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Bernie Sanders Interview; Santorum to Drop Out; Trump Accuses Cruz; Candidates Target Rubio; Aired 2-2:30p ET

Aired February 03, 2016 - 14:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[14:00:00] SEN. BERNIE SANDERS (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: What all of that means.

WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: She also says she's a progressive. She says she gets things done. You said - just recently you said she's a progressive on some days, to which she replied - and I'm going to play the clip for you, senator. Listen to this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

HILLARY CLINTON (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Little disappointed, to be honest, yesterday. It was kind of a low blow when Senator Sanders said in response to a question, well, you know, maybe she's a progressive on, you know, some days. We've been fighting the progressive fight and getting results for people for years! So I hope we keep it on the issues because if it's about our records, hey, I'm going to win by a landslide on Tuesday.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: All right, you just heard what she said. I'll repeat it. She said, because if it's about our records, hey, I'm going to win by a landslide on Tuesday. Your reaction?

SANDERS: Well, let's talk about - OK, let me talk about two things. What I said is simply repeating what she said. I believe, if I'm not mistaken, she was in the Midwest. And what she said is, I am a moderate. I'm not - that's what she said. Some days she says she's a progressive. On that particular day she said she's a moderate. And you can be a moderate. That's fine. You can be a progressive. But you can't be a moderate and a progressive.

Second point, Wolf, is, most progressives that I know really do not raise millions of dollars from Wall Street. Most progressives that I know are firm from day one in opposition to the Trans-Pacific Partnership, the TPP agreement. They didn't have to think about it a whole lot. They were opposed to the Keystone pipeline from day one. Didn't have to vacillate on that issue. Most progressives historically were against the war in Iraq. Most progressives were against the so- called Defense of Marriage Act way back in 1996. Those are issues that, you know, Secretary Clinton has not been all that progressive about.

BLITZER: She does say she's been a progressive since she finished law school and went to work for the Children's Defense Fund. You've heard her say that many times, right?

SANDERS: Right. And I applaud her work. Look, I mean God only knows we have the highest rate of childhood poverty of any major country on earth. Half the kids in our public schools are on free or reduced lunch programs. We need a lot of work for our children and I applaud the secretary for her work on kids and for many, many other areas.

But I think in terms of comparing records, you're looking at the guy who took on Wall Street and opposed deregulation, who today believes we've got to break up these huge financial institutions, which, once again, are too big to fail. You're looking at the guy who does believe that health care in America is a right of all people and wants to pass a Medicare for all single payer system. You're looking at the guy, unlike Secretary Clinton, who believes that we should expand Social Security benefits by lifting the cap on taxable income. You're looking at the guy who believes we should raise the minimum wage to $15 an hour and create millions of good paying jobs by rebuilding our crumbling infrastructure. And you're looking at somebody who's not just talking the talk on campaign finance. I am walking the walk, as you've just mentioned. I don't have a super PAC. I don't want Wall Street money. Those are some very substantial differences between Secretary Clinton and myself.

BLITZER: A quick couple questions before I let you go, senator. I know you've got a lot going on, including that CNN town hall tonight with Anderson Cooper and the voters in New Hampshire. You now say you will be participating in that Democratic presidential debate tomorrow night. Did you get the - the commitments from Secretary Clinton you wanted about three additional Democratic presidential debates down the road?

SANDERS: Yes. To the best of my knowledge, we have. We didn't get all of the commitments that I wanted. We got California. We got Michigan. And that's good. I wanted a debate in New York City. Secretary Clinton represented New York state, I believe, for seven years in the Senate. New York City is our largest city. I would have loved to have a debate in that city but Secretary Clinton has not agreed to do that. But I believe we're looking at a debate perhaps in Pennsylvania or somewhere else. But we do have her commitment, as I understand it, for three additional debates.

BLITZER: All right, good. That's good to hear. The American public likes these debates, clearly.

One final question. I get this from some of our supporters. Now, you're 74-year-old. Young people love you out there. They came out overwhelmingly for you. And a lot of these people are wondering, why did you wait so long to run for president of the United - why didn't you run four years ago, eight years ago, 12 years ago? Why now?

