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Republicans Gear Up for S.C. Debate as Primary Looms; A New Cold War; Pope Francis in Mexico; Seeking a Ceasefire in Syria; Democrats Campaign in Nevada; Remembering Columbine. Aired 11a-12p ET

Aired February 13, 2016 - 11:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

FREDRICKA WHITFIELD, CNN ANCHOR: And welcome, everyone. It's 11:00 on the East Coast. I'm Fredericka Whitfield. NEWSROOM starts right now.

Just one week until one of the most influential and contentious Republican presidential primaries in South Carolina, this is a critical day for the six remaining candidates who will face off in a debate tonight in Greenville, South Carolina. And as we saw in New Hampshire, it could change everything.

While all the candidates are no doubt preparing a good offense and defense, some are still working their ground game. Jeb Bush spoke to voters at a diner in Greenville this morning.

And next hour, New Hampshire runner up John Kasich will hold a rally in Malden, South Carolina.

Let's go to CNN's Ryan Nobles who is in Greenville, South Carolina right now the site of tonight's debate. So Ryan -- South Carolina has, you know, a recent flood of attack ads among the Republicans. Is it expected that this will be another kind of gloves-off kind of debate?

RYAN NOBLES, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Fredericka, as you mentioned, every single one of these debates have been crucial in this Republican primary contest. And tonight should be no different.

And Donald Trump, fresh off that win in New Hampshire, clearly the frontrunner here in South Carolina. That could mean he'll come under attack here tonight. Already on the campaign trail this week we've seen Jeb Bush, Marco Rubio, and Ted Cruz find opportunities to go after Trump.

Now Trump himself has talked about running a more positive campaign. But he's still talking about Ted Cruz's Canadian birthplace. He's even suggested that he may have to sue Cruz over that issue.

Now, on the campaign trail, we've definitely seen Trump and Cruz find opportunities to criticize each other but for some reason, when they get on the debate stage, they generally play nice. But perhaps that changes tonight because there is so much at stake here in South Carolina, the vote of course just one week away. And most polls show that Trump and Cruz are running first and second here in South Carolina.

So Fredericka, yes, there's a good chance that tonight the gloves will come off between these two guys.

WHITFIELD: All right. Thanks so much -- we'll be watching, of course. Ryan Nobles there in Greenville.

All right. Let's talk about what more we might be able to expect from tonight's Republican debate in South Carolina with Republican strategist Brian Morgenstern and Republican strategist conservative columnist for "Above the Law" and Donald Trump supporter, Kayleigh McEnany. All right -- good to see both of you.

BRIAN MORGENSTERN, REPUBLICAN STRATEGIST: Hey -- Fred.

KAYLEIGH MCENANY, REPUBLICAN STRATEGIST: Thanks -- Fred.

WHITFIELD: All right. So Brian -- you first. The polls show Trump has a major lead over Cruz in South Carolina. But the evangelical vote is quite influential. Are there any indications that Trump could steal Cruz's thunder in that area?

MORGENSTERN: He's been polling pretty well for several months, of course, Trump, you know, did pretty well in Iowa despite -- in the months leading nobody expected him -- or at least when he announced nobody expected him to do very well, but he did.

But this debate is going to have a couple of different face-offs. I mean Trump and Cruz are definitely going to be competing for some of the same voters. So they're going to go after each other.

The ads this week have been pretty amazing. I mean Trump has been calling Cruz a filthy Canadian liar. And Cruz has been calling Trump a petulant, poorly behaved child. So I wouldn't expect them to just suddenly disavow that kind of a message.

WHITFIELD: Right. So much for Mr. Nice Guy.

MORGENSTERN: Right, exactly. But then you may have Jeb versus Rubio competing to be the alternative. And they may get a little bit more confrontational there. Jeb has been hitting Rubio on experience. Of course, Rubio has been going after Jeb for having no foreign policy.

He might go after him on sort of a messaging, a legacy argument, saying that in this election, when voters are so mad about the status quo and about the rich and powerful sort of dominating things, you don't nominate the son and brother of a president. So maybe there's a new line of attack there. We'll see.

WHITFIELD: Yes, which makes it very interesting for Rubio and Bush, Kayleigh, because like Brian just said, people have been so angry at the establishment, kind of the professional politicians, we understand it's Bush who is going to be working the hardest to try to convey that he's the real establishment guy over Rubio.

