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Dow Turns Positive for 2016; Economist Warns that a Trump Presidency Could Pose a Risk to Global Economy; Cisco's Chuck Robbins Says the Country Needs a Uniter; SeaWorld Ending Orca Breeding Program; Ashley Judd Appointed U.N. Goodwill Ambassador; U.N Tackling Inequality and Violence Towards Women; Singapore Changi Named World's Best Airport. Aired 5-6p ET

Aired March 17, 2016 - 17:00   ET



ELENI GIOKOS, HOST: The Wall Street closing bell rang an hour ago on St. Patrick's Day, and of course, the markets were green to go with it. It's

Thursday, the 17th of March.


GIOKOS: And tonight, bedlam in Brazil calls for the President to quit as her predecessor suffers another legal setback.

South Africa's finance minister fiasco is back sparking uproar in parliament. And I'll speak to the director of "Blackfish" after Sea World

says it will stop breeding whales.


GIOKOS: I'm Eleni Giokos, and this is "Quest Means Business."

Well, very good evening to you.


GIOKOS: And tonight, Brazil is tearing itself apart over a political crisis that is getting deeper by the hour.

A short time ago the lower house of parliament approved a special committee to consider impeaching President Dilma Rousseff, this as protesters flood

the streets around the country.

Earlier today, a judge suspended the controversial swearing in of former President Lula da Silva, as Rousseff's Chief of Staff. Opponents say the

appointment was an attempt to shield Lula from a corruption investigation. It follows the release of recorded phone calls between Lula and Rousseff.

[speaking foreign language].


GIOKOS: Well as the scandal grows, Brazil's government looks more and more like a house of cards that could topple over at any moment.


GIOKOS: First there's Lula da Silva and he's being investigated for bribery and money laundering involving the state owned company, Petrobras. As

protesters outside the presidential palace called for him to be jailed, Dilma Rousseff stood by the former President and she called him my dearest

colleague. Rousseff is facing calls to resign and she has gone on the offense instead targeting the judge who released her phone calls with Lula.

That judge is Sergio Moro and the President says his decision to release the recording is an affront to the presidency and a flagrant violation of

the law.


GIOKOS: Joining me now is Rafael Romo, and he's CNN's senior Latin American affairs editor. Rafael, thank you very much for joining us. And the reality

is this is a very dramatic event that occurred but at the same time, they are coming out - they are coming to the fore and at least investors can

make decisions based on the realities on the ground at the moment.

RAFAEL ROMO, CNN SENIOR LATIN AMERICAN AFFAIRS EDITOR: Yes, definitely. And it's just a very complex story. Just in the last 24 hours Eleni, there was

the announcement from President Dilma Rousseff that she was going to name her predecessor - imagine this her predecessor, Luiz Inacio Lula da Silva

as her chief of staff.


ROMO: A move, as you can imagine strongly criticized by her opponents as an effort to shield him from prosecution. In spite of the criticism, the

President swore in Lula early this morning while protesters shouted shame. And that's the word of the day in Brazil, shame and supporters were

chanting Lula's name to the tune of a football chant. Not an hour had passed before a federal judge issued an injunction saying he would block

the appointment on grounds that it violates the free exercise of the judiciary power. And finally, as you mentioned, this afternoon the

Brazilian congress formed a committee test with starting impeachment proceedings against President Rousseff.


ROMO: As "The New York Times" put it this morning, Eleni, Brazil is looking more like an aspiring Banana Republic right now.

GIOKOS: Well, thank you very much for that update. And Brazilian traders are now betting on impeachment.


GIOKOS: The (inaudible) jumped more than 6% on Thursday and investors believe a new government may be able to pull Brazil's economy out of

recession. Now the Real also saw strong gains and it rose around 2.7% against the dollar.


GIOKOS: And joining me now, we've got, of course, an analyst that is going to give us a little more insight into this and we've got Alberto Ramos, a

senior Latin American economist with Goldman Sachs. Thank you very much Alberto for joining us today.


GIOKOS: Are we're talking about a country that is dealing with recession, basically a little earlier we were talking about you were saying it's

depression, not even stagflation. Where to from here for this economy that was once viewed the shining light of the emerging market.


RAMOS: No doubt about it. Tremendous challenges we are living through a period of -- with an enormous amount of uncertainty. You're talking about

political uncertainty, social, economic, judicial. We need to overcome all those challenges. This is an economy with double digit inflation. It's an

economy that has experienced contraption of historical proportions in terms of the cumility of decline, in per capita GDP. This could be a recession

that will match the so-called loss decade of the '80s. So the onus is now on the authorities to deliver the policies that are needed to rebel the

economy, to lift the animal spirits so that we can stabilize the economy and eventually move to a better place.

GIOKOS: Well you've got problems with commodity prices, you're talking about annual spurts, we've got spurts coming through in the political

scene. How does that complicate the credit rating scenario that Brazil faces down the line?

