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Effort Gearing Up To Stop Trump; Trump vs. Romney. Aired 3- 3:30p ET

Aired March 03, 2016 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[15:00:03]

BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN ANCHOR: I am sure many people are trying to get that entire hour with Mr. Trump.

For now, David Gregory, Adriana Cohen, Maeve Reston, and Kurt Eichenwald --

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: Trust me, we all have the questions. A lot of people have the questions. I appreciate you very much.

I want to continue on. You're watching CNN. Lots to talk about on this Thursday. I'm Brooke Baldwin. Thank you so much for being with me here.

Listen, let's just be real about this. The world is witnessing a first-of-its-kind fight in 21st century politics. So, on the right side of your screen, you have the most recent Republican nominee for president, former Massachusetts Governor Mitt Romney today, you know, for 20 minutes standing there at University of Utah, ripping apart the man who really should be considered the party's presumed nominee, the guy on the left side of your screen, Donald Trump.

And that is happening as Trump is hours from facing his three rivals in a presidential debate.

Here now, the war of words that has played out over the course of the last few hours today.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MITT ROMNEY (R), FORMER PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Donald Trump is a phony, a fraud. His promises are as worthless as a degree from Trump University.

He's playing the members of the American public for suckers. He gets a free ride to the White House and all we get is a lousy hat.

Now, Donald Trump tells us that he is very, very smart.

(LAUGHTER)

ROMNEY: I'm afraid that when it comes to foreign policy, he is very, very not smart.

Donald Trump says he admires Vladimir Putin, at the same time he has called George W. Bush a liar. That is a twisted example of evil trumping good.

And then what he said about -- on "60 Minutes." Did you hear this? It was about Syria and ISIS, and it has to go down as the most ridiculous and dangerous idea of the entire campaign season. Let ISIS take out Assad, he said, and then we can pick up the remnants.

Now, think about that. Let the most dangerous terror organization the world has ever known take over an entire country? This recklessness is recklessness in the extreme.

Watch, by the way, how he responds to my speech today.

(CHEERING AND APPLAUSE)

ROMNEY: Will he talk about our policy differences? Or will he attack me with every imaginable low road insult?

DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I will just address it quickly, because it's irrelevant.

Look, Mitt is a failed candidate. He failed. He failed horribly. The third -- he failed badly. That was a race, I have to say, folks, that should have been won.

When I heard Mitt was going to run, little before this period of time, I was very tough. I said, he can't run, he can't run. He was going to run. He can't run. Then I started to say, look, we have to keep him out because he's going to lose. He's a choke artist.

He's an absolute -- and I started hitting him so hard. In fact, people say, why did you hit him so hard? Because we cannot take another loss.

So, with Mitt, I just want to tell you that he came out. It was very nasty. I mean, I thought he was a better person than that. I did help him. I raised money for his campaign. I actually had two fund- raisers for him. In fact, the first fund-raiser was so successful that we had the second one that same day.

His wife, who is a lovely woman -- by the way, a really lovely woman. She came up. We had a fund-raiser in my apartment at Trump Tower. And it was so oversubscribed. I did a great job. They couldn't have cared less about him. In fact, a lot of them said, I don't know, he's a stiff, he's not going to win. I said, oh, he will be fine. He's a stiff.

I should have listened to the guy. So you help somebody and then he turns. Now, I will say this. I will say this. I will say this. He probably had a right to turn, because nobody could have been nastier than me in getting him not to run by saying he's a choke artist, and I will say the reason I think that he going to run, I love our country too much. If he would have won and even if he would have run, it would have been

bad. He doesn't take what it takes to be president. That, I can tell you.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: Let's chat about this and go straight to Detroit, to my friend, our chief political correspondent Dana Bash.

Detroit, by the way, where Trump will be headed to debate the other three presidential Republicans on the Republican side this evening.

Dana Bash, you saw Romney this morning. You just saw Donald Trump. What the heck did you think?

DANA BASH, CNN SENIOR CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Where do I even start?

