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Legal View with Ashleigh Banfield
Teen To Get Treatment After School Massacre Plot; Five Students Stabbed At UC Merced; Parents Honor Child's Dying Request; Boy Without Legs Becomes Wrestling Star. Aired 12:30-1p ET
Aired November 04, 2015 - 12:30 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We have a tree out in the front yard that is an old useless tree. And my son made up a little target, he was going to, you know, throw these things at the target at the tree, and didn't see it as a problem. All we saw it was as a target practice.
[12:30:18] UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I did quite a job of keeping myself under the radar, too, it seems.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: So yet, you were still going to do it here in the next month probably.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Oh, yeah.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Put this plan together.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yeah, no question.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I'm just trying to figure out...
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Why?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Why? Because you say that...
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I that there are three reasons why. The reasons I said I did in my journal were because there are three. One, just because it's an opportunity to get out of here, two for fun and the third to follow my idol.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Who is that?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: My number one idol is Eric Harris. He's the main perpetrator at Columbine High School.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: How did he become your main idol?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I don't know.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It just seems like a strange lottery, you know, like the unlucky lottery, the kind that you don't want to win, it kind of feels like that's what my life has become.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: My dream for him is the dream I had. I found him alive. I don't know how long he's going to take for him to recover.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I'm thankful that nothing happened. I'm thankful that first of all my son wasn't hurt. I'm sad that it came about the way that it did.
And I certainly wished that we would have known that something was wrong long before this. But we didn't.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
ASHLEIGH BANFIELD, CNN ANCHOR: Danny Cevallos joins me now, CNN Legal Analyst and Defense Attorney.
The question I think for so many people seeing the horrors that this person listed out for the police, knowing that he's not going to be put away for a long time, because they couldn't get these charges to the stick, especially the attempted murders.
When does preparation end and an actual crime begin in the eyes of the law.
DANNY CEVALLOS, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: The law has struggled for centuries with issue of what we call inchoate crimes or incomplete crimes. Attempt is one of these. On one hand we want to punish people who intended to do things and do a substantial step in that direction, even if they're unsuccessful.
We want to punish the bank robber who attempts to rob a bank, but trips on the way in. At the same time on the other hand of the spectrum, we don't want to create pre-crime, we don't want to punish nearly thinking really hard about a bad act.
So that's how we have the distinction between mere preparation and the substantial step. But how do we do -- how do we draw that line?
Courts are all over the place. Federal courts, state courts as a general proposition, you can say that if something was not interrupting the act it would otherwise be completed. But even that doesn't give us a whole lot of guidance.
When you look at the facts here, you have to ask yourself, how much of this was a substantial step towards completing this horrific act and the court of appeals said this erred more on the side of mere preparation.
BANFIELD: Oh, it's so hard to hear that when he set off explosives to test them and get ready. I mean this is just -- it's so frustrating and you know the pain in those parents is real as well.
And I have to interrupt you just one moment we have some breaking news.
This is just coming into CNN at U.C. Merced in California. Five students have been stabbed, and this is a campus east of San Jose, it's one of the newest U.C. campuses. Merced has just twitted out that the suspect in this multiple stabbing incident was shot and killed. Those students are alive and they are being treated for stab wounds, the campus is closed at this point, classes certainly canceled at this time, very little else known.
We're going to continue to gather information on this story. Stay tune to CNN throughout the day for that, back after this.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[12:38:42] BANFIELD: You're about to meet a 5-year-old girl who may not live to see her 6th birthday.
Her name is Julianna Snow, a sweet little princess who will be the first one to correct you. The sister's name in Frozen is pronounced Anna and not Anna for crying out loud.
But when it comes to more serious matters like Julianna's health, she also has a say. Instead of getting more treatment at the hospital, she wants the die at home, in her pink princess room. And her parents are honoring this wish.
Senior Medical Correspondent Elizabeth Cohen sat down with Julianna and her family.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ELIZABETH COHEN, CNN SENIOR MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: What princess are you today?
JULIANNA SNOW: Cinderella.
COHEN: You're Cinderella.
Julianna Snow has a neuromuscular disease that's slowly taking her life. She can't walk or breathe on her own or even use her hands to play with glitter.
JULIANNA SNOW: I think there's no such thing as too much.
COHEN: There's no such thing as too much, OK.
The next time Julianna gets a cold, or any infection her body will be too weak to fight it off.
What are the doctors tell you is likely to happen if she were to get another cold?
STEVE SNOW, JULIANNA'S FATHER: She almost likely die if she catches another cold.
Are you, OK?
JULIANNA SNOW: Yes.
COHEN: Julianna's doctor presented her parents, Steve Snow and Michelle Moon with two devastating options. [12:40:06] Julianna could die at home in her pink princess room made comfortable surrounded by family. Or she could go to the hospital where treatment likely couldn't save her or even if it did she would likely have a terrible quality of life.