MCENANY: Sure, exactly. They're vying for that position. We see Rubio doing exceedingly well in Iowa, better than expected. Then you see Bush overtaking Rubio and Rubio kind of faltering, landing in 5th place in New Hampshire.

So this is Jeb Bush's golden moment. South Carolina is his territory. George W. Bush won the state. George H.W. Bush won the state. If he can exceed Rubio and push Rubio down he can become that establishment candidate.

But Fred, I think you hit on an excellent point. This is an outsider's election. So being the establishment candidate, I'm not sure that that really wins you an election this time around.

[11:05:02] Cruz and Trump, you know, look at how well Cruz did. Cruz did third place in New Hampshire in a state that he is not supposed to do well in at all. To me, that speaks to the fact this is an outsider election. It's not who is more conservative, who is more establishment, who's more experienced. It's who is on the outside.

WHITFIELD: And Brian, you know, the pressure is on all of the candidates, even if you're out in front, but particularly for Rubio, coming off that not-so-great debate performance in New Hampshire just prior to that primary.

So how can Rubio convey that he can be more spontaneous and less scripted, as Chris Christie, you know, kept reminding people, there it is -- there's that 25-second memorized speech?

MORGENSTERN: Well, he's been spending really this week kind of combating that. He did a 45 minute sit-down with reporters where he answered every question until there were no more questions. He's been taking more questions at rallies from voters and having a more responsive approach as opposed to just, you know, sticking hard core to that stump speech.

We're going to hear things from him tonight I think that we haven't heard yet. So that's going to make that point, because he's coming out on offense. He has been focused so laser-like on being this optimistic candidate, and that's a good thing, but voters also want to see that he's a fighter.

And in South Carolina, this has been, I don't know, pugnacious to say the least, looking at these ads. And so being able to compete, part of it is having that positive message. Part of it is showing that you're not going to -- you know, you're not going to be afraid of getting into it with Hillary Clinton. And in order to demonstrate that, you have to get through the primary first.

And so I would expect him to be a lot more offensive tonight than he has been in the past.

WHITFIELD: And then there's the issue of immigration which is likely to be front and center as well -- Kayleigh. We know where Donald Trump stands, except he still is being pressed on some specificity. There was a "New York Times" article saying that the candidates' outlooks on immigration are split into two camps. And this is what the "New York Times" says. "One including Mr. Trump and Senator Ted Cruz of Texas favor strict immigration policies that would never grant legal status to undocumented immigrants; and the other, including Mr. Rubio and Mr. Bush, who are both trailing in the polls, has endorsed a crackdown on illegal immigration without ruling out legal status for people in the country illegally at some distant point in the future."

So how will they all be tested on distinguishing themselves on this issue with real specificity?

MCENANY: I really think you're going to see an all-out fight between Rubio and Cruz, because Rubio has insisted on going down this path of trying to paint Cruz as weak on immigration, which is foolish. It's like trying to paint Mike Huckabee as a pro-choice candidate.

You know, Ted Cruz is known for his strong immigration stance. He's known for opposing Chuck Schumer and Marco Rubio. So I think you're really going to see that distinction there.

I also think, as you point out, Donald Trump is going to be pushed for specificity. I would argue he's given some specificity. Last week he said his wall will cost $6 billion. So you're going to see that.

But the really important point is I think national security and how that ties to immigration, because Americans are scared. We found out that there were 60 ISIS fighters in Europe during the Paris attacks. That's an immigration issue. So I think you're going to see it tied to national security as well.

WHITFIELD: All right. We're going to leave it right there. Sorry, Brian -- we're out of time, but we're going to see you again a little bit later, ok.

MORGENSTERN: All right.

WHITFIELD: we'll pick up from where we left off. Kayleigh McEnany and Brian Morgenstern -- thanks so much to both of you. Appreciate it.

Of course, you don't want to miss CNN's coverage after the debate tonight. Erin Burnett will be breaking it all down with our political experts starting as soon as the debate ends.

And you can also hear how the candidates feel about the debate tomorrow morning on CNN's "STATE OF THE UNION" -- Jeb Bush and Marco Rubio will both be on. "STATE OF THE UNION" starting at 9:00 a.m. Eastern right here on CNN.