[14:05:00] SANDERS: Wolf, you know, I am running for president of the United States, as I said many, many times, not for - because I wake up in the morning and say, boy, Bernie Sanders has to be president. That's not it. I'm running for president because the crises facing this country, income and wealth inequality, the disappearance of the American middle class, a corrupt campaign finance system, the horrendous dangers of climate change, a broken criminal justice system, et cetera. The problems are so severe that I honestly believe in my heart, as somebody who respects and likes Secretary Clinton, you know, media tries to create this, you know, attack mode. I respect her. But I just believe it is too late for establishment politics and establishment economics. We need leadership now, which is prepared to take on corporate America, whose greed has done so much damage to this country, taking on Wall Street. That's what we need, and that's why I'm running.

BLITZER: All right, senator, thanks so much for joining us. Senator Bernie Sanders. We'll see you at the CNN town hall later on tonight in New Hampshire.

SANDERS: Thank you very much.

BLITZER: Thank you.

SANDERS: And coming up, we're going to hear from the Clinton press secretary, Brian Fallon (ph). He'll be talking to Brooke Baldwin. That's come up. So stay tuned for that.

And joining us now, a little discussion of what we just heard. Joining us, our political strategist, the former executive director of the Congressional Black Caucus, Angela Rye, and CNN political commentator S.E. Cupp.

Guys, so - look, S.E., your immediate reaction to what we just heard, the differences between Bernie Sanders and Hillary Clinton?

S.E. CUPP, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Well, he did a great job of laying them out. I think what might be a little too late is his decision to really go after Hillary Clinton and not all that decisively. You heard him there when you asked him about the super PAC and accepting money. Hillary Clinton, you know, accepting money from Wall Street. And he said I'm not going to - I'll let the American people fill in, you know, that - that decision, make their - make up their own minds.

Hillary Clinton and her surrogates have been brutal against Bernie. She says she wants to talk about the issues. She's insinuated that he's sexist. She had one campaign surrogate insinuate that he's racist. You know, it's time for Bernie, if he actually wants to get these messages across and actually wants to be president, to really take her on. And he's just unwilling to do that.

BLITZER: Angela.

ANGELA RYE, POLITICAL STRATEGIST: So I - I disagree kind of. I think that he has taken her on. And I think this latest line of attack about her being a progressive sometimes and moderate sometimes will be particularly effective when you think about the folks who said, when they were going into the caucuses that they would support Bernie Sanders. Eighty-four percent of young people are doing that because -

CUPP: Right. RYE: Some of them are very, very idealistic, and in some ways maybe unrealistically optimistic. I think the other challenge that you have is, when people start digging into the actual numbers, when Senator Clinton was in the Senate with Bernie Sanders, their voting records were pretty closely aligned. We're talking about a 39 percent voting record that was the same. So I think that he's going to have to drill down and focus on where those differences are and what matters now.

I think that one other challenge that I have, and I hear this every time he talks is, the campaign finance reform is - I don't think that's a top five issue for the American people.

CUPP: Right.

RYE: It sound good, but I don't know how much that resonates.

CUPP: Right.

BLITZER: Well, he did underscore several difference -

RYE: Yes.

BLITZER: Between Hillary Clinton and Bernie Sanders.

Guys, stand by.

You can see a whole lot more of Bernie Sanders and Hillary Clinton later tonight. Both of these Democratic presidential candidates will take part in a CNN presidential town hall in Derry, New Hampshire. It will be moderated by Anderson Cooper. Once again, tonight, 9:00 p.m. Eastern, right here on CNN.

All right, we've got some breaking news out there on the Republican presidential campaign trail. Sources now telling CNN that the former Pennsylvania senator, Rick Santorum, is preparing to drop out of the race for the White House. He's expected to make the official announcement later this evening. This decision comes just hours after Kentucky Senator Rand Paul announced he was also suspending his presidential campaign.

