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Legal View with Ashleigh Banfield

Trump Shows Softer Side at CNN Town Hall; Both Sanders and Clinton Pick up Endorsements; New Developments in the Will Smith Investigation. Aired 12-12:30p ET

Aired April 13, 2016 - 12:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[12:00:27] PAMELA BROWN, CNN ANCHOR: Hello, everyone. I'm Pamela Brown, in for Ashleigh Banfield on this Wednesday. And welcome to LEGAL VIEW.

It is a tale of two Trumps today. On the one hand, the fiery, blustery side of Mr. Trump is on full display as he escalates his war of words with RNC Chairman Reince Priebus. Trump claims that the system is rigged, while Priebus says that it simply not true. All of this comes as Trump shows off his softer side during CNN's town hall, joined by his wife and children. The GOP frontrunner revealed his role as a father and husband. Michelle Kosinski gives us a closer look.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ANDERSON COOPER, CNN ANCHOR: You don't think the RNC wants you to get the nomination?

DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: No, I don't think so.

MICHELLE KOSINSKI, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Republican frontrunner Donald Trump calling out the Republican National Committee during CNN's town hall Tuesday night, accusing them of conspiring to keep him from clinching the GOP nomination by denying him delegates.

D. TRUMP: I won Louisiana. I won it easily. So I -

COOPER: You won the popular vote. He got more delegates than you did.

D. TRUMP: I won the popular vote. And because of all the shenanigans that goes on and this is -

COOPER: You call them shenanigans. Those are the rules.

D. TRUMP: I do. I do.

COOPER: And didn't you know those rules -

D. TRUMP: You know why the rules - I know the rules very well, but I know that it's stacked against me and by the establishment.

KOSINSKI: Trump alleging the Republican Party is, quote, "100 percent controlled by the RNC" and that rules were changed to stop him.

D. TRUMP: And they changed the rules a number of months ago. The people in -

COOPER: Just about eight months ago.

D. TRUMP: Well, it's not very long ago.

COOPER: But you had a lot of time to prepare a better organization.

D. TRUMP: You know why they changed the rules, because they saw how I was doing and they didn't like it.

KOSINSKI: The Trump family later joining the candidate on stage. Trump's daughters taking on critics who say their father is disrespectful to women.

IVANKA TRUMP, DONALD TRUMP'S DAUGHTER: He always taught me that there wasn't anything that I couldn't do and I don't think that's the message a father would relay to a daughter who he didn't believe had the potential to accomplish exactly what her brothers could.

KOSINSKI: Both pointing to their upbringing as evidence of an equal opportunity father and business mogul.

TIFFANY TRUMP, DONALD TRUMP'S DAUGHTER: My father, since I've been a little girl, has always just inspired me and had so much faith in me to just be the best person I can be, the best woman I can be.

KOSINSKI: Trump admitting that when it comes to debates, his family sometimes wishes he would lighten up.

D. TRUMP: They're always saying, be nicer on the debate. I say, wait a minute, they're coming at me from all these different angles. Well, how can I be nice? But Melania in particular would say, but nicer in the debates. I said, I can't do that. I have to win first.

KOSINSKI: Donald Trump Jr. agrees.

DONALD TRUMP JR., DONALD TRUMP'S SON: Everyone talks about that tone, but there also comes a time where you actually have to put the hammer down, right?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I agree.

DONALD TRUMP JR.: There comes a time where, you know, being nice and trying to do all this stuff, you know, when people are laughing at your face, you have to actually fight back. And, you know, that's what's so important about what he does.

KOSINSKI: Trump's wife, Melania, pushing her husband to act more presidential.

COOPER: How would you like him to be different?

MELANIA TRUMP, DONALD TRUMP'S WIFE: Just to use nice language sometimes.

COOPER: Better language.

M. TRUMP: Better language. Not all the time. Not all the time.

COOPER: I know you were - you - you were upset when -

M. TRUMP: Sometimes I agree with him.

COOPER: Somebody yelled out something at one of his rallies. I know you were upset - you were upset with that.

M. TRUMP: Correct, and shouldn't (ph) repeat it. Yes, and I was thinking, just don't repeat it because (INAUDIBLE) the press, all they will talk it's about the word, inappropriate word, and that was correct.

KOSINSKI: And on changing his tone, Trump says he can switch it up anytime.

D. TRUMP: It's easy to do it. I mean it's easier to do it than the way I behave right now. But -

COOPER: So, why not?

