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More Than 30 Dead in Japan After Two Massive Earthquakes; Pope Francis Meets with Migrants in Greece; Battle for New York; Interview with Gov. Andrew Cuomo; Sanders on Meeting the Pope; Clinton, Sanders Battle For Delegate-Rich New York; Tiger Attacks, Kills Keeper At Florida Zoo; Trump: "The Republican System Is Rigged". Aired 11a-12p ET

Aired April 16, 2016 - 11:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[11:00:19] FREDRICKA WHITFIELD, CNN ANCHOR: Good morning, everyone. It's 11:00 on the East Coast. I'm Fredricka Whitfield, welcome to the Newsroom.

We're following three developing stories this morning. Dramatic pictures coming in from Japan where more than 30 people are now dead and hundreds more injured in two massive earthquakes. Heavy rains and winds are making rescue efforts very difficult and powerful tremors continue to rock the region. Also this morning, Pope Francis meeting with migrants in Greece. In a surprise move, the Pope takes three families back with him to the Vatican. And the battle is on in New York. Three days to go before voters hit the polls in what could be a make-or-break primary.

All right, let's talk now about the three migrant families who are with the Pope on their way back to the Vatican. Senior International Correspondent Atika Shubert was with the Pope on this trip to Greece and CNN Vatican Correspondent Delia Gallagher in joining us from Rome, all right.

Delia, let me begin with you because we saw incredible pictures all morning long with the Pope meeting with migrants, many of them Syrian refugees there in Greece. And then we get this news that three families, including six children, get a chance to go with him boarding that Alitalia plane back to Rome. How does this customarily happen? We know the Vatican operates like a country in and of itself with its on governing parties. But describe, if you could, how the Pope managed to do this?

DELIA GALLAGHER, CNN VATICAN CORRESPONDEN: Oh well, I think he managed it because he's the Pope. I mean, the Vatican says that they were very clear today in their statement to say that they have discussed this previously with Italian and Greek authorities because obviously there's also a question of legality of bringing these people back to Italy.

But, you know, Fredricka, the day and in itself was quite a gesture for the Pope to go to the island of Lesbos and meet with the migrants but nobody really expected that he would bring back three families from Syria. Now, last September, the Pope said, "Open your doors, parishes and organizations in Europe to refugee families", and he did do that. And he brought a Syrian refugee family to the Vatican. But, of course, he didn't go there and pick them up.

So we have had one family already living in an apartment near the Vatican. These three families, Fredricka, will be hosted by the community of Sant'Egidio. It's another Catholic community here in Rome and they will take care to help them in the first six months because the rules are, for the first six months, when you ask for asylum, you cannot work. So obviously somebody needs to far pay for that and the Pope is paying for that. Fredricka?

WHITFIELD: And then, as you talk about, I mean, I'm sorry, Delia, you're talking about, you know, the first family and that was really last year whereas now the Pope goes to Lesbos and he actually, you know, picks these three, can you - would you be able to describe the process? Would it be the case that the Pope, you know, Delia, already or at least, you know, people working with him would have made the distinction which family among the 3,000 that he met with in the short hours that he was there, and they were selected based on certain criteria?

GALLAGHER: My feeling, Fredricka, on that, is that the Pope just said, "I want this to be done. And however many we can take and whomever they are it doesn't matter". The fact is that there are three Muslim families. The family last year was a Catholic Syrian family, but I don't know that was necessarily a request from the Pope in particular.

Clearly, it had to be cleared ahead of time and presumably the Pope, as is his way, leaves it to the people on the ground to decide who would be the best family to be able to come and be lucky enough, of course, to come and be chosen by the Vatican.

WHITFIELD: Wow. All right, Delia, thanks so much.

Stick around now. Atika, sorry, getting my vowels all mixed up. Now, Atika Shubert with us now, you are traveling there with be Pope. So describe for us what you witnessed there, because there were some powerful images that we got a chance to see earlier with the Pope meeting with a little girl who was kneeling at his feet. Is there a feeling of Pope was particularly moved by this moment or over all by his meeting with these some 3,000 migrants there.

[11:05:00] ATIKA SHUBERT, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: I think it was clear that he was very touched and he would have connected with people inside the Moria camp. And this isn't just any camps. This is a refugee and detention center here on Lesbos Island.

