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Sanders Gains Momentum after Wisconsin Win; WhatsApp Move Comes after Apple-FBI Privacy Feud; Libya Moves Closer to Unity Government; African Nations and Leaders Cited in Panama Papers; Republican Nomination May Hinge on Insider Politics; Water Crisis in Bangladesh. Aired 10-11a ET

Aired April 06, 2016 - 10:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[10:00:00]

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ROBYN CURNOW, CNN HOST (voice-over): Ahead at the INTERNATIONAL DESK, Ted Cruz trounces Trump in a key primary election. It's a big win that

could lead to a big mess at the Republican National Convention.

And protecting your private messages: we'll show you the app that could keep a billion people safe from hackers.

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CURNOW: Hi, there, welcome, I'm Robyn Curnow at the CNN Center.

Well, there's some clarity in the Republican presidential race.

Or is there?

A day after the Wisconsin primary, there are new complications for front-runner Donald Trump. Ted Cruz's big win in Wisconsin makes it less

likely Trump will clinch the nomination, setting up a contested convention this summer in Cleveland.

For the Democrats, Bernie Sanders' sixth win in the last seven contests puts more pressure on Hillary Clinton heading into the next big

primary, which is in New York.

Cruz calls his victory in Wisconsin a turning point in the Republican race.

Is it?

CNN's Phil Mattingly has more on his big win.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

PHIL MATTINGLY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Ted Cruz and his campaign made no secret. They were going all in on Wisconsin. They had an extensive ground

operation. The endorsement of the very popular Republican government, Scott Walker, and a series of conservative talk radio hosts, who had been

hammering home a pro-Cruz message for weeks.

It was actually an effort looked a lot like what Cruz's team did in Iowa and the result was very similar.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

SEN. TED CRUZ (R), TEXAS: Hillary, get ready; here we come.

MATTINGLY (voice-over): Ted Cruz pulling off a big win in Wisconsin's Republican primary, the victory for Cruz narrowing Donald Trump's path to

the nomination and moving the party ever closer to a contested convention.

CRUZ: Tonight is a turning point. It is a rallying cry.

MATTINGLY (voice-over): Cruz's win the most substantial since his defeat of Trump in Iowa.

CRUZ: Three weeks ago the media said Wisconsin was a perfect state for Donald Trump. But the hard-working men and women of Wisconsin stood

and campaigned tirelessly to make sure that tonight was a victory for every American.

MATTINGLY (voice-over): Trump now facing a nearly impossible mathematical challenge to amass the 1,237 delegates needed to capture the

nomination. A rough week of political blunders, attack ads and questions about his ability to be presidential loosening the front-runner's grip as

the presumptive nominee.

Former presidential candidate, Lindsey Graham, who reluctantly backed Cruz, tweeting, "Well done, Ted Cruz. Hopefully tonight is the turning

point to deny Donald Trump 1,237 delegates."

In the hours before polls closed, Trump hit the trail hard. It wasn't enough.

DONALD TRUMP, REPUBLICAN PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: We could have a big surprise tonight, folks. A big surprise.

MATTINGLY (voice-over): Trump's campaign mostly silent after his loss. Only releasing a biting statement against the Cruz campaign, saying,

in part, "Lying Ted Cruz had the governor of Wisconsin, many conservative talk radio show hosts and the entire party apparatus behind him," going on

to say, "Ted Cruz is worse than a puppet. He's a Trojan horse, being used by the party bosses attempting to steal the nomination from Mr. Trump."

Cruz, meanwhile, celebrating his big win.

CRUZ: My wife, Heidi.

MATTINGLY (voice-over): Ensuring she shares the spotlight after Trump retweeted an unflattering photo of her, which he later acknowledged was a

mistake.

CRUZ: I may be biased but isn't she going to make an amazing first lady?

MATTINGLY: The Republican race now moves east. New York, the next big state to come up on a primary schedule. April 19th, 95 delegates are

at stake and Trump's advisers are not trying to hold down expectations at all, one adviser telling me they believe they can win as many as 90 of

those 95 delegates, the type of victory that would really seize the momentum back from Ted Cruz.

