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Taliban group claims responsibility for an attack at a park in the city of Lahore, Pakistan; Bernie Sanders sweeping democratic races in three crucial states; protests are growing through the weekend in both North Carolina and Georgia; 3-4p ET

Aired March 27, 2016 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ORIN LIEBERMANN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: He tells me what we pass to the next generation is not only the key, but also the way you respect other religions.

At 4:00 in the morning on Holy Thursday, the Armenian orthodox offer their prayers, next the Franciscans, then Greek orthodox, and others. Judah protects the church key for all of them. It's a model of coexistence dating back centuries that can serve as a lesson of interfaith harmony, even to this day.

Orin Liebermann, CNN, Jerusalem.

[15:00:31] ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.

FREDRICKA WHITFIELD, CNN HOST: Hello again, welcome to the NEWSROOM. I'm Fredricka Whitfield.

We begin with breaking news out of Pakistan, a Taliban group now says it was targeting Christians in an attack at a park in the city of Lahore, Pakistan. At least 63 people now have been killed, 315 injured in this suicide bombing and most of the victims are women and children. And the Taliban says that the timing of the blast was no coincidence. It was meant to happen on Easter Sunday.

CNN international producer Sophia Saifi is on the phone with us from Islamabad.

So Sophia, what more do you know about this Taliban group and why they did this?

SOPHIA SAIFI, CNN PRODUCER (on the phone): Fredricka, what we do know is that this group is a faction of the Pakistani Taliban. It is known as (INAUDIBLE). They said that the reason behind their attack is to combat the Pakistani state and to show them that they are still very much in power. They still have a lot of control and that they will continue this fight against the Pakistani state. They have actually been responsible for the attack that happened just this month in the northwestern city of (INAUDIBLE).

Like you said, most of the people who died in this attack, who have been killed in this attack, are women and children. The attack took place at around 6:00 in the evening on Easter Sunday. It was very close to the amusement park section of the park, where they have rides and Ferris Wheels. And that's why a lot of the children are amongst the dead in this attack.

A three-day period of mourning has been announced in the province of Punjab and the death toll is expected to rise - Fredricka.

WHITFIELD: And Sophia, you know, leading up to this, does this completely catch people flat footed, or have there been any other indications of potential turmoil or that the Taliban, any Taliban related groups might be looking for an opportunity to strike?

SAIFI: Well, Fredricka, the city of Lahore itself is very peaceful compared to other places where there is militants in Pakistan. So along the border with advance and in those cities you will see more concern, more fear, more attacks, but the city of (INAUDIBLE) - the city of Lahore where this attack took place, it has caught people by surprise. It's always been (INAUDIBLE) that there is a problem of militant in that province, but there has not been an attack of this scale in previous month or within in the past six months or a year in the city of Lahore. There was fear there would be pushback against the military's ongoing, you know, operation against these militants in northwestern Pakistan, but it has still taken people by surprise. There are over 60 people dead, over 300 people injured. It's quite shocking and scary - Fredricka.

WHITFIELD: Yes. Shocking and quite horrible.

All right. Thank you so much, Sophia Saifi. Appreciate that.

Also following breaking news in Belgium. Police in Brussels using water cannons to break up protests at the memorial site to last week's terror attack victims. People who gathered at the site to honor victims were confronted by protesters raising their arms in Nazi salutes and shouting anti-immigrant chants.

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WHITFIELD: Also this morning, police in Belgium carried out 13 new raids in connection with Tuesday's attacks. Nine people were initially taken into custody and four are still being held.

Let's bring in CNN's Cristina Alesci and CNN's Alexandra Field in Brussels, who is reporting on new information about some of the victims.

So Alex, you first, what can you tell us about the investigation there and the victims?

ALEXANDRA FIELD, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Fredricka, we know this. We saw people who came out here in the square today to honor the victims, to honor the fallen. They had had what was supposed to be a peaceful demonstration in support of those who died, those who suffered. This is a city that's been left reeling. They were met by people who wanted to express, frankly, fear and anger. We did see some clashing between the demonstrators who were out here today. But so many people are trying to keep the focus on those who lost

their lives this week. We know 31 people died during the double attacks, three of them suicide bombers, 28 victims, 14 in the metro station, 14 at the airport, and now the very painstaking work of identifying all those victims is still being done.