D. TRUMP: You have to because I have two more people I have to take out and -

KOSINSKI: But when it comes to the retweeting that sparked Trump's recent war of wives last month with Ted Cruz, Trump said, yes, it's the retweets that usually get him in hot water and that it's all his own doing.

D. TRUMP: During the evenings, after 7:00 or so, I will always do it by myself.

COOPER: Melania, do you ever want to say to him, put the mobile device down?

M. TRUMP: Oh, yes.

COOPER: That like - that it's 2:00 a.m. and you're still tweeting.

M. TRUMP: Anderson, if he would only listen. I did many times. And I just say, OK, do whatever you want. He's an adult.

COOPER: Right.

M. TRUMP: He knows the consequences.

KOSINSKI: But it's the special bond, they say, they all have with their father that trumps it all.

ERIC TRUMP, DONALD TRUMP'S SON: He's just always had so much love for us and his whole family. He's an amazing guy. One of my best friends in the entire world. (END VIDEOTAPE)

KOSINSKI: Well, we also learned something new about how those infamous Trump tweets make their way out into the world. How do they come to be? In Donald Trump's own words, he said he simply shouts them out to the young ladies in his office.

And speaking of tweets, we do have a tweet rebuttal today. A tweet buttle from RNC Chair Reince Priebus saying, "nomination process known for a year and beyond. It's the responsibility of the campaigns to understand it. Complaints now? Give us all a break."

Pamela.

[12:05:03] BROWN: All right, Michelle Kosinski, thank you for that.

And let's talk more about this town hall and the feud between Trump and the RNC. Joining us now is Trump supporter and treasurer for the state of Arizona, Jeff DeWit, along with Raul Reyes, he is a CNN opinion writer who wrote a new piece on last night's town hall.

Thank you both for coming on.

Jeff, to you first. You saw what Mr. Priebus had to say about Trump's claims that the rules were made to hurt him, to go against him. What do you make of the RNC chair's response?

JEFF DEWIT, TRUMP SUPPORTER: Well, clearly the response is inaccurate when you - you look at Colorado's rules were changed in August, after Mr. Trump was not only in the race but leading the pack as the frontrunner. So, obviously, when he comes down, you know, the GOP chair now, and says, oh, it was done over a year ago, well, that's inaccurate. It was done in August. Mr. Trump was in the race. And these rules were clearly changed to reflect the fact that the establishment is very worried about Mr. Trump being the nominee. But that doesn't change the fact that as a country the majority of the people want him as not only the nominee but as a the president, which is why he leads Ted Cruz by over 2 million votes.

BROWN: But, hold on, that was the Colorado Republican Party, that wasn't the RNC. And, look, he's saying, the rules have been out there. You're supposed to learn up, read the rules and act accordingly. Isn't that a fair rebuttal to what Trump is saying?

DEWIT: No. I think the other thing that's interesting is that some of these state parties are not following their own rules. And we've heard many stories about Colorado kicking Trump people out of the room before they vote. If you're going to kick all the Trump supporters out of the room before the vote, clearly then Ted Cruz can sweep. So - which is evidence by the GOP's tweet that said we did it #nevertrump.

So these are rules - I guess if you go to the American people and you say, OK, the rules are we can change the rules whenever we want and we don't have to follow the rules, that's basically what the rules are saying. But what I'd like to ask now, Reince, is to say, OK, are you going to commit that the rules will not change then also at the convention? Because there's a lot of rumor that they're going to keep - if Mr. Trump keeps doing well, as we project that he will, they're going to go further and try to change those rules and I think someone needs to pin him down and see if he's now saying that he won't do that.

BROWN: Yes, we're going to have a discussion about that actually, that very topic later in the show.

Raul, I'm going to get to you in just a second, but I have one more question for you, Jeff, because one of the claims by Trump is that the Republican Party does not like him because he's not bound by these special interests. Take a listen to what he said about that.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Anderson, we had delegates there. We had a lot of delegates and they were not heard because the Republican Party out there was 100 percent probably controlled by the RNC, which maybe doesn't like this happening because I'm a self- funder. I'm putting up my own money. They don't like when I put up my own money because it means they don't have any control of me because I'm working for the people.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BROWN: So he's self-funding to a certain extent. But, still, how does that play to voters in the GOP, Jeff?

DEWIT: Well, voters have figured out, and I myself can tell you, as an elected official, that the role that money plays in politics is disgusting. And money absolutely controls so many of our politicians. And we are looking for that fresh face that Mr. Trump brings where he's not controlled by the money interests. So, that, obviously, plays very, very well. And when you look at his family now too coming on TV and you see that they are all very good, high moral value, clean-cut, straight-shooting, straight talking, very well spoken and beautiful - a beautiful family that he brings with him and, quite frankly, his family, as we saw last night, looks very presidential, too. Looks like the first family that will make America proud again, too. So I think the whole package is there for him to do very well.

