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Nancy Grace
ISIS in the U.S.?. Aired 8-9:00p ET
Aired November 18, 2015 - 20:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
NANCY GRACE, HOST: Breaking news right now. Evil ISIS`s bloody attack on Paris, but what about our country? What about America?
Bombshell right now. What we know at this hour -- the Paris attack ringleader is still at large. Can he get to U.S. soil? We learn multiple
men and women arrested and charged in ISIS-related plots on American soil! Repeat, arrests and charges on American soil!
This as ISIS allegedly prints photos and brags about the soda can bomb used to down an airline! Could that happen here? With TSA failing 95
percent of Homeland`s secret tests, how can they stop a soda can bomb?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Gunshots, explosions thunder through the Paris suburb Saint-Denis as police launch a massive siege on suspected terrorists
at multiple locations. Another chilling twist, the target of the raid -- police believe the suspected ringleader was actually hiding here in Paris.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: And live, Tinseltown. Movie, TV superstar of "Two and a Half Men," "Platoon," "Hotshots," "Major League," "Wall Street" Charlie Sheen
confirms in a live interview he`s HIV-positive and, he has been for years, Sheen paying literally millions of dollars in blackmail money to cover up
the HIV secret, but reportedly continuing to sleep with dozens and dozens of partners, coming out HIV-positive only after an investigation by "The
National Enquirer."
Well, in the last hours, reports Sheen spending over $1.6 million a year on hookers while HIV-positive -- that`s reported -- forcing partners
to sign nondisclosure forms before meeting Sheen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Have you, since the time of your diagnosis, told every one of your sexual partners before you had a sexual encounter that
you were HIV-positive?
CHARLIE SHEEN, ACTOR: Yes, I have.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He`s lying! He`s lying. He didn`t tell me that. We had sex every night for a full year. He could have killed me.
SHEEN: They`re going to have to reveal a whole lot of proof, you know, because it`s just not there. Doesn`t exist.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: That from NBC`s "Today" and "Inside Edition."
And live, Indianapolis suburbs, a pastor`s gorgeous pregnant wife, just 28, shot in the head in her own home, protecting her son from a deadly
home invader, the pastor`s husband cleared in the horrific death of his young wife. Police say tonight, We know who killed her. And just
released, grainy photos of Amanda`s alleged killer. Breaking right now. Has the murder weapon been found?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Investigators say they have surveillance videos, a vague description of a black male suspect and a getaway car.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We`re serious about this. We`re coming to get you.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: And Torrance, California, a young dad of three outside working on his car comes inside to find his three little daughters dead in bed,
with Mommy clutching a knife.
Good evening. I`m Nancy Grace. I want to thank you for being with us.
Bombshell tonight. Evil ISIS`s bloody attack on Paris, but what about America? What we know now at this hour, the Paris attack ringleader -- is
he still at large? Can his death be confirmed? If alive, could he get to U.S. soil? We learn multiple men and women arrested and charged in ISIS-
related plots here in America! On American soil! Repeat, ISIS-related plots on American soil!
This as ISIS allegedly prints photos and brags about the soda can bomb used to down an airline! With TSA failing 95 percent of secret Homeland
Security tests, how can TSA stop a Schweppes can bomb? These headlines just the tip of the iceberg of what is going down as raids continue in
Paris.
[20:05:00]Straight out to U.S. politics editor, Dailymail.com, David Martosko. David, thank you for being with us. Let`s start at the
beginning with the soda can bomb. Now, this was apparently published in an ISIS-oriented magazine, "Dabiq." What can you tell me about this Schweppes
bomb?
DAVID MARTOSKO, DAILYMAIL.COM: Well, first of all, it`s just a claim from ISIS in their propaganda magazine "Dabiq." I mean, for all we know,
they completely made it up after the fact. But if it`s accurate that that`s the kind of device they used to bring down the airliner, I think it
poses a few tough questions.
