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John Kasich Says America Has 2 Paths in Election; Will Obama's Greatest Mistake as President Hurt Clinton Campaign; John Kerry Criticized for No Atomic Bomb Apology in Japan; Video Provides Key Detail in NFL's Will Smith Murder. Aired 2:30-3p ET

Aired April 12, 2016 - 14:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


[14:30:00] BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN ANCHOR: But could there still be a chance for an upset at the GOP convention? We'll discuss that.

Also, President Obama admits the biggest mistake of his presidency. Does it help or hurt Hillary Clinton's chances at the White House?

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[14:34:42] BALDWIN: We're just past the bottom of the hour. You're watching CNN. I'm Brooke Baldwin.

Following breaking news, following the 2016 race, we're waiting to hear from House Speaker Paul Ryan who is expected to shut down, once and for all, all speculation he might at the last minute be chosen as the Republican nominee for president at the convention. He's set to speak at Republican National Committee headquarters. We are told he plans to say he will not be the nominee under any circumstances. So stand by for that.

Meantime, one candidate vying for the nomination is laying out his, quote/unquote, "two paths," he says Americans can choose this election year. Ohio Governor John Kasich says it all boils down to his path that is, quote, "steep but well trod and solid," or the other offered up by his opponents that would lead America down a path of darkness. Here he was.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOHN KASICH, (R), OHIO GOVERNOR & PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Some who feed off the fears and the anger that is felt by some of us, and exploited, feed their own insatiable desires for fame or attention. That could drive America down into a ditch and not make us great again.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: With that, let me bring in Republican strategist, Lisa Boothe. She's also the president of High Noon Strategies and a contributor to "The Washington Examiner." And here with me, Joe Boreli, a New York City councilman and the co-chair of Trump's New York campaign.

Welcome to both of you. LISA BOOTHE, REPUBLICAN STRATEGIST & PRESIDENT, HIGH NOON STRATEGIES &

CONTRIBUTOR, THE WASHINGTON EXAMINER: Hi, Brooke.

JOE BORELI, (R), NEW YORK COUNCILMAN & CO CHAIR, NEW YORK DONALD TRUMP CAMPAIGN: Thank you.

BALDWIN: Lisa, to you first.

Just hearing Governor Kasich, you know, he didn't name check any of his rivals per se but it was very clear who and what he was talking about. Do you think with what he said today, does that move the dial for him whatsoever?

BOOTHE: It doesn't. I mean, look, Governor Kasich has been trying to position himself as sort of this consensus candidate. The alternative to Donald Trump and Cruz but that's not happened yet. If you look at the election process, the only state he's won is Ohio. So I don't think that message is being heard. You also have to look at what the appetite of the Republican electorate has been thus far. If you look at exit polls, it's clear that Republican voters want an anti- establishment candidate, that they are upset at the Republican Party and, you know, so I just don't -- think his message is really falling on deaf ears right now.

BALDWIN: On that, cue the question about Donald Trump.

Joe, turn to you on that, because, you know, we talk about new polling number, massive numbers coming out of this poll. He's at 60 percent which is I think the biggest number I've seen thus far here in New York, headed into next week's primary, commanding 43-point lead over his Republican rivals. There's a "but" to this. The "but" is, when it companies to general elections head to head, he is trounced by both Hillary Clinton and Bernie Sanders. That has to be concerning for you looking into a potential general election match.

BORELI: Right, look, there's no caught that some polls indicate Donald Trump will have a difficult time against Hillary, but there was an A.P. poll out that indicated he was in a tie in Pennsylvania. So there is some --

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: OK, but what about this poll?

BORELI: Yeah, this poll certainly doesn't say that. But the real battle for Donald Trump right now is make sure he gets enough delegates to secure the nomination. After the convention in November, we will have enough time to sort of move the needle and ideally take on Hillary in the general.

BALDWIN: Is that doesn't worry you, even just looking ahead to November, assuming he gets that magic number, that he doesn't fare well with either of them?

BORELI: It's not necessarily worrying. A lot of people have focused on his unfavorables. If you look at Hillary Clinton's unfavorables, you don't see her that far behind. If Trump has a national problem, I say to you Hillary Clinton also has a national problem.

BALDWIN: Looking at, Lisa, reading this piece, this interview, Donald Trump did with "USA Today," he talks about potential picks for vice president. I think it's interesting, a number of the names he threw out are people he's criticized, being Scott Walker, Marco Rubio, and he also mentioned John Kasich. What do you make of those choices he mentioned?

BOOTHE: Those would be all good choices for him. He has said he needs someone who is in politics, who has that federal experience, and I absolutely do think he does. If you look at his campaign so far, his Achilles heel, potentially, has been so far, is the organizational structural, the failure to be organized. That's part of being a novice candidate. He's not done this before. He's not run for political office. He's flirted with the idea but he hasn't actually done it and moved forward with the process. I think he needs someone that can help navigate that process for him and also someone who will help deliver a key state. You look at Ohio, Florida, Wisconsin, pivotal states to Republicans potential winning the White House. So I think he needs someone with that federal experience, that political experience to help guide him.

BALDWIN: Joe, what do you think, those names floated?