BALDWIN: I don't even know.

BASH: First of all, let's just start with Mitt Romney, how extraordinary it was to have the Republican or a Republican standard- bearer, the last Republican presidential nominee, to come out and warn not just about party politics, not just about the fact, that as you have heard from other Republicans, those who are running, especially that Donald Trump isn't a real Republican, it was bigger than that.

[15:05:06]

He's saying he's dangerous for America, clearly wanted to get that off his chest, did it in a very kind of very precise Romney-like way, very clearly planned out. And then you had Donald Trump come out and, you know, also be vintage Donald Trump in the way he hit back.

But it did seem to me, aside from what you just played, Trump hitting back on a person level, on how he thought Romney was a failed candidate, he was a choke artist, he chickened out and didn't run this time because he was afraid of Trump, but also it seemed as though Romney did hit a nerve where he was talking about the central rationale for Trump's candidacy, which Trump would say, I'm a winner.

And Romney was saying, you know what? No, he's a loser when he comes to his business acumen, going through all of his failed ventures that Trump has engaged in, whether it was a magazine or the airlines and so forth.

Trump came ready with a list of some of his accomplishments and building especially around New York. That clearly, as much as he had his typical Trump bravado, seemed to hit a nerve.

BALDWIN: Do you think -- we heard from Mitt Romney and then John McCain released a statement. A couple other candidates have as well.

But do you think it would have been more powerful for Mitt Romney to have out of the gate said, all right, I'm not throwing my hat in the ring, I don't want to run for president, but here is who I feel so strongly about and endorse that person and then have the establishment party coalesce behind that non-Trump candidate?

BASH: It could have.

But the flip side of that is it also could have potentially hurt whomever that person he endorsed is, because the fact of the matter is, there is a real animosity out there towards the -- quote -- "establishment."

And it could potentially help one of those candidates say like here, where I am in Michigan, where Mitt Romney won very handily twice in the two times he ran -- he's popular here. He grew up here in Michigan, but big picture, you know, unclear.

The other problem is, and we should say, and this is something that Trump pointed out in very colorful language, saying that Romney could have dropped to his knees if Trump --

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: Hello, vulgarity much?

BASH: I know, back in 2012.

But he has a point. Mitt Romney did endorse -- excuse me -- he asked -- Mitt Romney did ask for Trump's endorsement, I should say, back in 2012.

And it was before, as Romney just said recently in a tweet just in the past hour, it was before Trump's comments on KKK or on Muslims or on Hispanics. But it was after Trump had made headlines over and over again with his birther comments on Barack Obama. It wasn't as clean as Mitt Romney is saying. And so he definitely is an imperfect messenger for the message that he had today, not just because he's part of the establish, but because of his former ties to Trump.

BALDWIN: Dana Bash, on point as always, thank you so much live in Detroit for us.

You just teed us up to have another big discussion here about all of this.

And joining me now, Kayleigh McEnany, CNN political commentator and Trump supporter. David Catanese is back with us today. He's the senior politics writer with "U.S. News & World Report." And Steve Deacey -- Deace -- excuse me -- syndicated radio talk show host and Ted Cruz supporter.

So, wonderful having you all on.

And, actually, let me begin with Dana's final point on sort of the notion that Trump said, you know, listen, Mitt Romney has begged for me to endorse him four years ago. The vulgar line, he would he dropped to his knees for me at the time.

Let's play the sound bite, if we can, Romney then, Romney now. Roll it. (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ROMNEY: Even though Donald Trump has offered very few specific economic plans, what little he has said is enough to know that he would be very bad for American workers and for American families.

Donald Trump has shown an extraordinary ability to understand how our economy works to create jobs for the American people.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: David, to you first. I mean, Romney had to have known that everyone will juxtapose two different Romneys. Do you think he should have mentioned that in the speech today?

DAVID CATANESE, "U.S. NEWS & WORLD REPORT": Yes, I do.

