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Trump Holds Campaign Event in Cedar Rapids; Former al Qaeda Recruiter Has Advice For U.S.; Obama: "We Will Defeat ISIS"; Trump, Bush Feud Heats Up; Major of Democrats Worry About Economy, Not Terrorism; Is American Dream Still Alive; Volunteers Brave Cold to Help Refugees in Greece. Aired 5-6p ET
Aired December 19, 2015 - 17:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[16:59:53] ATHENA JONES, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hi, Poppy. It is complicated and it is critical because this voter file -- this voter database that the DNC maintains is used by all of the campaigns. But even though all of the campaigns may have access to the lists of democratic voters, each of these campaigns is separately doing a lot of groundwork, a lot of spade work. Whether it's phone calls or door knocking, emails, mails to try to determine which people are likely to vote for them in any of these given states. Places like Iowa, like New Hampshire. They want to find out is this person a likely Hillary Clinton caucus goer?
Are they going come out? Are they very heavily motivated to do so or are they on the light side, are they persuadable? So, that is why a breach like this is such a big deal. I do, as you expect it to come up tonight. A Sanders campaign aide told me as much. But the campaign manager also said that even though there's been a lot of heat between the campaign, between campaign staffers, he doesn't necessarily expect the senator himself to bring the same fire to this issue if it comes up tonight or when it comes up tonight. If it's raised, we expect Senator Sanders to acknowledge that some of his campaign staffers acted inappropriately, that one has been fired and that it's being investigated -- Poppy.
POPPY HARLOW, CNN ANCHOR: What do you think Athena is sort of the number one thing that Sanders can do tonight to try to break ahead? Because he is still really far behind Clinton in the national polls. He's leading her in New Hampshire by two points. What can he play to that is his strength, that can help him tonight?
JONES: Well, this is very interesting. We've talked about this a lot. Senator Sanders has a one really big issue that he talks about all the time. Income inequality.
HARLOW: Right.
JONES: So, this is of course a domestic issue at a time when a lot of voters certainly across the country are much more concerned about national security. You may remember the last debate right after the Paris attacks. The focus shifted a bit to national security. Sanders didn't spend a whole lot of time talking about how he would defeat ISIS. He said, look, ISIS is a problem. But then so is income inequality. Sort of shifting back to his main issue. So, it's possible that for him to gain more ground, gain more momentum and appeal to the world that he's not already appealing to, he may need to show some command of issues beyond this issue.
That certainly resonating with his very avid supporters. Which is income inequality, raising the minimum wage, making sure the middle class has a chance that sort of thing. That maybe something that he can do to kind of pick up the momentum, because he did have some momentum, but he's now right now stall behind Hillary Clinton certainly nationally -- Poppy.
HARLOW: Yes, interestingly, though, the Monmouth poll showed that the democratic primary voters actually are most concerned with jobs and the economy, even more than the terror threat, so that may play to his benefit tonight, among the primary voters at least.
Athena, thank you very much live for us in Manchester, New Hampshire, head of the debate, that is in three hours time. You can catch all the post-debate coverage right here on CNN. Our very own Wolf Blitzer with a democratic debate special tonight, 10:30 p.m. Eastern Time.
Republican front-runner Donald Trump in Iowa today. He polled a group of enthusiastic supporters in Cedar Rapids. How the latest FOX News poll gives him a commanding lead over the rest of the GOP field.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: They came out with that big poll last night. And they have Trump at 39 up --
(CHEERS AND APPLAUSE)
Yes. Up 11 points. So, it went up 11 points since the debate. Eleven. And I said, you know, I wonder, do they ever give credit on these debates? Because we've had the debates. And every online poll there, I think 11 of them. I had them. I gave them to everybody. But every online poll has me winning by a lot. And then you go on, you know, television, well, Trump is OK, he was all right. But then you see the big one. I go up by 11 points. That's a lot. That's a lot. So, we're at 39. Cruz is second at 16. Then you have I think quite a bit lower -- I mean, I won't go through the names but I get a lot of people and then you have a lot of single digits. And then you get down into the zero territory. Close to zero. Very close to zero. That's Bush and others.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HARLOW: CNN's Jeremy Diamond was there throughout the rally. He joins me now live from Cedar Rapids. Biggest headline, Putin, tonight, from Trump, Jeremy?
JEREMY DIAMOND, CNN POLITICS CORRESPONDENT: Sorry, go again, Poppy.