BROWN: And, Raul, voters were able to hear from Trump's family about his role as a father. Here's some of what his children had to say about that.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

IVANKA TRUMP, DONALD TRUMP'S DAUGHTER: Every day of our life, every morning, don't drink, don't do drugs, don't -

ANDERSON COOPER, CNN ANCHOR: Every morning?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Every morning before school.

I. TRUMP: Every morning.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Without fail.

I. TRUMP: I mean it was, as young children, it often was accompanied by one of us eye rolling, but, you know, I think, in retrospect, as parents, we - we see how much that was an important message.

D. TRUMP: She used say, daddy, don't say that anymore.

I. TRUMP: Please.

D. TRUMP: Don't say that anymore. But I just felt it was important because I've seen so many brilliant young children of wonderful parents destroyed because they drank or they took drugs.

DONALD TRUMP JR. DONALD TRUMP'S SON: Throughout our lives he's always - he's always been there. It's usually been on his terms. It wasn't a typical, let's go play catch in the backyard sort of father-son relationships, but we always went to job sites with him. We'd be in, you know, his office playing with trucks as a six-year-old while he's negotiating deals with presidents of major companies. And so he always made himself available.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BROWN: So, Raul, you had this opinion piece on cnn.com where you spoke how lovely Trump's family was, but you wrote this. Quote, "as Trump brings his family into the limelight at this type of event, it glosses over the very real ugliness of his campaign." What did they gloss over, Raul?

RAUL REYES, CNN OPINION WRITER: Well, first of all, I want to say that I - that I do agree that his - his family certainly seems very lovely. And it is a tribute to him considering all of his accomplishments as a builder, as a developer. I think one of the greatest tributes to Trump, the man himself, is that he has such a close family that - that seems to respect him deeply. They're close. And they all look to him as an inspiration.

[12:10:15] Now that said, that - that is all true and it's very commendable, yet we cannot overlook the Trump phenomenon in the broader context. And that is, Trump, as a candidate, has trafficked in the worst type of ethnic stereotypes. He has questioned - as a birther, he has questioned the legitimacy of our first African- American president, he has engaged in varying degrees of Islamaphobia. He has called for mass deportations. All sorts of things that would not strike most Americans as so-called family values.

Now, I'm not taking away from who he may be in his own personal life and his children probably have every reason to love and admire him and respect him, but that - that cannot explain away, for example, his misogynistic comments about women, the way he has mocked disabled people, the way he has mocked at time veterans, and the way he has in a sense mainstreamed hate within not only the Republican Party but within the United States.

One of the things that Ivana Trump said last night, she said, the facts speak for themselves and she talked about her close relationship with her father. And it's true the facts do speak for themselves and that's why Donald Trump has something like 70 percent plus negatives among American women. That's why Donald Trump currently has 80 percent plus disapproval rates among Latinos and within those numbers, it's 70 percent plus very negative among Latinos. These did not occur in a vacuum. These are a direct result of the type of ugly campaign that he has been running that has played to so much of our worst nativist fears and anti-immigrant sentiment.

BROWN: So what do you make of that, Jeff. Raul's basically saying that his family sort of conveniently didn't address those issues.

DEWIT: Well, I don't think those are issues that are real. I disagree with almost all of them. I think if you look at - let's look at the state of Florida where you have two Cuban background candidates, you know, Marco Rubio was still in the race in Florida, and you have Ted Cruz and Donald Trump got more votes than both of them. And so to say that he doesn't - and that's a very strong Latino community there, too. To say that he isn't crossing those - those lines and getting into, you know, the support of not only the Hispanic people but of women is completely inaccurate. He does very well with both groups and he's only going to do better.

As people see his family and everything on there, you know, we've done very well. I'll be honest, you know, President Obama has two very beautiful daughters. And even going back, George Bush had a very beautiful family. People look at that. And when they see his beautiful family and they see that - what Ivanka said about how Mr. Trump raised her to know that she had every possibility and opportunity male - that a man does, and she's a very strong, confident, capable woman.

REYES: Right. Right. You're - you're exactly right. And I think he - I think he does have a beautiful family.

BROWN: Raul, quickly.

REYES: I'm not questioning his beautiful family. I'm just saying that it is a fact. You know, we're talking about the facts. Donald Trump has incited violence at his rallies. His rallies -

BROWN: OK.

