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Mitt Romney called out for Donald Trump's Tax returns to be released; Protester in a private fundraise said Clinton needs to apologized; Exclusive interview with Ben Carson; 3:30-4p ET

Aired February 25, 2016 - 15:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[15:30:00] JASON CASELLAS, ASSOCIATE PROFESSOR OF POLITICAL SCIENCE, UNIVERSITY OF HOUSTON: Trump's campaign has gone to the right on immigration. That's been a problem I think for a lot of reaching out to Latino vote. Mitt Romney didn't do so well last time. He got about 27 percent of the Latino vote. But if the polls look right, it looks like Trump, if he gets the nomination, will do even worse. And that could pose a problem in swing states like Florida, Colorado, states where the Republicans need to win Florida in particular in order to get the White House.

JOHN BERMAN, CNN HOST: You know, in Nevada, there was a lot made of the interest polls because it did show that Donald Trump is able to win in Nevada as result or at least led according to the polls, it was a small sample size. But look, he didn't get crushed, you know. At a minimum, he did OK there. And maybe that's because, you know, like every other demographic group in the country, you know, he knows there's no monolith when comes to voters.

CASELLAS: Sure. Latinos are monolith. But to be clear about Nevada, I think, you know, these are only Republicans voting. If you look at all Latinos, 93 percent voted for someone other than Trump and most of them voted in the democratic primary. But nevertheless, I think you're right that in some instances Donald Trump has been doing OK with Latinos but according to "the Washington Post" poll and a lot of other analysis, that it would be a big problem in terms of Latino outreach if Trump gets the nomination.

CASELLAS: So Maeve, one group that Donald Trump is not doing well with today is the Mitt Romney group. He is in this twitter war with the last Republican nominee. Mitt Romney and Donald Trump are going back and forth on twitter in a way that's almost unimaginable. I mean, you know, you think that Gerald Ford did this to Ronald Reagan? Do you think Ronald Reagan did this to George H. W. Bush? This doesn't happen in politics.

Mitt Romney yesterday says he thinks there might be a bombshell in Donald trump's tax return. Called on Donald Trump to release his tax return. Donald Trump did know says Mitt Romney was the worst nominee ever, said he would win, unlike Mitt Romney. And just today Mitt Romney came back and said me think that Donald Trump protests too much. Is there a winner here?

MAEVE RESTON, CNN NATIONAL POLITICAL REPORTER: I don't know if there is a winner or not. But you have to think about the fact that Mitt Romney, everybody keeps talking about this irony but Mitt Romney knows better than anyone what going through the scrutiny of your tax returns can do to your campaign. And it's very true that the public looks differently at Donald Trump and sort of aspires to his wealth than they did with Mitt Romney where his wealth became a huge problem. But I was talking to a number of sources today who are close to Romney and they said that he is been thinking about this for some time, Donald Trump's tax returns, thinking about the problems that could be in there, not only charitable giving, but where has he sheltered any of his investments, will he have any kind of off shoring issues.

And I think that he is saying this is an issue that should be raised now so it's not an October surprise that really hurts the Republican Party. And in that way, I think it's a totally legitimate issue for Romney to raise and for the other candidates also to be forced to release their tax returns.

BERMAN: Is this something the other candidates have had to do or have been forced to do or have done willingly a lot in past campaigns. It's not unusual to call for. What is unusual is who is calling for it.

RESTON: That he's trolling him.

BERMAN: Mitt Romney is trolling Donald Trump.

You know, Matt Lewis, one of the things that Donald Trump has managed to do is benefit from his enemy's list, you know. At first blush, a lot of this, you know, a lot of the times when someone speaks out against Donald Trump you think it's bad for Donald Trump, then it doesn't turn out to be so. He somehow turns it around to his advantage. Is this one of those cases where Donald Trump wins because Romney's going after him?