First of all, how would they have gotten the components, metal components -- you know, it takes more than just a soda can. This is not
just a soda can full of some sort of liquid that blows up. It takes some metal components of the kind that would be caught in a metal detector or in
a TSA scanner. I think it`s far more likely...
GRACE: Whoa, whoa, whoa! Hold it right there. Hold it right there, sir. Is it Martossko or Martosko?
MARTOSKO: It`s Martosko, but I`ve heard far worse (INAUDIBLE)
GRACE: David Martosko, you said that this Schweppes can, soda can, would contain, theoretically, metal components that would be caught by TSA.
Sir, are you familiar that in the last week, somebody goes through metal detectors with a loaded handgun at the busiest airport in the country, that
being Atlanta Hartsfield? So why would you think TSA could catch something in a soda can?
MARTOSKO: I`m not saying necessarily that TSA would always catch it, I`m just saying that from the point of view of a terrorist, if you want to
get things behind security in airports, it`s far more foolproof to use an insider who works at the airport and to circumvent security that way. And
look, if you`re going to base your plot on the luck of being able to get the one stupid screener asleep at the switch, that`s a heck of a risk.
But I think it`s far more sensible, if you`re a terrorist -- if there`s anything sensible about being a terrorist -- to recruit somebody
who works at the airport to bring something in behind the scenes through employee entrances where the screening is a little less intrusive and a
little less...
GRACE: OK, hold on. You said something else extremely interesting. David Martosko joining us, U.S. politics editor with Dailymail.com. David,
you said that, How do we know that this is the bomb they used to down the airline? All right, they`re using a magazine, which is their mouthpiece,
one of their mouthpieces, "Dabiq," and this is the photo of the alleged bomb, or a similar bomb. They`re bragging and showing this off.
What are the three things? Obviously, we know what the soda can is. What are the other two things that I`m looking at?
MARTOSKO: You`re looking at a detonator switch and some sort of a probe device that would be inserted, connecting from the detonator to the
explosive material that`s inside the can.
GRACE: OK...
MARTOSKO: It`s not complicated. The point...
GRACE: No, it`s not.
MARTOSKO: The point, though, is that they could have used something completely different, and they`re publishing this piece of propaganda to
throw investigators off the trail.
GRACE: Let me ask you this...
MARTOSKO: We just don`t know that that`s real.
GRACE: David, if this were the type of device used to down the airline, would -- I assume it would have been carried on the plane where
the passengers were, or would it be down below in the baggage department?
MARTOSKO: That particular device you`re looking at, according to a security professional I spoke with an hour ago, is an in-person-detonated
device. You would have to physically hold that switch in your hand...
GRACE: OK...
MARTOSKO: ... and push the button. So somebody would have to volunteer...
GRACE: All right...
MARTOSKO: ... to kill themselves as part of blowing that up, yes.
GRACE: OK, hold on. Everybody, I`m getting to around 66 people being arrested and charged on U.S. soil with ISIS-related offenses on American
soil, many of them Americans.
But first, we want to address this Schweppes bomb that has just been published in "Dabiq" magazine, which is basically a mouthpiece for ISIS.
Joining me right now, in addition to Mary Schiavo, CNN aviation analyst, Peter Brookes is with us, national security expert with the
Heritage Foundation and the former deputy assistant defense secretary.
Peter, thank you for being with us. What do you make of this most recent claim by ISIS through "Dabiq" that this is the type of device used
to bring down the Russian airliner?
PETER BROOKES, HERITAGE FOUNDATION: I think David`s onto something. And unless you find a Schweppes can like that in the aviation wreckage --
and this type of can may be on -- all over the plane -- we have to, you know, look at it with some skepticism. It`s certainly possible, but I
don`t know why a group like ISIS, which is going to continue to target commercial aviation, would tell us how they did it unless they want to
throw us off the scent. So I think we need a lot more investigation at this point.
