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Protester Charged After Rushing Trump Stage; Trump Blames Sanders For Chicago Clashes; Republican Blitz to Grab Delegates; Protests, Chaos at Trump Rally; Rubio Tells Ohio: Vote for Kasich. Aired 5-6p ET

Aired March 12, 2016 - 17:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[17:00:23] POPPY HARLOW, CNN ANCHOR: Top of the hour. 5:00 p.m. Eastern, 2:00 p.m. Pacific. I'm Poppy Harlow in New York.

Thank you for being with us. Up first this hour a tense and scary few moments for Donald Trump earlier today speaking on stage just days before the crucial winner take all primary in Ohio and in Florida. This man, accused of trying to jump a barrier trying to rush towards the Republican front-runner while he was on stage at an event in Ohio earlier today. Secret service stepped in, that man is now charged with disorderly conduct and inducing panic. This happened after Trump pointed fingers at the Bernie Sanders supporters that he says are to blame for the clashes that broke out last night before a planned Trump rally in Chicago. Trump's campaign eventually canceled that rally.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: The people that came there were so nice, and let me tell you. The people that were there that came there that were invited there, thousands and thousands of people, they caused no problem. They were taunted, they were harassed by these other people, these other people by the way, some represented Bernie, our communist friend. Now, really, Bernie should tell his people, there weren't many Hillary people there, you know why. I mean in all fairness to Bernie, the reason there weren't Hillary people there, they have no fervor, there is no fervor. Say what you want about Bernie. At least they have a little bit of fervor, right? But with Bernie, so he should really get up and say to his people, stop, stop. Not me, stop. They said Mr. Trump should get up and this morning tell his people to be nice. My people are nice, folks. They're nice.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARLOW: Sanders' camp responded to that in a statement today writing, as is the case virtually every day Donald Trump is showing the American people that he is a pathological liar. Obviously, while I appreciate that we have supporters at Trump's rally in Chicago our campaign did not organize the protest.

Let's begin with CNN Senior White House Correspondent Jim Acosta because he is at a rally and was there in Chicago last night and now you're in Kansas City where there is a very long line behind you to get into this Trump rally this afternoon and then across the street, Jim, a lot of protesters as well.

JIM ACOSTA, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: That's right. It's been pretty rowdy throughout the afternoon outside this venue in Kansas City Poppy where Donald Trump will be here in a couple of hours to speak. Just to give you a lay of the land here you, have got Trump supporters behind me in this very long line as you mentioned. And then across on the other side of the street you have the Donald Trump protesters. Now, the Kansas City Police Department has done something, I think that's pretty smart here, they put up these traffic barricades, basically separating both sides.

This is one of the traffic barricades right here. And these go up and down this street in front of this arena just to try to keep the peace. I think it's a pretty effective policing technique. Now, I did talk to a police supervisor here in just a few moments ago, they don't have any more police officers out here than they normally would have. He said they had a Hillary Clinton rally just here and they had the same number of officers devoted. But he did tell me yes, we are certainly aware of what happened last night in Chicago, what happened in St. Louis the other day. There are also some problems there.

And so they are trying to make sure that when they go into this rally tonight that they can keep the peace and make sure that nothing happens like what we saw in Chicago last night. And Poppy, I think the big question that will tell us whether or not we have a repeat of what happened last night in Chicago, is essentially do the protesters try to go inside. That was essentially what happened in Chicago last night. You had hundreds, really thousands of protesters who were able to get inside that event. They weren't stopped at the front doors. They went inside. They were able to disrupt the rally. And essentially causes the Trump campaign to cancel it. We haven't seen evidence of that yet where you see protesters really trying to go inside for the same purposes.

So, I think at this point that leads me to believe that maybe we won't have a repeat of last night but of course Poppy, we're hours away from Donald Trump speaking. We'll just going to have to wait and see. You can see these police officers going past me just right at this very moment, they are certainly well aware of the security situation that they are up against tonight -- Poppy.

HARLOW: Yes. Quite a line, quite a group and you hear their voices loud and clear there. Jim Acosta, thank you very much for that.

ACOSTA: You bet.