BORELI: I think a lot of people right now are potentially saying they wouldn't be considered as potential nominees. I think that's the thing that always happens going into a convention.

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: For V.P. picks you mean?

BORELI: Right, I think any one of those would be someone who can bring a positive experience and some positive momentum.

BALDWIN: Even though Marco Rubio, day one, back in the Senate, said, no way, no how, not anybody's V.P., minds can still be changed?

BORELI: I think minds can be changed. That's traditionally what people have said going into national conventions.

BALDWIN: Joe Boreli, thank you.

Lisa, thank you.

BOOTHE: Thanks, Brooke.

[14:40:01] BALDWIN: Coming up next, President Obama opening up about what he says is the biggest mistake of his entire presidency. For how that can perhaps affect the current race for the White House, we will talk to Fareed Zakaria, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BALDWIN: President Barack Obama, 40 weeks remaining in office, getting quite candid about a number of issues, including what he says was the biggest mistake of his presidency.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CHRIS WALLACE, FOX NEWS ANCHOR: Worse mistake?

BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Probably failing to plan for the day after what I think was thing to do in intervening in Libya.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: Joining me now, Fareed Zakaria, host of CNN's "Fareed Zakaria, GPS."

Welcome, sir. Always a pleasure.

Jumping off what he told FOX News, in "The Atlantic" last month, the president referred to the troubled state as a bleep show. Said the U.S. had no business attempting to govern in that region. We're politically minded in this race for the White House, Hillary Clinton served as the secretary of state, was quite involved with what happened in Libya. Does what the president said there, as his biggest mistake, affect her negatively moving forward in the race?

[14:45:13] FAREED ZAKARIA, CNN HOST, FAREED ZAKARIA, GPS: First, I think it was a mistake for the president. The correct answer to that question should be, I'm going to let historians decide what my biggest mistake is. Because he's still a player. He's still dealing with all these people. It's rather odd, at the very least, wait until you're out of office and write your memoir. He's now going to have to deal with the very people whom he's talking about. So there's something odd, almost too frank. It's understandable you want to be frank. But you can't do it while you're still playing the game. You wait until you get off the field. I don't think it hurts Hillary though. I think fundamentally, anything that gets at the substance of these issues, ironically, or strangely, helps Hillary Clinton.

BALDWIN: How?

ZAKARIA: Because it reminds people she was the secretary of state for four years. It brings up her clear competence and knowledge on these issues. She can talk about these with great depth. Compare that to the other side. I mean, you have Donald Trump who doesn't remember, doesn't know what the triad is, can't remember what countries he's dealing with. You know, the contrast between the qualifications of Hillary Clinton and the lack thereof, particularly of the Republican front-runner, get accent rated the more the discussion is about substance.

BALDWIN: That's interesting that's your take on that. I wanted to ask you, also, what's happening in Japan. U.S. Secretary of State John Kerry, the highest-ranking diplomat to visit Hiroshima Peace Park, ground zero for the atom bombs. He's criticized for not issuing an apology. What do you make of the fact he was there and should he apologize? ZAKARIA: No, he should not apologize because it's not a mistake.

It's a difficult complicated choice. A perfect illustration of Sherman's great line, "War is hell." It probably saved Japanese lives because the alternative to dropping the atomic bomb would have been an all-out ground invasion of Japan, which would have cost enormous number of American lives, enormous numbers of Japanese lives. Remember, without atomic bombs, we firebomb. The United States firebombed Tokyo and killed tens of thousands of people, essentially reduced Tokyo to a wasteland. So that's the kind of thing that would have happened throughout Japan if there hasn't been this incredible demonstration, in fact, terrible, terrible consequences.

But I do think it's the right thing to show a kind of remorseful what happened in the sense that war is hell and these are terrible choices. And I think that Kerry phrased it in exactly that way. You know, Obama, his administration, have been trying to push the envelope on these issues, which is Obama's view I think is very clear and I think he's articulated it a couple of times, it's a good thing for the United States to reflect on its past, to acknowledge areas --

(CROSSTALK)

ZAKARIA: -- and to acknowledge areas where there were mistakes made. It doesn't make us weaker, it make us stronger. In Cuba, if you'll remember, there was a moment where Raul Castro criticizes the U.S., and Obama says, you know what, come at me, that's fine, we're a strong country, we believe in introspection, self-criticism. I think that's basically a right choice. In Hiroshima, I don't think an apology is necessary but certainly some reflection on what was clearly dark day in the world.

BALDWIN: Fareed, thank you so much.

ZAKARIA: Pleasure.

BALDWIN: Fareed Zakaria.

Make sure you watch Fareed, 10:00 a.m. and 1:00 p.m. eastern, Sundays, here on CNN, "Fareed Zakaria, GPS."

Coming up next, new videos bring new twists to the new shooting death of a former NFL football star. What they indicate and why the suspect in the shooting says he was, in fact, the victim of a crime.

Also ahead, speaker of the U.S. House of Representatives, Paul Ryan, due to set the record straight, finally, finally, he says. Next hour, Speaker Ryan says emphatically he is not going to be the next president. But might there still be a chance for an upset at the convention for the Republicans in Cleveland?