MATT LEWIS, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: I think so. I think Mitt Romney maybe has a little too much time on his hands. Maybe he is still fighting the last war. Maybe he is, you know, still feeling what it was like when he came under attack for the tax issue. And I think maybe mistakenly assuming that Donald Trump would face the same, that the same backlash would happen if Donald Trump was sheltering, you know, money or wasn't paying a tax rate that was, you know, what normal people normal income.

I think he is wrong. And I think what Donald Trump I believe has spent decades studying leadership, studying public relations and I think he is a master demagogue and until somebody round on him and, you know, out-maneuvers him, I'm inclined to think that it is like when Mitt Romney attacks, it would only help Donald Trump.

RESTON: But remember that Mitt Romney is pretty popular in the party now, more so than when he was running and was damaged. At the end of his race, I mean, there was that huge bubble of discussion about whether he would run this time. So maybe it's better to have Mitt Romney make this attack then Marco Rubio, his close ally, for example.

LEWIS: There a really good piece this week about how surrogates, you know, when Newt Gingrich was surging, you had surrogates who follow him around. And you know, when Donald Trump says something about, you know, religion, why aren't their pastors increased following him around? When he says something about POWs, why weren't there veterans and former, you know, POWs who followed him around and spoke out? That really the surrogate battle didn't happen.

BERMAN: It will be interesting to see if this takes place on the debate stage tonight.

Matt, Maeve, Jason, thanks so much for being with us, really appreciate it.

Next, he just finished his walk-through of the CNN debate stage. Dr. Ben Carson will join us live to talk about what his plans are for tonight on that debate stage. And maybe what his plans are for beyond.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:39:33] POPPY HARLOW, CNN HOST: Hillary Clinton is counting on African-American voters to show their support for her at the polls in South Carolina this Saturday. But one protester says what Clinton needs to do is apologize to black people for the mass incarceration policies that she supported as part of her husband's administration. This is what happened during a private fund-raiser for Clinton in South Carolina last night.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

HILLARY CLINTON (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: We're making sure that South Carolina became the first state. There's more work to be done but got to lay down these markers, you got to build towards common sense. We have somebody saying here --

[15:40:07] UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: -- we have to apologize for mass incarceration.

CLINTON: OK, we will talk about --

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I'm not a super predator, Hillary Clinton.

CLINTON: OK, fine. We will talk about it.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Can you apologize to black people for mass incarceration?

CLINTON: Well, can I talk, maybe you can listen to what I say.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You called black people super predators.

(CROSSTALK)\

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I know that you called black people super predators in 1994. Please explain your record. Explain it to us. You owe black people an apology.

(END VIDEO CLIP) HARLOW: The sign she was holding read bring them to their heels. It was a reference to this comment made by Clinton back in the '90s when talking about some youth offenders.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CLINTON: Not just gangs of kids anymore. They are often the kinds of kids that are called super predators. No conscience, no empathy. We can talk about why they ended up that way, but first we have to bring them to heel.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARLOW: Ashley Williams is the activist who confronted Clinton last night. Ashley joins me live from Charleston. Thank you very much for being with me.

ASHLEY WILLIAMS, CONFRONTED CLINTON AT PRIVATE FUNDRAISER: Thanks so much for having me, Poppy.

HARLOW: What were you hoping to hear from Clinton last night?

WILLIAMS: I was hoping to hear Clinton be accountable for the things she said in 1996. I was hoping to hear an apology for mass incarceration and apology to black communities and other communities of color. I was hoping to hear her reconcile the inconsistencies in her record.

HARLOW: So let me read you, because I don't know if you've seen this yet, Ashley, but she just responded to the encounter last night by telling a reporter from "the Washington Post" this, in that speech, referring to the '90s, in that speech, I was talking about the I impact violent crime and vicious drug cartels were having on communities across the country and the particular danger they pose to children and families. Looking back, I shouldn't have used those words and I wouldn't use them today. What is your response hearing that now?

WILLIAMS: So, one of the things I don't hear in that response is an apology for mass incarceration. I also don't hear her taking responsibility for the ways in which those words and her backing certain policies have affected black communities and communities of color.