But it's funny. He had mentioned it in a tweet after the speech because I think he heard all of that exact reaction. Hey, what about 2012? There's been a lot of new that's come out about Donald Trump through this campaign, but a lot of his -- a lot of what he said, his misogynistic comments, Trump University, what he said about shipping jobs overseas, things that all the mainstream Republicans are attacking him for, they knew that that was all out there prior to 2012.

[15:10:03]

BALDWIN: Old news.

CATANESE: Now, maybe they didn't run the oppo on it, but this is the problem, and this is why people see

But this is the problem, and this is why people see politicians as hypocritical. When Mitt Romney needed Donald Trump, he was going to do what he needed to do. But now it's coming back to haunt them. And that's why I think Trump can point to Romney and call him one of the typical politicians that created his constituency.

BALDWIN: Kayleigh, what do you think, as a Trump supporter?

KAYLEIGH MCENANY, CNN CONTRIBUTOR: David's exactly right, especially on that last point.

Mitt Romney said in 2012 Donald Trump is far more successful than I am and went on to say how much Donald Trump understands the economy and understands China. And now here he is trying to diminish his business credibility. If, you know, Mitt Romney doesn't like certain things about Trump, that's fine, he's entitled to his opinion, he's entitled to let his opinion evolve.

But it is a very clear mirror image flip. And I think Donald Trump had the most salient point today when he said this is a guy who dismissed 47 percent of the electorate, who said I am not worried about the 47 percent who are dependent on government, who are dependent on the government for health care. That is offensive statement to dismiss half of the electorate.

It's the same elitist attitude we see out of the Republican establishment. It is wrong. Donald Trump has brought in this party ideologically and said no one's going to die on the streets on my watch, I'm bringing jobs back to America.

That is the message that is resonating. Romney just does not understand that and it's why he lost the election.

BALDWIN: Steve Deace, jump in. I want to hear from you.

STEVE DEACE, RADIO TALK SHOW HOST: Well, forgive me, Brooke, because I have got some background audio, but I could have sworn I just heard a Trump spokesperson complain about offensive comments.

Pot, kettle, kettle, pot, you're well-acquainted I think at this point. I mean, the problem with Romney's speech today is never Trump isn't a candidate. Venting about Donald Trump isn't a candidate. Everything Romney said about Trump, from the fraud to the sleaze to the lies, it's all true.

But you have to have an alternative. There's one candidate in this race who can beat Trump. He's neck and neck with him right now in the delegate count. That is Ted Cruz. So eventually if you want to vent about Trump, if you don't want Trump to be your nominee, you actually have to offer people an alternative and right now that alternative is clearly Ted Cruz.

BALDWIN: David, you looked like you wanted to jump in there. Did you?

CATANESE: Yes, the most glaring comment that Romney made in my opinion in that speech is that he didn't endorse, but he also said, if I was a voter, I would vote for Marco Rubio in Florida, I would vote for Ohio Governor John Kasich in Ohio, and then vote for Cruz anywhere else.

To me, that was indication he wants this to go to the convention and potentially be the unifying candidate. But he could have easily endorsed Marco Rubio. That seems like where he would be most likely inclined to go. He didn't do it. I think Mitt Romney still wants to be president and that one line where he had everybody winning their own states to stop Trump benefits Mitt Romney.

BALDWIN: Well, isn't that precisely what Donald Trump was saying, that he wanted to be in the race and that he was scared of Trump?

At the same time, I was talking to David Gregory, who I found very, very smart, and especially when it comes to this topic. He said, Brooke, maybe there's a possibility Mitt Romney wants to be that sort of unbiased, play that role at that convention if it comes time to have a brokered convention in the fall. Possibility?

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: Go ahead, Kayleigh. MCENANY: That's the problem with the Republican Party. It's a kingmaker policy, where it's John McCain's turn and then it's Mitt Romney turn.

And we are going to crown the next guy despite the will of the people. I absolutely believe that is why Mitt Romney said vote for Kasich in Ohio and vote for Marco Rubio in Florida because at the end of the day, he does not care about the will of the American people. The American people are speaking loudly.