HARLOW: I just said, was the biggest headline from Trump tonight, his comments about Russia and Vladimir Putin? DIAMOND: That's right, Poppy, we had Donald Trump tonight kind of,
you know, he's taken a lot of heat in recent days for kind of touting this semi-endorsement from Vladimir Putin. You know, he's been taking a lot of heat for saying that it's a good thing that Vladimir Putin is praising him. Listen to what he had to say today.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: Yes, he's a tough guy, right, he's tough. Then they're accusing me. Putin called him brilliant. That's not good. Well, you know, isn't this sort of nice, if like countries we're always fighting with, maybe we get along and let them do -- right? I mean, look, you know, we're all tough guys, but wouldn't it be nice if, like, Russia and us could knock out an enemy together, not us bear the full cost sometimes? Like, you know, we're always fighting but I've had some guys say, oh, Russia. How about one of the people up in the -- I wouldn't talk to them, I wouldn't discussed anything, I wouldn't talk. What do they want to do? They want to have a World War III.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
[17:05:45] DIAMOND: And Trump went on to say that they're jealous as hell because he's not mentioning them, because Vladimir Putin is not mentioning them. The other Republicans are very jealous. You know, Trump added that Russia and the United States could have a mutually beneficial relationship given the apparent mutual admiration, he and Putin are sharing for each other. But of course all of this cuts really against what the main Republican foreign policy line has been for the last eight years or so. Republicans have spent their time vilifying Vladimir Putin. You have Marco Rubio calling him a gangster and a thug. You have Jeb Bush calling him a bully. These are the kinds of comments that we get from Republicans. So for Trump to kind of embrace Putin is really cutting against the grain of what the Republican establishment and just Republicans in general really have thought about Russia, about Vladimir Putin, for some time now.
HARLOW: It is absolutely is. Jeremy Diamond, live for us in Cedar Rapids, Iowa, thank you very much. And those comments from Russia's president about Donald Trump came a few days ago. Vladimir Putin told reporters that he regards Trump as a, quote, "bright and talented person who is the absolute leader of the presidential race." We just heard how Trump is handling it.
But our Jill Dougherty is in Moscow with Vladimir Putin's motivations for talking Trump.
JILL DOUGHERTY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Poppy, you know, it does seem kind of strange but you know, don't forget that Vladimir Putin is a former KGB officer and he reads people extremely well. So, I think number one he was playing to the ego of Donald Trump. And then also, President Putin has this kind of tough guy image and that's part of the image of Donald Trump as well. He also gets to take a swipe at President Obama who is depicted here in the Russian media as extremely weak. And then it gives President Putin the opportunity to look like a regular reasonable guy who can deal with any candidate that America comes up with. And then also, he gets to insert himself into the U.S. election while denying that he's doing that.
You know, during that news conference, he said they always, the Americans, always tell us who to vote for. We never do that to them. And he even gets to, in a way, take a swipe at Hillary Clinton. You know, remember, he said, he, Donald Trump, is leading in the election. He didn't say the Republican primary. So, by ignoring Hillary Clinton, he gets to kind of get back at her. You know, there's some personal animosity that goes back to 2011 when he accused her directly personally of stirring up demonstrations on streets of Moscow against him and his government. So, President Putin gets to touch a lot of basis, make a lot of points without even trying to -- Poppy.
HARLOW: Good point, great reporting. Jill Dougherty from Moscow, thank you very much.
Just ahead, what does the former al Qaeda recruiter think of the internet recruiting efforts of ISIS?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Look at the moving imagery, the animation, the vast movement. It's done with computer generated graphics. You see the movement, the very good graphics (INAUDIBLE) skills. This is not done by amateurs. It's far superior to what is being done on the other side.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HARLOW: You heard it from him. The advice he has for America in the online fight against ISIS. Next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[17:12:22] HARLOW: The war against ISIS is being fought on two fronts. The physical one on the battlefield but also online. That is the propaganda war. Pictures and videos posted by ISIS and the forces working against them. But how effective really is the American anti- ISIS message?
Our Elizabeth Cohen sat down with a former al Qaeda recruiter who says the U.S. government is losing this online fight against ISIS and he has some advice.