HARLOW: All right. Let's talk more about this as we wait for this Kansas City rally to begin with me now. CNN senior political analyst and advisor to four presidents, David Gergen, also with me are CNN political commentator Jeffrey Lord who a Trump supporter. Jeffrey, to you first here. I want you to listen to some of the sounds from Donald Trump talking about protests and protesters over the past month.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

[17:05:10] TRUMP: So, if you see somebody getting ready to throw a tomato, knock the crap out of them, would you? Seriously. I will pay for the legal fees, I promise. You know what they used to do to guys like that when they were in a place like this, they'd be carried out on a stretcher, folks. He is walking out like big high fives, smiling, laughing, like to punch him in the face, I'll tell you. In the old days, which isn't so long ago, when we were less politically correct, that stop wouldn't have happened.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARLOW: And then let me show you this video as well. Video of an African-American protester being sucker punched at a Trump event in Fayetteville, North Carolina this week. Jeffrey, what do you say to those who argue that the man throwing this punch, listen to Donald Trump and felt like perhaps they were encouraged. I know that is the opposite of what you believe. Is there any merit to those that argue that?

JEFFREY LORD, DONALD TRUMP SUPPORTER: I mean, I believe the man who threw the punch is responsible for throwing the punch. Just as I believe you know, as I said a few minutes ago, the African-American man at the Trump rally in Chicago last night who threw a punch at a Trump supporter is responsible for his actions. I mean, individual responsibility here. I mean, David is here and I don't know if David remembers this, but I took a look at what Governor Ronald Reagan did in 1969 in the people's park situation at the University of California in Berkeley. And I believe he called the protesters communists and sexual deviants as I understand the quote. It wasn't very nice. But certainly there were people who tried to blame Governor Reagan for the violence inciting violence. And it's simply wasn't true. The people who did the violence were responsible. Not Governor Reagan.

HARLOW: So I'm glad you bring that up. Because I mean, David Gergen, you know the history of this very well, adviser to four presidents. And you made the point last night on CNN by saying that Trump is not the first to get these large crowds, to get this outburst for Reagan and Obama's messages were very different, they were positive, Trump is not. But should that make a difference here to Jeffrey's point? Is this about command and control or is this about an opening a Pandora's Box?

DAVID GERGEN, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: It's about inciting and encouraging violence by a candidate, Ronald Reagan did (INAUDIBLE) I don't recall him ever inviting people to punch them to beat them up. And Donald Trump has done that repeatedly.

HARLOW: Donald Trump says, I'm just telling them to fight back.

GERGEN: Donald Trump has made the argument, I missed the good old days of when people acted up like this, they went out on a stretcher. And we don't do that anymore because we've become so weak. His argument, basically, is if you're strong, if you're passionate about your country and somebody disagrees with you at my rally, it's OK to beat them up. No. I think the candidate sets the tone are for his rallies, I think that's his responsibility. If Donald Trump is not willing to renounce violence and call for peaceful rallies and stand up in front of the entire nation and do that at his rallies, then he bears moral responsibility for any violence that ensues.

HARLOW: So Jeffrey Lord, I mean, to you David Gergen says, Trump bears moral responsibility for this. I mean, there is the argument to be made that Trump could have come out and said Chicago, I am so disappointed in what happened, this is unacceptable, period. Rather than pointing fingers saying who he thinks did it or not but he tweeted this and said, he tweeted the organized group of people many of them thugs who shut down our First Amendment rights in Chicago have totally energized America. Is that the response you wanted to see?

LORD: Yes. Absolutely.

HARLOW: Or did you want to be Donald Trump come out and condemn any sort of violence and say, it's not OK?

LORD: They were thugs. Well, first of all, he is not -- I mean, he has condemned violence, number one. But number two, these were thugs, this is exactly what they were doing. And as a matter of fact, when he says in the good old days they would be carried out in a stretcher, again I go back to what then Governor Reagan did. He sent in the troops, one man was killed. People were gassed. I mean, it was a pretty serious thing and the media of the day was all over Governor Reagan and blamed him for this. So --

GERGEN: Was the media wrong, Jeffrey? Was the media wrong, if they sent in the police and people got killed?