They're saying they want Trump. But Romney and the establishment will do anything to dethrone him, even if it means thwarting the will of the electorate, which is wrong and undemocratic at its core.

BALDWIN: Well, I think if Mitt Romney were sitting here, he would probably disagree. And Romney supporters would as well.

But, Steve, I want to ask you about this, because actually kudos to our own Sara Murray. She first reported this, and we just heard this from Donald Trump, the fact that he was, you know, sort of saying, and then bragging that he would have enough funds or also from others to be able to self-fund if he were to win the party's nomination, he would be able to self-fund come general election time.

What do you think about that?

DEACE: I think that's probably about as true as most of the other stuff Donald Trump says is not.

The idea he is going to spend billions of dollars of his own money to win this thing when he has spent practically nothing up until this point, I just don't think that's credible.

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: Let me clarify. He will raise money if he wins the nomination.

DEACE: Well, then, Brooke, tell me why there's going to be a lineup of people around the country willing to say, yes, I would love to give $50 to $100 a month I don't have so a billionaire can fill out his last line of self-actualization.

I can't imagine why that wouldn't be a greatly successful fund-raising mechanism. Help a billionaire be great again. I just -- I don't think that's going to work, brooking.

BALDWIN: Kayleigh, you want to jump in and respond to that? How is that going to work?

MCENANY: Yes, that's ridiculous. Look at the turnout in all of these states. Every state except Vermont had record Republican turnout. There is excitement engendered on the Republican side.

[15:15:05] You have Democrats coming into the fold. You have independents coming

into the fold and turnout like we have never seen before because Donald Trump is energizing this country with a positive message and a will to fight for America first, bringing jobs back. That is his message. It's resonating. It's not about him being a billionaire. People don't see him as that. They see him as a messenger.

BALDWIN: Go ahead, Steve.

DEACE: I agree that Donald Trump is doing a great job of bringing Democrat progressives and independent progressives into our process to hijack it.

We have had two closed primaries. He's lost them both; 29 contests left on this calendar are closed when actual Republicans will get a chance to vote. So, I agree Trump is doing a great job of bringing liberal progressive voters into our process to hijack it. Let's see what happens the rest of the way, when actual Republicans get to make a decision.

MCENANY: And let's keep that small tent that has harmed the GOP in the last two elections. Let's not broaden out tent. Let's keep it as small as possible because that's really worked so far.

BALDWIN: OK, David, close us out, final thought.

CATANESE: I think the point that Sara Murray is reporting on that Trump may start to raise money actually is an important one because I think it undercuts one of his main themes.

I have been around the country and Trump supporters, the first thing out of their mouths is they say they like him because he can't be bought and he's not raising any money and he's using his own money and he can't be bought.

DEACE: Exactly.

CATANESE: And I think if this is true, if this reporting bears out and he starts raising money, I do think it undercuts some of that credibility that he gained with new voters that you guys were arguing about that he has brought into the process.

DEACE: Exactly.

BALDWIN: David Catanese, Kayleigh McEnany and Steve Deace, thank you all so much. Appreciate that, of course.

MCENANY: Thank you, Brooke.

CATANESE: Thanks.

BALDWIN: Of course, we will hear from the voters again this weekend.

Republicans and Democrats in five states head to the polls. Watch all day, live coverage of super Saturday right here live on CNN. Still ahead, Donald Trump knows how to rally crowds and grab headlines

here in the United States, but how is he perceived overseas? CNN asked people all around the world, what do they think about this Republican front-runner? We will play their responses for you come up.

Also ahead, Jeb Bush may have suspended his campaign, but one voter is pushing for him to get back to work, saying Jeb Bush may not be running for president any longer, but he has some unfinished business helping stop Trump from getting to the White House. We will speak with her live next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:21:29]

BALDWIN: Welcome back. You're watching CNN. I'm Brooke Baldwin.