ELIZABETH COHEN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Poppy, ISIS propaganda has been appealing to some Americans such as the Boston marathon bombers and the San Bernardino shooters. President Obama has called it a battle of hearts and minds. It's a battle that many people say the U.S. is losing but one man recently released from prison says he knows how to help.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
COHEN (voice-over): He admit he was once one of the most effective al Qaeda recruiters in the United States.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I went to prison for propagandizing on behalf of a terrorist organization.
COHEN: For his personal safety, we've disguised his voice, we can't use his real name or show his face or even say where he is. But now Abu Huriya (ph), a U.S. citizen regrets what he did and wants to use his expertise to keep others from being recruited.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I hurt so many people. There's a couple individuals I influenced that are now dead and I have to walk around with that for the rest of my life.
COHEN: He has a message for the United States government. If you want to stop terrorists from radicalizing young people online, get your act together and fast.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This looks like it was done on window's moviemaker.
COHEN: Because videos like this one from the State Department --
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is low level production quality.
COHEN: Can't compete with videos like this one from ISIS.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They are the soldiers of Allah. Their honor is in jihad.
COHEN (on camera): So what's so powerful about this video?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Look at the moving imagery, the animation, the vast movement. It's done with computer generated graphics. You see the movement, the very good graphics (INAUDIBLE) skills. This is not done by amateurs. It's far superior to what is being done on the other side.
COHEN (voice-over): He says, ISIS knows its target audience. It's the gaming generation. So just like in games, ISIS uses a lot of symbols.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The notion is that the entire world community, the United Nations, the U.S. government, its primary leaders and even the soldiers on the ground are in one grand conspiracy.
COHEN: He says the U.S. campaign on the other hand is preachy.
COHEN (on camera): Is this going to dissuade a young girl from joining?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She considered it government propaganda. Again, it would actually prove probably counterfactual and help that story, that narrative that the U.S. is at war with Islam.
COHEN: Another thing about the terrorist target audience he says is that they're lost souls like he used to be.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: -- I came from a traumatized and very dysfunctional community. Online community was very warm and welcoming and then as I got engaged more and more, I met people (INAUDIBLE) that were very kind, very, very, very, very, very giving.
ABU MUSLIM: My name is Abu Muslim, I'm a brother of Islam here in Syria.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And now he has joined this movement and every day he's able to hold a Kalashnikov stand in front of a black flag, pray with his brothers that are like minded. It sends a sense of community. Very powerful narrative.
COHEN: And it also makes it look like sort of a brotherhood.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It is a brotherhood, yes, for them, it is a brotherhood.
COHEN (voice-over): This State Department video portraying a former ISIS captive isn't nearly as emotional, he says. The main character looks cartoonish. And you never actually see him talk.
COHEN (on camera): He doesn't look real.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes -- that's an actor.
COHEN (voice-over): Alberto Fernandez used to run the State Department's campaign to fight ISIS propaganda.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It was a small operation against a colossus of messaging from the Islamic State.
COHEN (on camera): Did you feel like the White House was committed to the mission to what you were trying to do?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It depends what day you talk to them.
COHEN: What does that mean?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It means that they varied according to the circumstances. You know, if there was criticism in the media. If, you know, John Oliver made a joke about the work of our operation, it kind of, you know, caused them to get flustered. So it depended on the day, on the event, on what happened.
COHEN: So one joke on a comedy show would make them anxious?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes.
COHEN (voice-over): The State Department says they beefed up their staff for anti-ISIS messaging. At a talk this week, State Department Undersecretary Richard Stengel said, he knows his department has work to do.
RICHARD STENGEL, STATE DEPARTMENT UNDERSECRETARY: It is a big challenge. And it's a difficult challenge for government. Because government doesn't always move rapidly. And nimbly.
[17:17:06] COHEN (voice-over): Abu Huriya (ph) says, if we don't want any more attacks like in San Bernardino, Chattanooga, Boston, the government must learn to catch up to the terrorist online. No more videos that look like this.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: If we drop the (INAUDIBLE) against some of the propaganda of ISIS, we find that it can't compete.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
COHEN: The State Department says, they know that if someone is thinking about committing jihad, they're probably not going to listen to online messaging from the United States government. That's why the State Department says, they've reached out to partners outside of the United States to get out that anti-extremist message -- Poppy.
HARLOW: Fascinating report. Elizabeth Cohen, thank you very much for that. Still to come, this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
WOLF BLITZER, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Are you referring to closing down actual portions of the internet? Some say that would put the U.S. in line with China and North Korea.