LORD: Look, if you remember, David, Ronald Reagan was elected partly on the platform that the administrative system of the universities in California were too soft on leftist protesters who were taking over the colleges. And you know, in the name of free speech eliminating free speech.

GERGEN: Yes.

LORD: He's with (INAUDIBLE) and act on as governor.

GERGEN: Jeffrey, I'm --

HARLOW: Let me get David in -- let me get David in to respond. David?

GERGEN: Yes. So, first of all let me say I join you in believing that Donald Trump has had -- has a legitimate right to be heard, he has made claims and I think to his credit that he has amassed a very large following, he's brought a lot of voters into the Republican ranks, he's done things in politics that very few ever could have accomplished. At the same time, he has unleashed a rhetoric of hate and a rhetoric that leans towards violence, he relishes when people are carried out of his rallies and there are things being shouted at them. And people are aiming to take punches at them. He seems to relish that. And to me I don't understand as a Trump supporter why Trump supporters like you who are so respected, don't believe that he has a responsibility what goes on his rallies.

[17:10:44] I would remind you that 2008, at the Sarah Palin rallies when things ugly things were said about Barack Obama as the candidate and there was air of violence in the air, it was John McCain had the guts to stand up to the people in his own base and people who were swearing at Obama and say, stop it. You know, we're going to treat this man with decency, we disagree with everything he says but we're going to do this with decency. I don't understand why you're not calling for Donald Trump to do the same thing.

LORD: David, he's done this. I mean, let me make it as plain --

GERGEN: He doesn't in footnotes. And he doesn't and I mean, then he calls for violence in blazing color.

LORD: What? I'm sorry? I didn't hear you.

GERGEN: He has repeatedly, at least a half dozen times, last night there somebody on the air here on CNN said, well, it's only be twice and he's been joking. I'm sorry, it's been repeated. It's been over a half dozen times. And he's done that in very loud volume and this oh, I condone violence, is an afterthought to cover his tracks.

LORD: David, David, of course he doesn't condone violence. He said in his statement that was issued today that he did what he did last night so that everybody could leave in peace and be fine and they were. But we've got to get to the root of why do people keep showing up and committing violence at these rallies?

GERGEN: They are not committing violence. They are bringing signs.

HARLOW: Guys, I need you to stay with me. The control room is just talking to me. I have to take you to Cleveland, Ohio. Hillary Clinton is speaking live. We'll get back to that.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

HILLARY CLINTON (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: If you see a bully stand up to him.

(APPLAUSE)

It should not -- it should not need to be said that America belongs to all of us, not just to people who look one way or worship one way or even think one way. I believe America is strong when we are all strong. So we have to build on the progress that we have made under President Obama. We have to help more of our neighbors and our fellow citizens get the good jobs, the good schools, and the good health care they need and deserve. We have to work together to keep our families and communities safe.

And we have to stand together to resist the forces of division and discrimination that are at work right now. To divide us one from the other. Us versus them. However you define us and however you define them. Now, diversity --

(CROWD BOOING)

Well, as I was saying diversity is a strength, not a weakness.

(CHEERS AND APPLAUSE)

And I do believe that all of us, all of us have to recognize the intense feelings that are at work in our country today. We have to see each other's humanity, lift each other up, and I do think we have to show more love, kindness and respect toward one another as well. I want you to know that I'm running for president to tear down all of the barriers that hold people back. I want us to work together to build ladders of opportunity to empower every American so that every single person especially young people, have a chance to live up to their God given potential.

(CHEERS AND APPLAUSE)

We got to knock down the economic barriers that stand in the way of people getting good jobs, with rising incomes. It's absolutely clear that in many places in our country including right here in Cleveland, there aren't enough jobs, people are not able to find one that gives them and their families a good living, that enables them to provide a better future for their children. I have a very comprehensive approach to creating more good jobs and raising incomes.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARLOW: Hillary Clinton speaking live in Cleveland, Ohio. We'll continue to monitor this. Also I want to point you to tomorrow morning, when a lot of the presidential candidates will join our Jake Tapper on State of the Union. John Kasich, Donald Trump, Marco Rubio, Bernie Sanders all live with Jake Tapper 9:00 a.m. Eastern tomorrow right here on CNN. Quick break with be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[17:19:24] HARLOW: Senator Bernie Sanders and Donald Trump pointing fingers at one another as to which candidate supporters sparked their clashes in Chicago last night. Videos surfaced last night of people at the Trump rally holding Bernie Sanders signs and some demonstrators could even be heard chanting the Senator's name. Now, Senator Sanders is speaking out.