We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[14:53:22] BALDWIN: We are getting some breaking news just in to CNN. A controversial new bill is headed to the desk of the Tennessee governor. Just one of a swath of similar protection bills being passed and rejected across the country. It would essentially allow therapists and counselors to legally refuse service to LGBT people based upon religious objections. As soon as we have more, we'll bring it to you on CNN.

Video may provide key new details of the moments just before former NFL star, Will Smith, was shot and killed. Here is the new surveillance video. Shows this New Orleans street just before the shooting. Appears to show a Mercedes SUV rear-ending a Hummer. Just as the Hummer starts there to pull off the road, the Mercedes drives away. Then a short time later, police say a Hummer, driven by the shooting suspect, Cardell Hayes, rear-ends Will Smith's SUV. They say Hayes shoots Smith multiple times, kills him, and then shoot's Smith's wife in the leg. Now, the suspect's lawyer is drawing attention to another new video in which a witness claims there was a second gun.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED WITNESS: He starts freaking out on this guy like, get out, I have a gun. Then he's like, I get one, too.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: It is important to note, police only found one gun at the scene.

I'm joined by Sonny Lee, the founder of Son of a Saint, an organization in New Orleans that provides mentoring and support service to young boys whose fathers have died or been jailed, also the chief aide to Tom Benson, who owns the New Orleans Saints.

Sonny, I know your dad played for the Saints as well, so wonderful to have you on.

[14:55:15] SONNY LEE, FOUNDER, SON OF A SAINT & CHIEF AIDE TO NEW ORLEANS SAINTS OWNER TOM BENSON: Thank you for having me. Good afternoon.

BALDWIN: I was texting and this is how I got connected to you, a current player of the Saints who was drafted with Will Smith in '04. He says the whole thing has been horrendous and awful for the team and the community. You're there in New Orleans. Tell me what the reaction's been like.

LEE: First, I'd like to give my condolences to the Smith family but also the family of the accused shooter. But you know the community -- it just really hits home for us. We have a lot of violence in our city. But somebody who plays for the New Orleans Saints, you know, it's a little close to home. A lot of people are going to wake up and actually do something.

BALDWIN: Well, I want to get to the "do something" bit in a moment, but, you know, talk about a visceral reaction. We've heard from the Saints Head Coach Sean Payton, he talked to "USA Today," railed against guns. This is what coach said. "200 years from now, they're going to look back and say, what was that madness about? The idea we need them to fend off intruders, people are more apt to draw them. That's some silly stuff we're hanging on to. I hate guns."

My question to you, as you work with young men in New Orleans and we talk about, you know, in some pockets of violent culture, you know, what are the young men telling you in terms of what's happened with this former player and just in terms of settling an argument with a gun?

LEE: Well, my boys have actually been called in and asked if kids were going to be in the program along with the accused killer's sons, because in our program, that's what we have, boys who have lost their fathers to violence or long-term incarceration, majority of our boys. So we're dealing with a bigger issue and this is the symptom of it that's been going on for a long time in a lot of urban cities. We're dealing with poverty and we're dealing with lack of education, lack of opportunity, broken homes. So this is nothing new. And so, you know, now we need to act on it and focus on the solutions.

BALDWIN: Talk about what you've done so far with, you know, your organization in terms of solutions, in terms of helping these young men not turn to violence.

LEE: Well, for us, focusing on getting the boys at about middle school age and the boys are with us until they got their college acceptance letter. We provide hope, vision and opportunity for the boys. These are boys that come in our and we also -- they've also had a lot of trauma. And we provide a safe and secure place for them at our clubhouse in New Orleans. We have about 45 boys in our program. Our oldest boy is actually at Xavier University. The next graduate just got accepted to the University of Tampa. So we feel that our formula is working. Our boys, they receive counseling, tutoring. They get exposed to a variety of things that they otherwise probably wouldn't. It's really consistent and positive messaging is what we're giving them.

BALDWIN: We were talking in the commercial, you know, I don't know if you will be in touch with Will Smith's kids or the kids of Mr. Hayes, but if you advice what would you say?

LEE: Well, for me personally when I first heard about it, I immediately thought about the kids, specifically the boys, because it's what I went through. My father died when I was 3 years old. And so, you know, there are going to be a lot of questions you know from the boys, you know, what if they dent go out that night or what if they made a left turn versus a right turn. They're going to see pictures of them, video. A lot of his teammates are going to talk about how great of a guy he was. These are things that are going to be hard to hear. You know, it's really letting them to grieve over there, really understand it. I feel they will need counseling. But really it's the support of the city and understanding from their friends that they're going to need. We just need to be really patient and let them digest this just as much as we are in the community. So, yeah, I mean, we're there for them. We welcome them, and want to be a part of the change.

BALDWIN: Our hearts are with all of you in New Orleans.

Again, Sonny Lee, thank you.

If you want more information in New Orleans, the organization is Son of a Saint.

Thank you.

LEE: Thank you for having me.

[15:00:07] BALDWIN: Hour two. Here we go. You're watching CNN. I'm Brooke Baldwin.