We know that 11 of them have been identified as foreign nationals, 13 of them are Belgium nationals, but there are seven people who are yet to be identified. We spoke to officials about why this is such a lengthy process and they tell us because of the extent of the injuries, they really need to do very elaborate work to properly identify people. That means not just DNA testing, but also looking at dental records, also speaking to family members.

And again, because of the proximity of some of the victims to the bombs themselves, the injuries were so extensive that this work really does take some time, we're told, by the officials. That, of course, has been very difficult for the families who are waiting now for days for confirmation about what happened to their loved ones.

There's also the added complication here of the fact that there was so many international people who are in that airport, of course. So we spoke to the foreign ministry office here and saying they are working with more than 100 embassies trying to coordinate the giving of these details and these information to so many different parties so that these embassies can get in touch with the right families in each of these countries, Fred.

WHITFIELD: And Alexandra, now can you speak to the concern that may be sweeping that country about the images that have now come out, the conflicting images of those who are there in peace, you know, paying homage to those who have been killed and injured, being met by folks who are chanting anti-immigrant slogans and even, you know, raising their arms like they were saluting Hitler or something. What has been the expressed concern about these two very different images in Brussels right now?

FIELD: Look, it speaks to the tension, it speaks to the stress that the people in the city are living under, not just this week, not just in the days since these bombings, but given the fact that people here have been living under this fear of another attack for some four months now, really since the Paris attacks, since the manhunts for terrorists began in this city. So you saw that erupt in this square, where people wanted to come and focus on the victims.

We heard from officials yesterday, they had asked people to call off a peace march that was planned for today, people wanted to come here to honor the fallen in those attacks, but officials said don't do it today. They've got too much police work to do. They have got too much investigation to do. They didn't want to devote police resources to the square to watching this march. So what was meant to be called off, you did have people who wanted to come out and honor the victims and they were met by some of those angry demonstrators, angry protesters, some of them setting off fire crackers, some of them giving this salute to Hitler. It all came to an end within about the space of an hour when police in

riot gear came into the square. They were able to push those demonstrators back. They had crowd control vehicles that were equipped with water cannons. At one point, they had to let some of the water out as the demonstrators dispersed.

But what we're seeing out here tonight, Fred, right now, candles lit in the square, people here to remember those who were killed in the attacks this week.

WHITFIELD: All right, Alexandra Field. Thank you so much in Brussels there.

So, again, about seven people who have yet to be identified. But we are still learning more about some of the other victims who had been identified in Tuesday's terror attacks in Brussels at the airport there and train station.

Let's check in with Cristina Alesci with more on the information gathered about them - Cristina.

CRISTINA ALESCI, CNN MONEY CORRESPONDENT: So on Friday we heard from U.S. officials that said that there were two Americans that died in the attack. Today, we know who they are. Justin and Stephanie Schultz. They were working in Brussels. In fact, they had plans to return to the U.S. just next year.

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ALESCI (voice-over): Justin and Stephanie Schultz's families are reeling from the shock of learning that they were the two Americans killed in the Brussels terror attack. The two Tennessee native weren't even traveling. They were at the airport dropping off Stephanie's mother, Caroline Moore, for a flight to the U.S. Moore, who was injured in the blast, confirmed her daughter's death to CNN, saying quote "they are in heaven."

The Schultz are among a handful of victims with known ties to the U.S.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Today has been the worst day of my life.

ALESCI: Emily Eigenman's boyfriend and Belgium native (INAUDIBLE) was on the way to Georgia to visit her.

The former ambassador to the U.S., Andre Adam, was also at the airport. He died in the blast, according to a Belgian official. The (INAUDIBLE) family also got the horrific news last week. Dutch siblings' Alexander and Sasha were checking into their flight on their way to New York, where they lived. In a statement, the family said, we're grateful to have closure on this tragic situation and are thankful for the thoughts and prayers from all.

In total, the terrorist attacks in Brussels killed 28 people and wounded 300.

(END VIDEOTAPE) WHITFIELD: And now, Cristina, we also understand, beautiful profile of the people that we know about, the Americans killed. And now we know the president has actually issued a phone call to the family members of at least two of the victims. What more do we know about that?