One woman is begging Jeb Bush to get back to work to help bring down Donald Trump. She says this is no time for Bush to take it easy even after suspending his presidential bid.

So, she is with me now, the author of a letter to Jeb Bush. Danielle Allen is a political theorist at Harvard.

DANIELLE ALLEN, "THE WASHINGTON POST": Hi, Brooke.

BALDWIN: And hello. And a contributing columnist for "The Washington Post."

So, today, in a column entitled "Dear Jeb Bush, Help America Stop Trump," she writes this: "I have read that you are resting, getting some exercise and writing thank you notes. I can understand that. But you are a public servant and there's an epic battle raging for your country's soul."

Danielle, welcome. Let me just have you read a little bit more from the letter.

ALLEN: Thanks, Brooke. Here we go.

"Dear Governor Bush, the epic teamwork that still awaits you is the job of stopping Donald Trump. Marco Rubio can't do that by himself. John Kasich can't do that by himself. Even Ted Cruz can't do that by himself. March 15 is the next big battle. Can you help turn the tide in Florida?"

BALDWIN: All right, so on that, you know, for much of Jeb Bush's campaign, Danielle, as you well know, Jeb Bush failed to, you know, garner the support that he needed with voters. Why do you think a Jeb Bush endorsement would really accomplish anything here?

ALLEN: It's more than that I'm asking for an endorsement.

I actually think that Jeb Bush needs to hit the road in Florida. He was governor of Florida. He had a great record in Florida. There's lots of reason to think that he can help Marco Rubio a lot in Florida.

And they're at the point where the question is about delegate count, delegate math. And if Rubio can take Florida, if Kasich can take Ohio, if the three of them together can take a number of states together, they will be able to deny Trump the majority of delegates that he would need to make it to the convention, through the convention to the nomination.

We're talking about a contested convention here and there's a fight to be waged in every single state. And Governor Bush has an awful lot to give in the state of Florida in particular. We definitely need him in the fight.

BALDWIN: On Marco Rubio, famously, Jeb Bush is one of his mentees. It was widely reported through this campaign that Jeb Bush didn't really think Marco Rubio was ready for prime time.

But you write that proteges are not always grateful. Rubio never asked for Bush's endorsement in the post-dropout call. Do you think if there's any bitterness between these two that he could put his backing, Jeb Bush's, behind another candidate, almost the way that Chris Christie was able to with Donald Trump?

ALLEN: Look, I don't know about the personal interactions between these two, so I'm as far away from that as any other citizen. I only know this.

We are actually facing, I believe, a constitutional crisis in the presidency, potential presidency of Donald Trump. He's shown in so many ways he doesn't respect the Constitution with violations or proposed violations of the right to freedom of association, the idea that we should be registering Muslims, the idea that he should open up libel laws to push back at freedom of the press. That's another violation of First Amendment, that idea.

With his condoning of unlawful violence at his rallies and things like that, there's never any time ever that it's acceptable for a leader of a democracy to condone unlawful violence. He's called for taking out the families and children of terrorists. That's a call for a war crime.

[15:25:00]

Democracy cannot survive if its most prominent leaders advocate things of that kind. He is teaching us all to forget the fundamentals of what it means to have a democracy, respect for rights and so forth.

So, yes, we have a mess in our hands in our country. Politically speaker, we have all kinds of issues to deal with, immigration, economic security, political divisiveness, but you don't clean house by burning it down and that's what a vote for Trump would amount to.

And so as far as I'm concerned, since we're in danger of having the house on fire, we need everybody here and we need Governor Bush in Florida working as hard as he can for Marco Rubio.

BALDWIN: OK, Danielle Allen, thank you for your perspective.

At the same time, I just want to counter that. People are speaking. In the latest CNN poll, 49 percent favor Mr. Trump.

Danielle, thank you very much.

BALDWIN: Next, 78 of the most influential policy minds in the country band together to take a stand against Donald Trump. We will hear from one of them.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)