REYES: One of the hallmarks of these rallies has become violence directed at everyone from Black Lives Matter protester to Arab- Americans and Muslims and Latinos. Those are the facts. I'm not denying that Donald Trump has broad (INAUDIBLE) support among many different demographics -

DEWIT: Those aren't the fact. Those aren't facts, Raul. They're not facts.

REYES: But the fact is, he has run one of the ugliest presidential campaigns in modern American history.

BROWN: OK, thank you both.

DEWIT: No, that's - that's the leftist (INAUDIBLE). BROWN: Jeff DeWit, Raul Reyes -

REYES: Thank you very much.

BROWN: I have a feeling we're not going to settle that debate right here on the show, unfortunately.

REYES: All right.

BROWN: But thank you both for coming on. And by the way -

DEWIT: Thank you.

BROWN: Tonight it's Ted Cruz and his wife Heidi on the stage. You won't want to miss the third Republican town hall tonight at 9:00 p.m. Eastern only on CNN.

And coming up next, Hillary Clinton and Bernie Sanders battling out in New York, a day ahead of their big CNN debate. Both of them with plenty to say today and both of them picking up big endorsements. We're hot on their trail, coming up.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[12:17:50] BROWN: The two Democrats racing for the White House have their next faceoff tomorrow. That clock on your screen right there counting down to the New York City debate. This is where it's happening. Take a look at the Brooklyn Navy Yard. Clearly not a lot going on there right now, but all that changes tomorrow at 9:00 p.m. Eastern.

Senator Bernie Sanders appearing at a rally today thrown by a 42,000 strong transport union in New York City. Sanders has their endorsement. And he also picked up his first sitting senator's endorsement. Oregon Senator Jeff Merkley writes in today's "New York Times" that he feels Sanders is the guy to, quote, "rethink American politics and the economy."

OK, so we'll get that sound later on. But by contrast, Hillary Clinton has the endorsement of many sitting U.S. senators. At least 40, in fact, including the minority leader. This is a Clinton event happening right now. It's the convention of the National Action Network. New York's primaries for both parties, by the way, is six days from now. Things certainly heating up. To join us to talk about everything, Sally Kohn, a CNN political commentator and columnist for "The Daily Beast," and Maria Cardona, a Hillary Clinton supporter whose firm currently works for a pro-Clinton super PAC. She's also a super delegate.

SALLY KOHN, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: You are?

MARIA CARDONA, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: I am.

KOHN: I didn't know that.

CARDONA: Did you not know that? KOHN: Oh, my gosh, we're going to have to talk later.

BROWN: So - so we - all right, time is valuable now, so I want to just go to this new information we got about Bernie Sanders. You saw him, you know, walking the picket line with Verizon workers. Clearly a powerful image. He got this big endorsement from the transport union today. How will organized labor support affect the vote next Tuesday in your view here in New York?

KOHN: Well, you know, listen, it's - I think it's powerful and positive that some unions are coming out for Bernie. I think it sort of shows the real issues that he's bringing to the table. And, frankly, that a lot of working people - let's not forget, this isn't just about a campaign. This is about a lot of working people who feel like the Democratic Party, the Democratic Party establishment, and it's history of more centrist, big business and Wall Street cozy policies, have left out working people. And so those unions send an important signal. Let's not also forget, there are a lot of unions on the other side as well -

[12:20:03] CARDONA: Yes.

KOHN: Who have supported Hillary. So in earnest, I think it's probably a wash when it comes to the primary here.

BROWN: Let's - yes, so let's look at these endorsements that we know of right now. You have Occupy Wall Street, which is endorsing Sanders. You have Elijah Cummings, the Maryland congressman, Elijah Cummings, who likes Hillary Clinton. Hillary Clinton has 80 percent of the sitting Democratic senators support.

CARDONA: Yes.

BROWN: Bernie Sanders has the one senator's support we just discussed.

CARDONA: Right.

BROWN: What do these endorsements mean really because on the Republican side you've seen these endorsements not carry as much weight. Do they carry more on the Democratic side?

CARDONA: I think we are in an era of politics, Pam, where a lot of these endorsements don't mean as much as they used to. But at the same time, they are something that the candidates can tout and can use to further the message. You know, Sally just used it to further Sanders' message about working-class voters. I can use it to say, well, Hillary Clinton has a ton of endorsements from unions and, in fact, she has won the union vote in all of the primaries and caucuses up until now. And so it is something to tout.

