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Inside Deadly Biker Shootout; Jeb Bush Campaign Not on Life Support?; Passenger Jet Catches Fire Just Before Takeoff; China Drops One-Child Policy; Prep School Graduate Gets One Year Sentence for Sexual Assault; No Charges from Biker Shootout in Waco; 6000 Non- Violent Prisoners Released. Aired 12-1a ET

Aired October 30, 2015 - 00:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[00:00:12] JOHN VAUSE, CNN ANCHOR: This is CNN NEWSROOM live from Los Angeles.

Ahead this hour, deadly shootout in Waco, Texas. CNN has the dramatic video when the bullets started flying between two rival biker gangs. Six months on and still no one has been charged with murder.

Jeb man walking. After another poor debate is this the end for Jeb Bush and his run for the White House?

And terror on the tarmac. The engine of a commercial jet catches fire, emergency chutes deployed, dozens of passengers evacuated. All of this moments just before takeoff.

Hello, everybody. Great to have you with us. We'd like to welcome our viewers in the United States and all around the world. I'm John Vause. NEWSROOM L.A. starts right now.

And we begin in Waco, Texas. The scene of that deadly biker gang shootout back in May. CNN has obtained the surveillance video from inside a restaurant in a suburban mall and this is the moment when the shooting erupts. Some duck for cover. Others returned fire. It was all over, nine people were dead. Almost 200 arrested.

Ed Lavandera walked us through the video now as well as never-before- released details from the police report and why some defense attorneys say this might actually help prove their clients are innocent. And we should warn you, some viewers will find these graphic images disturbing.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ED LAVANDERA, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): The showdown was like the gunfight at the O.K. Corral. That's how a witness describes the biker massacre to investigators. You don't have to hear the eruption of gunfire to feel the chaos the moment rival motorcycle clubs unleash a deadly melee.

These videos take you inside the Twin Peaks restaurant in Waco, Texas, where nine bikers were killed and the parking lot was turned into a raging war zone. CNN has obtained more than 2,000 pages of documents, crime scene photos, many too graphic to show, and surveillance video, giving us the most detailed accounts of what unfolded last May. Some of the very evidence that a Texas grand jury is using to possibly indict the 177 bikers arrested and charged with organized criminal activity.

Restaurant surveillance cameras show the patio area filled with members of the Cossacks Club waiting for an early afternoon biker meeting to start. They had already been there for more than an hour. The Bandido Crew rolls in as police and SWAT teams, anticipating violence, are watching from a distance.

John Wilson is president of the Cossacks Biker Club chapter in Waco. He's sitting on the patio when the Bandidos arrive.

JOHN WILSON, COSSACKS BIKER: The lead guy on that -- you know, I looked out. I was watching. He deliberately steered into one of our prospects and hit him. You know, I mean he wasn't going real fast, but he deliberately ran into him with his motorcycle, enough to, you know, knock him down.

LAVANDERA: The man Wilson is talking about is Clifford Pierce. He refused our interview requests and has not be charged. But in a police report, an investigator wrote, "Pierce said he did not get his foot run over but may not have gotten out of the way fast enough."

It didn't matter. The Cossacks believed the Bandido ran into one of their guys and the fight was on.

(On camera): Who fired first isn't clear. One witness told police a Bandido fired the first shot into the ground. Another witness says a Cossack fired first. And in dozens of police interviews, the rival biker clubs point the finger at each other or claim they didn't see anything.

(Voice-over): Clifford Pierce says he hit the dirt and was shot. A bullet hits his spine, leaving Pierce paralyzed from the waist down.

WILSON: At that time it was -- it was pretty horrific. There were guys getting hit and falling. And I realized that I needed to get away from where I was. And I looked to the guy to my right -- my left, a good friend of mine, and I told him, I said, we got to get off this sidewalk or we're going to die here, you know.

LAVANDERA: Mayhem ensues. A biker running across the patio fires a gunshot caught on camera towards the fight scene in the parking lot. He then stashes the gun. A number of Cossack bikers take cover. Some slide handguns across the ground to each other. Restaurant patrons and Twin Peak waitresses are stunned and trapped.

The scene plays out in gory detail. You can see a group of bikers pummeling one man just outside the patio area. Crime scene photos later show a biker's body left dead in that exact spot. This biker runs toward the camera with a bloody face. Another group pulls a wounded man into the patio and they appear to be trying to revive him. He's then carried away. Several defense attorneys tell CNN the videos show that most of the

bikers there that day were innocent bystanders.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Well, y'all going to put us in jail?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes, everybody's going to jail.