TRUMP: Well, look, this is so easy to answer.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HARLOW: We will bring you Donald Trump's quote-unquote, "easy answer" as he calls it to fighting ISIS and the similarities to a plan floated by Hillary Clinton, next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[17:21:25] HARLOW: At his end of the year news conference, President Obama sought to reassure Americans that the United States would prevail against ISIS. The President spoke about his strategy for combating the terror group before heading to San Bernardino to visit with families of victims that were lost in the terror attack.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PRES. BARACK OBAMA (D), UNITED STATES: We're going to defeat ISIS. And we're going to do so by systemically squeezing them, cutting off their supply lines, cutting off their financing, taking out their leadership, taking out their forces, taking out their infrastructure. We're going to do so in partnership with forces on the ground that sometimes are spotty. Sometimes need capacity building. Need our assistance, need our training. But we're seeing steadily progress in many of these areas.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HARLOW: CNN's Global Affairs Analyst Kimberly Dozier is with me, as is CNN intelligence and security analyst, former CIA Operative Bob Baer. Thank you both for being here.
Bob, in that press conference yesterday, we heard the President also note that ISIL has already lost, this is his quote, "ISIL has already lost about 40 percent of the populated areas it once controlled in Iraq and its losing territory in Syria." Does that, though, Bob, translate into a decreased threat here at home?
BOB BAER, FORMER CIA OPERATIVE: Poppy, I think it's just the opposite. These people are committed as they lose ground, they're going to get more desperate. They're going to blame the United States. And I think they're going to try to make more attempts here. Even the President said, the ISIL threat is not going away. It's going to be here for a long time. And he's right. But I think again, the more desperate they get, the more likely they're going to strike here.
HARLOW: Kimberly, I'm interested in if you agree -- well, let's just address that, do you agree with Bob, the more we choke them off in Syria and Iraq, the graver danger it puts us in here, just because they blame it all on America?
KIMBERLY DOZIER, CNN GLOBAL AFFAIRS ANALYST: Well, I think what's going to happen is, the more they get pushed in Syria, they will migrate. And they've already started that process building up in Libya and other parts of Africa and the Middle East. So the threat will change and migrate, not disappear. And Pentagon planners are already looking at this and watching this evolution. That's why they talked about building up some of the U.S. special operations bases overseas to also bolster them with intelligence to track these movements. But, yes, it's going to be a problem that's with us, as they've said, for a generation. It's as if the American public is just waking up to that and wants a solution now when nobody is saying that's possible.
HARLOW: Bob, to you, I mean, Hillary Clinton spoke about shutting down ISIS in terms of their online recruitment. And that also sounds like what we've discussed by Republican front-runner Donald Trump in the debate which you just heard before the break. Here's what he said on Tuesday night.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: ISIS is recruiting through the internet. ISIS is using the internet better than we are using the internet and it was our idea. We should be using our brilliant people, our most brilliant minds, to figure a way that ISIS cannot use the internet. And then on second, we should be able to penetrate the internet and find out exactly where ISIS is and everything about ISIS and we can do that if we use our good people. I would certainly be open to closing areas where we are at war with somebody. I assure as hell don't want to let people that want to kill us and kill our nation use our internet.
HARLOW: Bob, is that possible, what he proposes, to shutdown access for ISIS?
BAER: No, it's not possible, the internet is just a wild chaotic place and they can appear in chat rooms, encrypted apps, all sorts of ways you can get news. And then you have the question of news organizations like al Jazeera which covers the war in Syria. That has an enormous effect on the Middle East when you see all the slaughter and the bombing. And people are taking sides on al Jazeera. And that in itself recruits people. So, Trump is oversimplifying this. You know, we as Americans look to the internet way too much for our explanations, for understanding of the world, and to defeat a movement like ISIS. ISIS is caused by really, you know, root problems in the Middle East. Until you address those, you can't fix it. It's not something you can fix on the internet.
[17:26:06] HARLOW: But Kimberly, you can understand, American's desires for answers. You've got 60 percent of Americans polled are not confident in the President's strategy against terrorists, again terror. So they're looking for something else. Donald Trump puts it out there. As Bob said, it's not possible. But isn't it possible to better battle ISIS online?