And from there, the math only gets better for Donald Trump and potentially worse for Ted Cruz. Primaries up and down the East Coast,

Trump's advisers pointing to that as the way they are dealing with the Wisconsin result right now.

But no question at all. What Wisconsin does more than anything else is point to the difficulty of anybody reaching that 1,237 delegates

necessary to secure the nomination before the Republican convention in Cleveland.

A big night for Ted Cruz. A bigger night for anti-Trump supporters that are trying to block --

[10:05:00]

MATTINGLY: -- Donald Trump from that nomination -- back to you.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

CURNOW: OK. Thanks to Phil for that.

Now there is real uncertainty in the Republican race now as Phil was saying. Let's bring in CNN political analyst David Gregory, live from CNN

Washington.

We have heard these words "contested convention" over and over again. But as Phil was saying there, look at the math.

Can anyone reach this magic number?

Not really, no.

DAVID GREGORY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, it may be difficult. The magic number is 1,237, which is half the delegates plus one. And that is

to win on the first ballot. Now if are a delegate and you vote in one of these primaries and you're an elected delegate to the convention, your

first obligation is to vote -- let's say you vote for Trump, vote for him on the first ballot.

But if he doesn't get to 1,237, there could be other ballots and you could change your allegiance. But if Trump fails to get to that magic

number, it doesn't mean that he can't still get there. Remember, an open convention means there could be a lot of horse-trading going on; there

could be a lot of negotiation.

And if he's close -- and I've talked to some Republicans who indicate that he might fall short but he could still be within 100 -- in which case

he could probably do some negotiation to win on the first ballot. That is what the anti-Trump forces fear, that even though he lost in Wisconsin,

he's got the ability -- he's still ahead and he's got the ability coming up in states like New York and in Pennsylvania and New Jersey, where Trump

leads in the polls. He has got the ability to rack up some more delegates.

CURNOW: But even if he doesn't make that 1,237 magic number and he's 100 short, as you say, as we heard in Phil Mattingly's story there, he's

already crying, well, there's a concern from the Trump camp that this is going to be stolen from him.

If there is some back-door deal made with the Republican establishment, the reaction from Mr. Trump, who is known to be litigious,

could make this even messier.

GREGORY: Yes, and I don't think it's -- whether he's litigious or not is the issue.

The issue is does he essentially walk out literally or figuratively and what happens to his base of support?

Does he bolt the party?

Does he try to run as a third-party candidate?

Whatever could happen with some theatrics by Trump, if he feels that he's denied, it just kind of further unravels the party.

But at this point, you have a couple of scenarios. Either Trump wins it on the first. Whether it goes then to second or third and then what's

the combination. Do you have a Cruz ticket with Rubio?

Do you have it with Kasich?

Or do you have a complete outsider?

A lot of talk in Washington about the desire for the current Speaker of the House, Paul Ryan from Wisconsin, who was Mitt Romney's running mate

back in 2012, could he be the phoenix that rises at the Republican convention?

That's still considered farfetched but that's possible, too.

CURNOW: Yes. And there are many who feel, at least within the Republican establishment, that they would rather lose with Cruz because

it's about values rather than electability and the long-term protection of the party and what it means.

I'm going to come back to you in just a moment. I just want to take a quick look at the Democrats, David. Bernie Sanders won in Wisconsin by

double digits. Let's not forget that. He's on a roll.

But he's heading to states that may be tough for him. And Sanders needs over three-quarters of the remaining delegates to clinch a

nomination.

Still, he told supporters at a victory rally, his winning streak may have given him just what he needs.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. BERNIE SANDERS (I), VT., PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Momentum is starting a campaign 60 to 70 points behind Secretary Clinton. Momentum is

that within the last couple of weeks, there have been national polls which have had had us 1 point up or 1 point down. With our victory tonight in

Wisconsin, we have now won seven out of eight of the last caucuses.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CURNOW: So that sounds good, David Gregory.