And this breaking news this hour: strong words this morning from Russia's prime minister saying the strained relationship between Russia and the West could be described as slipping into a new Cold War.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) DMITRY MEDVEDEV, RUSSIAN PRIME MINISTER: NATO's policy with regard to Russia remains (inaudible) and opaque. One could go as far as to say that we have slid back to a new Cold War. Almost on everyday basis we are called one of the most terrible threats either to NATO as a whole or to Europe or to the United States. Sometimes I wonder whether it is 2016 we live in or 1962.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WHITFIELD: All right. Let's talk more about this with CNN contributor Michael Weiss and CNN international diplomatic editor Nic Robertson joining me from Munich.

All right. So Nic, first to you, put this into context for us. Is this primarily because of the sanctions imposed by the West?

NIC ROBERTSON, CNN INTERNATIONAL DIPLOMATIC EDITOR: Well, Russia was coming in for a lot of criticism today. I mean just prior to today you had the French Prime Minister Manuel Valls saying that Russia is responsible for bombing civilians in and around Aleppo in Syria and Russia needs to stop that.

[11:10:02] There has been a lot of pressure on Russia over the past few weeks over that particular issue and Russia continues to bomb those people in and around Aleppo right now.

So what we've heard is sort of a kickback from the Russian Prime Minister, Dmitri Medvedev.

But I was sitting down just less than an hour ago with the NATO Supreme Allied Commander in Europe, that's General Philip Breedlove, a U.S. four-star general. He is the military man in charge of NATO, also the U.S.-European command, he's in charge of that as well -- he wears several hats. I said, what about this about what Medvedev is saying calling you, NATO, opaque, unfriendly, and slipping towards a Cold War.

He said, look, opaque? He said, "I just don't get that." When NATO does military exercises, they're published. They're online. Everyone knows when they're going to happen and where they're going to happen. Not the case in Russia. When the Russians go on military exercises close to the border, as he said, unfriendly he said. That's not the case indeed.

You know, Europe -- NATO has kind of reached out and be friendly towards Russia but he says Russia is changing its posture. Russia is not just trying to rewrite the rule book -- he said Russia is trying to create new rules. He said, Russia went into Ukraine, crossed an international border, annexed Crimea. None of these things sort of, you know, stand up to international law.

On top of that, NATO sees Russia developing what's known as A2AD -- Anti-Area Access Denial, which are combined air, sea, and land missile systems, all the way from Kaliningrad in the north of Europe, St. Petersburg, Crimea -- all the way down now to where Russian forces are in the north of Syria. So what he said they see, NATO sees, Russia clustering these A2AD systems and complex military systems in these areas. And they see that as not particularly a friendly gesture towards NATO and NATO countries. So I said, doesn't that amount to a slippage towards a Cold War? He said, look, from our perspective and NATO's perspective, we are not trying to head in that direction. But the implication is, across the border, Russia is upping these clusters of sophisticated defense systems as well as these measures, annexing countries and crossing international borders.

WHITFIELD: I know we just heard from Medvedev there, but maybe some people may not have understood every word he was trying to say with that translation. So I just do want to read this quote. He says, "You could say even more sharply we have fallen into a new Cold War. Nearly on a daily basis we are being blamed for the most terrible threat to NATO as a whole, to Europe, to America, to other countries. They make scary movies were Russia starts a nuclear war. I sometimes wonder are we in 2016 or 1962."

So Michael, is this hyperbole? Or you know, is he simply underscoring that this lack of trust that has been long standing seems to be going into a new direction?

MICHAEL WEISS, CNN CONTRIBUTOR: I don't think it's hyperbole. But I think what he's espousing is what I call the Russian security doctrine of Freudian projection. You accuse your enemy of that which you yourself are guilty. You know, I can't count how many times President Obama and the U.S. defense establishment have said in no uncertain terms, we do not want a new Cold War, this is not a zero sum game. Your called so-called reset policy where the U.S. prostrated itself to accommodate Russian interest, bringing Russia to the World Trade Organization, working closely with Russia to allow access for men and material into Afghanistan to combat the Taliban, which is a joint kind of counterterrorism interest.

Look, in the last two or three weeks, let's count the number of things that Russia has done to try and destabilize Europe, cleave alliances within the West and combat or confront or contain American interests.

Russia's most-watched television network Channel 1 fabricated a story in Germany alleging that a German-Russian girl in Berlin had been savagely raped by men of Arab or North African appearance. Now this whole thing was bogus that the German authorities had said from the start. It was designed to foment social and political crisis in Germany. Why because Angela Merkel has been very hawkish on sanctions against Russia for, as Nic said, an unprovoked and unwarranted invasion of European soil -- an annexation of European soil.