RAMOS: I mean, on current trends, it's inevitable that you may see additional rating downgrades. You know, this is a story where you know --

it's not inflation that is in double digits, the fiscal deficit is in double digits. Public debt, the GDP is growing at a very fast rate.


RAMOS: So we need to deliver the policies that change the medium term fiscal trajectory. If you're not able to deliver that, I think additional

rating downgrades are quite likely.

GIOKOS: Well, let's take a look at the overall economic problems and to what extent the political scenario has actually had a significant impact in

terms of what Brazil is facing at the moment.


RAMOS: It's another source of uncertainty again contributes to keep the animal spirits quite depressed. Important investment and consumption

decisions continue to be delayed. As long as that is the case you know we won't see the economy stabilizing. We don't see any signs that the economy

is about to stabilize.


RAMOS: This is a very deep recession, very broad, very prolonged recession. It's basically reaching the water mark of a two-year contraption with

probably more still to go. Very, very significant challenges in front of us.


GIOKOS: Well Alberto, the reality is, I mean let's go back before this drama actually occurred, before the economy fell into recession. We were

looking at an economy where we saw a lot of excitement, part of the bricks nations.

RAMOS: That's right.

GIOKOS: How long will it take to get out of the down cycle? I mean this is going to take a while isn't it?

RAMOS: That's right. I mean it may take a while. You know the extraordinary favorable external conditions that were behind, you know the golden years,

you know the very strong performance of the Brazilian economy, very strong capital inflows into an economy that has a very low domestic savings rate,

very high international commodity prices contributed to leverage the performance of the economy. There was also significant slack in the

economy, there was a credit boom, there was also a very significant expansion of fiscal transfers, nothing like that is going to - is being -

is going to happen in front of us. We have already ten consecutive quarters of declining investment spending. The capital stock of the economy --

GIOKOS: Would that change if commodity prices started to swing higher?

RAMOS: It will help - it will help, no doubt about it, it will help. But I think you know the problems that we have are structural. The problems that

the Brazilian economy is facing today are not short term cyclical problems. Most of them are structural long-term problems that need to be addressed by

structural reforms, fiscal and other.

GIOKOS: What are you telling investors right now? Is it a good time to get into Brazil? Buy when it's slow, do you think it will downslide? I mean,

you know, how do you read the bottom at this stage?

RAMOS: It's very difficult to have you know much clarity because of all the you know the political uncertainty, the political friction.


RAMOS: What's going to happen in the very near term and whether they are going to have a political transition in the very near term you mentioned at

the beginning of the segment, that congress is currently discussing you know the potential impeachment of the President.


RAMOS: So we need probably to see volatility subsiding a little bit, having a little bit more clarity in terms of the policy outlook, in terms of the

political outlook in order to make a strategic bet on you know, in terms of financial - financial --

GIOKOS: So wait and watch is what you're telling me.

RAMOS: That's right.

GIOKOS: Watch it very closely.

RAMOS: That's right, that's right, that's right.

GIOKOS: All right, Alberto, thank you very much for your time sir. Next, another (inaudible) country caught up in a bizarre political turmoil.


GIOKOS: South African President Jacob Zuma is facing calls to resign over a scandal in his finance ministry. Coming up right after this.




GIOKOS: Welcome back, South Africa's President has dodged calls for him to step down over claims that a wealthy and influential South African family

offered the job of finance minister to a member of his cabinet.

South African opposition leader, Mmusi Maimane called for Jacob Zuma's resignation inside parliament. Maimane asked if the Gupta family had indeed

offered the job to deputy minister Prediksi Jonas as he claims.


MMUSI MAIMANE, LEADER DEMOCRATIC ALLIANCE: Is Minister Jonas in fact lying? Because if in fact he is, or he's not, is the President willing to take

accountability for the decision and resign in front of the people of South Africa? [ cheers ]

GIOKOS: Well, moments later the speaker of parliament asked Miamane to leave sparking uproar in the chamber.


GIOKOS: And back in December, South Africa went through three finance ministers in just one week. And we've got Jacob Zuma of course firing

(Nene) and then replacing him with a relatively unknown person (David van Rooyen) as you can see there in the middle and then Zuma backtracked and

handed the job to Pravin Gordhan who had previously served as finance minister prior to Nhlanhla Nene.

Now the deputy finance minister, and (Prediski Jonas) says he was offered the job by the Gupta family. A powerful clan with ties to Zuma.

Now South Africa's Central Bank in the meantime today has raised its key interest rate to try boost the rand.


GIOKOS: of course the Rand has come under significant pressure over the past year. It has bumped it up by a quarter of a percent to 7%. Now the

Central Bank admits the recent political developments are having a major impact.