Jeff Zeleny joins me from Chicago. You were there, you saw it all. Look, Sanders isn't saying my supporters weren't there. He is saying we didn't tell them to protest, we didn't incite any of this where as Donald Trump is saying you are responsible. What do we know?

JEFF ZELENY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: That's correct, Poppy. The minute we arrived that, the rally outside the rally last night, the worst in Bernie Sanders signs and Bernie Sanders supporters, not surprisingly so. Because Bernie Sanders was actually having a rally not far away in Chicago just about an hour or so later. And, you know, that was on a college campus. There are a lot of Bernie Sanders supporters on college campuses. But it's clear that there were a lot of Bernie Sanders supporters in attendance and many signed up to attend this Trump rally.

But to say that the Sanders campaign organized the protests, the Sanders campaign says that's simply not true and there is no evidence that we have found to actually support that. MoveOn.org, a liberal group and another local liberal groups were organizing protests but Senator Sanders had a news conference earlier today in Chicago and he took on directly the criticism that Donald Trump has said that his campaign was firing up these protesters. Let's listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BERNIE SANDERS (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: When our supporters are doing is responding to a candidate who has, in fact, in many ways encouraged violence. When he talks about you know, things, I wish we were the old days, when you could punch somebody in the head. What do you think that says to his supporters?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ZELENY: And then just a short time ago the Sanders campaign released a statement even adding to that saying that Donald Trump is quote a pathological liar by saying that accusing the Sanders campaign of organizing these protests and Donald Trump was calling out this in rallies today, calling for Bernie, so a little back and forth, Poppy. No evidence that the Sanders campaign organized these protests yesterday.

HARLOW: All right. Jeff Zeleny live for us in Chicago. Jeff, thank you very much.

Let's talk more with David Gergen. I want to bring him back in here to continue the discussion we were just having with you and Jeffrey Lord. We're trying to get Jeffrey Lord back. So, if we do, we'll bring him in on here. But let's talk about that because I have a few of the quotes here from Donald Trump over the past few months about these protesters. February 23rd, rally in Las Vegas, talking about a protester, he says the guards are being gentle with him, and he says, quote, "I'd like to punch him in the face. I'll tell you that."

And then in Iowa, on the 1st of February, on a David, caucuses, Trump said knock the crap out of them would you seriously, OK, knock the hell, I promise you I will pay for the legal fees, I promise, I promise. Now, that is in response to the protest, it's not saying start these protest, et cetera. OK. But here's what he told Jake Tapper on Thursday night in the CNN GOP debate when he was asked about it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JAKE TAPPER, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Do you believe that you've done anything to create a tone where this kind of violence would be encouraged?

TRUMP: I hope not. I truly hope not. I will say this. We have 25, 30,000 people, and you've seen it yourself, people come with tremendous passion and love for the country and when they see protests in some cases, you mention one case, in which I haven't seen, I heard about it, I don't like, but when they see what's going on in this country, they have anger that's unbelievable. They have anger.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARLOW: And he went on to say, David Gergen, they love this country, there is some anger, there's also great love for this country.

GERGEN: There's no question, there is great anger in the country and much of it is justified. You know, people are angry at political elites and I think much of that is justified both of the left and right. But Donald Trump has been contradictory here. He told Jake at that debate that he didn't -- he certainly hoped he didn't have anything to do with this, and yet repeatedly when he's at the podium he has called for it. So, you know, and so his supporters can say, well, look, he doesn't condone violence, he said he's against violence. But then he goes up and calls for it. You know, so you have to -- and he does it repeatedly, and seem to take joy from it.