[00:05:02] STEPHEN STUBBS, FORMER BANDIDO ATTORNEY: The way they handled it with just the mass incarceration of people with million- dollar bonds flies in the face of justice and flies in the face of fairness. It's ridiculous.

LAVANDERA: After it was all over, the scene was chaos. Dozens of bikers had run inside the restaurant to hide in bathrooms, in the Twin Peaks kitchen. Police SWAT teams move in to round up the crowd. They're escorted out with their hands up, weapons litter the crime scene, knives, brass knuckles and more than 150 firearms everywhere. Some even hidden in toilets.

(On camera): It's been more than five months since the Twin Peaks brawl and all of the bikers are out of jail, out on bond. They were all charged with engaging in organized criminal activity, but not one of them has been indicted by a grand jury yet and no one has been charged with murder. In fact, it's still not clear who killed whom.

(Voice-over): One police report says at least three officers fired into the crowd and one officer wrote he heard, "suppressed fire from what I believe to be SWAT officers with suppress rifles." Several defense attorneys say it's likely some bikers were hit by police bullets. But as far as we know, ballistics reports have still not been completed to determine that conclusively.

Police and prosecutors have refused to answer questions about the investigation citing a gag order, but Waco Police have defended their actions since the beginning.

SGT. PATRICK SWANTON, WACO, TEXAS, POLICE: This is a criminal element that came in here yesterday and killed people. They're not here to drink beer and eat barbecue. They came with violence in mind and were ready for it.

LAVANDERA: These images of the Twin Peaks brawl tell the story of unbridled pandemonium.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: And all these bikers started shooting. They put us in a freeze.

LAVANDERA: It was a Wild West style shoot out in broad daylight.

Ed Lavandera, CNN, Waco, Texas.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

VAUSE: Some incredible details there. And joining me now is Darren Kavinoky, a criminal defense attorney, also host of "Deadly Sins" on Investigation Discovery. OK, Darren, we've seen the video. Does this video now in any way

explain why now, six months later, no one has been charged with murder even though nine people were killed?

DARREN KAVINOKY, CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, yes and no. We have to put this in context that right now there is a grand jury hearing or a series of hearings that are going on in front of a grand jury. A grand jury in Texas justice is 12 people who are impanelled to hear the evidence brought forward by the prosecutor. And nine of the 12 have to vote in favor of a prosecution in order to return an indictment.

But this is a bit of a star chamber proceeding. It happens in secret. And there is no right for the defendant to be there or any defense lawyers to be there.

VAUSE: OK.

KAVINOKY: It's the prosecutor there presenting the evidence and as we can tell from this tape, there is a lot of evidence to be parsed. So that --

VAUSE: A lot of ballistics. A lot of witnesses. All that kind of stuff. Right?

KAVINOKY: Right. And all those videotapes and all the reports. And ultimately what the grand jurors have to decide is not just well, did these 177 guys do bad? But who exactly did what? It has to be specific evidence towards an individual.

VAUSE: So we're now down to second grand jury there in Waco. So what is going on? Why is this process, it does seem to be taking a long time? Is it unusual six months on you don't have murder charges?

KAVINOKY: Well, it's tough to say because we don't have insight into what's going on in that grand jury room.

VAUSE: Right.

KAVINOKY: But here's the interesting thing about grand juries is the prosecutor, since there is no defense attorney there, the prosecutor is supposed to be seeking justice. And they have an obligation to present not just evidence towards guilt of particular people but also if there is any exculpatory evidence. They are duty bound to bring that evidence before the grand jury as well. So that could be part of the delay. But here we've got 177 people, who are swept up in the arrest event that day. And there is nine dead bodies.

So when we are talking about the murder charges, obviously, many of those folks are not going to be defendants in a murder charge. And that's really part of the problem here.

VAUSE: Well, and all those 177, as we heard from Ed Lavandera, they've all been released from jail. No one is being held any more. And they're saying that those effectively, they're part of this massive sweep. And the attorneys are saying, just because they were there at the scene doesn't necessarily make them guilty. They were just simply bystanders.

KAVINOKY: Right, and --

VAUSE: And now -- sorry, now the county is liable according to their attorneys for, you know, millions of dollars.

KAVINOKY: Well, I don't know about that. I mean, ultimately that's something that will have to get sorted out with the evidence.

VAUSE: Sure.

KAVINOKY: But I think the point is valid. That when you make these huge sweeps and you've got 177 people really in your -- you're concerned about nine different murder counts, there is potential for a lot of dolphins to be caught in the tuna net that day.

VAUSE: Sure.