GIOKOS: A little earlier today I spoke with the managing director of ETM Analytics in Johannesburg and I asked what the finance ministry scandal

tells us about South Africa's economy.


GEORGE GLYNOS, MANAGING DIRECTOR, ETM ANALYTICS: I think there is two ways we can look at this. I mean, yes, we can look at it with a great deal of

frustration that things have got to this point already but you know I'm tending to look at this in a more positive way. Purely because a lot of

these shenanigans have come to the fore and we finding out about them it says quite a lot about South Africa's freedom of speech. It says quite a

lot about social activism, if you like, and the fact that the pressure has been building for some time to clean up government and to make it a more

functional organization.

And to the extent that this information is coming out, I think you can even see it in the market, in a peculiar sort of way. Even though the - even

though the information that's been released has not been all that good in terms of news, the markets haven't reacted all that badly at all. In fact,

the rand posted an amazing recovery through the course of today and only part of that was related to the FAMC decision.

Some of it, I believe, was related to improving local perceptions because all of this is eventually going to come to ahead. I think there is a lot of

political pressure now within the ANC that's also becoming apparent which is going to put pressure on those in government to get their act together

and to start becoming more accountable for their actions.

GIOKOS: Well, George, is the government going to get its act together? They're worried about the fate of Pravin Gordhan worth an investigation, of

course, which is underway, as well. We're concerned about the credit ratings agencies and what the world perceives of South Africa and whether

we can actually start going on the right political path without any political interference.

GLYNOS: Quite right. And I think those are very valid and important concerns. I don't want to down play them at all. I'm simply highlighting

that there is an alternative view out there that suggests that in fact, it's good news that we are in a country that allows us to be able to

elevate these points to a level where I think the pressure is going to build to the extent that something is done about it.

GIOKOS: So George, what are you pricing in right now? What is the fate of South Africa's finance ministry?

GLYNOS: So at this point, we are still looking for South Africa to slide into (inaudible), not so much because of the political shenanigans as much

as we just don't believe that the budget that was announced in Feb went quite far enough. We think that they could have done a little bit more. We

still think that some of the growth projections that they built their budget around were a little on the optimistic side.

So at this point, we still have South Africa sliding towards (inaudible). Of course that's not a guarantee but we think there is a pretty high

probability thereof.



GIOKOS: Right, and that was George Glynos joining us from South Africa. Now, the South African Chamber of Minds says it's concerned about the Gupta

family's influence on the businesses. Charmaine Russell is the chamber spokesperson. She joins me now on the phone from Johannesburg, and a very

good evening to you. How concerned are you and or course we've seen actually a lot of big mining houses selling assets in South Africa. Is this

part of the pressure felt on the ground?


CHARMAINE RUSSELL, CHAMBER OF MINDS SPOKESMAN: Good evening. Yes, the chamber is concerned, it is the concern that we've made. Today we issued a

statement and that has raised the concerns about it. It's certainly allegations of (state capture) are things that we take very, very

seriously. But I don't believe that that has an impact on the (inaudible).

GIOKOS: Well, let's also take a look at the fate of a lot of the minds. This has actually been in conversation for quite some time, we've been

talking about nationalizing some resources, looking at strategy resources the debate is still currently on going. Do you think that this is going to

be a deterrent to investment within the sector?

RUSSELL: Two things. The first is I think that the issue of nationalizing has died down quite substantially over the last number of years, it's

certainly not the policy of the (inaudible). But yes of course it was allegations (inaudible) certainly have an impact on the (inaudible). But

the challenge with the mining sector has been in crisis. Every day the mining sector has been in crisis quite frankly.

And what our industry in South Africa particularly is policy stability and certainty. As well as the fair and transparent implementation of law from

the (inaudible). So allegations of corruption and undue political influence, certainly have an impact. Money companies in South Africa are --

have large offshore shareholders and we know that the mining sector may delay (inaudible).


GIOKOS: Right, thank you very much for that, Charmaine. Much appreciated. South Africa' Miners aren't the only ones under intense pressure. The

country's steel makers are also struggling with competition from overseas markets.

As I discovered, South Africa's steel industry is in danger of complete collapse. In fact I went back to my hometown and discovered that a steel

plant that I basically grew up watching and seeing at work has collapsed.


GIOKOS: This is the sad state of the South African steel industry. The only sound now, the wind against abandoned metal. After 50 years in operation,

Evraz Highveld Steel was forced to shut its doors.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You know the people that are leaving us today they have 35, 40 years' service, they and haven't worked anywhere else. It is not

nice, obviously. It's terrible.

GIOKOS: Once queuing to access the plant for a day at work, and now waiting for letters of unemployment.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It's like end of the road for everyone, especially me having kids, a family, wife, you know, it's certainly killed for my entire

dreams and plans.

GIOKOS: This is the consequence of the global steel glut, and cheaper Chinese imports the industry says. But how much cheaper is Chinese steel

relative to the structural steel that you've been producing?