HARLOW: So let's play for you part of this interview that she did give to the BET earlier this month, to BET, to that network talking about the '94 crime bill, et cetera. Let's play it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CLINTON: There was a crime bill and as most bills turn out to be, there were things in it that I didn't particularly like and there were things in it that I approved of. And it was implemented in ways that I think did go too far.

(END VIDEO CLIP) HARLOW: So in that interview, she spoke extensively about the '94 crime bill that was passed during her husband's administration. She supported it. Do you believe the president, because she talks a lot about the problem of mass incarceration, do you believe as president she will govern differently, has learned from this, Ashley?

WILLIAMS: I believe from what she has given us, whether that be the BET interview or the things she said in reference to what I did last night, I think that she is inconsistent. And I fear that we don't know which Hillary we're voting for. We don't know if we're going to get the Hillary from '94, we don't know if we are going to get Hillary Clinton from 2008, or we don't know if we are going to get this refined Hillary that allegedly shows up for racial justice.

I'm just not convinced and I'm unsure. And as a voter, this is something that I'm looking at very closely. I want to make sure that her current policies support things that she supported in the past. And I also want her to be accountable for the things she said or done.

HARLOW: Ashley, before I let you go, very quickly, Bernie Sanders, her competitor, they have a big race, obviously, in the state you're in this weekend. Bernie Sanders signed and supported the same crime bill in '94. Do you have the same concerns about him?

WILLIAMS: Absolutely. I think Bernie Sanders and all of the presidential candidates can be held to the same scrutiny. I think they all can get it at this point. I think that we need to hold all of them accountable in terms of the way they have and have not shown up for racial justice. And I'm interested in holding them to the same scrutiny. And I hope voters do as well.

HARLOW: Ashley Williams, thank you for joining me.

WILLIAMS: Thanks, Poppy.

HARLOW: Coming up next, Dr. Ben Carson, one of the five men on the stage tonight, along with our moderator Wolf Blitzer. Well, Carson will join my friend John Berman next live to talk about prep and much else ahead of tonight's big Republican debate.

Stay with us for that.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:49:06] BERMAN: John Berman here at the University of Houston in Houston, Texas, the site of tonight's CNN Republican presidential debate, the final debate before Super Tuesday. The debate with the fewest number of candidates on stage yet, only five. And we have one of them sitting with us right here right now.

Dr. Ben Carson, you just had your tour of the CNN debate stage. Thanks so much for being with us now.

BEN CARSON (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Thank you.

BERMAN: Simply, what do you think you need to do tonight? CARSON: Well, the one nice thing is, as you mentioned, there's only

five people so it's going to be kind of difficult for them to ignore me. So I want to have an opportunity actually to talk about some of the real issues. And maybe perhaps be able to deflect it away from people attacking each other so we can actually get to the crucial issues, because I think America is actually in a lot of trouble, which is the only reason that the people drafted me to run. And I want to really expose some of the solutions to the problems that we're facing.

[15:50:09] BERMAN: What breaks through? What breaks through on that stage tonight?

CARSON: Well, I think one of the real keys is our financial situation. You know, it's amazing how many people in America have never even heard of the fiscal gap. And yet our financial foundation is about to crumble and we're talking about spending more money. It's unbelievable.

BERMAN: Can I ask you about one of the issues that's come up over the last three days, having to do with transparency and those running for president, the idea of candidates releasing their tax returns. Mitt Romney, who was the nominee four years ago, has called on Donald Trump to release his tax returns. First of all, I don't know if you've released your tax returns, have you?

CARSON: I know we sent a bunch of stuff when we did our financial disclosure. I don't know where it ended up but I have certainly don't have any problem with it.

BERMAN: Do you think all candidates should be as transparent as possible?

CARSON: Absolutely.

BERMAN: Do you think Donald Trump should? He says is going to consider and he might release it eventually. Do you think Donald Trump should go ahead and release those tax returns?