KAVINOKY: And, you know, there's a lot of expressions about the grand jury system in America and a lot of notions that in fact it may be broken. But there's an old saying that the grand jury would indict a ham sandwich if a prosecutor asked them to which makes people scratch their head in wonder and say, well, wait a second, why are we here all these months later with no indictments?

VAUSE: Yes.

KAVINOKY: But ultimately it is up to those 12 people to decide that there is enough evidence to allow the case to go forward. The grand jury is really part of a safety valve to make sure that people don't languish away on false charges.

[00:10:11] VAUSE: OK. And well, they're taking their time, obviously you say there is a lot for them to get through. But clearly, six months on. A lot of questions being asked as to why this hasn't moved forward at least at this point.

Darren, again, thanks for being with us. We appreciate it.

KAVINOKY: Yes. You bet, John. Thank you.

VAUSE: OK. We move on now to the latest in the U.S. presidential race. And there is unhappiness among the Republican candidates. Aides say some campaigns will be meeting in Washington on Sunday to try and take some control over the debates from the Republican National Committee. The RNC has not been invited to that meeting.

Many of the candidates are seething at the host network CNBC and the moderators and their questions.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DR. BEN CARSON (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Debates are supposed to be established to help the people get to know the candidates. And get to know what's behind them. And what they're thinking processes, what their philosophy is. And what it's turned into is a gotcha. That's silly. And that's not really helpful for anybody.

DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Maybe every moderator should show that they vote Republican because why should we have -- why should we have these people that hate everything we stand for and they're -- I mean, I won't mention his name, but the questions were so nasty.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

VAUSE: Now despite the tension it was a good night in Boulder, Colorado, for Marco Rubio. The Florida senator proved to be a favorite especially with his takedown of his one-time mentor and now apparently one-time friend Jeb Bush.

Texas Senator Ted Cruz scored big by attacking the mediator and -- the media, rather, and the moderators. Frontrunners Donald Trump and Ben Carson were relatively quiet but they seemed to hold serve. No harm, no foul. 14 million viewers tuned in to this debate. That was a record for the network CNBC. And those viewers tuned in to see Jeb Bush have a really bad night. The day after debate night his campaign is now in damage control.

Brianna Keilar has more.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JEB BUSH (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: It's not on life support. We have the most money. We have the greatest organization. We are doing fine.

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Jeb Bush is back on the trail trying to convince voters his campaign is not on life support.

BUSH: It's not about the big personalities on the stage. It's not about performance. It's about leadership.

KEILAR: Now some political observers are concluding that Bush's presidential prospects are doomed, even as he tries to project confidence he can make a comeback.

BUSH: There are two types of politicians. They're the talkers and they're the doers. I wish I could talk as well as some of the people on the stage, the big personalities on the stage. But I'm a doer.

KEILAR: This, after critics including many Republicans are panning his third debate performance.

BUSH: I'm running with heart. I'm not a performer. If they are looking for an entertainer in chief, I'm probably not the guy.

KEILAR: Bush, the once presumed frontrunner, whose raised $25 million for his campaign and is back by a super PAC that's holding more than 100 million, has had to cut payroll cost by 40 percent and has dropped sharply in the polls.

Wednesday Bush struggled to make a mark and gave Marco Rubio a huge opening.

BUSH: Marco, when you signed up for this, this was a six-year term and you should be showing up to work. I mean, literally, the Senate, what is it, like a French work week? You get like three days where you have to show up? You can campaign or just resign and let someone else take the job.

RUBIO: I don't remember you ever complaining about John McCain's vote record. The only reason why you're doing it now is because we're running for the same position and someone has convinced you that attacking me is going to help you.

KEILAR: An exchange that must have stung even more coming from a man Bush mentored and helped get elected to the Senate.

BUSH: The most principle centered leader I know, Marco Rubio.

KEILAR (on camera): As Jeb Bush stressed that he has the organization, the money and the heart to continue with his campaign, those Republicans who are backing him really stressed the money aspect of that saying that he is an enviable position between the funds that his campaign has and the $100 million that the super PAC backing him raked in.

Brianna Keilar, CNN, Portsmouth, New Hampshire.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

VAUSE: Next here on CNN, fireball on the runway. The engine of a Boeing 757 bursts into flames. We'll look at what may have gone wrong.

Also to come, when one becomes two. China announces an end to one of the world's biggest attempts at social engineering.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(WEATHER REPORT)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[00:18:27] VAUSE: Just moments before takeoff this Boeing 767, with more than 100 on board catches fire. The smoke billowing from one of the engines. 17 people including a child were hurt in the scramble to get off the plane. An official investigation is now under way.