Now, a couple of things about Chicago I do think are deserve further scrutiny, and that is Donald Trump claims that those were thugs who came in last night. That's a pretty strong word. Not Bernie Sanders supporters, they were thugs. And many, many Trump supporters believe that. But my Twitter account, I'm sure you lit up with Trump people saying you're wrong, this is their fault, they came in, they actually did, they organized in order to disrupt and squelch his free speech. We need to know about who these people are. Their reports are that there were people who were for Bernie Sanders who were not connected to his campaign, organized a petition, got 11,000 people saying I'd like to come, 19,000 were more interested.

[17:24:26] And that began in MoveOn.org got involved so we do need to know what the story was. But there is something else we need to know. I'm really curious to know, why did the Trump people choose the University of Illinois? This is a school that has traditionally and historically been associated with social activism. There is a lot of diversity in this campus. Chicago is red hot on questions about the police, everything else there. This is a city that's reached a boiling point on a couple of occasions recently. The faculty and the staff wrote to the university and said, you ought to call this off. It's too dangerous. Did the Trump people know that? And if so that they intentionally --

HARLOW: Can David, can you really make that leap? This is a state that is voting in three days.

GERGEN: There are a lot of other venues. Now, let me just say, they are all blaming, you know, Trump people are blaming the protesters. Now, let me just ask you, if you go into a site where you know there is a lot of social unrest and there are a lot of folks who don't like you, and if you're the guy who holds up a red flag to a bull and the bull comes charging, who bears responsibility? The bull or the man holding up the red flag?

HARLOW: David Gergen, thank you very much. I'm told we're out of time. GERGEN: Thank you.

HARLOW: But we will have you -- you're on with us the rest of the program.

GERGEN: OK.

HARLOW: Stand by. Also, an important programming note. We will see the democratic candidates tomorrow night, we have a live town hall event from Ohio right here on CNN tomorrow night with Bernie Sanders and Hillary Clinton. 8:00 p.m. Eastern only right here.

Coming up next, call it Super Tuesday part three. Our John King breaks down the delegate math for next week's big contest of Tuesday's votes including the critical winner take all primaries in Florida and Ohio, could Trump be unstoppable in the coming days? Much more of that, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[17:29:58] HARLOW: The Republican candidates are on a campaign blitz today, they are hammering three states especially hard, ahead of Super Tuesday number three. Take a look at that map. Well, a lot of stops for them today. Ohio, Missouri, Florida, these are key states in their quest for enough delegates to nab the Republican nomination.

Our John King is with us to break down the delegate map, what you need ahead of this week's contest -- John?

JOHN KING, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Poppy, it's hard to overstate the stakes on Tuesday if you want to stop Donald Trump Tuesday's voting will go a long way to determine whether that's a reasonable scenario. A quick look at the delegates. Five states up for Democrats and Republicans. A look at the numbers. 367 delegates at stake Tuesday. Nearly 30 percent of what it takes to win. A big pool in these battleground states. Enters at 461 in the delegate chase. The magic number is 1237.

So, Poppy, imagine if the Donald Trump runs the board. If Donald Trump runs the board and wins them all, just around 800 delegates. At this point, the Trump train becomes a run away train. The dreams of stopping Donald Trump of keeping him from 1237 become problematic, because if he runs the board he needs roughly 44, 45 percent of the remaining. That will be in his reach.

It's so important. You heard Marco Rubio's campaign say, hey, vote for John Kasich in Ohio. Why? If Kasich wins in Ohio Trump is still way ahead but knocks him back. He'd need to win 55 percent of the remaining delegates. If Rubio can win his home state of Florida and take those 99 delegates, knocks Trump back more.

Again, Trump in the lead, but if this happens, Rubio wins at home, Kasich wins as home, the Stop Trump movement thinks they have him to the convention. In the sense if Trump ends the night with a big lead but in the 630 range he would have to win 60 percent instead of 40, 45 percent if he runs the board. This is key to stopping Donald Trump, here, or they think they can keep him from getting a majority, probably still in the lead but they would not get him to 1237 or if the Donald Trump runs the board, forget about it -- Poppy?