Really, what are his prospects here?

GREGORY: They are very, very difficult. He does have a lot of enthusiasm. He's raised a lot of money; $44 million in March. I spoke to

a Democratic consultant this week, who said hope -- especially when it's well funded -- is very hard to extinguish.

And there's a lot of voters out there, progressives in America, who look at Bernie Sanders and say, yes, this guy is different. He stands up

for us. And they are enthusiastic about it.

But that doesn't mean that he doesn't face very difficult odds.

And the reality is that even Barack Obama in 2008 lost six of the nine last contests and he lost them by a lot because of the rules for how

delegates are given out in the Democratic Party. Hillary Clinton's lead is very hard to overcome. And then she has those super delegates, local

elected officials, who are party bigwigs essentially, who've already pledged support to her.

[10:10:00]

GREGORY: So denying her the nomination becomes very difficult. Him staying around with a lot of money means he stays in and he continues to

point up her vulnerabilities and he's get another debate out of all of this later in the month before the New York primary, which gives him a bit more

oxygen and prevents her from completely turning to the general election.

Which she would like to do; she would like to focus on the Republicans right now and not have to continue to fight her left flank.

CURNOW: But she is. And she is focusing on Bernie Sanders. She said a few things today.

But he's also seeming to have a few questions raised by his responses to conversations he's had, particularly with the editorial board of a New

York newspaper where he really seemed unsure, vague on how to implement the details of some of his main campaign points.

GREGORY: Well, not only -- I think that's right and I think that this was the kind of tough policy questions that we haven't often seen of

Senator Sanders, where he doesn't look very strong.

I mean, even on his points about breaking up the big banks, he seemed rather unsure about what kind of authority the government would have to

carry that out and what would happen as a result, what would be the pluses and the minuses.

On international matters, he misstated by the amount of civilian casualties in the 2014 war in Gaza by seven times the number of the

civilian casualties in Gaza. Seemed unclear about how he would handle prisoners who are -- captured terrorists on the battlefield and so forth.

So there was a lightness to some of his foreign policy views that have not been scrubbed that deeply here that I think you'll certainly see

Secretary Clinton try to seize on when we get to that next debate.

CURNOW: Indeed. And Secretary Clinton's certainly no lightweight when it comes to foreign policy, is she? But that's also the point.

Besides perhaps Bernie Sanders handing her a gift in terms of these rather difficult conversations he had with journalists, Clinton is also saying

that he isn't a real Democrat -- well, at least hinting that he isn't a real Democrat. That's a step further than she usually goes when talking

about Sanders and the party, isn't it?

GREGORY: Well, that's right because she's still, in the end, appealing to Democrats. I mean, it's like sometimes we overcomplicate

these things. In the Republican race, it's mostly conservatives who are voting here. You got to win conservatives and you have to be able to win

tried and true Democrats here as well.

And some of his support is just the more progressive wing of the Democratic Party. Let's remember that, in presidential contests, you can

go down the list and look at issues. You can look at what is the likelihood that issues can actually be implemented. Positions can be

implemented and executed once you're President of the United States.

What's far more important is character and personal characteristics that end up swaying the day. And I think that is the basis of that Bernie

Sanders support. There's a lot of distrust of Hillary Clinton within the Democratic Party, to say nothing of the larger electorate. And he is

tapping into that.

And so what she'll keep trying to do is say, well, he's a weak and one-issue candidate, who can't actually get these things done. Breaking up

the banks, universal health care. She's going to keep hammering away at that to ultimately persuade people that he shouldn't be getting the oxygen

that he's getting.

CURNOW: Indeed. And Bernie Sanders and Donald Trump seem to be similar candidates in that way, outsiders really threatening the

traditional bases.

Thank you so much, David Gregory, as always. Appreciate it.

GREGORY: Thank you.

CURNOW: Well, coming up here at CNN, no more prying eyes for a billion communicators worldwide. We'll talk about WhatsApp's latest move

to protect its clients' privacy.