And what that means is that, refugees would have their asylum application rejected, their appeals rejected. They are detained in that camp. Nobody can leave without permission.

So by coming to this camp, is really highlighted what's happening inside, the condition inside, and we saw this incredible scenes of that little girl in pink dropping to her knees, you know, in tears on adult man, begging to be blessed by the Pope. And numerous people are coming to kiss his hand and to give him messages. And it was really about being able to communicate directly with the Pope expressing those frustrations and asking request why isn't Europe opening the doors.

And he spoke directly to them, and clearly, as Delia pointed out, by bringing three Syrian families back with him to the Vatican, he set the example what about the rest of Europe, especially those Catholic countries in eastern Europe that have been so resistant to taking refugees. He is now set the example and said, "Taking more refugees, they need to find home."

WHITFIELD: Atika Shubert, Delia Gallagher, thank you ladies, appreciate it, extraordinary imagery there.

And then also, quite the moment, particularly as it pertains to American politics, before the Pope took off for Greece, he had an impromptu meeting with presidential candidate Bernie Sanders. Sanders was attending an economic conference on social and economic justice at the Vatican by the invitation of the Pope, and he actually had a chance to speak with, I'm talking to Bernie Sanders now, he spoke with CNN's Ben Wedeman about this impromptu moment. What he said was "A great honor to meet the pontiff.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BEN WEDEMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: You and Pope Francis agree very much when it comes to moral economy, climate change but when it comes to other issues like same-sex marriage, like abortion, like contraception. You don't see ...

SEN. BERNIE SANDERS, (I-VT) DEMOCRATIC PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Absolutely, correct. We do not.

WEDEMAN: And did you express that to him?

SANDERS: No, I don't think. I mean, it is no secret that my views on women's rights, on gay rates, on contraception is different from the church's, but I think in this world, what we have to do is just work with people when we can work with them. And his leadership in terms of the need to create a moral economy, the need to make sure that we transform our energy system so as to prevent climate change from wrecking havoc on this planet has been extraordinary. So you work with people on those area if you can, we disagree, everybody knows that to disagreements on, and let's work together where we can.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WHITFIELD: All right, we'll have much more on Ben Wedeman's interview with Senator Bernie Sanders a little bit later on this hour.

Meantime, Bernie Sanders will also be live tomorrow morning on State of the Union with Jake Tapper that starts at 9:00 a.m. Eastern Time, all right. Coming up, we're going to talk more about the politics of the march for the White House. The next primary up next, New York and we'll be talking to New York Governor Andrew Cuomo about this, setting the stage for us there.

All right, also this breaking news now we're following out of southwestern Japan. Crews there are still scrambling to reach survivors who may be trapped after a 7.0 earthquake toppled buildings, collapsed bridges and left many homes in ruins. More than 30 people are reported dead. Today's earthquake was centered near the city of Kumamoto and comes two days after a 6.2 earthquake struck nearby.

CNN's Matt Rivers is there live with us on the phone. So, Matt, give us an idea of what is happening there in terms of trying to rescue those who may still be in trouble.

MATT RIVERS, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, that is main effort right now as we are in the middle of the night here local time, and rescuers face an uphill battle looking the dozens of people who might still be trapped. This area has been absolutely devastated over the past two to three days. And right now, rescuers are facing lots of rubble, an unknown amount of people who might be still trapped, as well as heavy rainfall and a lack of electricity.

The power is out in the majority of the area. They're having to bring in their own power sources and they're having to deal with a very heavy, steady rain that has fall in here for the last several hours, so a very, very difficult situation for the tens of thousands of rescuers here between police and firefighting personnel, as well as the Japanese Self-Defense Forces. They've (inaudible) 25,000 troops here to help with this rescue.

But as you mentioned, so far we know just from Saturday's earthquake alone, 32 people have lost their lives and on Thursday's earthquake, over 40 people lost their lives as a result of just a terrible couple days here in Japan.

[11:10:05] WHITFIELD: All right, Matt Rivers, keep us posted. Thank you so much. I appreciate that.

Meantime, we are just now three days away from the New York primary and the state's Governor Andrew Cuomo weighing in on the race coming up next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

WHITFIELD: All right, the stakes are particularly high for the Democrats. We're talking about the race for the White House now with a whopping 247 delegates up for grabs in New York. Significantly trailing Hillary Clinton, some say New York is Bernie Sanders' last chance. Let's talk about this crucial primary race with New York Governor Andrew Cuomo. Good to see you.