So Vladimir Putin is looking to undermine the European Union. George Soros wrote a piece in "The Guardian" -- Project Syndicate this week saying Putin is a greater threat to Europe than ISIS in the long term. Russia's bombardment of Syria around the clock has led to catastrophic refugee crisis. Between 50,000 and 70,000 people fleeing Aleppo for the Turkish border. Internally in southern Syria -- and this doesn't get reported enough -- 150,000 people are internally displaced in (inaudible) Province. Added to which the intervention in Syria, which was (inaudible) to go after is, has actually been strengthening ISIS -- another aspect that doesn't get reported.

[11:15:05] Col. Steve Warren, the spokesman for the Pentagon said Russia sorties in Syria, only 10 percent of them are actually targeting. That means 90 percent are going after civilians, Free Syrian Army groups, U.S.-backed rebels. This is designed really to undermine and weaken the western position.

And also, I mean if there's a kind of light motif to it all, particularly in the Middle East, it is to make Moscow the regional power broker. If you want anything done in this part of the world, you don't go to Washington anymore, you go to Moscow. That includes a peace deal with Bashar al Assad, that includes talks about a revivified security establishment between Cairo, a traditional American ally at least since the 1970s and Moscow, that includes what the Saudis are up to, that includes an Iranian nuclear program.

I mean this is a great power in the making again. And I do think that yes, we are in a cold War footing, although one of the benefits that the Kremlin has on its side is the U.S. just doesn't acknowledge it. We pretend like we're really not, that this is still a zero sum game and if we accommodate their interests, they'll do likewise and return it. It just doesn't work that way, I'm afraid.

WHITFIELD: Interesting. All right. Michael Weiss, Nic Robertson -- thanks to both of you, appreciate it.

WEISS: Sure.

WHITFIELD: All right. Also this just into the CNN NEWSROOM, terror organization al Shabaab is now claiming responsibility for setting off that bomb on a Somali airliner. You might recall this scene right here, the bomber falling to his death after the explosion blew a hole in the plane. Al Shabaab admits the bombing didn't go as planned. The attacker snuck in a laptop rigged with military grade TNT but it didn't cause a catastrophic explosion because it was set up before the plane reached cruising altitude.

Only two people were injured. The pilot was able to land safely. The group al Shabaab is vowing to continue targeting western intelligence teams operating in Somalia.

All right. Straight ahead, the Pope is in Mexico right now and is expected to speak in just a few minutes. Live pictures from Mexico City right there. The Pope's tough words on drug trafficking -- next.

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[112021] WHITFIELD: All right.

Very large crowds waited for hours to warmly welcome Pope Francis who kicks off his five-day trip in Mexico.

And then soon you will see him actually kissing babies, blessing the sick.

The Pope's visit comes at a time when the country is being ravaged by warring cartels. He's expected to address that along with poverty and corruption there in Mexico.

CNN correspondent Rosa Flores joining me live from Mexico City. And so Rosa, you know, the Pope has been spending a lot of time with Latin countries. Why has it been so important for him to do this?

ROSA FLORES, CNN CORRESPONDENT: You know, he is a pope that likes to evangelize from the peripheries. That's what he likes. So not just geographically, Fred, but also where there is pain, where people are suffering, and where there is ill.

Mexico is one of those places. It's also where -- the country that has the second largest Catholic community. And every pope, you know, has had fun in Mexico when they do come here, because it's a very warm crowd, they love their popes.

You saw the welcome ceremony last night with lots of people, lots of love, lots of music, mariachi music, folkloric dancers. Pope Francis wore a mariachi hat, the crowd went wild. But Pope Francis has said he's not here to cure every ill. He wants to be here with the people. He wants to make sure that they receive his message.

One of the big questions will be, will he bring some tough love?

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

FLORES: Pope Francis is the Pope of mercy and sometimes of tough love, calling the unfettered pursuit of money the dung of the devil blaming human activity for climate change.

POPE FRANCIS, ROMAN CATHOLIC CHURCH (through translator): Our house is going to ruin and that harms everyone.

