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Legal View with Ashleigh Banfield

GOP Debate Reviewed; Rick Santorum Talks about Trump Event. Aired 12:30-1p ET

Aired January 29, 2016 - 12:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[12:31:35] ASHLEIGH BANFIELD, CNN ANCHOR: Just three days away now from the day that we've all been talking about for months now. And Republican candidates are not wasting a minute making their last push across the state of Iowa, following last night's final GOP debate before Monday's caucuses.

Among those out on the stump Senator Marco Rubio who spoke at a town hall.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MARCO RUBIO, (R) PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: We have enjoyed so much this process. But now it's deciding time. You know, what is it, three nights from tonight, yeah, three nights from tonight -- I'm losing track. It's Friday, right? Yeah.

You're going to be the first Americans in the country that start answering the question of what comes after Barack Obama? Think about what an incredible opportunity this is for our country. You will be the first Americans that answer that question. What comes next for America after Barack Obama? I don't know of any other time that that question has been more important than it is right now.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BANFIELD: So with the stakes that high. Let's discuss the fall-out from the debate with CNN Political Commentator, Tara Setmayer and Chief Political Correspondent for USA Radio Networks and also Trump surrogate, Scottie Hughes.

So Scottie, I'll begin with you. Who benefitted the most from the big elephant that wasn't in the room last night, Trump, who wasn't in the room last night?

Was it Trump who benefitted most? Or was it every other candidate who got to finally talk?

SCOTTIE HUGHES, CNN CHIEF POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: Or option C. Hillary Clinton, Bernie Sanders and the Democratic Party.

And I think that's a better -- I do because I think if you watched last night and you watched the debate, you saw exactly what we've seen the last year, eight years, with the GOP, and the reason why we've lost. You saw a bunch of angry people shooting smart remarks at each other trying to get a dig in at each other, trying to blame the media.

In contrast what we saw a few a nights before at the CNN debate where the town hall people while they were discussing ideas were relatable. They were happy, they were sad, they expressed emotion.

Last night was just a bunch of angry people on a stage. And for those anti-establishment conservatives who were watching that, I hope it was a wake-up call. We better find a way to unify or that's what we're going to be dealing with for the rest of the primary season.

So Tara, I want you to get -- I wanted you to either weigh in on the tenor of the debate because I always watch the moderators like Hawks to see how tough they are, how researched they are.

And these three moderators did a bang up job. They were tough which some people are always surprised that they don't think that's Fox can put three tough moderators into a GOP debate but they did. Do you think Tara, do you think that that is why Fox is starting to take it on the chin from Trump supporters in the far right in the party?

TARA SETMAYER, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Well, I think it's interesting that Scottie just described the debate last night as being angry, divisive, and, you know. And I'm like, that sounds exactly like what Donald Trump does every time he gets on stage and goes off on these tangents and insulting people. So that's the tactic now.

So Trump campaign is turning around and blaming the media and establishment. And now all of a sudden it's everybody -- Donald Trump he is the unifier here?

You've got to be kidding me. He made a decision because of the -- he knew he was going to face tough questions like the guys who showed up last night. He decided take his wall and go home and throw a pandering event over for veterans to avoid facing the tough questions that those candidates stood up and showed up to do.

And I actually applaud Fox News for doing that. And that's what you need to do at this time. Voters need to see serious candidates that offer serious solutions. Not just bluster and just pandering which is what Donald Trump does.

[12:35:09] BANFIELD: And I got to say, it made for a good T.V., I really made for good T.V. and they did four times the audience of the guy next door, even though he sucked the oxygen out of the television networks.

(CROSSTALK)

BANFIELD: Yeah, all right guys, I to leave it there. And not only because you wouldn't believe it but there's Democrats out there too. Can you believe it? They're busy too.

Tara and Scottie, thank you for that.

SETMAYER: ... our guy pointed that out last night. And like Marco Rubio with the contract, which is not what Donald Trump has done. BANFIELD: You're not jumping in with another talking point, are you? Tara, are you jumping in with another talking point after the wrap?

Ladies, I got to leave it there.

Hey, the music started, like the Oscars, I got to say good bye.

And we are going to talk Democrats next because they are really busy. There are 99 counties in Iowa. And I don't know how many they're going to hit. But they're trying to hit a lot of them today. I'm going to update you in a minute.

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[12:40:17] JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: It is a whirlwind day for Democrats in Iowa. Both Hillary Clinton and Bernie Sanders making their final push just three days before the Iowa caucuses. Their schedules are packed today. Both Hillary and Bill Clinton will be campaigning across the state as for Senator Bernie Sanders, he has five stops.

Just a short while ago the senator continued to make his speech to the people of Iowa.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BERNIE SANDERS, (D) PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: There are those people who think that what America is about is that everybody should be in it for themselves. What was life is about because you're doing anything that you can to advance yourself. But you don't have to pay any attention or have any compassion for anybody else. That you walk over people who are homeless, you ignore veterans who are struggling. That is not what you are supposed to worry about.

The only thing you are supposed to worry about is yourself. I don't agree with that definition of what America is supposed to be.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BERMAN: Senator Bernie Sanders there.