[15:10:15] ALESCI: We know that the president has reassured the family that these two individuals, Stephanie and Justin, were outstanding Americans. And he is probably going to be making phone calls to some of the other victims that have ties to America.

But also keep in mind it's not just the two who died, President Obama said yesterday that of the 300 wounded, 14 wounded are Americans. So there's probably some work to be done there in terms of the president reaching out to those families. And this is truly a horrific event for a lot of countries around the world. The victims represent about 40 different nationalities, Fred.

WHITFIELD: All right, Christina, thank you so much.

And remember to join CNN's Chris Cuomo as he returns to Paris to investigate the terror that struck there. That's CNN Special Report airs Wednesday night at 9:00 p.m. eastern time. Now, four months after that attack.

All right, straight ahead, more details are emerging about the links between Tuesday's bombers in Belgium and the Paris attackers from last November. We will look into just how wide this terror cell could be and what European authorities should do to prevent another attack.

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[15:14:46] WHITFIELD: Welcome back to the NEWSROOM.

We just heard moments ago that President Obama has called the parents of the Americans killed in the Brussels attack. And as authorities in Belgium are continuing, the complex manhunt for the terrorists involved, one thing is certain, these men did not act alone. Authorities are unraveling the complex relationship between these bombers and the assailants in the attacks in Paris last November. And furthermore, if or how these individuals communicated with the caliphate in Syria or elsewhere.

Joining me right now is CNN military analyst lieutenant colonel Rick Francona.

So Colonel, welcome back. We know at least one of the Brussels bombers and several of the Paris attackers attempted to travel to Syria. The EU has been so focused on migrants coming in from Turkey and Syria, but is it doing enough to tackle current residents leaving and then returning to potentially carry out attacks like we have just seen?

RICK FRANCONA, CNN MILITARY ANALYST: Well, this is a big problem, especially for a country like Belgium, which has limited resources, yet they have one of the biggest problems because as we have discussed, Belgium is one of the primary recruiting grounds for ISIS. Many, many citizens of Belgium, mostly Moroccan descent, have gone to Syria to fight and now they are returning. The Belgians just cannot keep track of them. The amount of people required to do surveillance on the ones they are worried about is just too great. So they pick out the ones they can and they don't always select right.

And we see a lot of planning going on in Belgium for other countries. We saw what happened in Paris. Most of that planning and logistic support was from Belgium because they can operate in Belgium. France, different problem for them, because France has very capable intelligence and security services.

WHITFIELD: And in large part is the fact that these borders are so porous and that there is, you know, frequent and easy travel in between certain European nations. And if you're already a residence of say France or even Belgium, perhaps it's a lot more difficult to track where you may have been prior to some of the friendlier nations?

FRANCONA: Exactly. And you know, the (INAUDIBLE) agreement which governs the passage of people throughout Europe. And you know, my recent travels there, I planted to one country and virtually traveled the entire continent without ever stopping in the border, without anybody ever asking me to show who I was, show my passport, and like that. And this plays right into the hands of anybody planning these kinds of terrorist operations. If you can enter in Greece, you can make your way all the way to France, almost undetected.

WHITFIELD: And you know, we heard now from the splinter group of the Taliban claiming responsibility for the suicide bombing in Lahore, Pakistan, saying it was no coincidence. That they were targeting specifically people on this Easter. But at the same time do you look at any real correlation between the kind of attack that was carried out by way of suicide bombing in a park, with lots of families on Easter there in Lahore, and what took place just days ago in rather soft target locations where many gather, you know, at the airport or at the metro station in Belgium?

FRANCONA: Sure, sure. No correlation between the groups, but certainly using the same tactics, the same tried and true tactic, use a suicide bomber going into a soft target rather than going after a church on Easter in Lahore. They would go after a group of people, because the churches would have some sort of protection.

And this is the fear that all law enforcement and security people have, is these targets are unprotected. Malls in the United States are a perfect example, how do you secure them? You can't. That would be the perfect target. And what we saw here was a group of children playing in a park, easy target, yet causes great damage and great psychological impact.