FLORES: And now that he's visiting Mexico, he's expected to arrive with a holy dose of some of that tough love. One of his targets could be drug traffickers when the Pope visits Morella a city in the heart of cartel territory. In Mexico, the drug-related death toll more than 80,000 in the past nine years.

In a recent video message to a group of Mexicans, the Pope encouraged them to fight against corruption, drug trafficking, against organized crime and human trafficking.

During the Pope's visit to Brazil in 2013, he blasted narcos, calling them dealers of death. Some of the Pope's tough love could also be pointed at the United States when he speaks about immigration.

POPE FRANCIS: So many of you are also descendants of immigrants.

FLORES: During his speech before the U.S. Congress, Francis said immigrants should be welcomed. But GOP frontrunner Donald Trump vows to build a wall.

DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I will build a great, great wall.

FLORES: And overlooking the existing wall dividing Ciudad Juarez, Mexico and El Paso, Texas is where Pope Francis plans to celebrate mass.

MICHAEL MURPHY, CATHOLIC STUDIES LOYAL UNIVERSITY CHICAGO: What the Pope will be saying, look, a wall is a symbolic message that people are not welcome. And that's not what our constitution or our history says at all.

FLORES: Francis is visiting Juarez and Casa Pe, a suburb of Mexico City -- both areas where women are being brutally targeted.

HECTOR GARCIA, LOYLA UNIVERSITY: I mean the number of women who have lost their lives, have been abused, disappeared -- it feels like a civil war.

FLORES: And as the war rages on, the Pope says he wants to be an instrument of peace in Mexico.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

FLORES: And in very much Pope Francis fashion, he is also visiting the poor, the sick, and the youth. Fred, we know that he just lights up with the youth. We saw him in Brazil saying that he wants them to be out in the streets, to have a ruckus, to have fun, to enjoy in Christ.

So we're going to have to see what he tells youth in Mexico. But I think he's going to have a good time. He always does.

WHITFIELD: Yes. And Rosa, it seems mutual because he lights up, they light up.

[11:24:57] And then there are beautiful images of you and he. You had your own special private moment with the Pope. I might say that, you know, I was seeing little hearts, you know, bursting with you guys too, and just seeing how much joy it meant to have that kind of contact. So explain how that happened.

FLORES: Yes, so when we traveled with the Pope on the Papal plane, every journalist gets to meet him one on one. Most of the journalists bring a little gift or token for the Pope. And so this time, as you know, this is the second time that I meet Pope Francis, so this time I wanted to share it with others.

The first time I met him, it was very personal. The second time I really wanted to share it with others. So what I did is I went to a school in Chicago and asked the kids to write letters to Pope Francis. And they were just so excited, Fred, to do this. And I was so excited to share this moment with them.

And so I gave him more than 200 letters --

WHITFIELD: Oh my God.

FLORES: -- from St. Mary Star of the Sea School in Chicago. So I was carrying quite a bag of letters. But he saw them and he said "they're beautiful". So he was very excited to read them. I'm going to follow up with him to see if he reads them. WHITFIELD: That's right, you better follow up.

FLORES: I'll let you know -- Fred.

WHITFIELD: Something tells me he probably will. He just seems very, very genuine and very genuinely touched by people and the efforts that they make to try to reach him. So you were the vessel, you were the conduit in which to make that happen. That was so sweet, Rosa.

Thanks for sharing that with us. We appreciate it. You are an old hat now. You had your hand on his shoulder, like oh, we're old friends now.

FLORES: It was wonderful. It was good.

WHITFIELD: No problem. Thanks -- Rosa Flores. Appreciate it.

FLORES: We're besties.

WHITFIELD: You're besties -- I love that. All right. Appreciate it.

Coming up next, CNN is showing you what so many people have not seen, a look inside Syria, a country rocked by civil war, cities crumbling, people fighting for territory. We'll take you inside Aleppo -- next.

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[11:30:50] WHITFIELD: U.S. Secretary of State John Kerry said the cease-fire in Syria will need time to work. An agreement was hammered out this week to have all sides agree to a, "cessation of hostilities within a week." Some critics say the agreement could actually intensify fighting in the days leading up to it.

Speaking in Berlin this morning, Secretary Kerry defended the decision to wait a week.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOHN KERRY, U.S. SECRETARY OF STATE: Why in a week, why not yesterday? For the simple reason that the modalities have to be worked out. And for the simple reason that people have to be communicated to in order to not have it start with failure. And this will apply to any and all parties in Syria with the exception of terrorist organizations Daesh and Al Nusra.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WHITFIELD: One of the biggest obstacles to the cease-fire could be Syrian leader Bashar Al Assad. He vowed Friday to retake the entire country from Syrian rebels.