JOHAN BURGER, CEO EVRAZ HIGHVELD STEEL: Chinese steel at the beginning of last year was probably in the order of 20 to 30% cheaper. But it's because

of subsidization by the government. You know we are not against competition, so if you're not cheap enough, you know that is fine. But

it's impossible to compete with subsidized imports.

GIOKOS: During the good times, this plant produced over 60,000 tons of structural steel every single month. It is the only place in Africa that

produces this type of steel, and now walking in the empty hallways, there are only small reminders of the 2,000 strong workforce that used to operate


75 steel companies country-wide have cut capacity with 7,000 jobs lost since last year. A cautionary tale for a subsidiary of the world's largest

steel maker, ArcelorMittal South Africa virtually on its knees.

This is all (inaudible) steel destined to become (inaudible) barely makes margins on this product. The company says that the (inaudible) tariff that

it's going to be implemented on Chinese imports will barely help the industry.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I think the steel industry around the world is on its knees.

GIOKOS: Dean Subramanian is the acting CEO of ArcelorMittal South Africa, and he says without further government assistance, many plants like these

could face closure. What would a closure mean for (Fundavale Park)? What would it mean for this town?

DEAN SUBRAMANIAN, CEO, ARCELORMITTAL SOUTH AFRICA: It would shut down this town. This place would be a disaster.

GIOKOS: For employees, like (Johan Hartzer) there is still hope after 32 years in the industry.

(JOHAN HARTZER, EMPLOYEE OF ARCELORMITTAL SOUTH AFRICA): I will do everything that is possible to make this steel industry still survive and

still even maybe create a future for my son to maybe also one day become an engineer.

GIOKOS: As cycles come and go, the industry's resilience will be tested. Thousands of jobs depend on it.


GIOKOS: Right, a former human trafficker opens up about his ugly past. We'll find out how hundreds of young women in India are being sold into

slavery (inaudible) that story coming up next.


GIOKOS: Well this week, CNN's Freedom Project is shedding light on a dark part of the tea industry. Some of the young tea pickers in India make so

little money they fall prey to human traffickers. And the last in our three part series, journalist Mohammed Lila talks to a convicted trafficker who

admits to selling girls into domestic slavery or worse.


MOHAMMED LILA, JOURNALIST: For many trafficking victims, this is where their modern-day slavery begins, loaded on crowded trains headed for a life

of bonded labor. But for the people behind it all, it takes months of planning. Do you still remember her, her face?

(Paul Le Jen) is a convicted trafficker who spent four months behind bars admitting he tricked young girls from tea plantations with promises of a

better life. He agreed to talk to us, and as we drive through town, he describes how he was the middleman taking three girls to Deli knowing they

might never come home. How much money were you paid for taking these girls to Deli?

[Speaking foreign language].

LILA: It works out to less than $200 American dollars per girl.

Do you think that's okay to take money and send these girls away and they never come home?

[speaking foreign language].

LILA: Traffickers like (Paul le Jen) specifically target young girls on tea plantations. He says it was an easy way for him to make some quick money.

To find out why, we head to the nearest police district.

Sub inspector, Bora, nice to meet you. I'm Mohammed with CNN's Freedom Project. When girls go missing, it's Sub Inspector Bora's job to find them.

[speaking foreign language].

LILA: So he just said there are about 20 or 30 cases of trafficking just in this one district alone. Most of them are girls who work and live on tea

plantations sometimes making just pennies a day with no education and no hope for a better life. Why are there so many cases of trafficking

involving families or girls from these tea gardens?


LILA: If you ask me, the Sub Inspector says, people who work on tea gardens are financially poor, they're uneducated and they have a lot of debt so

they need a lot of money. And that makes them perfect targets. Hundreds have been tricked by phony placement agencies who promise them jobs and

money that they can send home. Instead, they are sold into bonded labor or the sex industry with no way to escape.

Back at the railway station on the very same platform where he took these girls away, this trafficker insists he's a changed man. If you had the

chance to do it again and you knew 100% you couldn't get caught, would you do it again? Would you put more girls on a train like this?

[speaking foreign language].

LILA: But beneath his remorse, there's an even darker reality for every ex trafficker like him, there are dozens more waiting to take his place.

For the CNN Freedom Project, Mohammed Lila, in (inaudible) Northeastern India.


GIOKOS: All around the world, people are trying to make a difference in the fight against human trafficking like those you just saw. On our website you

can find stories from hope - of hope from courageous survivors and links to charities helping in that global battle. Just go to


GIOKOS: In a moment, why one publication thinks Donald Trump could actually be a risk for the global economy. Stay with us.



GIOKOS: Hello, I'm Eleni Giokos, coming up in the next half hour of "Quest Means Business." The Hollywood star Ashley Judd tells me about her role in

"stopping violence against women." And I'll speak to the director of Blackfish after SeaWorld announces it will stop breeding killer whales.