WHITFIELD: And while the tactics as the correlation between Lahore and Brussels, when you also look at t Paris attacks four months ago, the Paris attacker, who was in Belgian custody, Abdeslam, do you see a correlation indeed between him being in custody, answering questions, at least to a certain extent, no longer fighting extradition, and then this attack happens in Brussels. There have been lots of theories whether there's a real correlation or not. What elements do you need to know definitively there is a relationship between the facts that it happened in Brussels, when it happened, shortly after Abdeslam said he is not fighting extradition?

FRANCONA: Yes. Well, when they get more interrogations, they will be able to piece this together. But I think many of us were surprised there was an attack so soon after Abdeslam's arrest. Normally when you have an arrest of one of the operatives, all the plans are aborted and then they start developing new plans because they have to assume that anything Abdeslam knew, was now known to the security services. So we were surprised to see that.

WHITFIELD: Lieutenant colonel Rick Francona, thanks so much for your time. Appreciate it.

All right, Disney, Marvel Studios, and the NBA have something to say about a bill being considered in Georgia. The fallout surrounding this anti-LGBT bill next.

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UNIDENTIFIED MALE: All these people are upset. They are angry, they have been left out of the democratic process.

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[15:23:48] WHITFIELD: All right, welcome back.

In both North Carolina and Georgia, protests are growing through the weekend after critics say state legislatures passed similar bills that weaken antidiscrimination laws.

Here's CNN's Nick Valencia with a look at what the law changes and the overwhelming reaction from both citizens and corporations.

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UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is not all over!

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: All these people are upset. They are angry. They have been left out of the democratic process.

NICK VALENCIA, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): This week outside of the governor's mansion in North Carolina, protests and arrests. The demonstrators are opponents to a newly passed state law that they say is devastating to the civil liberties of transgender people. The law strikes down a recently passed ordinance in Charlotte. It would have protected Trans people and allowed them to select the restroom of their choice based on how they identify.

The adoption of the ordinance by the city council of Charlotte was just crazy.

VALENCIA: Republican lawmakers like senate (INAUDIBLE) were furious at the legislation.

PHIL BERGER (R), NORTH CAROLINA STATE SENATE: Allows grown men to share bathrooms and locker facilities with girls and women.

VALENCIA: In a special session, solely to consider the bill, Republican lawmakers passed the public facilities privacy and securities act. It means transgender people in the state of North Carolina must use the restroom must use the restroom related to the gender on their birth certificate. North Carolina's bill signed into law Wednesday is the latest in a string of states attempting to pass similar anti-LGBT legislation.

[15:25:21] MIKE CRANE (R), GEORGIA STATE SENATE: In the courtrooms you're seeing folks get their religious beliefs persecuted against.

VALENCIA: In Georgia, the controversial bill passed by the state house and Senate is called the free exercise protection act, one of the several religious liberty bills that have surfaced across the country. Governor Nathan Deal has until May to cite into law. Senator Mike Crane is one of the bill's most adamant supporters.

Is this legislation a direct result of what the Supreme Court did last year at legalizing same-sex marriage?

CRANE: I think it's a result of many things, but that was just another catalyst, I believe.

VALENCIA: But many blue chip businesses around the nation say there will be major financial consequences to Republican efforts in Georgia and North Carolina.

Disney and Marvel studios have threatened to abandon production in Georgia if the governor signs the bill into law. The NFL says it could have an impact whether Atlanta is selected as host of the 2019 super bowl. And in North Carolina, the NBA says because of the new law, it may pull the all-star game from Charlotte next year.

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WHITFIELD: Nick Valencia with us now with more on this. It's not going away any time soon. The clock is ticking. And, I mean, there are big messages of how corporations are responding to this, you know, as well as how state lawmakers are responding.

VALENCIA: Right. And in North Carolina, something not being talked about, and we should really emphasize, it's not just going to impact the LGBT community. Virtually guts workplace discrimination laws for everyone. It eliminates a state statute which was implemented in 1977 that made it easy for employers to file discrimination lawsuits against their state employer. Now that statute is eliminated. They have to go to a federal level, which the statute of limitations is much shorter and it is a lot higher bar to reach.