Right now his forces are continuing their assault on the rebel-held city of Aleppo, already retaking some of the northern suburbs. The Syrian army is also getting ready to move on Raqqah Province, a stronghold against ISIS. Russia has been backing Syrian forces within air strikes against ISIS and Syrian rebel positions for months now. ISIS has maintained control of Raqqah province since its stormed in and took over back in 2014. Russia is promised to keep bombing ISIS positions throughout the beginning of the cease-fire.

As the battle intensifies on the outstirts of Aleppo, CNN has been able to get close to the fighting. Our Frederik Pleitgen is the only international journalist in the city and he was given exclusive access to the front lines where Syrian forces are battling rebels.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

FREDERIK PLEITGEN, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Years of urban combat have laid waste to Aleppo's old town. Syrian army snipers scan the terrain for possible movements on the other side.

We're right on the front line in the Syrian government's offensive against the opposition. And the soldiers here tell us they still frequently see rebels on the other side but they also say they often pick them off from the snipers' nest.

This soldier tells me morale has never been higher. "Thanks to God, everything here is under control," he says. "Our fingers are on the triggers ready to destroy the rebels." Bashar Al Assad's forces have made major gains in the Aleepo area in recent weeks while the opposition rebels say they're simply being slaughtered. But for years this battlefield was in a stalemate, the front line right around Aleppo's ancient citadel.

As Syrian and Russian war planes hover overhead, the commander knows who to thank for the new-found momentum.

"It's only a matter of months now until we win," he says, "thanks to Russian support with their air strikes flown from the Syrian airfield, we will defeat the rebels once in for all."

Aleepo was Syrian largest and one of its most historic towns. Tourists from all over the world used to flock to the old town before it was engulfed by Syria's brutal war.

The old town of Aleppo is a UNESCO heritage site. Some of these buildings are hundreds if not thousands of years old. And now as you can see most have been completely destroyed and burned out.

But now Assad's troops believe they are on the verge of a decisive victory. The commander warns the U.S. not to interfere.

"We are steadfast," he says. "You cannot defeat the Syrian army because we are determined to win and we're loyal to President Assad." Amid this divided and destroyed city, Syrian government forces believe they're dealing a crushing blow to the opposition, one that could end this five-year civil war that's destroyed so much more than just the landscape.

Fred Pleitgen, CNN, Aleppo.

[11:34:44] WHITFIELD: All right, next, Hillary Clinton and Bernie Sanders in the last minute campaign push to clinch support before South Carolina. Plus, I'm talking to the governor who ran against Bernie Sanders and beat him for perspective on the current race, right after this.

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WHITFIELD: Democrats are campaigning in Nevada today where that state's Democratic caucus takes place in a week. Bernie Sanders will launch his canvas in Reno and Hillary Clinton is hosting a rally in Henderson.

But while Clinton will be shaking hands with motors out west, her campaign is more invested in South Carolina, literally. CNN is learning Clinton's super PAC is launching a $4.5 million effort into gaining more minority voters in South Carolina. This was funding originally reserved for the general election.

So let's talk about this with CNN Senior Washington correspondent Joe Johns. So, Joe, how are the tea leaves being read here? Is the Clinton campaign kind of sweating?

JOE JOHNS, CNN SENIOR WASHINGTON CORRESPONDENT: It's not clear at all, because of course super PACs aren't supposed to coordinate, if you will, with the candidate. Nevertheless, this super PAC was formed to help President Obama, now it's helping Hillary Clinton.

And Priorities USA say is confirming as you reported that is making a big move in South Carolina $4.5 million, to focus on Latino voters, women voters, minorities, also about a half a million dollars for a radio ad to tie Hillary Clinton to the Obama legacy.

So what does that tell us? Number one, it tells us that her friends are concerned about her after that narrow win in Iowa as well as the big loss in New Hampshire. And as you said, Fred, the other thing that's very interesting about this is that Priorities USA was expected to keep its powder dry, if you will, and save the money for the general election.