MICHELLE MOON, JULIANNA'S MOTHER: Everyone told us there is no wrong answer.
COHEN: So Michelle and Steve give Julianna something almost no parent could even had them. When she was just 4-years-old, they asked her what she wanted to do, go to the hospital or go to heaven.
You blogged about it?
MICHELLE MOON: Yes.
COHEN: So let's take a look.
MICHELLE MOON: OK, so me Julianna, if you get sick again do you want to go to the hospital or stay home?
Julianna, not the hospital.
Me, even if that means that you will go to heaven if you stay home?
Julianna, yes.
Me, and you know that mommy and daddy will not come with you right away you'll go by yourself first.
Julianna, don't worry, God will take care of me.
Me, and if you go to the hospital, it may help you get better and let you come home again and spend more time with us. I need to make sure you understand that. Hospital may let you have more time with mommy and daddy.
Julianna, I understand.
COHEN: Julianna, told her parents she hated the hospital, but especially of procedure called nasotracheal suctioning.
STEVE SNOW: Basically stick a tube on a suction machine and you stick up the nose down pass the tongue back into the throat stiff as you go and you start suctioning.
If given the choice of me or one of the respiratory techs, she would usually ask for me do to it.
COHEN: Was that hard to do?
STEVE SNOW: Yes.
COHEN: Could you watch her go through that again, do you think?
STEVE SNOW: No, if I had too, I do it. COHEN: Would it save her life do it again, if she were to get an infection?
STEVE SNOW: I don't think so.
COHEN: Michelle and Steve say when the time comes they'll honor their daughter's wishes to die at home and go to heaven over the hospital.
Some parents wouldn't have consulted a child so young, they would've said where the parents. So you asked your daughter at the age of 4. What did you think, what should we do?
MICHELLE MOON: Julianna have to go through hundreds around the nasotracheal suctioning she knows exactly what that was, she was awake for every single one. She knows what it is.
So I think she have the right. I think t she has a say.
COHEN: Juliana's doctors told CNN she's an exceptionally wise 5-year- old, and they support her parents' decision to carry out her wishes.
For now, Julianna is enjoying her life with her parent, her big brother, Alex.
(SINGING)
COHEN: And her princesses.
Are Elsa and Anna, I forget are they cousins or?
JULIANNA SNOW: They are sisters.
COHEN: Oh, they are sisters.
It's Anna, that was Anna, I said Anna not Anna. I'm sorry.
JULIANNA SNOW: I forgive you.
COHEN: She forgives you.
What are your realistic hopes for her for the rest of the time that she does have left?
STEVE SNOW: To make her comfortable and be happy, feel love.
COHEN: What's gotten you through it?
STEVE SNOW: Faith. Whoever you pray with wherever you may be, I can guarantee for certain God will listens to you and me.
The faith that she will be in a better place when her time comes and we can join her someday and this will all pass away.
COHEN: What do you want people to remember about Julianna?
MICHELLE MOON: Her heart. She is just so much love, there's so much love.
COHEN: Elizabeth Cohen, CNN, Washougal, Washington.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
BANFIELD: And Art Caplan is with me now, he's the director for the division of medical ethics at NYU Langone Medical Center.
Watching that story, you cannot, not be affected.
ARTHUR CAPLAN, MEDICAL ETHICIST: They're so courageous, they're so together, you know, it's clear that people think there's a controversy, but they are all on the same page, I have no issue of letting her go.
She has been listened too. The one point that you want to take away from this, is that even a mature thoughtful smart 5-year-old like she is, you don't put a decision-making authority there.
It does go to the parents legally that they have the last call, and they can't sort of say, we're doing what she says, they have to say listening to her, we've decided this. And that's important, because if you went away from this case the situations where kids are getting treatment that works which she doesn't have, you don't want them to over write it, either the parents or the kid.
So authority goes to the parents when it's end of life. You listen to child like this carefully, because she has plenty to tell us about, and she is mature beyond her years, but at the end of the day, parental decision and not kids decision.
BANFIELD: And ultimately with life-saving proven life-saving treatments.
CAPLAN: There you want to push forward and you don't want to listen to child refusals as carefully.
BANFIELD: Art, thank you.
CAPLAN: My pleasure.
[12:45:00] BANFIELD: For that I do appreciate it.
Coming up, we've got some breaking news following that stabbing on the University of California Merced Campus, five students injured. More details just ahead.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Isaiah Bird's mantra is no excuses. The 7-year-old was born without legs.