So, isn't just gays, lesbians, and transgender people that are going to be impacted by this new North Carolina law. It's everyone who feels that they were discriminated against for any reason. WHITFIELD: All right, keep us posted on this. Thank you so much.

Appreciate it, Nick Valencia.

All right. They witnessed the attack at the airport in Brussels and now they are returning to the scene to recover their belongings. Coming up, the difficult journey for victims as they return to the site of the bombings.

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UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I saw the whole facade, this from the bus we could see the roof that was completely shattered, the glass roof. And then when we get out of the bus, we could see the whole front area basically with all the glass shattered.

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[15:30:48] WHITFIELD: All right, welcome back. I'm Fredricka Whitfield.

We want to bring you the latest on the breaking news out of Pakistan. A Taliban-related group said it was targeting Christians on Easter in an attack at the park in the city of Lahore. At least 63 people are dead and more than 300 were injured in the suicide bombing in Pakistan. Most of the victims are women and children. Reports say the bomb donated in a children's play area. And the Taliban group claiming responsibility for the blast said the prime minister of Pakistan quote "won't be able to stop us," end quote. And they say their suicide bombers will continue these kinds of attacks. We'll have more on this at the top of the hour.

All right, victims of Tuesday's attacks in Brussels are now faced with the task of having to return to the scene of the bombing and collect their suitcases and personal belongings that they were forced to leave behind as they ran for their lives. Reliving those terrifying moments is not easy.

Here's CNN's Alexandra Field.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It was a matter of time. So you live with that.

FIELD (voice-over): Every minute mattered, but only some people get time to think about that. They are here waiting to go back.

Minutes before that you had been in the same spot where the bombs went off.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes, yes. But I was lucky, I did online check-in. Because came in, and immediately went to the gate.

FIELD: He narrowly missed the blast. UNIDENTIFIED MALE: At the beginning, nobody could reach me. I

couldn't call. After 10, 15 minutes, I could call my wife. She was very in panic, she was panicked. She couldn't reach me.

FIELD: Another woman tells us she touched down right in the aftermath.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We saw the whole facade, basically from the bus we could see the roof that was completely shattered, the glass roof, and then when we got out of the bus, we could see the whole front area basically with all the glass shattered. So people were just still walking down from there, and ambulances is driving up.

FIELD: When you realize you could have been in that airport at the time this happened --

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Few minutes, yes. It's a real shock. It was a really bad day in the days after, starting to get better now, but really tough.

FIELD: The airport is still a crime scene, it's being guarded 24 hours a day by both police and members of the military. The only people who have gotten through the barricade are the ones part of the investigation until now. Some of the first people getting back in here are some of the last people who got out.

It's time, they are picking up many of the 6,000 cars left behind, but no one will be allowed into the terminal.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The crime scene investigation is still ongoing. There is still, of course, a lot of luggage, hand luggage, and personal belongings that are in the buildings. These buildings are not accessible to us yet.

FIELD: Engineers are asserting the damage. There's still no word on when the building where two bombs exploded will be back open. Another matter of time.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

WHITFIELD: And Alexandra Field joining me now from Brussels. The chaos that, you know, followed the blast, are you hearing anything about if initials are trying to retrieve any of the victims' belongings for them? Because it's so difficult for some to return to those areas?

FIELD: Yes, this is kind of a piecemeal process, the first thing they wanted to do was get people to be able to access their cars. That was also the simplest of some extraordinary complicated tasks. So people were first brought in to get cars, then we are told that they were also offloading some of the cargo already loaded on to planes, so people in the airport at that time were able to pick up those things in a separate building. But as far as the things in the terminal itself at the time of the explosion, that's all been locked in the building as investigators did their work. So with investigators now clearing that scene, the job will have to start with sorting through the personal items and getting them back to the survivors and perhaps also to the families of the victims.

WHITFIELD: And will the airport be reopened?

FIELD: Not yet clear, Fredricka. We are being told that engineers have gone in for an initial survey at this point. They have been taking a look at the terminal where the bombs went off. They have determined there aren't major structural issues. So the airport's going to start to look at solutions for how to get r itself open as quickly as possible. That means they could set up some temporary check-in desks while the rest of the repair work gets under way, but no timeline at this point, Fredricka.

[15:35:05] WHITFIELD: All right, Alexandra Field. Thank you so much.