Hillary Clinton in that last debate just a couple of days ago actually talked about a bit about the super PAC, also dismissively, if you will. Listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

[11:40:07] JUDY WOODRUFF, PBS NEWSHOUR DEMOCRATIC DEBATE MODERATOR: You have said there's no quid pro quo involved. But is that also true of the donations that wealthy Republicans give to Republican candidates, contributors including the Koch brothers?

HILLARY CLINTON, (D), U.S. PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I can't speak for the Koch brothers. You're referring to a super PAC that we don't coordinate with, that was set up to support President Obama, that has now decided they want to support me. They are the ones who should respond to any questions. Let's talk about our campaigns.

(END VIDEO CLIP) JOHNS: Now while this helps the Clinton campaign financially, there is also a potential downside, because Bernie Sanders has been focusing so much about the amount of money in politics. And he says he doesn't take super PAC money. So this can be a continuing debate. And it could be a very long debate, considering the fact that Hillary Clinton is having so much trouble with Bernie Sanders right now, Fred. Back to you.

WHITFIELD: All right, there in Henderson, Nevada, with Clinton, Joe Johns, thanks so much. We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[11:45:02] WHITFIELD: Hillary Clinton is not the first progressive Democratic woman to run against Senator Bernie Sanders. In the mid- 1980s, Sanders ran for governor of Vermont against Madeleine Kunin. While Governor Kunin was running for her second term as a Democrat when Sanders ran as a third party candidate. Sanders did not do so well, getting just 14 percent of the vote.

Governor Kunin was easily reelected with 47 percent of the vote in the three-way race. Former Vermont Governor Madeleine Kunin joining us now for some perspective. Good to see you an insight on what it is like to run against Bernie Sanders. Thanks for being with us.

MADELEINE KUNIN, FORMER VERMONT GOVERNOR: Well, thank you. I'm delighted to be with you. And of course, you know, he was a young man then. And he gave the same message, though, in terms of income inequality. But he's toned down a whole lot. I mean, then he was frankly a fringe candidate, and the message of income inequality today resonates more. But he had similar body language. And he probably didn't have the same haircut or the same suit.

WHITFIELD: So his message resonates more in terms of income inequality, yet you are endorsing or at least behind Hillary Clinton, is that right?

KUNIN: Absolutely.

WHITFIELD: OK, why is that?

KUNIN: Well, I believe very simply put that, she is by far the most qualified candidate, male or female, to lead this country for the next four or eight years. And in addition, but not the only reason I stress, I'm very proud that she could be the first woman president of the United States. And that's something many of us have dreamed about. And she could make it a reality.

But I really think she has the intelligence, the experience, the temperament to be in the White House and be an expert on foreign policy, be an expert on economic policy.

And admittedly, her style is different from Bernie's. And I think part of that is that women are held to a different standard. You know, if she becomes emotional or she waves her arms, people say, oh, she's shouting. When a man does that, he's considered powerful and strong. And even authentic.

So I think, you know, the word "revolution" is very attractive. In a way, I'm very glad that so many young people are involved in politics and so many women. And I hope they stay involved. But that's a big accomplishment of Bernie's, that he's done that.

But you have to ask the next question, which is, how are you going to get it done, how are you going to get results? And revolutions don't happen overnight. The suffrage amendment, the right for women to vote, took a hundred years. Even the LGBT movement has taken 30 or 40 years. Those are huge accomplishments.

But I hope the voters know that you don't get immediate results. This is not a quick process. But I'm glad we're beginning to talk about it. But I also think Hillary has the know-how to say yes, we need to create change and this is we're going to do it. Her plan isn't as exciting.

WHITFIELD: Yeah. Well, I, you know, I wonder what your thoughts recently Atlanta's Mayor Kasim Reed had some criticism of Bernie Sanders, saying that he thought he was too dismissive of the sitting President Obama especially as it pertains to income inequality and health care, as if no groundwork had been made on those issues with this president.

How would you -- or do you see it that way, that Bernie Sanders is being dismissive of the current president? As it pertains to those things.

KUNIN: Well, I don't know if dismissive is the right word. But certainly Hillary has a great allegiance with Barack Obama, because they worked together. Obviously, she is secretary of state and he had great confidence in appointing his former opponent. And she has done a superb job.

So being a Democrat is not new for Hillary. Working with a president and with former presidents is not new for Hillary. So, I think President Obama's achievements are huge in terms of the health care system, Obamacare, in terms of climate change. He's been fighting for these things.