John King is our CNN chief national correspondent, the anchor of CNN's "Inside Politics." He's joining us on the phone.

John, you - you've got the news, you broke the news. Tell us what you know.

JOHN KING, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (via telephone): Good afternoon, Wolf.

Yes, I'm told by two Republican sources involved in this that Senator Santorum will do a television interview tonight on another network and he will announce he is suspending his campaign for the presidency. I'm also told he's planning to endorse as he does that interview tonight. We don't have it firm yet who he will endorse. We don't have the sourcing on that yet, so I'll refrain from getting into that speculation. But as you noted, we lost Rand Paul from the Republican race this morning, and now Senator Santorum will exit tonight (INAUDIBLE) after very disappointing. He came in at the bottom of the pack in Iowa, a state he won four years ago narrowly over Mitt Romney. So he was planning to go on to South Carolina. He had a schedule of events in South Carolina. The original plan was skip New Hampshire and go to the more conservative state of South Carolina. But I'm told they did a reassessment and just realized that, a, there's not a viable path to the nomination and, b, fundraising has dried up substantially because of his struggles with the polls.

[14:10:07] So tonight Rick Santorum will join Rand Paul, exit the race. And unlike Senator Paul, who says he's not planning to endorse, at least in the short term, Senator Santorum will give another candidate his blessing tonight.

BLITZER: We'll see who that is. John King breaking the news for us. John, thanks very much.

Rick Santorum will suspend his presidential campaign. Earlier, we heard Mike Huckabee announce he's suspending his campaign earlier this morning. Rand Paul, that news was first broken on CNN as well, that he was suspending his campaign. We'll watch all of this.

That's it for me. Thanks so much for watching. I'll be back 5:00 p.m. Eastern. A lot more news coming up in "The Situation Room."

In the meantime, let's go to Brooke Baldwin. She's got much more news coming up right now.

Brooke.

BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN ANCHOR: All right, Wolf, thank you so much. Good to be with you on this Wednesday. I'm Brooke Baldwin. We'll take it here.

Also breaking in the Republican race today, Donald Trump calling for a new election in Iowa, accusing Ted Cruz of fraud. Hear how Cruz is responding to that.

Also, a pretty stunning turn in Jeb Bush's presidential hopes. Some of his allies on Capitol Hill now making a big admission about Bush's fall. And one columnist suggesting Hillary Clinton should skip New Hampshire all together, something she says is not going to happen. We'll debate that. You're watching CNN's special live coverage. Back in a flash.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[4:15:23] BALDWIN: All right, and we're back. You're watching CNN here. Thank you so much for being with me. I'm Brooke Baldwin.

I have more breaking news in the world of politics today. In the wake of those Iowa caucuses, a couple of Republicans have officially dropped out of the race. As you know, Huckabee and Paul, and now we're learning from John King, according to two of his sources, we now know that former Pennsylvania Senator Rick Santorum will be dropping out of the race. He's expected to make an endorsement as he leaves the race. Who will he throw his support behind?

Let me bring in MJ Lee, one of our intrepid political correspondents, who's been out and about on the trail. Also standing by with me is Daniel Newhauser, a correspondent for "The National Journal" for his response as well.

But, MJ, to you first. Tell me more. What do we know about this Rick Santorum news? And, you know, I think Rick Santorum, the last time we really saw him beyond Iowa, was standing behind Donald Trump at that fundraiser the night of the debate.

MJ LEE, CNN POLITICS REPORTER: Yes, that's right, Brooke. So the field is really starting to winnow at this point in the race. As you said, Rick Santorum is going to drop out of the 2016 race, as our John King is reporting. And he may be making an announcement around the time that he does that. From what we know, he is going to make that announcement tonight.

Of course, important to keep in mind, Rick Santorum, he is the guy that won Iowa just four years ago. And four years later, he finds himself in a very different situation. He finished at the bottom of the pack two days ago in Iowa, did not do as - certainly not as well as he did four years ago when he actually won the state. And I think the question for him, really, and for these other candidates that have dropped out, like Mike Huckabee, like Rand Paul, was, is there a lane for me in this crowded race? And clearly the decision for Santorum ultimately was that there was not a lane for him and there was not a path forward.