First, these are the top news headlines we're following for you this hour.


GIOKOS: Brazilian lawmaker haves approved a special committee to consider impeaching President Dilma Rousseff this as protests have swept the

country. Earlier on Thursday a judge suspended the controversial swearing in of former President Lula da Silva as Rousseff's Chief of Staff.

Opponents say the appointment was an attempt to shield Lula from a corruption investigation.

The United Nations - the United States rather has declared that atrocities carried out by ISIS in Iraq and Syria are genocide. Secretary of State John

Kerry says the terror group is bent out on wiping out Christians, Yazidis, and other religious minorities, that don't agree with its beliefs.

Germany says a possible threat has forced it to close two diplomatic facilities and a school in Turkey. This follows Sunday's suicide bombing

that killed at least 35 people in Ankara. An offshoot of the PKK rebel group called the Kurdish Freedom Falcons has claimed responsibility for

that attack.

Switzerland's attorney general has opened criminal proceedings against FIFA's former secretary general, Jerome Valcke and is being investigated

for criminal mismanagement. Last month he was banned from world football for 12 years after breaching ethical rules at footballs governing body.

China has voiced its opposition to new sanctions levied against North Korea by the United States. The White House announced the sanctions on Wednesday

saying they are in response to Pyongyang's "elicit nuclear and missile activities."

It's a stunning turnaround for U.S. stocks. The DOW has recovered from the brutal two months and is now up since the start of the year. The latest

boost came from the Federal Reserve and it has announced plans to slow the pace of rate raises this year and the DOW had been off nearly 2,000 points

in late January as oil prices plummet in fears about the health of the global economy gripped investors.

Now, "The Economist" warns that a Donald Trump presidency is one of the biggest risks facing the global economy. The publications intelligence

unit says a president Trump could start a global trade war and encourage jihadist in the Middle East with his militaristic tone. Robert Powell is

Senior Editor of The Economist Intelligence Unit and he now joins us this evening. Thank you, sir, for joining us.


GIOKOS: It's great to have you on the show. When you have a country that is holding over $1 trillion worth of T-bills, -- and of course I'm alluding

to China holding $1.2 trillion worth of U.S. T-bills. Surely you don't want to disrupt that relationship. What would a Trump presidency do to

that relationship?

POWELL: If you're a businessman, you don't really want to disrupt that kind of trade when at the same time, Trump himself as a businessman imports

a large quantity of goods from China. So it seems a little bit odd for him to be in effect escalating towards some kind of trade war with China. And

he also rather contradicts all his talk about trying to make friends. So it isn't probably the best direction to go, but it's worth noting that

China might have little choice but to dissolve some of the bills because he has up to $100 billion a month or spending of $100 billion a month on

foreign exchange just to prop up her renminbi at the moment.

GIOKOS: Well I mean, apart from that you're talking about protection rhetoric that has come through. What would that do to global trade?

POWELL: Well, it's a big concern because of course, we got NAFTA. He voiced a very strong opinion against that and not exactly delighted

Mexicans. However, TPP which came in January with Asia and the American states, which the World Bank estimates would increase global GDP some -- by

the member states by some 1.1 percent by 2030. All of that will be lost and it would be a huge disruption, not just global trade but economy and

also geopolitics, as well.

GIOKOS: Doesn't sound good at this stage. Take us through big points you're looking at now as a major risk in a Trump presidency.

POWELL: There was sort of three key themes. He does kind of change his opinions with the weather. But there are three things to pick out of it.

First of all, as you've already identified, against free trade and all that will be lost from that. Obviously, the "Economist" since 1843 has been

very, very keen on free trade. The second thing is you do have this strident anti-Muslim rhetoric, which would actually harm alliances,

particularly across the Gulf States.

[17:35:00] And then thirdly you have a lot of anti-immigration, and actually just generally the divisiveness of his campaign, which won't

really help. It's been pretty dysfunctional administration under Obama, but would be a whole lot worse under a Trump presidency.

GIOKOS: And terms of relations with the international community, with other politicians and presidents, what are you pricing in by way of that?

POWELL: That's a good question. I think everybody would try to make friends, at least for a little while, but unless he did some pretty major

180s and turn back from the world, change language his to China about manipulating the currency, it could leave the U.S. quite isolated.

GIOKOS: We have a lot global risk that we're facing at the moment. You've got emerging market turmoil, you're worried about what is happening in the

Middle East and so forth. In terms of what the biggest risk is right now, where does Trump fall into the greater scheme of things?

POWELL: Well, we have these top ten risks and he's sort of in the middle. The number one is, as you say, the China hard landing scenario, which is

taking a lot of our attention at the moment. If you're looking at its debt levels in particular, it's now surpassed Japan before it had its long, long

stagnation. It surpassed the United States before the big financial crash of 2008. So we feel it's quite possible a reckoning here and would have a

huge spillover effect for the rest of the world economy.