GOV. ANDREW CUOMO, (D) NEW YORK: Good to see you, Fred.

WHITFIELD: And, of course, everybody knows this by now but we've got to remind those who don't, or at least share with those who don't know that Governor Cuomo is the big brother, I should say, of CNN's Chris Cuomo.

So, Governor, you have endorsed Hillary Clinton. CNN's Democratic debate in Brooklyn was perhaps the most aggressive today. But then, how would you assess what unfolded?

CUOMO: Well, I think Hillary Clinton is going to do very well in New York because this one basic advantage. New Yorkers know Hillary Clinton. She was here for Senator. We've seen her work, we've seen her performance. We know that she's effective at making change, which is what this race really comes down to at the end of the day, in my opinion, Fred.

You know, as Democrat, you listen to Bernie, you listen to Hillary, they basically saying the same thing, same goals. The question is who can actually get it done. And I think Hillary has proven, especially to New Yorkers, that she can make change, she can make the government work.

[11:15:06] You know, when you become, they don't give you a magic want that you wave, you have to get legislation passed, get agencies to run programs, and that's art form in and of itself, and that's what Hillary does very well.

WHITFIELD: Well, it's interesting because even the closing remarks of that debate, Hillary Clinton, she really did lay out. These are the things that I've done, whereas Bernie Sanders laid out, this is the vision that I see.

But bottom line, voters want to feel inspired, are they more inspired by seeing someone present these are the results, I want a continuation of, or the candidates who says, this is the America, this is the change, this is what I see for the future.

CUOMO: Yeah. Well, the - it's an interesting question. We just did an event with President Bill Clinton rallying for Hillary. And I quoted my father who we lost last year, former Governor of New York Mario Cuomo, who said, "We need ideas that are good and sound, not ideas that sound good". What we are saying to the electorate is, let's be smart.

We don't want just 12-second sound bites. We need ideas that are actually going to happen that you can get passed a Congress and through a Senate. And we need the ideas that are actually going to work in people's lives.

So it's not a simple as just saying "We're with, you know, free lunch for everyone. Free this, free that". You have to show people that it can actually happen. And that's what Hillary's strength is.

Do I understand that sometimes the details can become boring and people just want it hear the big picture? Yes. But primary voters are smart, especially here in New York. These are seasoned primary voters. They pay very close attention, and you're not going to fool them with just a broad brush approach. You know, the old expression if it sounds too good to be true, it probably is? That is especially true with New Yorkers, who can be a little cynical at times. If it sounds too good to be true, probably is.

WHITFIELD: So then, talk to me about New Yorkers because New York City, New Yorkers are very different from the rest of the New York State. But, you know, we're seeing, I think most of them would agree we're seeing the tenor and the tone changing quite a bit between Bernie Sanders and Hillary Clinton.

Is that appealing to New York voters, New Yorkers, New York City, dwellers versus New York State of voters? Do they see a difference in the chang of these candidates and will it make a difference in the way in which they cast their votes.

And I think two things are happening. Number one, you'll getting closer to the end and I think you see candidates getting more energized, more aggressive. I think that especially true frankly with the Sanders campaign. They need delegates. They're see the full pool shrink and the pool is drying up and the pool dying up literally is generating anxiety. And I think you hear that forecast by the Sanders campaign.

I don't think Hillary's tone has really changed over the past few weeks. New York tends to be a little more intense, a little more combative. The debate we had in Brooklyn tended to be louder, the crowd was louder and they vocalize positive and negative.

I don't think it makes a difference, Fredricka, from New York's point of view because we're accustomed to it. But I don't know if there's a discernible difference in the tone outside of New York.

WHITFIELD: And then, let's talk about, you know, one of the items of policy or, you know, ideas that has been driven home by both the candidates. You just recently signed a $15 minimum wage plan and Clinton supported you. And this happened to be a moment during that debate, Sanders wants $15 minimum wage, nationally,. Clinton had said, nationally, "How about let's start with about $12."

So is it your view that the rest of the nation should go as New York has gone?

CUOMO: Yeah. This is a perfect example of what we were talking about. You can talk in a broad stroke or you can actually be a little more specific and factual. There are two minimum wages. There is a federal minimum wage and then state by state you seat minimum wage.