DOZIER: Absolutely. In that you can be more aggressive in reaching out to, would be recruits and doing the same thing that ISIS is doing, identifying people they might be interested in, and wooing them to something else. At this point, the question is what is that something else. That hasn't been created. That's one of the reasons that you hear people from the Hillary campaign talking about building a safe zone in the north of Syria where you can start to see a counter government forming and that can be a draw. That can have sort of an attractiveness to young people saying, OK, there's another side to this. There is someone fighting for the Syrian people, not just ISIS. Because that's often how it's sold to young recruits. Come here and defend the Syrian people. And that wins them over. We don't have a narrative to counter that.
BAER: I agree.
HARLOW: Narrative -- it's so critical here. Kimberly Dozier, Bob Baer, thank you very much.
Up next, Jeb Bush goes toe-to-toe with Donald Trump and uses some of Trump's vocabulary.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JEB BUSH (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Just one other thing -- I got to get this off my chest. Donald Trump is a jerk.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HARLOW: Could Bush back out of his pledge to support Trump if Trump becomes the nominee?
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[17:30:55] HARLOW: Just days after they had a fiery exchange on the CNN debate stage, Trump and Bush are taking their feud today to a whole new level.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JEB BUSH (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Just one other thing. I got to get this off my chest. Donald Trump is a jerk. (LAUGHTER)
(APPLAUSE)
BUSH: You can't -- you can't -- you cannot insult your way into the presidency. You can't disparage women, Hispanics, disabled people. Who is he kidding?
DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I had one guy come at me with sound bites from his pollster. It was so sad to watch him. So sad. Bush.
(LAUGHTER)
No, it was just sad. I mean, it's like close to incompetent.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HARLOW: Let's bring in our CNN political commentators for their take. Marc Lamont Hill is with me, a professor at Morehouse College; and Ben Ferguson, host of the "Ben Ferguson Show."
Ben, to you first.
Do you think Bush, using this language, calling Trump a jerk, is he going to back out of his pledge to support Trump if Trump is the nominee? He admitted this week in his interview with John Berman his team was looking in to the legal issues around that.
BEN FERGUSON, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: I think at the end the day, he's going to support whoever the Republican nominee is. Cannot see a scenario where he would support Clinton or, for some reason Sanders had a miraculous comeback here. Don't think you'll see him actively campaigning for him. I don't think you'll see them walking around or introducing him at events or the convention or anything else if Donald Trump does win this nomination. Think ultimately he will say I'm a Republican and I'm going with a Republican nominee even if it is Donald Trump.
HARLOW: Marc, to you.
Trump got some interesting praise this week from Russia's president Vladimir Putin. Here's a quote, "He's a very flamboyant man, very talented, no doubt about that. He is an absolute leader of the presidential race, as we see it today." Trump responded saying, "It's always an honor to be nicely complimented by a man so highly respected within his own country and beyond." Then doubled down on that in Iowa, saying he's happy to have the support of Putin, why can't the two countries just join together to fight our enemies.
Do you think, Marc, that statement and the support from Putin helps or hurts Trump?
MARC LAMONT HILL, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Apparently, nothing hurts Trump. I will say this. If Barack Obama had gotten an endorsement from Putin, Republicans would be saying, of course, they're endorsing him because that's the guy they want to do business with, that's the guy they take advantage of, that's the guy who they can outmaneuver, that's the guy they want in place to be a puppet or even a poodle of the Russian nation state. When it's Donald Trump, suddenly -- at least Donald Trump's people are saying, oh, this is a sign we're respected, like Putin respects us. Putin has never given any indication he's invested in American politics in a way he wants to see a strong leader emerge. If I was Donald Trump, I wouldn't tout that. I suspect his Republican competitors will say the same thing soon. I also think it's funny Jeb Bush would say Donald Trump's a jerk, you can't insult your way to presidency. That's a remarkable and somewhat ironic phrase that he didn't seem to pick up on --
(CROSSTALK)
FERGUSON: I think it's fair to say they definitely do not like each other. I don't think either of them has the other one on their short list for a V.P. pick, I can promise you that.
(CROSSTALK)
LAMONT HILL: Oh, I got a better shot at V.P. under Bush than the other one does, I promise.
HARLOW: It's interesting, Mitt Romney got into this discussion. He knocked Trump for expressing admiration for Putin. He tweeted this, "Important discussion. Thug Putin kills journalists and opponents. Our president kills terrorists and enemy combatants."
What do you make of Romney weighing in, Ben?