But whoever he does end up endorsing, that could be a pretty powerful endorsement. The guy that - who won Iowa four years ago -

BALDWIN: Right.

LEE: Who has clout among the conservative evangelicals, that's something definitely for us to be watching out for carefully.

BALDWIN: MJ, stand by. I have more for you. But, Daniel, just your - your reaction to this news, a, and, b, who do you think Senator Santorum endorses?

DANIEL NEWHAUSER, CORRESPONDENT, NATIONAL JOURNAL: Well, we know that Santorum has really staked his claim to the evangelical pro-life Christian values segment of the Republican Party. So I think that he would almost certainly only align himself with somebody who - who would sort of espouse the same principles and who he could perhaps bring some of his evangelical voters and other people who care about pro-life matters such as that.

BALDWIN: So Ted Cruz?

NEWHAUSER: I mean, it's a possibility. But like MJ said, you know, we saw him at the Trump rally. But I would - I would have to put it between one of those two guys, especially since they finished pretty highly in Iowa.

BALDWIN: Hmm. OK, Daniel, stay with me.

MJ, ping-ponging back to you. I wanted to ask you about this. We know that Donald Trump, he is calling out Ted Cruz, accusing him of stealing the Iowa caucuses, committing voter fraud to defeat him. This morning Trump tweeted this. Let me read it for everyone. Quote, "based on the fraud committed by Senator Ted Cruz during the Iowa caucus, either a new election should take place or Cruz's results nullified." It didn't end there. I want you to hear what Trump said today in an interview on a Boston radio show.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE (voice-over): What he did is - is unthinkable. He said the man has just left the race. And he said it during the caucus.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Right.

TRUMP: So - and then when the clarification - when a statement was put up by Ben Carson saying it's untrue, they got the statement and they - and they didn't put it out. A lot of people didn't think I should even go to Iowa and I came in - actually I came in probably first, if you think about it.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: MJ, how is the Cruz camp responding to that?

LEE: Yes. So Donald Trump, all of a sudden, unwilling to accept that he has lost Iowa. Even wanting a rematch. I want to just explain to you the back story here. What happens is that during the Iowa caucuses, Ben Carson's campaign told CNN that Carson would be returning home to Florida instead of going straight to New Hampshire or South Carolina, where the next contests are being held. Now, the Cruz campaign seized on this news and basically suggested that Carson may be dropping out soon and encouraged Carson supporters to vote for Cruz instead, all while the caucuses were still taking place.

[14:20:00] Now, I want to make it very clear, CNN never reported that Carson was dropping out. In fact, we made it very clear that he was simply returning home briefly before, you know, coming back on the campaign trail.

Now, Trump is now using this news to basically call for a rematch and to accuse Cruz of having stolen the election. I want to read for you what Rick Tyler, Cruz's communications, said in response. A pretty entertaining statement. He said, quote, "reality has hit the reality TV star in Iowa, so nobody's talking about him now, so he's trying to regain some attention on Twitter. There are Twitter addiction support groups, so he should seek out his local chapter." So there you have it. Never a dull day on the 2016 campaign trail.

BALDWIN: You have your work cut out for you, MJ, following all these different storylines, narrative. Thank you so much. Let's move on from that. I've got Daniel waiting in the wings because