[11:20:00] What Mr. Sanders is saying, I believe, is the federal minimum wage should go to $15. The federal minimum wage is now $7. If you go from $7 to $15 in a very short period of time, potentially that could have a negative effect on some economies, because that is a very big jump. And you're saying the business is that employ large number of minimum wage workers, your payroll is basically going to double. That could have a negative impact. It would have to be studied and the economies are different across the country. So states are doing better than others. Some states naturally have stronger economies.

What we did here in New York is we get to 15 but at different rates in different parts of the state because different parts of the state, Fred, we have different economy. New York City, we're going to get to $15 in three years. Why? New York City economy is strong and it can absorb that.

Upstate New York is more rural. It's one of the slower economies in the country. So we get to 15 but over a longer period of time. We have also built in a calibration mechanism, because what happens if the economy slows in, two, tree, four years. And it can't absorb that increase in the minimum wage.

You know the devils in the details. These policies are important. So it's not as simple as saying, "Let's go to 15." If you do it wrong, you can hurt the very people you're trying to help. So I think Hillary's response and Hillary's policy is actually smarter and more judicious and more sophisticated.

WHITFIELD: OK.

CUOMO: Now, it takes more words to say, face in, calibration, regulatory mechanism and it doesn't have that 12 second appeal, I get it but it also happens to the truth.

WHITFIELD: OK. And it's very clear, you backing Hillary Clinton, but now just days away from the New York primary, how exciting is it for you as governor of the state to see that for the first time perhaps in a very long time, this primary in New York seems to be very pivotal both on the Republican and the Democratic side.

CUOMO: It is exciting. It's exciting as a New York governor. I think it's helpful to the process because when you come to New York, the bright lights are there. You've seen some of the candidates get into trouble in places, in ways they haven't got into trouble before. Just because when you go before the New York media, there's nothing quite like that experience.

WHITFIELD: And you've got three New Yorkers in the race.

CUOMO: Well, yeah. Some of them are accustomed to it but some of them aren't. Well, some of them haven't been onto the lights for a long, long time, Fred. So I think it actually helps the dialog and I think it's good.

WHITFIELD: Governor Andrew Cuomo, good to see. Thanks so much and good luck.

CUOMO: Thanks for having me.

WHITFIELD: All right.

Still ahead, the story behind Bernie Sanders' impromptu meeting in wee hours of the morning with the Pope. He went not knowing that he was going to be ...

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SANDERS: I do feel that getting this invitation from the Vatican given my enormous respect to the Pope is something that I just could not refuse.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[11:27:16] WHITFIELD: Welcome back. It's back to New York today for Bernie Sanders following a spontaneous meet up at 4:00 a.m. with the Pope.

Sanders spent the last 24 hours in Rome attending a conference on social and economic justice at the Vatican. An official meeting with the Pope was not on the agenda and then, miraculously, I should say, the two had about five minutes of face time just as the Pope was leaving for Lesbos, Greece, to meet with refugees.

CNN Senior International Correspondent Ben Wedeman caught up with Bernie Sanders about his chat and time with the Pope.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

WEDEMAN: It is no secret that my view on women's rights, on gay rights, on contraception is different than the church's, but I think in this world what we have to do is work with people when we can work with them. And his leadership in terms of the need to create a moral economy, the need to make sure that we transform our energy system so as to prevent climate change from wreaking havoc on this planet has been extraordinary.

So you work with people on those area as you can, where you disagree, everybody knows what the disagreements are and let's work together where we can.

WEDEMAN: And, certainly, the reporting leading up to the conference yesterday, there was an indication that there's an element within the Vatican that has felt "The Bern" so to speak.

SANDERS: That may be the case, if so, I am honored and pleased by that because the truth is, I think, it is fair to say there have been few members of the Senate, if any, who have been more outspoken in support of the role that the pope is playing in the fight for, not only economic justice, but talking about the need to create a moral economy.

What we have now, was so few, have so much and so many, have so little, in my view, it's not only immoral, it is unsustainable. And certainly in terms of climate change, if we don't boldly address this crisis, I worry very much about the kind of planet we'll be leaving our kid and grandchildren.

WEDEMAN: And why do you suppose, the other people running in this election, in this lead up to the election, none of them were invited, Hillary Clinton, Ted Cruz, Donald Trump ... SANDERS: You'll have to ask them and you'll have to ask the Vatican.