HARLOW: Forget about it.

John King breaking down the math. Thank you so much.

John will be with us live on Tuesday night as those numbers start rolling in.

Appreciate it.

Coming up, President Obama gives his take in Austin, Texas, last night on the GOP front-runner Donald Trump's surge. We'll talk about that.

Also ahead, why is Marco Rubio telling Republican voters, votes you think he wants, but he's telling them in Ohio they should back their governor, John Kasich. John mentioned it. We'll dig into the strategy, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[17:35:50] HARLOW: We're standing by live in Kansas City, Missouri, where a crowd of supporters is waiting to hear from GOP frontrunner Donald Trump. And across the street there, as you see, a crowd of protesters. It has been a tense day following last night's chaos at a canceled Trump rally in the heart of Chicago. Trump called it a planned attack. He pointed his finger at Bernie Sanders supporters, who he says are to blame for causing the disturbance ahead of that Trump event. And also he says they caused the disturbance in Cleveland at a Trump rally. Sanders released a statement calling Trump a pathological liar and saying, quote, "Our campaign did not organize the protest."

Back with me CNN political commentators, David Gergen and also Jeffrey Lord, a Trump supporter.

Thank you both for being here.

Before the violence last night, President Obama spoke in Austin, Texas, and he sort of mocked, he pointed to the GOP establishment and said I can't believe you're shocked about this. Let's play it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: How can you be shocked?

(LAUGHTER)

This is the guy, remember, who was sure that I was born in Kenya.

(LAUGHTER)

Who wouldn't let it go. And all this same Republican establishment, they weren't saying nothing. As long as it was directed at me, they were fine with it. (END VIDEO CLIP)

HARLOW: Jeffrey Lord, to you first.

When you listen to what the president said here, saying where were you, why didn't you speak up sooner, what do you say?

JEFFREY LORD, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: First of all, just for the record, I believe the president was born in Hawaii in 1961. Aloha.

(LAUGHTER)

Look, this whole birther business, I have to say, this -- and this is a side issue but typical of what goes on here. Barack Obama is about the fifth or sixth president or presidential candidate who has been accused of not being born in the United States and therefore unqualified for the office. The first one, by the way, was Chester Allen Arthur in 1880. You know, from Chester Allen Arthur on to George Romney and Barry Goldwater and John McCain and now Ted Cruz. I mean this is -- you can like it or not like it, but the implication, is there is something racially driven when, in fact I mean, this is simply not the case.

(CROSSTALK)

HARLOW: You don't believe there is? Bernie Sanders points to the fact, he says, my father was born in Poland. No one says anything about me like this because my skin is white.

LORD: And you see there you are right there. That is -- an example of Bernie Sanders playing the race card. Look, this is a political party that is raised on the race card. Historically speaking, as I'm sure you heard me say before, they are on record having supported slavery, segregation, lynching, the Klan, et cetera. Today, it's racial quotas, illegal immigration by skin color, and they appeal to people based on race. And I suggest that it's morally wrong. And Bernie Sanders just did it right there.

HARLOW: So, David Gergen, let me ask you this. Wherever you fall on this argument, there is the question to be asked, as ugly as this has become at points, is there any benefit to society that this is playing out on a national scene, even if it's a very uncomfortable conversation to have, that this nation is forced to have it, that you two gentlemen are debating it on this program right now?

DAVID GERGEN, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: I think it was very helpful when Jeffrey said that. He and Van Jones had conflicts and got into a serious conversation. And my hope, the silver lining out of Chicago and the cancellation of the rally is that it can bring all of us to our senses about the possibility of violence in these rallies and violence in our politics, and the polarization can boil over into violence. I do think that, unfortunately, sadly, that the divisions and the racial divisions have gotten deeper and wider during the Obama years. I think -- and I do this there's underlying racism that goes into that. I must tell you, in the beginning, I thought the president could have

reached out. And I think the president working with the Republican Congress, he says they have been opposed the whole time. That is not true. There were times when they -- he could have gotten with the Republicans. The White House didn't want it, Lamar Alexander.