Hillary Clinton for her part stepping up her calls for Bernie Sanders to do another debate ahead of the new Hampshire primary, that's a more than a week and a half away. She joins CNN's Wolf Blitzer in the Situation Room to talk about that.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

HILLARY CLINTON, (D) PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I would like the DNC to work with all of the campaigns because that's what it did when it set up this schedule. And obviously we want to be supportive. But I am urging publically that we do this debate next week in New Hampshire. And then I said I am more than happy for us to start scheduling additional debates as we go through the spring in April and May and try to get those on the calendar.

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BERMAN: The poll here say it's closed both sides they essentially tied a new ish, NBC News Wall Street Journal Poll shows the weight is going down to the wire. Hillary Clinton at 48 percent, Bernie Sanders at 45 percent, Martin O'Malley at 3 percent, virtually tied within the sampling errand. Of course, Martin O'Malley's vote it was below 3 percent beneath the threshold. Those voters will have to choose one of the other candidates, and that could matter Monday night. Ashleigh?

BANFIELD: Yeah, but he wasn't given that up though on the town hall. He would not tell Chris Cuomo who he would give up his seat to, he said me. I want them to stay with me.

John Berman, great to see you, keep warm. And thank you.

Hey, John just showed you those polls that had Hillary about clicking the out front by about 3 points. But if you've just looked at the last week, that top two has been flipping back and forth. Clinton-Sanders, Sanders-Clinton, Clinton-Sanders, Sanders-Clinton, it's a real horse race.

And I want to discuss this with CNN's political analyst and editor-in- chief of The Daily Beast, John Avlon.

We're getting close now. So each time these numbers slip, I keep wondering if anything that makes a difference because they're typically within the margins.

So what I want to ask you John, and Iowa called you the human Wikipedia, is with your deep well of knowledge of past elections, have you ever seen something this close between candidates like these two that have flipped back and forth within days of the caucuses and does it give you any insight as to what we expect Monday?

JOHN AVLON, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: What's significant and I think really different about this race, Ashleigh, is that in a feel which is essentially only two candidates, not a crowded Democrat field which everyone is kind of jostling but two candidates with a margin this tight representing two totally divergent political philosophies, that's unique, that's different and I think it shows the fault lines in the current Democratic Party.

And the debates within the party about what it means philosophically to be a Democrat. We have Sanders being of course devout socialist and pushing an economic liberalist based agenda.

And Hillary Clinton essentially running for the third term of both her husband and Barack Obama, and if you dig into those numbers a little more deeply, you see fascinating divides.

Bernie doing better among young voters under 45, Hillary doing better among voters over 45, Hillary doing better with women and Bernie doing better with men, a gender gap, so these are all fault lines with the fact that it's so close with such diverse opinions between two folks, that's different, that's unique and that's fascinating. BANFIELD: I have 30 seconds left. I'm going to hit you up on this debate spat between Bernie and Hillary. Hillary wants another one off the DNC chart before New Hampshire. Bernie is not committing to it. I'm kind of curious as to why the DNC is making this so difficult for Hillary.

I thought they kind of kept her off the debate stage originally because she was a shoe-in, and now she needs the help. Why aren't they backing her?

AVLON: Look, bottom rail on top now. This is very unusual. Usually the candidate feels like they're behind is the one asking for more debate. You're right in saying that the DNC by sort of, you know, putting debates in undisclosed locations on weekend nights was trying to strengthen the hand of the presumed frontrunner.

[12:45:11] The fact that Hillary is asking and lobbying for more debates right now speaks to a real anxiety among her team and a belief that this could be a long, long race.

BANFIELD: John Avlon, it's good that you have a long, long deal with us because I'll be talking to you again soon. Thank you, sir.

Hey, by the way, be sure to tune in to CNN on Monday for all day coverage of the Iowa caucuses. It's the first real votes are cast in this presidential election.

And coming up next, it is really not the prevailing wisdom that Rick Santorum was going to win the Iowa caucuses on Monday. But, you know, something, hardly anybody expected him to win in 2012, including the pollster and the pundits and boy, were they wrong. He showed them he won it. He is hoping for a repeat, and there he is live to talk to me about how he's going to do it this time with one big elephant on the ballot being Mr. Trump.

We're back after this.

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[12:50:04] BANFIELD: He won the Iowa caucuses in 2012, and Monday despite with all the polls say former Pennsylvania Senator Rick Santorum is hoping for a repeat performance.

The problem is last time around there was someone who wasn't in the picture and it's a big, big, big someone, Donald Trump. Donald Trump also wasn't in the picture in last night's debate. And after Senator Santorum was finished with the undercard debate, he went down the street, and he took the stage along side Donald Trump at Trump's veteran's event. Have a peek.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

RICK SANTORUM, (R) PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Not to be offense about stand a little bit over here so I'm not photographed with the Trump sign. I'm supporting another candidate for president.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BANFIELD: That candidate, of course, would be himself.

And Former Pennsylvania Senator Rick Santorum, kind enough to bring the call and join me now live, senator thank you for being on the program today.