CNN's Randi Kaye has more on what may have gone wrong.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

RANDI KAYE, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): A pilot with a keen eye notices the first sign of trouble, fuel leaking from the plane taxiing in front of him. Dynamic Airways flight 405. He radios it in.

UNIDENTIFIED PILOT: Hey, Dynamic, out on the left engine, it looks like it's leaking a lot of -- I don't know if it's fuel. There is a fluid leaking out of the left engine.

KAYE: Air traffic controllers contact Flight 405.

UNIDENTIFIED AIR TRAFFIC CONTROLLER: OK, Dynamic 405, do you copy?

UNIDENTIFIED PILOT: Yes, sir, we copy. We probably need to go back to the ramp.

KAYE: But before they could --

UNIDENTIFIED PILOT: Engine's on fire. Engine's on fire.

MIKE JACHLES, BROWARD SHERIFF FIRE RESCUE: Our fire rescue units received the call at 12:34 for a reported engine fire aboard the jet. Our units deployed. Within two minutes, our first units were on scene.

KAYE: There, they find a Boeing 767 on fire right on the runway at Ft. Lauderdale-Hollywood International Airport. Thick black smoke spewing out of the jet's left side and into the sunny Florida sky. All of it forcing an evacuation of the 101 passengers and crew. The jet's emergency slides are deployed. Within minutes, everyone is out. Some lucky enough to simply walk away. Others were taken on stretchers and in wheelchairs. More than a dozen were taken to the hospital, one with serious burns.

Meantime, fire crews doused the plane with water and special white foam to knock the fire down. It covers the tarmac but leaves the plane's burned-out left engine on full display.

The plane was taxiing out for takeoff, on its way from Florida to Caracas, Venezuela when the engine suddenly caught fire. Passengers on other airplanes nearby captured the terrifying scene. Posting pictures and video on Twitter. Many writing simply, "Plane on fire." Both runways were closed. The airport shutdown until late afternoon when the north runway is reopened. At least 111 flights delayed, nearly 50 canceled.

(On camera): And we're learning more about Dynamic Airways. It only started about five years ago. It has two international destinations from the United States, one to Venezuela, where this plane was going, and the other to Ghana.

This particular plane we've learned is 29 years old. We don't know if the engine that caught fire is the same age or maybe it had been replaced. We tried calling the airline for some comments on what happened here. They would not comment at all.

Reporting from Ft. Lauderdale-Hollywood International Airport, I'm Randi Kaye. Back to you.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

VAUSE: Randi, thank you.

We go to China now where for decades the communist government has restricted most families to just one child. But now couples will be allowed two children. Officials say it is because of an aging population. In the next 15 years it's estimated Chinese aged over 60 will number more than 400 million. China's population right now is more than 1.3 billion.

And we go live to Hong Kong and Leta Hong Fincher, sociologist at the Tsinghua University joins us now with more on this. She's also author of "Leftover Women: The Resurgence of Gender Equality in China." Inequality rather in China.

Leta, thank you for being with us. China has been relaxing the laws for years when it comes to the one-child policy. Has this decision now to scrap it altogether come as a surprise?

LETA HONG FINCHER, SOCIOLOGIST, TSINGHUA UNIVERSITY: Well, no. I mean, people have been talking for many, many years about the importance of abolishing the one-child policy. This policy has been in place for about 35 years. But the fact that this announcement suddenly came last night, I think surprised quite a few people including myself, although, you know, government officials have been talking about it for years. They just suddenly announced it without warning. And it is a really a historic move.

VAUSE: Yes. It's all about the economy really which coincidentally way back in 1979 when Deng Xiao-ping introduced the policy in the first place. It was also all about the economy.

FINCHER: Well, I don't think it actually is all about the economy. It is certainly about maintaining China's long-term economic growth. But in order to maintain that economic growth, China has to have a growing population. It has to have a growing work force. The right kinds of people in the work force according to the Chinese government. So it's definitely about demographics. And these major population changes. The aging of the population. The shrinking of the work force. You know, falling birth rates. Those are really severe challenges for China.

VAUSE: And there is a lot of debate about whether this policy has actually worked. Many experts say the population rate would have declined anyway and the one-child policy was simply cruel and unnecessary.

FINCHER: Yes. Well, I mean, I certainly believe so. I mean, you see that fertility rates have fallen in a lot of countries that didn't have such draconian population planning policies like forcing women to have abortions, which happened routinely, especially in the 1980s. You know, sex selective abortions. Parents wanted to have a coveted boy instead of a girl. So yes, it's been extremely controversial. It's caused a lot of harm to the population.