GRACE: Well, Peter, I`m on the outside looking in. You`re the one that`s the former deputy assistant defense secretary. But -- Liz, can you
pull up that recent threat where they threaten Washington, D.C.?
And Peter, we see their faces. We hear their threat. They`re very clear about what they`re going to do. Before the Paris attack, there was
quite a bit -- there you go. Do we have sound with that?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
[20:10:10]UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (SPEAKING IN FOREIGN LANGUAGE)
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: You know, I mean, Peter Brookes, applying logic to an illogical situation, why would they do this? So why would they show us
their soda can bomb? I mean, it doesn`t make sense, or does it?
BROOKES: Yes, I mean, there`s certain -- Nancy, there`s certain elements it does. They want to prove they could do this. A bomb expert
would look at that and say, That`s reasonable, that`s how they could have done it.
But in the same sense, you know, the world of intelligence, the world of war, the world of terrorism is involved in denial and deception. So why
would they tell us this? They`re sending a message, potentially, that they can do it. They want to prove that they can do it. They want to recruit
followers, foot soldiers and funders who might say, This is terrific, in their twisted sort of way.
But in the same sense, they may also want us to be -- go around looking for soda cans, when they actually did it in a different way. So
there`s a lot of reasons we just don`t know, I don`t think, at this point.
GRACE: I hear you.
To Mary Schiavo, CNN aviation analyst, aviation attorney. Mary Schiavo, thank you so much for being with us. What do you make of the new
revelation from "Dabiq" magazine, which is a mouthpiece of ISIS, that this is the type of bomb that was used to bring down the Russian airplane?
Now, many people believe that that set off or that was the first in a series of events leading up to the Paris bombings. Not to look at the
Paris bombings in isolation, but of course, you`ve got the train incident, you`ve got other incidents, you`ve got foiled attempts. That could be the
beginning of this string of terror attacks.
But what I`m worried about right now, Mary, is the possibility that this is going to be used on an American plane.
MARY SCHIAVO, CNN AVIATION ANALYST: Well, in time, what has come out today, with what has come out in recent months -- and you always have to
follow the trends -- as you know, as a former prosecutor, when you`re looking for the crime, you see what led up to it. And they published --
ISIS allegedly published a journal or a manual, a 37-page manual as to how to bomb an airliner. In the United States, they listed various U.S.
carriers. That was a couple months ago, and in that case, they showed pictures using plastic soda cans.
So maybe this one was, you know, a little bit to throw people off, but it was to take claim without showing exactly what they had in the manual.
But it`s very, very dangerous because, obviously, you know, there`s -- if you took the thing apart, the TSA success rates on taking bombs that are
not constructed when they go through -- in other words, they`re in their component parts -- is quite low.
And so this bomb, and of course, the manual that came out that they put on the Internet a few months back would take advantage of that horrible
failure rate.
GRACE: Mary, I`ve got another thing to just throw at you. Sadly, you`re the recipient of all these difficult questions.
Liz, could you please show Mary the video of the baggage handlers rifling through bags?
I know you`ve seen it a million times, Mary. But these are the people that are supposed to be protecting us? I mean, look, right there, they`re
busy trying to find my Timex watch. They`re trying to find my grandmother`s engagement ring. They`re not looking for a soda can bomb.
I mean, the reality is, Mary, if this is to be believed, TSA failed about 95 percent of the secret trials Homeland Security gave them. They
failed 95 percent. How are we ever going to increase the security? That`s what I`m worried about.
Come on, it`s Thanksgiving, it`s Christmas, people are traveling, Mary!
SCHIAVO: That`s right, and one of the best ways to increase the security is reduce the known loopholes, which is have every person
reporting to work, the million people who report to work at airports today and go through no screening. Some of those are rifling through the bags
and stealing things.
GRACE: Right.
SCHIAVO: And then also, we have really kind of fallen off on explosive detection on the persons. We do the bags through the EDS
swabbing and on hands sporadically, but we gave up on those machines that could detect it. So it`s going to be screening the persons because if you
put explosive material on a person...