Plus a Syrian warplane is shot down and the pilot captured. Why a dispute is emerging over the firepower used to bring the aircraft down.

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[10:15:00]

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CURNOW: A billion people are now sending completely private communications on WhatsApp, meaning nobody can pry into those

conversations. Now WhatsApp, which is owned by Facebook, has rolled out end-to-end encryption for all messages on all devices.

Samuel Burke joins me now from CNN New York to talk more about this.

Firstly, Sam, what does end-to-end encryption mean?

SAMUEL BURKE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: This is a monumental shift because end-to-end encryption means that if Robyn Curnow and Samuel Burke are

WhatsApping, as we do sometimes, only you, the sender, and only me, the receiver, can read these messages even though they pass through the

WhatsApp servers. It's as though you and I are the only two people with the keys.

And if somebody intercepts the messages on the WhatsApp server, it doesn't matter because all they will see is mumbo-jumbo code. You and I

with those keys are the only two people who can unlock the message.

But I want to show you what Jan Koum, he's the CEO of WhatsApp and one of the co-founders said. It really stood out to me. He said that privacy

is at the core of WhatsApp and he went on to say, "For me, it's personal. The fact that people couldn't speak freely in Ukraine under Soviet rule is

one of the reasons my family moved to the United States."

So he's always talked about this being a core value to him and now we see this monumental shift of tech companies following the way of Apple and

wanting to encrypt everything end to end.

CURNOW: OK.

So what does this include then?

More importantly, does it include phone calls as well?

Or is it just the messages you tap out?

BURKE: Very good point, Robyn. It's not just the text messages, which a lot of people think of WhatsApp and their core service but also now

you can have phone calls which many of us enjoy. You can call your loved one in London for free, your family back in South Africa for free.

Those are encrypted as well. Everything on WhatsApp, including file transfers, but the phone calls really pose a new type of question for law

enforcement; for years they have been able to wiretap people's phones. This means that they won't be able to wiretap text messages, phone calls

and so of course it creates an outlet for all types of people that we may not want using WhatsApp, that we may not want to have their conversations

secret. But they will be protected by encryption as well.

CURNOW: Yes, I know that in the field I have had conversations on WhatsApp with sources because you know that it's probably the most

confidential way to have it, besides being face-to-face. But that said, is this really 100 percent encrypted?

Is somebody going to be able to hack into an iPhone -- somebody's already been able to hack into an iPhone.

So why not with WhatsApp?

Why is this different?

Or is it?

BURKE: Some people have called this perfect privacy. I wouldn't go that far because I have learned every time you think that something is

perfect, somebody figures out a way around it, just like we saw with the iPhone.

But I think this is as close as we can get. This is the most perfect type of privacy. This will pose the biggest challenge. Even if eventually

someone finds their way around it, this is really a huge shift in the technology industry, saying we are responding to all the hacks and we are

responding to the prying eyes and ears of government and we're saying no to all of it.

CURNOW: OK. Sam Burke, thank you so much. Important story, appreciate it.

Belgian Prime Minister Charles Michel is calling for greater international cooperation in the fight against terrorism. He spoke

exclusively to our Christiane Amanpour in his first interview since the 32 people were killed in that Brussels bombing.

He responded to criticism over intelligence failures leading up to the attacks.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CHARLES MICHEL, BELGIAN PRIME MINISTER (through translator): I'm going to be very clear. In this fight against terrorists, against these

enemies who are hiding, who are more and more professional in their way -- in the way they communicate --

[10:20:00]

MICHEL (through translator): -- everywhere in the world, including in Belgium, there are successes and there are failures. We are working with

hundreds of investigators.

We have been working with them for the past months. Our intelligence services are mobilized and I think that we need to do everything we can do

to improve international cooperation within Europe and also beyond Europe.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CURNOW: And you can watch the rest of Christiane Amanpour's interview with the prime minister coming up on "AMANPOUR." That airs at 7:00 pm

today in London, 8:00 pm in Brussels and Berlin, right here on CNN.