WEDEMAN: And now, there has been some talk that you sort of abandoned the campaign trial to come over here to run, how do you responded to that criticism?

SANDERS: Everyone has been following me in New York State for the last week, to talk about abandoning anything. We' been doing rally after rally after rally. We had 27,000 people out of Washington Square Park. We're going back to do another rally. I think tonight, we're going to be working very hard for the next few days.

[11:30:03] We'll have talked to over 100,000 people in upstate New York, in almost every borough in the city of New York.

We have been working very, very hard. But I did feel that getting this invitation from the Vatican, given my enormous respect for the pope, is something I just could not refuse.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WHITFIELD: All right. Who would refuse an invitation like that? Let's bring in Ben Wedeman. So Ben, tell us more about this meeting that happened between the two of them. Hello, I'm in the dark here. Now there is light. All right, what about this meeting? How did it come about?

WEDEMAN: You know, everybody had this suspicion that despite the fact that Vatican officials have said there would be no meeting. That there would be a meeting.

Because of course, we found out very late in the day Senator Sanders was staying at the Casa Santa Marco, which is the Vatican residence where the pope stays as well.

It's not very big and we understand that very early in the morning at the pope was preparing to leave for Greece that he asked to see Senator Sanders.

He met with Senator Sanders and his wife and one of his advisers, Jeffrey Sax (ph), and they spoke for about 5 minutes. It was not -- I asked, they didn't sit down for coffee.

Apparently, it was standing in the hallway, but this was a meeting that the pope specifically wanted or an encounter so to speak. And according to the rules, no photographs were taken of the meeting.

I can tell you, the last thing I did before going to bed last night, I contacted the people in the campaign, the Sanders campaign, to find out what was going on. They were very tight lipped.

First thing in the morning, I contacted them again. When I saw them before the interview, they were giving some very sly winks to me, although not actually admitting that that meeting took place until we actually spoke to Senator Sanders. WHITFIELD: They didn't want to let the cat out of the bag so to speak until it was a done deal. And of course, wow, what a story to be able to tell. All right, Ben Wedeman, thanks so much. We know you were all over it. Appreciate it.

Let's talk more about this with CNN's religion editor, Daniel Burke, and Larry Sabato, director of the Center for Politics at the University of Virginia.

So Daniel, you first, is this a first for a presidential candidate to meet with the pope in the midst of a campaign?

DANIEL BURKE, CNN RELIGION EDITOR: Well, it is definitely highly unusual. I've been covering religion and politics for more than a decade. I've never seen anything like it.

On the other hand, when you look at Pope Francis and Bernie Sanders, it kind of makes sense. Ben Wedeman said that people in the Vatican have clearly felt the Bern.

I think it's equally true that Bernie Sanders may love this pope more than some Catholics. He praises him profusely. He talks about him all the time.

He talks about him as a personal hero even though Bernie Sanders is not Catholic. He is Jewish. Earlier, this week, we put up a quiz on cnn.com. It was called who said it, Bernie Sanders or the pope, and a lot of people couldn't tell the difference. They mixed up the two.

WHITFIELD: Really?

BURKE: Yes. It just goes to show how closely these two men are aligned on certain things like economic inequality and the environment.

WHITFIELD: So Larry, what potentially does this mean for a presidential candidate, while the pope has said before that he tries to stay out of politics, in a way he injects himself into things that are of the political nature. So this visit in your view, how does Bernie Sanders use this to his advantage, particularly so close to a very pivotal, potentially pivotal race in New York?

LARRY SABATO, DIRECTOR, UVA'S CENTER FOR POLITICS: Well, Fred, it's a media coup for Sanders, first of all, who is dominating the news on a Saturday before the New York primary? I haven't seen Hillary Clinton for three seconds. I've seen Bernie Sanders everywhere because of this meeting with the pope. So that's a plus.

And think about the vote in New York. I'm a voting analyst so I have to go to the votes. Even though Sanders would be the first Jewish president, he's doing very poorly among Jewish voters in New York. He's losing to Hillary Clinton by 20 or more percentage points but --

WHITFIELD: Why would that be?

SABATO: Well, he was losing even before the CNN debate on Thursday night that I think Sanders probably hurt himself at least with older Jewish voters, with his comments on Israel.

But think about the voters in New York, it's 6 percent Jewish and in the Democratic primary, it can be a lot higher than that. New York City, it's often 20 percent.