FERGUSON: I don't think it's going to be much impact on the election. I was sitting there going, you know, you can't control what someone else does when they endorse you. If Vladimir Putin has this endorsement, so be it. When Trump says he gives him an "A" for leadership, and that's exactly what he said about Putin, that should concern me and it should concern every voter out there. Look, Ronald Reagan got along, you could say, with Gorbachev pretty well but he never gave him a grade "A" on leadership. He confronted him on --
(CROSSTALK)
FERGUSON: He confronted him on Communism. That's different than what this relationship seems to be.
[17:35:35] HARLOW: Let me push back on that for a moment.
Marc, Trump just talked about this today in Iowa. And he said, well, don't see why we can't just get along with Russia and Russia and the U.S. come together and fight our enemies together so it all doesn't fall on the United States. That resonated with the crowd.
LAMONT HILL: Of course, it resonates with the crowd. So does cotton candy. So does Kumbaya. So does holding hands.
HARLOW: Come on! LAMONT HILL: Look, part of what Donald Trump is doing is showing a
lack of sophisticated geopolitical knowledge. The question isn't can the U.S. and Russia partner on projects. They do that all the time. But at the very same moment, you have a proxy war being fought in Syria, a strategic battle between the United States and Russia for oil resources throughout the Middle East and Eastern Europe. We can't just get along because our interests aren't aligned. U.S. and Russian interests are at odds at many points. So when Trump says that, it sounds good to the people in the cheap seats. It sounds good to people who vote for him, who don't know the difference between a Disney city and a real city. But for real analysis, you can't go with a Trump plan.
HARLOW: Stay with me.
(CROSSTALK)
HARLOW: Wait, wait, wait. I've got to get a break in. Hold that thought. Got to get a break in. Ben and Marc, stay with me.
Up next, just hours from the Democratic debate, it's the economy stupid, or is it?
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[17:40:06] HARLOW: The deadly attacks in Paris and San Bernardino refocusing much of this country's attention on the growing threat of terrorism. But a survey of voters shows more Democrats are concerned with the economy, 46, percent than they are with terrorism, while Republicans are much more concerned about national security and terrorism at 57 percent.
Let's talk about all this ahead of the debate tonight. CNN political commentators, Ben Ferguson and Marc Lamont Hill, back with me.
Let me get you both to comment on those survey results.
To you, Ben.
When you look at this, the Republicans clearly are more concerned about terrorism than the economy, and the Democrats on the other side. What's your read on that, just overall, when we get into a general?
FERGUSON: Yeah, I think usually, when your side's in charge, you usually trust them more to do with problems even if you're concerned about. So I think what this is, you're saying the Democrats, why Democrats in the White House, hey, do you feel like everything's under control, and they're saying yeah, pretty much so. They, look, that's still a big number of Democrats concerned about national security. Obviously, they feel like that's not saying that they want to admit, yes, they are worried about it. The Republicans, on the other hand, are very clear, they don't feel the strategy against ISIS or the al Qaeda, or the J.V. team, however the president wants to put it, is working or effective. I think after San Bernardino, you see that even more so, and Paris as well. So it really is how you are looking at this. Are you rooting for your team? And your teams in charge right now. So you got to back him a little bit more, where Republicans are saying we don't feel safe and we don't feel like you have' plan that's working.
HARLOW: Marc, when it comes to the stage tonight and the Democratic debate, Bernie Sander's message from the beginning, and what resonated so much with voters that gave him such a push at the beginning, is the economy, is income inequality, is the message that he says his main competitor, Hillary Clinton, is cozy with Wall Street and he says I am the candidate that cares about the underdog, right?
LAMONT HILL: Yes.
HARLOW: Does that help him push ahead tonight? Because it helped him at the beginning. Now we still see a gap between the two.
LAMONT HILL: I think voters are still being pragmatic. They're still saying, if Bernie can't be president, do we want to invest in him emotionally, psychologically, certainly in the voting booth? We saw the same thing in 2000 and 2008 when Ron Paul is running as a Libertarian for the GOP nomination. Kids loved him. College students loved him. Young voters loved him. Libertarians loved him. Ultimately, even though he polled high and his favorability numbers were high, when it came time to go to Iowa, he didn't pull the numbers out because people didn't think he could be president. I'm not saying Bernie Sanders can't be president. I'm not saying Bernie Sanders shouldn't be president. I'm saying the gap you see is largely due to pragmatic assessments, which is shortsighted because Bernie can win if you vote for him.