CARSON: I think we all should do that because the people have a right, I believe, if they're choosing the president of the United States to know what kind of person they are choosing.

BERMAN: What's your strategy now to win this campaign just a few days before Super Tuesday? Realistically, what can you pull off next Tuesday?

CARSON: Well, the strategy is really to continue to tell the truth, continue to talk about the solutions, encouraging people to read about our policies at bencarson.com and recognizing that at some point, and I don't know when that point is, people will actually be interested in your policies and how you're going to solve problems and not so much in the personality and the WWE raw match.

BERMAN: Do you still think you can win?

CARSON: Absolutely. CARSON: Armstrong Williams is a friend of yours, a business advisor.

He says that sooner or later you're going to have to think if you should keep doing this. He says you have some tough decisions to make.

CARSON: Well, everybody has tough decisions to make. You know, we make decisions every single day. I don't know that you can read a whole lot into that statement.

BERMAN: You don't. He says that it could be by March 2nd, the day after Super Tuesday, when a decision needs to be made.

CARSON: That's arbitrary. It doesn't really matter. You can talk to ten people and they'll say you have to do it here, you have to do it now. You know, that's just so irrelevant. What's relevant is what direction are you going in? How much support do you have? And what are you trying to accomplish?

What I'm trying to accomplish is to save our country. I really think that this is an incredibly serious situation that we're in right now.

BERMAN: It's got to stink having people ask you that question constantly. And you know, it would tick me off if people asked me that every day of the campaign.

CARSON: You have probably noticed that I don't get ticked off very easily, you know. And some people think that's a sign of weakness, but it's actually a sign of strength. It means that you are able to look at the big picture and you're able to keep things in perspective.

BERMAN: Do you think it's been worth it, this campaign?

CARSON: It wouldn't be worth it if I was just doing it for myself, but it's very worthwhile because we are trying to save this country for our children. That's what my whole professional life was about, trying to create a good environment, longevity and quality of life for children. And I recognize that they are not going to have that. They are not going to have the American dream if we continue taken so far.

BERMAN: Eleven states vote on Tuesday. Which ones do you think you can win? Are there any you need to win?

CARSON: You know, my entire professional career and even before that I faced people saying that's impossible. That can't be done. How are you going to do this? You know, you just continue to do your best and the rest of it is taken care of by the good Lord.

BERMAN: Dr. Ben Carson, appreciate you being with us. Again, you are one of the five candidates on the debate stage tonight. It is the final debate before Super Tuesday. A lot at stake for all five of you.

CARSON: Absolutely.

BERMAN: Of the other four candidates, who do you think has the most to lose tonight? CARSON: Well, this is in the state of Senator Cruz, so obviously he

needs to do very well in his own state.

BERMAN: Setting the bar high for Senator Ted Cruz.

Dr. Ben Carson, that's so much. We do appreciate you being with us.

CARSON: Thank you very much.

BERMAN: Again, just a reminder, it is just a little more than four hours from now, the CNN Republican debate takes place right here. Wolf Blitzer will be your moderator.

Special coverage continues in just a moment.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(VIDEO CLIP PLAYING)

[15:58:58] HARLOW: That is Lady Gaga's Oscar-nominated song "Till it happens to you." It is from the CNN documentary "the Hunting Ground." If you haven't see it, it's a film that highlights the disturbing rate of sexual violence on college campuses. It's an issue that is also very close to the heart of vice president Joe Biden. So this Sunday night, he will take to the Oscar stage to introduce Lady Gaga's awards performance. Last year you'll remember that it was Biden who called on young men to speak out against and to act to prevent campus sexual assault.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOE BIDEN, VICE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Have the gumption to step in! Tell him! Expose him! Save him! Have the nerve! Look at that young woman as if she were your sister or your mother. You know it's wrong. You know!

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARLOW: A passionate vice president Joe Biden there. Again, he will be on the Oscar stage Sunday night.

Thank you so much for being with John and I today. "The Lead" with Jake Tapper begins right now.