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No Indictment in Tamir Rice Shooting; After Ramadi, Iraqi Forces Focus on Retaking Mosul; Wintry Weather Across U.S.; Al Jazeera Reporter Stands by Doping Documentary. Aired 9:30-10a ET

Aired December 29, 2015 - 09:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[09:30:31] POPPY HARLOW, CNN ANCHOR: Good morning, everyone. I'm Poppy Harlow, sitting in today for my friend Carol Costello. Thank you so much for being with me.

The Cleveland police officer who shot and killed 12-year-old Tamir Rice will not face charges. A grand jury agreeing that both officers involved they say had no way of knowing that Rice was holding a pellet gun and not a real weapon. Outraged, Rice's family released a statement reading in part, quote, "the prosecutor deliberately sabotaged the case, never advocating for my son, and acting instead like the police officers' defense attorney." The family attorney this morning on NEW DAY said this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JONATHAN ABADY, ATTORNEY FOR TAMIR RICE'S FAMILY: It's clear to us from interaction with the prosecutor that this entire process was being distorted and corrupted and directed in a way that would engineer a no indictment in this case.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARLOW: Prosecutors are denying any wrongdoing, calling the case, quote, "a perfect storm of human error." Let's pause for a moment because I want you to listen to this. This is part of the 9/11 call that prompted the officers to respond.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

911 CALLER: I'm sitting in the park at West Boulevard by the West Boulevard Rapid Transit Station and there's a guy in here with a pistol. You know, it's probably fake, but he's like pointing it at everybody. It's probably fake but, you know what, he's scaring the (EXPLETIVE DELETED) out of people.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARLOW: All right, so you hear there that person says it's probably fake twice. I should also note that if you extend the recording, the person also says it is, quote, "probably a juvenile," along with the gun being fake being said twice. That was not relayed to the two officers who responded. With me to discuss now all of this, Shakyra Diaz, policy manager for

the ACLU in Ohio, Rashad Robinson, executive director, colorofchange.org, and Phil Holloway, CNN legal analyst and a criminal defense attorney.

Thank you all for being here to talk about it.

Rashad, let me begin with you.

No charges filed. And you heard why. They said, look, that the officers couldn't have known it wasn't a real gun. They didn't know this was a juvenile. That wasn't relayed to them. You say?

RASHAD ROBINSON, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR, COLOROFCHANGE.ORG: I watched how this grand jury process was used. Grand juries are used simply to move the case forward. And the role of the prosecutor in this was to move this to a full case.

It's been said in this country that you can prosecute a ham sandwich through the -- through the grand jury prosecutor. And over and over again we saw that this prosecutor set up this case so he didn't actually have to bring it to trial.

HARLOW: In what way? What specifically are you alleging that the prosecutor here did?

ROBINSON: Well -- well, first of all, he did a couple of things. First he hired, at taxpayer's cost, an expert -- a so-called expert to come in and basically defend the police officers. He released report after report and in many ways spoke out to the public in ways that prosecutors don't do when they're trying to go for -- for -- to bring this to full case. He released three different reports. He went to the press multiple times to try his case in the public as well, showing over and over again that he did not want to bring this too trial, that he did not want these officers to have a day in court. Officers, in fact, that have had a history of misconduct.

And we've seen this throughout Cleveland. It's why Cleveland's under a decent decree. It's because the Justice Department has even found that there isn't the type of oversight necessarily when police officers do something to --

HARLOW: So --

ROBINSON: Yes.

HARLOW: One thing we know, just for our viewers, is that that consent decree has declared that there is oversight of the entire police force now there for a matter of years.

ROBINSON: Yes.

HARLOW: But let's get our other guests in here and keep talking about it.

Shakyra, when -- when you look at the FBI analysis of the video that shows that the shooting death of this 12-year-old, Tamir Rice, and the officers and, of course, we know that the gun now was fake. You've got the gun pointing at him. Again, the officers did not know the gun was fake. I think we have an image we might be able to bring up here just to show you how similar it looks to a real gun. What do you say?

SHAKYRA DIAZ, POLICY MANAGER, ACLU OF OHIO: Well, it's really an indictment on the entire system. Every single player in our criminal justice system has to face the fact that the entire world is watching. The fact is that this country incarcerates and criminalizes more people than any other country in the world. That we have issues, such as this, where we have many children and adults, people of color, who are disproportionately and negatively impacted by the criminal justice system.