VAUSE: And this shortage of girls which is a direct result of this one-child policy because as you say the families wanted a boy to keep the family name going, they saw a boy as the best way to support the family when they sent him off to the city to work because girls were often seen as just kind of a liability. But now there's a huge ratio of more men to women. And that's going to be a problem for a very long time in China.

FINCHER: Certainly. I mean, Xinhua News, the official news agency in China just said that there are 30 million more men than women in China now. And that means that 30 million men will not be able to find brides and this is a real -- this has been identified by the Community Party as a severe threat to social stability.

[00:25:07] And so that's certainly one of the reasons why the Chinese government has decided to just completely abolish the one-child policy now.

VAUSE: Yes, with numbers like that, it makes it hard to get a date for the prom, doesn't it?

Leta, thank you for being with us. Leta Hong Fincher there in Hong Kong, sociologist with the Tsinghua University. Thank you.

We have one note here, if you want to see the immediate impact of Beijing's announcement, take a look at this. Shares in Mead Johnson Nutrition jumped nearly 4 percent. The company makes one of the most popular brands of baby formula in China.

Still to come here, about 6,000 U.S. prisoners are scheduled for early release. And coming up we'll look at why so many will be let go at the same time.

Also still to come, Apple wants to change how you watch TV again.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

VAUSE: Welcome back. Thank you for staying with us you. You're watching CNN NEWSROOM live from Los Angeles. I'm John Vause with the headlines this hour.

In the U.S., a number of Republican presidential campaigns say they're frustrated with the way recent debates have been going. They say they'll meet Sunday in Washington to try and take more control from the Republican National Committee. The RNC has the not been invited to that meeting. Some candidates slammed CNBC and its moderators for asking what they considered to be gotcha questions.

In Ft. Lauderdale, Florida, a commercial passenger jet caught fire on a runway with about 100 on board. Officials say 17 people were injured including a child. The Dynamic International Airways flight burst into flames as the plane taxied for takeoff. An investigation is under way.

[00:30:00] CNN obtained exclusive surveillance video of a deadly biker brawl from May, in the U.S. state of Texas. Nine people were killed that day when violence broke out between rival motorcycle clubs at a strip mall restaurant. Almost 200 people were arrested. It has been more than five months now and so far no one has been charged in connection to those deaths.

In New Hampshire, a judge sentenced a graduate of an elite prep school to one year in jail for sexually assaulting an underage classmate. Lawyers for 19-year-old Owen Lebrie are appealing that ruling. Lebrie must also register as a sex offender. He was convicted in August of luring a then 15-year-old girl into a sexual encounter last year.

In the next few days, in the U.S., they will start to address what is the highest incarceration rate in the world. With 1.5 million inmates almost a quarter of the world's entire prison population is right here in the United States. About 6,000 prisoners are now slated for early release starting Friday; possibly the biggest one time release ever of federal prisoners. It's part of a plan to reduce overcrowding, but also to provide some relief for drug offenders who were on the receiving end of what is now considered to be overly harsh sentences. Prison cells in the U.S. are often filled with non-violent, petty criminals, drug addicts or prisoners with psychiatric problems and some times, those who are innocent, like Brian Banks, who joins me in Los Angeles. He was wrongly accused, charged and convicted of rape; finally exonerated. It is good to have you here. Thank you for joining us.

I want to talk to you about your time, when you were actually in prison. From your experience with the criminal justice system, how many people are locked up, not just who are innocent like yourself, people who just shouldn't be there because their crimes were petty, and they're there because there is some tough law on some book some where?

BRIAN BANKS, former PRISONER, CALIFORNIA: Right. Well, you know what; I can't give you an exact number how many people are wrongfully convicted -

VAUSE: Sure.

BANKS: -- or currently in prison now for crimes they didn't commit. What I can say is there is a percentage. 95 to 97-percent of all people who have been charged for a criminal case, it ends in some form of plea-bargain. It never even goes to trial. When we watched that last moment of "Law & Order", when they're in a trial forum setting, that's only 3-percent to 5-percent of all cases in the United States. That doesn't mean people are guilty, that everyone is guilty. That means some people are being exhausted into deals, feared into deals or even forced into some form of a plea-bargain. So I think plea-bargain is one of the bigger issues that we should be discussing, as well as the systematic problem that continues to keep that revolving door of men and women in and out of prison.

VAUSE: Yes, we're sort of looking at a symptom here, aren't we, really? What are your thoughts, now, of the 6,000 inmates who are about to be released? We should note that this is a federal prison that, federal prison trial which they're being released from, not the state prisons -

BANKS: Right.

VAUSE: -- which is where the vast majority of prisoners are being held.