And Libya appears to be moving closer to forming a unified government. One of the country's rival governments has announced it's stepping down to

help avoid further violence.

CNN senior international correspondent Nick Paton Walsh is in Beirut.

You have been keeping an eye on events in Libya. There's been real concern with the fragmentation of this country since the fall of Moammar

Gadhafi.

What's this latest decision by one of the governments mean?

NICK PATON WALSH, CNN SR. INTL. CORRESPONDENT: Well, it's remarkable this is considered to be good news, frankly, given the torrent of ghastly

news that Libya has had to face in the past years.

The fragmentation of its government, militias running the country and most importantly now a large pocket of land held by ISIS just on the other

side of the Mediterranean from the European Union.

But what today after late last night's announcement by a government called the National Salvation, based in the capital of Tripoli, means is

that we are now talking about two rather than three competing governments inside of Libya.

Let me wind back and explain how we got to the ridiculous number of number. Well, there was a group called the National Salvation Government

in Tripoli, who refused to relinquish power, de facto control of the capital.

While some of the outside world recognized a group based in the east of the country in Tobruk as, in fact, the legitimate government. They are

led by a powerful military figure known as General Haftar there.

Those two competed often in conflict from inside Libya for a number of months, if not years now. And then the West said, well, frankly, we've had

enough of both of those. We need to urgently intervene inside Libya now to attack ISIS. So we need a government we can do that with the assistance

of.

And then they, with the U.N., pushed for this man, now known as Prime Minister Fayez Serraj to form his own government, which was initially based

in a hotel in neighboring Tunisia to start with.

They, then, in the past week or so, moved in to the Libyan capital of Tripoli and said, OK, we mean business. And it appears that in the last

few days, increasing internal pressure on that second of the three governments, the one of National Salvation, meant that, in fact, they

released a statement on Facebook last night, saying they were suspending work in the ministries that they ran.

That's confirmed by our people on the ground. They're saying that, yes, people are actually packing up on their desks and going home and new

figures are coming in.

But this also happened with intense international pressure, Robyn, because the E.U. put sanctions against key leading figures in this

government of National Salvation, allowing the outsiders led by prime minister Serraj -- you'll hear more of his name in the weeks ahead -- to

come in and try and exert now some control.

But they still have the government who's declared themselves in the east of the country to contend with. They haven't fully recognized

Serraj's new administration -- Robyn.

CURNOW: Thanks so much, Nick Paton Walsh there, and of course begs the question, what does all this mean for the fight against ISIS in Libya?

Appreciate it, Nick Paton Walsh.

The Syrian government is trying to rescue one of its pilots whose plane was shot down over Aleppo Province on Tuesday. Now Syrian state TV

reports the plane was on a reconnaissance mission when a surface-to-air missile brought it down. The Syrian government has expressed concerns

about rebels obtaining such advanced weaponry. But rebels say they brought the plane down with a machine gun. The pilot parachuted out of the plane

and was captured.

And just days after the Panama Papers splashed into the public sphere, the fallout tidal wave is picking up momentum.

In France, the finance minister has decided to rebanish the nation of Panama to its list of non-cooperative tax havens. Panama says it's not a

tax haven and it refuses to be a scapegoat for those implicated in the scandal.

Ukrainian President Petro Poroshenko is defending his offshore accounts, which were revealed in the documents. He says his accounts are,

quote, "very transparent," and he insists he follows the law.

The political fallout and the public outrage over the Panama Papers has touched nearly every corner of the globe. That includes Africa. More

than a dozen African countries are cited in some way in the documents.

Our Eleni Giokos has been following this angle. She joins me now live from Johannesburg.

Hi, there.

How does Africa and which countries specifically have been touched by this scandal?

ELENI GIOKOS, CNNMONEY CORRESPONDENT: Robyn, we have got about 18 countries which are on the radar when it comes to the Panama Papers. It

ranges from South Africa to the likes of Uganda, Nigeria, Ghana, and so forth, even Sierra Leone. We're talking about 18 out of the 34 countries

in Africa.