All right, still to come, the world according to Donald Trump. America comes first and everybody else pays? We will talk about that.

Plus, Bernie Sanders says the U.S. needs to be tough on terror and accuses the government of keeping secrets.

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SEN. BERNIE SANDERS (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I think we know who ISIS is, we know those people.

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[15:00:00] WHITFIELD: All right, on the road to the White House, Bernie Sanders is savoring a clean sweep across the west today, Washington, Hawaii, Alaska, all going to the Vermont senator yesterday. Sanders is now looking to run forward on this momentum straight into Hillary Clinton's territory including her adoptive home state of New York. He touted his three wins when he spoke with our Jake Tapper on "STATE OF THE UNION" this morning.

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SANDERS: I think every vote is pivotal. We are now winning in state after state, the Latino vote. We're doing better now that we're out of the south with the African-American vote. We're doing extraordinarily well with young people, and we are -- we think we do have a path toward victory.

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WHITFIELD: All right, joining me right now, Ellis Henican is a Democratic strategist and the co-author of "the party's over" and Brian Morgenstern is a Republican strategist. Welcome to both of you.

All right. So, Ellis, you first. How do you assess this? I mean, Bernie Sanders did say, you know, out west they are a lot more progressive so this is what's supposed to be happening for him. How does he maintain this kind of momentum? [15:40:12] ELLIS HENICAN, DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST: You're right, but it

was undeniably super Saturday for Bernie. He might even get some super delegates, remember those?

WHITFIELD: Yes,

HENICAN: Listen, he is doing well. He has got momentum. And clearly, the bucks are rolling in and the passion is still there. But you have got to say he is still got this problem of running out of runway between now and the convention. The states he has done well in are the ones that like Vermont, Washington, lot of kids, lot of liberal thoughts. I don't know about New York. It's going to be a lot tougher there.

WHITFIELD: Really, running out of runway? I mean, we have got until June, I mean, to continue to collect if it turns out that, you know, the proportional votes continue to go, you know, Bernie Sanders' way.

So, Brian, you know, is he on to something? I mean, you know, he says he has got the momentum and look how much ground he's gained in just a week or so. And he needs what, a little over 1,300. I mean, he has got to get 75 percent of the rest of the delegate count and maybe that's tough, but he is giving Hillary Clinton a run for her money.

BRIAN MORGENSTERN, REPUBLICAN STRATEGIST: Well, and he is creating additional runway is what he's going, because he's now making the argument to many of these party leaders, these super delegates, the elected officials and party blasters. He is saying you are going to have a choice to make.

When you look at all these states that I have won, are you going to vote for me, the person your constituents voted for by 40 percent or 50 percent in some of these states, or are you going to stick with Secretary Clinton and give me a (INAUDIBLE) over the head and say look at this establishment trying to steal the election from the people?

Either outcome is not so good for the Clinton camp. So Sanders, with these wins, is creating, like I said, a little more runway to try to steal some of the leaders who have already pledged and try to get them to go back on that.

WHITFIELD: And I wonder, Ellis, if this is a little psychological warfare, too, really, you know, looking at New York, I mean, Hillary Clinton's adoptive home state and saying I'm going to spend a little bit more time in New York and really kind of threaten you there.

HENICAN: It's smart. I mean, New York you're right, is one of Hillary's three arguable home states. Here's the real dance that's going on behind it, though, is Bernie - I mean, the Hillary folks can't try and bum rush Bernie out of the race. He is doing decently well. He is a perfectly good opponent, but they have got to get to victory in a way that doesn't alienate the Sanders people that you are talking about.

WHITFIELD: How do you do that? HENICAN: And that is really the -- one thing you discuss him

respectfully, and you keep talking about how great it is he's got passion and money, and you certainly don't say he's got to quit. It's a manners game, really.

WHITFIELD: Interesting.

MORGENSTERN: But at some point he has got to start stealing voters, or rather she is going to have to start stealing more voters because the numbers of people, you know, she was saying over the weekend, you know, I have two million more voters than Bernie had. Well, he has got a lot more donors, a lot more people who are with skin in the game passionate about it and at some point he is closing the gap in those votes. He is taking away that argument. And so she may have to take the kid gloves off for a little while, but that's, as said, there's a risk to that in alienating those votes.