I have watched that moment. And the first thing I thought it was like I cannot wait to ask the senator if you stood aside from the trump sign, why on earth would you even go to the stage that had flags of Trump everywhere?

This is your competition. Why jump on stage with him?

SANTORUM: Well, it had American flag Ashleigh, number one the only Trump sign that I saw was the sign in front of the podium.

BANFIELD: Yeah, it was a pretty significant Trump event, a branded Trump event. A highly controversial Trump event, it was all Trump.

SANTORUM: Well, look, I -- the way I looked it was simply this. You know, if someone asks me to attend an event to help raise money for veterans and highlight the plight of our veterans in this country and the problems with their V.A. and the like, you know, I -- and I'm someone who has a son in the air force. I've got -- I grew up on V.A. grounds. My both -- my parents worked for the Veteran's Hospital for 40 years. And I grew -- like I said, I lived on hospital property when I was a kid.

Veterans are near and dear to my heart. And as I mentioned last night at the debate, I had nothing going on at 8:30 last night here. There was -- I was in an earlier debate. So I was going to come and support our veterans. And as I said, if you didn't continue on, but if you would have listened to my speech, I talked about what we have to do to reform the V.A.

And, you know, the fact that we're losing 22 vets a day who commit suicide, this is a serious problem.

And if I could bring attention to that I was going to do that. And that's why I went.

BANFIELD: So and I will say you're right. I wish I could've run your entire soundbyte but we didn't running anything, we'll have to be either -- it's just that we're hour long show. So I have to be judicious system ...

SANTORUM: Oh no, I understand that.

BANFIELD: So I got a big question for you, and it's all about 2012. You and I have actually met on this program before and talked about the amazing race that was Iowa 2012. You did it. You nailed it. No one thought you would, but you did.

And now here you are again. But there was no Trump back then. And then here's the other thing, you know, Romney was 24 percent and you were 15 so you did a great jump there.

But right now in the latest NBC Wall Street Journal Maris poll, you're polling less than 1 percent. Do you really still think, and I want you to be honest, senator. Do you really still think that you can win Iowa?

SANTORUM: I think there's going to be a big, big surprise on Monday night. I really do. I think that there's lot of folks out there who are having a lot of second guessing, particularly after the events of this week about the frontrunners.

And I think you saw it at the debate last night with one of the frontrunners. I think a lot of folks are starting to think about "Well, you know, well this is real bullets. So this is actually we're going to recommend to the country who should be the commander-in- chief, who should be the president of this country."

And I think Iowans will take that responsibility seriously that I did a great job four years ago as you mention when they have that decision, they put forward someone who is a fighter and we need a fighter, we need someone to shake things up. That's what Republicans are looking for.

But how about someone who can shake things up and build things. You know, someone who can help bigot by Partisan support or things like welfare reform and health savings accounts and Iran sanctions and all the things that I've proven that I can do. I think that's what's going to help win the day for us tomorrow on Monday.

BANFIELD: So I can I ask you. And I only have a short time left here. But how much of what's been going on in this wild ride that is Donald Trump in the last several months, have you been watching, and tailoring and realizing things are different in America and Republicans want something different. How is that change you and find tuned what you've been doing to try to get the headway?

SANTORUM: I'll be honest with you. If you look at what Donald Trump is doing. There's a lot of what he is saying and doing that actually is things that I said and did four years ago when I actually kicked off my campaign doing. Talking about, you know, restoring our manufacturing prowess in this country.

I went around with a, you know, and with the campaign economic plan four years ago that talked about making America the number one manufacturing in the world. I kicked off my campaign in May of this year from a factory floor in Western Pennsylvania, his issue on immigration.

[12:55:12] One of the immigration group yesterday tweeted out. You know, when the campaign began, Rick Santorum was the only A when it came to, you know, Conservative policies and immigration. And the next closest person was a C.

Now that you have two A's, three B's, I mean everybody has moved in our direction. So in some respects, you know, I can take it as flattery that people have begun to address some of the issues that I have been talking about. And, you know, and I think that's a good thing. I don't see that as a bad thing. But it makes for tough competition.

BANFIELD: Senator, it's good of you to be with us. I thank you. And I appreciate you getting out there in the cold to talk to us too. We're going to watch. And hopefully you'll come back on Monday. How about that live invitation, will you come back on Monday?

SANTORUM: I'll -- if I can fit it in, absolutely, yeah. I would love to come back.

BANFIELD: Thank you. By the way make sure to tune folks Senator Santorum, thank you again. We're going to have coverage of the presidential candidate, Ted Cruz, Marco Rubio, Bernie Sanders, all are going to join Jake Tapper on the State of the Union this Sunday 9:00 a.m. eastern time. Thanks for watching everyone.

Wolf starts right after this quick break.

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WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: Hello. I'm Wolf Blitzer. It's noon in Des Moines, Iowa. It's 1:00 p.m. here in Washington D.C. It's 4:00 p.m. in Rio de Janeiro, Brazil. Wherever are you watching from around the world, thanks very much for joining us.

[13:00:13] We're counting down on the first official vote of the 2016 --