And I want to take a moment to give a lend my condolences to the Rice family. Not only for the loss of their son, but for being yet another family that feels the sting of injustice in this country within our criminal justice system.

[09:35:12] HARLOW: Philip Holloway, to you. You wrote an interesting op-ed about this on cnn.com. And in the middle of it here you cite a Supreme Court case. You cite Graham versus Connor. Walk me through why you think that this shooting, this death, is justified.

PHILIP HOLLOWAY, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: Good morning, Poppy.

And, likewise, I extend my condolences to the family of Tamir Rice.

And I would respectfully disagree with Mr. Robinson. The point of a grand jury is not necessarily to bring a case to trial, but it's to act as a filter so that cases that don't need to be brought to court don't get there and when they do need to be brought to court, that they do get there. So it's a screening mechanism.

But, yes, I do think -- and I don't necessarily want to use the word justified. I would choose the words non-criminal or not unlawful. Graham versus Connor says that police use for force cases must be analyzed from a perspective of objective reasonableness. Poppy, we do not have the benefit, according to the U.S. Supreme Court, of Monday morning quarterbacking these things. We must look at them from the perspective of the officers who were on the scene with the sometimes wrong or limited or inaccurate information that they may have. And we know in this case they had some inaccurate information. They had some incomplete information. Under the totality of the circumstances, even if the police didn't do everything perfectly, Graham versus Connor leads us to the necessary conclusion that the grand jury got it right.

HARLOW: Shakyra, to you. I do think it's also important to talk about the totality here. And you've got the person who took the 911 call failing to relay two crucial pieces of information to these officers, that the gun was, quote, "probably fake," according to the witness, and that this was probably a juvenile. Did you think that there should be accountability? Legally, can there be accountability for the 911 operator who took, you know, the dispatcher who took the call and then relayed it to the officers? DIAZ: There should be accountability for everybody involved in this system and that's really what the problem is, the fact that we have such a low bar for officers who engage in misconduct, whether that is engaging in excessive use of force or sexual assaults or just general misconduct. We have a very low bar of accountability for officers or public officials in general. We, as citizens and residents who pay taxes, who pay into these systems, have to be in a position to hold all public officials accountability, whether they are elected or appointed, and that is not the case. That is not the case. And we need to change that. The fact is that not only are people in this country watching these videos, but people around the world are watching these videos and the context of knowing that this country's definition of justice and its rhetoric of justice is not really meeting the belief of justice, the intention of justice.

HARLOW: Philip --

DIAZ: That -- that is not actually what is happening in this country.

HARLOW: Philip Holloway, to you. The family, at the end of the statement that they released, they called for the Department of Justice to step in. Can you talk us through legally where this case could go now because I do want to point out both of these officers do still remain on restricted duty until the internal administrative process is completed. But legally, what can the family do, if anything?

HOLLOWAY: Well, the family, of course, has the option of a civil case. And in that realm, I think they may very well get some relief because I do believe there was some negligence on the part of the department at large, in particular with the dispatcher.

As for the Justice Department, Poppy, I think it's important --

DIAZ: And the officers.

HOLLOWAY: That the Justice Department look at this and I believe that it's important that we have another look at it. I think that the federal government taking a look at this and if they come to the same conclusion then I think that may very well put an end to the -- to the overall question. But that being said, it's much more difficult to bring federal criminal charges in these kind of cases than it is state cases. And at the end of the day, we're still going to be left with this same investigative report and the same evidence that was obtained by the Cuyahoga County Sheriff's Office, an independent agency, that did this investigation.

HARLOW: Rashad, final word to you.

ROBINSON: I think what this says is that moving forward we've got to do more work politically. Not just at the presidential level around criminal justice --

DIAZ: Right.