Look, I'm glad Jeffrey is back. I want to say one other thing, if I might, about the --

[17:40:24] HARLOW: Sure.

GERGEN: -- the issue coming up repeatedly on Twitter from Trump supporters that the Bernie Sanders people did disrupt, they went in with the intention of disrupting, didn't come from his campaign, but went in with the intention of disrupting. It does seem to me that Trump supporters are right in saying that Bernie Sanders ought to call to his supporters to not disrupt in any way that's provocative that brings this -- Donald Trump deserves to have a place.

(CROSSTALK)

HARLOW: -- you want to hear from either candidate.

GERGEN: I would like to hear more from Bernie Sanders as well as Donald Trump.

HARLOW: David Gergen, thank you. Stay with me.

Jeffery Lord, you are both back with me again. I got to get a break in. Thank you so much.

Coming up next, Marco Rubio with a surprising message to voters, Republican voters you would think he would want in Ohio. He is telling them don't vote for me, cast your vote for someone else. I'll get reaction from Ohio's Republican Party chairman, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[17:44:57] HARLOW: It is one of the big political prizes up for grabs on Tuesday. That is the Buckeye State, Ohio, a winner-take-all primary, 66 Republican delegates at stake. Ohio Governor John Kasich has staked his campaign on winning his home state. He does have a high approval rating, 77 percent, as governor. Can he take it away? A lot of polling shows Trump ahead of him.

Let's talk with Matt Borges, chairman of the Ohio Republican Party and a supporter of Kasich.

Thank you for being with me.

MATT BORGES, OHIO REPUBLICAN PARTY CHAIR & JOHN KASICH SUPPORTER: Hi, Poppy. Good to see you.

HARLOW: Our polling shows Trump ahead overall. FOX News poll has Kasich ahead. We'll see what the voters think. That's all that matters. Your candidate said today regarding this try lens that broke out in Chicago last night ahead of the Trump rally.

Here is what your candidate said.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOHN KASICH, (R), OHIO GOVERNOR & PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Donald Trump has created a toxic environment, and the toxic environment allowed his supporters, and those that sometimes seek confrontation, to come together in violence. There is no place for this. There is no place for a national leader to prey on the fears of people who live in our great country.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARLOW: But what about those who argue, where was Kasich, where were the other members of the GOP establishment during the past few years as some in the party attacked the president, President Obama, with false claims, talking about where he was born, his citizenship, and many of them stood by. Where was he then?

BORGES: Well, John Kasich has been running a positive campaign throughout this entire effort in his run. I don't think anyone would argue otherwise.

All those things that you brought up were actually created by the Democrats, created by Hillary Clinton in 2008, and some of the wild things that Donald Trumps say --

(CROSSTALK)

HARLOW: What? What?

BORGES: -- we just don't think are representative of our party and ---

(CROSSTALK)

HARLOW: What -- wait. What do you mean? What do you mean? What do you mean when you say those were created by Hillary Clinton?

BORGES: I mean the birther movement -- I mean the birther movement -- I mean the notion that somehow --

HARLOW: You think Hillary Clinton is to blame for --

(CROSSTALK)

BORGES: -- came out of the --

HARLOW: You're saying Hillary Clinton is to blame for the birther movement?

BORGES: Those things came out of the 2008 -- those things came out of the 2008, very ugly Democratic primary that went on, on their side, that lasted until June. And then, of course, Barack Obama became their nominee and ended up winning the presidency. HARLOW: But can you clarify for me how you're pointing to Hillary

Clinton for starting the birther movement against the current president?

BORGES: I think it's well documented that that was, in fact, where this all came from, the 2008 primary, that the Clinton campaign started these rumors about Barack Obama, and they were still able to come together as a family for the Democratic party. Our party will heal. And on Tuesday, when John Kasich wins the Ohio primary, we'll start to set this election on a much different course.

HARLOW: Hillary Clinton -- we're going to move on, but Hillary Clinton never asked for the president's, then-Senator Barack Obama's birth certificate. Donald Trump led a lot of it. And a lot of people, and Mitt Romney wanted Donald Trump's endorsement, and got it at the time. He was a leading candidate on your side.