momentum is everything, right? I mean you don't have to tell that to Marco Rubio, who's riding this wave right into New Hampshire after a strong third place finish in Iowa. His surprising showing putting him square in the face of attacks from his rivals. Here is Ted Cruz on Fox News.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. TED CRUZ (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: We've been joking that in media world bronze is the new gold. And, you know, they're going to push the themes they want to push. They're going to push the candidates they want to push. And the Washington cartel has its favorite candidates.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: That was Ted Cruz. You have Chris Christie taking fresh swipes at Rubio a short time ago in New Hampshire.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GOV. CHRIS CHRISTIE (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: When he gets in front of folks at town hall meetings, he, you know, does a drop by. That's like a drive by town hall, man. Forty-five minutes. You know, Marco Rubio is the master of the drive by town hall. Give the canned speech I've been giving for six years. By the way, look at it, it's the same speech he gave when he announced for the Senate. It's the same speech he gave when he nominated Mitt Romney for president of the United States. It's the same speech he gave when he announced for president of the United States. It's the same speech he gave in Iowa the other night. I mean it's - you know, we're just one day away from Groundhog Day, but every day is Groundhog Day in the Rubio campaign.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: This as the Bush campaign hammered Rubio with a full page ad in "The New Hampshire Union Leader" featuring a letter from former and current speakers of the Florida House of Representatives, a position Rubio formerly held. The ad reads in part, quote, "take it from the people who know Marco and Jeb best. Governor Bush is the leader we need to make America safer, stronger and freer."

But, on the flip side, a number of Bush supporters may be reevaluating.

Let me bring back Daniel Newhauser, with "The National Journal."

And so, Daniel, just reading your piece, when you name all these different, you know, Washington officials, members of Congress, you know, early on Jeb Bush backers, now reevaluating - is that the right word?

NEWHAUSER: I would - yes, reevaluating is a good word for it. I mean I talked to one member, Pete Sessions, a chairman of the House Republican Rules Committee, and he said, you know, yes, I'm in Jeb Bush's corner, but that was ten months ago. He hasn't performed like he - he was expecting to. And so now Rubio's kind of speaking to me.

You know, it's not surprising that - that Bush is kind of trying to distance himself from Rubio, because it's really him - Rubio that's nipping at the heels of Bush's supporters.

BALDWIN: So the if game would be, when you look ahead to, you know, less than a week from the New Hampshire primary, if Bush doesn't place well, and let's consider well higher than Marco Rubio, how quickly do you anticipate that the Jeb backing exodus to occur and the allegiance to switch?

NEWHAUSER: Well, I've had members of Congress tell me that this can't last past South Carolina.

BALDWIN: Oh, wow.

NEWHAUSER: If Bush finishes with something like 3 percent, you know, how much - how long - how much longer can people stay in his corner. They have - of course they've had deep ties to the Bush family. Some of them have known Jeb for a long time. There are members of Congress from Florida who have been personally helped from him. But, you know, nobody likes to back a losing candidate. And if it becomes quite apparent that people need to start lining up behind a different establishment candidate, I think people have put it to me that this is going to happen, and this is a quote, "soon."

BALDWIN: Wow. OK. Daniel Newhauser, for now, thank you so much. We should chat again post South Carolina.

Still ahead here, Hillary Clinton speaking right now in New Hampshire. Here she is, ahead of tonight's critical town hall with Bernie Sanders that will be live here on CNN this evening. She's also responding to those who suggest she should just skip New Hampshire all together as she gets ready to face off against the senator from Vermont this evening.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[14:29:02] BALDWIN: Just about half past the hour here on this Wednesday. I'm Brooke Baldwin. Thanks for being with me.

In just a couple of hours, the only two Democrats remaining in this race for the White House are set to make their closing arguments before New Hampshire voters during a live, primetime CNN town hall. Bernie Sanders is heavily favored to win in the state that is just next door to his home turf in Vermont. CNN's poll of polls shows him with a nearly 20 point lead over rival Hillary Clinton.

But after eking out such a narrow victory in Iowa, the closest in history, by the way, Clinton is looking to close the gap against Sanders, all the while embracing her usual underdog status here. Now, Clinton, along with thousands of her volunteers fanning out across New Hampshire. Voters there head to the polls in the nation's first primary next Tuesday. Today she told supporters Sanders doesn't stand a chance if voters compare their records.

[14:29:53] (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

HILLARY CLINTON (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Oh, my gosh, we've been fighting the progressive fight and getting results for people for years. So I hope we keep it on the issues, because if it's about our records, hey, I'm going to win by a landslide on Tuesday.