ROBINSON: Not just at the congressional level, but we've got to hold prosecutors accountability. We've got to build the type of movement that holds prosecutors accountable to change not just the written rules but the unwritten rules that say that when black young people are killed, that folks will be accountable. That police officers will be accountable. Those police officers pulled out their gun in less than two seconds and then they claim that they told him three times to put it -- to put the gun away. They told him three times to -- to respond. At the minimum, these police officers should be held accountable for not telling the truth. But nothing -- and this family is left with answers -- unanswered questions about what happened to their young person. The community is left with unanswered questions. And the community and the country at large is left with the idea that police officers will not be held accountable when they hurt and harm young black people in this country. And that has got to change.

[09:40:15] HARLOW: Rashad, thank you very much.

ROBINSON: Thank you.

HARLOW: I appreciate it.

Shakyra Diaz, to you. Philip Holloway as well.

HOLLOWAY: Thank you, Poppy.

DIAZ: Thanks.

HARLOW: Still to come, the Iraqi army may have momentum on their side in their fight against ISIS. Their toughest and bloodiest battle still though lies ahead.

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HARLOW: The prime minister of Iraq says his forces can wipe out ISIS completely in the next 12 months. Haider al-Abadi, who just announced victory in their fight to retake the key city of Ramadi from ISIS militants, says troops have liberated 40 percent of ISIS held territory in Iraq and he's vowing to completely eliminate them in 2016. Now, the army has set its eyes on retaking the ISIS stronghold of Mosul there in the north of Iraq. It is the second largest city behind Baghdad. And while they may have momentum on their side, this fight may be the bloodiest and their toughest yet.

Let's talk about it with CNN military analyst Colonel Cedric Leighton.

And, colonel, when you look at that prediction, driving ISIS our in 2016, is it realistic?

COL. CEDRIC LEIGHTON, CNN MILITARY ANALYST: You know, Poppy, I'd love to think that it was true and that it would be possible, but I think we have to temper that with a degree of realism, that basically tells us that this is going to be a really long fight. And I think that, you know, if they're going to be able to achieve some degree of success against ISIS, they're going to have to do a great deal more than just capture territory.

[09:45:01LEIGHTON: They're going to have to hold that territory and they're going to have to change the political equation that exists in Iraq, or existed in Iraq before ISIS was even a major factor.

HARLOW: This morning we heard from Colonel Steven Warren, he's on the ground right now in Baghdad, and he said on CNN, look, it took 600 air strikes, some 2,000 bombs just to retake Ramadi which fell in May. What is it going to take in Mosul? Can you walk us through tactically what is different about retaking Mosul?

LEIGHTON: Well, first of all, Mosul is a much larger city, so you're talking about 1.6 or so million people living in and around Mosul. So the challenges in terms of the urban environment are much greater. The other factor that you have tot consider is t hat the ethnic make up of Mosul is completely different from that of Ramadi. So in some ways that would work in favor of the Iraqi government, but in other ways it could actually be a bit of the problem, because you've got a Kurdish factor, you have a Sunni factor, and you have a Shiite factor that are really a big part of the equation in Mosul.

So when you go in there tactically, what you're going to see is that you're going to have to clear many areas block by block. ISIS is going to do some of the same things that they did in Ramadi. They're going to put IEDs in buildings; they're going to put IEDs in and around the roads that lead to major installations. There are a lot more important buildings and important artifacts in Mosul than there are in Ramadi. So ISIS is going to be bent on destroying as much as they can before the Iraqi army even gets a chance to get into that city.

So it would take a great deal longer. When you look at Ramadi from May until now, you could probably double the time that it took to get into Ramadi for Mosul. You know, it would be that difficult a fight potentially. Unless --

HARLOW: But at --

LEIGHTON: Yes, go ahead, Poppy.

HARLOW: But at the same time, isn't it hard to -- I mean you're a military guy. Isn't it hard to overstate what a boost of confidence can do for your troops? Because you look back to May when Ramadi fell. You had Ash Carter, the U.S. Defense Secretary, saying look, the Iraqi forces lost the, quote, "will to fight." Now they have proven otherwise. How much does that help them?

LEIGHTON: Well, first, it does then them a lot. So that is the key intangible factor right here. The morale of troops is a very, very important issue in combat. And so if their morale holds and if it takes advantage -- if the Iraqis can take advantage of what has happened in Ramadi, at least what we think has happened in Ramadi so far, then the fight for Mosul could be a much better scenario that what we expect right now.