GRACE: Well, this is what I know. Mary and David and Peter Brookes, I know that there is about a $1.4 billion, with a B as in brother -- $1.4
billion contract for those airport security measures, and they`re not working, all right? Now, what I showed you earlier, we`re talking about a
Schweppes soda can bomb that was bragged about on "Dabiq" magazine, a mouthpiece for ISIS.
We have translated the most recent ISIS video. Listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): We say to the countries that are participating in the crusader campaign, I swear to God, you will have a
similar day that France went through! I swear to God! Like we struck France in its stronghold, Paris, we will strike America in its own
stronghold, Washington. God willing, we will open Rome (ph) as what the honest man promised!
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
[20:19:16]UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): You started it, and it is time for revenge!
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: An international manhunt is under way with raids across Europe searching for suspects known and unknown.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The killer`s pre-attacking staging apparently hiding in plain sight before that deadly assault.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Seven suspects now in custody. Two people are killed amidst all that gunfire.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: I want to go straight out to David Martosko, U.S. politics editor of the Dailymail.com. As of now, the ringleader in the Paris
attacks is still at large. Why?
MARTOSKO: Well, I`m not sure that`s true. Intelligence sources have been telling us and "The Washington Post" that he was killed, Abdelhamid
Abaaoud was killed today in a pre-dawn raid in the north Paris suburb of Saint-Denis. He appears to be one of the two people who died in that raid,
the other being his female cousin, who blew herself up. So I`m not sure he`s still alive. Even if he were, I don`t think he`s getting out of
Paris.
[20:20:17]GRACE: OK, so you believe, you firmly believe he is no longer alive. Do you believe that?
MARTOSKO: Yes. From what our -- you know, we only know what our sources tell us, and intelligence sources are speaking very plainly right
now that Abaaoud was one of the two people killed in that raid. It started at 4:30 this morning in Saint-Denis. They took either seven or eight
people into custody, depending on who you believe. And there were definitely two casualties. One is a female, and the other appears to be
him.
GRACE: Another issue that`s emerging now is the fact that dozens of people within the U.S. arrested, charged with ISIS-related terror plots on
American soil. Some of them involve American teenagers.
For instance, a U.S. Air Force veteran, a National Guard soldier who allegedly plots to gun down colleagues. There is one woman who is
apparently tricked into becoming a shrouded ISIS wife. There is a list of allegations of people getting involved on U.S. soil with ISIS-related
plans, people reportedly charged with sending money and military equipment to ISIS to groups in Syria.
A group of men leave a state, we believe, of Minnesota to fight alongside ISIS, one person running a restaurant arrested for plotting to
send men to a welcoming camp in Syria. These are allegations of people on U.S. soil with ISIS-related plots. Very disturbing!
Peter Brookes, national security expert with the Heritage Foundation and former deputy assistant defense secretary, what do you make of people
on U.S. soil allegedly plotting to help ISIS?
BROOKES: Well, Nancy, we shouldn`t be surprised. In fact, this year alone, there have been 11 or 12, depending on what they decide about
Chattanooga, the terrorist attack in Chattanooga. There have been 11 or 12 ISIS-related terrorist plots in the United States. We`ve had more than 60
since 9/11.
ISIS is able to radicalize and recruit people over the Internet. And the unfortunate truth is, is that some of them are here in the United
States. There`s no one profile. You talked about all the different types of people that were involved in this, and there`s a whole list of
motivations that they might either go to fight with ISIS, to join ISIS or to materially support ISIS.
And it`s very difficult for people to understand, but the fact of the matter is, is that ISIS is able to draw a limited number of people to their
cause and to their way of life and to the destruction they want to cause.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
[20:27:13]UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: French police (INAUDIBLE) looking for clues or more terrorists.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Gunfire explosions rock a Paris neighborhood.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Also, we are learning that a telephone was found in a trash can outside of the Paris attack that had on it, OK, we`re ready. We`re
also learning about something called encrypted apps.