But Catholics in New York are 39 percent of the population. So what Sanders may have lost among Jewish voters, he potentially could make up with Catholic voters although it may not work out that way.

[11:35:07]WHITFIELD: Wow. That's a fantastic and very interesting dynamic indeed. All right, thank you so much, Larry Sabato and Daniel Burke. Appreciate it. We'll talk more about this.

So Bernie Sanders will also be live tomorrow morning at the "STATE OF THE UNION." That starts at 9 a.m. Eastern. I'm sure he'll be ask a whole lot more questions about his trip to the Vatican. We will be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

WHITFIELD: All right, welcome back. I'm Fredricka Whitfield. So just three days away now from New York's crucial primary where a whopping 247 delegates are at stake for the Democrats.

Both Bernie Sanders and Hillary Clinton are hoping for home state advantage appealing to New Yorkers at the CNN Democratic debate.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

HILLARY CLINTON (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I was so honored to serve as a senator for New York for eight years. We worked hard to really keep New York values at the center of who we are and what we do together. I love being in Brooklyn, this is great.

BERNIE SANDERS (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I grew up in Brooklyn, New York, the son of an immigrant who came to this country from Poland. And with your help we're going to win here in New York. Thank you.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WHITFIELD: All right, let's talk more about this with the New York City's first lady, Chirlane McCray. Good to see you. The wife of New York Mayor Bill De Blasio and a Hillary Clinton supporter.

All right. So Bernie Sanders you know has been pulling major support at rallies in New York. You remember seeing so many thousands of people there outside of Greenwich Village.

His campaign says there were in fact 27,000 people at the rally at Washington Square Park. Is there an enthusiasm gap when it comes to h&1lary Clinton's campaign?

CHIRLANE MCCRAY, WIFE OF NEW YORK CITY MAYOR BILL DE BLASIO: Clearly no. There is no enthusiasm gap. Bernie is a good campaigner. [11:40:04]I don't know how many of those people were registered voters, but Hillary's got a double-digit lead here in New York and she's excelling during this campaign. I'm so happy to see her doing so well here in New York.

WHITFIELD: So when you see crowds like that, do you worry for your candidate, Hillary Clinton, that perhaps while the polling may show her out front, do you worry that she might or even her supporters might feel too comfortable and potentially be surprised come primary day?

MCCRAY: No. Again, there's a lot of enthusiasm among the people I know and the events I've attended. It's been electric. There's been young women, older women turning out for Hillary in various events here. I was in Iowa, too. The support is very strong, maybe stylistically different, I don't know, but it's there.

WHITFIELD: OK, earlier in the week, you thought that or at least you classified Bernie Sanders's campaign or even he as a candidate as appealing to be rather desperate. This is what you told Alisyn Camerota.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MCCRAY: I think the tone will be respectful, but I think that Bernie is getting a little desperate. I expect we'll hear the volume be pumped up a little bit.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WHITFIELD: Do you still feel that way?

MCCRAY: I do, I do. I think that Bernie has shown that he can go wide with issues. He can get the spotlight but he doesn't have the details. He's turning to accusations now, doing things that he said he wouldn't do in the beginning of the campaign with Hillary.

WHITFIELD: And then he and his camp might say is it really desperate or is it determined? Because folks seem to be fighting very hard in very different ways. It's a different tone, is it not, between these Democrats?

MCCRAY: There is a different tone. Hillary is clearly the most qualified candidate that we've ever had for president. I hope that voters are really paying attention to the fact that, first of all, she's qualified. She's progressive. She has plans.

But also she has been so deeply involved with children and families throughout her career. This is a woman who moved through life as a daughter, a spouse, a mother, a grandmother and who can tackle inequality for more than half the population, right, from a different perspective, a much needed perspective.

She is someone who paid attention to pay equity, domestic violence, universal pre-k, and social security in the way that none of the other candidates have. I hope voters are paying attention because families are the foundation of our society and Hillary gets that when women do better, our families do better economically. They're more healthy. She really gets that.

WHITFIELD: And speaking of families, you know what it like to be on the campaign trail, you know, as a spouse, as a mother, the leader of your family.

Give us an idea what it is like for all of these families, you know, and spouses who are campaigning for their loved one, you know, leading into New York and with hopes, you know, of ending up in the White House.