BANKS: Yes, it's an interesting move. I think California has the most people incarcerated in one single space than anywhere in the entire world. All of that takes place in our prisons, not in our federal prison but in our state prisons. I've had a firsthand encounter of being there myself, as a wrongfully convicted man, being in prison, being in dorms, being in gymnasium's where there are three tiered bunk beds inside of a gym. You know, and you ask yourself are all these people committing these crimes? And if so, what type of rehabilitation are we providing for these people so they don't re- enter this system and keep this revolving door going? So it's not - I think the question is not -- one of the bigger things, and I will say this, I think we need to eliminate the stigma that's being created around our prisons and with our, our people who fill those prison.

We have built a safety net around our communities where if we see some one with bars in front of them, or handcuffs on their arms or behind police inside of a car, we automatically assume those people is guilty. Not only guilty, we label them as monsters. We think they're sup - they're supposed to be there. Since we think that they're supposed to be there, we don't ask where they're going, how long they're going there and for what reason. We just think that we're safe.

VAUSE: Someone once told me people are sent to prison as punishment, not for punishment. in your case, you were, you were, exonerated. So your details -- your details: you were accused, charged and sentenced for, for rape.

BANKS: Right.

VAUSE: How did you - and you actually served your five years, five years probation. Missed out on career playing for the NFL.

BANKS: Yes.

VAUSE: So, how did you clear your name?

BANKS: You know what, through the grace of god. That's the only way i can -- say it. There was no special law. There was no special guideline that got me out, other than this woman who made the false accusations coming forward and admitted she lied about everything; but not everyone is that lucky. For example, there is the California 12. The California Innocence Project is currently fighting for 12 wrongfully convicted men and women who have exhausted all efforts towards their exonerations. They have gone up the chain of commands in the court system and now they are begging for clemency from our governor.

[00:35]

VAUSE: Just from your time, -- very quickly. We've only got about 30 seconds left. How overcrowded are the prison systems, and, essentially, filled with people who just should not be there. How awful is it?

BANKS: It's pretty awful. Some of the - I've met some of the most interesting people behind bars during my time there. Some of the smartest, most kindest, wisest people, I've met behind bars. Even the opposite, crazy -

VAUSE: Sure.

BANKS: -- so forth. So there is a balance, but I think the bigger issue, really what it comes done to, i saw a mean that made me laugh. The mean was a crowd of people standing there, there was a man on a podium, and he asked the question, who wants change? Everyone raised their hand. He said who wants to change? Only a few people raised their hand. So we can sit here and we talk about all the things that need to be fixed and we can voice all the things we want to see different, but until we make the change as a nation, as a society none of this will change.

VAUSE: Yes, there's a real problem with, essentially, a prison industry in this country. Brian, thank you for coming in.

BANKS: Thank you.

VAUSE: Wish you all the very best luck. I know you are working with the NFL now. I know you've got a great job. Your career is on track. You know, ten hellish years for -- things have improved.

BANKS: Power of choice.

VAUSE: Thanks for coming in. We'll take a short break. When we come back, they're talking in Vienna to try the end the daily hell in Syria. For the first time there's a new player at the table who actually might make a difference. Also, meet Red, the American volunteer fighting ISIS in Syria.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

VAUSE: Now to Vienna where talks to end the Syrian war will resume in just a few hours. For the first time, Iran will be at the table, joining the US, Russia, Saudi Arabia and other nations, trying to find a solution to this crisis. Western powers are pushing for a way forward without President Bashal al- Assad. Russia and Iran are his biggest supporters and so far have shown no hints that they're ready to abandon Syria's dictator. According to the United Nations, the death toll from Syria's civil war stands at 250,000.

[00:40]

New video out of Syria shows chaos after multiple air strikes in a town in Aleppo Province. You can see families emerging from the rubble of destroyed homes. Witnesses blame the strikes on Russian airplanes. If confirmed, the air strikes would be the furthest south Russian jets have struck since the aerial campaign began a month ago. Moscow denies its bombings have resulted in any civilian casualties.

(Inaudible) the U.S. says Russian President, Vladimir Putin, is "winging it" in Syria. The Director of National Intelligence, James Clapper, spoke exclusively to CNN's Jim Sciuto.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) JAMES CLAPPER, DIRECTOR, U.S. NATIONAL INTELLIGENCE: You are expected to know that a decision has been made by a foreign head of state before he makes it. Putin's case in point. I think he is very impulsive, very opportunistic. It is a debate. but i personally question whether he had some long term strategy or whether he is - wor -- you know, being very opportunistic on a day-to-day basis. I think his intervention into Syria is another manifestation of that.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

VAUSE: Clapper also says the U.S. intelligence community was not surprised when Russia started to launch air strikes in Syria a month ago.