Joining me, in addition to Peter Brookes, Mary Schiavo, David Martosko, Larry Fishelson, technology expert, co-founder and COO of
Dynalink Communications. Larry, thank you for being with us. Explain to me, what is an encrypted app?
LARRY FISHELSON, TECHNOLOGY EXPERT (via telephone): Nancy, thanks for having me. What an encrypted app is, it`s an app that uses an algorithm,
scrambles texts in what`s called cyber-text, which is gobbledy-gook. It`s unreadable to anybody but the sender and the receiver. Just think about it
when you use a credit card on line and when you go ahead and buy something and it scrambles it so nobody else could see it. That`s what it is.
GRACE: So how, conceivably, could it be used in the Paris attacks and/or attacks in the U.S.?
FISHELSON: Well, what could happen is your terrorist can go ahead and use these encrypted apps to text back to each other, where it`s
undetectable to law enforcement and they can`t see it because it`s scrambled through the algorithm.
GRACE: To David Martosko, U.S. politics editor, Dailymail.com. What can you tell us about the phone that was found discarded in a trash can,
apparently, as the attackers went into the rampage?
MARTOSKO: Well, police in Paris haven`t told us much about the phone itself. All we know is what you`ve said, is that there was a text message
that appeared to be a ghost signal. And I`m made to understand that police there used some other information on the phone to pinpoint parts of that
Saint-Denis neighborhood where they wound up raiding this morning. So little bits of intelligence can provide bigger windows into where to look
next.
And of course, the bigger picture is how much, you know, more information can they get out of the apartment that they raided today? That
information might point to an even bigger net. It might tell them where to look in Belgium. It might tell them where to look in the United States,
for all we know.
And to your point earlier, Nancy Grace, we definitely do have a problem in this country with the same kinds of folks infiltrating us, you
know, in the U.S. homeland as we`ve got problems with in Paris. Just today, four or five Syrian nationals were arrested in Honduras for trying
to come into that country with fake passports, and that`s the point of entry, really. It`s Central America, and then it`s up through the same
illegal immigrant...
GRACE: Well, I`ve got another...
MARTOSKO: ... trail and through Mexico. That`s how they come in.
GRACE: Peter Brookes, apparently, phone threats last night causing the closing of a theme park, causing all sorts of problems.
[20:30:10] What do you make of the phone threats, and if they are originated on U.S. soil, how difficult are they to trace? We all see in the movies, Peter,
where you`ve got the terrorist, or the kidnapper or the bad guy, and you`re counting down the seconds, and just as it gets to the second where you can
identify the location of the perpetrator, they hang up. Is that true? How can we find who did these bomb threats?
BROOKES: It`s not really funny, but it`s interesting. We talk about it. A lot of those in the old days, they were land lines, right? Today
they`re cell phones. I think my sense is, and I`m not the best technical expert on this, but my sense is that it`s much easier today because your
phone has a GPS in it and they can locate with the cooperation, I assume, of the phone companies, law enforcement can find you much quicker than in
the old days. They used to talk about minutes, keeping somebody on the line to do that. I don`t think that`s the case anymore. Every phone, it
seems like, has your location so it could be much, much easier.
So I think technology, while it can hurt us as we heard about with encrypted communications, it can also be our friend.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[20:36:00]
GRACE: Live, Tinseltown. Movie and TV superstar of "Two and a Half Men," "Hot Shots," "Wall Street." Charlie Sheen confirms in a live
interview he`s HIV positive, and he has been for years. Sheen reportedly paying millions in blackmail money to cover his HIV secret, but reportedly
continuing to sleep with dozens of partners. Coming out HIV only after an investigation by the National Enquirer. Well, in the last hours, reports
Sheen spending over $1.6 million a year on hookers, while HIV positive, forcing partners to sign nondisclosure forms before even meeting him?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I could be dead right now. I could literally be dead right now because he didn`t tell me that.