WHITFIELD: But then when you talk about demographics and, you know, the candidates can't help but, you know, do that to see where they are more advantageous and Wisconsin is voting in the primary in just about a week and a half from now, Milwaukee has a large African-American voter base, and Hillary Clinton has traditionally done well, particularly when it was in the south. And even Sanders acknowledged that, you know, he's doing better in the west. He didn't do so great in the south. But, you know, when it comes to Wisconsin and the African-American vote, is it a geographical issue, does it become a demographic one, how does this potentially serve either candidate, Ellis?

HENICAN: Listen, Bernie is doing a little better. You can't deny that. But this is all about being gracious, you know. Hillary is quite confident that the numbers are on her side, so the strategy is just flatter the guy, you know, say how much you appreciate him and how much you love his supporters. That's really what it's about. I think more than a mathematical equation, which is still really, really tough for Bernie.

MORGENSTERN: Well, and remember that in Wisconsin, labor is a huge issue. Governor Walker has, you know, with collective bargaining, I think it will be a competition between these two candidates to see, you know, who can really galvanize the working class voters who are united. I mean, they are able to get a recall election against the sitting governor. Now, it wasn't successful. But that speaks to their ability to organize. So I think these two candidates will have to be addressing those issues and kind of trying to out-leftist each other when it comes to being pro-union. As I said, may see some of that.

WHITFIELD: All right, so far that's the Dems. We are going to have you back in a moment to talk about the Republicans.

WHITFIELD: Crazy stuff.

WHITFIELD: Yes. It is getting a little crazy. I guess it's been crazy.

[15:45:03] HENICAN: A little?

WHITFIELD: And we're also going to talk about last week's attacks in Brussels and how the candidates are weighing in on their foreign policy as it relates to that. All that straight ahead.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:48:58] WHITFIELD: All right, let's bring back our panel, Ellis Henican and Brian Morgenstern. And let's talk a little bit more about foreign policy, particularly as it pertains to Donald Trump since he hit the air waves today and had a lot to say about it and what he's calling, quote, an America-first approach. And in a lengthy interview with the "New York Times," Trump actually gave his reasoning for this kind of branding saying quote "we have been disrespected, mock, and ripped off for many, many years by people that were smarter, shrewder, tougher. We were the big bully, but we were not smartly led."

So Brian, you first, let's talk out, you know, Trump and his views and whether it will resonate with American voters. Do most people understand where he's coming from?

MORGENSTERN: Some do, you know, I mean, he has proven that at the polls, but his, you know, we need more good deals and fewer bad deals is, obviously, a little simplistic in trying to make some many other countries pay, I guess I don't know, pay us rent or something or like pay us security payments like the mafia.

I mean, what he's ignoring is how this world order came to be, which was a world war and a cold war and America sort of assuming the leadership mantle and other countries backing away from the defense industry, most notably because he mentions them -- Japan.

Well, we basically took over the defense of Japan because in the world war they attacked us and they were an aggressor along with Germany and other countries. I'm not suggesting that his plan will lead to a world war or anything like that. But his facade of toughness really is an effort to try to make other countries get more aggressive in the defense game, which would actually erode America's authority. So it would actually have the sort of, you know, the opposite effect of what I think the voters would be voting for.

[15:50:45] WHITFIELD: Yes. And particularly, he was talking about, you know, allowing Japan and South Korea to build their own nuclear arsenals rather than having to depend on the American nuclear umbrella for their protection against North Korea. And here, the U.S. worked so hard to make sure something like that didn't happen. And you know, to continue to be the peace maker between, you know, Korea and Japan.

So Ellis, you know, is this the issue of, you know, this is the world of Donald Trump. This is how he sees it or does it instead highlight that perhaps he is out of touch with the way history has unfolded. Or perhaps he is not consulting with anyone. He is just kind of brain storming?

HENICAN: Well, what's the matter? My friend Brian doesn't want America to be a winner, is that the problem here? He doesn't know, right? He has two or three slogans that have worked wonderfully for him, right. One of them is make other people pay for it and another is keep foreign people away from us. And those two - listen. There is an audience for that. And as long as you don't scratch too deeply, you know, a significant number of Americans are going to nod along.