ISAIAH BIRD, BORN WITHOUT LEGS: I don't let to my way. You don't make no excuses on this team. No excuses at all. UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The mantra comes from Bird's wrestling coach and also a mentor Miguel Rodriguez who met the little boy at a dark time for Bird's family. Homeless after Hurricane Sandy, Bird didn't even have his own wheelchair.
[12:50:08] MIGUEL RODRIGUEZ, COACH & MENTOR: He has been through so much in life, but he never feels sorry for himself. The fact that he never complained about not having legs. The fact that he said to me, I can do it. That's what caught my eye about him.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Rodriguez encouraged Isaiah to take up wrestling, the sport he could compete without the use of his legs. Isaiah started to win.
RODRIGUEZ: He took third place at the New York Kid Wrestling Championships, sixth place in the internationals. Parents and coaches would tell their kids to take easy on him, to take easy on him. But it's all opposite now, you are wrestling Isaiah, you go hard on him. You take him down.
BIRD: Cowabunga.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: For Bird, wrestling is just the beginning. He also taken up surfing, and he's not stopping there.
BIRD: I want to earn so bad, I want earn things. I don't complain, because I do it. I never give up.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BANFIELD: I want to update you on this Breaking News. We've been following at the U.C.-Merced campus in California. Five students stabbed at that university. Merced is tweeting out that the suspect was shot and killed. Those students are being treated. They are alive. The campus is closed. Classes are canceled.
James Leonard joins me now from U.C.-Merced. James, can you give me any further details? What do you know? What are you hearing?
JAMES LEONARD, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, what we know right now as you said five students were stabbed on campus this morning in front of the classroom and office building. As far as we know they were all conscious. Three of them were transported or two of them were transported by helicopter to the local hospital, and three of them treated on campus. The suspect was shot by police, and died from his injuries or her injuries. I don't confirmation of the suspect.
BANFIELD: Yeah. We don't know, right? Correct.
LEONARD: Correct.
BANFIELD: We don't know if the suspect is male or female? Do we know anything about the five student, are they connected to the suspect in any way? Did the suspect randomly attack students?
LEONARD: We don't have any information like that confirmed at this time. Obviously investigation is ongoing and waiting for information to be confirmed just like the rest of us.
BANFIELD: James, I understand that you are the director news and social media, can you give me a feel for what is transpiring a among the student community online at this time?
LEONARD: Well, obviously, there's a lot of activity, and a lot of concern. You know, and we share that concern, you know, with the families of all of the victims, certainly and as well as the suspect.
BANFIELD: And again, I am not sure if you said this and i missed it, but there is no confirmation that all five of the stabbing victims are in fact students of U.C.-Merced, correct, or do we know that they are in fact?
LEONARD: The information I have is that the five victims were students.
BANFIELD: Were in fact students, and I think I heard you also mentioned that this was adjacent or close to a classroom, near one of the buildings. Can you clarify that again?
LEONARD: Yeah. The building is called the classroom and office building. In front of a main classroom buildings on campus, and as I understand it, the incident happened in front of that building.
BANFIELD: All right, James Leonard. Thank you for that. We're going to continue to watch the story and bring detail to our CNN audience as the details come to us as well.
In other news the synthetic drug molly is a popular party drug with electronic dance music sounds. And then some cases the party is turning very deadly. So Lisa Ling decided to investigate and she found some people actually are using kits not to test molly, to protect themselves and others against a potentially lethal high. There's a quick clip from "This is Life".
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
LISA LING, CNN CORREPONDENT: There is a vigilante here who is literally approaching people and offering a product to them that he believes is an essential part of the EDM experience.
That vigilante is named Adam, and what he's selling aren't drugs, they're drug testing kits. It's a simple product that can determine the mix and potency of listed narcotics in seconds. And last night Adam and his partner smuggled in enough kits to conduct over 15,000 drug tests. Adam operation is called the Bunk Police. He believes drug use is inevitable and it's kits help to save lives.
What do you do when you get to festival site?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Hand out flyers and tell people where to find us.
LING: What (inaudible) is Bank? So how is the response to this?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Excellent. You know, everybody has been, you know, happy that we're here. A lot of people are already knew about us.
[12:55:06] LING: How dangerous is it for people to be buying drugs from random dealers out here?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Extremely dangerous. You have no idea where those came from. There are quite a few deaths over year from adulterated substances and permanent injuries that occurs, so we know that this prevents some of that.
LING: So at a festival like where you have tens of thousands of people, what percentage would you say will be doing drugs?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Depending on the festival, at least 50 percent.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BANFIELD: And again, "This is Life with Lisa Ling" airs tonight at 9:00 p.m. Eastern on CNN. And we're getting some more Breaking News on that Russian plane crash. There's new reporting on the possibility of a bomb just coming from U.K. Prime Mister's office. Our Wolf Blitzer's going to have some details on this after a quick break. Stay with us.
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