CHARLIE SHEEN: That I was intentionally -- that I knew I had AIDS and I was intentionally spreading it. And I just thought, wow, that`s -- damn,
that`s just as far from the truth as anything could be.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He`s a monster.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: You are seeing footage from NBC`s "Today" and "Inside Edition." Out to Mike Walker, senior editor of National Enquirer, author of
"Out for Blood." Michael, thank you for being with us. Also with us, Melissa Cronin, managing editor of Radaronline.com. And David Perell,
editor, director "In Touch Weekly." Mike, first to you. Was this actually an 18-month-long investigation on Sheen and why?
MIKE WALKER, NATIONAL ENQUIRER: Well, because when we approached him on this and told him what we knew, he completely denied it. We gave him
the chance to take a medical test, and he turned that down, and then we knew we really had him. Because if he really was HIV free, as he tried to
say at first, then we could have determined that through the medical tests. He wouldn`t do that, we knew we were on the right track, we already had
sources. We kept putting the heat on and finally came up with the story we came up with.
GRACE: I want you to see footage of a former Sheen girlfriend. Listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I could be dead right now. I could literally be dead right now. Because he didn`t tell me that. He says he found out when
him and I were together. I was living in his house. There is no one he could have trusted more to confide this information in than to me.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Why do you think he didn`t?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I don`t think he cared. I know he didn`t care. It was like playing Russian roulette. That`s the best way to put it. It
was like he was putting a gun to my head and pulling the trigger each time.
He`s lying, he`s lying, because I`m telling the truth. He used this word, I`m clean. I`m clean. And I know -- I know it`s -- but I believed
it. He would come out of the room and kiss me and hug me like nothing. And then sex again that night. You know? We had sex every night.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: For a full year.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: For a full year.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: That is Bree Olsen talking to Inside Edition claiming Sheen never told her he was HIV positive. Now, here`s the big question. Unleash
the lawyers. Kirby Clements, Atlanta. Misty Marris, New York. In California -- I think there are 31 states that have legislation on this
issue. If you knowingly have sex with someone else and you`re HIV positive, that is a felony if it is done with intent to spread HIV. Now,
here is the fly in the ointment, Kirby Clements. All three of us are trial lawyers. The law presumes you intend the natural consequence of your act.
For instance, if I throw china down on cement, the law presumes I meant to break the plate, right? So if you know you`re HIV, and you lie to your
partners like the young lady we just saw, and you continue to sleep with them, ergo, wouldn`t the law assume you intend the natural consequence of
your act, Kirby, ie you`re giving someone HIV?
[20:40:00]
CLEMENTS: If those were the facts, that would probably be correct, Nancy. But that`s not even the facts. The man is HIV positive. He
disclosed it. She`s living with him. He`s got the medication is in the house. What, is she going to tell us she didn`t use the same bathroom as
this man? This woman knew what his medical status was. Plus, he had the treatment that lowered his viral load, and he did all the precautions
necessary.
(CROSSTALK)
GRACE: What you`re saying is not an answer to my question. My question was about the law, not the facts of this case.
CLEMENTS: The law -- you`re right on the law.
GRACE: I was trying to say the facts are going to have to be decided by a jury unless there is some sort of settlement. However, this is
potentially a criminal case, Mike Walker, against Charlie Sheen. And Mike, I`ve been looking at your article. What can you tell me about alleged
disclaimers or special agreements people have to sign before they can even go in and meet Sheen? Disclaimers?
WALKER: Well, anyone who has signed a disclaimer with Charlie Sheen is going to find the awful fact is -- you`re an attorney. You know that
these agreements designate arbitrators to make the decisions. When you have an arbitrator, it`s not like a judge. Once the arbitrator says,
that`s it, we find for Charlie Sheen, it`s over. There`s no judge to turn to. They`re going to find they`re in terrible trouble with these
agreements they`ve signed with Charlie.