So quite a substantial chunk. But I think if we put this into contest, we have to look at the overall corruption issues that the

continent has faced over the past few decades.

[10:25:00]

GIOKOS: The worries about tax avoidance, tax evasion, shady deals, questionable deals but as this starts to change now into more democratic

environment, where you see more and more African countries embarking on democratic elections, a lot of these stories are starting to come to the

surface, Robyn.

And we're talking about $50 billion of illicit outflows out of Africa. So no surprise that Africa is on the radar when it comes to the Panama

Papers.

Also around 18 officials, whether it be government officials, family linked to government officials or even like to just very high-profile names

that have also been revealed within this debacle but also importantly South Africa, very much also coming to the fore. And we know that President

Jacob Zuma's nephew, Khulubuse Zuma has been mentioned.

And of course we have also heard a response coming through from him and saying, well, we haven't really heard anything new. And importantly,

over and above this, that he doesn't have any ties to any offshore account.

CURNOW: OK, Eleni, thank you so much for that update there from Johannesburg.

CURNOW: Still ahead, the fate of John Kasich's presidential campaign may hinge on a committee of 112 Republicans. We'll talk to our Jon Mann

about how the Republican race for the White House is pivoting to the convention. Stay with us.

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CURNOW: Welcome to the INTERNATIONAL DESK. Thanks so much for joining me. I'm Robyn Curnow. Here's a check of the headlines.

(HEADLINES)

CURNOW: And Wisconsin voters may have set the stage for deciding the Republican nominee at this summer's convention. Here's a look at the

delegate count --

[10:30:00]

CURNOW: -- right now. Wisconsin gave Ted Cruz at least 36 of the state's 42 delegates on Tuesday. Donald Trump now needs about 60 percent

of remaining delegates to avoid a contested convention.

Jon Mann joins me now to talk more about all of this.

"Contested convention," at one point many people said, well, this is just a journalist's wish list because it's going to be great for ratings

and newspaper sales. But actually it's becoming more and more likely, isn't it. This is the scenario.

JONATHAN MANN, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: This I think is really going to happen. And the reason is clear from those numbers. You

saw that Donald Trump has more than his top two rivals.

But when you add all the delegates of all of his rivals who are still in the race, like John Kasich or Marco Rubio, who's no longer in the race,

he actually doesn't have a majority of delegates that he needs to get. He has got to start winning, as you said, 60 percent of the delegates. He's

never done that.

Up to now, he's won between 35 percent and 45 percent of the vote in most states. And in states where those delegates are shared, this is

looking like no one is going to arrive at the convention with the 1,237 delegates needed and for the first time in 40 years the convention, instead

of being like a quiet day at church, where everyone shows up on their best behavior, singing from the same hymnal and basically sharing their faith as

a community, they're going to show up and it's going to like be a rugby match. It's going to be like a hockey game and they are going to be

swinging sticks at each other.

And the Republican Party -- the old school Republican Party -- is terrified because it will be live on national television, an experiment in

public democracy of a kind no party in this country has really ever seen before.

CURNOW: Very messy political theater. Let's just talk, though, about the convention. Maybe we're getting a bit too far ahead of ourselves here.

There's a lot of dealing and conversations that are going to be had in the next few weeks that actually could have a huge impact on how this plays out

in the convention.

MANN: Exactly right. And this is -- easy to lose track of.

Up until now, the contest has been to win delegates. Every day, we tell you about the number of delegates they have, who won last week's or

who won last night's.

And once those delegates are selected, we just kind of assume they're like points, like a football team might have and halfway through the match.

(CROSSTALK)

MANN: They're not like points in a football match because they can switch sides. And that's the crucial thing that's going on now. It's not

about accumulating points or accumulating delegates: it's making sure that the Trump campaign can't steal people who have been elected to support Ted

Cruz or the Cruz campaign can't steal delegates who've been elected to support Donald Trump.