GIOKOS: Fantastic, sir, thank you for your time. Great to have you in the studio with me.

Like the CEO of Cisco says he might support Hillary Clinton in this year's election even though he's a Republican. Chuck Robbins says he's not

supporting Donald Trump because the American economy needs a uniter. Mr. Robbins spoke with CNN's Poppy Harlow.


CHUCK ROBBINS, CEO, CISCO: People are frustrated. I think they are frustrated. And they're frustrated with a lack of action. They are

frustrated with a lack of commitment for Washington and our leaders to truly sit down and work on the issues and try to get to a compromise. What

we ultimately need is a leader who will bring these sides together and actually begin to solve the problems that the people care about, and I

think that's what they want.

GIOKOS: Who is that leader now?

ROBBINS: Well, I think that each side has a set of interesting candidates, and I think that, you know, if you press me on the Republican side, I

actually think John Kasich has shown great results in what he did in Ohio. He's done a phenomenal job. But I think Hillary is a great candidate on

the Democratic side. I think they both --

POPPY HARLOW, CNN ANCHOR, CORRESPONDENT: You're are Republican saying Hillary is a great candidate.

ROBBINS: I know, isn't that shocking? I hope my dad not watching.

HARLOW: You're not buying the GOP frontrunner right now, Donald Trump. A businessman like you.

ROBBINS: Well, I think some of his policies are very good. I just think that what we need is we need someone who will bring the country together.

That's what I believe.

HARLOW: And you don't see that in him?

ROBBINS: Well, I think that to date what we need is people who talk about the issues and really get at and also just really they spend time trying to

bring both sides to the center so that we can actually solve the problems of the country.

HARLOW: Let's talk about the FBI and Apple and this -- just the bigger picture debate here. As the CEO of one of the biggest technology companies

in the world, how do you balance the, what is determined to be the public good by the government and private industry and the need for privacy? How

do you balance that when technology is advancing so much faster, frankly, than the applicable laws?

ROBBINS: Yes. I think that's the issue you just brought out that technology is moving faster than the laws are. So on this topic, I sort of

three points. The first is we need encryption. You need encryption. If we're going to achieve the benefits we talked about earlier relative to

healthcare and your patient records moving around the internet, you want that information encrypted. So we need it.

We don't need backdoors in technology. There should never be backdoor availability that's created, you know, quietly for governments to use.

It's just not right and you would just simply expose that to those who would like to use it for negative implications, terrorists, criminals,

whatever they are, and they will find a way to use it if you open the backdoors up. What we believe is that -- we actually believe that in the

House, that there's a committee that has been discussed that would actually look at these issues, bring in experts, and actually build the legislation

in light of today's technology and then that's what we need to operate under and where we think we need to get to.

HARLOW: So what about the Apple/FBI debate now then? You have a partnership obviously with Apple but --

ROBBINS: We do. Well I think we signed an amicus brief to support Apple from the position that the old Writs Act is being used to try to get them

to actually go modify their code. We don't believe that's realistic or viable. What we believe is that Congress needs to take a look at this

overall issue. Again, communicate with the experts and come up with a legislation that they believe that we all need to operate under and that's

what we'll have to do.

[17:40:00] HARLOW: Government needs to catch up with tech.

ROBBINS: In a sense, yes.


GIOKOS: SeaWorld says society is changing and it's changing with it. After years of criticism, it's making a major change to its controversial

orca program. We'll be speaking to the director of the film that puts SeaWorld under the spotlight. Don't you go anywhere.


GIOKOS: SeaWorld is making a historic change. It's ending the controversial killer whale program. SeaWorld says it will no longer breed

orcas and the current generation of the whales swimming in it parks will be the last among others. Investors cheered the news with shares closing

higher by more than 8 percent. Commercial pressure on SeaWorld has been intense in recent years as campaigns against keeping whales in captivity

have grown in strength. The company share prices almost halved since 2013. The president of SeaWorld San Diego Park explained the decision.


JOHN REILLY, PRESIDENT, SEAWORLD SAN DIEGO PARK: The world is changing, and in the case of orcas, it is an attitudinal change that we helped

create, and now we need to change too. These announcements show that SeaWorld is listening and changing. We are working toward new ways to

deliver on our purpose. We want every guest who walks through the doors at SeaWorld to be inspired to take action to help protect wild animals and

wild places.


GIOKOS: Well, that fall in share price came not long after the release of the CNN film "Blackfish" that focuses on one of the SeaWorld orcas. The

film's director, Gabriela Cowperthwaite, described the announcement by SeaWorld as a defining moment. Gabriela joins us on the phone from Los

Angeles. Thanks so much for your time, Gabriela. And you've also said that we'll be part of the generation that says, "I can't believe that we

used to do that." Where to go from here, where do you think the fate is of people now engaging with wildlife but in a more humane way?