MCCRAY: Well, I can tell you it is really hard work, but it's also gratifying to meet so many different kinds of people from all over the country. It's a lot of work, but it's also tremendously fulfilling to see so many people involved in the Democratic process.

WHITFIELD: Chirlane McCray, thank you so much for being with us.

MCCRAY: Thank you.

WHITFIELD: And we'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[11:47:24]

WHITFIELD: Welcome back. An investigation is under way in the death of a zookeeper in Florida. Palm Beach Zoo's own Stacey Konwiser was mauled by a rare tiger while preparing for a live tiger demonstration. CNN correspondent, Boris Sanchez, explains.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

BORIS SANCHEZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Tragedy at the Palm Beach, Florida Zoo after a rare Malayan tiger kills its lead handler. Officials say the attack happened in a contained area called the night house where the big cats are fed and sleep.

The 38-year-old Stacey Konwiser was preparing for a scheduled tiger talk, an informational event for zoo visitors when something went wrong.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: This was a tiger that was very familiar with Stacey. She was very familiar with this tiger.

SANCHEZ: The tiger was off exhibit and no visitors were ever threatened, but the zoo was evacuated. Getting to the victim was not easy. West Palm Beach police says the animal was tranquilized and they had to wait for the drugs to take effect before reaching Konwiser, who later died at the hospital.

(VIDEO CLIP) SANCHEZ (voice-over): Officials of the zoo where her husband also works as a trainer said Konwiser had lots of experience handling the tigers and did not do anything unusual as she worked in the enclosure.

NAKI CARTER, SPOKESWOMAN, PALM BEACH ZOO: The love that they have for these animals. You don't get into this business without the love for these animals and understanding the danger that's involve even more.

SANCHEZ: Officials have not identified which of the four endangered tigers attack Konwiser, but they say it's a 13-year-old male.

MARK MCCARTHY, MCCARTHY'S WILDLIFE SANCTUARY: That's a powerful animal. And if they get ahold of you, there's nothing you can do to let them go. I don't care how strong you are, how big you are.

SANCHEZ: Attacks by zoo animals in the U.S. are relatively rare. In 2007, a Siberian tiger named Tatiana escaped her open-air enclosure at the San Francisco Zoo and attacked three people. One 17-year-old boy was killed. The tiger shot dead by police after the mauling.

In 2003, the entertainer, Sigfreed and Roy, were performing in Las Vegas with their white tiger, Monticor. Halfway through the show, Monticor lunged and bit him Roy Horn on the neck dragging him around in front of the horrified audience. Monticor was subdued. Horn survived the attack.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

SANCHEZ: Fred, this is a sad story. Just a short while ago, we heard from a zoo spokesperson who told us that Stacey knew that she was putting her life was at risk but that she was doing it to save these endangered animals.

We also got an update on the condition of the tiger that mauled her. We were told that it's now recovering from being tranquilized, but weren't being given indication as to the zoo's future plans with the animal -- Fred.

[11:50:09]WHITFIELD: All right, Boris Sanchez, thank you so much.

All right, coming up, Donald Trump doubled down on his fight with the RNC.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I'm not one of these politicians that say it doesn't matter if you vote for me or my opponent, it's so important for the Americans (inaudible). Let me give you a hint, you want to vote for somebody else, don't vote.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) TRUMP: We have a rigged system. The Republican system is rigged. They change the system. They say they didn't change the system. They changed the system and went to a deal where the bosses pick the delegates and the people never got to vote.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WHITFIELD: Donald Trump's feud with the Republican National Committee heating up this week with the frontrunner railing against what he calls a rigged system despite centers around Colorado which decided last year to skip an open primary and instead have the party select delegates at the state's convention.

And in a "Wall Street Journal" op-ed published Friday, Trump writes, quotes, "What we are seeing now is not a proper use of the rules but a flagrant use of the rules. Delegates are supposed to reflect decisions of the voters, but the system is being rigged by party operatives with double agent delegates who reject the decision of voters."

[11:55:07]Joining me now to talk about this is CNN political commentator, Jeffrey Lord, and Republican strategist, Ford O'Connell. Good to see you both.