At the convention, virtually every state -- and the rules are complicated and they're varied across state lines -- every delegate has to

support their declared candidate for the first ballot. But after the first ballot, it's open season on those delegates.

And so what we're seeing already is an attempt to win delegates over who might say, well, we know you're going to support Robyn on the first

ballot. You've got to support Robyn. But Jon Mann is the guy you've got to go to on the second ballot.

And given that these delegates are not necessarily -- even the Trump delegate, the people who've been elected to vote for Donald Trump -- they

may be party figures who have no allegiance to Donald Trump. They just know that their obligation is to go and vote the first time. They may hate

Donald Trump.

And they may be looking for an opportunity to switch sides and we're going to see that at a contested convention live on television.

CURNOW: And also if we're going to stick with the sporting analogies here, there's this rules committee -- and this is also about shifting the

goalposts before a convention. That, in itself, is fascinating because no one quite knows what the ground rules here are.

MANN: Literally. That's exactly right. Imagine a championship match and the rules haven't been set. Before the Republican convention will

actually get underway in Cleveland in July, someone has to establish rules. Well, it's 1,000 pages thick, the book of rules. But one of those rules

for example, were famously known as Rule 40b, says that in order to even be nominated, to get on the nomination paper at the convention, you have to

have won eight states by at least 50 percent of the delegates.

(CROSSTALK)

CURNOW: John Kasich doesn't make that at all.

MANN: Ted Cruz doesn't qualify. The only Republican right now under Rule 40b who's eligible to be nominated for the Republican nomination is

Donald Trump.

So obviously John Kasich's people want to approach the rules committee which is going to meet this month, months before the convention, to get

that rule changed. Ted Cruz's people and Donald Trump's people, Cruz is a bit of a surprise, are saying, no, let's keep Rule 40b.

So the fight that you've described, this championship match is already underway over the rules. So the campaign now is no longer a conventional

campaign. It's a campaign within a campaign, a campaign to win the rules and a campaign to win over delegates to steal points from the opposing

team's score --

(CROSSTALK)

CURNOW: What's so important about what you're saying now is that actually this, in a way, disregards voters' wishes. This is about deals

and backroom shenanigans in many ways and the will of the voter seems to be secondary.

I want to talk though, quickly, about Donald Trump and the threat that he might walk away, that always the option is, if he feels something has

been unfair or something -- this is going to be stolen from him --

[10:35:00]

CURNOW: -- he could become a third-party candidate.

It's not that easy, is it?

MANN: It's not. He's already been angry enough to threaten to sue in two separate states about the delegate process. And he's threatening to

leave the party entirely and run as an independent.

It's very easy to leave the Republican Party. The question is, how can you run for president without that party, without that infrastructure?

The way the laws are in the 50 states of the United States, and every state's different -- it's tough.

But Donald Trump still has time to do it. He could, for example, decide he wants to be the nominee of the Libertarian Party. He's had a

flirtation with them in the past. They haven't got a nominee yet. So he could switch parties and go to the Libertarian Party, the Constitutionalist

Party. But he'd have to do it soon because they are going to choose a nominee as well.

Or he could do it with no party backing whatsoever and start his own Trump-like organization, the Trump Party. But to do that, he'd have to get

on the ballot in all 50 states. He'd have to get all kinds of petitions, hire all kinds of attorneys.

Can it be done?

Yes. But here's the thing: by July, when the Republican convention convenes, it will be too late. He has to do it now. If he's going to jump

ship. he has to do it before it leaves port.

And so right now his decision has got to be, well, am I going to stay? Am I going to stay and work with the Republican National Committee and the

Republican Party or not?

And he's got to make that decision before he knows what's going to happen at the nominating convention.

So if you're Donald Trump and you have the prospect of a messy convention or an even messier effort to go without the party, that's a

decision he's got to make literally in the next month or two if he's going to actually make good on his promise and potentially leave.

CURNOW: Fascinating stuff. Jon Mann --

MANN: It's a mess.

CURNOW: Here we go, you just said. That's the headline. Thank you.