GRACE: With us is David Perel, editorial director of "In Touch Weekly." What can you tell us about this document that Sheen allegedly
made people sign before they could even come in to meet him, and the allegations he spent $1.6 million in one year on hookers after he is HIV
positive?
DAVID PEREL, IN TOUCH MAGAZINE: Yes, Nancy. "In Touch" has obtained the nondisclosure agreement that Charlie made all his sex partners sign.
It`s a two-page agreement, and it clearly spells out that it will go to mandatory, binding, confidential arbitration, if there is a dispute between
the parties, and carefully tucked into the agreement is that the person signing it won`t expose or tell anything about his security alarm codes,
calendars, health and medical information. This is how Charlie was trying to protect himself, when trying to keep his condition secret, and the fact
is, signing this document, women had very little choice. The document cannot protect him from a criminal act.
GRACE: I haven`t been able to confirm that anyone ever actually signed one. I know you guys have gotten your mitts on one of the documents
he would make people sign before they came in to meet him, a nondisclosure agreement. I`m very concerned also -- thank you, David Perel, joining me
from "In Touch Weekly." Melissa Cronin, managing editor, Radaronline.com, about this allegation that`s been made that even after knowing he`s HIV
positive, he spends $1.6 million on hookers?
MELISSA CRONIN, RADARONLINE.COM: Absolutely, Nancy. It`s pretty shocking. The National Enquirer and radaronline.com obtained today some
financial records Sheen had for his production company in 2013. So this is two years after he said that he was diagnosed with HIV. And in those
financial records, it says that he spent more than $1.6 million on what he called friendly entertainment. and, according to an insider source close to
Sheen, that covered hookers, prostitutes, and that`s men, women and transsexuals.
GRACE: Okay, none of this has been confirmed by CNN or HLN. These are documents, information obtained by radaronline.com, the National
Enquirer, "In Touch Weekly." I`m noticing there has been no response to these allegations. Take a listen to this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I`m going to get tested for HIV. I am HIV negative. I would never do to anyone what Charlie did to me. That is
giving someone a possible death sentence. I would never do that to someone, ever.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: And he did it to you.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He could have killed me. He doesn`t care. There is nothing that man could say to me. He`s a monster.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: That is Bree Olsen talking to "Inside Edition."
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[20:49:00]
GRACE: Live to the Indianapolis suburbs, a pastor`s gorgeous pregnant wife, just 28, shot in the head in her own home while protecting her 1-
year-old son from a deadly home invader. The pastor husband is cleared in the horrific death of his young wife. Police say we know who killed her.
Just released, grainy photos of Amanda`s alleged killer, but breaking now, has the murder weapon been found?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Investigators say they have surveillance videos, a vague description of a black male suspect and a getaway car.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We`re serious about this. We`re coming to get you.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: Straight out to Candace Trunzo, senior news editor, dailymail.com. What we do have is a surveillance video. This is a still
taken from video of this guy walking around the neighborhood the day of the shooting.
[20:50:00]
TRUNZO: Very, very grainy video. Hard to tell exactly what he looks like. We know he`s between 5`4 and 5`9. He was wearing white pants and a
hoodie that was cinched up around his face so you can`t really see his face.
You know, I think police have surveillance video of Davie, going into -- Davie, the husband, Amanda`s husband, going to the gym, coming out of
the gym, but this couple was so much in love, Nancy, it just seems to me that this man is heartbroken. He has a 1-year-old son, Weston. His wife
was 12 weeks pregnant with a baby girl. I just don`t see it.
GRACE: Ryan McConnell is a neighbor of the victim. The neighborhood watch captain. We now learned the murder weapon may have been found. What
do you know, Ryan?
RYAN MCCONNELL, NEIGHBOR: We know that in an area near the neighborhood, there was a handgun found in the front yard by a neighbor,
and we were made aware of that yesterday.