The issue though is this. The troops that went into Ramadi were elite forces. The Iraqis have to make sure that they have that same degree of training and a far greater number of elite troops, special forces, special police units, all of those kinds of factors that really need to play in Mosul in order for them to be successful there. So that's going to be key. It's going to be a factor of morale and it's going to be a factor that involves the make up of units that are well led and that led in a way that achieves combat results. And that's going to be I think the key difference, Poppy.

HARLOW: All right, Colonel Cedric Leighton, thank you so much. Appreciate the expertise.

LEIGHTON: You're welcome, Poppy.

HARLOW: Coming up next, we're going to tell you all about those nasty winter storms that millions of you are going through right now. Wasn't it just last week that we were basking in the warm weather? What happened? Next.

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[09:51:48] HARLOW: All right, I want you take a look at this. We have some video just in to us of Officer Jason Van Dyke arriving for his second court appearance in Chicago today. He is charged with first degree murder in the shooting death of 16-year-old Laquan McDonald. You'll see that the gaggle of cameras around him and a few protesters pointing questions at him. Let's roll it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You couldn't wait to shoot a black man! Hecouldn't wait to shoot an unarmed black man.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Come on people, make a hole.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Who cares about him? Who cares about him? Like the holes he made in that boy? Like the holes he made in that boy? What are you talking about?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Keep moving. Make a hole.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Let him through.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Like the 16 holes he put in that boy?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARLOW: All right, we'll have much more live from Chicago in just a few moments.

I do want to get to this nasty winter weather, though. The United States still recovering after a monster storm unleashes heavy rain, flooding, and tornadoes. More than 40 deaths blamed on the severe weather over the last week, 11 killed by tornadoes in just North Texas alone. In Chicago, nearly 2,000 flights canceled yesterday. Big, big delays still a headache this morning. You can expect delays if you're flying or driving today. Here's a look at Boston also bracing for its first winter major storm of the season. At Logan Airport, they've been de-icing planes since 6:00 o'clock this morning.

Jennifer Gray tracking the latest across the country this morning. What a headache.

JENNIFER GRAY, AMS METEOROLOGIST: Oh, yes, what a headache, Poppy. You know, this is all part of that same system that went across Texas just a couple of days ago. And now it is making for a wintry mix across the northeast.

(WEATHER REPORT)

[09:55:11] HARLOW: Right. I finally put my winter coat on, finally in almost January. Jennifer, thank you so much. You'll keep an eye on it for us all day.

Still to come next, Peyton Manning denying using human growth hormone. His own accuser says the allegations aren't true. So we're going to tell you what the reporter behind this explosive story is now saying.

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HARLOW: The Denver Broncos pulling out a win over the Bengals in overtime, clinching a spot in the playoffs. This a day, the day after a lot of distractions surrounding their injured quarterback, Peyton Manning, accused in a cable documentary of using and having human growth hormone, having it shipped to his home, to his wife specifically.

Our Andy Scholes joins us now from Atlanta. Andy, I mean, Manning came out and said this is absolute garbage, his words, before the documentary even aired. The source of it has taken back what he said, saying it's not true. The reporter is standing by it. What are they saying?

ANDY SCHOLES, CNN SPORTS: Yes, that's right, Poppy. Deborah Davis (sic) is the reporter who put together the documentary for Al Jazeera. And she was on the "Today" show this morning and she's standing by everything that was said and done in the airport. But Davis (sic) wants to make this perfectly clear: her reporting is not alleging that Peyton Manning ever used performance enhancing drugs.

Take a listen to what she said.

(BEGIN VIDOE CLIP)

SAVANNAH GUTHRIE, NBC HOST: You're not even alleging that Peyton Manning took the substances.

DEBORAH DAVIES, AL JAZEERA INVESTIGATIVE REPORTER: The only allegation in the program from Charlie Sly is that growth hormone was sent repeatedly from (INAUDIBLE) to Ashley Manning in Florida.

GUTHRIE: So it sounds like your documentary doesn't have any evidence against Peyton Manning.

DAVIES: We're not making the allegation against Peyton Manning.

(END VIDEO CLIP) [10:00:02] SCHOLES: Again, Davis (sic) said they aren't making any allegations against Peyton Manning, but he still was included in an hour-long documentary about doping in sports.