RNC Chair Reince Priebus pushed back against Donald Trump's claims this way. Listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REINCE PRIEBUS, REPUBLICAN NATIONAL COMMITTEE CHAIRMAN: This is the way that the parties and the Democrats do it in a similar way, choose their nominees. The delegates are empowered by the voters, but the delegates on the floor choose the nominee of the party after being empowered by the voters. This is a very normal system that we've been using for many years.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WHITFIELD: All right so, Ford, you first. Normal system. You know, the divide between Trump and the RNC is widening. What is this fight setting up? Because if Trump wins the nomination or at least the plurality, the RNC has to deal with him and Trump has to deal with the RNC. I mean, they have to somehow get along, right?

FORD O'CONNELL, REPUBLICAN STRATEGIST: Let's understand the first thing, the facts don't support Donald Trump's argument. I have been bullish on him. The system is not rigged against him because no other candidate has a competitive advantage. It's all the same rules.

The argument he does make, which is almost a fair point, it is undemocratic. But you have to understand it is not undemocratic, it is less democratic and undemocratic in his favor in the sense that he's 37 percent of the vote and 46 percent of the delegates.

Frankly, I don't know what Trump is talking about because he has benefitted more handsomely than any other candidate. WHITFIELD: It is simply because he hasn't been able to win particularly Colorado recently.

O'CONNELL: That's because of the fact that's he's campaign on the chief and he didn't pay attention to nuts and bolts and campaign rules, it came back to bite him on the back side in certain contests like Colorado.

But for every Colorado, I can point to a South Carolina or Florida where the rules really did help him and might have actually disenfranchised even more voters.

WHITFIELD: So Jeffrey, how do you defend your candidate of choice, you know, Donald Trump and his argument when it sounds as though it is just, you know, being disappointed, angry, mad, that it hasn't gone in his favor recently.

JEFFREY LORD, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Let me read you a couple of sentences, a direct quote. "I went before the people and I won. Now the national committee and a portion of the convention, which has made a majority only by the aid of delegates not elected but chosen by the national committee are trying to cheat me out of the nomination.

They can't do it, as far as I am concerned, it makes no difference, it is not me they're cheating. It is the people of the rank and file of the Republican Party." That's not Donald Trump. That's Theodore Roosevelt in 1912.

My point is the system can indeed be rigged. You can get people who are chosen as delegates in districts that Donald Trump won and yet they're put there by party officials that know they have allegiance to other candidates.

For example, if there's a second ballot, they're not really Trump delegates at all, if they're committed by law, then they can switch freely. They can vote against Trump -- on rules and credentials.

O'CONNELL: Let me make one point here. I agree that the system can be rigged, but under current rules, Donald Trump is benefitting more than anyone else.

If you notice in "The Wall Street Journal," the reason he didn't give you a solution to what a fairer process would be is because if he proffered that, which would be a closed primary with delegates allocated by congressional district with proportion weighted for actual Republicans in said district, he would actually be further behind the 1,237 number.

And understand something about the notion of democracy, OK, that is democracy is power vested in the people, exercised through indirect or direct representation. I don't like state conventions in Colorado any more than Trump does, but it is still a form of democracy, and that's something we all have to understand.

WHITFIELD: In other words, Jeffrey, does it mean this is incentive that Donald Trump has to change the way he is campaigning because clearly districts do matter, and if he doesn't have his support on the ground to try to give a persuasive argument as to whether they need to support him like you've seen in Ted Cruz's campaign, then it's going to be more of the same?

LORD: I do think he is adapting here. There is no question of that. The appointment of Paul Manafort says a great deal this. I know Paul from Reagan days. This is exactly the kind of person, did it for Gerald Ford, for Ronald Reagan, this is exactly the person you want.

I tried to say over the months when people would say where is Donald Trump's position papers, where is this or that, that as the campaign goes along, it morphs into a full scale presidential campaign. And that's exactly what's happening --

WHITFIELD: So too little too late or is there time, you know, to make gains --

O'CONNELL: Absolutely there's time. To Jeffrey's point, you have to understand, this is misdirection on Trump's part but it's political goal because he keeps his supporters fired up. It makes Ted Cruz look like establishment goon.

The bottom line is he will do very, very well going forward and it takes away from the spotlight from the fact that he's had two terrible weeks of campaigning.

WHITFIELD: All right, we will leave it there. Ford O'connell, Jeffrey Lord, thanks so much, Gentlemen. Appreciate it.

All right, of course, there's more so stay with us because coming up at the top of the hour, Donald Trump is holding a wide rally in Syracuse, New York.