But then, then you asking for the particulars. OK, you hate NATO. So what do we do? Are we going to abandon NATO? We are going to walk away from it? What about the issues of terror. Once it gets complicated as it did in that "New York Times" conversation, it just becomes -- he doesn't know.

WHITFIELD: But we haven't heard a whole lot of specifics on so many things. And here we are, you know, almost at the half way point of the primary season and he still is out front. So I mean, I guess no one can really explain it because a lot of people have tried, you know.

But Brian, at what point, you know, do American voters, you know, demand to hear more? Not just from Donald Trump but perhaps, you know, from you know, John Kasich as well as, you know, Ted Cruz as well where they want more specificity on these very big issues particularly as it pertains to NATO or as it pertains to, you know, America's fight against ISIS, et cetera.

MORGENSTERN: You would think, as in past elections, it comes to that. However, Trump, and I'll give him credit where it's due, has turned his lack of specificity somehow into a strength by saying no we need to be less predictable. I'm not going to tell you what to do. It is the first campaign where we have seen in a while where an actual arguing point in his favor is I'm not going to tell you what the heck I'm going to do. That is how he turned it on its head and his supporters love it. They may think, great. You know, our adversaries abroad shouldn't know what we're going to do. They should be on the edge of their seats and you know, sort of at our beckon call because they are, I guess, afraid of us or whatever the sensation is supposed to be. But that's how he's approached it and so far it's working. So I don't know -- I want more specifics. You want more specifics. But it seems like the candidates actually are incentivized against giving them at this point in time.

WHITFIELD: Well, this is what he said this morning on "This Week" as it pertains to NATO.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: If we adjust NATO, and it is going to have to be to either readjust it to take care of terrorism or we are going to have to set up a new coalition, a new group of countries to handle terrorism.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WHITFIELD: So Ellis, what was your interpretation of that?

HENICAN: It is a perfect example of what we are talking about. Either we got to totally redo it or we are going to make somebody else pay for it. Maybe we will scratch it or, you know, maybe we will come up with a new group.

Listen. There are some reasonable arguments one can make about trying to drag NATO into the modern terror age, you know. Sophisticated people are wrestling about that. But do you really think Donald Trump is going to get us there? Nothing he said yet makes us feel like he understands those nuances.

WHITFIELD: OK. Then he discussed on how he would take on ISIS and this is in a "New York Times" interview, saying this quote "I've been saying take the oil. I've been saying it for years. Take the oil. They still haven't taken the oil. They still haven't taken it." But we are reminded by lieutenant colonel Francona who said their oil has been ceased from ISIS and that is why a large part, some of the, you know, the paychecks for some of the fighters is now being reduced because ISIS has been hit hard where it is getting most of its money.

So Brian, I guess in generalities, when Donald Trump is able to continue, you know, talking about this way, does it help cement his point? Meaning he is very repetitious. And that makes it much more believable?

[15:55:22] MORGENSTERN: Well, his style is one that has broad appeal. And look. There have been countless articles about how he is speaking at like a third of fourth grade reading level. But at the times write said, you know, fifth grader reading. In other words, his language is accessible. And so, what may seem to matter more than what he says is how he says it. And you know, the other candidates will keep hammering him on the substance of it. But until they can actually break through and get the kind of reaction that he does, you know, he will continue to lead.

WHITFIELD: All right, Brian Morgenstern, Ellis Henican, thank you so much. Appreciate it. Good to see you always and Happy Eater.

HENICAN: Happy Easter.

MORGENSTERN: Happy Easter.

WHITFIELD: All right. Still ahead in the CNN NEWSROOM. We will have more on the breaking news that we are following a bombing that killed more than 60 people in Pakistan and the breaking news out of Belgium where police used water cannons to break up protests at the memorial site of last week's terror attacks. All that coming up.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[16:00:00] WHITFIELD: Hello, everyone. And welcome again. I'M Fredricka Whitfield.

We begin with breaking news out of Pakistan. A Taliban group now says it was targeting Christians on this Easter Sunday in an attack at a park in the city of Lahore. At least 63 people have been killed, 315 injured --.