaid patients or they may get the Title X patients; 78 percent of our patients live at 150 percent of poverty or below.

And for many of them, Planned Parenthood is the only family planning provider that will see them in their area.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Do you defend the sale of baby body parts?

RICHARDS: No. And I think that is really a total mischaracterization.

CHAFFETZ: Your compensation in 2009 was $353,000. Is that correct?

[15:20:03]

RICHARDS: I don't have the figures with me.

(CROSSTALK)

CHAFFETZ: It was. Congratulations.

In 2013, your compensation went up some $240,000. Your compensation, we're showing, and based on tax returns, is $590,000. Correct?

RICHARDS: That's not my annual compensation. Actually, my annual compensation is $520,000 a year.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The entire time I have been in Congress, I have never seen a witness beaten up and questioned about their salary. Ms. Richards heads a distinguished organization providing health care services to millions of Americans, and I find it totally inappropriate and discriminatory.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: And that was just a sliver of the exchange.

Tom Foreman is with me from Washington.

Tom, how long did that go on?

TOM FOREMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Forever, and it's still going on. No, it really went on for a long time. This is not an easy day in the chair for Richards because it started early.

And I have to say, Brooke, the question of the videos honestly after awhile wasn't even coming up much. What you were hearing is more of this generalized debate where the theme of the Republican side was, hey, this is public money that is being used by this agency to lobby for its position, to pay for parties, to pay for big salaries, all of this, this is just a bad use of public money and you're not being very transparent about it.

And the other side, Democrats, saying this is a perfectly legitimate use, because it's a perfectly legal thing under our law and you're being completely unfair to her about it. That's what gone on all day.

And, honestly, Brooke, if you didn't tune in until after the first hour or so, you might not even know any videos were involved.

BALDWIN: Because it didn't come up as much as perhaps one would have thought.

Tom Foreman, thank you so much.

FOREMAN: You're welcome.

BALDWIN: Still ahead here, time is ticking for the vice president, Joe Biden, to decide if he wants to run for president of the United States. Should he, shouldn't he? We have both perspectives ahead.

Also, Bill Clinton comes to his wife's defense. See how he responded to criticisms from Donald Trump in a brand-new interview here on CNN. Erin Burnett joins me coming up next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:26:00]

BALDWIN: This is CNN. I'm Brooke Baldwin.

Donald Trump pulls no punches. We know that. Just last night, when Erin Burnett asked him about Bill and Hillary Clinton, he held true to form, and now we're getting the Clintons' take.

Erin Burnett, host of "ERIN BURNETT OUTFRONT," sat with Donald Trump one day, Bill Clinton the next at the CGI, the Clinton Global Initiative, here in New York.

And so what did he tell you?

ERIN BURNETT, CNN ANCHOR: It was interesting. We were talking about the 2016 race. All right?

He weighed in on his own future, his own role in her campaign, whether he wanted to V.P. We're talking about Republicans then. And we were talking about how they call each other clowns and freak shows.

BALDWIN: Idiots and whatever, yes.

BURNETT: Doofuses was the word he used.

And so, I said, on this point, is this going to stop? Is this going to be the tone? Here's what he said to that. (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BILL CLINTON, FORMER PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: You shouldn't be able to insult your way to the White House or use enough politically incorrect phrases to get your way to the White House on either side.

And I think it's the feeling when I was down. I hope it will be more -- get more serious, because the American people deserve some sense of what the heck you're going to do if you actually get the job, because the day after you take the oath of office, you can't level an insult or have a -- you're not in an episode of "Survivor."

(LAUGHTER)

CLINTON: You're actually supposed to show up and run the show.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BURNETT: And then, Brooke, we specifically talked about Donald Trump. Donald Trump, right?

Donald Trump, yesterday, when I talked to him, had really, really harsh words for Secretary Clinton. So, I played that back for Bill Clinton and he defended his wife pretty stridently. And here's how that whole exchange played out.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BURNETT: You say you can't insult your way to the White House. You say Donald Trump could be the nominee. So, I have to play this for you. This is something he said in the interview yesterday about your wife, and I want to play it for you and get your reaction. Here's Donald Trump in my interview yesterday.

DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I always respected him. I have actually liked him over the years. But when we look at what's going on in the world, when we look at the job that Hillary did as secretary of state, she goes down as perhaps the worst secretary of state in history.

And when I run against her evenly in the polls, I'm doing well against Hillary and beating her. Erin, if you look throughout the world during her reign and the reign of Obama, the whole world is blowing up. We have lost friendships. We have lost everything.

CLINTON: Well, the thing about branding is, you don't have to be -- you can be fact-free.

(APPLAUSE)

CLINTON: I think, so even the Republicans admit that the sanctions on Iran were well done and that it was a major achievement to get Russia and China to agree to sign off on these sanctions and to enforce them. She did that. That's what made the talks possible. So, even to people who don't like the Iran deal like the sanctions.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: All right, so he didn't fully take the bait.

BURNETT: What he did was defend her, as opposed to insulting Donald.

BALDWIN: Yes.

BURNETT: What I think was interesting was, he actually had positive things to say about Donald Trump. He thinks he could be the nominee, very clearly. He keeps making that clear.

He talked about the things about Donald Trump that he thinks are resonating, the master brander, as he sees him, his energy. So, it actually was very interesting that he chose not to level an insult, but to defend her.

But he also then did go on -- and you will hear this tonight -- to talk about, well, when I was at his wedding, he told me many, many times how wonderful a job Hillary did after 9/11 as senator in New York, and went on and on. So, he made that point very clear, that Donald was a fair-weather friend.

BALDWIN: How about that? And we know the polls that just came out last night, just quickly, you look at hypotheticals, Hillary Clinton vs. the Republicans, the only one she really doesn't do so well against -- or that she does do well against is Donald Trump.

BURNETT: OK.

BALDWIN: So, I guess, if I'm Bill Clinton, I'm hoping it's Donald Trump, right, who is ultimately up against my wife.

BURNETT: Yes, it's a fair point.

BALDWIN: Erin Burnett, can't wait to wait -- watch the rest of the Bill Clinton interview. Thank you so much.

BURNETT: Thank you.

BALDWIN: "ERIN BURNETT OUTFRONT," 7:00 Eastern here on CNN.