GRACE: So in the front yard. Joining me, Dr. Sean Enlow, forensic pathologist, joining us out of L.A. I`d like you to weigh in with the
knowledge you have of the case, Dr. Enloe.
ENLOE: Yes. As far as linkage of the gun to the persecutor -- the perpetrator, there may be DNA or fingerprints either on the weapon or on
the ammunition, specifically the casing that may be able to link back to tie it in with the actual murder.
GRACE: Yes. You know, on that same thinking, Dr. Enloe, a bullet will bear the markings of a particular gun. It`s like a fingerprint. Only
that gun can leave those markings on a bullet. Assuming a bullet was found on the scene. Psychotherapist joining us at DrEris.com. Eris Huemer is
with us. Eris, why is it so difficult for people to let go of the idea that the pastor is somehow involved?
HUEMER: Well, everybody wants to hang their hat on possibly knowing who had viciously murdered this innocent woman, this innocent mother of now
two children. And they want to have the end result of what that is, and now we`re completely vague about who has murdered this woman, and dealing
with the grief, you know, wanting to get an outcome, wanting to know the answer is going to help the people close to this family move on through
this tragic, tragic time that they`re dealing with.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[20:57:00]
GRACE: Live, Torrance, California. A young dad of three outside working on his car comes inside to find his three little daughters dead.
In bed with mommy, clutching a knife.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I called her and she sounded calm, like any regular conversation. She was always calm.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Deputies made entry into the residence and found three young children dead inside.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The mother was inside. She was taken into custody and transported to a local hospital for evaluation.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GRACE: So the father comes in and finds his wife in bed with the three little girls. We know that they fought for their lives, because of
defensive wounds on their body. So Kirby Clements, Misty Marris, first to you, Misty, what is your defense for Carol Coronado?
MARRIS: Well, the defense is saying that she is not guilty by reason of insanity, and they have a good case in this instance. In Colorado, it`s
the prosecution`s burden to show that the defendant was sane. So the husband`s testimony regarding her mental state, coupled with the fact that
she was incapable of distinguishing right from wrong at the time of the incident, will give her a good chance of the insanity defense in this case.
GRACE: Matt Zarrell on the story. What, if any, facts indicate that she was sane and not insane?
ZARRELL: Well, a couple of things. First the story`s in California, detectives found three knives and a scissors laid out on the table near the
bed. Another knife was on the floor. And the prosecutor said every time Coronado cut these little girls, she had time to stop, time to reflect,
time to think about what she was doing, and time to continue killing them.
GRACE: Response, Kirby Clements?
CLEMENTS: The fact she stopped and reflected has nothing to do with sanity, in fact, it`s proof of her insanity. That`s all that`s proof of.
She stabbed these little girls. When she was found, she was seen -- her husband acknowledged she was acting irrationally and not in her normal
state of mind. So that information we just got had nothing--
GRACE: Well, irrational and not your normal demeanor does not insanity make. I`ll tell you what`s very convincing. It may convince the
jury. Is that the husband is standing by her through all of this, which I think speaks volumes, whether he ever opens his mouth on direct or cross at
all. He`s there sitting behind her. So Misty Marris and Kirby Clements may win the day on this.
Let`s remember American hero, Colorado state trooper Jamie Jursevics, 33, killed in the line of duty. Colorado state patrol. Big smile. Set to
transfer to Colorado`s front range. Leaves behind grieving husband and baby girl. Jamie Jursecivs. American hero.
Happy birthday to our friend ABC radio host Rita Cosby. Rita, we love you. And thoughts and prayers to Ohio friend Lisa battling non-Hodgkins
lymphoma. Mother of daughter, Amelia. Lisa, we are staying, we are praying, please stay strong.
Thanks to our guests but especially to you for being with us. Nancy Grace signing off. I`ll see you tomorrow night, 8:00 sharp Eastern, and
until then, good night, friend.
END