I can talk about "The Daily News" and how impactful the horrible interview that Sanders had with them, you know, had an effect. That was out there. And - but I think the most important endorsement is the endorsement of the voters, right? At the end of the day, they're the ones who are going to make the decision. I think this is an election probably more so than any other where outside endorsements don't matter and voters are going to be looking at the records. They're going to be looking at the stances. They're going to be looking at what these candidates are saying and what they want that candidate to be doing for themselves.

BROWN: And it's interesting because the New York primary is getting more attention and carries more weight, Sally, than what we've seen in the past.

KOHN: Yes.

BROWN: For many reasons. And in light of that, you know, Bernie Sanders has had this tremendous momentum, winning eight of the last nine contests. How much of a make or break will the New York primary be for him in your view?

KOHN: You know, in all honesty, so it's a break for Hillary. If Hillary - and she is expected to win New York state, but we don't know. There's still six days. There's a great - there's the CNN debate tomorrow night. I think there's still a lot that could change. But it is a break for Hillary. If she does not win what was her home state as a senator, that is a real problem. That suggests that she is a damaged frontrunner who really doesn't deserve the term frontrunner status if you can't win your own state.

If Bernie does not win, though, again, the expectations game are always important in politics.

BROWN: Right.

KOHN: No one was quite expecting him to win the state. And the fact that he started to close the margin is enough of a small victory for him. He'll keep going. He has the money. He has the support. He has won enough states. He has enough credibility. He'll keep going through the convention if, for nothing else - because he still could win, especially if the super delegates, you know, decide to abide by the democracy of the people. But, either way, he'll still go to press his agenda and his issues, which is vital to the future of the Democratic Party.

BROWN: And in light of that, I mean, most political observers expect - expect and expected Hillary Clinton to win the New York primary, but how worried is the Clinton camp right now that Bernie Sanders could creep up on her here?

CARDONA: I think they should wake up every day worried. That's really the only way that you can run a winning campaign. So I hope they are nervous. I hope they are nervous. And, in fact, that is how they should be running each and every single day. And - and, yes, he is closing the margin and that's what we've seen him do in a lot of these states that - that we have seen the contests go - go into.

So I think what she needs to do is run like she is the underdog. That actually is where she is at her best. Focused on what she's going to be doing, focused on her record, focused on breaking down barriers and making the comparison, not just to her opponent in the Democratic primary, but frankly focused on how critical this election is and how important this decision is for voters because of what Democrats are going to be facing in November. And I think that's actually something that we can both agree on.

And as passionate and as - you know, it's gotten - the back and forth has gotten very intense in the last couple of weeks -

KOHN: Absolutely.

CARDONA: As the Democrats are going through right now, it is nothing compared to the gutter politics and frankly the debauchery that the other side is going through at the moment. So I think Democrats really need to keep their eye on the ball in terms of what's important. And that's what Hillary's going to continue to do. And at the end of the day, I think what she has been focused on is what voters are listening to her in terms of, you know, she is ahead. She's ahead by pledged delegates, not super delegates. She's ahead by super delegate, but it's the pledged delegates that matter, right?

KOHN: Should.

CARDONA: But she's ahead by pledged delegates by more than 200 at this point, 240, I think. And she's ahead by almost 2.5 million votes. And at the end of the day, those are the two things that matter the most.

BROWN: All right, that New York primary six days away. We will continue to monitor all of the developments.

Sally Kohn, Maria Cardona, thank you very much. Appreciate it.

CARDONA: Thank you, Pam.

KOHN: Thank you.

BROWN: And by the way, another big event, the stage is being set right now for the big Democratic debate tomorrow night. Hillary Clinton and Bernie Sanders will take that stage in Brooklyn. It all starts at 9:00 p.m. Eastern tomorrow night only on CNN.

And up next, two more guns turn up in the investigation into the shooting death of NFL star Will Smith. One of them belonged to the former New Orleans Saints player. We'll find out what else police have learned coming up.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[12:29:31] BROWN: Well, now we know former New Orleans Saints defensive end Will Smith did have a loaded gun in his car the night he was shot and killed after a crash, but the suspect, Cardell Hayes, had two guns, one used in the shooting, the other found in his Hummer H2 yesterday morning. It's the latest twist in this high-profile case that started with a fender bender.

For the legal view, I want to bring in CNN legal analyst and defense attorney Joey Jackson for more on this.

So, Joey, Will Smith announced he had a gun. It turns out there was one in his car.

JOEY JACKSON, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: Right.

BROWN: So do you think Hayes' attorney will then make the case that this was a justifiable homicide based on the stand your ground laws in Louisiana?

JACKSON: Without question. So, first, let's look at stand your ground to begin with.