GABRIELA COWPERTHWAITE, DIRECTOR, "BLACKFISH" (via telephone): Well, you know, I think it's the future. I think it's the future. I think that, you

know, the idea that SeaWorld is making these meaningful steps and changing could mean that they are really going to be part of this conversation

about, you know, being what it means to be humane and conservation and all these things. I mean they are a multibillion-dollar company. They're

lending their resources to this conversation of being humane and conservation and saving the oceans and what not, then this is a seminal

thing that's happening.

GIOKOS: Let's look, and again, I'm quite curious, for people that have been going to these parks and watching the orcas, of course, we've seen

that many people have stopped actually going. And this is why the share prices actually have been going down for quite some time. What would that

new model look like where people are able to engage with wildlife?

COWPERTHWAITE: You know, I think what we would ultimately do eventually is to hope for a sanctuary model, the sea sanctuary model, which is retiring

orcas into ocean pens, so they are sort of in the ocean and can echo locate on new objects and novel objects and really be -- see what it feels like to

be a killer whale for the first time. This is a very dignified and sustainable way of retiring these animals to a more human setting. That

said, you could make this a visitor center. People would be -- this could be a profit-making endeavor if it need to be. Where people would be going

to see killer whales doing what killer whales are meant to do and not, you know, performing their silty tricks and all that. So there is a way to

take care of animals that can't be returned to the wild. And I think the sanctuary model is the future.

[17:45:00] GIOKOS: Gabrielle, let's look at just the notion of breeding at these parks. What is your next move? Are you going to be taking another

project on?

COWPERTHWAITE: You know, there is always -- it's in my DNA for sure and hoping to keep myself in that conversation, and worked just on a film just

recently, but this one not about orcas. But no, I hope to continue kind of safeguarding this message that, you know, it appears to be picking up steam

from the likes of SeaWorld. So yeah, hopefully, we're in for some kind of a changing of the guard.

GIOKOS: I mean, I'm asking you this because, you know, your documentary started to have a lot of clout in this move. Do you think that it had the

desired effect? How much influence do you think it had?

COWPERTHWAITE: You know, I always sort of think of it in -- I think it struck a nerve for sure. I think in a way, some of these changes were

hopefully inevitable. I think we're seeing a movement toward humane practices with animals. With factory farming, you know, with Cecil the

lion, with conservation efforts and I think that people are starting to think this way in general. So I think the film "Blackfish" struck a nerve.

It hit that movement in the epicenter. And so, you know, we were part of a larger conversation as a result of it.

GIOKOS: Well it not just about these types of facilities, Gabriela, because you can extend the conversation further to the likes of zoos and so

forth. What is your assess the of the way that thing are going to play out going forward when we talk about a new generation that is viewing wildlife

and animals very differently?

COWPERTHWAITE: You know, I do -- I have my own sort of feelings about it. I have not been the researcher, made a movie about zoos and everything, but

I've learned is there are ways to treat animals in human care. You know, for animals that cannot be returned to the wild that are humane. And I

think I mentioned the sanctuary model for orcas. There's also the sanctuary model for a lot of -- you know there's tiger sanctuaries, there's

elephant sanctuaries for animals that retire from the circus.

And so it's really just a free roaming area that hopes to approximate what that animal would encounter in the wild. And you know, is it a perfect

system? Of course not, but it's possibly the most sort of humane, you know, structure that we might have for animals that can't be returned to

the wild now. So I would hope the whole movement, you know, goes towards sanctuaries and that tiny, tiny cages are for free roaming sentient,

intelligent animals are things of the past.

GIOKOS: Fantastic Gabriela, thank you very much.


GIOKOS: And the United Nations newest good will ambassador Ashley Judd has told me that she wants to try to end violence against women in all its

forms. Earlier this week the actor and activist was appointed in the role by the United Nations Population Fund. I sat down with her and the

Executive Director of the U.N. FPA, Babatunde Osotimehin and asked why in 2016 girls were still being forced into child marriage.


ASHLEY JUDD, ACTRESS, ACTIVIST: Thank you for having us. And you make the perfect point. It's related to structural inequality. So there's a

persistent attitudinal norm that a girls sexuality needs to be protected. So that's one of the push factors. So she's forced into a marriage to

which she has neither consented, about what she hasn't been informed, and obviously, against her will. And then within that so-called union I don't

call sex with a child marriage sex, I call it rape. Her sexually integrity and bodily autonomy is routinely violated. So I appreciate the fact that

you would bring it up as we discuss very simply and plainly, it's completely unacceptable. And it's absolutely is linked poverty. It's

linked to lack of universal access to quality primary and secondary education.

GIOKOS: Well as a U.N. Goodwill Ambassador what do you hope to achieve?