Let's move forward. Marco Rubio had a surprise message to a lot of voters in your state in Ohio. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. MARCO RUBIO, (R), FLORIDA & PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Clearly, John Kasich has a better chance of winning Ohio than I do and if a voter in Ohio concludes that voting for John Kasich gives us the best chance to stop Donald Trump there, I anticipate that's what they will do.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARLOW: When you heard that, what did you think, hearing Rubio say don't vote for me, vote for Kasich. What did you make of that?

BORGES: De facto endorsement of John Kasich for the Ohio primary. We'll take all of the help we can get. One of his main supporters and a delegate to the convention for Marco Rubio, a county chair here and the sheriff of Montgomery County, which is where Dayton, Ohio, is, Phil Plummer (ph), sent out a robo-call to known Rubio supporters today encouraging them to join him in voting for John Kasich. And so all that kind of encouragement and help for John Kasich's campaign helps us. The momentum is clearly on his side as you mentioned --

(CROSSTALK)

BORGES: -- the latest poll shows John Kasich up by 5 points here in Ohio, and I think he'll win on Tuesday.

HARLOW: Do you read it as Rubio thinking that this is the best way to stop Trump, and also not feeling very threatened by John Kasich overall, saying you can take those delegates, go ahead?

BORGES: Well, I think that Marco Rubio's not going to win his home state on Tuesday and John Kasich is going to win Ohio on Tuesday, so really, that probably makes this down to a three-person race, and what his motivation for that was I guess doesn't really matter in the end. What he's asking Ohio supporters of his to do is to vote for John Kasich on Tuesday and we're looking forward to having their support and happy they're going to be doing that.

[17:50:00] HARLOW: The latest polling from CNN shows Trump ahead of Kasich overall. 41-35 percent, but where Trump wins really is the economy. And when it comes down to the economy, that has been a main point of Governor Kasich in his states added 400,000 private sector jobs and unemployment has come down, but yet, Donald Trump is resonating more on the economy. And a lot of this could come down to trade and the fact that Donald Trump is saying stop all these free trade agreements. Kasich has been a proponent of it. Does he need to change his messaging on that before Tuesday?

BORGES: When we were in Dayton yesterday, at a company that has brought American jobs back to America from China, we've got one candidate that's out there talking about all he's going to do to bring jobs back from China and one who has made hundreds of family's lives better by bringing jobs back from China, that's John Kasich. He did that here. He's added 415,000 new private-sector jobs since he was elected governor in 2011. So it's someone who has a record of accomplishments, balanced the federal budget when he was in Washington, has changed the economy here in Ohio, turned it around. Inherited an $8 billion budget from the worst governor in Ohio history, Ted Strickland, who wants to come back, we'll stop this that year. But -- and then --

(CROSSTALK)

BORGES: -- has a $2 billion surplus. So Governor Kasich should win on Tuesday and, like I said, that will set this race in a much different direction.

HARLOW: We will watch what happens Tuesday.

Running out of time. Appreciate you being with me, Matt Borges. Thank you.

Also, I want to point you to what happened today at a Trump campaign event. A protester rushing the stage, marched out by the Secret Service. At the top of the hour, we will have new video of the man on that stage. I'll bring you the latest, straight ahead.

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[17:55:43] HARLOW: In Detroit, which saw nearly three feet of snow this winter. People there know not to count out winter too soon. Neither does this week's CNN Hero. Veronica Scott designed a convertible coat for the homeless that turns into a sleeping bag at night. She says that's not all it does.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

VERONICA SCOTT, CNN HERO: The jacket itself was meant to offer people warmth and a little bit of pride, because you see so many people on the streets that are wearing somebody else's trash, somebody else's throw away. So it was about creating something made specifically for them.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARLOW: You can see more of veronica's story, go to CNNheroes.com. While you are there, nominate who you think the 2016 CNN Hero should be.

Coming up, we are standing by for Donald Trump's last rally of the evening in Kansas City, Missouri. You see long lines there. People already lining up to see him, one day after violence forced him to cancel a rally in Chicago that was supposed to take place last night. We will take you live at the top of the hour to Kansas City.

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