FERGUSON: Here's the other thing too.
HARLOW: Yeah.
FERGUSON: Bernie Sanders has run a really interesting, really good campaign. His biggest flaw is, when it comes toe-to-toe with Hillary Clinton, he is not willing to throw that big punch. In fact, he bailed her out on her e-mails. And that's the reason why he's become the nicest second-place candidate. I can't imagine that he would have a shot at winning this unless he truly is willing to go after Hillary Clinton.
HARLOW: Do you think really -- Marc, do you think that going after Hillary Clinton hard, hard, hard, sort of the nasty politics, as we've seen --
(CROSSTALK)
FERGUSON: Not nasty, just blunt with him.
(CROSSTALK)
HARLOW: Does, Marc, Bernie Sanders overtake Clinton if he does that?
LAMONT HILL: The only thing that will make Hillary Clinton lose this race is if the voter belief that there's something wrong with Hillary, her campaign, or her character, that is so egregious that it ultimately will cause her to fail.
(LAUGHTER)
I know Ben's laughing. He's saying Hillary has all that stuff. But Democratic voters may not believe that.
I remember two years ago, S.E. Cupp and I sat down and interviewed Sanders on CNN. And he said then, Hillary is my friend, I'm not here to challenge Hillary, I'm not going to criticize her, I'm not here to challenge Hillary, I'm going to push my agenda. When you make a claim like that, and you hold on to a claim like that, you win a lot of credibility but you don't win elections.
HARLOW: Guys, thank you very much. Marc and Ben, always good to have you ahead of tonight's debates, just under three hours away.
FERGUSON: Thanks, Poppy.
HARLOW: Coming up, American opportunity. Is the American dream still attainable for many in this country? Is it an American reality? "CNN Money" sent a photographer to capture these images of people saying their children have a better shot at achieving the American dream than they did. He's with me next. Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[17:4815:] HARLOW: Is the American dream still alive? The numbers say the U.S. economy is certainly recovering but too many Americans are still left wondering when the financial crisis will truly be over for them.
Yet, hope is at the center of a "CNN Money" search that sent photographer, John Loomis, to six states in seven days to capture images of people who said they or their children have a better shot of achieving the American dream than their parents did.
He joins me now with a fascinating look at what he found. It is today's "American Opportunity.
It is a beautiful photo series. Congratulations. Thank you for joining us.
JOHN LOOMIS, PHOTOGRAPHER, JOHNLOOMIS.COM: Oh, it's my pleasure to be on. Thank you very much for having me.
It was really a pleasure to spend this time with these people who have this incredible belief despite what we might think.
HARLOW: Let's talk about those people. You captured these really striking sorts of haunting images of people across the country. They are optimistic. They say the American dream is alive. I will do better than my parents. My children will do better than I. What is fueling their optimism?
LOOMIS: I think it's really just a greater access and a greater freedom to express themselves. And to create a life which just wants to fulfill, you know, the things that they can clearly see their past generations and their parents not having that option either to express themselves. It's greater access to education, a greater access to just the simple idea you can have a dream.
HARLOW: Wow, access is key.
Let's look through some of the pictures. You introduce us in this series to Regina, who owns a beauty salon. She talked about her version of the American dream being her ability to afford education for her kids. Did she tell you more about that?
[17:50:04] LOOMIS: Yeah, absolutely. And what we're seeing here is pictures of her grandkids, some of the many now standing in front of the school she lives across the street from. She was able to help send her kids to college one of which got a ph. d. Because she had a great job, that was all possible. Certainly, something that she is looking back on being very proud of.
HARLOW: Let's look at Brianna Carter, employee of Dairy Queen, there temporarily, saving up to go to community college. She wants to become an entrepreneur. There is a debate of wages and fast food, fight for 15 now and the numbers bear out that so many fast food workers today are older and they can't seem to get out of those positions and move up. What makes her so optimistic, that she can earn enough and become an entrepreneur.
LOOMIS: For her, she sees it purely as a lad, went from one fast food to another, more pay, better Benefits and seeing its a shortcut to college and starting her own business.
HARLOW: Bobby Wood, another person you photographed, who says something is going to come -- something I think is going to come as a surprise to many viewers, that he finds it easier to find a good paying job today. In fact, he hopes to buy a house in the near future and you know, though of course getting a mortgage is a scary proposition for anyone. What is it about him?