JUDD: Eradication of all forms of gender based violence.

GIOKOS: I mean it's almost, you know, when you're trying to get your head around how many people are effected on a day-to-day basis, you know, a lot

of work need to be done. What kind of tools do you have to get eradication going?

[17:50:00] BABATUNDE OSOTIMEHIN: EXECTIVE DIRECTOR, U.N. POPULATION FUND: We have tools. You, know, there is global legislation. There is national

legislation. There is local legislation. What we do and what we continue to do is to work with communities to make sure that we make them accept and

sustain the abandonment of these things. And that's what Ashley is so qualified to do. Because as a global citizen and knowing many other parts

of the world, and being able to go there and say, "You know, this is not acceptable."

GIOKOS: Well, let's take a look at the maps of Sub-Sahara Africa where you see it's still being relatively prevalent. What is interesting to note is

that using a lot more women being involved in government, and a lot more minister are female. But yet on the ground it's a very different story

when it comes to land rights. When it comes to access and so forth. What kind of progress do you foresee within this space?

JUDD: Well again, I think you make a very good point because the solutions are universal and they're holistic. Every part of the social structure has

to be included. There needs to be legislation. And that legislation need to be enforced. We need to end impunities. So child brides have access to

justice and then when they have access to justice, they need social support. They need livelihood, skill acquisition and also of course, if we

economically empower boys and men, they are less likely to try access a child bride as a source of cheap labor. And as a source of reproduction

for creating more cheap labor.

GIOKOS: Babatunde Osotimehin when you look at the growth rate across South Africa, when you look at the close birth rates around the world. We've

seen some numbers increasing. However, you've got inequality, which is increasing in tandem to this. Let's talk about the demographic dividend.

Let's talk about how we can actually bridge that gap so we can start eradicating the very serious issues that we're talking about.

OSOTIMEHIN: The inequality you talk about is global. The inequality in Africa is talk. And so in a sense, what Ashley just talked about is one of

the most important answer points. Working with adults and girls. Making sure they go to school and they stay in school. They are educated. They

have skills. They can make choices in their lives. If you do that, what you're going to have is that you'll have families that are that rights

based and then you'll have communities in which you'll have women who have been empowered to make changes happen. You cannot translate that into

national systems or subnational systems. It is about education, education, education and empowerment of women and goals. That's where it's going to

come from.


GIOKOS: Air travel is a lot of hurry up and wait and where you wait makes all the difference. The world's top airport has been announced and we'll

show you around. All that after some "MAKE, CREATE, INNOVATE."


GIOKOS: Speedy security lines, some restaurants, and lots and lots of seats, and that's what makes the best from an airport. Visitors to

Singapore's Changi get much more. It's just been named as the world's best airport for the fourth year running. Travelers can spend their layover in

a rooftop swimming pool, a butterfly garden or one of the airport's two movie theaters. Those luxuries become even more important when you're

traveling around the world on budget airlines and that's what our Richard Quest is actually doing and he's recently passed through Singapore as you

can see on this map.

[17:55:00] None of the other airports he has visited made the top ten list. And Richard filed this report from the home of the world's 23rd best

airport, Sydney. Let's take a look.


RICHARD QUEST, CNN ANCHOR: Day six and we have made it half way around the world from where we began, we are of course, in Sydney, Australia. The

flight from Singapore was my first experience of the long-haul, low cost airline in this case it was Scoot. We even had the CEO on board who pushed

the trolley selling the duty frees. Whilst the flight attendants danced in the isle. Now, from Australia after I've taken the picture, and then had a

local food, we start the long trek back to the northern hemisphere. Crossing the Pacific to Honolulu, on to Los Angeles, to New York, and then

back to London. Remember what this is about, it's how the low-cost carriers have changed the way we fly. So it's ten airlines across nine

countries in eight days, with one journey in low-cost. Richard Quest, CNN, Sydney, Australia.


GIOKOS: So of course, as Richard travels around the world, I'm standing in for him this week and we'll be back with more QUEST MEANS BUSINESS in just

a moment.


[18:00:00] GIOKOS: Welcome to the future, at least according to the cult classic "Back to the Future," in the movie Martin tries some sneakers that

do themselves up. And that is exactly what Nike has just unveiled. Nike's HyperAdapt 1.0 shoes run on rechargeable batteries. They have buttons to

adjust just how tight you want your laces. Take a look at that. It's futuristic footwear but no word yet on what you'll be paying for it.

And of course a reminder, if you want a daily digest of the day's top business stories, delivered to your inbox, subscribe to the QUEST MEANS

BUSINESS newsletter featuring Richards, Profitable Moment, and all the top headlines from the rest of the CNN Money team. Just go to to subscribe and that's QUEST MEANS BUSINESS for today. I'm Eleni Giokos. The news continues right here on CNN.