[11:50:03] WHITFIELD: And so you think it's smart that she would run on those issues and praising President Obama, and it reminded people that yeah, she served under President Obama.

KUNIN: Well, I think it is wise. But of course, she has to put her own agenda out there as well. So, her theme is I am going to build on what the president has achieved and here's the way I'm going to do it. So incremental change as we know it is not as thrilling as a revolution. But incremental change is how this country has always experienced change and achieved change.

WHITFIELD: Former Vermont Governor Madeline Kunin, thank you so much for you time. Appreciate it. What a pleasure talking to you.

KUNIN: My pleasure, too. WHITFIELD: Thank you. All right, moving to another big story of the day, an emotional and raw interview from the mother of the Columbine shooter Dylan Klebold. She hasn't said much since the in the last 17 years since that massacre. Will now she's sharing what she wishes she had done differently. That is next.

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WHITFIELD: Welcome back. It's been nearly two decades since two students opened fire in a Colorado high school cafeteria.

[11:55:01] Twelve students were killed along with one teacher. The shooters, Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold also considered children injured 21 other people.

We've heard very little from the shooters' families until now. Dylan's mom sue just sat down with ABC's Diane Sawyer. Here's what she had to say in her first television interview since that attack.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SUE KLEBOLD, DYLAN KLEBOLD MOTHER: Sometimes he would seem, you know, distant or quiet and I remember asking him "Are you okay? Are you sure you're okay, you seem so tired." He would stand up and say "I've got a lot of homework, I need to go to bed."

DIANE SAWYER, ABC NEWS ANCHOR: And you let it go.

KELBOLD: And I let it go. And that's the difference. I would dig, if it were me today, I would dig and dig and dig. I mean, I had all those illusions that everything was okay because -- and more than anything else, because my love for him was so strong. If I felt that I was a good mom, that he could talk to me about anything. Part of the shock of this was learning what I believed and how I lived and how I parented was an invention in my own mind.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WHITFIELD: That's incredible, that kind of taking of responsibility for Sue Klebold there, ahead of releasing her book, "A Mother's Reckoning". Let's talk with psychologist Eric Fisher about this.

So, she breaks her silence after 17 years. And for her to say that, that really it became a more reflective moment for her, too, of things that perhaps she could have done better, how she may have enabled this to happen.

ERIC FISHER, PSYCHOLOGIST: Right. I think we have to recognize this. There are a lot of cautionary tales for parents today. Because all the dynamics in our culture are there and then some that we have to look at.

However, what I want parents to do is not parent children from the standpoint, oh, my gosh, I have to prevent my child doing this or thinking my child would never do this, but to give your child the love, the attention and help them fulfill the needs they have because we love them and they deserve that, not from a place of fear because often our kids can feel at times our motivations even if they aren't obvious or out there.

WHITFIELD: And then this is what she had to say about the other victims.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KELBOLD: I just remember sitting there and reading about them. All these kids and the teacher. And I keep thinking, constantly thought how I would feel if it were the other way around and one of their children had shot mine. I would feel exactly the way they did. I know I would. I know I would.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WHITFIELD: Why do you suppose for her personally this was the moment and this was important for her to share publicly? It's one thing to come to terms with all of this privately, but it's another to share it with the world and what was really the most memorable, the biggest kind of school shooting massacre that any of us had ever experienced in this country.

FISHER: Right, and still to this day. So again, what she recognizes is to me, there is a moral responsibility for us all, her being in her position of being firsthand of that, but for us all to see that we are responsible for collective raising of our children, whether we're part of the media, whether we're part of the game creators, whether we're part of the cartoon and animated series creators that continue to sell the idea that violence is OK, but when we participate in this and we're part of it, it's that much more important to communicate our lessons and be part of the solution, not just let the problems continue because we feel afraid how people might respond or react.

This will bring up a lot of feelings in people. And what I hope is that the emotions that it brings up is the necessary need for us to see that we as a community are responsible for the message that our children the culture that we have allowed to occur.

WHITFIELD: Yes, as painful as it is, it also becomes very generous that she, a parent who is grieving and dealing with that would leave that for other parents as they raise their kids and keep...

FISHER: Right.

WHITFIELD: ... these top of mind. All right, Eric Fisher, thanks so much. Good to see you. Appreciate it.

FISHER: Thank you.

[11:59: 17] WHITFIELD: And we'll be right back.

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