Meantime, the Pentagon now says U.S. troops are in combat with ISIS forces in Iraq after previously categorizing the American role as an "advise and assist" mission. Defense Secretary Ashton Carter says the U.S. commander killed just days ago, in an operation to rescue hostages, died in combat. Carter added the American public can expect to see more raids on the ground against ISIS.

An American Army veteran is back on the battlefield. He has joined Kurdish forces to fight ISIS. He spoke Carissa Ward about why he is willing to risk his life on the front lines.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CARISSA WARD, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Randy Roberts has spent much of the last seven months on the front lines. The former U.S. ARMY SPECIALIST, who deployed twice to Iraq, was studying graphic design in the U.S. when he decided to join the fight against ISIS.

RANDY ROBERTS, VETERAN, US ARMY: I felt like I could, given my past military experience and that I had been to this region before, that I could contribute and I could actually help the cause.

WARD: How did you get guidance as to how to get here? who to link up with?

ROBERTS: Um, well, Google. [Chuckles]

WARD: Google? That's how you planned your trip to come and fight ISIS?

ROBERTS: Believe it or not, yes. i just, i simply looked up Westerners who had come over here before me.

WARD: Roberts is one of more than 100 Westerners who have come to Syria and Iraq to fight with Kurdish forces. The internet is full of slickly produced YPG propaganda videos featuring American volunteers. There is even a website selling ISIS hunting kits and offering packing lists on what to bring.

At a small training camp in northern Syria, we watched some new recruits, among them two Americans. Most did not want to show their faces. Unlike Roberts, few had any military experience. ROBERTS: You also meet a lot of people who think this is going to be the, you know, gaming experience, "Call of Duty". They think that just because they understand how to pull the trigger on the controller, they know how to do it in real life.

Always elbows in and tight to your body.

WARD: Roberts believes the most valuable gift he can offer Kurdish fighters and his fellow volunteers is training.

ROBERTS: So when you need to reload, take a knee behind cover. Mag out. Up. Stock in here. Mag out --

WARD: While some Kurdish fighters welcome Western volunteers as a morale boost, others have dismissed their presence as a nuisance. Do you think you have helped?

ROBERTS: I believe yes, i have.

WARD: But some people would say this isn't your war. This isn't your business.

ROBERTS: It's better to stand up and do something, if you think you can help, than to sit back and watch because, hey, you know, it's on the other side of the world; not my problem.

WARD: Certainly the risks are real. One American, Keith Brumfield, died fighting alongside Kurdish fighter this past summer in Syria. Roberts has seen for himself how tenacious an enemy ISIS can be.

ROBERTS: Outside of the mines they place all in the field there to keep us from advancing on these villages. they also have little waddies (ps) and trenches they hide in. So then they pop up and machine gunfire.

WARD: Has it ever crossed your mind that you could get killed?

ROBERTS: Yes.

[00:45]

WARD: That's a price you would be willing to pay?

ROBERTS: Yes. If I got to the end of my life and I hadn't come, and i looked back on this and I had chose not to come out, then it would have bothered me. Like, it would have bothered me for the rest of my life.

WARD: For Randy Roberts being here is a moral duty.

Clarissa Ward, CNN, Northern Syria.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

VAUSE: Change gears; when we come back, Apple TV says it about to get a whole lot better. Details after the break. (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

VAUSE: An English Bulldog who skateboarded his way to the Guinness World Record has died, age 10. Tillman's owner says the beloved dog, who had heart issues, died in southern California Tuesday night. Tillman became a celebrity, made millions, -- made millions of people smile actually, not millions of dollars. when video surfaced of the pooch rolling along on the skateboard, surfing some waves as well. He set a world record in 2009 as the fastest skateboarding canine. That water skiing squirrel must be dead by now as well.

[00:50]

The latest version of Apple TV is now on sale. The company is promising big things for your favorite shows and apps, but Apple is facing some stiff competition from companies like amazon and Roku. Details from our Brian Stelter.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BRIAN STELTER, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hey, John. Now these new Apple TV devices start to go on sale on Friday. if you don't have one, if you're not sure what it does, basically it's a box that helps you connect your big screen TV to all of the programming available on the internet. For example, there's a CNN-app that allows you to watch CNN through the Apple TV box, with interactive features. There's apps for ESPN, for lots of other channels, but also for the kinds of things you're not used to doing on your big screen TV. There's apps you can use to try to find homes for sale in your neighborhood. There's apps look up recipes, what to cook for dinner. Stuff like that, that you might not be used to seeing on big screen. There's lots of companies in this space that are making their own versions of these devices: amazon and Google and Roku and others.