MANN: Sure thing.

CURNOW: Well, you're at the INTERNATIONAL DESK. Still ahead, concerns over safe drinking water are resurfacing in Bangladesh. Why Human

Rights Watch is accusing the government of neglect.

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CURNOW: Thanks for joining me. I'm Robyn Curnow. You're watching CNN.

Human Rights Watch says millions of people in Bangladesh are slowly but surely being poisoned; in a new report the rights group accuses the

government of failing to find a solution to much of the country's drinking water being contaminated with arsenic.

Sumnima Udas has the story.

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SUMNIMA UDAS, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Thirty-year-old Jahara Akhtar (ph) draws water from her family's well. The clear water contains a

deadly element, arsenic, but she doesn't have another option.

Her mother died from drinking it. Her brother and father are both ill. The problem is widespread and well-known. The fix: simple but

costly.

According to Richard Pearshouse of Human Rights Watch.

RICHARD PEARSHOUSE, HRW: Water from 150 meters down is usually safe. It's usually arsenic free. Water from just 30 or 50 meters down, that's

the water that is usually contaminated with arsenic.

The problem in Bangladesh is shallow tube wells. They're wells that go just 50 meters down. To get 150 meters down, that costs approximately -

-

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PEARSHOUSE: -- $1,000.

UDAS (voice-over): Odorless, tasteless and poisonous arsenic naturally occurs in soil and rock in Bangladesh. Beneath the world's

bypass, this top third (ph). But Human Rights Watch says tens of millions of people living in rural and poor areas of the country need the government

to provide these deeper, more expensive wells.

The group visited five villages and talked to over 100 people and found a big problem.

PEARSHOUSE: A deep tube well from the government could be providing lifesaving, safe water for hundreds of people. But what I saw when I went

to the villages was a different situation.

There would be a few government tube wells in those areas. But they would be in private people's houses. They'd be in someone's back yard,

locked up behind the shed and they'd be used by that person's immediate family, so five or six people.

And there are thousands of people in that one village, who are still drinking contaminated well water from their wells. They know the arsenic

is contaminated but they have no alternative because the government water points are used by private families, who have got them through political

connections.

UDAS (voice-over): And even when the government tries to install deep water wells in villages, Pearshouse says it's not getting it right.

PEARSHOUSE: Bangladesh has mapped to an incredibly precise degree where the arsenic is in its groundwaters. They are extensive maps that are

incredibly detailed level across this country. But when deciding where to put new tube wells which could keep people safe, they don't actually follow

that.

UDAS (voice-over): Human Rights Watch hopes that by again drawing attention to the issue, the government of Bangladesh will take its

recommendation to adopt a national plan to end arsenic exposure and provide millions with access to safe water.

PEARSHOUSE: This problem came to the world's attention 20 years ago. And it got on the front page of "The New York Times" and was widely

covered. The problem of arsenic in the drinking water is still as deadly as it was the first time the world learned about this problem.

UDAS: Now we reached out to the Bangladesh government for a comment on this Human Rights Watch report.

The director general of health services, Dean Mohamed (ph), said he was not aware of this report but he did say -- and I quote -- "Arsenic in

water in rural Bangladesh is a problem no doubt. But it's not very serious. The government has been setting up health care facilities and

community-led programs to educate people about arsenic in water for years.

"We're trying to stop villages from using tube well water and asking them to use boiled surface water instead" -- Sumnima Udas, CNN, New Delhi.

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CURNOW: Thanks to Sumnima for that report, important report.

OK. Finally, forget about catch of the day. This could be catch of a lifetime. A group of hunters came across this Godzilla-sized alligator at

a private ranch in Florida.

After they shot that, they found it weighed in at more than 350 kilograms. But amazingly, it's not the most massive gator found in

Florida. Wow, look at that boy.

The biggest one on record weighed about 100 kilos more.

Thanks for watching. I'm Robyn Curnow. This has been the INTERNATIONAL DESK. Coming up, "WORLD SPORT" with Alex Thomas.

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