LOOMIS: I think, for him, he really -- it comes down to freedom -- this is something that happened over and over, people finding freedoms to own their own time and hours and businesses. And Bobby, as a truck driver, has so much more control where he's moving. I think that has empowered him to believe that he can have everything he wants in this life. And you see it happening. He's a relatively young man and he's doing great.
HARLOW: You highlighted, John, the stories of hope and the stories of optimism and these beautiful pictures that I push everyone to go to CNNmoney.com/Americanopportunity to look at. You almost have heard stories of us administration and despair.
LOOMIS: Yeah. I mean, I don't think any of these people or any of us really don't have things that have been obstacles in our own paths. What was so rewarding to me, and I hope to the audience who is seeing these pictures, is that the way that these people have reframed that as being part of this greater goal and dream for themselves. You know, everything can be hard, you know, in looking here at Ray in Oregon, who has had some health problems and that was a refrain of what we were doing and seeing. But instead of wanting to blame anyone for what's happened in his life, he's excited about the opportunity to maybe go back to school and find a new way to express himself and make a living.
HARLOW: Encouraging stories.
Again, just go to CNNmoney.com/Americanopportunity. You can see all of John's work right there.
Thank you so much.
LOOMIS: My pleasure. Happy holidays.
HARLOW: Happy holidays to you as well.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ALISON THOMPSON, VOLUNTEER: And shivering. We wrapped her. She wouldn't let go. She felt safe. We tried to give her love.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HARLOW: Volunteers braving the freezing temperatures to help desperate refugees arriving on the Greek island. CNN's Sara Sidner is there. Her report, next.
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[17:56:57] HARLOW: Nearly one million refugees have reached Europe so far this year, fleeing persecution, many more still making a treacherous journey.
Our Sara Sidner is on the Greek island where volunteers right now are out in the bitter cold, and they're helping traumatized refugees arriving by boat.
SARA SIDNER, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Poppy, to give you some idea of how much the refugee crisis is still ballooning, take a look at this huge mountain of life jackets. This is the island of Lesbos and, today, as we were here a few hours, we saw dozens upon dozens upon dozens of refugees, men, women, children, mostly children, arriving on this island.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
SIDNER (voice-over): They don't know each other's names, they don't speak the same language but they cling to one another like mother and daughter, one is a refugee from Syria, the other an Australian volunteer.
THOMPSON: She was just like in shock and shivering. We wrapped her. She wouldn't let go of me. She just felt safe. So we are just trying to give her love.
SIDNER: Alison Thompson has dedicated her life to carrying for those that are the most vulnerable, from New York during 9/11 to the shores of Lesbos, Greece, where tattered boats filled with refugees arrive daily.
THOMPSON: This is kind of a gentle landing, but it gets chaotic, especially at night. The screams are terrifying for us, too, the volunteers. It's like everybody's screaming. It's so dark you don't see them until 10 feet from the shore.
SIDNER: On this day, by 2:00 p.m., five distressed boats filled with cold, wet people have been towed in.
This family of five says they escaped from Syria with three young children.
"We left because of bombing from al Assad, war, just war everywhere," he tells us.
The refugee crisis nowhere near slowing down. As long as the bombs keep falling and the bullets keep flying, waves of people will keep coming.
But fear is also rising, as new details about the path of the ringleader of the Paris attackers and two others mimic that of the refugees.
UNIDENTIFIED VOLUNTEER: In Greek media, a lot of coverage that one bomber from Paris, he passed from the Greek islands. So I think all of this gives support to the right wing parties, the rising in Europe.
SIDNER: Jason, from Athens, is here to temper the fear, showing support for the refugees. Jobless in the stagnant Greek economy, he spends days rescuing those far worse off.
Hundreds of thousands have made it to the Greek island of Lesbos, the vast majority on dangerous vessels like this rubber dinghy.
Desperate people often running from terrible atrocities with no other options.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
SIDNER: Of course, security is a concern with a number of refugees who are coming and whether or not the government can handle checking each and every one. But there is a great deal of concern here. But the vast majority of the refugees are indeed exactly who they say they are, asylum seekers, looking for a better life -- Poppy?
HARLOW: Sara Sidner for us from the Greek island of Lesbos. Sara, thank you very much.
I'm Poppy Harlow, in New York. I will be back here in one hour.
"SMERCONISH" begins right now.