Apple is so big, still has such immense scale that every move it makes is closely studied by the television world and by the tech. You can tell they're becoming more ambitious about TV. With all the new features in this new box, I spoke with a Eddy Cue; a Senior Vice President of the company, about what is new about it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

STELTER: You say the future of TV is apps. What does that mean, as practical matter?

EDDY CUE, SVP, APPLE TV: Well, if you think about when we started we started this with phones, it let things be created that we couldn't think of. In TV that hasn't been available. TV has been a closed environment. You've been able to get the channels that were coming in. You had to get them through a single cable and satellite provider. That was the eco system. Now it allows people, like ESPN and CNN to create apps that cannot just be viewing CNN live, but, for example, can make it interactive. Somebody is watching this interview in the app can do things like; people can give it a thumbs up or a thumbs down. You are on air live. If were getting feedback from customers, they might be asking for more information or driving into a different way and you might air different.

STELTER: Interesting. So you might do a longer segment, if people are really reacting strongly to what the guest is saying?

CUE: That's right. And there is no way to do that today, but the technology is there. This is the first time that it is going to be available on the TV.

STELTER: Is this a supplement to my set top box that I have from my cable company or do you envision Apple TV as replacement?

CUE: Right now it probably is an add-on, for most people, because if you want to watch things like, watch ESPN, or the ABC or CNN channel, you have to authenticate using your cable or satellite subscription.

STELTER: Right, so you can't cut the cord. You still have to have cable.

CUE: That's right.

STELTER: Apple is known for being a closed system. You all try to make it easy to do everything. Isn't it still too difficult to have to bring the cable subscription? and authenticate with my user name and password? Aren't these all problems that the TV experience?

CUE: I think those are things that we can always make better, and we'll continue to innovate and make better. But we've may it easy by, again, having all of the channels available to you. How you subscribe to them today, in some cases you subscribe right on Apple TV by tapping a button. So if you want to subscribe to Netflix or Hulu or HBO, you just tap a button and you subscribe. So, we're already doing that and we'll do more of it.

STELTER: So for most people they keep your set top box. Is the end goal for Apple to get rid of it?

CUE: This is a much better experience for consuming content. So whether you are consuming a channel, like ESPN Today, on your cable and satellite subscription, it's much better on Apple TV.

STELTER: Do you think Apple TV needs exclusive programming in order to thrive? Does it need to be able to have apps or shows that i really can't find anywhere else?

CUE: Well, we try to do; we don't try to do things that are exclusive. What we try to do is build technologies that let developers do things that they can't do an where else.

STELTER: Hmm.

CUE: So, we certainly don't think there is anybody that can do this today on a TV. So, by it's sheer nature, may be exclusive. We're going to keep adding features and functions. It's great because the it's software. So we update it, just like we do with your phone.

STELTER: There have been rumors that Apple is going to get into licensing, actually financing TV shows, basically what Hulu and Netflix do today. Can you clear it up for us? Is that true?

CUE: No. We love working with our partners. We're great at technology and they're great at creating content. We think that is a great partnership to have.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

STELTER: Right now something like Apple TV is a supplement, a complement to your existing set top box at home. Most people, certainly the people that are watching CNN right now, still have a set top box. That's the main way people consume TV; but you can tell, through the comments from Eddy Cue, Apple is getting more and more serious about this television space. That maybe one day they want you to throw away the set top box and go ahead and subscribe to the CNN or ESPN or the cable universe directly through Apple TV.

There's also been rumors that Apple might go into the original programming business, the same way Netflix has and amazon has and Hulu has, by making their own shows: like "House of Cards" or "Orange Is the New Black".

[00:55]

Now, when I asked Eddy Cue about that he kind of sized up the question, said that Apple is happy working with other partners that actually make the programming. One thing is clear, Apple is trying to, as he said, revolutionize TV. It's taking a series of steps in that direction with this new box. It's not all the way there yet. If we know one thing about Apple, and its biggest competitors, like Google and Microsoft, its that they have an enormous amount of power to shape and then reshape the way we all watch TV or listen to music, or make phone calls. There is definitely more change on the horizon.

Tom, back to you.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

VAUSE: Brian, thank you for that. Some are calling it the next step toward driverless cars. Yamaha is showing off its motorcycle riding robot. The Japanese company says the robot can twist the throttle, hit the brakes, change the gears, analyzes its location and route using GPS, without help from anybody who has a heartbeat. The company says, "One day the robot could drive you home, especially if you had too much to drink."

Thanks for watching "CNN Newsroom" live from Los Angeles. I'm John Vause; back for another hour, after a very short break. You are watching CNN.